Crazy how Game&Watch went from having an incomplete shield 21:19 to having one if if not the best OOS option 21:48. What a character development.

@kkmac7247

9 ай бұрын

G&W does technically have the fastest OOS option in melee, it's just not great

@patrickettienne8423

9 ай бұрын

@@kkmac7247 For me, a good OSS option is a balance between speed, range and power.

@haterkiller1312

9 ай бұрын

@@kkmac7247not just the fastest in melee - it’s the fastest in the entire series!

@nathanlevesque7812

9 ай бұрын

He also had the worst spotdodge (which is practically useless), and his hurtbox lets him get grabbed from further away than one would expect.

@GoldGuard

9 ай бұрын

21:08 “unfortunately for the character, he [Mr. Game and Watch] was probably completed around the tail end of the game’s development” No he wasn’t completed at all😂

Was waiting for a sequel of the previous video with the 64 characters. Thanks Larry!

Great video! Surprised to see that Melee Mewtwo wasn’t picked for the worst version. I do think that Melee Mewtwo is lowkey underrated tho and if Larry thinks that too then thats based

@nathanlevesque7812

9 ай бұрын

I wonder if that's what he meant to say, because after putting Sm4sh Mewtwo as best he said worst was a tossup between Sm4sh Mewtwo and Ultimate Mewtwo.

@noice8911

9 ай бұрын

He had to have skimmed over Melee Mewtwo

@beauhendershot7911

9 ай бұрын

@@noice8911 maybe but pre patch smash 4 mewtwo has an arguement to be worse than melee mewtwo honestly

@Migota_

9 ай бұрын

Melee mewtwo would get clapped by pre patch ult mewtwo any day of the week tho

@beauhendershot7911

9 ай бұрын

@@Migota_ mmm maybe honestly. Ult mewtwo has a crazy ahh shadow ball but melee mewtwo also has rly good vertical kill moves like fair. Also melee mewtwo has a better nair plus a wavedash that’s one of the longest in the game

17:06 that forward air is actually INSANE

Playing Peach was a treat in Brawl because you can't trip if you're floating.

It's basically impossible to argue which version of Bowser is better, crazy just how close in viability they are

@lava64_

9 ай бұрын

Imo, Ultimate Bowser is the best Bowser.

I like these videos a lot! Larry has such a deep knowledge of all the smash games I *do* think Mewtwo's worst iteration is Melee, though. He's painfully light, and his poor horizontal hitboxes stack up exceptionally poorly against the game's top tiers.

This was an enjoyable watch, I'm glad to see you continuing these kinds of videos. The only thing I disagree with is the worst version of Mewtwo, Pre Patch Ultimate Mewtwo is a fair pick, but I'd argue that Melee Mewtwo is worse. He doesn't have any safe and reliable KO options, Confusion just does not work, and many of his attacks are very small and weak, and he lacks any approach options compared to other characters. 4 and Ultimate Mewtwo were at least saved by patches, but Melee Mewtwo started low tier and stayed low tier.

This is because I’m a content fiend, but I feel like if you are including pre patch versions, you should also quickly go over the worst “final game” version. It wasn’t necessary for Pichu as the result is the same, but w Mewtwo and Marth, in every games current tournament ruleset it would be melee and ultimate respectively. This isn’t to critique and criticize as it was an amazing video, and you said it was already a long production, it’s just a suggestion for more content. Or make it a KZread short. Love the content nonetheless and I’m excited for the Brawl edition

16:38 when I saw Ganon I knew what the clip for the background was going to be probably the most legendary Ganon moment of all time

@illford6921

9 ай бұрын

No that's the Melee Ganon Salty Suite, Nairo ganon is close tho

@gkoala8360

9 ай бұрын

Okay, but can we talk about the clip at 17:26 😂. The trip zoom-in made me lose it

@captainmega6310

9 ай бұрын

​@illford6921 it's tied I think

Miss your Falco in melee, always fun watching your runs at SSS

Wanna address the Mewtwo comments I've been getting since that seems to be the opinion that sticks out the most to people. One thing I've seen brought up is Mewtwo's weight in Melee, he's actually lighter in both Smash 4 and Ultimate even after the weight buffs. Reminder when I say Mewtwo is worse I'm talking about prepatch Mewtwo in both Ultimate and 4. Ultimate Mewtwo(who is still considered a mid tier btw even after the buffs he's received) was lighter, utilt and uair were worse combo tools, usmash/bthrow/dsmash/shadow ball were weaker kill moves, some of his moves were less disjointed and he was easier to shield poke, dthrow could only combo at low percent, and his shadow ball was overall worse for combos and zoning. Prepatch Smash 4 Mewtwo got so many massive buffs to make him top tier. Not going to list everything, but to put it into perspective how massive the buffs were Mewtwo went from not even having a top 20 run speed to having a top 10 run speed in the game being faster than Sheik. Depending on the interested I might make a video talking about Melee, Smash 4, and Ultimate Mewtwo more in depth and how he got changed throughout the series

@captainmega6310

9 ай бұрын

Please do that one day, I'm REALLY curious because melee mewtwo is so bizarre

Is Mewtwo in Melee really better then the original versions of Mewtwo in both Smash 4 and Ultimate? I know Mewtwo is a low tier in that game.

@StriderZessei

9 ай бұрын

Mewtwo is absurdly light in 4/Ultimate.

@ABC-ik9vj

9 ай бұрын

Nah, melee version is way worse, Larry def forgot about him in that game

@carlosjefferson2578

9 ай бұрын

I was thinking the same thing. Melee M2 is definitely the worst

@SeriousStriker

9 ай бұрын

@@StriderZessei But that's like the only thing Mewtwo is better at in Melee.

@drascore6668

9 ай бұрын

leffen has joined the chat

14:49 one of the best plays by Bobby Scar of all time

@Kalazt

9 ай бұрын

Banger comment

I find videos on competitive play for previous smash titles fascinating. I'd love to see some more content out there of good players playing and discussing N64, Brawl, and 3DS Smash.

16:49 Bro playing a mirror match irl

The M2K clips in this video are quite entertaining. 3:45 Him totally dead serious stomping this bowser with shiek while the other guy giggles 14:30 Cheeky little gimp he pulled on zain in a marth ditto. fastfalling and using his up b to interrupt since zain was gonna recover low

Watching poor Dabuz getting worked by Brawl Ice Climbers was hard to watch

i think larry just forgot that mewtwo was in melee.

Can't wait for the next one! This series is great. 👏

Ganon SLAPS in melee ❤

It's so fascinating how Brawl Zelda was buffed in nearly every aspect vs her Melee version, yet managed to be an even worse performing character due to the physics and pace of Brawl. Pre-patch S4 Zelda could definitely give her a run for her money though! She's such an odd character in the series; always changing each game but never being good. It's part of her charm for me though, since I've mained her for 15 years now. I think I need help...

Melee Falco is pure art, a fluidity and creativity that I can't find in any ultimate character sadly

@captainmega6310

9 ай бұрын

I love lasers too

@TheBeggies95

9 ай бұрын

“Creativity” but Falco players will laser and pillar combos all day

@Hags_95

9 ай бұрын

@@TheBeggies95 I was talking about what the character could do, not how people play him

@captainmega6310

9 ай бұрын

@TheBeggies95 too be fair, Falco in Melee can do alot of cool stuff but his players are boring

@Emphetic

8 ай бұрын

​@@TheBeggies95I think Falco vs floaties is a lot more creative, Falco vs fast fallers is pillars but what you do after can be creative as well. He definitely is bread and butter in a lot of stages of the game tho

There is a version of Sheik and Zelda that is even weaker than the ones described in this video, although they are probably the more forgotten versions. Pre-patch Ultimate Sheik was a very weak character. You basically take Ultimate Sheik where she is currently, and you make her forward air harder to land, her down smash barely work half the time, her down tilt harder to sweetspot, and her Needles being much worse between it charging at a slower rate and its landing lag canceled combos being essentially nonexistent. It was a version of Sheik that had a harder time initiating her higher damaging combos, a character that worked harder for neutral, and a character that had an even more inconsistent time KO'ing. She was considered weak at launch, and at least Brawl Sheik is considered by many modern Brawl players to be a fairly solid character. Pre-patch SSB4 Zelda is essentially taking Brawl Zelda and further nerfing her moveset. While she technically had a better combo game, it still wasn't good, and it was no where near as potent as what she would get later down the line in patch updates. She was considered to a strong contender for the weakest character in the game (alongside vanilla Charizard and Mii Swordfighter), and is only considered not a worst character contender thanks to patch 1.1.5.

@user-ru7vo6xq7h

9 ай бұрын

Pre patch Sheik is not even that bad. Her camping and speed won her a lot of matchups, for example, she had good matchups against almost all sword fighters, heavies, and zoners. Her speed and frame data also allowed her to do decently against other faster/rush down characters too.

Excited for the Brawl video, some of the most competitively diverse characters definitely came from that game.

I really like this video concept. It is unique and it is fun because I would pause the video and try to guess the answers. I hope you make a Brawl version in the future!

Ganon was the best character in melee because of his air forward attack (the punch), and also the fact that he can double jump, wizard foot ANOTHER DOUBLE JUMP, and then wizard dive to horizontally recover.

Brawl Sheik was a good time. Definitely the weakest, but at the same time I think people were just starting to see the character was underlooked. She was getting some use in Japan from EARTH and Daiki, and her frame data combined with air release -> DACUS (which was such a cool looking kill confirm) made the MK matchup pretty doable (it was bad, but relatively good for her tier). ftilt locking the spacies was also kind of nice, only issue is she was garbage against Ice Climbers and Olimar. Fun character for me to practice, since the guy I played against often played Marth and Falco which are pretty even.

@RTU130

9 ай бұрын

Ye

You forgot the part where you could permanently stun the opponent with Mewtwo when he first came out on Smash 4.

The real best version of pichu was blue alt pichu in melee

@yeticoatabrigodeyeti160

Ай бұрын

ngl the googles look kinda great on pichu i have no idea why

Great video Larry

I don't see the sense in claiming Smash 4 Marth was the worst iteration of him and then having the reason be: "This outdated version of Smash 4 Marth was really bad.. despite the fact he got buffed later and became one of the better characters in the game anyway but imma talk about how he was before he became good." Wouldn't it be better to talk about Smash 4 Marth as he is now since.. he was no longer bad? That just ain't click to me at all. I personally think Ultimate Marth is the weakest version of him for sure.

Here's to shouting out the underrated Glytch ad that Larry plays at the beginning of every video now

I saw Larry in person and wanted to debate some of his pick in the last video, but he had a tub of glitch with him so I turned around and kept my mouth shut.

Finally it’s back

Larry I love you and your content man I hope you have a great day

it's crazy how much zelda was nerfed between melee and brawl lol

This video was super good!

Can't wait for the Brawl cast version. There is going to be a LOT to talk about there. Brawl was a messed up game and the characters who debuted in it have some history to share.

Whenever I play as Pichu in ultimate, I just panic as soon as Im at 30%. Like any strong hit is enough to kill me. Pichu hurting himself doesn’t help, it just makes him even easier to kill

I used to disagree that Brawl Zelda was the worst version of Zelda simply because I was so sold on her awful status in Melee for quite a number of years. My limited memory of Brawl only lead me to assume that she just was pretty unviable which could be said for most of Brawl's roster, but recent Slippi Era results from Melee Zelda have shown that not only does she have the potential to rise on the tier-list due to people exploring the character more, but the fall of characters like Roy, Ness, and Pichu in Melee have sort of shown me what it takes for a character to be truly irredeemably awful, and Brawl Zelda fits that bill. She has better moves than I think characters above her in Brawl have, but none of them allow her to advance her game-state and the shoddy reliability of multi-hits in Brawl means that even the moves that are good can often fail her. I've started to realize that having limited Win Conditions is infinitely better than having no Win Conditions but a marginally better neutral, and that exactly describes why I can now see Brawl Zelda as the uncontested worst. Which would shock me like 10 years ago, if you told me JMook could take games off Top Players on Slippi in Melee with Zelda back then I would have thought you were huffing copium so hard that you became delusional.

Always a good day when Larry uploads

6:13 if we’re talking hype iceclimbers best is ultimate cause there actually hype

I’m already knowin thanks to the order of the roster Meta Knight would be the first for if an innate brawl one comes out and his best iteration should be extremely obvious 😂

Disagree about Ult Mewtwo being the worst. That title goes to Melee Mewtwo. Despite having some good traits, that character was slower than Smash 4 and Ultimate Mewtwo. It's Side B didn't work as a reflector or as a command grab, in fact, you could get punished for grabbing an opponent. Disable also saw no use because of it's lack of utility. Melee Mewtwo was an incomplete character that was a victim of the game's rushed development.

what if every characters best iteration was in the same game?

Brawl: Everyone is bad!

Cant wait for “every smash ultimate characters best and worst version”

I can't wait to see the ultimate version of this list.

Pocket Glytch never gets old

Funny how some of these characters worst iterations we're from the smash game that they first made their appearance

15:05 i beg your pardon

Cant wait for the best ans worst iterations of characters who debuted in ulti

Lmao the ad was good

I think you should only count post patch

Waiting for brawl now

Cant wait for Best and worst version of Brawl characters

Hello! Melee mewtwo!? How was that not the worst version? Lowkey think Larry forgot

Ridley's best version is obviously ultimate due to his good range and it's surprising but his worst version is ultimate due to his big hitbox

Was honestly expecting Melee Mewtwo to be the worst but release of Mewtwo on Sm4sh was so bad i'll agree

wait so ur telling me the reason why marth smash 4 is worse than ultimate is because he *used* to be worse

Using Mang0’s funzies doc is crazy 😭😭😭

vid starts on 2:18

Miya himself said he top 3 and Peeps continuing throwing tantrums about gnw especially after SSC

I feel like including pre patch versions of characters in a list like this is kinda unfair but otherwise good video.

@lmao2302

9 ай бұрын

Nah it's based as fuck for adding versions of the characters that people would overlook instead of the obvious answers.

when’s the brawl character video ?

(character) (best) (worst) Dr. Mario: Melee, Ultimate Bowser: 4, Melee Peach: Melee, Brawl Ganondorf: Melee, Brawl Falco: Melee, 4 Ice Climbers: Brawl, Ultimate Zelda: No idea Sheik: 4, Brawl Young Link: Ultimate, Melee Pichu: Ultimate, Melee Mewtwo: 4, Melee Mr. Game & Watch: Ultimate, Melee Marth: Melee but close, Ultimate Roy: Ultimate, Melee

I think that the worst sheik(not competively) should've been Melee in terms of moveset because in that game her side b means death,but the best version I think it's debateble between Smash 4 and Ultimate. In Ultimate there's Joker so she's underestimated,but she's still really good.

Nah Zelda's best game has got to be melee, that down b is ridiculous

Still kinda baffled that Mewtwo in Melee didn't even get mentioned once when considering the worst version. I'm not sure who I think is worse since I don't play competitive or Melee in general that much but it would still be worth mentioning at least as to why pre-patch Smash Ultimate was chosen over Melee. Can't wait for Brawl btw

I've been waiting for this! I'll guess the Brawl characters here. Best Meta Knight: Brawl Pit: Brawl Zero Suit Samus: Smash 4 Wario: Ultimate Snake: Brawl Ike: Ultimate Pokémon Trainer: Ultimate Diddy Kong : Brawl Lucas: Smash 4 Sonic: Smash 4 King Dedede: Brawl Olimar: Brawl Lucario: Smash 4 R.O.B.: Ultimate Toon Link: Brawl Wolf: Ultimate Worst Meta Knight: Ultimate Pit: Smash 4 Zero Suit Samus: Ultimate Wario: Smash 4 Snake: Ultimate Ike: Smash 4 Pokémon Trainer: Brawl Diddy Kong: Ultimate Lucas: Brawl Sonic: Brawl King Dedede: Smash 4 Olimar: Smash 4 Lucario: Ultimate R.O.B.: Smash 4 Toon Link: Ultimate Wolf: Brawl

@lmao2302

9 ай бұрын

They're definitely going to say pre patch diddy smash 4 for best and pre patch olimar ult for best. And he might say smash ult for sonic for best but I might not be as sure.

@JD-ve6kn

9 ай бұрын

Diddy is a banana spawning demon in Brawl. I also agree that Brawl is where Olimar shined the most, having that man pikmin at once seems wild now in retrospect

Cool video (I think, I don't know anything about smash)! But I don't think pre-patch should be included.

Melee Mewtwo is arguably worst than Ultimate and Smash 4. Its super light , it dies fast , it pretty slow , and it match up spreads is pretty bad. If you see Mewtwo destroying players , is probably Taj , Leffen or M2K been insane lmao.

can confirm that being a Peach main in the Brawl days were kinda sucky

I wish Melee Link had 64 Link's movement speed 😅

I wish Mewtwo was a good character in ultimate...

2:00 bro why are you actually funny 💀

Larry you could said more about smash 4 falco. You were holding back…

I think Ultimate Bowser is the best. Four words. SIX. FRAME. SIDE. SPECIAL. Oh and Whirling Fortress is an even better out of shield option

wait do u think ultimate mew2 is worse than melee mew2?

Mewtwo doesn’t have a tail

Predicting the remaining ones just because Meta Knight: Brawl best, Ult worst Pit: Ult best, 4 worst ZSS: 4 best, Ult worst (by default) Wario: Ult best (pre patch), 4 worst Snake: Brawl best, Ult worst (again by default) Ike: Ult best, 4 worst PT: I cannot even begin to guess due to how Smash 4 Charizard factors in Diddy: 4 best (pre patch), Ult worst Lucas: Who knows Sonic: Ult best, Brawl worst Dedede: Brawl best, 4 worst Olimar: Brawl best, 4 worst (could see pre patch Ult Olimar being best too) Lucario: 4 best, Ult worst ROB: Ult best, 4 worst Toon Link: I have no idea Wolf: Ult best, Brawl worst Villager: Smash 4 with customs best, Ult worst Mega Man: Ult best (pre patch), 4 worst WFT: Ult best, 4 worst Rosalina: 4 best, Ult worst Little Mac: 3DS best, Ult worst Greninja: Ult best, 4 worst Miis: IDK Palutena: Ult best, 4 worst Pac Man: Ult best, 4 worst Lucina: Ult best, 3DS worst Robin: About the same I think? Shulk: Ult best, 4 worst Bowser Jr: Roughly the same Duck Hunt: Roughly the same Ryu: 4 best, pre patch Ult worst Cloud: 4 best, Ult worst by default Corrin: Pre patch 4 best, Ult worst Bayo: Pre patch 4 best, pre patch Ult worst

Where’s brawl?

Am I missing something we missed a lot of characters for this to be every character

@dinglemcdangledongle

9 ай бұрын

no smash 64 characters were included. they made a separate video for it

Mewtwo was way worse in melee imo

is brawl falco not the best falco? that short hop double laser, the chaingrab, dacus... sure he doesn't have shine so no pillar combos, but he's still a top 4 character in that game too for a reason.

It's always so important for me to remind myself that I'm not a competitive player and to not apply my own experiences to your opinions lmao I played an absolute metric ton of ivysaur in brawl and regularly kicked my friends' asses lmao. but I'm no comp player nor have I ever tried to be project m ivysaur best tho

bro how is ult mewtwo considered the worst one when melee mewtwo exists

I think best sheik's version is Sheik Melee

Tbh the worst mewtwo should have gone to melee

Wait, if Ultimate Marth was really bad, similar to how Marth was in Smash 4 before getting buffed, then which version of Marth was worse before getting buffed? Smash 4 or Ultimate?

The only thing I disagree with is that Brawl Climbers are better than Melee Ice Climbers. Wobbling is my explanation haha

@evanshanley8110

9 ай бұрын

ics' chain grabbing in brawl is just as good as wobbling, plus wobbling is banned now anyway

@aqua_serene

9 ай бұрын

@evanshanley8110 Wobbling was so good it was bannworthy. You could argue the chain grab was banworthy too, but like half the cast had broken chain grabs in that game.

@LarryLurr

9 ай бұрын

They only banned Wobbling because Melee players dislike how easy it is to do and feel like it makes matches less fun to watch/play. Even with the technique legal they're not considered better than the other top tiers

I agree with every choice exwpt mewtwo his worst version is in melee.

I literally thought Peach's and Sheik's best iteration was Melee. They're top tier compared to the rest of the games.

@TriopsTrilobite

8 ай бұрын

Sheik was top tier in smash4. Considered the best pre dlc

@TriopsTrilobite

8 ай бұрын

Sheik was top tier in smash4. Considered the best pre dlc

18:46 uuh you meant Melee Mewtwo and Ultimate Mewtwo right? 😅

@evanshanley8110

9 ай бұрын

no he was talking about the pre-patch version of smash 4 mewtwo

still waiting for brawl

I don’t think it’s arguable that bowsers the worst melee character

Well, I did commit on the last video that I will subscribe if you made the best and worst versions of melee characters and I did subscribe, but next time please don't take too long.

17:55 the best Version of Mewtwo was Project M 3.0 that boi was Broken even tho it’s a Modern Game I’d say 3.0 Mewtwo was the Best version Smash 4 at 2nd and 3rd ofc melee

Ultimate Mewtwo is so unbelievably better than Melee Mewtwo was. Not even close.