I find the argument that "investing in arms manufacturers encourages force rather than deliberation and therefore conflicts with the mission of the university" to be far too simplistic. The primary motivation to invest in a military and the associated technologies should not be the intent to see its use in war but so that it may serve as a deterrence to any aggressive parties. If US military industry were to collapse it would only serve to invite war and conflict in the world. And the idea that you simply don't want to invest in a company that "profits off of war" seems somewhat ridiculous to me. Should universities divest from medical and biotech companies because they profit off of pandemics and other outbreaks of disease?

The difference is that they were threatening other students. If they hadn't done that no one would have cared about the protests. Also, they were supporting Hamas, a terror organization. They were not pro Palestinian they were pro Hamas. There is a huge difference.

@norman_5623

20 күн бұрын

At most or all of the protests, protesters were not threatening other students; anti-protester mobs were threatening nonviolent students. That was recorded at UCLA in exhaustive detail. That also happened at Columbia. Go read the Columbia Spectator, with first-hand accounts by students and faculty.

@ruthhorowitz7625

20 күн бұрын

@@norman_5623 wrong

@norman_5623

20 күн бұрын

@@ruthhorowitz7625 I don't suppose you have any evidence to support your claims, as I do.

@ruthhorowitz7625

20 күн бұрын

@@norman_5623you have no proof. There's plenty of proof they were violent.

@norman_5623

20 күн бұрын

@@ruthhorowitz7625 I've cited my proof. And I've been to SJP and JVP protests. What is your proof?

An excellent, highly nuanced, and rare open inquiry here, many thanks! Professor Harper is a brilliant writer and thinker on a wide variety of things that matter. Really enjoyed the range of important topics and angles you both showed up to related to academic freedom, Higher Ed, and peaceful dissent amid ongoing genocide and humanitarian catastrophe. It was refreshing as a listener and scholar, thanks again.

Tyler has adopted all the Palestinian talking points without really interogating them. He speaks as though Israel was looking for targets and decided universities would be a good place to bomb. What possible up-side could there be for Israel to bomb any school in Gaza? The lack of critical thinking about such a basic question really hurts his credibility. The obvious answer is that those locations were turned into legitimate targets when Hamas started shooting out of them. Like Hamas has done from safe corridors, safe zones, mosques, and schools. The lack of intellectual honesty about such a simple point is very disappointing.

I doubt that any speaker that did not follow the Hamas line would be tolerated on campus. They would at the very least be drowned out by screaming, chanting, drums and perhaps physical violence. The universities are not able to educate under these conditions. Might as well close down and send the students home.

This is the first heterodox presentation with which I have disagreements (It goes without saying here that Tyler has a right to say anything-free speech): But the campus “protesters” who are blocking campus activities and intimidating Jews are doing more than protesting and THIS is not protected speech. Police aren’t needed for the peaceful protestors, but they are needed when campus activists are blocked and to protect threatened groups. This is NOT taking a political stance, this is FOLLOWING the LAW!

Do professors no longer teach what civil disobedience means? I think of the civil rights movement and the sit- ins at lunch counters. Brave students publicly breaking an unjust law, bearing the wrath and violence of racist opponents. In past eras, our students accepted the consequences of their actions gracefully. Their grace sent a meaningful message of peaceful resistance. They did not hide their faces in fear. In shame. Today, I see students assert: we are fearless, we camp, on plush, manicured lawns. No statement, no purpose, no need to spend the night. No all-night silent vigil. Our sacrifice is sleeping, safe and sound in a free land. They resist arrest- for camping without a permit, wielding large slabs of wood in escalation, crying oppression and police brutality. I’m a student! I’m a faculty member! Confident of their privilege above just law. Today, I see students intimidate, bully, block minority students from entering their campus. A perverted echo of the civil rights movement. I’m haunted by an image of students laughing and jeering at Black officers of the NYPD. Accusing them of being the Kay-Kay-Kay. How cool-headed those officers, solemn with the weight of those deadly letters. Must our college students now be trained when and how to speak? Have they exhausted the limits of their free speech? Chanting, too easy for scholars, as easy as hate. It is not beyond the reach of young scholars today to wish peace and human rights for humanity - Palestinian infants, Israeli toddlers, American baby sisters and brothers. Who taught these young minds to think in black and white only, wholly pure or wholly evil, discerning nothing between? With a solemn pledge of allegiance to diversity, equality, and most of all, inclusion - speak now in peace. May they grow up. May they take off their masks. May they recognize the noble, imperfectly human, American history of their own beloved Holy Land.

@norman_5623

20 күн бұрын

Are you speaking from personal experience attending the protests, or are you basing your facts on videos you saw on the internet?

@River10081

20 күн бұрын

@@norman_5623 I haven’t attended these protests. I was an activist in college. It takes dedication and a lot of work, countless hours studying and understanding your cause. It’s so important to understand how civil disobedience works. To really get that your right to free speech is limited by time, place, and manner. You have a choice: Respect time, place, and manner restrictions or accept the consequences gracefully in the name of your cause. The police are not arresting you because they are oppressors who hate brown people. They often are brown people. Stay calm and don’t fight- or accept getting arrested. If there is police brutality the world will know. I want to say to the students and professors: have you thought this through? Encampments. Liberated zones with guards posted. Masked faces. Occupation. Needlessly war-like. There is no opposing army poised to recapture your territory. Go home and sleep. Do these protests distract people from the actual war? Divide people? Most Americans really support ceasefire because of the death toll. Stay on point. Imagine peace activists with calm, solemn, visibly human faces - staying on point, focused only on what is important right now: Ceasefire Peace End the war and end terrorism Peace for Palestinian and Israeli children

@norman_5623

20 күн бұрын

@@River10081 I think you should read the Columbia Spectator, in which several professors argue why the protests actually didn't violate Columbia rules, and didn't break any laws. In contrast, President Shafik did violate Columbia rules, which required her to consult with the university Senate. In the no-confidence resolution, they say that Shafik "falsely claimed" that the students were a "clear and present danger to the substantial functioning of the university." In other words, your facts are all wrong. First get your facts right.

@River10081

20 күн бұрын

@@norman_5623 Please tell me which specific fact that I stated is wrong. I reported what I saw and heard. It’s documented on videos students posted. I don’t think Columbia is the center of the universe. The war and terrorism are far more important. That’s my point. How do student, faculty, and administration disputes help children in Gaza? Students broke the law by either not knowing or not respecting time, place, and manner restrictions on free speech and assembly. What was the rationale for camping, vandalizing, or occupying Harrison Hall? Disjointed, meaningless actions.The police are often called when a large group of people are freaking out, breaking windows, swinging pieces of plywood. That’s not news. NYPD cops calmly face dangerous and/or out of control people who resist arrest every day. Stay on point. Peace.

@River10081

20 күн бұрын

@@norman_5623 Please tell me which specific fact that I stated is wrong. I reported exactly what I saw and heard in videos. Columbia is not the center of the universe. The war and terrorism are more important issues. That’s my point. How do student, faculty, and administration disputes help children in Gaza? People broke the law by not respecting time, place, and manner restrictions on free speech. If a large group of out of control people swing pieces of plywood, break windows, vandalize, the police are called. Not surprising. NYPD cops calmly face dangerous and/or out of control people every day. What really matters? Peace.

Tyler is a shining example of the problem.

Glosses over the majority of the issue. Not a very good interviewee (or interviewer, to be honest).