The miter joint for the strength and simplicity is the clear winner for me.

I really appreciate how non-sketchy the setup you devised here is. I've watched a lot of these videos and most of them have an embarrassing test methodology.

Wow, I would have guessed the miter would be about the same as a normal butt joint, but since it avoids end grain on both pieces it makes a bit of sense why it's stronger...just didnt realize it would be that different I also appreciate the heavy influence from PF, the dude is a legend

@GGg-ug3jr

Жыл бұрын

It also increases the surface area that is glued. But yeah I would not have guessed that is the strongest.

@mdemel06

Жыл бұрын

I’ve seen tests like this before and I thought the dovetail or biscuit joint would have prevailed. But no it was miter Bc more surface area across the end grain.

project farm says, hooooooo yeahhhhhhhhhh very impressive

@gregmize01

Жыл бұрын

"We're gonna test that!"

Great work! Project farm would be proud

I’d of expected a Canadian to debate which intimate moose encounter was best. But to each his own.

That was super cool. I was hoping to see if you'd do a non-glued dovetail joint. I read about how non-glued dovetails CAN be stronger than glued ones because the tails actually slide and compress when they're stressed and they get squeezed by the pins allowing for a more mechanical joint. But nobody does unglued dovetails anymore, so who cares? Great vid!

@gregmize01

Жыл бұрын

And he have to borrow anything from his neighbors

@DIYBuilds

Жыл бұрын

Honestly it's amazing that I even showed dovetails or box joints because I never use them in my Builds. But that is an interesting concept.

The miter joint was the biggest surprise . I wonder if that spline joint would be just as strong if poplar was used to make the spline ? I need to build that 45 degree jig for cutting the grove for the spline joint.

What impress me the most is The " over night drying time " in total i count 31 night That is one full freaking month ... Lol ! Good job !

Hey dude …thanks a million for your pocket hole machine…i built it when your video first aired, probably 5 or 6 years ago…I sent you pics of it when you wanted viewers to show their builds. I’ve built so many kitchens , closets, and fixtures using that thing. I owe you big time🤙

Love the ProjectFarm sounds. Both the miter and spline were joints on a 45 degree angle, and with this test, it put all of the force on the glue instead of the wood. I wonder how different the results would be if the jig was changed. Really great video.

Saw this test on another channel and was shocked at strength of splined mitre joint. You’ve confirmed it is far superior to other joints. I’m assuming that the long grain of the spline helps strengthen it. Awesome video and would love to see more. Keep up the great work.

This is one of the best videos I've watched ever, period

@DIYBuilds

Жыл бұрын

Thank you.

Splined miter for the win! Probably my favorite as well honestly

Two words about this video: Very Impressive!

I love how direct this video was. Tbh this might be my favorite video ever

Realistically just use the miter joint. No need to waste your time adding the spline (unless you just want the aesthetic) as it only added about 60 more pounds of strength to the joint. It’s clear miter joint alone stands on top according to this test. 👍

@IzzyIkigai

7 ай бұрын

It added *more* than 60 pounds. Video said the scale was maxed out and given how drastic the difference was for plywood we can only assume the difference for the pine would have been just as mindblowing.

Wasn't expecting PF Todd to make an appearance here, ha ha! Great video, quite an eye opener.

Holy cow that's completely unexpected!

Very impressive!

The PF cameo cracked me up! Got your WASP tickets yet?

Love that hat tip to project farm...

Nice job. Clearly it was a lot of work, but it was time well spent.

Great video! My brain is full.

Thank you!

The miter joint really surprised me

Great, informative video… I never would’ve guessed that a simple miter joint would fare so well. Learn something new every day!

Thank you. I was really hoping to see my favorite. A Lock Miter? I think I will try a lock miter with splines.

The miter joint utilizes 100% of the glue. It diverts the force and spreads it out to every single surface area that the wood glue touches. It basically forces the wood to utilize itself to failure.

I was somewhat expecting box joint to win over the spline joint.....And I really wasn't expecting the plain old miter joint to do so well.......Nice test, thanks.

This is a modernized, more accurate, seriously measurable examination and testing of "joint" integrity.....as I recall, a very nice update of a previous demonstration. There is a lot of good education for all of us....many thanks....eh?

Great job mate. Now I want to see the tests done by pulling apart the joints, really see who is the winner.

That was "Very Impressive" testing! Love Project Farm's YT channel. Other than how strong the spline joints are, I also love the way that they look. Nice work & thanks for putting in all of that time to do this testing! 👍👍👏👏

Great test! Thanks for the hard work

Excellent!

It appears that maximum glue surface area and minimum modification of the end of the board is the rough rule of thumb to follow... Frankly, it's just amazing how strong wood glue is!

I was thinking about how the use of only one fixed angle, 45 degrees, to apply force would skew the results. This is why the miter and spline joints scored high, it removes the mechanical component of the strength, and instead relies on the holding power of the glue over the a large surface area. Other biases with nonsymetrical joints are not shown due to the chosen angle. Still, I am impressed by the strength and simplicity of the miter, and the low damage on failure. I’m going to experiment with them. However I am not sure how it would perform vs a dovetail or finger joint in a twisting test. I would love to see this experiment expanded to different thickness’ of material, test different angles, shock or drop test, and apply twisting forces.

Very impressive

a fellow colleague of you (Bourbon Moth Woodworking) made a similar test and came out with comparable results. Miter joints are surprisingly strong.

great video. so it seems the miter is the best joint considering effort to produce/lb. which is exactly what I was looking for. thank you!

Fellow Canuck here. Just found your channel and subscribed. Watching your record stand build, I was wondering if anyone uses rabbit joints anymore. I started woodworking in the 80’s at a cabinet shop where everything was built with a rabbit or dado. The setup is so quick but the pay off comes at assembly. Everything is self aligning and a quick 18 gu. staple is the clamp. I don’t think we ever used a clamp. I don’t mind pocket screws where they’re not seen or shop furniture,or knock down applications,but I find all that drilling and driving and clamping tedious. I was curious about strength and behold: I found your joints test video. Well done....and an homage to Project Farm. P.S. thanks for not using a Festool domino. The day I have to spend thousands of dollars on a hand tool is the day I’ll give up woodworking. Someday that patten will expire and we can pay a reasonable FAIR price for that tool.

Awesome job with the testing setup and selecting a comprehensive list of commonly used joinery. Very impressive!

Boy, this is an eye opener! Excellent job!

Very impressive 😁👍

Just came here from you first video-terrific job on this one! You’ve really grown as a woodworker and your testing and video making skills are better as well. Great to see- and these results are super interesting and helpful.

Here's a comment for the algorithm boost!

Really nice work

Excellent! Appreciate the effort. Your test rig looks simple, reliable, and repeatable. Good work.

The spline trumps for sure, on each type of material. Also looks pleasing if you changed the spline for a darker hardwood. Great video.

Great video! The miter joint is so simple but so strong.

Leo Fender made all of his guitar/amp cabs out of pine using finger joints. No wonder there's still so many around today. 🎸🎸🎸🎸

Good comparisons thank you.

Great video, very useful. I've seen lots of these competitions, but this was the best and most comprehensive. Thanks for your continued contribution to the DIY community.

Thank you so much for your work! very interesting results.

Great job with testing, though I suspect that if you used more dowels for that particular joint, it would have done a lot better, similar to the loose tenon. When I make joints with dowels, I generally use as many as will fit. In the test you did, it looks like 4 would have fit easily. Thanks for posting!

Good video. Very thorough and surprising.

Thanks for all of your hard, careful work on this. CNC for the win!

Brilliant. Thank you for the time you spent. I can't believe the miter joints does so well - especially because that is the joint I want to use on boxes. Simple.

That was awesome Brad! Had no idea the 45deg joint would do as well as it did. Thanks for putting all these tests together 😀👍

@DIYBuilds

Жыл бұрын

Thanks pete

Very, very interesting. Love the videos, thank you.

I think the spline joint was the strongest because of the hardwood. If you used softwood splines to "equalize" with the softwood bisquits, dovetails and finger joints I reckon that the the finger joints would have come out on top.

@DIYBuilds

Жыл бұрын

I don't think so as the miter alone was very strong. Running any type of wood with perpendicular grain would help in my opinion.

Great test procedure.

Very informative. Thanks for putting this together

Great video, appreciate all the joint types plus the plywood. Would love to see MDF added.

@DIYBuilds

Жыл бұрын

I used mdf in an older testing video

Amazing job, lots of work and thought went into this experiment and you can tell. Thanks for going through the trouble.

Very cool video.

Fascinating! That was really cool! As a Kreg user, I would be interested to see how pocket hole screws compare with out the use of any glue. Also makes me wonder what that standard 45 would do with screws added. Fun stuff!

Interesting stuff, thanks.

Bline? In that like neufy for blind? Teehee Great comparison, thanks for sharing. Cheers

It would be good to see a miter joint with through dowels (perpendicular across the miter joint). I guess it would be similar to the spline joint.

@ImaginethenMake

4 ай бұрын

I agree. I can see adding through dowels easier to do for me since I do not own a table saw.

I'm just starting to make a "T-handled" walking cane from some hardwood hoe-handles they sell here (Thailand). The problem is I won't have much surface area to glue, only about a 1" X 1.5" D-shaped section. Also no tools to cut fancy joints, so I'll likely go with a simple mitre joint. I just saw on a different vid that mitre joints aren't that strong, but yours seemed to do well. Great vid.

Lucy....You got some splining to do.... :D

Would you be able to test laminated post/beam? 3 layers of 2x6 creating 6x6 post/beam. DIY beams and post are used as decorative elements or in landscaping projects. Glues and nails require special attention for outdoor use. Nails rust and accelerate rot, glues may fail with moisture, waterproof glues are expensive. Therefore wood-only dowel based laminate could be a potential winner for DIY garden projects! 1) just glue 2) just nails 3) just nail but driven at the angle 30-45 degrees 4) just dowels - dowels made of same wood as 6x2 or hardwood dowel - hardwood could be treated as a separate test. 5) just dowels but driven at the angle 30-45 degrees 6) nails with glue 7) angled nails with glue 8) dowels with glue 9) angled dowels with glue 10) as an extra, purely decorative aspect, you could use your CNC to create butterfly/bow-tie inserts for a lateral aspect of the laminated timber - this would be mainly aesthetic but could add a bit of strength. Trick with dowels is to dry them before use and drive them into the project while they have lowered moisture content. Few minutes in the oven should do the trick. Once dry, dowels are inserted into laminate, they absorb moisture and swell, locking themself within the laminate. Ideally you would have all timber dried and assembled dry, then allowed to absorb ambient moisture and swell to natural (air dried) dimensions - but this is quite advance and unlikely to be undertaken by average DIY hobbyist. Thanks ;)

A 90 deg mitre joint has about 50% more surface area for glue-up so it makes sense if it was at least 30% stronger. A butt joint has approx 2/3's the surface area of a 90deg mitre if you work it out backwards though so, who knows.

awesome video, not sure if you did it behind the scene but i would like to have seen at least 3 of each type tested to help iron our manufacturing or process flaws and perhaps you could do another video on sheer strength as I would like to see that too

I love these types of videos, totally thought the glue and screw would do way better than it did.

Mitres and splines rate high in all tests, good work

Fantastic testing, dude!!! 😃 Really interesting results indeed! Specially the miters!!! Anyway, stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊

Good video, like the comparison (y)

Miter with dowels has always been my favorite joint. I like the look and it's proven strong

Fantastic video, Todd! 😂

Always appreciate testing results! Some might be surprised by the spline or miter, and good to know. Would be interesting to do a test based on wood moisture contents since moisture can have a huge affect curing and bonding (ex: for Titebond water based glues). Like your tee-shirt LOL, Thanks!

well paced video. thanks for the good information.

Fascinating….. Ijust for fun I would have liked to see 1/4” dowels also… wonder if they differ from 3/8 since you could fit more? Hmmm. Great results on the box joints!

Hi, I liked it. Don't judge the joints to quick. I am curious how the joints break, if you tear boards apart by stretching, not by squeezing like here. And to have a full picture we would have to also tear them apart by rotating one of the boards in a plane perpendicular to the other - just as if you tested the leg of a table by pushing the table.

Thanks for doing this one again. The previous version was good but this one had a few more joints and I think this method of testing might be a little more accurate than the previous one. I always wondered if in the previous one, the screw penetrating the material may have led to some inaccuracies, and based on the values you got this time, it looks like it may have. Also, the use of "does a very average job of..." is hilarious.

Very nice, going to likely be building a lot or drawers and want to make them strong since they may be up to 6 feet long. In the process of working on a house and upstairs has the dreaded 45" slope ceilings on the sides with the "storage" behind another wall. I figure if I make big drawers for part of it I can use it for blankets and clothing that isn't often worn in the bedroom. The stronger the drawers are the better. And thanks a ton for the plans available on your site. I know everyone is out to make a few bucks but so many people want to profit on top of profit and for people who don't have a huge budget it is very frustrating. Right now I am putting insulation in the house which was built around 1911 and outside of a few little things was barely upgraded, like have to replace knob and tube wiring because the previous owner rented the place out and was too lazy. Anyway to insulate I am furring out the 2X4 studs and with 2X4's running 4.25 locally and 2X2's running 3.98 I bought a table saw so I can rip my own by cutting some 2X4's in half. Honestly the exact size doesn't matter too much as long as they are about the same. It's a pain because the cheap table saw has a crap fence among other things but I gotta start somewhere and I am saving 1.86 per piece cut so I only have to cut about 25 more to pay for the table saw. That is a huge deal when the budget is 500 or less per month.

Speechless!

This is really great testing, thanks for doing this. Wonder if you could stress test these joints by dropping heavy weights on them until they break either with the most weight, or most repeated blows.

Sir your testing set up is very clever. One more joint i would like to suggest is lock mite joint. I think it would go around 500

My precious 2" screws under-performed. Maybe it's time to pay for better screws: the engineered screws over plain drywall screws. Either that or glue miter + spline FTW. The box joint should have done better. It's not clear what failed. Was the glue fully cured?

Very cool! Same conclusion as bourbon moth. I'll be using more miter joints!

Interesting, it would be great to test the joints on a solid and dense wood like oak. Probably the miter joint would perform less well relatively..

Great video and very informative. Just out of curiosity, have your tested the dovetail spline miter joint vs. the regular miter spline joint? With more meat in the dovetail joint vs regular spline, I would think it would do even better. I'd like to know if you want to try that joint. Thanks for the info found your video very informative. :)

I’m curious about pine spline with through dowel perpendicular to the splines I.e. parallel to the face of the 2 boards.

I think the miter joint performance is due to the way the pressure is being applied. I bet if the pressure were applied outward against the legs, we would see a very premature failure. Part of the pressure being applied is actually pushing the joint together.

@DIYBuilds

Жыл бұрын

I have another video like this testing in a different method if you are curious.

So what other metrics could you use to measure these joints. I'd imagine the dove tails do well where there is repeated cycling of the joint putting it under a load and backing it back of. I'm thinking of the kids rocking on the dining room chairs.

Dude, great test ... but 4:10 and 4:20 are different joints! In the first one, the compression force tries to yank the dowels out; in the second one, the compression force tries to snap the dowels! Other than this, great to watch - very useful!

this video doesn't take into account forces from different angles. I'm sure some of the weaker joint perform well if the pressure is applied laterally. The Miter clearly performs better because the joint is perpendicular to the applied force.

would moving the biscuit and dowels and tenons towards the inside improve anything? based on the destruction would you optimize any of the joints tested? I am curious about the through dowel if you glued the butt joint first. id love to see if there is or isn't an advantage of using nails or ringshank or nailgun or brad nails or staples beyond holding things enough for glue.

@jimysk8er

6 ай бұрын

nevermind, I guess you did the nails and screws stuff but the first part would be nice to know.