Can't believe I missed the blaster pushstick, but it is awesome! Gotta love the Internet where everybody is an expert and has the deity-given right to tell you all about it. I'm planning on using PVC for my own dust collection setup, mostly because I think working with sheet metal pipe is a PITA. Thanks for sharing your adventures in this subject!

It amazes me that people watch a video so closely on you tube to pick up on such a small detail. I watch primarily to pick up tips and find things to try that will make my woodworking better or easier, then for entertainment. Really enjoy your videos, from just down the road in Collins MS

Jay, I've had my PVC ducting for 15 years and have never had a shock - ever. You have a great system! Enjoy it.

@scotthaun8582

7 жыл бұрын

thats funny because everyday when i used my flex hose and then bump my lathe or other grounded equipment, i get a little shock...

@PoignantPirate

7 жыл бұрын

Jay is in a high humidity area, so static doesn't build up the same way it does in dryer climates. In colorado, my shopvac had a HUGE static charge every time I used it. In Louisiana, I've never had it build up any charge at all. (same unit)

@dblehar

7 жыл бұрын

i've had the same thing with flex hose. ran a little bare copper wire around it and it fixed the problem.

@Delston05

7 жыл бұрын

Definitely agreed. Having lived in Denver I can attest, every time I'd walk around in my house, I'd get shocked from merely touching my light switches. It was almost unavoidable. On the flip side, in Southern Texas, static build up is hardly noticeable to up in comparison.

@Huck249

7 жыл бұрын

That probably explains the difference in our experiences. I live in southwest Georgia and the humidity is always very high.

Kinda reminds of an Adam Savage quote: "I reject your reality and substitute my own." Some people can't be bothered to actually read informative texts, be they online articles or an actual book. They simply know better because [reasons]. Jay I'm happy to see you laughing about it, don't ever let them get you down.

You inspired me to start woodworking along with some other great KZreadrs, please keep it up. Excellent work.

I have heard from a friend of a friend that if you put a Festool logo on all your dust collector fittings that it will prevent internet trolls from getting static shock and exploding on your comments. In all seriousness your DC setup has given me a lot to consider as I plan out mine. Thank you for going into detail with the design and the thought process.

You are right 99% of time, would love to meet you and get some ideas. You have inspired me to do more. Thank you

Thanks for the video on dust collection. Wish that I had the space to be able to put in a good system like yours, maybe someday. Looking forward to the sharpening video.

I was amused too, at the amount of flak about the size of piping etc etc ad nausea... :-) Oh well. Glad you're happy with the set up! Thanks for sharing.

Greetings from someone who lives in Livonia MI. Love the hat! Seriously, love your videos and the podcast. Keep up the good work.

@JayBates2

7 жыл бұрын

haha. I got it the last time I was up there. I think it was a walgreens or CVS on 7 and Middlebelt.

Jay, take care and have fun!

One way of grounding the PVC is that you twist around and around the pipe in whole length 1mm thick copper wire. But there is no nead. I have 20-30 meters of 200mm diameter PVC pipes in my shop. I'm woodworker and the dust colector is running 5-8hrs a day. Without any grounding. If static builds up it immediately discharge everywhere where is touching the wall,floor,machinery.

It does amaze me that no matter what data you show, people will still believe they know a guy who knows a guy that had his entire shop explode because of pvc dust collection duct work. With all the people that say they've either seen it or know a guy that it happened to you'd think there would only be 4 shops left in the world that have not exploded yet.

@Brandlin

7 жыл бұрын

thats the difference between evidence and anecdotal commentary

@RickMcQuay

7 жыл бұрын

I don't really get it but some people want to believe things that aren't true

as an electrician id say if your not getting shocked dont worry about grounding your system. if you do however start getting static charge the correct way to ground ot is to run a bare copper wire completely threw the inside of the pipe connect all the wires together then run one wire to the ground bar of your shop. but lime i said, if your not getting shop them forget it

I don't know who started the whole "ground your PVC dust collection" nonsense, but I'd like to shock them with a car battery. There is ZERO need to ground PVC dust collection. Even if there was, It would require grounding every foot or so due to PVC non-conductivity. In any event, I've been a subscriber and fan on your "main channel" for some time, and was completely unaware of this second channel. I'm glad I found it. It definitely shows a different, more personal side of you. I'm a bigger fan of you having watched some videos on this channel.

Hi Jay. Nice set up. I've had PVC ducts for 3 years - never been shocked or had any issues.

Great job on the dust collection system. I always enjoy your videos... keep up the good work. Thanks!

Good comment about helping the little guy out! Corporations can afford advertising - the small guys can't. Good job.

Jay I absolutely love your videos. I look forward each week to seeing a new one. When KZread sends me the notification I go right to watching. I am very new to woodworking, (few months), and have found your vids to being very helpful in my progression. I own a daycare center with my wife and I base my projects off toys and needed furniture for the kids. Would you ever do some projects that would be geared toward child size furniture? I have been in the works to turn my garage into a shop myself since I have started watching your vids. I am jealous of your setup. It is awesome. Keep up the awesome work Jay.

"You look fat", "That won't work", "You suck"... All empty words from people that probably are just jealous they can't do the work you do and I'm glad you don't let yourself discourage by so many trolls on the net. Keep up the good work since must of us always enjoy you content and honesty.

Central vac systems are installed in new homes - having to meet building and NEC codes - with PVC pipe all over the country. The only thing that gets grounded in these systems is the motor on the vac itself. I'm sure we'll be seeing the news about the exploding McMansions and the maimed house keepers any day now.... Great looking new system Jay. I am seriously jealous!

@JayBates

7 жыл бұрын

Great point!

@8haggard

6 жыл бұрын

I think the issue surrounding this topic is the presence of fine small, dry wood particulates. The pvc creates some charge or creates a charge on surface and create a shock. In turn the shock could ignite the small particles inside pipe or shop. Central vacs in homes have different conditions than your shop. That said, who knows what could actually happen..wish the mythbusters were still around

We've had the CV1800 with the same pvc duct for two years now. I have been shocked but that was in the first few months of use. It was the same as static from walking across carpet.

I guess dust collection is just a dirty subject man. disregard the trolls, your content is awesome... and so is the push stick!

Thanks for sharing the links to the dust explosion myth articles. Hopefully will quite the trolls. Like Earl I have used PVC for many years with no issues. The only place I ever get a shock is where the flex hose hooks to my Dewalt 735 planer. The warp speed ejection of chips certainly can build up some static. Would be easy to ground the wire in the hose back to the machine if it was really a bother... Keep on sharin'!

@nevermindthebull0cks

7 жыл бұрын

Mine does this to. I wrapped a bit of bare copper wire around the hose for about a foot and taped it there. I wrap the other end around one of the screw post on the planer. No more getting zapped.

I have had my Clearvue up and running about 10 years now with all Norfab piping terminating into the plastic collector with out grounding and without static problems.

That doweling jig looks cool.

With the combination of the dust collection and Star Wars in one video, all I keep thinking is "Shut the Blast Door, shut the Blast Door....Open the Blast Door, open the Blast Door".

jay I was able to put contact switches on each gate that then run to a relay panel. when the gate is pulled open the system turns on for that tool and is turned off when the gate is closed I find this very helpful great video

It may be a little off topic, but I really like and go through your list of tool and material links. While I am not going to run out and buy each one it is nice to have a reference for sources. Thank you, russell.P.S. the only thing better than your dust collection system would be a complete bunny suit with blown in air. And that would get old quick, russell.

I have a clearvue with ungrounded PVC ducting and flex hose with plastic ribbing. I live in a dry climate and I can attest that it shocks the heck out of me on a regular basis.

PVC Pipe Dangers Debunked An Article by Rod Cole Home-shop dust-collection systems have become increasingly popular, but their safety has been hotly debated. The primary issue is whether PVC pipe is safe for use as ductwork. Many claim that sparks in PVC pipe
due to static electricity may ignite the dust cloud in the pipe. The specter of a giant fireball consuming a shop and home is repeatedly raised. Others claim you can ground PVC, thus ensuring its safety. Two years ago I had to decide for myself: PVC or metal ducts for my basement shop. Being both an avid woodworker and a scientist, I made a concerted effort to understand the issues. Fortunately, I have the resources of the library at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT) and a professor just down the hall who’s an expert in the physics of lightning. I studied static discharge from insulators, as well as the more general topic of dust ignition. I found that it’s extremely unlikely for a home-shop-sized system to have a dustcloud explosion. Commercial-sized systems have had dust-cloud explosions, but different phenomena come into play in larger systems, and 4-in.-dia. PVC is too small for use in such systems, where the airflow is much greater than in a home shop. Sparks are unlikely in 4-in.-dia. PVC pipe In my research I turned to the Journal of Electrostatics, a publication
that covers the effects and interactions of static electricity, particularly in commercial applications. This journal 
has published a number of studies on the combustibility of dust clouds by electrostatic sparks. The researchers were able to determine some of the conditions necessary to create sparks and ignite a dust cloud. Sparks can be caused by a variety of conditions-one of which is static electricity. However, sparks are unlikely inside
a standard 4-in.-dia. PVC pipe that would be used in a home shop, and more importantly, any such sparks are extremely unlikely to be strong enough to cause an ignition. I can’t say it is truly impossible, but it is very close to impossible, and I do not know of a single instance. The difference between metal and PVC is that one is a conductor (metal) and the other is an insulator (PVC). A conductor allows electrical charges to flow freely. If any excess charge is not given a path to ground, it can arc, creating a spark that in certain conditions can ignite a flammable substance such as dust. Grounding provides a path for this excess charge to flow harmlessly to the earth, which is why dust-collection systems in all commercial shops are required by code to be grounded. However, an insulator is a very poor conductor of electricity. While it’s possible to get a static shock from the outside of a PVC pipe, it is highly unlikely for sparks to occur inside. Dust collectors with 3 hp or less pose little danger I published my findings on my web site. Rob Witter, a representative at Oneida Air Systems Inc., which makes dust-collection systems, said he largely agreed with my research. “We as a company have been trying to trim away at these misunderstandings for years,” he said. He added that plastic pipe will “probably never cause a problem” in a home shop. Finally, he pointed out that the National Fire Protection ssociation NFPA) puts no regulations on dust-collection systems of 1,500 cu. ft. per minute (cfm) or less. All of this discussion applies to home-shop-scale systems. Larger systems, complete with ducts and filters that move
more than 1,500 cfm, require at least 3 hp and are not found in most home shops. Larger systems need larger ducts, and with that you have to begin to worry about more complicated forms of static sparks. The real hazards In a home shop, the dust-collection fire hazards you need to worry about are not in the ductwork but in the collection bag or bin itself. A fire may be caused by a spark, which can occur when a piece of metal is sucked into the ductwork and strikes another piece of metal, or by embers from a pinched blade. The spark or ember settles into the dust pile to smolder, erupting into a full-blown fire hours later, often after the shop has been shut down and no one is there to respond. For this reason, my most important recommendation is to empty the collected dust every day or at least keep it in a closed metal container.

@larrybe2900

7 жыл бұрын

+Lucien Lasocki Thanks for your research. It is good stuff to know.

@lucienlasocki2544

7 жыл бұрын

Larry Be Thank you for your nice comment. It's nice to not be trolled for once.

Planning to install some type of pvc collection system in my shop. As for the static charge I'm more concerned about damage to computer controlled machines than explosions. At the moment I use a metallic duct on the CNC router. Don't know if I need or should ground the ducting if/when I change to a centralized system. Great videos!

Jay having a bit of fun with the video editing around 2:09.

That push stick looks like it will just be "Clumsy and random", you need an elegant push stick for a more civilized age...

@JayBates2

7 жыл бұрын

:)

@XerfThingol

7 жыл бұрын

That means you have to turn some lightsaber hilt on a lathe =]

Hello Jay, I up graded my Harbor Freight Dust collector to a Grizzly H0703 HEP Cyclone and it was a great improvement. I dont have the room or the money for something like the clear vue. I enjoyed the video though. Take care of your lungs they come in handy.

Jay 10 -13 years ago was the dust wars ,feelings were hurt, Clearvue was born Onieda was suing folks over stuff it thought was thiers. Bill Pentz was either a saint or a sinner depending on the forum. It was epic times. But somethings never change as to what folks feel about a subject but cannot quantify with facts.

With your metal blast gates you have natural points to attach grounding wires if you choose to ground the system

I ground off the aluminum screw boss on my gates and epoxied a 1"x1/8" neodymium magnet on instead. It works -really- well and saves a step.

Just keep doing what you're doing man, don't let the forum junkies ruin things for you. I say forum junkies because that's what I blame for this kind of stuff. Forums are breeding grounds for exaggeration and opinions being reiterated enough that people start to consider them fact. Hell ive even seen posts on forums where guys swear you have to ground from INSIDE the pcv pipe. I'm still standing by for a good explanation on how the hell you secure a piece of wire inside a 15 foot section of pipe. You are a one man shop, running one tool at a time, so you will be just fine. If there were multiple people running multiple tools generating gobs of fine dust, then you may have an issue, but that would more likely be a huge system using metal duct work, which is easily grounded anyways.

Love the pushstick. I will definitely add one to the collection. May the force be with you... while you're woodworking.

I liked your video, now if only I could get my shop vac wood chip separator to work as well as yours I'd be doing good 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

You could post a KZread video showing how to cure cancer and some idiot will have a negative comment about how you did it wrong. In my experience, the negative people are just mad because they've never actually done, or accomplished anything themselves. Screw them. As for the rest of us, I think I speak for a great many people when I say that we anxiously await the next Jay Bates video. Keep it up dude! I personally envy your inefficient, dangerous exploding dust collector.

Nice job with the subtle Darth Vader over the face mask.

Man..i would give anything to just have one trolling my comments in 24h jet alone in just 3h. There's no trafic at all :-) Just kidding. Don't worry about grounding the pipes.. the conditions for explosion must be so dead on that is nearly impossible to create in your shop. Keep up the good work

If you did want to ground pipes, gluing a tiny coper wire over it's entire length does the trick.

The only reason to ground the pipe would be to protect the electronics on some switch components on modern machines. Static can damage these circuits. Almost any dust given the right conditions can propagate combustion. These condition do not normally exist in woodworking dust collection unless you are sanding aluminum and manufacturers have "systems" in place to prevent this. If you want to really see potential for dust explosions then consider In grain handling there is always the risk of an explosion as there is a different type of dust that may have traces of methane etc.

jay you are doing it all wrong you should have positioned it in MY shop!!! :)

I had to ground my flex hose. When I hook it to my planer it zaps me pretty good. That's the only thing that it does it with. I'm getting a cnc machine and I hear that the static can make those do odd things or maybe fry a component, so grounding everything is going to be necessary for me.

I would used your open port above table saw for an air filter to catch that fine dust.

Woodworkers can do what whatever they feel comfortable at home, but according to the California Mechanical Code Sub-chapter 7. General Industry Safety Orders Group 8. Points of Operation and Other Hazardous Parts of Machinery Article 59. Woodworking Machines and Equipment Ducts and flexible hoses used to convey air and materials as part of dust collection systems shall be constructed of metal or other conductive material and shall be bonded and grounded to prevent the accumulation of static electricity generated by the airflow. Non-conductive ducts such as PVC pipes shall not be permitted. Basically, in this over regulated state, you won't get be able to obtain building permit unless conductive duct work is specified on your prints. Additionally, the inspectors will not sign off on a C of O (certificate of occupancy) unless they verify your dust collection system is properly grounded...

Like the out-tro audio. LOL JimE

i use aluminium tape i stick inside the pipe and the connector

I thought that video really sucked. 🙄 Only joking, great channel, great advice. I’m new to your channel and recently got back in to woodworking so I’m currently building my own garage workshop up bit by bit, loving all the shop tour videos and helpful advice from your community. Merry Xmas and kind regards. 🙏👍

Cool push stick.

Could you also cover the pipe where it could shock you in like that Flex Seal stuff? Just rubber so that it can't pass through to you.

If you don't want to risk ruining your fancy push stick, make a sacrificial bottom? If the company made them to be fitted easily with one that would be great. Of course that might lower sales and ultimately profit and we can't have that.

@darrenstamos

7 жыл бұрын

@aaronschimming keep your eye on @laserlion_fab on Instagram, you might be interested in what's coming down the pipe in the next few weeks!

Ha, that's hilarious. Myth Busters disprove the dust explosion a long time ago. I was curious about there not being a gate just beyond the first drop to shut off the rest of the shop when you are using the tools that are serviced by that first drop.

Jay. The only place I get a build up is on the Rigid oscillating sander. It is frequent when I have a big sanding project. I have 2" flex hose going into my 4" pvc main line. It goes through a super dust deputy on a 55 gallon metal drum and a harbor freight system. 2hp. I live in the humidity too. Any thoughts on this?

Jay - I think you may have forgotten to add the link for the push stick.............. Thanks in advance

You should be very pleased with yourself, just think of all that time you'll save yourself cleaning up which means more time for projects and obviously the health benefits, can't wait for your 1st project of 2017.

sometimes it seems like when you get one troll, they all come to pile on.

Yeah, I was going to leave a really offensive, angry, comment on the dust collection video for no real reason except for me being a KZread expert on nothing but then decided you are beyond help so I let you off... this time! Best Wishes, Brendan.

you rock jay vader

Jay at 75 years old at least you'll still be alive to make a wooden toy for your grandchildren

Jay I don't see the link for that awesome push stick. Keep up the great work

@duewest2225

7 жыл бұрын

Dave A same here. Maybe we'll see it soon

@reesewoodworks

7 жыл бұрын

laserlion.bigcartel.com/product/high-safety-push-stick

@JayBates

7 жыл бұрын

Sorry. Forgot to update KZread description. I put in the website article only. I do apologize.

Thanks Jay, I just subscribes to your channel. Great channel, im picking good tip off of it.

You always have great videos and you are a red wings fan

I just noticed you had one of Rob's saws. How does it compare to the Veritas?

I want a hepa cylcone dust collector but with 4" pipe so os this a good option

You should do a montage of reading mean "tweets" or comments.

Hi Jay, Great system and I do enjoy watching all your videos, and all the stuff from the woodworking exponents Stateside (and all with so much room!) I'm in the UK: we don't usually have that luxury. I'd like to ask, why does nobody put their dust collection machine inside a 'box' to cut noise? I'm currently in a partitioned UK garage (very small) with my dust collection the other side of a stud wall: but am hoping to move shortly, and get a larger workshop and I'm wondering about installing a ventilated 'box'/cupboard to house the cyclone/extractor motor to cut workshop noise: In your opinion is it not worth the effort? I'm sure others will add their comments!

Hi, Jay where can I find that remote turn on for the dust collection & what is it called?

Hmmm, trolling dust collection really? I believe you can run and ground a foil strip inside the pipes, to reduce internal static which could be a problem in dry climate mixed with finishing vapors. Oh I get the trolling, Jealousy 😊, I know I felt a twing of it when I watched your build...

Didn't Mythbusters do something about plastic pipe and static charge.

People that hate on other people's work usually couldn't build or fix anything if they tried. Because they read it on the internet they are geniuses, but have never done or experienced anything. BTW do you think dowel joints could compare to the Festool dominos as far as their uses and strength?

Jay, you mentioned that gravity doesn't have any effect on some of your blast gates. Is that due to the fact that your shop is actually in outer space flying from galaxy to galaxy? Don't worry. I'm sending this confidentially. I wont tell anyone else your secret.

oh my gosh, are you ok....watch your shop and home, Darth Vader is in your area.....oh my oh my....please let me know if your ok jay....

Jay hope your having a good Tuesday as normal🇨🇮, I like the way you did a model in sketchup of your shop, what's the best way of doing that i.e. The machines in your shop, do you google a image of your tool then import it in?

@JayBates2

7 жыл бұрын

I explained it in the article for the dust collection pipe video.

@kylecroft5807

7 жыл бұрын

Jay Bates 2 bang on jay, thanks

Cool push stick. Am I crazy or is the one thing it DOESN'T do is keep your hand away from the blade??

@snowypirate07

7 жыл бұрын

I wonder if you aren't supposed to use the gun handle as the point you hold.

I am just making an observation, not commenting on its effectiveness -- but I recently bought a dust deputy and it came with some aluminum tape that the instructions had me install along the cyclone and the inlet. So, perhaps aluminum tape along the PVC pipe would have some kind of effect? I have no idea.

@Getoutthere247

7 жыл бұрын

SkewToob the dust deputy is not made of pvc andI will build a charge. I found out while cleaning up the shop the first time I used it. was really easy to ground it to the container im using.

@SkewToob

7 жыл бұрын

I figured that would be the case because it doesn't feel like PVC. What about the ClearVue cyclone part? Is it PVC?

This is all awesome, thanks for sharing. But what i want to know is when you are going to start the Shop Dust Collection Tour 2017. Start in South Florida and help/coach me into setting mine up. There really should be a "service" out there for folks who just want someone to hook them up. I am a Mommy of 3, i just don't have the time to set all this up. Come one, let's start the ShopDustCollectionTour2017!!! ;)

@JayBates2

7 жыл бұрын

lol. Lots of resource on BillPentz.com about dust collection.

The probability of something serious happening is not all that great but there is still a possibility. I have knowledge of an incident where an individual improvised a vacuum operation for extended reach using a plastic pipe. Granted he was actually handling the pipe while in use but the static discharge was so violent that it sent the man to the hospital. It would take little effort to purchase a small spool wire and tape it to the pipe in a spiral and grounding it at a common point in the system. Jay if I may offer a tidbit of wisdom dealing with safety being drilled into my head while at work, don't wait until you get shocked. It could be your wife or a child innocently/accidentally touching the pipe and getting shocked. Granted it is not the end of the world if you do nothing but I am surprised at your willingness to take a chance against safety. it is not the direct danger of a saw blade running 3600 RPM but it might be something else you have dismissed as improbable odds of happening only to be unlucky enough to have lost that lottery.

Looking for a new planer. Looking at grizzly or Laguna Any suggestions?

@JayBates2

7 жыл бұрын

I don't think I've even seen a Laguna planer. I don't have any experience with Grizzly planers either. I do own a few Grizzly tools that I'm pleased with though.

@ryanmeloney3421

7 жыл бұрын

Thanks. I'll keep researching

Hey Darth

Ok Darth Jay Overloard. Glad you found the trolls funny, good attitude to have. Dowels? You will never use them since you have the almighty Festool Domino. Help the little guy you say? Well I think you and I are not so big, 5' + a couple and few - haha (I know what you meant).

@JayBates2

7 жыл бұрын

I never use the Domino on camera because people complain. Which I understand to a degree.

Who would consider grounding PVC ? Oh yea, someone who would want to move the grand canyon to California.

I want a doweling jig

+1 for the outro

My question about grounding wasn't trying to be troll. Just wondering if I can be lazy and not do it myself.

@JayBates

7 жыл бұрын

Comments regarding the dust collection are not troll comments. Vulgar insults towards me in regards to the dust collection system and the way I handle things are what I was talking about.

@jayfromjumbie679

7 жыл бұрын

Damn, screw the haters. You rock dude. Btw, if you ever need anything laser cut like that blaster, hit me up. We've got a 500 watt laser. :)

@larrybe2900

7 жыл бұрын

Jay, do you consider my input regarding your safety as "vulgar"? It was not meant to offend but when I can share a precaution I will whether or not the recipient is offended or not. Your shop is just fine if you feel your shop is just fine.

Regarding dust explosion, I worked as a contract supervisor for a company in Scotland based in Kinross. They used mahogany to build their bespoke home improvement products and I can remember arriving one morning to see smoke billowing out of the containment unit outside. In a panic I ran inside screaming Fire and one of the factory employees casually walked outside with a fire extinguisher while another hooked an earth wire that had fallen off a section off mild steel waste pipe. Basis of the story is, don't panic when you have cool guy's around kitted out with a fire extinguisher and another whom is not afraid of a belt of electricity going through his body.

I didn't see any dust collection to your spindle sander #teamspindlesander

@JayBates2

7 жыл бұрын

In time young Jedi....in time.

HANDS ARE TO CLOSE TO THE SAW BLADE

Do dust particles have rights too ?

@JayBates2

7 жыл бұрын

not in my shop.

Dust was a good video .

I just seen Vader!

No grounding? OMG I can't believe you've survived this long. Who am I kidding, you're probably dead already and we won't find out about it until Tyler or someone is announced as your replacement on the podcast. You'll be missed and oh, calling dibs on the jointer while I'm at it.

Think about hot-gluing a replaceable base to the blaster push stick😉👍🏻

Stop touching your pipe in the workshop.