It's a shame cause the gothic knights definitely look coolest

@PixelatedApollo1

9 жыл бұрын

yeah for sure!

I used them for 2 years and this video showed me why I kept losing as HRE

@fabianustertius6460

3 жыл бұрын

LMAO

@jaypea30

3 жыл бұрын

Thats why you don't use them *No Gothic Knights allowed*

@simplifiednews4235

3 жыл бұрын

@@jaypea30 but they look nice

@jonash3406

2 жыл бұрын

I mean if you really wanna use them just get one as a flanking force

I've found that Units like Varangian Guard and English /noble/ portugese knights seem to have less of a problem with the two handed glitch

@jackdaone6469

2 жыл бұрын

Those are the units that wield the poleaxe, right?

@mckee7789

2 жыл бұрын

@@jackdaone6469 yes

@Chriscs7

2 жыл бұрын

I use them in most of my battles as can verified in my sttreams and do very good. Varangians are my favorites

@likliklik9515

5 ай бұрын

that's because their weapons have armour piercing on them, total game-changer. Now mounted gothic knights do also have AP, but then they have lower attack with their 1H mace than the 2-handed troops you mentioned AND they don't have a shield so still don't do that great.

nice vid apollo but the gothic knights have sick armour

@PixelatedApollo1

9 жыл бұрын

yeah they do!

@michaeldog123ful

9 жыл бұрын

ajay caruana They just cant use it really well.

@michaeldog123ful

9 жыл бұрын

***** Thats weird. Probably just a glitch

@jacksaville6047

9 жыл бұрын

Ajay caruana they don't have suck armour

@williamknapp4492

9 жыл бұрын

+Jack Saville it is pretty cool

If medieval II were more realistic they would probably be #1

@sosig6445

6 жыл бұрын

The armor itself was just perfect, light and strong and doesn't restrict movement as much as the other plate armors did, normal arrows would bounce off only crossbows would have a chance against them.

@rapidtreal4612

5 жыл бұрын

not even crossbows only guns

@RingoMonto

5 жыл бұрын

Duchy of Mecklenburg-Schwerin Is there much historical showing for the teutonic knights being very op? I mean, I don't think the knightly order had any standardized sets of armour or weapons, or that their equipment or skills would have been any better than other knightly orders? On top of that the Teutonic knights in-game are of an earlier period than the gothic armour. Maybe some Teutonic order knights did use gothic armour in the real late medieval period though? I would agree that in-game their visual appearance is the most badass though. Sadly I'd guess those winged great helms probably weren't very common in real history either.

@taloob493

5 жыл бұрын

@@sosig6445 well there really was no well made plate armor that restricted movement

@retardcorpsman

4 жыл бұрын

Ringo The successes of the teutonic order was not because of their equipment but rather because of they’re better disciplined rank structures and organisation which allowed them to be much more successful than their Polish counterparts.

I cannot believe the game made Gothic Knights so weak compared on how they should be. First of Gothic armor was the best armor in the world of the time and I would dare to say the top three best metal armors of all time. Light, very strong thanks to fluting and ridges that adds the strength to the steel with out making it thicker, and they are knights so they are more than likely have heat treated steel that is fully hardened on top of that. Arrows are nothing to that armor in real life. The other thing is that two handed swords are amazing weapons and can still defeat a man with a shield with out too much trouble. Both have ups and downs but a sword like that can simply fined it's way around the shield. The game is good but a bit flawed.

@theo4269

8 жыл бұрын

+Landsknecht 86 The unit itself is good, its just the two-handed weapon glitch that makes them suck

@landsknecht8654

8 жыл бұрын

Theo Fullerton There is a glitch? Also if I remember right they had the foot Gothic Knights in the first Medieval Total War so bad ass, those guys beat just about everything around them short from a cavalry charge, and arrows did almost nothing to them too.

@theo4269

8 жыл бұрын

Landsknecht 86 There's something called the "Two-Handed glitch" where basically most units with two handed weapons, they attack slower than units with one handed weapons, so they are blocking more than they are attacking. They fixed this in the kingdom expansion backs but in vanilla they suck

@landsknecht8654

8 жыл бұрын

Theo Fullerton I just thought that the Gothic Knights were going to be so bad ass as they were in the first Medieval Total War. I mean they are Knights trained sens childhood. If anyone will read any real history as well as any real historical battles and documents you will fiend that Knights were very good warriors and that they are underrated in our history/media. Also the fact that they have Gothic armor should protect them very, very well.

@rorschach1985ify

7 жыл бұрын

Nice to see someone else who remembers and knows about the Gothic Foot knights in the original MTW. Looked at their stats from some unit guides and tested them out and yeah, they were really badass and more then made up for their slow speed and smaller unit size with their incredible stats. A shame that the DGK are so much weaker in comparison to other units unlike their original counterpart.

maybe some like to pay more for armor polishing :)

@sakesaurus

7 жыл бұрын

They might have lost in combat, but they surely were victors in grace of their harness! Defeats mean nothing for truly Chivalrious Knights (except they mean, probably, pretty much, everything)

While playing on Total war kingdoms I was testing who was better with forlorn hope, Gothic knights, and zweihanders while being against dismounted Feudal knights. Surprisingly they (2h guys) won but Forlorn Hope took the least amount of casualties with personally I find Forlorn Hope better. Also their armor upgrade looks sick

@Dr.CaveCurinas

2 жыл бұрын

I know this is old but the "bug" that caused this was removed in Kingdoms

@FifinatorKlon

8 ай бұрын

@@Dr.CaveCurinas Those twohanded cunts sure as hell shredded through my teutonic knights

Vanilla MTW2 unit balance is just broken.

I like how the ultimate evolution of plate armored knights suck balls in this game.

A little piece of advise for anyone who doesn't know: Darthmod Medieval II, fixes this issue about 2 handers, Darth's very good at properly balancing total war games. Stainless Steel 6.4 is very good also, but I pick Darth because it doesn't crash, SS crashes a lot for me (and I have a £2,000 PC as of Aug 2020, so a new and powerful rig) I recommend Darthmod for its stability and as being the vanilla game essentially, but with major bug fixes and improvements. For instance, pikemen actually hold onto their pikes (never switch to their short swords) and so actually function as pikes.

@juhannusruusu

Жыл бұрын

how about vanilla kingdoms EMF ?

@ivanpavlov7260

Жыл бұрын

Late to the party, but JLMP's vanilla kingdoms is a very nice mod that also fixes pikemen bug, musketeers, a lot of units ( including gothic knights).

@BaronUltimo

9 ай бұрын

Thank you for the hint

It's a shock infantry, so you should use them as cavalry and use their charge bonus and never let them be alone against enemy.

@thattonnatoguywithafez8246

3 жыл бұрын

The problem with that, is you can just use you know, Cavalry, and they would ussualy do a better role in that regard. Of course with something like Scots that have like 2 cav units sure, but even then Mailed Knights do a resonable job even if its the only thing you have.

@steelwind2334

2 жыл бұрын

@@thattonnatoguywithafez8246 Units with Shield always win prolonged combats vs no 1H/2H no shield. You should never use 2H trrops for long combat. Also use 2H in loose formation so they can encirle enemy and debuff morale. 2H swords and 3-4 meter pikes need some space you know...

Keep up the good work bro. I really enjoy your commentaries

@PixelatedApollo1

9 жыл бұрын

thanks man!

Brilliant video series Apollo, and again Awesome commentary and explanation!!!

@PixelatedApollo1

9 жыл бұрын

thanks man!

Does the 2 handed glitch happen in third age total war?

dismounted feudal and chivalric knights were SOOOOO damn strong

He decides to rub it in by getting the Feudal Knights to just walk away from the routed dismounted Gothic Knights. Just not worth it, like he said. Ouch! Feel the burn!

Out of curiosity, are 2-handed units good in siege in the expansions? I know they fixed the 2-handed bug, and while they'd probably still suffer in the field, I'm curious how they do in expansion shields.

@CaptainInvisible1

6 жыл бұрын

They didn't "fix" the 2-hander glitch as much as they buffed 2-handers and weakened sword and shield infantry, which still helped a lot. It depends where you are using the in the siege. Taking the walls and attacking choke points will always end badly for all units. But they do better at crushing armoured foes, and get them in the courtyard and they have the freedom to flank.

In reality, the Gothic knights armor was good enough they didn't need Shields. The game doesn't seem to give them high enough defence points. Also their armor was arrow proof.

@Sunxxet

4 жыл бұрын

You sould use all two handed weapon units in loose formation. They will easily overpower any one handed weapon unit.

@derekyohan1444

3 жыл бұрын

@hellavadell but are they bolt crossbow proof?

@akakios7386

Жыл бұрын

@@derekyohan1444 Yes, in fact some particularly late period armor was even bulletproof to a limited degree, armor was damn good. It was more economics and growing army sizes that ended the dominance of personal armor rather than the armor being defeated. Obviously an arrow or bolt hitting where the armor isn't is going to fuck you up though, and with enough projectiles flying, some are practically guaranteed to find some gap or weak point.

@Nuncey

Жыл бұрын

I disagree

It's a shame that with a unit like that they are broken. Although from reading the comments it seems that the GK's are fixed in the expansion pack and are fixed in stainless steel.

I hate how they all clash then 70% of the army steps back and watches

@joevenespineli6389

3 жыл бұрын

Because battles aren't bar brawls.

@derekyohan1444

3 жыл бұрын

@Josepene Espinili Yeah cause they have swords but in fights they fight tight to not get enemy's inside there army and have you heard of phalanx formations?

@joevenespineli6389

3 жыл бұрын

@@derekyohan1444 Are you really going to mock my name first?

@derekyohan1444

3 жыл бұрын

@Joeven espineli well my bad but I'm angered of your logic

@joevenespineli6389

3 жыл бұрын

@@derekyohan1444 I can't do anything about that, people have differing beliefs, perspectives, and eccentricities, I won't force anyone my own. But as a rebuttal to your mocking, I shall call you, Derelict Yahoo.

Didn't vanilla gothic knights do well against the later knights that were more reliant on armor?

Today on my english class i had to explain the meaning of the word Salty, guess what video i was looking for :v

Does that apply to the Gotland unit?

Could you do a video of Dismounted Huscarls vs. Dismounted Feudal Knights? I've heard so many rumors about this.

@windwaik3r689

9 жыл бұрын

Me too. If you were to do another comparison could you show huscarls?

Could I ask which version of the game this is? Is it vanilla and v1.3+?

Since the game is on steam, wouldn't patches be possible?

Does Stainless Steel 6.4 eliminate the 2 hand glitch?? Actually, the thing with the shield is important.

how do you get Gothic Knights without dlc

On the stainless Stell mod they are Monster. But on vanilla game units without shields are all ducks xD

@Samuel-iv4qt

8 жыл бұрын

true, I rather play with the SS mod.

is there a way to mod it where 2 handed weapons are somewhat better?

@Userius1

7 жыл бұрын

Play Stainless Steel mod or the Kingdoms campaigns.

Hi, i'm just started to watch you today, and i already watched your video about the top 10 inf in MTW 2, and why the Jannis suck in battlefield, i want to ask you: how to use properly the billmen? (i know they have a bug, they are not the legendary "tin can openers" from MTW 1, and that they are "bloody useless unit" but my petition goes because i liked a lot how they perfomed in the demo, i know the "billman spirit" is out there, but is unknown to me as i didn't played it enough... as i'm playing NTW - tomatoes from the public ready to throw me- i just wanna ask you that... and if you can tip me about a top 10 of inf units in NTW if you don't mind, of course, sir).

@CaptainInvisible1

9 жыл бұрын

Bryan Jean Ramirez Billmen certainly have their uses. Their cost makes them a nice "filler" unit for armies. They are also brutal against stationary cavalry, so using them to support your cavalry will allow you an advantage. Their morale is weak and they don't do so well against other infantry outside of the Kingdoms expansion. So you are best just using them to win you the cav fight or as a meat-shield.

Did you take into account upkeep cost?

That's why you get the Retrofit mod which contains the two handed fix from the Kingdoms expansion.

Have they fixed that glitch in stainless steel

how about stainless ?they have the bugg too ?

What's the two handed glitch? I always use dismounted portuguese knight and they're very good...

@CaptainInvisible1

9 жыл бұрын

Lorik Cana The 2 handed glitch affects all 2 handed pole-armed, axe and sword wielding heavy infantry. Their slower attack animations are constantly interrupted by sword and shield infantry. They spend most of their time blocking attacks instead of attacking, which for a unit with 21 attack and only 13 defense (I think that is right for Dismounted Portuguese knights) is a a big problem.

@lorikcana7451

9 жыл бұрын

Captain Invisible thanks, but my dismounted portuguese knights do good against elite units. Anyways, thanks for answering me

I think they are meant to help hold the mainline, protect the archers and flank on the sides to help collapse the enemy's attack. While spear men are meant to hold the main enemy force. And of course cavalry is meant to stop enemy cavalry and strike from the rear to finish the unit. But this game is buggy, broken, unbalance and we all still love it.

@BaronUltimo

9 ай бұрын

I don't think so. Those Two-Handers are meant to be heavy battle infantry with low protection against arrows (no shields) but great effectiveness in melee combat (where they suck however which makes them useless).

nise job bud sick of hearing there the greatest aswell but i have to admit that just look so slick!

hmmm I still don't believe you, I think they are great, I get 1000 of kills ez

Realistically, they should be better.

What about dismounted portugese knights?

That sarcasm though Apollo. XD

@NEY-uu3lx

3 жыл бұрын

do you still watch him?

The gothic knights suffer from a glitchy charge animation, but their attack and defense animations are alright (or perform similar to swordsmen with the same stats) Problem is they have stats of 14 14 while feudals have 13 22, so there is no contest.

Have you tried charging Gothic Knights in wedge formation? As I understand, their armoured improves their charge impact, which is particularly efficient if used in wedge. I tried charging Lancers in wedge against Chivs , and their kill them

To be honest I think the forlorn hope is one of the most underrated units in the game and personally I choose forlorn hope over goths

I never really bother going for the expensive units that are hard to replace because you need high quality forts to get them. Usually i just use armies which have somewhat small numbers of infantry, large numbers of cavalry and crossbowmen or if there are no crossbowmen, then either archers or horse archers. I just see little to no point in wasting money to higher tier units that cost a lot to get and upkeep.

Is this glitch fixed in definitive edition now?

@MetalHeadHellYeah

Жыл бұрын

no, vanilla medieval 2 still has the bug, but it's fixed in kingdoms

ap was a great skill that makes weaker units able to kill other well armored units like dfk but it got nerfed after the 1.2 or 1.3 versions thats why units with that skill are sucks like gothics and janissaries even it efected veneterian heavy inf if you try them in 1.0 or 1.1 versions of m2t you can easly understand why so much people say that they are great because they were able to defeat conquristadores (sorry for bad english :)

@RocketHarry865

Жыл бұрын

also sword and board units defensive skill is absurbly high. The best two handers only have a melee defensive skill that caps out 5 while dismounted feudal knights which are a common mid game sword and board armed unit has a starting defensive skill of 8 and this in addition to both their high armour and shield rating.

Does this glitch still exist?

Wait does this two handed glitch affect my English dismounted knights? I always favored damage over tankiness. Don't make me feel bad using the armored swordmen as disposable shields for my superior English long bowmen.

@chofa135

3 жыл бұрын

Damage over tankiness = Venice Heavy infantry or lumberjacks

You say two-handed glitch, does that affect every "Zweihänder"-wielding unit in the game? Like Canons of the Holy Sepulcher in Crusades expansion or Forlorn Hope from the Empire? Are they any good? Duel-handed axes are all right aren't they? They seem to be... Would love to see you make a video explaining this further :3

@pawarsauza3042

9 жыл бұрын

2 handed glitch doesnt affect every two handed unit, just most of them.

@CaptainInvisible1

9 жыл бұрын

Revan Ar-Pharazôn The bug was partially fixed in the kingdoms expansion, so the Canons of the Holy Sepulcher will not be affected too badly. It is much more noticeable in the vanilla game. The only units I know to be relatively unaffected by the bug are halberd units. Does not make up for their got awful stats though.

Well the way with how two handlers should be used is by flanking there opponent rather than charging by themselves so that was the mistake there

Nice. But maybe the gothic Knights were supposed to be relied on reinforcements from cavalry or at least more infantry. I think they were supposed to be the battle line whose main purpose would be to hold the line while rest of the force would try to flank or something like that (hence more blocks than attacks). I'm by no means a medieval warfare expert, or even proficient at this game, but given than my Knights block more than they attack, they are more aptly used as tanks (so more enemy units are targeting them) while the bulk of my forces are killing weaker units only to circle and finish the rest of them off.

Why didn't they ever patch the glitch

Thank god someone made this video.Thank you Apollo

Did they ever fix it?

Is there a mod to fix this?

@taloob493

5 жыл бұрын

I think stainless steel does

Does this glitch exist in Stainless Steel?

@CaptainInvisible1

9 жыл бұрын

Lordhate Nope, they gave all 2 handed units brand new animations. It improved them so much that 2 handed units are one of the best infantry units to bring to battle.

Why are all cool units buggy?

I always wanted tw to add combined or paired units. Pike and shot for example.

Another great commentary but its za shame about 2h glitch but atleast in Teutonic expansion the HRE are one of the most powerful factions

@PixelatedApollo1

9 жыл бұрын

yeah very true

If you play 1.1 or 1.2 patch they do awesome actually. Always beat feudal knights and all the 2 handed units in the game for me

Its worth pointing out they fixed the glitch in Kingdoms, which makes them much better.

@roberttrue7219

3 жыл бұрын

are there any mods that fix vanilla medieval 2? I'd enjoy it waaaaayyy more if it were more playable

Apollo is so salty in this video.

@dwarfie24

5 жыл бұрын

Considering how annoying and know it ytcommebters get... I dont blame him.

@derekyohan1444

3 жыл бұрын

@The onderoinian sarcasm?

The cavalry Gothic Knights are pretty much invincible in Stainless Steel, and the dismounted ones are only beaten by any high end AP inf such as Pollaxes or Halberds.

Wow your voice has changed so much after just 5 years!

the sarcasm is priceless! !

How about Gothic Knight in Stainless steel mod, sir?

@augiedoggy6436

8 жыл бұрын

That's a mod, if you fine any mod you can make any unit better.

@leifcampion9290

8 жыл бұрын

Yeah I believe they fixed this glitch in stainless steel, and gothics perform better

@krekk2751

8 жыл бұрын

+Leif Campion two handed glitch doesnt exist

in the expansion the dismounted version has better stats costs a lot less and without the glitch they can almost anything with their charge

I know I'm late, but Gothic Knights are a support/shock unit, just like all two handers.

@CaptainInvisible1

7 жыл бұрын

They are very expensive for a support unit. I like my support infantry cheap as most of my money will be going into my cavalry and frontline infantry. Support units, to me, should be strong enough to take care of themselves and expendable enough not to cripple the entire army at their loss.

Can you do the same test but in kingdoms. it is said that they fixed the two handed glitch but i'm not sure i hope they are better because the cost and everything.

@SwedishLandsknekt

9 жыл бұрын

The animation glitch for the two-handed units still exist in the expansion for medieval 2, it's just their stats have been buffed up.

@CaptainInvisible1

9 жыл бұрын

***** They were also given the armour-piercing trait, which helped them out a lot.

@joejones8134

9 жыл бұрын

Thanks. I also noticed they made units like the dismounted feudal knights have lower stats, which make the two handlers a bit more value for money.

@DALKurumiTokisaki

9 жыл бұрын

The glitch only doesn't apply to canons of the holy sepulcher I believe due to the fact that they were made to move slightly faster then other foot units

@CaptainInvisible1

9 жыл бұрын

It doesn't apply to Kingdoms units really at all. All their animations were made faster and 2 handed swords were given armour piercing traits.

this is just for multiplayer though. In campaign the only cost that matters is upkeep, and the feudal knights are extemely expensive

Disregarding price and the Two-handed glitch, they have really shitty morale, also in terms of defense and attack, they are beat by Venetian Heavy Infantry and Dis. Conquistadors.

Ok, so the infantry unit is affected by a glitch. But why do the mounted knights lose even with AP attack?

@chofa135

3 жыл бұрын

Because the Shield adds more value than the armor Pierce removes. Also gothic knights dont have a shield. Edit: I was wrong 😂 both shields and AP add and reduces defense by 4

@dalmacietis

3 жыл бұрын

@@chofa135 But gothic knights have more armor? GC have 10 armor, 0 shield, Hosp have 7 armor, 4 shield. Is shield better in frontal melee than armor?? And then it also needs to counterbalance the AP...

@dalmacietis

3 жыл бұрын

I mean, here is the calculation as i understand it: Hosp have 7 armor (which is ignored) so 0 + 4 shield + 5 defence = 9 GC have 10 armor + 0 shield + 5 defence = 15 Attack is 13 for both. How are GC losing?

@chofa135

3 жыл бұрын

@@dalmacietis First at all im not an expert but there are more stats wich arent compared like discipline and training wich Hospitaller have better than GC also AP halves the armor so H will have 3 armor "7 rounded down" 5 defense skill and 4 Shield 12 in total vs 15 of GC. In atack H 14 vs 13 of GC. So I think Hospitaller wins because their "Training" stat wich is Highly trained VS the Trained of GC In discipline H have Normal VS Low of GC And both have 11 morale. Hope this can help but as I said before im a amateur jajajaja 😄

@chofa135

3 жыл бұрын

@@dalmacietis Remember a lot of units have 2 weapons in this case cavalry both have 13+8 atk with lances and charge bonus but then Hospitaller pull out the swords 14Atk +4 if they charge and GC use maces 13 +4 if they charge. In some cases units with bows are quite good in melee combat like Noble Highland Archers wich have 9+3 AP "bowmen with axes 😂" and 5 armour 4 defense skill and 3 shield so you can use them to destroy militias or in siege towers after a good melee unit to protect them and they will shoot from the enemy walls

but i have to notice the infantry did fight to the last man

if only someone could edit them to use sword and shield or mace and shield. Or make it so they dont stagger and change their stats accordingly.

Gothic Knights are use for charging.

People call it a glitch but I thought about it and... It must be really hard to wave a big fucking sword around like a parade baton

So this is the the test game that pirate was telling me of

@PixelatedApollo1

9 жыл бұрын

yeah lol

I like the Gothic Knights cavalry it's mostly how you use them that makes them good. I use them for powerful charges that break up solid lines, and then take them out of the fray as admittedly they aren't good with prolonged 1 to 1s as the video shows, they don't suck they're just found wanting in moments where they're expected to flatten the opposition, just my opinion btw but fair point they are very expensive compared to most units.

@echo12100

9 жыл бұрын

I know most other heavy cavalry is used the same way it's just that Gothic Knights cav has a flare in charges that other cav does not have. Again my opinion hope you reply to what you think of this.

@Nuncey

Жыл бұрын

Dude I’m 8 years late and I agree so much with your point of view! Thumbs up 👍🏾

If ca go to reality with the gothic knights Are much stronger Impossible to a arrow penetrate a gothic armor

@darklysm8345

5 жыл бұрын

@Anne Isopod lol what See videos Arrows cant penetrate late plate armor

@user-yh5ls8hk5y

5 жыл бұрын

@Anne Isopod Warbow's with bodkin tips had trouble penetrating chainmail and gambeson. It couldn't penetrate plate armor. No way in hell could it penetrate gothic or italian plate armors.

@LordVader1094

3 жыл бұрын

@The Cornfield It's not a ridiculous claim, missiles simply couldn't penetrate plate armour.

I clicked on this video not knowing that it was about total war, for a second I was like "now listen here matey"

Bugs and cost/value calculations aside - why tests troops by sending them against "same type" troops? Who does that in battle? The point of foot knights is to fight spearmen or really anything *but* foot knights unless they've been softened up by xbow, the last unit I'd charge knights into is *another* unit of knights. That's like testing polish nobles against jinetes or charging them straight into knights. Instead send both compared troops against the same third "victim" unit.

maybe gothic knigths work better with a pike oriented army. late era pike and shot how is the mobility of gothic knigths compared to knigth hospitaller? cavalry is focused on charging sword and missile infantry hit and run so keeping a unit of gothic knigths in the center behind the pavise and pike militia is worth it cuz if the opponent is atatck oriented he is going to have his cavalry on the flanks cuz cavalry cant break pike militia head on you charge tru your pike and pavise into his swords and retreat back behind your lines in the center

Bro, just go to data folder, unit text file and give them 2 hit points

It's all late periode units. Jannisary heavy infantry, Jannisary archers and Gothic knights. HI Pirate :D

thankfully theres a darthmod of this game so it fixes the "bug" its really just a balancing issue to stop two handers being overpowered, but even with the darthmod fixes theyre not over powered because they have less missile and melee defence i wish CA hadnt messed with that because without mods the unique faction units are unplayable. and come on everyone plays the HRE for gothic foot knights

Or install they mod that changes animations

I'm assuming that Zweihanders and Forlorn Hope have the same problem >.>

@CaptainInvisible1

7 жыл бұрын

Yes, but worse. The Zweihanders have weaker stats and there are half as many Forlon hope in the unit. They don't stand a chance.

Any two-handed unit in this game pretty much blow chunks. The highlander nobles and Janissaries both also get destroyed against any standard dismounted feudal knights.

i don't even play this game but still enjoyed this video. Gothic Knights watched Revenge of the Sith and saw the style (Soresu) of Obi-Wan-Kenobi of only defending himself until the enemy surrenders.

Mounted Gothic knights are like lancers and gendarmes; they are meant to charge infantry lines, use up the time on their charge bonus (about 30 seconds according to developers but 10 is better), and get out. If you want to have Gothic knights attack other horses you need space to reach maximum charge, while in a wedge formation, wait for the knights to switch over to maces then reissues the attack. The amount of babysitting is stupid but it does allow them to win. (about 50% loss but its better then total defeat lancers should just avoid cavalry fights.) Dismounted Gothic knights are like most other two handed units, hold units such as feudal knights [F.K.] in place while other units flank and surround. Or they can cut off a charge so the main force can come in and counter charge. Also their small size and high charge allows them access to charge in city streets where horses do not. Most other players might use armored sergeants [A.S.] and yes the do stop and hold the enemy at bay, but 1 on 1 against F.K. they can at best get 10 kills. In pitched battles two handed units may not be cost effective, but the other side of the game is campaign where money is no object really. While the point of F.K., missal units, and A.S. are clear and they can be used easily two-handed units, halberd/pike militias, lancer units, and hand-gunners are all specialty units which historically existed to deal with tactics at that time period. As heavy horse and gunpowder units started to takeover pikes became essential to protect infantry, in the game early pikes suck unless you get Swiss or Flemish pikes but if infantry get to them they give up on life. Pike and shot tactics are hard to do with the way units take up space. And as we all know C.A. makes A.I. of the special variety, one which blobs its way to a hopeful victory across a creaky bridge, devoid of thought. Thus going against the A.I. will be like slamming two bricks together. Against a human you have some room, you both want to pull off that one move which turns the battle to your favor. This point is where specialty units come in. The real reason they aren't used is because good is good enough, and simplicity is your friend. Why use lancers when feudal knights can do the job (all be it with slightly less efficiency) aanndd also fend off his horses (with slightly more efficiency), a person can get two of them instead of one of each. Why use Zwei-handers with knightly backup when two fueled knights could just charge in and stay there till they're done. So it should be stated that F.K.s are the heavy infantry staple of every (christian) army and there is really no equal to them. The chivalric knights are really only for faction flare. e.i. Imperial knights, Polish knights, English knights, Portuguese knights, Men at arms and broken lancers are able to get advance armor, Noble knights which is a version of France's chivalric knights, Hungary's Chivalric knights which are different in all but name, Norse War Clerics which does not have a lance but has better defense. Spain and Sicily don't have any snowflake Chivalric knights, most likely because of 'better' late game cavalry for Spain and Norman knights for Sicily. Maybe, even though the F.K. availability is high, show how suck-y units do versus a variety of units.

Those fetal nights bruv, there hard

Would think full plate would make them op against all types

Dont all 2 handers suck in m2tw? Which is annoying cuz they look sick

The best unit is mounted calivermen, in kingdoms expansion anyway.

i dont even play this game anymore but for some reason my brain consists of 90 percent total war strategy

But there horses also have armor . Which is why they cost more. Had this battle been on horseback they might have done better because they’d have more armor

I think its hard to judge (at least for the foot soldiers) based on a vid where you compare them to onehanded infantery. It goes with all the two handed units in the game, no matter what they are, let it be Gothic knights, Zweihander, Jannissary, Halberdiers, twohanded Axemen etc. If you let them fight one on one vs a simple infantery unit such as these feudal knights who have one handed weapons, they will get destroyed because they all have that blocking bug which makes them shit ass slow. So just because of that to say that "gothic knights suck" I find a bit vague, because the other two handed units suck equally in this game. With the cav however I totally agree

@Nuncey

Жыл бұрын

I agree only except the Gothic Knights mounted versions does not have a shield so that kind of negates their defense plus I believe they’re shock cavalry not “Melee Cavalry”. I believe you got to look at this way those two handed units and the French Lancers French Gendarmes and Gothic knights are “Late Period” units this is around the time “Pike and shot” formations became of existence. The two handers jobs were to break up pike formations, flank and dismantle cavalry units as well. That’s just my take on it so that begs the question why are we pitting Late Period units against High and Early Period units when the latter two were heavily focused on sword and shield combat?

@adolfhipsteryolocaust3443

9 ай бұрын

​@@Nunceyactually it simply is that the game doesn't account for the fact they didn't have a shield because their armour was better than shield, thus making shielded units better