Owner of the S2000 CR featured here...I paid mid $20k's for it as 7th owner with 90k miles on it and terrible paint

@FatalFist

2 жыл бұрын

It does just go to show how even primitive engineering still stands competitively against modern era. That’s so cool.

@Superkamikazee

2 жыл бұрын

It was a pretty pricey car for its time, equivalent to $45k today. Comparing it to a $30k car today, the BRZ.

@hossemadian7127

2 жыл бұрын

@@FatalFist Not sure about that. All these cars are back to the basics sport coupes. The point is to be basic. They all have LSD, RWD, and manual tranny.

@aavalos7760

Жыл бұрын

@@FatalFist I mean, the original S2k wasn't even in the same segment as the Miata back then.

@supra1722

Жыл бұрын

how can the S2000 be described as 'primitive' in any way. it's not a C6 on leaf springs or something. double wishbones and aluminum construction.

The fact that the s2000 is even being compared to these brand new cars just goes to show how good of a car it was/is. An engineering masterpiece.

@TheDalitis8

2 жыл бұрын

One of the best cars ever made. The end.

@CapFlipGaming

2 жыл бұрын

I wish Honda would pull their head out if their ass and make another. Their new cars are pretty "meh" unless you go Type R.

@TheDalitis8

2 жыл бұрын

@Damian Chiliński those are more expensive and higher spec cars than the S2000. Even so, the S2K is still the better driver's car. Even so, I agree with your first point. The mx5 and the brz are specifically designed to be retro and old school. And we should thank Mazda and Subaru for it.

@alpe3784

2 жыл бұрын

the s2000 is a masterpiece on wheels,the miata and brz are pretty basic little fun car but thats it.

@scottanthony3426

2 жыл бұрын

@@CapFlipGaming Honda would be challenged to repeat this level of performance in today's world. If I remember correctly, one of the reasons the S2000 went away was because they couldn't make side air bags work (without perhaps unacceptable sacrifices). So, to make a modern version, they'd be saddled with requirements that did not exist back in the day. keeping weight down with the extra "baggage" would mean more lightweight materials leading to even higher cost. Not saying it couldn't be done, but whether it could be done at a price point that would make it viable for Honda in today's market is another story. Unfortunately, it seems that the resale price curve initially dipped enough for clowns to buy these cars and thrash them or slap on half baked mods. Now the re-sale prices are in a steep climb as it becomes more difficult to find one with a good pedigree. The author's suggestion of 30K is a bit optimistic in the Miata with the Club Sport package (which nets the limited slip, Brembo's, BBS wheels, etc_) Those seem to run closer to 33-35, which is a lot for a car that lacks badly in utility for many of us. But as noted, any of these three are a hoot to drive, and a far cry from the sterile EV's out there with automatic dog washers.

We should realize how lucky we are that it's now 20 years after the S2000 and we still have new BRZ/86 models. I'm not looking for a future dystopia society where we have nothing but 4 wheel drive electric cars

@AnthonyTrifoglio

2 жыл бұрын

The worst irony is the fact that electric cars are no more environmentally friendly than gas cars, and potentially worse, and if we pushed for E85 or even E100 cars we'd be doing the environment more good. Also 100 corporations produce 70% of total global emissions

@tamwoof

2 жыл бұрын

I agree with you and ur avatar is awesome!

@jimbochoo3316

2 жыл бұрын

@@AnthonyTrifoglio The way humans live in general is very environmentally wasteful. Electric cars is not the solution that will solve our environmental problems. It takes a lot of material and energy to power electric cars. The way to save our planet is to drastically change the way we live. We need to condense our cities where we wouldn't even need cars to get around.

@flush_entity

2 жыл бұрын

As long as there are car enthusiasts, i dont think they'll all be AWD electrics. There will be rwd, for sure.

@tommynobaka

2 жыл бұрын

@@AnthonyTrifoglio these are all facts. to bring your point further, ICE has been efficient as ever they've just gained so much weight from luxuries. Imagine a new barebones car with a modern ICE drivetrain and relatively low weight. In theory it should have great fuel economy. Also, synthetic corn fuel is becoming a thing so traditional fuel isn't going anywhere. Couple with the fact the U.S. infrastructure isn't set for a full EV evolution across the whole of the country. Maybe only major cities equiped with recharge stations.

I thought loved the sound of the Miata's engine until you started driving the S2000. What a beautiful sound that thing makes.

@Zygrene

2 жыл бұрын

Can't beat that S2000 induction noise! No exhaust needed.

@heavyd2249

2 жыл бұрын

Can't say the same for the BRZ. Sounds terrible

@shaggyman8564

2 жыл бұрын

I bought the S2000, sight unseen, when it first came out. It was the closest thing to meth on wheels. Keeping this car in the sweet spot, between 5000 and 8500 rpm was loud and raucous. I like my brz better, though, with the fake engine noise . Am I the only person who likes the fake engine noise? It's like a beautiful women faking a organism. It still sounds real to me.

@johngezon1220

2 жыл бұрын

They are blissful, if you ever get the chance to take one for a spin, do it.

@shaggyman8564

2 жыл бұрын

@@heavyd2249 i bet you drive a pinto. The brz is the best

I'm starting to think these comparisons are just excuses to drive another S2000. : p I would be doing the same thing if I could. Great content as always.

@Zygrene

2 жыл бұрын

You're absolutely on point and I make no excuses for my behavior.

@pchae1

2 жыл бұрын

His next video will be battle of the Silverstone Metallics: 2004 AP2 vs 2005 AP2.

@verdict1163

2 жыл бұрын

@@pchae1 hahaha. Silverstone is such a great color on them. Give me an '00 or '01 with the partial red leather interior. AP1 FTW

@michaelcourville4081

2 жыл бұрын

I have a 04 Silverstone s2k and I approve of all these comments

The S2K has to be one of the most timeless designs ever made. What a beauty, especially with the CR accessories.

I am glad someone else finally did this test. Great video. Having spent now a unbelievable amount of time in all three any of the three cars are great in their own right.

My favorite RWD Japanese cars right now. So long as Zygrene is talking about and driving S2000s, all is okay with the world. Keep your S2000s if you can swing another daily folks--but don't get too crazy in keeping the miles slow (for what and whom). Drive it while it it is fresh and parts are relatively accessible. Now If I were going to buy a sub 50K RWD platform, it would be a tough choice between the new BRZ and ND.2. As I currently have a used NB which is a hoot to drive, ad Turo'ed a ND.2 for an extend period in California, I have a connection with the ND and may go with it If I didn't need the added practically from there BRZ. The build quality of the ND.2 is amazing. And double wishbone life is good. All great cars that should be celebrated; and, we need to go out there and buy them support these manufacturers. Who knows how long these light weight, RWD, Naturally Aspired cars they will be around. Live today folks.

@ayowser01

2 жыл бұрын

if you keep track of the odometer, you won't be able to sleep at night.

@kdavid123186

2 жыл бұрын

Parts and aftermarket on s2000 has been expensive for years. Thanks to Covid all oem parts are even harder to get. Enjoy s2000 and drive it while you can. I tracked and raced down the mountain for years and move on. No regrets, it was same feeling with evo, enjoy it while you can.

@iainbagnall4825

2 жыл бұрын

If you are in the US, I am going to throw you a curveball/wildcard choice - Saturn Sky Redline. 260bhp 2l turbo ecotek (similar to the popular 2.4 ecotec that people swap into miatas), 290 with a simple chip from GM, push 320bhp quite easily with a stage1 kit. I've seen these listed as low as 7k in the last year. 10-12k for a low mileage one (and I mean under 20k miles low). Comes with an Aisen 5 speed manual (same one the polaris slingshot has actually), double wishbone at front, corvette style stressed member independent susp at back, torsen limited slip diff as standard on the redline. parts availability is good due to sharing a lot of components with other GM models, in spite of the retired badge. I would recommend the sky/solstice to anyone with used miata money who is finding miatas going crazy in value for even shitty examples - its more car for the money, Of course, I don't own one lol - I have a miata bought before prices went nuts. Test drove the sky redline recently and was very impressed, decided not to however because Im still too in love with my miata and dont need.... four cars.... three already too many... lol. But id recommend it to anyone wanting a cheap little roadster with surprisingly excellent performance. The Kappa platform (sky) is a bit heavier than the S2000, but the turbo more than compensates and the 5 speed/wide torque bands in the ecotek mean you can actually spend more time in power/torque sweet spot than an S2000 where you need to row the gears constantly to keep it in the sweet spot. Basically, like a 5 speed NB miata, but with about 2x the power and torque. The extra weight actually helps put the power down on the ground plus its about a 15-10 years newer design platform and engine than the NA and NB miata or even S2000 and will protect you better in a crash. If you are in Europe, esp UK - just get an S1 elise instead.

@kdavid123186

2 жыл бұрын

@@iainbagnall4825 bro sky are so underrated. Seen it tear it up at track

I always found these video super informative, you touch/discuss all the important things when you review these cars. Thank you. keep it up!

The fact that these cars are being compared to a decade+ older car just speaks to how good the s2000 is. Its just such a well balanced and fun car to drive. And imo looks d best too lol.

@lw1878

2 жыл бұрын

The S2K was a much more expensive car as well. $50K+ in today's money so it explains why they were able to make it so good.

@jameswillard1

2 жыл бұрын

Well considering these 2 are being compared to the S2000 simply in terms of fun to drive and that the S2000 was from an era when fun to drive cars were everywhere compared to today and how much harder it is to produce cars that duplicate that recipe because of government regulations for emissions and safety, I’d say Im more impressed with the fact that the BRZ/ND2 Miata are able to replicate most of that

@balazspinter4832

2 жыл бұрын

I love comments like this... yes Mate on todays money the s2000 were twice as expensive than these others... actually the s2000 was exactly twice as expensive when it came out than the miata... tell ya why the s2000 was the 50th anniversary model of Honda. In Europe it was the flagship model... that time the miata was 1.6 litres so s2000 and Miata has never been on the same level ever...

@ImBarryScottCSS

2 жыл бұрын

TWO decades, the clue is in the same.

@copperkeyracing6167

2 жыл бұрын

14years ago the 2008 2000CR hit the market. Adjusted for inflation, its a $48.2k car ($36.3k price in Dec 2007).

Another really great video! Really happy to see these three vehicles out, and being compared like this! I'm really hoping to pick up (Most likely the BRZ) someday soon, to finally get a taste of RWD.

S2000 FTW still 2+ decades later!!

What a person is looking for out of a sports car to serve as a 2nd car is likely going to be different than were it to serve as an only car. Even then, what one person is looking for is likely to vary from what other people might be looking for. The key to purchasing not only cars, but countless other things as well, is for a person to be realistic with themselves when it comes to how they are likely going to be using it, understanding their preferences (and budget of course). I appreciate you mentioning these things.

This is the first vid I've seen of yours and just want to say I really liked the review, you touched on all the points I was curious about, and you're very well spoken, excellent job! Looking forward to more

I own both, a supercharged s2000 and a supercharged mx5 ND. I love the MX5 in the twistys and on tight country roads. The s2000 is more fun on the track tho. But in the city and real life the mx5 pulls better off the line and is more fun on the B roads. I love both cars but the supercharged mx5 with Ohlins coilovers never fails to put a huge smile on my face

This is the exact video I needed! Thank you, I’m looking for my next project car for track use so S2K, GR86 and MX5 ND are all in contention! Great content 👍🏻

I like your review on each car. All of them are fun to drive. To me is a matter of taste, comfort and personal background. My background is mostly on race cars and race karts, thus my preference is the S2000. Also, being that I'm not tall nor fat I fit perfectly in it. Kudos!

Staying silent just demonstrates how connected this car makes you feel with it, it provides a true driving experience. And we can see that by your facial expressions... The S2000 is a really special machine, and the more years go by people realize that!

@Zygrene

2 жыл бұрын

Well said. I was clearly the most excited in the Honda!

@VirtualGuth

2 жыл бұрын

To be fair, the S2000 was built to a price point that would be considerably more than the other two when adjusted for inflation. In addition, S2000 prices (and certainly CR prices in particular) will likely continue to rise over the coming years putting it even further out of reach for many. Few would disagree that the S2000 is a special car, but what this video also shows is just how far the Miata and the BRZ have come by comparison. Though the BRZ can't go top-free, it offers added flexibility as a 2+2 coupe. It is a credit to Subaru and Toyota that the BRZ/GR86 is as capable as it is.

Good detailed video. S2000 last model year '09 says so much about how good it is. I would own BRZ as a daily driver and S2000 soft top as my 2nd car/ weekend canyon carver.

awesome comparison. like that you go over trims of the cars

Such a well put together video, love it!

Great job and an enjoyable watch. I’d be thrilled to own any of these three with a slight preference for the Miata.

This was so mature well versed and well said. Great video I enjoyed every second

This is a simple but genuinely good video and a genuinely good review! Good job!!! I subscribed.

A really useful and well considered review for those considering buying a new Mx5 RF or a BRZ/GR86 . The addition of the S2000 gives a great benchmark for the comparison. Thanks.

My third video of yours and I'm hooked. You have a common sense approach to your observations and discussion. I have found myself fully engaged and wanting to hear your next comment and/or assertion. I just purchased and am awaiting the delivery of a '23 BRZ premium and can't wait. I've found your discussion of yours to be very interesting and informative. Growing up in the Bay Area, i thought some of the roads you driving looked remotely familiar. I look forward to viewing more of your content while I wait for my BRZ to be delivered. (BTW ... I'm a new sub) Cheers and safe tracking ... Dave

Great real world detail thank you for taking the time to share your experiences 👍 best wishes for 2024

Nice review and breakdown of each car. I like how you described their characteristics and how they could suit different tastes rather than just an outright "this one is the best". I think the thing that I'm most excited about is the fact that we have both the ND2 and gr86/BRZ options at around $30k, and when you consider how much an AP2 was when new the value is amazing.

Thanks for the insights... U were very clear and unbiased.... I enjoyed your video...

The S2000 is not bad to live with as an only car as long as you keep the motor mounts stock, have no holes in the soft top, and don't drive on 200TWs.

@itzzkittens3198

2 жыл бұрын

Naw S2K on RT660s or A052s is the meta, your balls gotta be huge to dive in corners, and you gotta have the late braking skills of Lewis Hamilton

@Zygrene

2 жыл бұрын

Stock AP2 can be passable as a daily but I always get worried about parking these cars in public, even in broad daylight.

@chubby_miata

2 жыл бұрын

@@Zygrene word about parking S2000s in California. Just went down to Streets of Willow, overnight in a hotel. Wake up and see marks on my lock as if someone tried to hammer a screwdriver into it. Joke's on them my door lock was already broken.

@chubby_miata

2 жыл бұрын

@@itzzkittens3198 lol, I daily drove on RT 660s for the good half of 2021. 22000 miles per year. My wallet didn't thank me, neither did my ear drums.

@Instameng

2 жыл бұрын

I bought a salvage 03 that came with solid mounts and a mugen rep hardtop. Drove it last January from Oregon to Montana in winter, definitely an interesting drive. I threw Blizzaks on it to mess around in the snow from time to time and even go grocery shopping with it lol. It's not a bad car to daily drive. Luckily I don't have the theft issues like Cali does, most people don't even know what it is when they see it here.

My all time favorite review video 😍

@WatchingYoutubeVid

2 жыл бұрын

@@subatomicmolecules I already knew it was gonna be gud

I owned a Miata and did a LOT of wheel time in the S2000 selling them at Honda. The high revving nature of the S2000 can get to be very grating in heavy SoCal. And you are 100% correct that the "snick, snick" nature on that shifter is simply the best shifter EVER! However, since 99% of us will never see a race track, much less get on one, trackability is meaningless for most. (In sales, we call that selling the "dream".) I see these as "switchback champions" designed to give precise feeling in handling like a British Roadster of the 60's). I prefer a car that is LIGHT, tactile in feel and with great driver input. The BRZ & S2000 are almost identical in weight at 2,815 & 2,813 lbs respectively. However, the Miata is 2,341 lbs. That's 2 extra large adults you're dragging around every turn! As my automotive hero, Colin Chapman (Founder of Lotus) said decades ago, "Adding horsepower makes you faster in the straights. LIGHTNESS makes you faster EVERYWHERE!!! These cars were not designed for the "straights". A Mazda Miata soft top WILL be my next 2nd car once again.

@Aiumy91

2 жыл бұрын

But if you have to choose between BRZ and MX-5 as first and only daily driver?

@Moriggia

2 жыл бұрын

@@Aiumy91 I think MX-5 is cheaper to maintain, if you don't care about space I would go MX-5 if you need more space and a solid roof BRZ/GR86.

@spitfirezip100

2 жыл бұрын

Interesting how there are widely different perspectives, I've owned 2 s2000's previously, sold the second one to help pay for school, and now I'm back in the market for another RWD fun car. I had the chance to drive a stock RF GT-S 2019 ND2 on some great, very tight canyon roads and I had a blast, it's extremely forgiving and playful. However after years of driving the S2000, doing lots of canyon time in it and several track days, somehow the Miata just wasn't enough. I found the limits of the tires very quickly in it and had fun hooning around in it, but it's just not sharp enough for my tastes. Logically the Mx-5 should win, it's new, whereas the newest S2000 you can buy is from 2009, and it would be much cheaper to maintain and upgrade the Miata. But I find that in my mind I was chasing the S2000 level of performance in the Miata which just isn't there, especially not engine and transmission wise. I started doing a lot of research into what mods I could do to the Miata... to make it match the performance of the S2000, but in the end I'd rather take a stock s2000 over a miata that was modified to bring it up to the level of performance of a S2000. I find myself trying to logically justify why the Miata is always the answer, but a "toy" car like this is not a decision driven by logic, but passion... Watching this video and listening to the sounds of the cars back to back... Remembering the feel of the shifter, the sound of the motor screaming at 8200 rpm... the look and functionality of the driver centric cockpit.... I think I'll be getting my 3rd S2000 after all...

@johntechwriter

2 жыл бұрын

@@spitfirezip100 The S2000 is the best pure sports car of the three. But how meaningful is this when the car is no longer in production? Honda did not compromise on power and ride stiffness when they designed this car, and so self-limited its sales to hard-core motorheads. And guess what? Too few of this endangered species remain in the USA to make the S2000 a viable business case for Honda to import. In a way, the car's excellence was its downfall. Mazda, on the other hand, provided the MX5 with all the sports car essentials as well as class-winning lightness and reliability. But wisely, they delivered American models softly sprung and bargain-priced. Americans whose idea of a sports car is a little roadster driven on sunny weekends at moderate speeds loved the MX5 from the year it was fret imported until this very day. And motorheads also love their MX5 when set up with the performance components they prefer from an unmatched aftermarket. Add everything up and you have a recipe for long-term success for Mazda -- one of the few sports cars to be profitable for their builder, to the point they can develop and improve the car over time. With a no-compromise car, Honda were forced to cease production of the S2000.

@gibbleway

Жыл бұрын

I'd nominate this as the most well rounded introspective analysis ever on youtube, you defeated common thinking of s2000 being king, and nailed the lightness of the miata in soulful mastery of opinion and I'd have to agrre and you also mentioned soft-top at that. Once you said light, tactile with great driver input I knew you were about to contest with the MIata no doubt. I got in the nd2, experienced exhilarating power with handling in the parking lot over doing donuts and I was pretty much blown away. I'd wanted one just on looks only since a teen looking at the na/nb cant remember. I ended up getting an nb2 with broken in miles pandemic year and enjoy it a lot, especially the cosmetics, too bad the ND has those taillights, which only look fine with the yesteryear's dark grey metallic whatever when they had the burgundy seats dont think that grey is still available but they nailed it that year with those colors given taillights super clean. Nd2 soft top club.

I absolutely loved this review. I have owed a BRZ and raced in Targa and Vinland Motorsports events. My brother bought an ND1. I love my NC brilliant black. Cheers

Great video on nice canyon roads, it's hard to find twisty roads in Chicago area. I think it would have been a level field of you chose a regular S2000. Using a CR, it was obvious what would happen. Next time wait for a BRZ with the performance package. Good video👍

This was like driving in the back mountains online. Thanks Man

What a great review! It's really good to see such an informed objective opinion on these vehicles especially considering that you have "skin in the game" as a BRZ owner. You haven't made my midlife crisis any easier though! Honda sound and gearbox? The practicality and grunt of the BRZ? The true to sports car philosophy and so, so nice styling of the Mazda? I guess the ute (I'm Australian) will have to do for now. Then again... my Wife needs a new car...?

Good job with this video. At this point, I like the ND2 Miata the best out of these three (and I own an AP2 S2000!).

Great post. Gave me a big smile for my day.

Great video. Where is this back road? Looks like an amazing cruise. Keep up the good work Zygrene!

if possible it would be very cool to see an elise thrown in here. great video btw!

BRZ. 1) A dealer can do it for you, electronically turning off the “Active Sound Control” feature. 2) You can pop off an access panel at the end of the dash, reach in, and unplug the sound module. Noise module delete available for ND2.

As an owner of a low mileage 2007 AP2 S-2000, I can truly say that it's one of the most fun cars that I've ever owned (btw, I'm 69 yrs. old). Most of the time, I drive it like I stole it.

Always seeing enjoy seeing a car which it's production ceased in 2009 being compared to others in 2020's. Just shows what a game charger the S2000 was between 1999 and 2009.

@qtest202

2 жыл бұрын

This is all you really need to know, S2000 destroys cars 20 years later, both shows how good it was and how garbage modern sports cars are with their fake engine notes, legion of electronic assists and bullshit that still don't help.

@AthenaAutocross

2 жыл бұрын

@@qtest202 The S2000 shouldn't even be compared to these cars. If the S2000 released today with inflation it would be a 50,000+ USD car. It not in the same class at all.

@qtest202

2 жыл бұрын

@@AthenaAutocross Hear hear!

@samster978

2 жыл бұрын

does it really destroy other cars?

@EnhancedTrashBin

2 жыл бұрын

@@samster978 maybe in a track yeah.

I think you have to consider the price factor as well. The resale price for the CR is insane! You can probably get a used RF + new BRZ for the price of one CR.

@Zeriel00

7 ай бұрын

THIS, Awesome car sure, but like the RX7 FD Collectors and scalpers have made it just way too expensive to be worth the purchase.

I totally thought that was a creative pan/dolly move at 19:55 😄 That guy needs to be hired as your cameraman. Here's to happy accidents... Great to get your take on these three. This is another one I've been waiting for.

I own a 2014 MX 5. 30 mpg, 0 to 100 in ten seconds, no rust at six years, 61k miles. If you parked it in that line up people would say, 'what's that' it looks so different. A true roadster expression. They changed to the rear faring in 2016.

Great video, I feel about the same as you do about how all of those cars feel. Have you ever driven / tracked a 2ZZ MR-S? It's my go to.

The S2000 is an absolute classic. I have once driven an S2000 Mk2 and NC1 Miata back-to-back to make a buying decision between the two. My heart said S2000 but believe it or not I ended up buying the NC1. Both were really clean low mileage examples, but the S2000 was still twice the price of the fully decked out NC1 Miata. Remember the S2000 was never really competing with Miatas in terms of price (S2000 was more in Porsche Boxter territory). So price obviously played a part in my buying decision, but sometimes I still regret not putting down the extra cash. That S2000 felt a lot sharper and exciting. But the reality was that I felt the Miata was way better as a daily driver, while still getting me like 80% of the fun at half the price when getting to the back roads. Now compare an S2000 with a Porsche Boxter of the same era. As raw and fun as the S2000 is, I'm still not sure what I'd choose.

Thanks for all these videos. They are really informative and technical unlike most of the 2022 brz videos which are just installs of wheels suspension and exhaust. I’m learning heaps about the car also. So you reckon if you add new coilovers and track the brz you will recommend at least 3-4 degrees negative camber ?? Does the stock car and suspension have any negative camber at all ? Like one degree even ?? Thanks 🙏

Amazing cars, amazing review. I choose the nd2 because its more fun even when ur not driving at the limit. Can you review the 2022 mx5, they added brake based torque vectoring they call it kpc. Imagine the nd2 with the bbr n.a power package, it give u cams n a bunch of stuff and makes it rev to 8000 rpm and make 220hp, but theres a difference in the european and north american mx5 ecu's so u cant use the tune they provide and u have to find someone who is able to work on the nd2 ecu which is very hard and it took untill mid 2021 for the first nd2 tune to come out.

Versus regular S2000, the CR also came factory equipped with rear tires sized up to 255, short throw shifter, ‘sport tuned’ exhaust, sound deadening gutted, and a chassis stiffener in place of the spare tire.

@DirtDude117

2 жыл бұрын

The rear tire is really just a size up the wheels are the same width as all AP2s. The CR shifter is the same as 00-09 shifters but the knob sits further down it. The exhaust is different and it does have more chassis stiffening, sway bars/shocks/springs, and an AP1 ratio steering rack with VGS.

Well done sir, excellent review 👏👏

The video we all needed

excellent reviews, thanks

Loved your video, nice and straightforward. What road is that mate?

I work in racing and even mildly prepped S2000’s with simple aero are consistently faster than they have any right to be.

@Zygrene

2 жыл бұрын

Double wishbone is underrated!

@endlesstwisties

2 жыл бұрын

@@Zygrene I hope you will try a 4th gen VTEC Prelude one day. I own both and cornering speed is just as good. Also double wishbone front and rear but longer wheelbase. And much closer to 50/50 than 5th gen you tested.

@mediocreman2

2 жыл бұрын

I think they have every right to be that fast.

I bought my ND2 last week, unfortunately within a period of 7 days rostered at work. I had three days off, and on both days I just went out and drove it on all of the twisty roads I could find and managed to go through a tank of fuel lol. The third day it was raining all day... Back at work, day 6 of 6 tomorrow and am praying for good weather to take it out again for a drive. Such a fun car.

Great video Zygrene! I was wondeering if the new Twins BRZ/86 comes with a spare tire. Also i been wondering how that NFC works... is it for quicker connection to the cars AA/Carplay?

love to get some tips from you on brake pad/fluid upgrades - I get my BRZ in April and its the first sports car i've had in 30-35 years. Looking forward to all the fun things to do with it.

@NahBra_EUC

2 жыл бұрын

Depends if its staying on street or going to the track. PMU club racer pads are great, I've used these on both street and track with good results. Prestone fluid is fine for street, it also will work for track but PMU fluid is worth it's price if you track often. 22' BRZ will be ready for track in a few days.

@Zygrene

2 жыл бұрын

I'll address this question in the next ZCT podcast!

@JeffMartinEquinox

2 жыл бұрын

@@Zygrene is that here on KZread or somewhere else?

@johngilmore7228

2 жыл бұрын

Carbotech AEx6 pads with ATE Super Blue Dot 4 fluid.

Very nice video, well done! Where did you test the car?

Great feedback.. I've driven the ND2 RF, previously owned a 1st gen BRZ and currently own a CR and couldn't agree more. Really need to try the new BRZ/GR86!

Great video! Thanks for your input.

@apolloandratti7922

2 жыл бұрын

unreal

Also tip to fix the understeer without replacing the suspension is run 0deg toe on all four corners

Not sure your comment re the first gen BRZ coming with Primacy "All Season" tires is correct. Mine is a '17 Ltd with Perf. Pack and OEM tires are the Primacy, but they are summer performance, not all-season. I have to run winter tires to cope with the cold winter temperatures. Anyway, nice reviews. Nice to have reviews by someone who really knows how to drive and wring out these cars, and dig out the more subtle differences. Would be fun to see a comparo with an older gen BRZ too. Interesting that the dyno is showing Subaru apparently sandbagged the numbers. Looking forward to driving one. I test drove a '16 Miata before I bought the BRZ and a couple things stood out. 1. It was really loud on the interstate - even at 60 mph, top up or down. 2. With the seating position, height of doors, rear seats, etc, it felt more like a T-top than convertible. 3. There is nowhere to put stuff in the cockpit if you have a passenger. Coats, purses, etc can only go in the footwell or trunk. Even if my BRZ backseats are small, I can put coats, hats, purses, etc back there. Some of the old old gen sports cars had a little area behind the seats. I think there is a hidden cubby behind the Miata driver's seat, but you have to be out of the car to get to it. That said, I did have to applaud the person I saw at Costco in a Miata with the passenger side stuffed full of Costco stuff. Way to make it work! (Of course his wife, whom he left in the store, was likely not nearly as impressed! LOL)

Interesting how there are widely different perspectives, I've owned 2 s2000's previously, sold the second one to help pay for school, and now I'm back in the market for another RWD fun car. I had the chance to drive a stock RF GT-S 2019 ND2 on some great, very tight canyon roads and I had a blast, it's extremely forgiving and playful. However after years of driving the S2000, doing lots of canyon time in it and several track days, somehow the Miata just wasn't enough. I found the limits of the tires very quickly in it and had fun hooning around in it, but it's just not sharp enough for my tastes. Logically the Mx-5 should win, it's new, whereas the newest S2000 you can buy is from 2009, and it would be much cheaper to maintain and upgrade the Miata. But I find that in my mind I was chasing the S2000 level of performance in the Miata which just isn't there, especially not engine and transmission wise. I started doing a lot of research into what mods I could do to the Miata... to make it match the performance of the S2000, but in the end I'd rather take a stock s2000 over a miata that was modified to bring it up to the level of performance of a S2000. I find myself trying to logically justify why the Miata is always the answer, but a "toy" car like this is not a decision driven by logic, but passion... Watching this video and listening to the sounds of the cars back to back... Remembering the feel of the shifter, the sound of the motor screaming at 8200 rpm... the look and functionality of the driver centric cockpit.... I think I'll be getting my 3rd S2000 after all...

@Zygrene

2 жыл бұрын

Great comment and I can definitely relate, having tons of seat time in various S2000s and 3+ hours in various ND1/2 Miatas. Keep in mind the quantifiable performance of a stock ND2 is still a tad better than a stock AP2 on the same tires. But I completely agree that the subjective feel of the S2000 is still in a league of its own, which is why I (like you) keep coming back to it after all these years.

@jasonscotta7129

2 жыл бұрын

Having owned all the vehicles in this video. Clean, low mileage S2000 have joined the 987.2 Cayman S territory. In which, I rather a 987.2 Cayman S over an S2000 everyday of the week and twice on Sunday’s.

Thanks for this video. My brother had 04 s2k with 20k miles and my brother in law had 14 brz. Both a driver totally different car. I will try to test drive a gr86 if available and nd2 but I really looking for new convertible. Nd2 is best choice

I've got offset strut tops on my BRZ, more caster, gives dynamic camber up front and a little heavier steering feel. Feels sweet but I don't do any autocross or anything. It would probably bump you up do the modified category.

Awesome review!

I could probably rock with the brz as a daily but where’s the fun in having what everyone else has or will have. I like driving the competition and I like how light the ND2 is plus the open air experience. I already have a corvette with a tiny cockpit so the nd2 won’t be much different. The brz is a very nice alternative if you need more space but it just won’t deliver the same experience as the nd1&2 because of the weight difference. So for a great majority of us, this is why Miata is always the answer😁

@sharodbell

2 жыл бұрын

I’m 6’2 by the way so I know about being a tight fit but it doesn’t matter to guys like myself.

Great review and driving bruv

Great comparo! Have you had a chance to drive a 370Z or new Supra? Wondering what your impressions are between the S2000 and modern Japanese muscle.

If you ever get the chance could you do a video on a fbo and tuned 8th gen Si? I’m not sure if I should keep mine stock or if fbo + tune would be worth the money

I miss s2000 i drove rsx type-s to ferrari 430' yet s2k was most fun car. It is just perfect fun car and it is not that slow in straight line either. When i srove s2k lotus elise was compitable. Ferrari was fun too but it is feel heavy and not as nimble as s2k. Now i am looking to get s2k again cuz i know i want fun car. Rsx' s2k' g35' m3 m5 amg c63 coupe maserati gt ferrari etc out of all those car s2k was far better car to have fun. Good video very nice comments. Good overall review.

Great video, thanks!

So are you not a fan of the Mishimito Shift knobs? Ive never been a fan of the Shift knobs shown here in the Miata and S2000 haha but we all have our Preferences, Great video bro 🙏🏽

Honestly I think it's a really simple answer for someone who's looking to buy. If it's your daily or only car, BRZ/GR 86 hands down. If it's 2nd or 3rd, then Miata if you want new or S2000 if you like old school. Can't go wrong.

@markplatter8394

2 жыл бұрын

I drove a used 2020 RF a couple of days ago. I am 5‘9“, 175 pounds, and found out that I could not recline the seat. It was a blast to drive, though.

@kevincrockett5155

2 жыл бұрын

A Miata as an only car can be tough depending on what other activities you're into but it, like the others are fun cars and will be light on the wallet.

S2k all day! Lol all three are amazing, but it definitely is nice to have a new car with a warranty! Great vid, would love to see a track review in the future with this same lineup

If you don't mind, please share the location of the road that was used in this video. The scenery is beautiful.

That smile on the face when driving the S2k, I can relate so much. Still nothing in its class comes close. Best regards from a fellow S2k owner from Germany. :-)

Being ever the pragmatist these cars are too costly for me in Canada, but i did splurge on an nc miata grand touring a month ago. It now waits for melting snow in my garage. Thanks for the review though. They are wonderful cars. I'm ok to have 4/5 of the fun at 1/5 the cost.

What is your camera gear?? Love your videos can’t wait for more

@Zygrene

2 жыл бұрын

Poverty status camera gear - 2 x GoPro Hero 8, 1 x GoPro Hero 4 Black, and Sony RX100V for b-roll.

Great job but you mentioned you were going to the track soon anyway 😉. I could enjoy any of these three but they're expensive for me. Too nice to beat up on gravel roads and daily traffic. S2000 is like get one before they're gone. So maybe but I can wait for the other two. Been thinking about the Acura RSX type s. Reasonable price,back seats and supposed to hold it's own against all comers. It's fwd but in a good way. Also have a sweet spot for the bugeye WRX. Currently daily the legendary ae86. Too nice for the real world and should be in a museum before some idiot rear ends me. I need a hammer of a car and the RSX may be my huckleberry.

As an s2000 owner this makes me very happy. What a car Honda built.

Have had a 13 Club Spec and an 18 Abarth. NC was my only vehicle for 5 years. Moderate snow was fine once you ditched the awful stock tires for decent all seasons. For a mid 20 something with no kids it was fine. Both cars sucked on long trips. They are loud. The NC seats killed your lower back after an hour. Both are very tiring on long drives. Noise is part of it, but with them tracking the road and very responsive to steering inputs requires paying more attention. Unless you have kids or need to haul large things there is no reason you cannot daily them. Trunk is big enough for costco runs. Both were cheap/reliable/fun cars. At this point I upgraded to a truck due to hobbies and fixing up a house. Sold the abarth for a viper which is not something I would recommend as a daily.

Amazing cars all three. Something I never liked about the MX5s and C7 Z51 I owned, was the inability to recline the seat to take a nap. The BRZ finally gives me this freedom 😄

@Zygrene

2 жыл бұрын

Underrated comment! Ability to recline for naps is key for a daily driver

@psewgobind

2 жыл бұрын

Very important for us enthusiast who love our car, we need to be able to sleep with it. I also did the reclining test on the GR86 and ideal for a nap.

@vlj1133

2 жыл бұрын

@A Z Long roadie, returning from Death Valley. Endless drone on Hwy 395 had me ready to nod off. Better to pull over and take a short snooze than be a safety risk to myself and others. I was really wishing that my ND2's seat reclined.

@CubanRider

2 жыл бұрын

If the concept of napping in a car seems odd to you, that's an easy way to tell you haven't been in the military. 😉

@psewgobind

2 жыл бұрын

@A Z Working night shift as Taxi drivers. But now, I do a 15min power nap after lunch. Also, waiting for wife, if I don't feel like like helping with grocery. Today, youngster are glued to their phone, but I'd rather take a nap in those down time.

I think this review was very fair, i'll still get a GR because i'm too tall for an ND2 and S2000 here are so expensive ! I don't have enough money to buy have two cars so i need that daily drivability. And man, who doesn't like a daily dose of drifting ?

What road are you driving on? I’ve been to Sonoma a few times as well. Not too far of a drive from humboldt

What was your Handling order again? Based on the roads you tested them all on in this video.

I used to pull the power steering fuse on my FRS, unassisted feel was great, but you have to have a bit of strength for it.

BRZ/86 are super nice and perfect as a daily as you said, it can definitely be your single car! (although maybe having a second truck/big suv, even old ones will probably comes handy) ND2 is so light and also pretty daily driveable imo, is also my favourite aesthetically speaking, you'll have a problem only when you'll need to carry more than one person and if you need to carry a lot of stuff. Let's be real: is hard and probably impossible at one point to live only with a miata, you should buy it a second car, this is the hard truth :'( The S2000 (I consider only the AP1) as of today is still the best honda ever made (IMO) and is also basically an investment if you care... Its biggest "flaw" is being old. Nothing else. Oh and costing 30k today is another problem I guess..... You can daily drive it probably for a week then you will probably want to drive something else, and it's fine like this. You should enjoy your S2k on weekends! So this makes it the perfect second or third car (if you're rich). So what do I think? There is one GIANT problem: I WANT THEM ALL 😫

Super excited to watch. Love my ND1 and definitely feel like upgrading to the ND2 lately. Don't find myself missing my S2000 anymore, like how the ND is more friendly everyday.

@jaydems2k10

2 жыл бұрын

Hair dresser lol.

@tealruby582

2 жыл бұрын

@@jaydems2k10tough talk from an AP1 owner 🧐

@f0rest10

2 жыл бұрын

@@tealruby582 h a i r d r e s s e r

@henrystephens1683

2 жыл бұрын

@@jaydems2k10 oh shut up

I foresaw the ending. I'm driving my CR this weekend for all the racecar lovers out there.

At 6foot 1inch, 225lbs and XXL shoulders, there's only one choice. GR86. That cockpit is completely design for a bigger guy. Huge, since every other weekend track car (except for Civic) is fitted for more normal body type. Sucks for me, cause now I have to get to work and acquire one.

I have a 21MX5 GT RF which has all the all the good bits of the club package And I love it. The only modification I have is The Guardian designs steering wheel Corsa series Which makes it much more enjoyable and stable stable for me when driving. The oem skinny steering wheel was the only downside in an otherwise enjoyable car so that was the hsd to go

Lol was stuck deciding between purchasing the s2k or GR86. Great vid. back to being indecisive lmao

Great content!

I've daily driven a ND1 RF for a month. I think it's good choice b/c the open top experience, and relatively soft damping. AP2 rides a bit more rougher and the engine feels more lively. Oddly I never drove a BRZ (not even the 1st gen) ...

@ForgetfulFoot

2 жыл бұрын

Not missing out on much. BRZ was probably the most disappointing car I have ever owned. My shitty old NA MX5 with 400,000kms feels more satisfying to drive. New BRZ seems a lot better. But now its got the issue of looking ugly and fake engine noise. Simply cant win. I will stick with my NC3 MX5 and Porsche Cayman. (I love the ND MX5, but it has no passenger legroom)

@copperkeyracing6167

2 жыл бұрын

@@ForgetfulFoot I feel the previous BRZ/FRS/GT86 were ugly, and childish looking, while now they look more upscale, refined, and better looking.

@patrickbateman7122

Жыл бұрын

@@ForgetfulFoot got a 19 BRZ and totally agree! It's soulless imo..

The high screaming VTEC and Honda shifter gearbox. Your right on the money Fenton, Honda’s MT gearbox is just pure magic.

@Zygrene

2 жыл бұрын

It just never gets old!

@iheartgs400

2 жыл бұрын

@@Zygrene I know right I’ve had several 8th Gen Si’s, CL9 TSX, now GD3 I just love now Honda manual gearbox is consistent just the right clutch pedal feedback and throw.

All three cars are fantastic. My choice would be the Miata since it's the most fun to drive and find it to be the most attractive. Especially the RF.

Hello, thank you for your video. Why do you say mx5 is less a daily car compared to BRZ? Doesn’t the Subaru have stiffer suspension and consume more gas? (And I think it is bigger also, as an European i care a lot). The clutch pedal instead? Who is the lighter?