Do you think that Rhys is real or is inside Joe's mind? Comment your thoughts below!

@miladaluscakova8845

Жыл бұрын

In reality, hes just a politician, but Joes mind halucinates him. It seems they want to do this with the story but i hope not, too basic.

@Anana315

Жыл бұрын

@@miladaluscakova8845 Yeah it’s basic but I wouldn’t mind. Especially if there’s another twist. Which is very possible. His student (the girl, I forgot her name) looks a little sus. She’s always there when he’s busy playing detective. And we still don’t know why she tried to break in Malcolm’s house. She lets Joe believe that she wrote him a love letter but that’s just too random. And Joe never read the letter so we don’t know what’s really in it. Overall, she’s too present not to be an important character. The hitman is weird too. I don’t get the point of him being there if he just lets Joe free right from the beginning. There has to be more. If they put him there just to justify Joe changing his identity, it would be a waste of a character because there is plenty of logical reasons to justify Joe becoming Jonathan, and more simple ways to do that too.

@Anana315

Жыл бұрын

@@miladaluscakova8845 Oh and there’s also the photographer. She’s there for a reason

@miladaluscakova8845

Жыл бұрын

@@Anana315 Yeah the photographer... I read that some people think that's Joe's mother but I think that's just crazy, but she definetely knows something. I understand, there's totally gonna be some other twist. I feel like the girl student will figure him out at some point but she doesn't know yet. People have so much theories that my head will explode. I saw a video where Joe opened malcoms secret notebook and there was Love's mothers name. Maybe It's going to be something different, I think people are conspiring too much like thinking that Rhys is Joe's brother, Candance had a triplet, the pee that Joe left in Peaches house will cause him trouble, or that love's still alive. Is this the final season btw? , I hope so, I wonder if it's gonna end with Joe dead, in jail or some facility, I would be pleseantly surprised if something else happend, just because it wouldn't be expected .

@samariam3043

Жыл бұрын

Anything other than Rhys being the killer would be better atp lol

Just saw part 2. Came to say this aged beautifully lmao

@kencas333

Жыл бұрын

same lol

@GabesEdtiz

Жыл бұрын

Fr. Dude’s a prophet. 😂

@asmaumohammed6232

Жыл бұрын

Exactly 😂

@ax3226

Жыл бұрын

@@GabesEdtiz why throw around big words for no reason

@IFeItYourShape

Жыл бұрын

@@ax3226 are you six years old or something

I'm SO glad that I didn't see this theory. You were right and I was pleasantly surprised by this plot twist.

@jessopo

Жыл бұрын

samee I’m glad I didn’t cause this would’ve spoilt the surprise for me😂

@MakeItUp19

Жыл бұрын

I did and I’m so mad! I denied it though. And it was right

@kdub3288

Жыл бұрын

Yep! I’m usually pretty good at seeing plot twists to a degree, but nope I missed this one completely. Pretty good and yet makes complete sense obviously

@ojs5988

Жыл бұрын

I did unfortunately, and it made so much sense that I was truly expecting it to turn out this way

@OverRule1

Жыл бұрын

That's why I never look up any shows or read any comments until I've watched it all. You have to be really naive to actually think you can do those things without getting spoiled

The initial text message that said "Hello, you" was what made me also believe this is happening in Joe's mind. That is Joe's catch phrase and I don't believe he's ever said it out loud to anyone....

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Very true!

@MariaPerez-fy5xk

Жыл бұрын

So true

@danwarner7816

Жыл бұрын

I think it's split personality. Where he unaware of his actions while blacked out

@Mpant.

Жыл бұрын

Exactly.

@lovettdeleted

Жыл бұрын

@@danwarner7816 ..that's literally what this video is saying...

I was getting a Sixth Sense vibe. No one ever interacts with Rhys when Joe is around him. I believe the man exist but Joe's split personality is manifesting as this man (because he admires him/redemption.) The friend group mentions Rhys but never interacting with him. Ever murder happens when Joe blacks out. I think the tv spot and the funeral speech is the real person. But every other time, Joe's is projecting this...sort of like Secret Window.

@danwarner7816

Жыл бұрын

More joker vibe to me

@morg2040

Жыл бұрын

I think he could see Rhys as a 'perfect' version of himself - he's a writer, comes from a mother that didn't take good care of him and had a father figure that was never present they relate there but Rhys is a better version of him; he's got a wealthy father who reached out to him and tried to be his father, he is a sucessful writer and all of that. It's clear he's supposed to be another 'mirror' character of Joe like Love was and they are doing the forcing Joe to look at himself kinda thing? Idk

@zarosderer4447

Жыл бұрын

Joe is innocent. Rhys is a pawn. He might got behind the real killer and for his enjoyment and candidacy he helped and coorpareted the real killer so he can habe a show and a framed kill to hunt for to win over the rich and win the presidency and takin revenge on scum people aka society.

@jlecampana

Жыл бұрын

It’s a very intuitive deduction! (Pun intended) dear Watson. Kate tells Joe at some point he’s a “shitty Sherlock” I think this is no coincidence, it’s like she’s telling him “How can you possibly not know YOU are the Killer!”

@jlecampana

Жыл бұрын

Also Joe is surprised Rhys is back from Berlin so soon! And that scene of them drinking reminded me of Jack drinking with the ghost bartender in the Shining.

Watching this after part 2. Is ultimately mind blowing.

@dorianoo1804

Жыл бұрын

Ikr 😂😂

Joe always finds about someone being dead after waking up. From asleep on his couch, asleep on the bench and asleep on the bush (after falling from the window). Anyone else noticed?

@hannahnuckols1730

Жыл бұрын

This is exactly what I was telling my sister and mom when we watched it. I was saying he was blacking out and killing people then not remembering it...they said it was far fetched, but I really don't think so.

@DanielJesusObsessedFit

Жыл бұрын

what about rhys knocking out the rich guy when he held a gun to Joe

@Werewolf581

Жыл бұрын

What about Joe getting thrown out the window before the lady gets killed?

@parkchanyeol1544

Жыл бұрын

@@quidproque76 because mental illnesses develop at any time. He was probably traumatised from what Marienne said to him about him just being a murderer so he had to disassociate from his actions somehow and developed an illness like this. It makes perfect sense

@SourGrasshopper

Жыл бұрын

The point that out in the show which is why I think it’s too obvious now

This is such a good prediction I almost feel like I just saw a spoiler. Rhys having no interactions with the other characters really sealed it for me, every part of his existence is potentially explainable by this theory. Great observations, and I can't wait to watch it play out!

@xxx-funandtheories8337

Жыл бұрын

Yeah but he was on the book cover that's a strange thing and would mean Joe is imagine everything

@unofficialbeautyqueen6624

Жыл бұрын

@@xxx-funandtheories8337no. He could very well still be a real person, but because Joe related so much to him, used him as a second identity in his head. So the real Rhys isn’t doing those things, but still is an author.

@xxx-funandtheories8337

Жыл бұрын

@UnofficialBeauty Queen yeah I left a comment on that too. He was on the book but even if in the end we see Joe on the books cover then maybe Joe killed the guy . Maybe it's even his apartment where joe is living in? How can he afford that place 😕

@kaycollarfeild

Жыл бұрын

@@xxx-funandtheories8337 I like that idea !

@xxx-funandtheories8337

Жыл бұрын

@@kaycollarfeild thank you 🙃

I’ve never seen a prediction on anything be so correct. You actually 100% nailed every little thing you said wow

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Haha, thanks a lot!

You forgot to mention that when they were having dinner, Rhys asked him “are you okay Jonathan? You look sick” something along those lines. Joe responded “I’m okay”, then Adam looked at him a little intrigued and asked “What did you say?” Which makes me believe Joe was talking to himself. Why would Adam ask that if he could clearly see that Joe was having a conversation with somebody else.

@rabbitreacts5982

Жыл бұрын

Right! That's when I knew something wasn't right and joe might be splitting his personality...unless Rhys was always there...like when Joe would have an inner monalauge but it manifested into another personality

@eileensnow6153

Жыл бұрын

2:19 - 2:30 he definitely didn’t forget to mention it lol

@unofficialbeautyqueen6624

Жыл бұрын

Yesss, I said this same thing on another videos comment.

@Anana315

Жыл бұрын

@@eileensnow6153 Yes he mentioned it but not the important details (in my opinion)

@Anana315

Жыл бұрын

@@rabbitreacts5982 Yes! And like he said in the video, there’s all the other scenes where Rhys is there but nobody seems to care. The only scene where people reacted to Rhys’s presence is the funeral. And it’s also the only scene where Rhys didn’t talk to Joe. Which means that was the real Rhys who doesn’t even know who Joe is.

My man predicted it all before it came on Netflix, mad props bro, keep the high level content up man. Much love but glad didnt see the video that time because it is so accurate.

The most obvious evidence supporting this theory is the beginning of episode 3, when Joe references Man of the Crowd by Edgar Allen Poe. In that story, a man becomes obsessed with someone he sees because he can't figure out who he is. He sees that the old man has a dagger under his cloak and follows him around the streets of London to deduce who he is. In analysis of this story, "It is heavily implied that these two men are two sides of the same person, and the old man represents a secrete side of the narrator, but the narrator is unable to see this. The old man may be looking for someone, or trying to escape the memory of a crime."

@jamjam0409

Жыл бұрын

Or it's about the girls he was obsessed with until now.

@koolkidtrav4424

Жыл бұрын

@@jamjam0409 it’s a story about two men who are actually the same person. You don’t throw that specific story into your show unless it means something.

@jamjam0409

Жыл бұрын

@@koolkidtrav4424 We'll see, then. My impression of this show was simplistic, cliche, and predictable so I didn't think about their encounter as more than two people meeting someone they can relate to. At the same time, it is pretty plausible as Rhys who talks with Joe seems to have a completely different personality from the one on TV.

@AkashRoy-xm7ip

Жыл бұрын

You are genius......just watched s4 part 2

@Maxrepfitgm

Жыл бұрын

You nailed it

This man had the script

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

I promise I didn't lol

aged like wine

It is unbelievable how good of a prediction this was.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Thanks a lot!

You have absolutely convinced me. It did seem a bit strange how Joe was protecting Kate given how messed up he's been in the past. In reality his subconscious is allowing him to be the good guy here by creating a situation where she is in danger giving him the perfect opening to be the white knight. He probably purposely (subconsciously) tried to frame Kate to ingratiate himself with her. Best of all, he's convincing himself that it's all genuine by putting the killings on an alter ego. Joe always has the complex where he's both absolutely pathological but also convinced that he's morally righteous, and this is just the next evolution of that.

@quanblown5033

Жыл бұрын

Ik ur high asf typing that 😂

@danwarner7816

Жыл бұрын

Nah current Joe is Jonathan Old s1-3 rhys is version of the "Joe" inside him

@xGrifo

Жыл бұрын

@@quanblown5033 i’m high off my ass reading this and my mind blown fr

@OngezwaDumel

Жыл бұрын

@@xGrifo same 😭

@birdi3beez

Жыл бұрын

That last sentence is so spot on. Like chef’s kiss. Not to spoil the ending of this season but I think he’s abandoned that way of thinking. It sets up a VERY interesting season 5, if they get it.

Yep. Like most people are saying, Rhys IS real but his presence in Joe's life and their relationship is probably all in Joe's head. It's like imagining you're married to your celebrity crush for example.

@jasmineclark6413

Жыл бұрын

Like black swan

@paprikaveronika

Жыл бұрын

yes, this is exactly what I was thinking all the time. there's a rhys, but it's not the one that talks with joe, neither the "killer". also I do believe that the moments where rhys is the "real rhys" are mixed with the others (for example when rhys did the interview on tv, I do believe that it was a genuine, real, interview, not related with all the villa-drama)

@mrchubmuffins8773

Жыл бұрын

Fuckin called it

@TorresSookdeo

Ай бұрын

​so who knocked out Joe in season 4 episode 5 and tied up his hands as well as the same too the other guy who was trying to shoot Joe @@paprikaveronika

When Rhys and Joe first meet, Rhys calls him Jonathan before he even introduces himself. This could point to this theory as well.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Very good point!

@jamicoleman6866

Жыл бұрын

I noticed that too

@smerkz1378

Жыл бұрын

What I don't get though is at the end of part 2 how was Joe chained up in that place if rhys isn't physically real? that's the only problem

@Ash-uf4fv

Жыл бұрын

@@smerkz1378 Joe's prolly dissociating then

@tweetttt7670

Жыл бұрын

Could’ve heard someone else call his name.

Also, when Joe witnesses the golden shower and the bodyguard searches him, Joe claims he's a writer and has the notepad. In all the seasons Joe was infatuated books but I never recall him being a "writer". I think using that excuse was more than just quick wit but also manifesting Rhys's persona either consciously or subconsciously

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Ah very good shout!

@MissBabyNe

Жыл бұрын

The notepad was Malcolm's blackmail booklet he took from searching his place.

@Jay-og4yb

Жыл бұрын

@@MissBabyNe yes true but Joe was too quick with the "I'm a writer" excuse. Rhys is a writer. That's op's point

@opalessential4097

Жыл бұрын

Also that’s more a psychological tactic I think because mentally his brain is creating a new reality instead of reading into the one he already has, almost like he’s …writing the narrative

@MaryJenevieve

Жыл бұрын

Amazing observation!

I believe that at the funeral it was actually the first time Joe saw Rhys in person. Notice how when Rhys was walking in to the funeral , he didn’t acknowledge joe. They locked eyes for a quick second but I didn’t get the impression that Rhys recognized a friend , it was sort of like he didn’t know who Joe was and just smiled due to Joes intense glare lol. There’s still a lot of questions though apart from the whole Rhys thing that I’m pretty sure will be answered. Like what’s up with the photographer lady ? That has to be a foreshadow or something , perhaps a reporter , maybe a spy for the Quinn family who knows. I think regardless there will be a twist with Rhys , because if he’s actually the killer I think that’ll be really mediocre writing , and love is definitely a hallucination because I don’t think they’d show her if she was alive , perhaps that moment we see in the trailer between her and Joe is when he realizes he’s crazy and the hallucination of love probably is the one to break the news to him.

@ethezeeb

Жыл бұрын

With you on all of the above... and been waiting for someone to comment about the photographer lady! Def seems to be foreshadowing, and PI seems like a good guess to me!

@LimitlessEntertainment826

Жыл бұрын

I completely agree with everything. I think the woman with the camera may be his mother but who knows. I have to disagree on one thing tho. I don't think saying Love is just a hallucination because they showed her in a trailer. You should never underestimate a companies yurn to make money. Even if they spoil something. It happens in pretty much every trailer to anything

@U794462

Жыл бұрын

Or maybe Joe and Love are the same person and the murders from season 3 were perpetrated by Joe and not Love. Dissociative Identity Disorder makes total sense and Joe's tendency towards violence may be the reason why Joe's mother placed him in an institution. Joe appears to be an unreliable narrator so it's difficult to accept his back story at face value.

@EmanEats

Жыл бұрын

i’m still wondering what he said to Phoebe. it was never explained and they kept bringing it up almost every ep!

@nathpi8410

Жыл бұрын

Just imagine, Joe being sure Rhys is the killer because he hallucinated him, but Rhys is actually a real person who never murders anyone. So Joe tried to stop the real Rhys who has no clue was going on because everything is in Joe's mind... That would be terrifying for him.

The most damning piece of evidence here is the fact that joe reads all the secret text messages in his narration when they’re sent, when this wasn’t something that he did before. when someone texted him, he narrated his OWN response, never someone else’s

@ulayla1605

Жыл бұрын

Omg good point

@RA-wp6th

Жыл бұрын

Tbh if it was narrated in the killers voice then it ruins the premise.

@frankie7384

Жыл бұрын

@@RA-wp6th I think they mean that nobody would narrate the killers texts, that Joe would on my read out his own response. If I remember correctly, in previous seasons whenever there is a text conversation with Joe, he comes up with a quip/reaction and then responds. Could be wrong

I’m so glad I didn’t see this video before part 2 because I was floored. I couldn’t believe he wasn’t real lol. I was so freaking shocked. And Here I was thinking the writers had forgotten just how psychotic Joe was and nope. No they. Did. Not! Part 2 was great

Very interesting. They are also wearing similar colours and outfits in all their scenes. I thought perhaps this is all a "who dunnit" story that Joe is writing. The story and the characters are really extravagant. We dont actually see what happens with Marienne so perhaps he has her trapped in his infamous glass cage and he is writing a book. Rhys is his "character" in the book.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Yes, very true - they often wore a very similar grey jumper! A very interesting thought on Marianne as well!

@marcialaboo3996

Жыл бұрын

That's a good theory!

@2cute2boot_

Жыл бұрын

Wow! That’s an incredible theory. Would much better fit Joes personality, I don’t believe he’s this rehabilitated serial killer

@cassiedion4144

Жыл бұрын

@@2cute2boot_yeah after season 2, it’s definitely not that. I also believe allot of the people he killed weren’t as bad as he claimed they were (talking about how the audience saw the victims he killed. In retrospect Peach was absolutely right to be suspicious of Joe)

@mackenziepalmer

Жыл бұрын

Wow, how you called that!

I was kinda disappointed Rhys was said to be the killer, it seemed way too obvious & boring. I really thought it was gonna be Nadia, and I’m ngI still kinda think she’s involved. But this theory makes it so much more interesting, so I hope you’re right.

@rollingrock450

Жыл бұрын

yeah I was hoping it was nadia who is revealed to be related to peach salinger from season 1 it would be dope

@unofficialbeautyqueen6624

Жыл бұрын

I thought that too but if anyone else is in on it, apart from Kate I feel like it would totally debunk any theory about Rhys being imaginary. Because then that would mean someone’s actually helping Joe commit all these crimes. Or at least knows of them.

@samariam3043

Жыл бұрын

Ugh I wanted it to be Nadia too! It makes way more sense that a young English writing student would have read Beck’s book, found out about Joe and decided in some way to exact revenge. They even alluded to her being a suspect when she coughed and dipped into her back pack when Joe received a text from his stalker and then when she asked Joe to retrieve a letter from Malcolms house. I thought she was trying to set him up.

@Natori_1999

Жыл бұрын

I kinda wanted it to be Kate 🤣

@Kwekwe

Жыл бұрын

I also thought it was Nadia until the Rhys reveal, but I'm now getting aboard this Rhys is Brad Pitt to Joe's Ed Norton (Fight Club) theory!

Also when Joe was being accused of being the killer, we did get flashbacks of Joe commiting all three murders

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

That is very true!

@HCProds1

Жыл бұрын

Probably was Joe but that's just because thats what Roual thought happened

@BethanyNash

Жыл бұрын

And I oop!! Haha this is such an excellent point

@Siderealmotion

Жыл бұрын

An extremely odd inclusion to show an audience who "knows" he didn't do it. A couple nifty details included in those flashbacks: he's wearing the same light colored suit as the person who killed Simon in the flashback, and you can see him limp when he walks in to kill Gemma.

I think RHYS exists in real , but JOE thinks RHYS is the killer and believes he is innocent

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Yeah that’s a good twist!

@krakesh5915

Жыл бұрын

@@BrainPilot after watching the trailer where Rhys closes the door on Joe I can just imagine this scene in my mind "Joe visits Rhys 's house and knocks on the door" "Rhys open the door and ask "who are you ?"" "Joe is shocked to hear and starts cussing and saying how Rhys is the murderer " "Rhys just closes the door and Joe interrupts it and maybe he might kill RHYs during the fight " And then JOE finally understands that he himself is the killer 💀

@danwarner7816

Жыл бұрын

@@krakesh5915 it's good twist sounds like joker twist to me in Joaquin phoenix film few years bk. I like see it play out but why suffering these blackouts now

@beatricebogoin6088

Жыл бұрын

Similar as Fight Club

@rup3rt752

Жыл бұрын

Ye but Rhys speaks at the funeral and we see people interact with him and laugh

I think you've nailed it. Here's another clue, Season 2 was loosely inspired on the movie Gone Girl directed by David Fincher, there's even the character of detective David Fincher who kills Forty at the end of S2. Not a longshot to think they're going the "Fight Club" way for S4, I think Marienne's rejection caused Joe to dissociate (Marienne tells him he's a killer and he couldn't cope) hence he hallucinates with Rhys, this is pretty much alike the movie Secret Window with Johnny Depp.

@unofficialbeautyqueen6624

Жыл бұрын

Yesss. I even saw someone theorize that Joe may have killed Marienne and not actually even let her go, despite us seeing him do so from his perspective. And creating Rhys, was in a way, him trying to cope with his actions.

@jlecampana

Жыл бұрын

@@unofficialbeautyqueen6624 Oh yes, hence the redemption arc he’s pursuing, I agree, Joe’s conversations with Rhys hold the key to understanding what happened with Marienne.

i need to start paying attention to detail cus i was shocked and whole time you knew exactly what was going on 😵‍💫

This man actually nailed the twist lol

boy how tf did you even catch on this early? part 2 just came out and i was mind fkd 😭

I did a rewatch before going on with the rest of the series with this series/ HOLY MOLY the foreshadowing. You absolutely nailed this

It is super weird that someone as high profile as Rhys isn’t talked to at all within the group. Even Simon was talked to and he barely said anything 😂

@danielfatone3994

Жыл бұрын

That’s what’s standing out to me the most lol

If this isn’t true then the writers have a lot of plot holes to fill, especially with timelines. I didn’t even consider this, but I did go back and try to see what I might have missed re: Rhys’ connection to the other characters. I noticed he shows up out of nowhere but never considered a Fight Club scenario. Well done! I actually wondered if Nadia was a plant somehow but this makes more sense. She was the first friendly interaction for Joe. The book she recommends becomes his imaginary friend who happens to know everyone he encounters.

Yep makes absolute sense now! I also think the reason Joe is devolving and conjured Rhys is that he actually KILLED Marienne for his own self preservation- when he was given the ultimatum. That's what created the rift is mind. If he killed Marienne then he is not good, something Joe really tries to convince himself off when he kills. So therefore his mind conjures RHYS as a substitute, to continue on with the cycle of obsession and killing lol

@rosyellowbird

Жыл бұрын

Yes that makes soooo much sense. Because if he actually let her go with the knowledge of who he is, who he has killed and where he is… he wouldn’t stay there. He’d take up a new identity or kill her

@benl326

Жыл бұрын

Yeah I feel like we’re gonna get a flashback which reveals Joe actually killed Marianne. He literally had her in there with a knife is his hand, like…

@Jordin_Taylor

Жыл бұрын

Yes I’ve been saying this for the longest

I honestly think Nadia will be responsible for something aswell, she did seem a bit sus about joe and she might have/gain an obsession with the new professor joe, idk I have a feeling she isn’t innocent yet and because the traitor is revealed to be Rhys the writers are trying to drift us away from her. Can’t wait for part 2!

@jessicaadelino2954

Жыл бұрын

Totally agree! I also thought it was she because of how the messages sound haha

@ThePinkPurples

Жыл бұрын

Agree! She may be a red herring but I haven’t trusted her since the beginning

@ThePinkPurples

Жыл бұрын

@@jessicaadelino2954 I heard all the messages in her voice lol

Also, when Roald was accusing Joe of the killings, they shows Joe killing all those people, misleading us to think it is just imagination, but in fact are flashbacks.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

True, that could be the case!

@SiddWasTaken

Жыл бұрын

Look at the limp when killing Jemma

I hope that is true, BUT I hope there’s another twist we are not seeing. Because I don’t want this to be predictable.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Very true!

@user-zd8br4gy2s

Жыл бұрын

The first 5 episodes are Joe’s story of what happened. I think Joe gets finally get caught by the police and this is all his allaby. End of the season Joe walks out of the interrogation room and it reveals that he was the one behind all the murders. I don’t think Joe is hallucinating this is all just a visual representation of what he told the police when he got caught.

@cassiedion4144

Жыл бұрын

@@user-zd8br4gy2soooo that would be a good twist. He finally accepts that he is a murdering monster.

@kgal1298

Жыл бұрын

It could be an intentional fake out. This is also why they probably thought splitting it into 2 parts would work. Part 1 we're getting this story, Part II the psychosis ends. Who knows.

Also In the preview for part 2, Love is seen holding Rhys’ book! could be a little foreshadowing into her talking to joe about it in his hallucination. Like how smart it was of him to make up a new persona etc etc, like another commenter said she might be the bridge between his delusion and reality- she could possibly “break the news” to him. I can picture it now. This season was genius and there’s no way this theory isn’t true!

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Very true!

Joe is 100% the real killer. Watch all scenes with Rhys and it becomes obvious. Not only that, there are so many clues within the episodes, this videos contains maybe half of it. It's my favorite season, really.

@lordprison13

Жыл бұрын

This season definitely grows the more u watch it n now I understand why they made it so different from the others!

@tweetttt7670

Жыл бұрын

How do you know? I can explain why I think otherwise

@lunavioleta001

Жыл бұрын

But he couldn't have killed Gemma. My first one, he could have. The second, maybe, though a lot harder, but not impossible. But with Gemma, he was thrown out the window.

@dogsbreakfast4952

Жыл бұрын

This season is dogshit. Season 3 was way better

@Matthew-oq1hx

Жыл бұрын

U were right

This theroy has blown my mind and just changed the whole of season 4 for me

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Glad it has!

@aa4488

Жыл бұрын

Have you never watched fight club or mr robot?

@enriquecarrizoza3000

Жыл бұрын

@@aa4488no why ?

@randomrachel1232

Жыл бұрын

@@aa4488I’ve never watched fight club but love mr robot - is it as good a watch?!

@aa4488

Жыл бұрын

@@enriquecarrizoza3000because this is a very overused, obvious trope. But seeing as you watched neither, it makes sense you didn’t see it coming. I’d recommend if you enjoy these kinds of twists

Not only is Rhys in Joe’s head, Joe’s hallucinations will be getting a LOT worse in Part 2. He’s going to start hallucinating LOVE QUINN as well!!! (This was in part 2 trailer)

An object of his obsession became a manifestation of his darkest side. Absolutely brilliant

Bruh is the godamn writer of the show and he really thought we wouldn't find it out

It's also worth mentioning that Dr Nicky told Joe that there are two of him in season 1. idk if anyone has mentioned that yet

@ambrebadhippie

Жыл бұрын

Good point

I think you might be right. That scene where Joe says "I'm fine" to Rhys and the whole table going quiet is pretty compelling evidence in hindsight. This season seems to be missing something, if this is the twist I definitely think it could save it.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Yeah I totally agree. The twist is something that I think this show definitely needs!

@angelavolkov1126

Жыл бұрын

Not much of a twist since it's so predictable.

You maybe right...I do not remember Rhys actually interacting with anyone else but Joe. I have to rewatch.

@Bluurji

Жыл бұрын

It was odd how he didn’t but this theory doesn’t make sense with part 1 ending

@0912sooli

Жыл бұрын

@@Bluurji why? It still makes sense. Rhys still didnt directly interacted with any other character. I think real Rhys is not even that close of a friend with the group

@njovie13

Жыл бұрын

How did he authored a book then? And how is he running for mayor? 😂

@HodajuciParadoks

Жыл бұрын

@@njovie13 My theory, one of many, is that until he read the book, he did not had hallusination of companion Rhys. Have in mind Joe is not sane. He does not see himself as a monster he is. He thinks that he is right doing all that for "love"...This is why he stop loving Love once he find out she is a mirror of himself, he can not stand himself. There is a real Rhys but there is a imaginary murder friend, the other part of himself. Did you notice that Rhys did text him with "Hey you" Joe's way of talking to the persons he is obsess with. This is most likely how Joe gets arrested in the end, madness and hallucinations can overlook the reality and he will make mistakes. We will see, it is just a theory.

@AllegraJina

Жыл бұрын

@@njovie13 Rhys is real, but his interactions with Joe aren't real. Joe conveniently uses him - someone who reminds him of himself - as a stand in. Jonathan (Joe's "good" side) doesn't know it yet.

I had already connected the dots that Joe was passed out for each kill, but I gave up on the “killing while passed out” theory when Rhys admitted that he killed Malcolm. I didn’t even think that Rhys wasn’t real, and now it seems so obvious

Lol i’m happy i’m only just now seeing this video now that part 2 came out. Really great job at analyzing this and coming to this prediction, great video

Another big hint that Joe is imagining Rhys is in the last episode. In the forest, Rhys hits Joe's head with the gun, but later when Joe wakes up there is not even a slightest scar on his forehead

@notamberp

Жыл бұрын

he wouldn’t have a scar if it didn’t break skin

@kamil4917-s9k

Жыл бұрын

@@notamberp such powerful hit would surely break the skin or at least leave some kind of mark

@notamberp

Жыл бұрын

@@kamil4917-s9k i didn’t say it wouldn’t leave a mark, bc you didn’t mention a mark, just a scar.

@FrancisFabricates

Жыл бұрын

Yeah that’s something I picked up on. Also Rhys would have had a hard time carrying them both. He would have had a cut on his head from it but he didn’t and that made no sense for them to be so bad with continuity since they are usually Good with that stuff

@otherbrookzy

Жыл бұрын

@@notamberp if it knocked him out it would

This aged wonderfully

Just finished the show, you cracked the code 3 weeks early

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Thanks a lot!

Another thing which bugged me was the fancy apartment. I feel like he killed the real owner of the apartment and took his name, job and identity. Joe said Malcome recommended it, but that could just be a lie to hide the murder. I feel like that will come to light.

Man from the future

Joe also mentioned not being able to go out with Kate because he was in a relationship with Rhys

Dude u are god.. Thank god KZread didn't showed me this video when i finished part 1 of fourth season..one month ago... Today i binged all the remaining episodes..nd the twist in eight episode blew my mind...

Whoa that is next level accurate lmao well done! I also thought it for a moment, but i was doubting it in part 2

This is definitely an interesting take on this season, I think it's possible. A lot of points you mention do make sense, and it makes me wish part 2 was out already, there definitely is a twist and I think you cracked it.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Ah great! Glad you enjoyed the video!

Wow lmfaoo just watched part two and this is their whole “big reveal” 😂

A small detail regarding the balcony scene with Rhys: right before it, you can see Rhys saying he needs some air, putting his drink on the table and Gemma looks at the drink. Joe is incapable of being the one placing down the drink because how far away he is from the table, so Gemma is acknowledging Rhys there, not Joe. Joe does talk with the real Rhys on the balcony

@deniloui810

Жыл бұрын

Your right, didn’t notice that. It makes his imagination seem more real to him probably

@kamkoqu

Жыл бұрын

It's possible that's just an actor error like whenever an actor accidentally looks into the camera, the actress might've just instinctively looked at the glass.

@lovettdeleted

Жыл бұрын

Or it could be like a Mr Robot thing where although we're seeing Rhys, the characters are seeing Joe?

Wow!!! I’m so impressed. Like I didn’t pay attention to the details and how rhys only appears near Joe and doesn’t talk to anyone else. Just finished season 4!

this aged like fine fucking wine you are a genius brother

I agree because we know Joe's mind is capable of doing stuff like this (Seeing/talking with Beck in season 2)

Nadia is who gave Joe the book written by Rhys? I'm intrigued by her character and the parallels to Paco and Ellie

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Yes very true!

@finfog4590

Жыл бұрын

It feels like it’s her playbook. I think she’s psycho.

@sidehustlesports4036

Жыл бұрын

@@finfog4590 would love that twist

@theshowdown9355

Жыл бұрын

She definitely has a bigger part to play!

@Natori_1999

Жыл бұрын

@@theshowdown9355 imagine if they are somewhat related or they actually know each other or she's like his niece or something

The fact that Rhys was in Joes head was kinda predictable (not like too predictable, like it was still cool but not shocking). But when Marrianne came back and was trapped, THAT was super damn cool also the twist was revealed early enough that it left story left to tell

I knew something about Rhys felt like he was blending in I just didn't realize it was the visual effects and lack of scenes with others. The fact that he's someone Joe knows about makes sense since a lot of people's delusions and hallucinations are of celebrities/micro celebrities

This guy must feel like a Chad now

YOU WERE RIGHT THE WHOLE TIME! YOU SHOULD WIN A PRIZE 🏆

I can't believe I overlooked this, makes so much sense looking back. Would actually make the season much better by having such a twist. We shall see

I had my suspicions when I heard the way Rhys said "you"

We appreciate your effort and hard work. God bless you.

This aged so well !!!

YOU WERE SO RIGHT!!! AMAZING!

Wow, this changed my whole perspective of the show. I 100% agree.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Glad to have provided and alternative viewpoint!

There is ALOT of symbolism with mirrors and reflections too, implying that ”You” really is Joe.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Very true!

I had the theory that "You" was always the audience through out this season. Like Joe could change but we want to see the series "You" unfold so we need him to kill, but he's disassociating. For some reason, I never made the Fight Club leap, but it makes sense cause Rhys never ever interacts with any other member of the cast. And yeah, it makes sense that Joe would idolize this guy and make him out to be his peer, while simultaneously carrying out what he thinks Rhys would do, which is murder the rich. I don't like what it says, politically, because it paints revolutionary anticapitalist sentiment in a shitty light, and that's maybe what kept me from putting 2 and 2 together, but it's clear as day now.

Who’s here after his theory was right

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

🙋

just finished part 2 - loved that this theory was correct!

@perc6224

Жыл бұрын

Right. Can’t wait for season 5. The ending was crazy!! Can’t believe I disliked the first 5 eps, but the last 5 were awesome. I loved Rhys tbfh

@markobolo4465

Жыл бұрын

@@perc6224 no season 5 its the end for you.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Thanks - me too!

@melissaashly

Жыл бұрын

@@perc6224 agreed, part one was okay but part two really sold me on the entire season. it was great

@perc6224

Жыл бұрын

@@markobolo4465 Since when? It’s definitely getting a season 5

Why is this theory so compelling and saddening at the same time?

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

I feel it's because the character Joe messes with our head so much. Do we like him, do we hate him? Both!

Spot on! Aged incredibly well, earned my subscription for sure

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Thanks a lot!

Wow respect! I washed part 2 and found your video. You were spot on bud 👏

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Thanks a lot!

This was my theory throughout!! Especially after the dinner scene where Rhys asks "are you alright?" and when Joe responds to him people act confused as to who he is talking to. I think the "writer" Rhys is real, but I think Joe has separated himself from the bad things he does by imagining Rhys, who takes over when Joe "blacks out" Alright, I'm gonna watch the video now to see how dumb I come off in this comment.

@alth7515

Жыл бұрын

which episode is the dinner scene in? I need to rewatch

@JeLo5218

Жыл бұрын

@@alth7515 ep2

@ethezeeb

Жыл бұрын

Nice when you're not dumb, but observant and brilliant! Well done, Briana Nicole!

This makes me want to rewatch!!! I also find it so odd that Joe has an old tube TV like that. I wonder if that could be another hallucination, showing that Rhys is a public figure Joe first discovered/became obsessed with when he was young and would have had an older TV.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

That's an interesting thought!

you just got yourself a subscriber! keep up the good work, the prediction was on point. hoping to see more predictions for other shows!

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Appreciate it!

This video aged beautifully👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾 great observation and analysing skills

i was convinced of joe being the real killer since episode 3 and all the clues being sprinkled in has been carrying the season for me

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Good sleuthing!

this aged like fine wine

I’m here after watching the second part of the season! Incredible video!

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed the video! And I’m glad I was right 😂

Watching part 2 and you were spot on well done

Jonathan Moore is basically a character in a murder mystery story Joe is writing, to convince himself that he's not the killer. He even says this to cover why he's asking for details on other murder mystery books. He's getting inspiration from books to write the story. When Rhys goes on TV saying the killer needs to be stopped, he now convinces himself to kill Rhys, because he challenged Joe, who is the killer. This theory is absolutely true. Here's why, The first shot of the entire season is the book, and then he proceeds to talk to his class about a story about a guy named Jon who's living in a fantasy. Then the second short story he assigns is about a man trying to convince everyone about who the devil is. Then he is handed the book after class, and begins to read it before Malcolm finds him and calls him Jonathan. They waited just long enough for the viewers to forget that the first story was about a guy named Jon, before revealing to the viewers that his name is now Jonathan. Before this we only hear him referred to as Professor Moore. One of the stories also talk about questioning if it's wrong, if it's for love, and some of the text messages he gets on the app are about how he murders for love, and how he's questioning whether or not he enjoys killing. It also shows how he was able to get all the evidence of who Joe was, and how he knows everything about him. It's Joe talking to himself on the app. Notice how Joe is also found following Kate by the security guard, who finds Malcolm's ring in Joe's pocket? Joe had it in his pocket because he took it, because he always keeps memoirs of his victims. Then he killed the security guard because he knew it was Joe. Nobody planted anything on Joe, or took his phone. It's all been him in a paranoid fantasy the whole time. UPDATE: looking back, I've noticed that the photographer lady that we thought was a person of interest plot wise, I think I know what's up with her. I think she notices that Joe is looking at Rhys, who isn't actually there. I think she sees him staring at nothing, and she finds it notable before taking pictures. I think at some point in part two, Joe will find the photos she took and see that Rhys was never in them. That's how the reveal might happen, or at least a vivid nod to it to the viewers, where Joe questions it and has a breakdown. I've also been thinking a lot about how all the murders kind of keep happening when Joe is "asleep"? It just seems like all his conversations with "Rhys" is just him talking to himself. It also seems like maybe the hitman coming to him wasn't real either, and that Joe is just reading books that are crafting this entire fantasy. I started thinking about why as a character would Joe be having his class read these books, and it's likely because he's trying to justify the plot he's crafting, to solidify its validity in reality. I think he's reading books, and he's picking and choosing elements from his interpretation to build his new fantasy. I also think that the interaction with Roald pushing him out of the window after finding him in the room was a fantasy too, and that was Joe's distorted memory of committing the third murder. Cause when he wakes up on the bush, Roald never chases after him or anything. I think Joe committed the third murder, snuck in to Roald's room to find evidence that could imply Roald committed the murder instead of him, Roald was coming in to his room, and Joe jumped out of the window to get away and fell on to the bush. They never actually interacted.

@isallen3106

Жыл бұрын

Nah, you're cooking and curious to know what you think the plot they are trying to do with Nadia?

@lasagnapapa

Жыл бұрын

I think Nadia is going to figure out that Joe is the killer, and begin seeing parallels with the real life killings with what he's saying

@dropnukeayo6823

Жыл бұрын

@@lasagnapapareally nice and in depth look, nice read. are you a writer?

@opalessential4097

Жыл бұрын

Also when roald tells the servant to see where joe is he says he hasn’t seen him since dinner yet he pushed him out the window awhile after dinner, your telling me he didn’t go straight to telling everyone that joe was in there

@jamicoleman6866

Жыл бұрын

I agree and did you notice Joe's voice change when saying the text messages from "killer" to "himself

Wow, I just finished the season and you be predicted it!

also, joe finally got a meet up response from the 'texter' WHEN he sympathised with them - this shows how joe and the texter are both joe himself, he understands himself and knows deep down that it really does feel really good when he kills people

Nice just finished pt 2 , great video! Edit: you got it spot on, badass brotha!!

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it! And hah, thanks!

Anyone here after part 2? Can't believe that this theory was true all along. You people are smart for figuring it out.

This guy is a Genius

I came to this conclusion while watching the last episode of part 1. I saw the title of this video and felt relieved that I wasn’t crazy.

Yes!💯 I love this theory! I really hope this is the twist. All 5 episodes just left me feeling so unsatisfied, almost like I wasn’t watching YOU at all. This has been the best explanation so far👍💯

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Great, glad you enjoyed the video!

Everything fits and also the text messages kinda gives a callback to gossip girl in away where Penn was actually gossip girl

@lc6237

Жыл бұрын

Spoiler alert I had just started gossip girl😢

@jlecampana

Жыл бұрын

@@lc6237 hahahahahahahahahah, Luckily for you, not even Penn Badgley liked the idea that Dan was Gossip Girl all along! I think it's best to think that the identity of Gossip Girl will forever remain a mystery.

@saturn313

Жыл бұрын

@@lc6237 tbh they don’t really give you hints about it or make her identity a big deal past the first 2 seasons

@zarosderer4447

Жыл бұрын

@@jlecampana Leonardo di Caprio was Gossip Girl. He wanted Serena so bad he got obsesed and watched her until he got her into his boot for 3 month doing everyday gymnastics with her

@summerslays1977

Жыл бұрын

Thanks a lot. Next are you gonna tell me who "A" is?

Oh my God, you could be so right I always felt that particular moment where Joe and Rhys are at the dining room table to be completely off. I didn’t understand why their quick conversation would bother Adam so much. However, if Joe was talking to himself then I could understand why Adam would think he was just rudely interrupting his story. Also he didn’t seem angry at Rhys , who initiated the conversation.

Bro this thing has been living in my head ever since, just saw the second part cudos nice catch

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed

This is such a good prediction. Everything mentioned makes perfect sense to come up with the theory also….like the group not really mentioning Rhys or being in any shots with him. Can’t wait to see if your guess is true.

@BrainPilot

Жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed the theory!