This is our great task, to contribute to the New Evangelization!

@Erik James in re 1 of 12: When you put your face to close to a book, your eyes can't focus to read and get the message of the words. When you are plopped down into the middle of a forrest and can only see the leaves, you miss the forrest for the trees. Dr. Hahn is very clear: Countries whose populations by and large historically professed the Catholic Faith (e. g. France (from the time of Charlemagne until the French Revolution), Spain, England, in fact most if not all of western Europe

Reply 1. Hahn speaks of two distinctive categories: Primary and Secondary Evangelization. The latter being the New Evangelization which focuses on "re-evangelizing the de-Christianized". Dr. Hahn said the push started around 1993 but failed to mention a key event..in October of 1992, the RCC Catechism, second edition was promulgated. This I believe is very important because it cements the updated views of the Catholic faith. (Continued replies in sequence, ie Reply 2, Reply 3, etc).

@ EJ in re 6/12: in their heart of hearts, in their conscience, that prevents them from being open to what is being presented - either because it cuts across the grain of everything they believe in, or they consequences and pain it would cause prevent them from willingly embracing it (rejection by family, friends, having to start a new and unknown life, etc). They are therefore NOT to be held accountable for what they don't "know" or believe but what they DO know and believe. That is the whole

I agree with him....

I have heard that St. Thomas chose India for his apostolate. There is a miracle attached to his work there.

My only fear is and this is from experience doing the discipleship discussions in our diocese. It's sounding more and more evangelical. Now how did Christ spread Christianity throughout the globe? I would argue with very Catholic things the mass the Saints the Rosary. But that's not what we're talking about. We have to be very careful

Dear Dr. Hahn. The church must evangelize by teaching the faith. The church is not teaching that the priest is "In Persona Christi". The priestly vow is the same self sacrificial vow / covenant of Our Blessed Savior Lord Jesus Christ. Look at 1954 missal. The laity is to be taught that Every action every sacrifice every offering every joy etc. is to be joined to the offering in the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. Thank you.

@ EJ in re 9/12: "suspicions" that Catholics somehow teach, that the CCC teaches, that the Church teaches, and that Dr. Hahn teaches that Muslims believe that Jesus is God the same as we do is TOTALLY unfounded.

Reply 4. Mr. Barron from the "Word on Fire" video series also spoke about this recent push talking about evangelizing to those who had "divorced themselves from God". This push on the outside seems somewhat innocuous as a Christian denomination just trying to keep and/or obtain new members. This is until you realize the theology behind why they are focusing specifically on Non-Catholic Christians.

@ EJ in re 11/12: The difference is someone was brought up in the Faith in a culture steeped in the Gospel and then formally rejects it versus someone who lives in a culture which has never largely embraced Christianity and was raised in a faith which is totally foreign to it. People can't be held accountable if they are unaware of Christ's saving Person and Work, but those who ARE can be. What is the problem?

@ EJ in re 6/12: The whole thrust of this paragraph is to focus on what we DO hold in common: the belief in one God [He Who Is (Ex. 3:14)] Yahweh, Tanakh (what we Christians call the Old Testament), the patriarchs (the covenants with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob), the Decalogue, the priesthood, the prophets. NOT to focus on what we DON'T hold in common, and yet, as I said, this paragraph falls in the subsection of "The Church and NON-Christians". Duh.

The New Evangelization was an expression of a primary goal of Vatican II for the Church to be a light to the modern, gentile world. The communists in the Nowa Huta area near Kracow Poland built a steel mill town without a Church as an expression of their atheistic faith. Instead, it became a place where crosses proliferated and the New Evangelization for the 21st century and Third Millennium was launched.

@ EJ in re 9/12: Newsflash for you. Scott Hahn is a theologian and speaks for Scott Hahn. Scott Hahn is not a member of the Magisterium (a bishop with teaching authority in the Church) and therefore his theology is his theology and not the Church's. If a statement within the Catechism contradicts YOUR personal reading of a separate passage in the Catechism as well as plain statements in the Bible, then that is a SIGN to you have come to a MISTAKEN opinion. Newsflash: Scott Hahn does not

Awesome stuff as always Dr. Hahn. If I may however raise some concern, it is that the means used to drive forward the new evangelization is not long lasting. What I mean is the following. Take the World Youth day. As great as it maybe, it is a problematic event in that has many dangers built in to it. The church has given an excuse for young children to get away from their parents and go to a different land. Now one might say, our culture already does that anyway. (continued...)

I perfectly agree with you though I am not sure if they do get to do drugs or have sex. But I feel that children get conditioned to desire the religious HIGH of being in a group of peers etc. In a sense, the religion becomes valued due to the communal aspect. As soon as the HIGH wears off, they will just try to get the same from even a different faith. Biggest issue for me is children being kept apart from their parents and their supervision in another country. This normalizes it for parents.

Reply 9. I thought that I may have misunderstood these paragraphs, since they're contradicting statements within the catechism itself about this and it falls so far away from Scripture. However, a recent Lighthouse teaching by Scott Hahn called "God vs Islam" confirms my suspicions. If I am misinterpreting the catechism then many other within the RCC are as well... namely my father, being a devout Catholic, now believes this as well...as do most that I speak to.

@ EJ in re 10/12: Two totally different situations. The same would hold true for a Buddhist or a Hindu. If they were to knowingly reject the faith in which their culture is steeped, in which they were raised by their families and taught to them and did nothing but exist from day to day secularly then they also would have committed apostasy - a formal rejection of their faith. Why is that so hard to understand?

@ EJ in re 10/12: The point AGAIN of these paragraphs is the Church's current relations with NON-Christian religions (that is, what do we have in COMMON, not stressing what we DON'T). It takes those religions at face value, not judging them from a "Christian" point of view. In other words, what do they claim about themselves. They claim to be seeking union with God, just as Christians are. They do so through the teachings of their religions (whether it be the teachings of Buddha in the case

@ EJ in re 2/12: Why on earth would any Catholic, Orthodox, or Christian be opposed to the preaching of the Gospel either to those who have never heard the Gospel before, or to those who have but whose faith had grown lukewarm, cold, or died?

Reply 10. The catechism also talks briefly about other pantheistic religions such Buddhism and polytheistic religions such as Hinduism, saying that they all are on a path to God. However, what's interesting is when the book discusses non-catholic Christians, the tone changes.That those who knowingly separate themselves from the RCC are doomed.

The focus of the camera is on the books not on the speaker.

Puritans, Methodists, Baptists, Quakers, and Catholics have ALWAYS been here and by and large the message of the Gospel is known by all. If someone KNOWINGLY separates themselves from the Church having grown up in it and had the Faith taught to them, having been baptized into it, if they then REJECT it and KNOWINGLY separate themselves from what they previously regarded as the truth, then YES they have committed apostasy - the sin of formally rejecting the Faith and Christ's body the Church.

@ EJ in re 12/12: I believe that the replies of 1 - 11 don't need to be rehashed here as this is your conclusion. I will simply say your personal take on these issues is mistaken. The catholic Church is the one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church in which you were raised and from which you formally separated yourself. I am praying for you as I am sure your father does to come home.

@ EJ in re 5/12: in point of fact the subsection in which it falls in the Catechism of the Catholic Church (hereafter referred to as CCC), "The Church and non-Christians" it can't mean what you say it means. I believe the problem is that YOU introduce the category "in God's economy" and conflate that with "The Church". The two are not synonymous. God's economy includes ALL men, of ALL time (past, present and future) in ALL tribes, ALL nations, and ALL tongues. It pleased God that Jesus

@ EJ in re 6/12: of the apostle St. Paul in Romans 2. I realize this cuts across the grain of your exclusionary Protestant theology but it doesn't make it any less true.

Reply 11. I realize the problems within mainstream liberal Protestantism today. They have also fallen, but there are many conservative Christians that believe in Jesus, and keep true to His word. I find it amazing that so many are included into God's salvation but when concerning those conservative Christians that have divorced themselves not from God but from the RCC, Catholics believe they need saving over everyone else.

Reply 5. In the catechism, starting at paragraph 839, it discusses the status of certain non-Christians in God's economy. For instance, it says that even though Jews do not believe in Jesus as the savior, it implies that the Old Covenant is still valid because they believe in a Messiah, only that the next time He comes the Jews believe that it will be the first.

@ EJ in re 7/12: It is amazing that this needs to be said to a Bible Christian, but even Muslims are included in God's plan of salvation. At II Peter 3: 19 it says that God is "...not wishing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.", and at I Tim 2: 3, 4: "This is good and pleasing to God our savior, who wills everyone to be saved and to come to knowledge of the truth." Paragraph 841, again in the sub-section of the CCC dealing with NON-Christians is not equating the

@ EJ in re 10/12: of Buddhism, or the Upanishads in the case of Hinduism). This is NOT to equate Catholicism with either Buddhism or Hinduism. It is NOT an attempt to muddy the waters theologically. The Church's position is that to the extent that these people live up to the faith as they understand it, they are saved through the salvific redemption that Christ won on the cross and His Resurrection and Ascension into heaven. It is important to read a document promulgated by the Congregation

@ EJ in 3/12: not heard of the progress being made by say, Evangelicals and Catholics Together and ecumenism in general. NO ONE wants to water down theological differences but the west has become as decadent and depraved as ancient Rome. It's united we stand or divided we fall to the atheistic, secular regime.

Reply 2. This Catechism, along with the teachings from past priests, peers, along with the additional teachings from scholars such as Scott Hahn, Joe Corapi, Steve Ray and Peter Huff had led me away from the Catholic Church. One of the biggest reasons is because of the RCC's evangelization priorities that is being called the "New Evangelization".

and atheistic. The whole point of the "New Evangelization" is that the initial conversion that we all go through of repentance from sin, faith in Jesus Christ and baptism into His body, the Church is ONLY the beginning. There must be a lifelong ongoing conversion of our lives (repentance from sin), our faith (catechesis) and reception of the sacraments (the means of grace - e.g. the sacraments of Reconciliation & the Eucharist).

Reply 7. The book goes further in discussing Muslims, in that they are also children of God and worship the same as Christians, therefore, "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the creator" (841). I have studied Islamic culture and religion, I'm required to within my job. I can't agree with this statement. The Quran and Hadith are diametrically opposed to our Bible.

the Q'uran nor the Hadith with the Bible. It is laying out what we hold in COMMON, not stressing what we don't. Namely: they "acknowledge the Creator", "PROFESS to hold the faith of Abraham"(they do profess to do this), & do hold to a MONOTHEISTIC faith ("and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."). Muslims do confess God as Creator, do profess (mistaken or otherwise) to hold to the faith of Abraham, and do worship God as merciful and judge.

Reply 3. What do I mean by the "RCC's evangelization priorites"? Dr. Hahn describes it clearly as trying to "re-evangelize" the de-christianized". Although, according to logical reasoning, based on RCC theology written in the Catechism, what Dr. Hahn truly means is to re-evangelize the de-catholicized (I made up a new word:) as well as to the non-Catholic Christian.

@tuliochristofoletti7809

3 жыл бұрын

It's true. But he is right. In the Catholic Church lies all the truthfullness of the faith. To call people to conversion its charity and the right thing to do to save this world.

@kb741103

2 жыл бұрын

@@tuliochristofoletti7809 sorry but I don’t believe that. I believe the RCC has fallen so far from its biblical orthodoxies that I have a hard time making the argument that it’s still a valid Christian church and not some cult. It’s views on soteriology are unbiblical and divergent from even its own historical interpretations

@tuliochristofoletti7809

2 жыл бұрын

@@kb741103 What a emphatic commentary. Would you tell me more about it? What bothers you so much about the RCC?

@kb741103

2 жыл бұрын

@@tuliochristofoletti7809 well, the comment you replied to is one... basically the modern theology of “near-world” universalism that has taken hold in the church.

@ EJ in re 6/12: It may make you feel good to believe that you alone possess insight into the mind of Christ, but paragraph 839 of the CCC is nothing more than the divinely inspired argument of St. Paul in the 11th Chapter of Romans vs. 1: "I ask, then, has God rejected his people? Of course not!" (cf. I Sam 12:22 & Ps 94:14). How about St. Paul at I Cor 2:8: "...and which none of the rulers of this age (including the Pharisees, the High Priests, the Sadducees and the Romans) knew; for if

@ EJ in re 5/12: Your characterization of paragraph 839 is certainly your own opinion but it is NOT the Catholic Churches. You yourself admit that paragraph 839 falls under the category of "The Church and NON-Christians". According to the New Oxford American Dictionary the prefix "non" means 'not of the kind or class described'. Therefore by virtue of the definition of the word "non" and the fact that the paragraph 839 falls within the sub-section which you yourself admitted because that is

Protestant missionaries didn't largely begin to evangelize the Asian continent until the 1800's. It is LUDICROUS to hold people accountable for a message they largely do not know, which has NEVER been widespread for them and NEVER adopted by the entire culture at large. However, the whole point of your last statement is that the West HAS by and large, as a culture, been predominantly "Christian" in the sense that, at least in the U. S. for the ENTIRETY of its existence Anglicans, Presbyterians

@ EJ in re 10/12: for the Doctrine of the Faith entitled "Dominus Iesus" - The Lord Jesus. To the extent that Buddhists or Hindus have not heard or simply cannot in good conscience accept a simple proclamation of the gospel, they may be saved by faithfully practicing their religion, HOWEVER, the salvation that redounds to them as they are obviously ignorant of the Gospel's message and cannot in good conscience accept it comes as a result of the salvific Incarnation, Life, Cross, Resurrection,

@ EJ in re 1 of 12: which used to be called Christendom, have by and large become thoroughgoingly secular and turned their back on the Catholic Faith. Whereas countries that formerly did not know and rejected the faith have become overwhelmingly Catholic (e. g. Brazil, Mexico, the United States). If you can't see that France after 200 years of Ecrasez l'infame; laicite; and equalite, fraternite, et egalite is now a 'mission territory' you are blind. Read Phillip Jenkins book "The Next

I was there until you mentioned world youth day. I was in Toronto in 2002 for World Youth Day, there was nothing godly about it, every day was like attending the Worldvision conference,, the only thing Catholic were confessions, which were gravely needed after several days of sharing the same large open sleeping quarters with both boys and girls together. But almost no one went to confession, I never saw a single lineup longer than 2. Then there was Mass, on a platform way up on a stage that reminded me of the Mia, and the Eucharist given to all, Catholic or not, in Grace or not, in the hand or not, pieces of Christ scattered on the ground. What a joke.

@ EJ in re 1 of 12: Christendom" which in meticulous detail lays out the massive explosion of conversions in the global southern hemisphere and the global eastern hemisphere (i. e. Africa and Asia). Hell the only reason why Christianity has remained relatively stable in the U. S. alone is that we have been inundated with Catholics and Christians from Mexico and Africa. For lack of a better way of describing it caucasian or anglo-Americans are by and large becoming thoroughly decadent, secular

The New Evangelism is the old. That the Holy Priest is In Persona Christi The Role of the Laity is to consecrate every action and every thought as joined to the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. To do this is the Little Way established by Our Blessed Mother and taught by St. Teresa the Little Flower A true priest takes a solemn vow of self sacrifice. This vow is very serious business. Abraham took his vow to God by sacrificing a beast and then splitting its carcass in two. Abraham then knelt down between the two halves and promised (vowed) to keep God's word and not sin. Tradition tells us that a solemn vow was taken between the beast torn in two because the person making the vow also asked that should he break his vow may his fate be as the beast. Lord Jesus Christ, who by His love, ended the bloody sacrificial lamb slaughter on passover and replaced the old covenant with His vow, the offering His life as the sacrifice, the new covenant in His Blood. Such a vow is the vow/covenant that can only be taken by the One Who Is Eternal Compassion and who sees you as His dearest relation. In this vow of the New Covenant established by sacrificing Himself The Blessed Lord simultaneously establishes the priesthood. He commands the disciples to 'do this' or 'do as I do' and each MUST take the same self sacrificial vow of Jesus. The apostles solemn vow of self sacrifice for the most part also ended in martyrdom. New evangelism is Jesus Christ Crucified and His priests in Persona Christi Instead of new evangelism just try to penetrate the meaning of the prayer of St. Francis of Assisi which itself is a priestly vow prayer: Lord, make me an instrument of Your peace; Where there is hatred, let me sow love; Where there is injury, pardon; Where there is error, truth; Where there is doubt, faith; Where there is despair, hope; Where there is darkness, light; And where there is sadness, joy. O Divine Master, Grant that I may not so much seek To be consoled as to console; To be understood as to understand; To be loved as to love. For it is in giving that we receive; It is in pardoning that we are pardoned; And it is in dying that we are born to eternal life. The priesthood is sacrificial in itself and the priest should immerse himself in the Covenant Vow of Jesus Christ in the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.

@ EJ in re 3/12: fervent and growing is the issue that the New Evangelization is concerned with. With 55 million babies aborted (by the way 1.5 million soldiers total have lost their lives in all U.S. wars from the War for Independence through Iraq), the erosion of law and order in the general populace, the complete greed that threatened the entire economy by the reckless financial practices of the U. S. gov't and the financial establishment, the mainstreaming of pornography and pornographic

Reply 12. This seems to be the evangelization priorities of the RCC as per their "New Evangelization" policy and the Catechism. This is what I would call near worldwide ecumenism... It's heretical and if I am right, the RCC would be considered a Christian cult. Please realize that I am not trying to attack, but point out... If I am wrong, please explain. This is the concluding reply to this series.

But that would be to forget the fact that some of our cultural practices have also eroded to become not so wise and prudent. In short, I see the faith crisis as being sustained and propagated forward by a bad culture. If we simply try to introduce faith by using the bad or problematic ideas of the current culture itself, then I feel that the solution will always be temporary. Because within another generation, the faith will once again be lost.

would grow up in Jerusalem among the Jews and that they had been specifically selected by Him through the patriarchs for that VERY purpose. As a Bible Christian you must be familiar with St. Paul's letter to the Romans. Compare chapter 11, vs. 29, 30 "...in respect to election they are beloved because of the patriarchs. For the gifts and the call of God are irrevocable". In fact it is just those verses that paragraph 839 in the CCC have as a reference verse. Please don't intentionally

Funny, I thought the catholic Church was about a relationship with Jesus Christ. What does the fact that a parish manages "church buildings" have to do with you reading the Bible, or the Daily Roman Missal, or praying the Liturgy of the Hours, or going down to those same "church buildings" and engaging in an hour's worth of prayer before the Blessed Sacrament in Eucharistic Adoration. Sounds to me like your prayer life has dried up.

@ EJ in re 6/12: they had known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory." Or how about Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ's words from the cross: "Father forgive them for they know not what they do". I can hear your Protestant mind balking, but they do know now and they still reject Him. My response: If they did "know" they wouldn't continue to reject Him. Perhaps as a former Catholic you are familiar with something known as "invincible ignorance". What someone is convinced of

@ EJ in re 8/12: Again, the CCC in this subsection "The Church and NON-Christians" is NOT stressing what we DON'T hold in common, but that which we DO hold in common. For you to twist it and claim that the Church is saying, in effect, "Well they believe in Jesus just like we do", is a gross mischaracterization. Your whole argument is based on a faulty reading of these paragraphs of the CCC. Muslims do claim to believe in the god of Abraham, however, (i. e. Yahwey, Jehovah) and so whether

Hahn is a very intelligent man, who does not know the faith. Saint Pope Pius X warned faithful Catholics of men such as him and Bergoglio. Promoters of a new false church, that is Vatican ll.We always have one Christ, who heads our one true Apostolic Church, in the one true faith. The only thing new about our Church is the tremendous falling away of Vatican ll, 1962, that St. Paul prophesied of in one of his epistles.-Joseph

@ EJ in re 4/12: The focus of the "new evangelization" is NOT the proselytizing of non-Catholic Christians. It is the lifelong spiritual life of conversion and catechesis of Catholics and non-practicing Catholics. You insist on setting up these 'straw man' arguments and then knocking them down convincing yourself that what YOU read into the author's plain remarks is his insidious meaning but that just makes YOU deluded, not the author a liar.

What is the New Evangelization? It is a failing attempt to save our Church! The Church needs to be saved from the inside not the outside at this moment!

He goes into a whole discourse on how he was making a presentation in which a Muslim was present and when he described God as "Father" the Muslim became upset that Dr. Hahn used such a familiar and familial image as "father". That to a Muslim God is wholly other, so infinitely transcendent that to speak of Him in such terms was blasphemous. The whole idea of a tender loving, compassionate, merciful father (such as the Parable of the Prodigal Son/Merciful Father) was abhorrent to him. So your

@ EJ in re 5/12: misrepresent the Catholic position because you are no longer a Catholic, but an evangelical, and feel the need to justify or rationalize to yourself your 'change of heart'. It is disingenuous.

I stopped attending Catholic church. The Catholic church's real problem is that it's so dependent on tradition and even church buildings themselves that it completely stifles and chokes all the life out of human souls that those souls can't connect with God. I feel the presence of God move in charismatic people, or in the beauty of nature itself, not in a church made of finery and wealth. That spirit Catholics will never find because they'd need to get rid of their wealth to do it.

@benjulitocaturay4671

5 жыл бұрын

So it boils down t how you "feel" doesn't it? Is that what worship means? It seems very selfish. Instead of worship being about god, it becomes about me and how i "feel".

@a.k.a.simaobezerra8289

4 жыл бұрын

May God bring you to the balance of the Tradition and Charisma: the FULLNESS of Catholic faith.

Reply 8. How can God be so contradicting? The answer is that He's not. Also, Muslims deny the deity of Jesus and even that Jesus had died on the cross. the first part of this blasphemy is written plainly on the outside of the Dome in Jerusalem. In refutation of those writings, Acts 4:11-12 quotes Jesus as saying there is no salvation through anyone but Jesus. To summarize this paragraph, The god of the Muslim is not our God.

Mr Hahn simply promotes “modernism of Vatican ll”

& Ascension of Jesus Christ Our Lord and Saviour on their behalf. The whole idea is "Father forgive them for they know not what they do." Buddhists and Hindus did NOT grow up in the U. S., England, or Western Europe. They do NOT have a 2,000 year history of exposure to, preaching of, or grow up in a culture saturated with the Gospel of Jesus Christ. It was not even until the 1500's that Jesuit missionaries FIRST preached the Gospel to a limited number of Chinese, Japanese, Indian peoples.

Reply 6. This denies Jesus. Jesus said that "I am the way the truth and the light, no one comes to the Father but by me" (John 14:6).

he's out of focus for the whole video

What is the New Evangelization? A massive failure! That’s what

Very dangerous material here...

@beast2sniper

6 жыл бұрын

RantzBizGroup How so? Catholics need to wake and we are.