A third reason, it is EASIER to go along with the crowd.

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

So true! We need ministers who have a backbone! Keep praying!

Two reasons especially if they have been around for sometime…1. Easy, they believe in the changes. 2. They will lose any and all retirement plan that they have earned, they will lose housing . The denomination may think they made the right move but they CAVED to earthly beings are NOT following Gods word. You don’t change Gods word you Obey Gods word.

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

Amen. Some I believe were deceived that the church wouldn't change but now it's clear. If you believe the Bible, you can't stay. You can't serve money and God - one has to take priority. Keep praying for the lost in this church.

I left the UMC ten days ago. The minister of less than 20 congregants is great; but, I can't support apostasy by gifts, service, or attendance.

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

Pray that all the rest will leave and a true church may form.

I understand the dilemma for a pastor to leave UMC before they can retire. Progressives are using that dilemma to keep pastors in the church against their will. What progressives seem to overlook is that they have and are driving the people with the money and the talent out of the church. What is coming is way worse than what has happened for UMC.

@johnbreitmeier3268

2 ай бұрын

It means that these pastors don't really believe that Jesu is real and can take care of his own. They are wells without water. No faith. Why are those people with money and skills stepping up to protect those vulnerable clergy? You all paid the UMC clergy's pensions who stayed in the evil church,

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

Amen. Ultimately, you have to be willing to give up all if needed. As Jesus said, you have to take up the cross - even if you lose your pension. Keep praying for the lost in this church and especially the pastors and leaders.

The UMC APOSTATIZED years ago!

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

There were large chunks of the church that were in apostasy, but many Christians believed they could turn the church around. General Conference 2024 was the final defeat. Please pray for the lost and deceived in this church.

As a son-in-law of a UMC member, my observation is that the ministers who didn't leave didn't do so because they tend to be compromised already because they, for years, have rejected the authority of Scripture (i.e. women pastors), and they are not used to having biblical convictions that stand against such modernistic trends.

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

Please pray for their repentance. The apostle Paul hated Christ and was converted. God grant salvation to these people through Christ!

Observation 1: Love for money is greater than love for God

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

Amen. Wealth and money is a trap that we all need to beware of. Keep praying they turn to Christ and repent.

There may be those who truly believe that they can help, in a small way, to bring the UMC back to what it used to be, to what it should be.

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

I've heard that rational. The problem I see is that they are leading people to remain in the UMC. The local church may be great, but eventually, they will move or their children go to college - and they will be inclined to first attend a UMC. Keep praying for the lost and deceived. God is able.

I have recently viewed many videos denouncing the evil apostasy within the United Methodist Church. Let me share my reflections from the mid to late 1980's; I know what many faithful UM laypeople and clergy have been experiencing. From 1985 to 1988 I studied for ordination. The seminary was totally sold-out to Politically Correct ideology. Every aspect of theology: sin, salvation, faith, morality, justice, hope, love, etc. was redefined in PC terms and the PC Obsessive Binary. I realized that PC was unbiblical and evil; now I realize it even more so. After three months at the seminary, I realized painfully that the seminary was highly evil; a spiritual brothel. I had the proper motives at first, but I shortly realized that my dreams of serving Christ and his truth would never come true; and I stayed essentially with the motives of a hireling. I knew that I was compromising with evil by harboring a hireling motive and even staying in this demonic environment and felt that before much longer I would feel God's wrath for compromising with evil by remaining. Surely, it happened. I did not trust that God would provide for me if I left the seminary, but remained for the wrong reasons. Fortunately, though it took over a decade, I regained my faith in God & his love after a decade in the desert. I found a small conservative church which helped me regain my faith in God, and is now a blessed refuge from the evil in the world. I realize more and more why PC is evil, ungodly, and nothing but a demonic deception, though it would take much time to explain here. PC is not a "prophetic" movement for justice and the "oppressed" at all- it benefits the top 1% of "white males" more than 99% of everyone else. I encourage all those who are suffering from the OPPRESSION by the Progressive BULLIES who control the mainline churches to consider what I am sharing and to prayerfully consult God about it.

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

I feel your pain and distress. I also was faced with the issue of leaving but God did provide - but not without some hard and scary times. I'm praying for you and asking you to keep praying for the lost and deceived - especially in the seminaries. Christ is still king.

I participated in and then watched this fight for 40 years. the cowardly ministers always covered their own cowardice with, "we must stay and fight", but of course, they never really fought. We are NEVER commanded in Scripture to "stay and fight". We are commanded to "go out from among them"

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

Amen. It was always, "this is not the hill to die on." Finally, there were no hills left. Keep praying they repent and believe the gospel.

REASON #3. Maybe the pastor wanted to remain in the "denomination" (not biblical, BTW), and be salt and light in a dark and lost organization. I wouldn't do it, but some men might.

@RyanTehPyro

2 ай бұрын

They’d be doing their congregation a disservice not rebuking the GC actions and the UMC as an organization. Bearing their teeth so to speak against the adversary. I’ve found the UMC pastors to be far too room temperature and weak to truly lead and get into tough scripture. And if they speak up I am sure they’d be removed these days 😓

@cjpreach

2 ай бұрын

@@RyanTehPyro Probably true.

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

He could make that excuse in the past and it might have been valid. But now, remaining in this church, he is sending money to support evil. If he can't see this, he shouldn't be in the pastorate. Keep praying - God can work miracles.

@cjpreach

2 ай бұрын

@@biblewalkwithjohn Yeah, I guess so. It's so hard to see a once dynamic denomination willingly reject the King of Glory.

Don't he believe the Lord will supply all his needs according to his riches and glory and do more exceedingly abundantly what he can ask for or begin to imagine.

@johnbreitmeier3268

2 ай бұрын

No they clearly do not. The ones who really trusted Christ left decades ago and are still fine. It is the fearful and faithless who are staying on a sinking ship.

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

I'm reminded that in Revelation, the cowardly are cast into the lake of fire. They might have been deceived in the past but now there is no excuse unless they are suing the denomination to get out. Keep praying for the lost. God is able.

Stayed for that good retirement package.

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

So true. I've heard that some conferences threatened retired pastors with cutting off their health insurance if they left. Keep praying for the lost and deceived and that God would give the pastors and churches courage.

God is speaking...are ears listening...not just hearing sounds that form words...

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

Pray that God takes away their spiritual deafness!

I think it partly depends on what the UMC decision means for local congregations. Is a local congregation now obliged to follow those decisions, or is it left to the decision of each local congregation how far to go with this? Is a minister now being forced to conduct same-sex weddings against their conscience? Or can a local congregation and an individual clergyperson still say “no”? If there is still a high degree of local church and clergy autonomy, I can see why a pastor might choose to stay, especially if they still have the opportunity to preach the Gospel clearly and without compromise in that place. But I can guarantee you that there will eventually be a lot of pressure from higher church courts on the non-conforming pastors to get in line.

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

Amen. I can understand the reasoning. However, I don't think Bible believing pastors will be left alone for long. And when they leave because of retirement or illness, it will be the conference that appoints the next pastor. Keep praying for the lost and deceived in these churches and courage for them to do the right thing. Christ is still king.

I believe this is what happened in the church thst I attend.

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

I'm so sorry. I pray you find a faithful church. Keep praying for the lost. God is able.

Have family that are UMC… Why don’t pastors leave? Retirement fund. Point blank. Money.

@biblewalkwithjohn

25 күн бұрын

I'm afraid you are right. Keep praying for pastors that they choose to follow Christ instead of cash.

Prophetically warned, but choosing their own way, they follow their own paths to Hell & beyond

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

Amen. Keep praying, they may repent and follow Christ and not the world.

Why dont orthodox United Methodists form their own Methodist Church

@biblewalkwithjohn

25 күн бұрын

Some have. The Global Methodist is one group. I'm sure there are others. Keep praying for the lost and deceived.

Money and a free parsonage is why they don't leave. The love of money is the root of ALL EVIL.

@joycewright5386

Ай бұрын

Suppose you had a family and you were going to lose everything at once: your job, your home, your pension,and your church. It is a very very difficult decision and one I am glad I don’t have to make.

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

Jesus said to take up our cross and follow him. He never said it would be easy. Many ministers slowly drift into thinking they don't have to make a choice - but that's exactly what Jesus called us to do. Keep praying for the lost and deceived.

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

I agree. I had to make that choice back in 1989 and it's not easy. Keep praying that they won't choose security over Christ.

Very sad 😢

Hey! May I come in? I'm of course an absolute outsider to this thread, YT gave me the video, and I wish just to have my 2 cents on the matter: I don't believe you're right on your #1, if I'm understanding that well. Big Evangelical congregations have already left UMC and they're elsewhere right now, save for the ones still dealing with both denominational or state side bureaucracies to simply have their activities regularized for good. The few Pastors remaining on that front are those whose congregations refused to leave and those will deal with it till they get retired. Most of them wouldn't be pretty young by the way. But I can perfectly to understand your #2. Several Pastors will to ask themselves "where would I go without my community?" and then, yes, that should have economical consequences for both them and their communities. From one day to another, they'd be without a congregation and the congregation without a Pastor. Remain would be a compromise to not let anyone behind. Permit me just to add a #3: Rural area communities have nowhere to go without the main denomination: Imagine "that" rural area Parish with just 20 members attending weekly? Where would they go without the main denomination? Bust at best; each one to their home and the property sold to someone else at worst, and no Pastor to serve them.

@jfranklinlewis

2 ай бұрын

They have an option. The Global Methodist Church. They provide some of that support.

@stevegrimes6326

2 ай бұрын

He forgot the real reason many pastors don't leave: They believe the general conference got it right.

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

I thought about #1 quite a bit because of knowing a large church here. The pastor was saying 4 or 5 years ago that they were going to leave - but when push came to shove, they stayed. I can't say exactly why but there comes a time when you have to take a stand - no matter how painful it is. Please keep praying for these churches.

Because they have never understood scripture.

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

Even worse. They understood and rejected it.

@jamesstrohl2016

2 ай бұрын

@@biblewalkwithjohn This separation falls back to Genesis 3. "And you will be like God." They tend to refuse to keep the word "Like" in the verse.

My mother and step father were very active. I had to go to MYF every Sunday night after having gone in the morning. Today 70 years later I am an atheist. I find this whole thing hilarious. It is all about

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

Yet God still exists - even if you don't believe. Praying that God will open your eyes and you will find the savior Jesus Christ. At age 70, close to my age, there's not too many years before you will stand before Him in judgment.

Sounds like it's either money or ego or he's a false preacher. There is no other reason to stay.

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

Amen. Pray for these pastors to grow a spine and have the courage of their convictions. Also, pray for the lost and deceived in this church.

I don't find his rationalizing to be satisfactory or correct. A Pastor who is not teaching the Word of God and is not willing to defend it is not being faithful and should be avoided. Regarding this nonsense about paying to leave a denomination. The church is not a building or facilities, it's people who believe that Christ has redeemed them thru his death and resurrection. It costs absolutely nothing to gather at another location and worship together. People are making the small things the important things.

@biblewalkwithjohn

2 ай бұрын

I agree. I'm not defending these people - just trying to understand their rational. A real shepherd guards the sheep.

Plz stop babbling let get to the point plz

they don't want to lose their "retirement"

@seanautilis15

Ай бұрын

I was a Methodist my entire life, but I only found 3 ministers who spoke the hard truths. they were too afraid.

@biblewalkwithjohn

Ай бұрын

I wonder if they ever read or preached on "take up your cross and follow me." Keep praying they repent and believe the gospel.