Dude, I have seen every WW2 historical films to exist. How have I never known about this? Well played.

@anthonymaddison9588

Жыл бұрын

Know what you mean.

@bigmal1690

Жыл бұрын

It's a 1st for me too, I've read and watched countless stuff about the war in the Pacific, and ur the 1st to mention it, I guess if more historians know about it, I would have known about it before now, because its like something someone would definitely say because its very interesting stuff

@31terikennedy

Жыл бұрын

Not everyone. You missed "Wing and a Prayer" They do a hanger catapult launch with a TBF. Good flick.

@jamesmaddison4546

Жыл бұрын

seriously dude! in all my years, seen them all, but NEVER heard about this

@jamesmaddison4546

Жыл бұрын

​@@bigmal1690 but even the vet pilots of the carriers have never mentioned this in everything ive ever watched

I've seen the picture of the Hellcat being launched from the hanger but never thought about a TBF Avenger doing it. That is a huge aircraft. My grandfather flew Avengers off the Saratoga CV-3. I have his Log Book. "Torpedo attack 1 Jap. DD and 1 Jap. CL in Nov. 1943" and got a commendation medal the certificate signed by Admiral Halsey. Later he crashed on take off and flew 2 days later new plane obviously but with same crew nice to see everyone got out. After WW2 he flew Grumman F7F Tigercats and In the 1950's he had a cold catapult shot in a A-1 Skyraider and crashed in the sea and came very close to drowning. He retired in 1968 a Captain and lived in San Diego with 6 children and 12 grandchildren and for the rest of his 30 years refused to go anywhere in the city where he could see even a tiny bit of the ocean. I think he had plenty of memories and enough of the Pacific.

@MrSvenovitch

Жыл бұрын

Men like your grandpa overpopulated the planet at an ever increasing rate. I salute him and all unbridled breeders like him for their continued efforts to make the funeral industry the corporate behemoth it is today.

@c4sualcycl0ps48

Жыл бұрын

Avenger is my favorite and Hellcat is my second favorite of all time. Grumman just made some of the best looking aircraft ever.

@larrybaker5316

Жыл бұрын

great story, thanks for sharing

@xmlthegreat

Жыл бұрын

​@@MrSvenovitch the fuck

My grandfather Frank was aboard the USS Heavy Fast Cruiser Tuscaloosa from 19378 until Dec 1945. His battle station was as a gunners mate, #2 turret to an 8 inch rifle, while his duty station was working as the crane operator for the catapult launched spotter aircraft (Of various types over the course of the war) He was skillfull at plucking craft from the sea, and placing them upon the launch, underway and in rough seas, he was given a commendation for his safe work, with no accidents over 7 years.

@no-won

Жыл бұрын

My great grandfather was a scout pilot during WWII. He was stationed at a U.S. Airforce Base in Cuba though but it'd be cool if our ancestors crossed paths.

@Fox-One1937

Жыл бұрын

​@@no-won yours ancestors never had blood in the hands Easy lazy cozzy war,

@mikemulligan5731

Жыл бұрын

@@Fox-One1937 That's right, both of those great old men had cold, hard prosthetics in place of the more regular blood-laden examples. Good call on that point, sir! As far as the war sentiments you put forth go, however, Adolf Hitlers dead, burned and mummified corpses' asshole would like to have a word with you..

@billgeissler

Жыл бұрын

Our fathers served together on the USS Tuscaloosa- my father was a gunners’ mate who fed the 8 inch shells into the main turrets at Normandy.

@chiphailstone589

Жыл бұрын

@@billgeissler Utah Beach and beyond.

"Wing and a Prayer" (1944) has a hanger catapult launch with a TBF. Good flick I remember watching it as a kid and thought it was weird a plane was taking off from the side of the ship.

Now, this is fascinating. I've been studying militaria for over 50 years, and this is the first time I've ever seen this. It just goes to show no matter how old you are or how much you've studied, each day can bring some new Wonder.

@miles2378

Жыл бұрын

I never new that.

@lordkreigs1978

Жыл бұрын

Exactly. I wrote and taught WWII & Korea history for several years, and have toured USS Hornet CV-12 four times. Never have I heard of this. I knew of scout launch/recovery from battleships and others but this is totally new.

@kelvinh8327

Жыл бұрын

Wow! I never knew about this before. Well done Navel Architects.

@KarlBeeThree

Жыл бұрын

Same here.

@andrewtaylor940

Жыл бұрын

Another weird one is the unique midship deck edge elevator on USS Wasp CV-7. Once you see it you suddenly realize that they took what was essentially a carnival ride and bolted it to the side of the ship. The early Essex's had a lot of strange stuff that had been poured into their pre-war development that ended up not really being used. For example they had British type aircraft outriggers, where you could park planes along the edge of the flight deck with their tails hanging off, to warm up the engines. The Americans never used them as they could warm up the engines in the open hangers, plus the Essex's had twice the width and real estate of a British carrier. So they never bothered pushing the planes out onto the little parking stands.

The Yorktown-Class were fitted with hangar catapults. But weren’t used for the same reasons. Yorktown (CV-5) still had hers when she was lost at Midway. But Enterprise (CV-6) and Hornet (CV-8) had theirs removed after the Battle and before Guadalcanal.

I can only imagine the resolve and courage it would take to launch an aircraft from a short catapult, into a crosswind, maybe a dozen feet above the ocean.

@lellopesce

Жыл бұрын

Great Balls of Fire!

@gotanon9659

Ай бұрын

Makes it easier if launched from a catapult.

Launching into a 25 knot + CROSSWIND must've been hellish for the pilots!

@SoloRenegade

Жыл бұрын

I takeoff land a Cessna 150 in up to 22kts at times. Big planes with HP handle it even better. If a fighter pilot cant handle it, they can turn in their wings for incompetence.

@jwenting

Жыл бұрын

@@SoloRenegade yeah, right. You do realise the 150 isn't certified for anything over 12 knots crosswind?

@SoloRenegade

Жыл бұрын

@@jwenting Actually, my C150 is capable of 15kts according to the POH, and the POH merely states the max DEMONSTRATED crosswind, not the max POSSIBLE crosswind. Cessna 172s likewise claimed ~15kt max DEMONSTRATED crosswind, but I have done up to 26kt crosswinds, and CFIs at our flight school were allowed to fly in up to 25kt winds with students. the true limit of an airplane's crosswind capability is the rudder. Just because you can't handle it, doesn't mean it can't be done.

@xj900uk

Жыл бұрын

You have to set the trim of the plane just right and literally take it off with a distinctive yaw towards the bow. It can be done - I remember talking to a TBF crew-man who had done htis and he yawned and said it was 'no big deal'.

This is something I didn't know existence of, another great history fact Ken

@-Cece

Жыл бұрын

I second this comment

@stewartdeerfield

Жыл бұрын

I 3rd it!

@toupac3195

Жыл бұрын

I know, right! 🤷‍♂️

It is notable how little this is spoken of, and it comes a surprise to me, that it was widely used in so many familiar carriers of the era, with this detail somehow becoming lost over time.

@jwenting

Жыл бұрын

it wasn't that widely used, and only for a few short years on a small number of carriers. One of the forgotten little details, swamped by the larger, more glorious things like massive airstrikes and landing operations.

@williamfuller2389

Жыл бұрын

With the rapid advancement of naval radar, these catapult systems became a less efficient use of space and resources aboard ship.

@johnhallett5846

Жыл бұрын

@@jwenting Very true. The same scenes and themes shown again and again over decades will drown out the occasional different one.

@user-en9zo2ol4z

Жыл бұрын

@@jwenting I am a student of history, yet at 65, this was new to me. I appreciate that fact.

*Raise Hand* I knew about them long before this video. This feature was illustrated in a 1990s educational book featuring cut outs of various ships throughout history. One of the ships featured was the Essex-class Lexington and has the hangar catapult not only clearly marked, but even has a plane just take off from it. It didn't have a blurb giving more details though - possibly because its so obscure - but then again this is supposed to be a children's book so they probably wanted to highlight more important portions of the ship. Not to go into a "good old days" rant, but it is a bit of a shame that small publishers like that essentially no longer exist, which largely killed off the cottage industry of researchers and illustrators who used to supply these books at this level of detail.

@angelapolinar5343

Жыл бұрын

Yep I had that book too. Haven't seen it in a while, but if I remember correctly there was a huge timeline on the last pages. I always wondered what kind of conditions were necessary to do that.

If your dig deeper you will see that the hanger can store aircraft on the roof. The sideways cat was quickly abandoned as the disadvantages you mentioned.

Ships had been using catapults to launch float planes for some time before carriers were a big deal. I can't recall the types, but the catapults were up high and rather short.

@williamfuller2389

Жыл бұрын

Yeah, Battleships and Cruisers used catapults to launch float spotter plains for years leading up and including WWII.

@AaronCMounts

Жыл бұрын

@@williamfuller2389 The British King George V class battleships carried their catapults amidships and launched straight to the side. Same for the USN's Pensacola class cruisers and New York class battleships. Later American ships carried their cats on pivot mounts on the stern, so they could (partially) control the launch direction.

@brian45auto

Жыл бұрын

the key, was up high...and irrc they used a gun powder charge rather then steam or compressed air.

Thanks for this video! My Dad was on the Essex CV-9 but, as you stated they never installed that catapult in her hangar deck. Haze Gray & Underway! 🇺🇸

The Japanese did it; they even built some that had a flight deck extending directly out from the hanger deck, below the upper fight deck. They had at least one carrier that had three stacked flight decks (one was very short, but it was there). They pretty much abandoned the idea by the time of WW-II.

@bostonrailfan2427

Жыл бұрын

the triple flight deck was an early ship, when planes became too powerful for the old design to work the lower flight decks were removed and converted into hangers while the top deck was extended. the ship was lost during the Battle of Midway

@Sandmann2605

Жыл бұрын

​@@bostonrailfan2427 Akagi and Kaga

Came from your short on this. 56 years and I am just now learning about this after watching every WW2 docu I can find. You just earned a sub, GJ.

Planes were launched from Cruisers for scout/patrol purposes as well. There were catapult arms that pivoted out from the stern to launch float equipped planes. Recovery was done with a hoist and they were lifted back aboard. Helicopters replaced them later on.

@KennethStone

Жыл бұрын

They were seaplanes that landed in the wake of the ship and were hoisted up.

@steveb6103

Жыл бұрын

I would add that those were small 2 set planes meant for spotting for the big guns.

@bostonrailfan2427

Жыл бұрын

every ship class larger than a destroyer had scout planes from the 1920s until the 1950s, including the needed hangers and elevators

I've known about this method for years. But it's never been a subject that has been given the attention it deserves.. Thanks for the excellent brief on this subject.👍👍

Wow Ken, I have never heard of or seen this before. That is something I never would've thought of but it obviously worked. Thanks for the great video.

THANK YOU ..... for Posting this!!! As a model ship-builder, I HAVE Heard of this method, but Never seen it in archive video of WW2. And Thanks for mentioning that the hanger catapult were All removed on those A/C, after the War.

Fantastic! This is some Mark Felton level "I've never seen THAT before." Thanks for sharing. All the years studying and reading about this stuff and it's always awesome to learn something new.

The Yorktown class were also built with the capability to launch from their hangars too, but they were never did so in wartime. This is according to Richard Worth in Fleets of World War II.

@ph89787

Жыл бұрын

Yorktown (CV-5) was sunk with hers. But Enterprise (CV-6) and Hornet (CV-8) had theirs removed after the Battle of Midway.

This I did not know! What an awesome and clever nugget of WWII history. Thanks for posting this!

A new one on me... and when it comes to WW2, that ain't easy. Well done!

While I had read about this, I’d never seen any footage of them. Really neat! Thank you for sharing.

It is a good day when you learn something new.

Fantastic info, Ken!

I saw this in a movie when I was a kid (I wish I could remember the name of the movie). I thought at the time it was a bit strange, but my dad (a navy pilot in ww II) said that yes, they could do that.

@geschirr9190

Жыл бұрын

It was called "Wing and a Prayer" maybe you'll see this comment before it's deleted for plagiarism again.

This is something I have never heard of before. Great video.

Brilliant piece of research, an innovative way to maintain a CAP, Combat Air Patrol, whilst the upper deck is fouled.

You give me new knowledge, thankyou verymuch

I believe Akagi class carriers (Akagi and Kaga) were designed with similar capabilities: facilities to launch planes from the 2nd. deck's hangar (in this case, in the same ship's heading) Greetings from Argentina 🇦🇷

Wow i was clueless about this even being a thing.. thanks for the knowledge!

They put catapults on the hanger deck to launch the ready planes quickly fairly early in WWII.

I've been a fan of military technology for 50 years or more and l have never seen this. Great video!

Stationed onboard carriers and never knew this. Great info. Thank you. - Phil

@HistoryX

Жыл бұрын

So glad you liked it. Thanks for watching, Phil!

You learn something every day!

Very interesting. Thank you.

@HistoryX

Жыл бұрын

So glad you liked it. Thanks for watching!

I vaguely remember hearing about this, but now you’ve confirmed it!!

@okonkwojones

Жыл бұрын

I think Greg’s airplanes and automobiles mentioned it in his best torpedo bomber of WWII video (it was the Avenger) but I don’t believe he had any photos or videos. Also, the stall speed of that plane was absurdly low, like around the speed limit for driving in a school zone

@Parr4theCourse

Жыл бұрын

@@okonkwojones wow….

Amazing video

as a boomer i did not know that, dad was ww2 navy, and was on a carrier for a short time....thanks for sharing

Missed it by one. My first ship was CVA-19. I was in Hydraulics, and we ran the deck elevators and hangar bay doors.

@jonathonhass4178

Жыл бұрын

My Dad’s ship was CVA-20, USS Bennington

Nice video Ken

Thank you! I just learned something.

Totally AMAZING !!

Wow. I am farily familiar with WWII US aviation history, but I had no clue about this. Thx for sharing!

Great military history! Thanks, I never knew of this.

@HistoryX

Жыл бұрын

So glad you liked it. Thanks for watching!

Interesting! Thanks! Didn't know that!

That was interesting thank you.

I have watched so many WWII war movies and studied about WWII war new Pacific and I had no idea this was a thing. Wow thanks for the information

@HistoryX

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching, RadioNut! I had never heard of it either until I read about it in a Facebook post a couple of weeks ago. Glad you found it interesting!

Learn something new every day!

Awesome work ripping of "The Crazy Aircraft Carrier Hangar Catapults Of World War II" by Tyler Rogoway.

@simonpayne1555

Жыл бұрын

Right? It's literally word for word.

I'm just reading and enjoying the comments below. My dad was as rear gunner on a B-29 in 1944.

I learned something new today. Reminds me of Battlestar Galactica's horizontal launch tubes.

Yeah, I can't believe I never knew about this. Bee building models for 20 years and still had no clue. Awesome video.

@HistoryX

Жыл бұрын

Thanks, Adam. Definitely appreciate your comment!

Why can't every youtuber be like this? An interesting video with a catchy but not clickbaity title that presents the information without a bunch of drama and BS or AI voices.

@HistoryX

Жыл бұрын

You're the best, Tranquility! Thanks for the kind words!

@jeffjefferson1503

Жыл бұрын

he plagiarised it

Good Video/Info.

@HistoryX

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching. Glad you found it interesting!

The relative crosswind was a huge help. I don't have my E6B handy, but the pilot has no crosswind effect until flung off the catapult. The aircraft will then naturally weathervane to the hypotenuse of the combined vectors. That airspeed will always exceed his catapult velocity. I got the E6B and this is hard to sus out as you kind of have to work it out sideways, it is smudged, and I am using the wrong pencil. But assuming a ship speed and wind over the deck combining to 40 units (knots, mph, whatever, let's say mph) and a cat speed of 60 mph, the plane weathervanes into a relative wind of 72 mph over its nose. I erred on the low side. If launched underway, if you came off the catapult with aileron and some rudder towards the bow, it would just come off as a gust reaction. So it would help, but the launches in the video appeared to be at rest, and so apparently not necessary.

Thank you.

Early aircraft carriers had one (or even two) "flying off" decks below the main landing deck

Never heard of this….thanks.

It was shown in a cutaway cross section book I had as a kid. Though the art had shown a Helldiver launching, so I didn't know if it could do that with a full ordnance load.

Thank you I've been a history buff my whole life. Wow

thank you so much. I volunteer at the USS Hornet museum and I tell visitors about this and they can't believe it

Learned this building models as a kid.

I didn't think there was enough room. That's the coolest idea ever

Cool, I've never actually seen footage of them in use before.

Good video Sir 👍🇭🇲

Short runway, water right THERE. Looks sketchy as hLL 😳

Huh, very cool & creative

I figured you would be talking about carriers that launch out the deck, like the pre-refit IJN Kaga(look it up). Out the side of an Essex? Didn't see that coming at all.

@AaronCMounts

Жыл бұрын

The old Japanese tri-deck carriers of the 1920s / early 1930s.

I remember seeing this done in a b&w carrier movie from the 40s/50s.

Dang how is this the first time I heard of it? I do recall the Lexingtons having a catapult near the stern area in the lower decks at one point but iirc it was for floatplane but never really used

Bei den Flugzeugträgern der Essex Klasse mit den Namen Yorktown, Wasp,und Hornet sollte dem Namen noch eine römische "II." angefügt werden, da die Schiffe mit dem Ursprünglichen Namen Versenkt wurden, beziehungsweise so schwer Beschädigt waren das Sie von den eigenen Seestreitkräfte versenkt worden sind.

The first ship to ever launch and recover an aircraft was HMS Furious during WW1. She started her life as a fast cruiser and was then converted to carry RNAS Sopwith Pups by removing her forward turret and building a launching deck from the main superstructure to the bow. She then underwent a series of re-modelling, first removing the rear turret and adding a landing deck on the stern (before then pilots had to fly alongside the superstructure and sideswipe across onto the take off deck - incredibly dangerous as the pilot who first managed to take off and land back on a moving ship at sea, Squadron Commander Edwin Harris Dunning was killed five days later attempting the same landing when an updraught from the superstructure lifted his Pup over the side of the bow, he was knocked unconscious and drowned in his cockpit). Furious then had a pair of side decks added allowing the biplanes to be rolled from the aft landing deck to the bow ramp and then finally did away with the last of the cruiser superstructure completely to build a through deck or 'flat top'. Her command bridge was situated in the centre of the flat deck at the bow and retracted down to allow flying to commence. Before the start of WW2 she had a new higher flightdeck constructed but still retained her original bow section which was level with the hanger deck so she could actually launch her aircraft from the lower deck and recover them on the upper one at the same time. Furious was the first ship to launch and recover an aircraft whilst at sea, the first in incorporate arrestor wires for landing (although they did tend to remove the undercarriage from light weight biplanes!). The first to launch a carrier attack against a land target (Zeppelin sheds, before that she was intercepting the Zeppelins themselves over the North Sea) She carried on into the second world war, taking part in the Norwegian campaign, ferrying aircraft to Gibraltar and Malta and her Swordfish took part in attacks against the Tirpitz. She survived the war, a German Heinkel bomber's bomb missing her by about 10 yards which threw her prop out of alignment and was finally scrapped in 1948.

Never knew this. 71 and I'm still learning something new.

@HistoryX

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the comment, Bobby D! I had never heard of it either until I read about it in a Facebook post a couple of weeks ago. Glad you watched this video!

Nerd here but it's awesome seeing the real life influences on the Venator and CIS capitol ships from Star Wars.

Yes, the USS YORKTOWN CV5 had a Hangerdeck launch system, and all of the other US Aircraft Carrirers followed

I had a prof. that flew Navy in WWII He said they had a plane that you could put a 2X4 on the deck 6 feet in front of the plane and the plane would hit that 2X4 and be airborne. Catapult, for other planes, I guess.

Man you about had me going to Alameda to check those hanger cats out on the Hornet! Missed it by that much

@HistoryX

Жыл бұрын

Ha! I actually left a voicemail yesterday with the engineering director there in Alameda asking if there was any evidence of a hangar catapult.

@plantfeeder6677

Жыл бұрын

@@HistoryX If I can talk my friend into it, a roadtrip is in order I think. Will let you know what I find out. Hopefully with pics. I'm about three hours away.

I have seen this in photos in a book featuring the Hellcat fighter.

Actually the IJN came up with another innovation - on their two big early carriers of the 1920's, the Agaki and the Kaga, they had not only a flight deck which did not extend as far as the bow, but also an upper and a lower hanger deck. Simply open the big doors at the front of the hangers, and fly off a few planes that way when the ships were steaming in to wind. So, in theory you could launch planes from three differen tpositions - flight deck, upper hanger deck and lower hanger deck. I think the Akagi lost this ability to launch from more than one deck after a big 1930's refit, but the Kaga continued with it until she was lost at Midway in June '42

I actually knew about this. If memory serves at least one could even launch float planes by greasing the hangar deck first.

When I was a teenager, before Marvel's Avengers and such. I would draw or sketch aircraft carriers that launch aircraft similar to the animated series "Yamato" who also launched fighters.

Avengers were big aircraft, but I wasn't surprised seeing one go off the the hangar deck catapult. "Dits" that were related to me by my father, an RN Fleet Air Arm Avenger pilot (TBF-1C, Avenger 1,) told of Avengers taking off from the main deck of an Escort carrier without catapult assistance (For one-off squadron re-deployment), after the carrier had been beached in the Firth of Forth, Scotland following severe torpedo damage off Norway. So taking off, in a lightened state, not necessariy a full crew or any warload, when the carrier wasn't even underway.

1944 film "Wing and a prayer, story of Carrier X" showed this very well.

Wow never knew this!

@HistoryX

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the comment, FireBrand07! I had never heard of it either until I read about it in a Facebook post a couple of weeks ago. Glad you watched this video!

Interwar they had the idea of maybe launching floatplane or other recon a/c from hanger decks with recovery later by cranes. basically the two deck model could work with lightly loaded planes by by 1940 a/c were already getting way too heavy for one short deck and another longer one. idk why all 2 deck carriers had one deck shorter tho.

I always wondered why I haven’t seen carriers having “two flight decks”. Dangerous probably, but can be used in an emergency.

@neurofiedyamato8763

Жыл бұрын

They did exist. The Japanese Akagi and Kaga originally had multiple flight decks

@davidjames4915

Жыл бұрын

The Royal Navy Courageous-class battlecruiser-to-aircraft carrier conversions featured two flight decks, but the lower flight deck was abandoned due to the longer take-off distances of 1930s aircraft. It seems that WWII-era carriers and carrier frontline aircraft existed in this sort of zone of not using catapults like post-war carrier aircraft would all the while the spotter aircraft of the era did use them. My guess is that catapult turnaround time was too long but one supposes that had something like the post-war catapult improvements been available in the 1930s then the second flight (or rather fly-off) deck might have been much more used, at least until jet aircraft made the entire concept completely obsolete.

You can see a launch in the movie "A Wing and a Prayer". 1944 You have the wrong picture for The Yorktown CV-10. It's really CV-5 the Yorktown, sunk at the Battle of Midway, the lead ship of the Yorktown class.

Interesting I never knew this

I have seen this footage used before and wondered what was going on. Now we know! 🙂

There is an old war movie that showed a hanger launch. They showed it with the camera in the hanger. It was a quick scene and easily missed.

I wonder if because it had a shorter stroke if it damaged aircraft when launching them, since they had to get up to speed in a much shorter run, and had no wind over deck to help them, the forces on them would be much higher than in normal carrier launches.

Great video, I never heard of this and I am 57 years old and have a minor in History

Insane , never knew!

@HistoryX

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching! Glad you liked it.

Thanks didn't know

Could this have been the inspiration for Battlestar Galactica’s side launched viper tubes ?

I seem to remember a WWII carrier fighter game on the apple iic that allowed hangar bay launching

A double-decker arrangement would make even more sense if the operation was longitudinal, rather than athwartships. Launch from the lower deck, and recover from the upper. That puts the weight of the catapults down low, still gets most of the headwind, makes a shorter trip from parked to launch, and leaves the upper deck clear for recovery and the usual excitements. Any idea why it was never tried? (Admittedly, the noise would have been appalling.)