My name is Mark Carder. My goal is to eventually cover all essential instruction for painting realism in oil so that anyone can learn to paint for free.
Thank you so much! Your instructions are so comprehensive. I have been painting and studying painting for many many years and a simple concept like this just got away from me. I love working with a limited palette, it gives me so much clarity. One question though - doesn't Alizarin Crimson shift a bit towards blue?
@patrollston72115 сағат бұрын
Very informative, thank you! just one question, what causes the paint to become so flat?
@nestingbirdcreationsКүн бұрын
This is the second comment I have tried to post-not sure what happened to the first. I think the question every artist should be asking is “How do I protect myself from becoming an AI victim?” No, I am not against the use of ai per se; however, as an artist I DO care about my images and personal information being scraped off the internet and used without my consent. Currently companies using ai have relatively few safeguards in place for how scraped information is used, and many datasets that “train” ai programs include copyrighted images! In the linked story from the University of Chicago, one person found her personal medical photos on a dataset…. I don’t know what the solution would be for artists. One would hope that individuals would be given a clear opt out when a web crawler prepares to scrape their images or other data; however, right now none exist as far as I am aware. And once it’s out there, your only recourse is to find that data and request it be removed. Good luck with that! “Glaze” (see link for more info) is one program which artists can use to help protect themselves and their art. It is not a perfect fix, however, and will likely not stop all bad actors. From Glaze: “Glaze is a system designed to protect human artists by disrupting style mimicry. At a high level, Glaze works by understanding the AI models that are training on human art, and using machine learning algorithms, computing a set of minimal changes to artworks, such that it appears unchanged to human eyes, but appears to AI models like a dramatically different art style.” Link: glaze.cs.uchicago.edu/what-is-glaze.html Note: I am in no way affiliated with UofC, the creators of Glaze, or anything else mentioned in the article. I’m just a concerned amateur artist who really doesn’t want to even deal with any of this stuff. Hope this provides some food for thought.
@maureenstagg9561Күн бұрын
Ai equals a photo. Artists are not perfect.
@TheSLATEcleanerКүн бұрын
I think the tech folks trying to "improve" AI are making the programs worse at art. In the infancy of AI artwork [still somewhat, but they've been intentionally working on the systems to remove these expressions], it 'struggled' with two things consistently - hands and objects partially behind non-opaque substances/surfaces. The result of those were extremely strange hands and random color noise respectively, but if you look at images with those problems I think they touch at something very artistic. It relates an experience of hands rather than an accurate reproduction in a borderline surrealist/abstract impressionist manner. The random color noise ended up being these surprisingly interesting spots of non-objective art in the middle of an otherwise realist work, similar to some of the beloved action painting-inspired realist painters of the past couple decades [my partner called them "intuitive realists" in their MFA thesis owing to how they used realism as a vehicle for an expression of process in a similar vein to the action painters, some examples being Alex Kanevsky, Victor Wang, Jenny Saville, and Ann Gale]. And the creators of these engines saw those qualities and were like "no, not photo-realistic enough, edit that out", which is so boring and short-sighted.
@alansphotosКүн бұрын
Yes, AI is a tool. But what about the the pieces of images that are used to create AI? Shouldn't the original artists be compensated for the work used in the creation of a AI image? Is it stealing, infringement, or a copyright issue? The internet is not the endless bounty of "free images to copy" that people have adapted over the years, there are copyright laws. Has AI been trained to not use copyrighted images, NO. Can it be trained? The general consensus among programmers is yes. The main obstacle is money. Make more on subscriptions and spend less on programming that techniquely isn't illegal. Ethics, pure ethics, eroding more everyday.
@orkatelura2965Күн бұрын
Does that mean your beard has blue pigment?
@MrSilva9602 күн бұрын
I agree that A I is just a tool, those that prefer to sketch in paper, what is important is the person that is behind, precisely, are we who made,final results and is that what matters.
@donna-elizabeth2 күн бұрын
I think AI is a fantastic tool. I have generated so much just for entertainment purposes. Some have been bad, others have wowed me to the point I'd want them framed! It will never replace traditional art. Humans will always have a desire to create with their hands.
@MrIsaTube2 күн бұрын
Salaam! Absolutely, you are a true Artist... You remind me of those great Artist Professional and teachers from the Tyler School of Art in Philadelphia... Thank you... Your Channel is relavent. (Keep that one special secret to yourself) that your "Magic" 🌹
@jonyoder23562 күн бұрын
Is there something wrong with going after really high photo realistic style of painting? Most people don't have the space to step 10-15ft back to look at a painting in their house. I've been to a couple of European museums and have found that one tends to want to get close to a painting to look at the minute detail and for me it's disappointing to find that many are just a 'mess' up close. I always felt that the artist able to paint super realistic would be viewed as the better artist if compared to someone painting 'abstractly'.
@dockalra2 күн бұрын
amazing!
@ronjohnson45662 күн бұрын
ive pursued my masterpiece for 70 years now. every new idea, every new painting begins as a masterpiece and is most often good enough for me to try again. people have been expressing (happiness) themselves since the day adam and eve discovered basket weaving. all those apples needed to be gathered. i wonder what will happen to human expression after AI takes over the arts. will we humans still want portraits or replicas? (defined here as a close reproduction, especially by the maker of the original). Art created his replica and now they are the best of friends.
@barni423 күн бұрын
i was taught using a limited palette, 30 years ago now and still using the same palette range.
@user-uv6ns8ui8c3 күн бұрын
Thank you!!
@BigBangThief3 күн бұрын
Wow! For the first time, I have understood this correctly. Thank you very much for your helpful videos! 😍👍
@user-ci5gt7po4o3 күн бұрын
Mark you have so much courage. Your transparency has been so refreshing. Keep up the great work!! So thankful for you!!!
@ohiovic12363 күн бұрын
Great video .. but why you didn't finally blend it ?
@thepaintedspindle4 күн бұрын
I love the outlook of doing our own thing. I am teaching myself and there are so many rules that it gets completely overwhelming. I just recently attempted to "follow" some of those rules and was not happy with the result. I went back to "my style" and was so much more pleased with the outcome. So thank you for this.
@cindyrhodes4 күн бұрын
Interesting.
@guilhermenunes31304 күн бұрын
Franz Hals deserves a mention here as a true pioneer of "impressionism" or actual "realism" as well, together with Velazquez
@edisonchin24634 күн бұрын
Am I not broke enough???
@Worldconc4 күн бұрын
How to get that color
@romanavecerova95364 күн бұрын
Great speach !!! Thank you for your work ❤
@PradeepSingh-oj6uw4 күн бұрын
RESPECTED SIR 🙏 VERY TRUE THANK GOD WE WERE NOT BORN IN THIS TECHNO DRIVEN WORLD WHO ARE OUT TO CHALLENGE GODS CREATIONS 😂😂😂SOLAR STROMS ASTOROIDS HEADING TOWARDS THE EARTH AT 37000 MPH LIGHTING SPEED OH LORD SAVE THE 🌍
@americanpsychonaut4 күн бұрын
Now just need a tutorial on holding 16 brushes and knowing which is which at all times lol
@nadynau.74674 күн бұрын
I love the advice and excellent music!! You are so talented…
@Nutsboss4 күн бұрын
Amazing video I thought I didnt even consider that there are such techniques in brush work, was never soemthing that crossed my mind
@lawrencenoctor27034 күн бұрын
NO !
@peterelmer91144 күн бұрын
It’s a complex subject and not simple to untangle. The philosopher Vilem Flusser wrote extensively on the subject of photography and creativity; he saw the camera as a programmed machine that controlled the photographer’s creative intention by reducing all human decisions and actions to a permutation within a predetermined program. A.I. could be seen in the same way, in that a program generates imagery. I would say that A.I. can be art as it is created by a program designed by human intention - it’s up to us to decide if it is art; not all paintings are art and some A.I. Imagery can be art. Programs are simply tools for the production of something - from this, we decide if it’s art or not.
@powerofone16455 күн бұрын
Excellent vid. Much appreciated. Subscribed immediately.
@EcomCarl5 күн бұрын
The video beautifully captures how art not only enhances beauty and creativity in the world but also plays a crucial therapeutic role in personal growth. Embracing the challenges and joys of painting can profoundly impact our lives, underscoring the essential human need to create and express. 🎨
@catherinepoloynis5 күн бұрын
That's a great tune... sounds like a night out in the city on a rainy night.
@ripzippy5 күн бұрын
I can speak from experience on how painting and art have improved my well-being. I was stuck and frozen for.maany reasons. But, the primary change I noticed first was how I actually see the world. How I focus on the light and the colors. I do get the feeling of accomplishment when I have successes for sure and those are great. It's a deeper change that happens. I think it even activates parts of my mind that simply were not used. And I paint for the joy of painting. I don't want to sell my work. I don't want any expectations or value set to what I created. I have more fun finding them in coffee shops and such with a note on the back that says if you love this, it's yours to keep and enjoy.
@kerryemery26615 күн бұрын
Wow. It is deceiving indeed. Thanks again for the reminders. My background is originally as a photographer And this is part of the illusion one must be aware of. It can also be used as a tool. Thanks Mark for starting up the series again.. I always enjoy new content and discussions. Your oration is excellent. I believe I'll finally have the time to now start up painting again - and look forward to your guidance. Keep up the excellent work! (question: do you do any water scenes or seascapes?)
@johndoe-rq1pu5 күн бұрын
Becoming an addict might change your life too.
@rrresonance26 күн бұрын
Glad you're still making videos. Your videos on color mixing found me at a transformative point in my life. Helped me grow into who I am today. Cheers and best of luck.
@kategeary16236 күн бұрын
Mark, what AI service(s) do you recommend for generating images as source ideas?
@LittleMew1336 күн бұрын
The paradox is: people who want to improve usually see room for improvement. People who want to feel perfect find excuses to why they might already be perfect.
@LittleMew1336 күн бұрын
I was so proud of my first oil paintings. But now I kinda start to hate the new ones I make.
@EllieMandyArt6 күн бұрын
I stopped painting back at the beginning of this year and now I am experiencing a spiritual death. 💀 my depression is consuming me as my 9-5 job has taken my soul and my passion away. God help me please. 🙏
@JoyceAnderson-ChristianMusic6 күн бұрын
Where do I go to see these AI images?
@pedroclaudio34016 күн бұрын
In the way creation with AI is presented here, to answer the question of what is the essence of being an artist, maybe it is a matter of being able to appreciate IA just for what it is ? a tool to help reproducing an idea of something that already exists ? Also here you don't create art from scratch. and you don't actually make it with your own hands, words, whatever. Here, the tool you are using is involved in the conceptualization and the finish product. The tool is guiding you during the all process. So it has nothing to compare with a creation made entirely by a human. Yes it is a creation, yes you are a creator. but what type of creator? what level of creation? In an other situation, a human could make the entire conceptualization himself without AI, and having a tool to make the finish product, with a 3D printer. This time the conceptualization was made entirely by a human mind, but still, it can not be put at the same level as something who would have been made entirely with the own hands of a creator. It is just not the same. The essence of art is different with AI. The examples showed in this video are just what they truly are : they are the expression of an idea that someone has of what already exists. the idea you have of a city at dusk while it rains. the idea you have of jazz music. it is fine if a tool can help you reproduce what you have already seen or heard. But we all know it is not the same as a creation from a musician who creates music only by himself. We can appreciate things for what they are. With the knowledge of what makes great art. And if you can not aknowledge the difference, maybe it is because you never experienced or you don't remember the experience of the magic and beauty of pure human creation. For example pure improvisation can not be compared with AI random choices. A musician who creates music on the spur with his own inspiration coming from his guts, pouring all what he's got in an instant, with his own unique expression, this has a magical feeling. and that may touches you just because it is coming from a human. so human and unique. Maybe one day, someone, somewhere, created jazz music. it can be emulated with AI, but is not the same level and essence of art. We can aknowledge that without having to debate whether one is better than the other. Last but not least, a differentiation can be made according to the amount of effort and human decision are put into the creation. A parallel could be made with a puzzle of 4 pieces VS 1000 pieces. If you make a creation by clicking 4 times on 4 different premade material on your screen, it is only what it is. By the way, my apologies for the syntax errors, English is not my mother tongue. Maybe I should have used google translate or even AI to produce a better comprehensive text. Anyway this came from my own mind (I guess) and hopefully you get the essence of what I was trying to say. Thank you.
@ewlong10316 күн бұрын
Tell your stydent to paint the pots and make them with holes in the bottom, then sell them locally. Gardeners love painted pots and buy them all the time.
@ankitaraj6486 күн бұрын
Art has transformed me. I felt listless and hopeless despite being in therapy for 4 years. I struggled with outbursts of emotions and then I joined art school and I have hope. I have so much hope and I have desire again. Desire to build and create. Nothing else could have cured me. Through practicing art, I have experienced being.
@user-vp2rh6ko4g6 күн бұрын
Well, when it comes down to it, AI is just a tool. It can't create things on its own, it just follows instructions from the human brain and executes them. Sure, AI might lower the technical barriers to creation, but it can never replace the mindset of an artist.
@vinkizik6 күн бұрын
There are great images made by midjourney we need to stop avoiding that fact as well
@tpakzone6 күн бұрын
If the apocalypse ended and Joel made it out alive
@christinegalysh74336 күн бұрын
We keep on evolving. Thank you for this video , the tune makes us happy. All the best.
@ArchADB6 күн бұрын
I feel art is the one thing that AI will never be able to do. Taking AI out of it I think there is even a big difference between people that paint and draw, make and compose and Artists. There is a fuzzy line where something becomes Art. What that fuzzy line means or how you define it , I am not sure. This is what I am trying to explore.
Пікірлер
Thank you so much! Your instructions are so comprehensive. I have been painting and studying painting for many many years and a simple concept like this just got away from me. I love working with a limited palette, it gives me so much clarity. One question though - doesn't Alizarin Crimson shift a bit towards blue?
Very informative, thank you! just one question, what causes the paint to become so flat?
This is the second comment I have tried to post-not sure what happened to the first. I think the question every artist should be asking is “How do I protect myself from becoming an AI victim?” No, I am not against the use of ai per se; however, as an artist I DO care about my images and personal information being scraped off the internet and used without my consent. Currently companies using ai have relatively few safeguards in place for how scraped information is used, and many datasets that “train” ai programs include copyrighted images! In the linked story from the University of Chicago, one person found her personal medical photos on a dataset…. I don’t know what the solution would be for artists. One would hope that individuals would be given a clear opt out when a web crawler prepares to scrape their images or other data; however, right now none exist as far as I am aware. And once it’s out there, your only recourse is to find that data and request it be removed. Good luck with that! “Glaze” (see link for more info) is one program which artists can use to help protect themselves and their art. It is not a perfect fix, however, and will likely not stop all bad actors. From Glaze: “Glaze is a system designed to protect human artists by disrupting style mimicry. At a high level, Glaze works by understanding the AI models that are training on human art, and using machine learning algorithms, computing a set of minimal changes to artworks, such that it appears unchanged to human eyes, but appears to AI models like a dramatically different art style.” Link: glaze.cs.uchicago.edu/what-is-glaze.html Note: I am in no way affiliated with UofC, the creators of Glaze, or anything else mentioned in the article. I’m just a concerned amateur artist who really doesn’t want to even deal with any of this stuff. Hope this provides some food for thought.
Ai equals a photo. Artists are not perfect.
I think the tech folks trying to "improve" AI are making the programs worse at art. In the infancy of AI artwork [still somewhat, but they've been intentionally working on the systems to remove these expressions], it 'struggled' with two things consistently - hands and objects partially behind non-opaque substances/surfaces. The result of those were extremely strange hands and random color noise respectively, but if you look at images with those problems I think they touch at something very artistic. It relates an experience of hands rather than an accurate reproduction in a borderline surrealist/abstract impressionist manner. The random color noise ended up being these surprisingly interesting spots of non-objective art in the middle of an otherwise realist work, similar to some of the beloved action painting-inspired realist painters of the past couple decades [my partner called them "intuitive realists" in their MFA thesis owing to how they used realism as a vehicle for an expression of process in a similar vein to the action painters, some examples being Alex Kanevsky, Victor Wang, Jenny Saville, and Ann Gale]. And the creators of these engines saw those qualities and were like "no, not photo-realistic enough, edit that out", which is so boring and short-sighted.
Yes, AI is a tool. But what about the the pieces of images that are used to create AI? Shouldn't the original artists be compensated for the work used in the creation of a AI image? Is it stealing, infringement, or a copyright issue? The internet is not the endless bounty of "free images to copy" that people have adapted over the years, there are copyright laws. Has AI been trained to not use copyrighted images, NO. Can it be trained? The general consensus among programmers is yes. The main obstacle is money. Make more on subscriptions and spend less on programming that techniquely isn't illegal. Ethics, pure ethics, eroding more everyday.
Does that mean your beard has blue pigment?
I agree that A I is just a tool, those that prefer to sketch in paper, what is important is the person that is behind, precisely, are we who made,final results and is that what matters.
I think AI is a fantastic tool. I have generated so much just for entertainment purposes. Some have been bad, others have wowed me to the point I'd want them framed! It will never replace traditional art. Humans will always have a desire to create with their hands.
Salaam! Absolutely, you are a true Artist... You remind me of those great Artist Professional and teachers from the Tyler School of Art in Philadelphia... Thank you... Your Channel is relavent. (Keep that one special secret to yourself) that your "Magic" 🌹
Is there something wrong with going after really high photo realistic style of painting? Most people don't have the space to step 10-15ft back to look at a painting in their house. I've been to a couple of European museums and have found that one tends to want to get close to a painting to look at the minute detail and for me it's disappointing to find that many are just a 'mess' up close. I always felt that the artist able to paint super realistic would be viewed as the better artist if compared to someone painting 'abstractly'.
amazing!
ive pursued my masterpiece for 70 years now. every new idea, every new painting begins as a masterpiece and is most often good enough for me to try again. people have been expressing (happiness) themselves since the day adam and eve discovered basket weaving. all those apples needed to be gathered. i wonder what will happen to human expression after AI takes over the arts. will we humans still want portraits or replicas? (defined here as a close reproduction, especially by the maker of the original). Art created his replica and now they are the best of friends.
i was taught using a limited palette, 30 years ago now and still using the same palette range.
Thank you!!
Wow! For the first time, I have understood this correctly. Thank you very much for your helpful videos! 😍👍
Mark you have so much courage. Your transparency has been so refreshing. Keep up the great work!! So thankful for you!!!
Great video .. but why you didn't finally blend it ?
I love the outlook of doing our own thing. I am teaching myself and there are so many rules that it gets completely overwhelming. I just recently attempted to "follow" some of those rules and was not happy with the result. I went back to "my style" and was so much more pleased with the outcome. So thank you for this.
Interesting.
Franz Hals deserves a mention here as a true pioneer of "impressionism" or actual "realism" as well, together with Velazquez
Am I not broke enough???
How to get that color
Great speach !!! Thank you for your work ❤
RESPECTED SIR 🙏 VERY TRUE THANK GOD WE WERE NOT BORN IN THIS TECHNO DRIVEN WORLD WHO ARE OUT TO CHALLENGE GODS CREATIONS 😂😂😂SOLAR STROMS ASTOROIDS HEADING TOWARDS THE EARTH AT 37000 MPH LIGHTING SPEED OH LORD SAVE THE 🌍
Now just need a tutorial on holding 16 brushes and knowing which is which at all times lol
I love the advice and excellent music!! You are so talented…
Amazing video I thought I didnt even consider that there are such techniques in brush work, was never soemthing that crossed my mind
NO !
It’s a complex subject and not simple to untangle. The philosopher Vilem Flusser wrote extensively on the subject of photography and creativity; he saw the camera as a programmed machine that controlled the photographer’s creative intention by reducing all human decisions and actions to a permutation within a predetermined program. A.I. could be seen in the same way, in that a program generates imagery. I would say that A.I. can be art as it is created by a program designed by human intention - it’s up to us to decide if it is art; not all paintings are art and some A.I. Imagery can be art. Programs are simply tools for the production of something - from this, we decide if it’s art or not.
Excellent vid. Much appreciated. Subscribed immediately.
The video beautifully captures how art not only enhances beauty and creativity in the world but also plays a crucial therapeutic role in personal growth. Embracing the challenges and joys of painting can profoundly impact our lives, underscoring the essential human need to create and express. 🎨
That's a great tune... sounds like a night out in the city on a rainy night.
I can speak from experience on how painting and art have improved my well-being. I was stuck and frozen for.maany reasons. But, the primary change I noticed first was how I actually see the world. How I focus on the light and the colors. I do get the feeling of accomplishment when I have successes for sure and those are great. It's a deeper change that happens. I think it even activates parts of my mind that simply were not used. And I paint for the joy of painting. I don't want to sell my work. I don't want any expectations or value set to what I created. I have more fun finding them in coffee shops and such with a note on the back that says if you love this, it's yours to keep and enjoy.
Wow. It is deceiving indeed. Thanks again for the reminders. My background is originally as a photographer And this is part of the illusion one must be aware of. It can also be used as a tool. Thanks Mark for starting up the series again.. I always enjoy new content and discussions. Your oration is excellent. I believe I'll finally have the time to now start up painting again - and look forward to your guidance. Keep up the excellent work! (question: do you do any water scenes or seascapes?)
Becoming an addict might change your life too.
Glad you're still making videos. Your videos on color mixing found me at a transformative point in my life. Helped me grow into who I am today. Cheers and best of luck.
Mark, what AI service(s) do you recommend for generating images as source ideas?
The paradox is: people who want to improve usually see room for improvement. People who want to feel perfect find excuses to why they might already be perfect.
I was so proud of my first oil paintings. But now I kinda start to hate the new ones I make.
I stopped painting back at the beginning of this year and now I am experiencing a spiritual death. 💀 my depression is consuming me as my 9-5 job has taken my soul and my passion away. God help me please. 🙏
Where do I go to see these AI images?
In the way creation with AI is presented here, to answer the question of what is the essence of being an artist, maybe it is a matter of being able to appreciate IA just for what it is ? a tool to help reproducing an idea of something that already exists ? Also here you don't create art from scratch. and you don't actually make it with your own hands, words, whatever. Here, the tool you are using is involved in the conceptualization and the finish product. The tool is guiding you during the all process. So it has nothing to compare with a creation made entirely by a human. Yes it is a creation, yes you are a creator. but what type of creator? what level of creation? In an other situation, a human could make the entire conceptualization himself without AI, and having a tool to make the finish product, with a 3D printer. This time the conceptualization was made entirely by a human mind, but still, it can not be put at the same level as something who would have been made entirely with the own hands of a creator. It is just not the same. The essence of art is different with AI. The examples showed in this video are just what they truly are : they are the expression of an idea that someone has of what already exists. the idea you have of a city at dusk while it rains. the idea you have of jazz music. it is fine if a tool can help you reproduce what you have already seen or heard. But we all know it is not the same as a creation from a musician who creates music only by himself. We can appreciate things for what they are. With the knowledge of what makes great art. And if you can not aknowledge the difference, maybe it is because you never experienced or you don't remember the experience of the magic and beauty of pure human creation. For example pure improvisation can not be compared with AI random choices. A musician who creates music on the spur with his own inspiration coming from his guts, pouring all what he's got in an instant, with his own unique expression, this has a magical feeling. and that may touches you just because it is coming from a human. so human and unique. Maybe one day, someone, somewhere, created jazz music. it can be emulated with AI, but is not the same level and essence of art. We can aknowledge that without having to debate whether one is better than the other. Last but not least, a differentiation can be made according to the amount of effort and human decision are put into the creation. A parallel could be made with a puzzle of 4 pieces VS 1000 pieces. If you make a creation by clicking 4 times on 4 different premade material on your screen, it is only what it is. By the way, my apologies for the syntax errors, English is not my mother tongue. Maybe I should have used google translate or even AI to produce a better comprehensive text. Anyway this came from my own mind (I guess) and hopefully you get the essence of what I was trying to say. Thank you.
Tell your stydent to paint the pots and make them with holes in the bottom, then sell them locally. Gardeners love painted pots and buy them all the time.
Art has transformed me. I felt listless and hopeless despite being in therapy for 4 years. I struggled with outbursts of emotions and then I joined art school and I have hope. I have so much hope and I have desire again. Desire to build and create. Nothing else could have cured me. Through practicing art, I have experienced being.
Well, when it comes down to it, AI is just a tool. It can't create things on its own, it just follows instructions from the human brain and executes them. Sure, AI might lower the technical barriers to creation, but it can never replace the mindset of an artist.
There are great images made by midjourney we need to stop avoiding that fact as well
If the apocalypse ended and Joel made it out alive
We keep on evolving. Thank you for this video , the tune makes us happy. All the best.
I feel art is the one thing that AI will never be able to do. Taking AI out of it I think there is even a big difference between people that paint and draw, make and compose and Artists. There is a fuzzy line where something becomes Art. What that fuzzy line means or how you define it , I am not sure. This is what I am trying to explore.