Geez. If only there was a KZread channel that gave us everything we ever wanted to know about e-drums. Oh, wait!

Justin, speaking of “conversions”, How about a Future Video Topic on Zildjian & DW and the utility (or not!) of their hybrid kits? Another channel did a vid on the conversion time of the DW kit and it was about 45 minutes. I DON’T see a customer for this.

HOW DO YOU NOT HAVE 1000000 SUBS YET. LOVE FROM THE UK

I honestly think there's more of a market for it now then there used to be. Full sized e-kits are definitely the rage now and I think a simple conversion system for a full acoustic kit would be a good idea. Though making silicone or mesh pads that go over drums is probably the easy part, making a companion module takes a lot more R&D and money which is what kills the concept.

@BFedie518

14 күн бұрын

A company could potentially do what EDrumcenter does with ATV kits and sell bundles with third-party modules.

@jerusalemiseternal

13 күн бұрын

Yep, the R&D module $$$ are prohibitive. I bought one of the very first Alesis D4's into Australia in 1991, and it was rumored they spent over $100,000 on just studio recording for samples. That's like 220 grand today. BTW the D4 still has some great kicks and snares which would be happy in many mixes, well worth investigating for library import. I think the trick is let Yamaha, Roland, Alesis, Fnote 2Box ATV etc do what they do be$t, and design multi-compatibility ekits with the understanding you'll have already bought (and mastered?) your module. This market is an outrageously tough gig - Kickstation (my company) has spent over $130K on a seriously re-thought hybrid, sound results were immense, right before the charlie vector 19 hit, and supply chain for core Italian components fell apart. We are still working, slow progress but funding, or lack of, makes it S L O W....

Justin…I like your honest to the point on your eDrum reviews! Bravo! Thanks for the excellent video!

i find this product category very interesting. a lot of drummers already have an acoustic kit. to be able to easily convert it to electronic is appealing to me. i don't think it needs to be a full turnkey solution (pads/module/cymbals) - i'd be tempted to buy this style of drum pads if i knew they triggered well, played well, worked with a variety of modules, and were reasonably priced. i would like the flexibility to pick out a module or midi interface (ie. edrumin10) and cymbals separately. i think yamaha should take a stab at this with their tcs technology. the snare would feel more snare like than rubber and maybe would have positional sensing. the toms would feel more tom-like and hopefully be 2 zone

@kbarb3071

14 күн бұрын

Maybe the target market is the same drummers that would buy an edrumin midi interface

@josephpezza1027

14 күн бұрын

Absolutely Yamaha should do this with tcs. I've thought this for years. I think they would crush the e drum market. I bet no larger company doesn't want it take away from the sales of their already established drum sets.

@NeCtRiCkS

14 күн бұрын

​@@josephpezza1027the only problem with Yamaha is marketing; they're fantastic though. The fact most people get any Roland over Yamaha (especially sub-TD50 models), still blows my mind.

@laptoples

13 күн бұрын

Totally !!!!! This would be easy as pie for Yamaha !!!! I love their TCS pads !!!! Just have it flop over all the drums and come up with easy cymbals and bam !!!!! Any Yamaha module would work with it too ! They can market it more or less money based on the module.

“We’re not sponsored, we’re sponsored!!!!”

make a mesh head clip-on system like the RTOMS, with clip-on rubber covers for the cymbals. Make them light and easy to install, and give them positional sensing. Charge under $1000 for the whole set.

yess!!! my boys uploaded again

Hahahaha I spent 6 weeks in the US March/April 1995, trying to secure second stage funding for the Reprecussion brand of this exact product. The main conversion pad was called the Acoustik, and a multi-zone (6) snare conversion, funnily called the Multipad (!). The patents were applied for in Australia in 1994, so many of these "new" products come from lapsed patent searches from Repercussion, and certainly others. I had a VHS video go "missing" in transit, 8 months later something remarkably similar surfaces. Such is the life of inadequately funded entrepreneurs!! I still have the Multipad prototype to this day. Not bitter, I did have a lot of fun, but I think we made a risk assessment mistake - I agree, this was/is an "in-between" category - essentially e-drum practice. Cheers.

@codersexpo1580

13 күн бұрын

wow very interesting! I sure do wish you better success in the future.

@jerusalemiseternal

13 күн бұрын

I'll try post a pic of the proto, if me technotrog understandum picum postum 😂 Ill try, cheers

Great overview as always. I would love to see Efnote rule in this space. It would be a good next step for them in product development because they already focus on acoustic kits in their modules. I own an Efnote 7 which is an amazing kit. And I do think that if you are using it solely as an electric kit, the current Efnote products are and would be probably better. But if you could plug and play with any Efnote module and cymbals on a set-up like this, I think they'd expand their market substantially.

The Aquarian OnHeads use FSR, which triggers perfectly. The connectors etc were too flimsy tho.

I wasnt looking at the screen and had to check if the moongel wasnt a joke

Modern Drummer had an ad for drum mute and trigger genius but a top drum company bought the patent and killed it

I agree that the TD-17 kits are always lurking there. You sell any conversion kit or pad set or anything like that and as soon as it starts creeping up in price it's like for a little more instead of messing with my acoustic kit I can just set up an ekit at home and it'll be a smaller footprint and ready to play all the time.

Justin, What would be cool - is a company that could make universal acoustical drum rims that could take the current manufactures (Roland etc, (pads) , that would fit over the acoustical set. It would be just a hardware company. - Just a thought- Love the vids-

I had a Yamaha set a few years ago, all the triggers were rubber but they worked well. I got rid of it for a few reasons, 1. no rim shot, 2. the module had a bad battery after 2-3 years and to replace it you had to take apart the entire module. That left me with just the default kits unless I wanted to leave it on all the time or set up the user kits each time I wanted to play. Still, the triggers were better than the ones I have now which was one of the cheaper set on Amazon. You really have to whack the cymbals to get them to work, the kick pedal misses a lot. If you do get a lower priced e-drum kit make sure it has a beater kick pedal hitting a pad trigger.

Awesome stuff, I actually love this little concept. If these pads were wireless they would be super convenient for practicing rudiments etc in a more fun manner. Or build your own little edrum kit out of old cheap acoustic shells. They seem like a convenience to have but without the actual convenience some how lol. Being able to quick swap these to switch between acoustic and electronic would be great, but it doesn't really provide a solution for cymbals. So it's easier to just stick with a more permanent style of a setup.

Since they’ve just entered the edrum world, zildjian could take a crack at it. Maybe with their reflex practice pad material in mind as a surface

Is that Joey Jordison @6:13? Anyway, wonderful vid Justin AS ALWAYS. Love the history lesson. I'm really excited about the future of electronic drumming. I have set up my own A to E set and always looking for upgrades!

Your comment about finding middle ground with the module was one of the reasons I ended up going with a Crimson 2 SE kit a few years ago. I use EZD3 anyway, so all i needed for the module was MIDI output & standard mapping(although there is the notorious hi hat note mapping issue, but easy enough to workaround), and the kit itself has decent enough triggering, nice feeling mesh, etc. Wish i could get confirmation from Jobeky about whether their LV metal hats work with the Crimson 2 module, but that's another story lol edit: Just adding to this, I made my initial leap into edrums from acoustic kits with the purchase of that Crimson 2 kit, and had been mulling whether to just cobble together one of these trigger/pad setups, convert my acoustic kit shells entirely, or just buy a full edrum kit. I ended up going with a hybrid of the last two, and converted my kick,snare and floor tom with Jobeky triggers and mesh heads(and then remapped the stock snare to be an additional tom). I'm maxed out on aux inputs at this point(kick, snare, 4 toms, hats, 2 crash & 1 ride), but I'm pretty happy with what i ended up with(and for

Great subject!! I would absolutely purchase a good electronic mute set that would be compactable with my drum module (running superior drummer)

Wow, the floor tom on that module sounds like someone hitting a huge sheet of plastic or an untuned head.

NFUZD was a really good system. I played it for a few years. Yes, the pads were rubber, but they were very comfortable to play on. There were definitely some things that could've been improved upon with a version 2 but unfortunately it just didn't take off. I've played many ekits over the years and NFUZD was one of my favorites.

GREAT video! I remember my unhealthy obsession with Nfuzd. Oh and I'm still your adopted cousin dammit! 😂

@65Drums

13 күн бұрын

Hey Derek sorry about that! I forget to upload the new Patreon PNG with your name in the video even though I had typed it out. You'll be in the next one for sure

@_xPaPaDx

13 күн бұрын

@@65Drums Not a worry, I actually got a giggle out of it. I can't complain my name's still there. Thanks again for the wealth of knowledge and research you share with all of us! hope all is well, Sir! Blessings!@

Hooplug has potential if someone wanted to do the work. Not really designed for electronics but you could easily mount a mesh head and trigger and connect them to your favorite module or VST.

Maybe an untapped market for those big 14" white pads would be as an inexpensive upgrade to a black rubber snare on an entry level kit.

Now if I was in Tennessee and I owned a store that specialised in only electronic drums and I sold cymbals separately and I sold modules separately.. I would design our own in-house brand of pads with triggers to go onto acoustic drum kits & sell it as a package.. I also might do this if I had a business called drum Tec in Europe that sold in-house ekits & big brand modules & cymbals.. that's who should be doing this, the people who already have the modules and cymbals supplied from the big brands

This is such a great topic and one I admittedly think about too often haha. I think the real question is, why do Vdrum style kits continue to dominate the market even when cool mute pad technologies cycle in every couple years? It’s because no one has produced a single cohesive system that matches the playability, practicality, and quality of those systems. The video touches on this point, the mute systems are always cool in theory, but never deliver. Mesh head playing surfaces are the preferred style of edrum hands down. Zildjian L80 style electronic cymbals are the future and I believe will quickly overtake rubber pads. So what’s missing? A hyper realistic module/software system that brings these components together that sounds as good as it feels. To me, the ultimate solution would be a Black Hole, L80, Sensory Percussion style sensor in one package. Unfortunately, Sensory Percussion has essentially refused to put in any real effort into marketing their sensors as an edrum solution, so I think we’re still years away from that. Hopefully their partnership with Evans will start steering them in that direction.

@kbarb3071

12 күн бұрын

yeah - i don't get the newer evans/sensory percussion product. it seems like the trigger tech is a step forward from piezos which is super exciting/intriguing...but all i see in the reviews and videos are people playing the marimba and other weird sounds on their drum kit. don't get it...90+% of drummers want to play drum sounds on their drum set. i also really hope they steer towards their product being used as an edrum solution instead of an odd percussion/synth solution.

Further development of the Black Holes, and the L80s (= Alchem-E ?), is the way to go, I think … I always liked the Black Holes, except the price …

Behringer Syncussion SY-1 is out now, for 199 USD .. 5=pin MIDI DIN and MIDI USB. that's the desk top version, no idea what the deal is with the Eurorack version yet. ( modular grid says the 80HP module is available, but I can't find it anywhere else )

I almost got the NFUZD system when they were on clearance, but nah. That was back in the day when I was first evaluating edrums. Ended up just getting a used Roland kit for $150.

Just to throw in my 2 cents. In my opinion, I think RTom could maybe make it happen. I have their system with the triggers and I use it with the EAD10. It is actually nice. If they could figure out dual zone trigger for the snare head and a way to trigger low volume cymbals (i know that is a huge ask) then figure out an affordable module, I think it could work. Lots of people like myself, live in an area where noise control is important and this could be a game changer. Maybe they wouldnt even have to figure out the module, just the low volume cymbal triggers to work with a 2nd hand module like the TD-17 for example.

Have you ever done a review of the Roland TM-6 pro? I remember you doing a comparison between it and the TD 17 but you did not dig into what you can accomplish with the TM and some Roland triggers on Acoustic heads. I generally by things based on your opinions. Thanks

I think the one thing that is truly missing from the market right now is a triggering system for low volume l80 style cymbals. Just an affordable set of triggers that can work with any low volume cymbal and any module. They'd sell by the shedload.

@65Drums

6 күн бұрын

GoEdrum already sells those, and nobody buys them

@bigfatpaul1759

6 күн бұрын

@65Drums I was just looking at those again yesterday. You'd still have to install the membranes and all that, which looks a bit fiddly. Plus, I'm not sure how many people are aware of them. I'm in Vietnam, and Goedrum now has shipping restrictions in place for this region. A straight-up plug and play trigger that requires no install, and that can be stocked in a physical music store definitely has potential. Shipping from Taiwan and drilling holes in low volume cymbals goes against goedrum right now.

I can see it now as something more people would want. Especially if you don't have room for 2 drum sets. I'm surprised the sounds are crummy though...lol I mean, I bought that Lekato mini set, and THAT module is actually pretty decent, ESPECIALLY, for what it is....lol There's not really any machine gunning, and most of the sounds are good. I'm surprised any company would come out with anything less then the Alesis nitro module. That's actually fine for practice !!! The TD6 is still really good too, so I'd get those pads, and just get a cheap Roland, Yamaha or newer Alesis module and you'll probably be pretty happy. It's better then it being late at night, or you don't want to disturb the neighborhood and you can't play at all....lol Plus I personally love all the crazy sounds other then drums, so I like edrums for that, so I'd probably always have the pads on for that reason. Some company should release a decent answer to covering acoustic drums with mesh pads on top... I bet it'd fly now more then ever !!! Thanks for the video Justin !!! Have a great day !!! :-)

I’d pay $750 for a system that does kick, snare, 2 toms, hi hat, ride and 2 crashes to midi, reasonably quietly and with reasonable velocity sensitivity.

Awesome I didn’t know that this existed lol

I'm waiting for when the electronic drum world starts coming out with a cymbal manufacturer company compatible with the top electronic drum companies and or possibly with their own modules, how come we haven't seen that yet? Lol 🙏🤘❤️

I never understood modules. Why does every e-kit need to be sold with a module? That's like buying drums with the cheap cymbals pack included. Yuck

@ericstearns170

14 күн бұрын

Back when Alesis was new on the block they made modules, not kits. The D4 was the standard drum module for nearly everyone and Roland and Yamaha hated it because everyone used peizo triggers so you could get away with it. Once proprietary digital became a thing this idea is just a pipe dream. If someone had came out with an affordable system in the 80s or 90s, we might not be discussing e-drums but e-add-ons.

@65Drums

14 күн бұрын

Because every time a company doesn't include a module, the drums don't sell many units. Most people need and want a module. While the nerds, like me, could go without a module entirely and use VST software. But we aren't the majority, we're just loud on the internet.

@codersexpo1580

13 күн бұрын

@@65Drums Yes but if the industry would acknowledge that professional "nerds" like us are going to do that, then there should be an option for that factored in. Like Roland TD 27 roping us into having to use their cable snake (OEM Harness)....OMG. Why?? This is very interesting ...to me. kzread.info/dash/bejne/iIOT2cute8vRZtY.html

@fallenshallrise

7 күн бұрын

I'm with you. Most modules have less processing power than a base level iPad Air. Same goes for all the racks and hardware. Like if I only play eDrums for the rest of my life the black racks and janky cymbal arms will keep stacking up because I already have great hardware that is actually solid. But the companies must know something we don't because it seems like 99% of eDrum customers have never played drums in their life or have just come back from backpacking around the world and own nothing.

I don´t se the point in "converting" the complete kit. If I needed to have something that´s ment to be temporary I would most likely just want to have a snare, bass, hh, ride -pads. Then connect them to my Multi-12. That would go a long way for late night practice and expansion/quick change on a hybrid kit. Alternatively you could have small trigger module with no screen with an usb connector to computer or mobile devices. For DW/Roland that would be an "easy" thing to do, or maybe even go wireless. Rtom is the closest thing do something that would be useful to me right now.

I have the black holes and the black hole triggers, but I’m afraid those triggers aren’t very good at least to me, I have seen demos with drummers using them, and getting good results but I unfortunately could never get them to trigger properly.

I prefer the rebound off rubber (practice pad) compared to mesh.

@jerusalemiseternal

13 күн бұрын

40 durometer natural rubber is quite good, certainly no harder or it feels...'fake'.

Would love a better version of the black hole concept.

@kbarb3071

14 күн бұрын

Agreed I actually have a set of black holes. I love the concept of the newer triggers but I wish they were 2 zone and I just feel apprehensive about their quality and durability

I'm watching videos about it, and I'm torn between acoustic and electronic at that price point. The problem is triggers working with a module without much tweaking. This seems to be plug and play?

@djashjones

12 күн бұрын

You only go electronic if you can't have acoustic. Nothing is plug n play with electronic. We all hit differently.

@jamescotton9269

12 күн бұрын

Yamaha EAD works with yamaha triggers and roland TM-6 works with pads and Roland triggers because it is not a TD 17. Td 27 and td 50 work with Roland pads. Have you tried the TM-6?