Finally, an honest discussion regarding Apocalypse. I started and have been purchasing, playing events to have strong NEW characters such as Out of Time, HIVE, Secret Defenders, etc. In several months, finished DD 5 and now thinking about skipping Apocalypse and going straight to DD6 instead of spending time and resources on crappy teams I won't be using to get him.

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

I think this isn't me saying Apoc is worthless, its me saying there are other better priorities, but something worth revisiting if they make enough changes, or theres a large enough gap in the game after im done my other stuff.

@itsthekid9815

Ай бұрын

The issue isn't getting use out of them. You'd have to be delusional saying you can't use these teams in day to day play. Darkhold is a team people use every day. Unlimited is a nice cosmic team. For a lot of player deathseed will do just fine in raids. Gamma is still a good war team and does work in cc. But the true discussion is filling your roster out with teams that aren't going to push you to the extreme worth it. While most players deathseed is probably enough it won't be in the near future. While gamma and darkhold are so annoying in war and cc are they going to be playable in the near future. Unlimited has the issue of being just fine in cc but it's counter part xtreme has so many more uses. The discussion isn't are the teams useless or not. Apoc is the best character and if that was the discussion it'd be go get apoc. The question is, is it the best choice for you to moving forward at the start of the account.

@athangeorgakopoulos2646

Ай бұрын

Hopefully they will change the way you unlock him in a few months ( one idea will be to only need the horseman for eash saga and then add 4 toon of your choice. That way you only need to update the 4 horseman.

Yeah, I put a pause on my hunt for Apocalypse and went to building for OML will go back after ends.

Entirely agree with your argument. However, how important is top arena rank to you? I am 8 months in and am slowly getting pushed out of the top 50, so i have decided to do apoc. Also being my first account have never done the apoc content so I am having fun with that. Given when I started the game I built kree minions, x force, x factor and new avengers shortly before players didnt have too. Will i be mad and feel foolish if they rework it? Absolutely. I just don't feel like I have a choice if i want to stay competitive in arena. Thoughts?

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

to be fair, 8-months and 3-months is quite a big difference even if it doesn't feel like it. I suspect that by the time I am 6-months in I will have 95 G18 on all my new raid teams (ExMen, HiveMind, Spider Society and Alpha Flight) maybe more? So the considerations in this video are definitely within the < 6-month range play time. We will see where I am at as time goes on and what I can do after im doing the top end raids.

@Mooping1

Ай бұрын

Curious what lvl/strength u are at 8 months? I'm just over 7 months in but wasn't on a boosted account, and just lvl 88 rn.

@unburntsun

Ай бұрын

@@Mooping1 wasn't boosted either, I'm lvl 93, 19 Mil TCP

@unburntsun

Ай бұрын

​​@Boilon I wasn't really aware that we had such a gap between our accounts as you are only 2 levels behind me. Forgot about the boost. I'm an alliance leader in the exact same position in raids. Inc 1.3, most alliance members skipping bifrost. A large chunk of us are headed for apoc rn. A few people are planning on just baby for now, so that they can use the VK flip in arena. I guess I was misled by the video title, and thought it applied to me. No shade, you got my clicks. Thanks for all the content.

If I already have completed gamma,unlimited , dark seed to the second tier should I still try to do the dark hold too the only problem is I have like such little stars for Agatha and Wong since i completely forgot to build them earlier on

Dorky Dad is saying the same thing, BPG is essentially saying the same thing also. As personal experience as a new player with about just 3-4 months in, with the amount of resources I have, it’s really choosing between Apocalypse or raid. And I think had I not built my raid teams, I’ll have even less resources than right now (purple ability mat is my bottleneck right now, although gold and training mods are creeping up menacingly) My game plan for now is to build my raid teams as 1st priority, DD as second, then whatever new team in the meta, after that, or when requirements arrive (to fulfill for trials and DD) these Apoc team will be the first choice that I will build up as much as necessary. That way, when the time comes for me to chase Apoc, I’ll have some of them on hand.

Let the comment wars.... begin! 😂

I started DD6 and after that pretty sure that I have time for those teams, after Skrull. I have Darkhold and Gamma finished, so I'ts not too bad for me for baby Apoc and then wait for an updated way to get Big Apoc ISO are terrible to farm...

Any help on getting through the scourges because I can’t seem to get 5 stars on any of the characters

I got baby apocalypse before i finished dark dimension 5 and im got big boy apocalypse just after i finished the timed run. But i I understand the why you wouldnt get him now but as someone who loves mutants he was an obvious get for me but i I understand why you wouldnt.

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

The difference is the time scale of new accounts now and how fast you move up esp with boosted accounts. I think there can be reasoning to do this after your main new raid teams are 95 G18 and you're doing the top PvE content. But, this is my first priority before I make other considerations.

@kurthauxwell1147

Ай бұрын

@@Boilon that makes sense my siblings account is really new and they only really want to level characters they like and they only like rogue of the horsemen but I pointed out that in order to unlock rogue youd have to invest in characters that you may not like so I've been allowed to level who I see fit to unlock rogue which is mainly the secret defenders which is fine as they like robbie also and black cat. But they don't have black cat so I'm hopping between the rogue scourge one week to the black cat trial the next. At least Cosmo and most of the sinister 6 are favourites so it makes getting felicia that much easier.

You don't think MfM will be necessary to unlock profX later? I understand war is a low priority but circling back to them later could be a mistake.

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

Why invest early for a game mode that doesn't matter now? Investing for no reason early for something you don't know will happen is perilous.

@Cbrizzie

Ай бұрын

@@Boilon because I remember what it was like investing in all of the teams for Apoc when I came back. It wasn't fun lol

@Cbrizzie

Ай бұрын

@@Boilon because I remember what it was like investing in all of the teams for Apoc when I came back. It wasn't fun lol

First and foremost thanks for your insight secondly you’ve convinced me. I’m on day 365 level 90 and the only character I have built up to level 90 is Gambit the rest of my characters are level 85 and below. Although I want Apoc I see that from a resource pov it’s definitely not worth it. I was the one who you answered yesterday on your Discord channel about this topic. 😊

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

I'm actually a bit confused lol. Day 365 at level 90? How is this possible! I am 3-months in at 92 lol. But, I think my situation will still be much different from yours given the 9-month gap in play time.

@Mooping1

Ай бұрын

​@@BoilonGuessing non-boosted account + maybe not coring all energies? That was the case for me. The mid range levels ~60-80 felt like moving through molasses... Also being in an alliance that wasn't progressing much in raids doesn't help. How can I join yours? 😝

Excellent points. I was considering talking about this myself. You hit it right on the head I think. Apocalypse is amazing but newer teams are so strong its not worth it to go back.

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

I think it's worth noting how much ions I have at 3 months in. I believe it was 25% of total blue5 ions needed, so big apocalypse is a moot point without the ions to actually get the job done. Baby apoc is worthless tbh.

Partially disagreement that a new player should not be focused on dd7. By the time you need crimson gear or even high teal you should grow organically over time to eventually get apoc. Get kestrel, ultron, doom. Don't focus on the finish line. Get the first mile done first

Boilon, now that you have decided this. Could you make an updated new player guide?

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

I mean I could, but given some of the comments it seems some people think i am crazy 🤪

Fully agree with the majority of what you are saying here, especially the focusing on raid teams first. I just have to nit pick the statement “it’s BBA or nothing” comment. I just got the baby Apoc a couple weeks ago and as a kid game player baby Apoc absolutely wrecks nerds. Jumped me from Top 25ish in Arena to 5-7 consistently. Even as a baby he is incredible in War and Crucible. In terms of end game, completely agree that it’s gotta be BBA. But outside of that he is a beast. Also, I get a ton of value from the horsemen teams in CC and War offense. Although I am not suggesting anyone make it a priority. Just my experience from recently acquiring baby Apoc.

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

I do think Baby apocalypse is kinda bad, but I know how he is winning for you. But, he is easily beatable with a combo of SD and Black Knight now. Realistically an arena combo of SD+Black Knight+ Void Knight or something like this can beat any normal baby apoc comp, what makes him so strong is the turn1 ult and falcon punch. War is a completely luxury game content for newer accounts anything less than 9 months honestly because you won't have the roster to play it well. Crucible is similar but you need less teams so its possible to be "semi-competitive" in maybe 6-months as you build. As I mentioned I only use 1 defensive team in Crucible which is my top arena team lol.

Story time. So I played at launch, got my account to 60 (the max at the time), and then quit for swgoh. I just came back two Februarys ago and was wayyyyyy behind. I DID go for big apocalypse and he’s made a tremendous difference in all modes for me. BUT the reason why I went for him is cus I had overly built my raid teams up and I was wrecking ultimus 7.5 and my alliance members weren’t trying to push for doom and incursion really. Today we’re in incursion 2, but if they were pushing for incursion raids back then I may have skipped him altogether. I think all alliances, new or not, should be pushing for incursion raids, but if for some reason you’re not maybe you might have the time to invest for apoc like I did.

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

I think if you're keeping up with the forefront of alliances and raid content this is the best thing to do for daily resources. IF and when this is done I think it might be more acceptable to circle back, but, I am also cautious of all this 'wasted' investment on the other characters that don't feel very good.

The worst part is the iso 5 I just got big boy apocalypse and with all the changes to teal gear through the raid shop wouldn’t be so bad. The iso 5 is hit or miss if I get like 2 or like 8 per day. I got big boy super skrull and apocalypse the same day due to being locked behind iso 5s requirement

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

Well i'm 3-months in with 25% of the blue5 it would seem. I don't plan to use this though so we'll keep track of my progress on this front as I go along but it definitely is slow.

I could see something like Teen Avengers or Teen "something" where you get Shuri BP, Brawn, Dazzler, Wiccan, and maybe Speed or something like that for a Crucible team and then you have 2 more reworked Apoc characters. Then they get a new Brotherhood team with Bishop rework, a new Magneto who is good (like from Age of Apocalypse), Archangel rework, and 2 new characters like Marrow, Maggot, or Havok. Tangled probably needs some new characters to make Spider Weaver great again...Iron Spider like from the 90s cartoon, Spider-ham (the only one left from the movies with speaking lines), maybe Prowler Miles on the team as just a weird offshoot, or ya know, any of the other 200 they had in the spiderverse 2 movie.

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

They already missed their chance to bring out Wiccan since it would be their chance to do it during Pride Month, this time its Northstar so maybe another year lol. And I wouldn't want Wiccan without Hulkling so.

Even if I just started this game I would never skip this character. Apocalypse is the best character in the game. Down. And they have slowly been reworking all of the teams anyways, so it's going to be worth the long-term investment. Top of Arena, you go from being in Gold to platinum, and War doesn't suck as much anymore. It's a no-brainer for me dog

@Zyeike

Ай бұрын

He's not the best character in the game. Mephisto is the best character in the game. Then it's Super Skrull after that. THEN it's Apocalypse

@Volcnz

Ай бұрын

⁠@@ZyeikeHonestly, Skrull is pretty dog shit rn. Apoc is way better

@Zyeike

Ай бұрын

@Volcnz he definitely isn't when ppl's main priority is killing him as fast as they can b4 he blows up your team with his ultimate. There's already a character made specifically to counter Apocalypse and she can survive his empowered basic once she's built high enough

@Volcnz

Ай бұрын

@@Zyeike hard light Is hardly someone to worry about. Just put disrupt on her then she’s useless allowing Apoc to not be restricted. Skrull just losses a lot of his potential compared to Apoc with black knight being a hard counter and is why people swap him out in high end Arena compared to Apoc

@Zyeike

Ай бұрын

@Volcnz hard light generally goes 1st or 2nd if skrull is on the field. She's starting off with a taunt and safeguard. By the time Apocalypse gets a turn he's stuck behind her taunt while black knight has been chipping away at your team. The top teams in arena all use skrull over Apocalypse along with black knight

It was a ridiculous grind. But he's a big boy now.

in the future the devs will make the requirement ISO Blue 4 from 5. The 5 was overkill but G17 is becoming pretty normal now a days. G16 is pretty much a joke and so is G17 I mean. Last year when you made G15 it appeared in the alliance chat that you G15 so and so. Now only G16 or higher appears meaning G16 is the current norm. Big Apoc will be easier near the end of this year or adjusted I feel. He is still needed but Raids and Arena should be any new account focus. Big Apoc will make you waste a lot of gold and resources.

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

I agree G17 isn't that bad now, but the Blue 5 is pretty bad still which is shown by my resources and how much blue4 vs blue 5 I have. If that comes to pass then I will probably do it then, but realistically blue5 isn't widespread enough to even think about it either.

I do believe that Scopely wants to make Apoc more of a natural progression with how they just reworked half of ULXmen, maybe at a point, the strongest teams will again have the Horsemen teams involved in other teams, making it so Apoc isn't a chore like now

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

Guess we will see over the next months or so if this continues this way or not. If by some miracle we're about half way useful characters I would reconsider then, but as of now I won't.

I can't agree more

R.I.P. #Thor 😂

Holding out hope that they change the characters needed to get apoc for Mt alt account

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

Yeah, I mean they can either slowly make reworks like it seems... or even a drop to blue4 ions from 5 would make a SIGNIFICANT change given how easy teal gear is now with raid store changes.

What if your under 6 months and your on the last nodes for DD6 and raid teams are all at iso blue level 4 already? I would LOVE to not build these useless teams for Apoc but can I wait 6 months for scopley to finally do the right thing and add the relevant teams and or charters? Doesn’t seem like that would be so hard for them to add new tags to the saga but either way I think I would be stuck because beating dd6 without Apoc is tough but dd7 would be insane without Apoc, I’m really torn right now I haven’t built any of the horseman teams yet but after old man Logan trails I will have to either do it then or live without having him… thanks for all the context I’m just hoping if you could help me with my specific situation… raid teams are good crucible is good, my war defense sucks and I do want to compete in all modes I just hate this decision that’s in front of me

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

I would be a bit surprised at this progress but maybe not. I have enough Blue4 ions it seems to do about 3 or 4 raid teams, and that's 3 months. At 6-months, if you are G18 95 on all your raid teams that are new (exmen, hivemind, spider society, alpha flight soon) I could see going back to doing this if you so wish. Keep in mind the blue5 ion cost though. DD6 is very easy without Apoc if you use ExMen in Global, and Doc Ock + GGC in legendary, I have done this on my main account.

@d_ezcwo7702

Ай бұрын

@@Boilon thank you, I don’t have everyone at g19 level 95 just the mvp of the team, but yes maybe I should keep the focus on the raid teams fully complete them I’m in alliance doing 60% incursion 2.2 so naturally we want to push for 2.3 and so on, and that’s a good point a new raid team is about to come out so that’s gonna take a lot of isos… I’m actually just behind your boosted account as far as when I started to play I’ve bought the passes and the time heist, (couldn’t do blitz manually) so that helped me with resources and my progress, also I’m sitting number 1 in my arena and I know it helps that I haven’t spent the resources for those irrelevant teams for Apoc so thanks for the advise I’ll stay the course hope things change because I do want him but it’s too big of a cost for what his worth is at this point.. and yea I’ve gonna back and watched all your dark dimension 6 videos they did help I’m just waiting for Friday to hopefully unlock old man Logan to start the legendary section I one shot all 3 city nodes with the 3 piece of spider society last weekend and missing running dark dimension wish Apoc saga was just dark dimension format with city, global, mystic, and legendary

@d_ezcwo7702

Ай бұрын

Meant to type g18… and for a dark dimension for Apoc have a section for the 4 horseman

I think a lot of people are taking this into account and i think it is the main reason why I am not following this path. My arena shard had at least 100 people that time heisted and there is not a single apocalypse. I am about to hit lvl 90 and my honest opinion is that getting Apoc will 100% give me number 1 between him and my BK etc. Even if its only for a month or so it is gonna 100% pay me back in dividends. Something that should be known is that i started my account before boosts were a thing so i had a few months of no boosted XP to build up Training mats and such so that is actually not a bottleneck for me.

@ARescuePanda

21 күн бұрын

Wanted to leave a response to this in case anyone is interested. I am a F2P player and am at 188 days played so just over 6 months. I unlocked Baby Apoc today and only need gold and Iso for Deathseed to get Big Boy done which should be maybe a week or 2 at max. I currently hold 15-12 in my arena shard and only 5 people have Apoc none of which are at Diamonds while I will be able to take mine to 3 diamond right away. This should easily get me top 10 maybe even number 1 between OML and the diamond apocs. Not saying skipping or going is better then the other just giving the thoughts from the other side. (also side note all of my raid teams are built high enough for incursion except Bifrost cause i can not be bothered)

Thats really fast lv 92 within 3 months im at lv 49 in ten days

R.I.P to #THOR

Apoc is a hard pass for me, 20 ish teams for one dude who doesnt do too much besides being a plug and play is not worth it for me, with the 20 something teams i need to build for apoc, i can use those resources to build newer raid/arena/war teams that will take me way further than a single toon would. And maybe even help me unlock new content in the future whereas the apoc teams u build will start tapering off .

@8nmerq_

Ай бұрын

It’s only 4 teams you only need 23 characters cause weaver deathpool and kestrel unless your counting the teams for horsemen but I’m pretty sure you can unlock them without the required teams

@alexl.8748

Ай бұрын

@@8nmerq_ yeah, 23 toons, sorry, my bad. thats 5 solid teams almost i could use for raids, cc, war, arena, blitzes, for one dude lol. also not counting the teams u need to build to get the horsemans as well.

@Mooping1

Ай бұрын

Yes! The whole thing for me is building those 23 toons of which about 10 are meta relevant vs building XXmen, hive, SpdrSoc, M4$, Alpha flight, even OOO(or rlly BK 😝), sup6.. etc. Does apoc make up the difference? Not really. And an annoying extra is it's not just those 23, it's also the toons to get thru the horsemen scourges if u want them at higher stars. Global Controllers anyone?

Apoc is literally the difference in winking most games or not. I've literally used him to get into the top 30. You should only skip if you have no choice but to, otherwise get him as soon as possible.

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

500% bet you're speaking from a position of already having him. Are you a < 6 month old account? Probably not

@diddyman4real

Ай бұрын

@@Boilon Gambling man I see! 😁 You're right, I'm not. However... I'd still choose him over Skrull just as I did before as Apoc is what helped me get to Skrull easier. I can't say skip him as both options weren't good when originally presented to us. So now that it's moderately easier to obtain (IMO), I have to say going for Apocalypse is what a player, New or otherwise, should do!

@diddyman4real

Ай бұрын

@@Boilon this was a question posed by you on whether to use resources on Apocalypse or Super Skrull when Skrull was 1st released and originally I was on the Skrull side... Until I released that I had a longer wait for Skrull than I did for Apocalypse. Seeing the time it was taking to build teams for Skrull vs Apocalypse lead me to build for Apocalypse instead and it was the best choice as the teams I now have still help me today. I can honestly say that skipping Apoc would be a bad idea.

Apoc is definitely worth it....

If you dont mind arena, sure... go ahead. But in regards to arena, Apoc is way more important than skrull... because his insta kill mechanic is way too important there and there are no options to avoid it...

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

500% bet you're speaking from a position of already having him. Are you a < 6 month old account? Probably not

Apoc is the best character in the game to me he is better than Skrull + with the ease of teal gears i see no reason why anyone should skip apoc.( Mephisto exists )

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

500% bet you're speaking from a position of already having him. Are you a < 6 month old account? Probably not

@boiiiiiii5741

Ай бұрын

@@Boilon why does it matter ? in 6 month everyone is focusing on dormamu not apoc and u can use the horsemen team character combined with other meta character to get dormamu as well so why should anyone skip ?

I cant agree with skipping him hes a monster and used virtually everywhere

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

500% bet you already have him so its a moot statement.

Apoc is getting a rework, to make you go for him.

@josephgiles1825

Ай бұрын

He already got one on release

Jeremy, bro, you don’t need that bullshit distortion and other generated shit over your voice

New players shouldn't be walking thru content just because they didn't play a year ago! Im glad apoc is hard, its tough on yous that the teams to unlock are not great now, they were at the time? But everyone at different places, if you don't think you need a big apoc, dont do it, but bear in mind all your raid teams will be dud in a year

@Boilon

Ай бұрын

Being able to get daily rewards from Inc2 is my priority and the biggest resource gain you can do. After this point where im doing these raids I will see where things are at, and I will continue to do account updates on this as I go along.

First 😂

@akaKRANNI

Ай бұрын

The first shall be last. ...or atleast at the bottom of the comments. Sorry, I couldn't help myself.