Brother your understanding is mine.you’ve done your homework.

All healing in god's name for you and your family and your loved ones and your friends all miracles in Jesus name go to you and your family and your loved ones in the father’s name and Jesus and Holy Spirit amen

@DogearedDisciple

23 күн бұрын

Thank you 😊

I have begun really questioning the hearts of people who can't simply read and understand what is written. With eschatology I believe it's a real pride issue. Thinking "I can handle it, I've got enough supplies!" It's different for believers who have issues with creation. Here it's very unpopular, silly really to hold to a young earth and it's not easy to handle the scorn that comes with it. Even after fact after fact proves you to be correct. Pride really seems at the core.

@DogearedDisciple

23 күн бұрын

I agree. That is my impression as well. I have many encounters with people who simply won’t believe the plain and straightforward truth right in front of them. Thanks for sharing!

@Ohios1Cheesehead

23 күн бұрын

@@DogearedDisciple I'm also not ignoring my pride in thinking I've got it all figured out lol

@DogearedDisciple

23 күн бұрын

@@Ohios1Cheesehead ditto 😊

That’s what I’ve been preaching, that the hole week is Gods wrath.

@peacefulpatriots

21 күн бұрын

Week? are you refering to the final week of Daniel's 70 week prophecy? if so, that was fulfilled when Jesus arose, and Steven was stoned

@jameswells9749

21 күн бұрын

@@peacefulpatriots your theology is screwed up. I guess you’re a Calvinist though. The last week has not even begun yet. 🤨🤣

@peacefulpatriots

21 күн бұрын

@@jameswells9749 I'm not the one separating prophecy

Agreed! There are 5 fundamental considerations (along with many additional factors), clearly indicating that the church must be removed from earth prior to the tribulation: 1. The church is the bride of Christ (Revelation 19:7, John 3:29), and God promised the saints constituting the church that they would not face His wrath (Romans 5:9, 1 Thessalonians 1:10 and 5:9), which is poured out on the earth during the tribulation (Revelation 6:16-17, 11:18, 14:19, 15:1, 15:7 & Revelation 16); rather, the promise to the saints constituting the church is for sequestration and protection (Isaiah 26:20-21, John 14:1-3-with parallels of Noah, Rahab, Lot & his family, and Enoch-all of which are not Jewish people). 2. The basis for salvation changes during the tribulation period. Now, before the tribulation, we obtain forgiveness of sin and eternal life by believing in and accepting the sacrifice of Jesus and His resurrection. (John 3:16, Romans 10:9-10). During the tribulation, however, in addition to believing in Jesus, a person must also refuse to worship the Antichrist, and a person must also reject the Antichrist’s mark (Revelation 14:9-10). This is why Jesus said that the Gospel during the tribulation is one of endurance (Matthew 24:9-14). The change in the standard for salvation is best implemented by first removing the saints constituting the church; otherwise, many saved people risk losing their salvation. 3. God needs to complete His plan for the descendants of Jacob (i.e.,the final “seven”-year period-of Gabriel’s prophecy to Daniel as recorded in Daniel 9:24-27-which prophecy is expressly related to Jerusalem and Daniel’s people), which has been suspended during the time of the church (Romans 11:25-26). The fact that the plan of God is directed almost exclusively towards Israel & Jerusalem in the tribulation is evidenced by the attacks on Israel during the tribulation (Ezekiel 38-39), which are described like a locust invasion of Israel (Judges 7:12, Joel 1, Isaiah 33:4 & Amos 7:1-6), the battle of Armageddon occurring in Israel (Revelation 16:12-16, 19:11-20), the special seal being given only to 144,000 “sons of Israel” (Revelation 7:1-8), and Jesus returning to earth at the Mount of Olives in Jerusalem (Zechariah 14:4). This is starkly different from the plan of God during the pre-tribulation period for the entire world (John 3:16 & Matthew 28:19-20). 4. During the tribulation, God uses special Gospel proclaimers, including the 2 witnesses (Revelation 11:1-13), an eagle (Revelation 8:13), and 3 angels (Revelation 14:6-11)-strongly suggesting that the church is no longer present to spread the Gospel. 5. There are indications in Scripture of a pre-tribulation harvest. See, for example, Amos 7:1-6, where the “king’s crop” has already been taken before the “spring crop” of tribulation saints are harvested, the latter of which occurs during or as a consequence of the assault on Israel and the descendants of Jacob. The king’s crop represents the church-taken before the start of the tribulation. The later crop represents people who become saints and die during the tribulation. There is extensive additional information in support of a pre-tribulation rapture. The overwhelming scope of information demonstrates the undeniability of the pre-tribulation rapture. Maranatha! See much more at prophecy resources dot com.

@DogearedDisciple

23 күн бұрын

Good stuff. One would think that if the Church were still on Earth during the 70th week of Daniel there would have been copious and specific statements by Christ and the Apostles as well as numerous clear indicators in the Revelation text saying so and yet there are none. Quite the contrary the most literal reading of the text clearly affirms the Church is off planet before the events begin due to being raptured. Thank you for sharing!

@nonexistenttheologian

23 күн бұрын

@@DogearedDisciple agreed!

Revelation 3:10 . The word from in the Greek means ( toretto EK )meaning (out of ) the hour of trial, but still the children of God ignore it . They read the surface of the Bible. Only.

@DogearedDisciple

23 күн бұрын

Indeed. I have studied the Pre Wrath ( a misnomer actually. All of the main Rapture views claim to be so but only the Pre-Tribulation view is truly “pre wrath”) and the only thing it has is confusion and fear and horrible exegesis.

Right’ the church is in heaven, and I believe the 24 elders proves this because they are the church.

@DogearedDisciple

23 күн бұрын

@@jameswells9749 I agree. The 24 elders represent the Church in heaven before the opening of the seals!

Read revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. His people are in heaven so Rejoice

@DogearedDisciple

20 күн бұрын

Maranatha!

And how about how the pre-trib fails?

@DogearedDisciple

20 күн бұрын

Please feel free to provide an exegesis of scripture demonstrating how you believe that to be the case.

So you believe in the church of God and the church of Christ...two distinct churches...so what do you use as a grid for your interpretation? You must believe in that the Old testament and Gospels belong to the church of God and the epistles belong to the church of Christ ?😢

@robertlindgren4916

20 күн бұрын

Peace be with you my brother... study hard and remember we have been grafted in...as long as one has the fundamentals and loves his Lord.

@DogearedDisciple

20 күн бұрын

Interesting assumptions.

@robertlindgren4916

20 күн бұрын

@@DogearedDisciple you did your homework on the origin of the dispensation doctrine... you should know all this stuff, you did mention the two churches...do you not own a Scofield Bible...he sat under Darby... I was taught these things too while going to Calvary Chapel I'm just glad I didn't pay too much attention to it. First I wanted to have a good theology and then from there to work on my eschatology...I hold the fourth view of eschatology from early church doctrines. I have studied the major three views... would like to hear your take on the millennium.

@robertlindgren4916

19 күн бұрын

It was that San Diego on you... I'm an old SD boy.

@DogearedDisciple

18 күн бұрын

I have been a believer for over 50 years and have studied all sides of this doctrine. I proclaim the view that the plain reading of scripture leads to a pre-tribulation view of the rapture, tribulation, second coming, and millennium. I count myself as a Calvary Chapel guy in theology and eschatology and a literal interpretation of scripture dispensationalist. That said I agree with brother Lee Brainard who says: "Rejecting the pretribulation rapture is not a matter of a robust eschatology in a robust theology. It is a matter of an allegorical methodology, replacement theology, prooftext argumentation, and resistance to contextual exegesis."

You should read two sentences after 1 Thess 5:2. It says "But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness, so that the day would overtake you like a thief". I guess you are claiming believers ARE in darkness? Also you started with "the doctrine of imminence means..." who would ever believe that??? Jesus gives 13 things in Matt 24 that happen before his return. (those are the same 13 events in rev 6-8 which are the 7 seals). I am trying to hear you out but youa re assuming imminence is correct instead of proving it with scripture. In your one attempt you left the context of the next two verses out that seem to squarely contradict your point. The lost are in darkness concerning the coming of our Lord not believers. Another strange thing you said is "we are not looking for the antichrist, we are looking for jesus". Jesus gives us a whole body of signs before His coming, but two very specific signs, one of them being "the man of sin sits in the temple declaring himself god". Jesus said He is not coming back until that happens. Why would you tell people that might see that, that it doesn't mean anything?

@DogearedDisciple

21 күн бұрын

You are conflating the rapture and the second coming. Matthew 24 and 25 are a continuous dialog and it is not directed to the church but to the Jews in Jerusalem at the abomination of desolation. Thessalonians 5:2 confirms the church is aware of the times and will not be caught off guard. The church is removed before the 70th week when “he who restrains” is removed and then the son of perdition is revealed. The Church is not on Earth when the anti Christ is revealed. The plain literal reading of scripture clearly teaches the imminent return of Christ. One has to try very hard to not see or understand it. Perhaps you’d like to disprove it using scripture?The Doctrine of Imminence kzread.info/dash/bejne/iZebp5WGpaqwiZs.html

The idea of the Rapture seems wonderful in fantasy, but yet I watched most arguments made for it. Yet, I see it nowhere in the KJV. The only word I see is "Resurrection" and it happens twice. The first with Christ, and the firstfruits, and the second at his coming. Which is the finale of the Tribulation. My second thought that didn't seem right about the Rapture. Is it would mean God would have to commit Sin for the first time. Flesh & Blood cannot cross the veil into the kingdom of Heaven. If Jesus had to die to return. Then therefore, we have to do the same as well. So God committing genocide in an instant to pull his faithful believing body off this earth because of the Son of Perdition. Doesn't make any sense. I always say, if you want to get "raptured" now, or before the Tribulation. Then you're going to have to die in your faith, however that may be. Nothing seems weirder to me than a bunch of "Christians" who believe in a pre/mid-trib rapture, more than the Word of Christ. Are just begging without thinking to ask God to commit Sin.

@DogearedDisciple

23 күн бұрын

Back up your statements with scripture if you can. Make a case from the Bible otherwise this is just an opinion without an exegetical basis.

@robertlindgren4916

20 күн бұрын

John 17:15

@DogearedDisciple

20 күн бұрын

@@robertlindgren4916 In John 17:15 specifically, Jesus makes it clear that His desire is not for the disciples to be removed from the world, but rather that they be protected from the evil one (Satan). This prayer acknowledges the reality of spiritual warfare and the presence of evil, while emphasizing the importance of the disciples’ mission in the world. Jesus wants them to be safeguarded against spiritual harm and temptation as they carry out their work of spreading His message and love.

Matthew 24 clearly tells us IMMEDIATELY AFTER the tribulation of those days the trumpet will sound and He will send His angels to gather His elect……..2 Thessalonians: Concerning the coming of our Lord and our gathering to Him will not come unless the man of sin is revealed. 1Thessalonians 5:2 The coming of the Lord is as a thief in the night……..vs 4 But you brethren are not in darkness that this day will overtake you as a thief. By the way, Jesus asked the disciples to watch with Him in the garden……..for who? The son of perdition. Judas. A type of anti christ. We should be watching for the signs the Bible gives us. Those who will be overtaken by the thief are those without oil in their lamps. God bless.

@DogearedDisciple

18 күн бұрын

The elect are the Jews and all others who believed the gospel being preached during the tribulation and put their trust in Christ and are gathered at the second coming. They are not the Church and there are no rapture verses in the Matthew 24-25 discourse. 1 Thessalonians 5:2 Paul refers to the fact that those in the dark would be caught off guard by the suddenness of the tribulation but the believer would not be caught off guard. 2 Thessalonians 2:1 has to be read in context like all scripture. If you read v. 1-12 specifically verse 6-8 the anti-Christ can't be revealed until the restrainer is removed, which is the Holy Spirit working through the Church. Once the Church is removed the lawless one can be revealed who Christ will destroy at the end of the Tribulation at the second coming. Christians are to be attentively watching for Christ's imminent return and working to obey his commands to make disciples of the nations and to live uprightly according to scripture, not the antichrist while living lives of fear and defeatism. The plain reading of scripture leads to the pre-tribulation view of the rapture, tribulation, second coming, and millennial reign. Every other view has roots in gnosticism, preterism, and replacement theology. kzread.info/dash/bejne/iZebp5WGpaqwiZs.htmlsi=Cx31BR8Ufbt1SBrF

@greywisker3180

18 күн бұрын

@@DogearedDisciple If you choose to believe that that’s your prerogative, but just an FYI, the pre tribulation rapture comes in to popularity by a man named John Nelson Darby, a cult leader in the 1830, just Google it if you don’t believe me. I challenge you to show me a teaching by any of the early church fathers or students of the fathers of the pretrib rapture being taught before the 1800’s. Also please explain how the ELECT or (chosen by God) only refers to believers in the tribulation period when the Bible clearly teaches that all believers who have passed away since Christ was here on earth are Gods elect.

@DogearedDisciple

18 күн бұрын

@@greywisker3180 No one on any side of the conversation believes the Darby invented the pre-trib rapture nonsense. There’s quite literally nothing but evidence that it was a doctrine taught for at least the first 3 centuries and researchers like Lee Brainard are finding more evidence regularly. The context of the verses in question demonstrates the elect are those on the earth during the tribulation.

@greywisker3180

18 күн бұрын

@@DogearedDisciple lol, Lee Brainerd, was called out by Joel Richardson for lying and misquoting Irenaeus and other extra biblical historians. Lee Brainerd refuses to debate Joel on this issue.

@greywisker3180

18 күн бұрын

@@DogearedDisciple When I first got saved over 34 years ago I was excited about the pre tribulation view but the more I read I realized this view did not line up with the Word of God. I think Joel Richard does an excellent job of pointing out where Lee Brainard misquotes time after time the early church father’s writings. If you are honest with yourself and the Holy Spirit and you really want to know the truth of the matter I encourage you to watch this video and this series where Joel Richardson calls out many of the modern day Pre Tribulation teachers and does an excellent job of exposing the misquoting and editing Lee Brainard and other teachers of this view do. You can watch it on KZread here under this title…..Refuting Lee Brainard's False Claims of Pre-Tribulation THE RAPTURE & ENDURANCE OF THE SAINTS. God bless and hope you truly want to be informed on this and realize how teachers like Lee Brainard have been dishonest at the least.

The pre-tribulation rapture theory is a man-made false doctrine lie. They twist the scripture about the Second Coming/Day of the Lord and try to invent a whole other supernatural event. Stick with the Bible and ignore the dispensationalist words of man: "2 Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers and sisters, 2 not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by the teaching allegedly from us-whether by a prophecy or by word of mouth or by letter-asserting that the day of the Lord has already come. 3 Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness[a] is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4 He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God." -2 Thessalonians 2:1-4 44 “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day. -John 6:44 "29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other." -Matthew 24:29-31 "15 According to the Lord’s word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever. 18 Therefore encourage one another with these words." -1 Thessalonians 4:15-18 "51 Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed- 52 in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed." -1 Corinthians 15:51-52 “And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.” -John 6:39-40 “But watch yourselves lest your hearts be weighed down with dissipation and drunkenness and cares of this life, and that day come upon you suddenly like a trap. For it will come upon all who dwell on the face of the whole earth. But stay awake at all times, praying that you may have strength to escape all these things that are going to take place, and to stand before the Son of Man.” -Luke 21:34-36

@DogearedDisciple

20 күн бұрын

Simply claiming a view you don’t agree with is a “man made false doctrine” then listing a dozen verses is not a competent exegesis.

@robertlindgren4916

20 күн бұрын

One verse that is part of the prayer of Jesus... John 17:15... explain this to me.

@DogearedDisciple

20 күн бұрын

@@robertlindgren4916 Well, John 17:15-16 is part of Jesus' prayer for His disciples in the Gospel of John. The verse states: "They are not of the world, even as I am not of it." These verses highlight the distinction between Jesus' followers and the secular world. In context, John 17 records Jesus' prayer to the Father before His arrest and crucifixion. Here are the main points of the chapter: 1. Jesus prays for Himself (John 17:1-5):He asks to be glorified so that He can glorify the Father. 2. Jesus prays for His disciples (John 17:6-19): He acknowledges that His disciples are distinct from the world because they have received His teachings. Jesus prays for their protection and sanctification, knowing they will remain in the world but not be of it. 3. Jesus prays for all believers (John 17:20-26): He extends His prayer to future believers, asking for unity and that they may experience the love and presence of God. John 17:15-16 emphasizes that the disciples, like Jesus, do not belong to the worldly system of values and beliefs. They are set apart for God's purposes and mission. Jesus' prayer reflects His concern for their well-being and spiritual integrity as they carry out their mission in a hostile world.

@RenegadeSith

19 күн бұрын

@@DogearedDisciple I'm just giving out true facts to my brothers. I apologize if you're offended... guess I'm right since you can't refute it. Read the scriptures for yourself. You cannot find a pre-trib rapture written in the Lord's word. There are plenty of places in the Bible that say "at the last trump" or "after the tribulation of those days" or those who can endure to the end." Jesus said that He will not return until after the abomination of desolation.

@RenegadeSith

19 күн бұрын

@@robertlindgren4916 Read the entire chapter. He is praying for His disciples.