I'm mostly amazed at how good XeSS is looking Vs FSR

@gametime4316

24 күн бұрын

and it's the "poor man" XESS DP4a that work on the same AMD cards the real XMX XESS looks way better.

@Athos90

24 күн бұрын

0:47 0:48 j the pb CC. 1:29 1:30 k 1:51 1:54 1:21 in bv 1:15 b​@@gametime4316

@kinghadu9611

24 күн бұрын

@@gametime4316 I have an ARC A750 and XESS looks incredible however the drivers for the card is trash and so is the performance on UE5 games, I am selling it next week already ordered a RX 6800 Core on sale

@CASTSTONE

24 күн бұрын

Too bad performance gains are minimal on AMD.

@techsamurai11

24 күн бұрын

Wait for PSSR - if Intel could do that with no knowledge of upscaling, then Sony being the foremost experts should be able to take on Nvidia.

6:17 that confetti shot really shows the limitations

@Timmysan

25 күн бұрын

This is almost the only shot where it is indeed not acceptable.. Kinda sad DLSS wasent in that comparison shot...

@jotarokujo.9667

25 күн бұрын

​@@Timmysan 10:14 fsr 3.1 and dlss comparison

@CasualG-mer

25 күн бұрын

That...my god, it's...my god AMD, we're already at FSR 3 and AMD can't do confetti? DAYYUUMM

@CasualG-mer

24 күн бұрын

​​@@jotarokujo.9667 This just shows, how much you are losing when your only choice is FSR... it's kinda insane when you think about it, the gap between AMD and Nvidia. That's probably why DF didn't even bother to try FSR 3.1's FG, because, we know it's gonna make it look worse than it already is, when the upscaler is this bad, then adding artificial frames is worse.

@gametime4316

24 күн бұрын

that looks so sad... DLSS is not perfect @10:25 but it show all the particles. not bad consider it running at about 8 times less resolution ( X4 SSAA from 1440P is 5K and DLSS balance at 1440P is less than 900P ) edit, I calculated it 1440P balance DLSS is 1485X835 so 1.24M pixels 5K is 5120X2880 so 14.74M pixels so it's more like 12 times less pixels 😱😮😮

FSR 3.1: now less worse

@razorbackroar

25 күн бұрын

😂😂😂

@VincentVanBro

25 күн бұрын

The poor man’s upscaler

@EquiIi3R1um

25 күн бұрын

​@@VincentVanBroyes 7900xt is surely a poor man's gpu then

@michahojwa8132

25 күн бұрын

At foundry - somehow they've forgotten they called 1440p fsrb completely unusable and now they have no problem with running it.

@VincentVanBro

25 күн бұрын

@@EquiIi3R1um poor people are capable of making large purchases, they just typically make very poor decisions when they do

We need a video comparing FSR3 frame generation to DLSS3 Frame Generation. AMD is claiming that they've made improvements to FG with 3.1 too.

@alistermunro7090

25 күн бұрын

Do we really? DLSS FG > FSR FG.

@12coco100

25 күн бұрын

​​@@alistermunro7090This is not the case. For some weaker gpus fsr frame gen is better. In ghosts at launch fsr looked better and gave more fps. Dlss frame gen could have lower latency due to reflex. But the actual frame gen its the same or fsr is better

@Vicric

25 күн бұрын

@@ScyrousFX It's only very recently we've had decoupled FSR FG with FSR3 upscaling, not months. You couldn't compare it before because you're also comparing the differences in upscaling too.

@srn7254

25 күн бұрын

I've used both for a while, and FSR3 had slightly better performance in some cases actually, but a lot more visual artifacts as well - shadows just didn't seem to match properly, and finer things like hair caused tons of ghosting when moving (especially annoying in third-person games). overall DLSS-FG feels a lot more stable and consistent for now, and the only noticeable issues were occasional HUD ghosting/glitching (which is mainly up to developers to properly fix AFAIK, since it only happens on certain titles whereas FSR3 artifacts were pretty much universal).

@asysjr

25 күн бұрын

for people using DLDSR with frame gen, the FSR frame gen is best. I noticed the DLSS frame gen dont work properly when you are using with DLDSR to improve render resolution in 1080 ou 1440p monitors. The DLSS frame gen gives only 25 to 30% increase in FPS if you using alongside with DLDSR. But the FSR frame gen gives something like 70 to 80%.

3:12 holy DAMN does the super sampled image look crisp. Not surprising at all, but still a stunning sight since i don't think i've ever seen 4x SSAA 1440p before.

@dreampillet

25 күн бұрын

6:12 is the one that blew my mind.

@luizsouza2034

24 күн бұрын

14440p that's some crazy numbers

@toastbrot97

24 күн бұрын

@@luizsouza2034 oh hanks, i didn't notice :D

@Waffle4569

23 күн бұрын

It's like people forgot what stuff looked like before all this blurry temporal AA upscaling shit took over.

@toastbrot97

23 күн бұрын

@@Waffle4569 So true. I can't even disagree if i tried to.

One big question still remaing is: Why have so many games no motion vectors for particles? Wouldn't that immediately improve image quality for all upscalers?

@CTBell-uy7ri

25 күн бұрын

I wonder this myself. My hunch is that generating the motion vector pass has a cost that they don’t want to spend. Also, motion vector buffers may be lower resolution and they miss it. In the end I think that game engines being built right now will have this in mind. But we may not see it for years yet. UE5 was made to be used with upsacalers, tho it didn’t quite nail it. I think we will only see more and better moves in that direction with time.

@BlindTrustProject

25 күн бұрын

Particles are usually super optimised shader to privilege quantity over quality. Not surprised if it's not writing motion vectors. Plus if they use a transparent material, usually they don't write in the z buffer or motion vectors.

@concinnus

24 күн бұрын

@@BlindTrustProject Costs are an issue, but consider also benefits. Most of the PC market is nVidia, and DLSS works well enough on vectorless particles, so why bother (unless the console version has FSR).

@goob8945

24 күн бұрын

probably quite expensive and would require reworking a lot of the code

@kzin602

24 күн бұрын

Particles are usually not objects in 3D space but a shader applied across a surface. In the cases where they do exist in space the actual 3D object is just a point and the particle you see is a type of shader driven glow or whatever, so there's no motion vector on the effect itself.

Making small particle disappear is big deal for me

@gattsgodai3

25 күн бұрын

You’re a high energy physicist too? /s

@lupintheiii3055

25 күн бұрын

It was the case with Xess and DLSS too

@Jas7520

25 күн бұрын

​@@lupintheiii3055you can trivially see in the side by side that isnt the case, at least for the confetti scene. DLSS keeps all the confetti visible and looks closest to the supersampled image.

@VincentVanBro

25 күн бұрын

@@lupintheiii3055incorrect

@DBTHEPLUG

25 күн бұрын

​Your 3 most recent comments on this channel are all anti-nvidia. Biased amd fanboy confirmed. @lupintheiii3055

Reportedly from TechPowerUp, AMD is starting a switch to become a "Software Company" Hopefully that means a more meaningful approach to the technology backing it's hardware.

@Medeci

25 күн бұрын

Not a drop of that will reach gamers

@user-mw4wq3ci3d

25 күн бұрын

Pretty sure they are focusing on AI like nvidia.

@rob4222

25 күн бұрын

​@@MedeciThanks for the information, AMD employee 😂

@techsamurai11

23 күн бұрын

That makes sense - software is where they lost the war against Nvidia. Their hardware is actually a better bargain. It's the software where Nvidia has beaten them.

0:07 A M deez nuts

@kupokinzyt

25 күн бұрын

please win top comment, i heard deez too lol

@Jun123

25 күн бұрын

😂

@fttmvp

25 күн бұрын

HA!

@slavboii420

25 күн бұрын

Goddammit I can't unhear it now, thank you

@Angel7black

25 күн бұрын

Gottem

I feel like quality modes at least need a mention? Adding 2min to the video time to briefly mention the quality modes and how they stack up would be very appreciated?

@ArchieBunker11

25 күн бұрын

FSR quality is between DLSS balanced and performance, whilst also getting less performance gains than DLSS quality.

@12coco100

25 күн бұрын

​@@ArchieBunker11 Your performance statement is not being truthful Hardware Unboxed did a video on performance between the upscalers, and using FSR 3.1 quality on a AMD gpu like the 7800xt. Gives the same amount of fps as DLSS quality with a 4070 in horizon. In Ghosts a 7800xt gives 5 more fps using FSR 3.1 quality mode. In Spiderman there's a difference in fps because AMD has worse RT performance so it got lower frames. In Miles Morales is where your correct. The 7800xt runs the same as the 4070 with RT without upscaling. But FSR 3.1 at quality gives you 104fps while the 4070 with DLSS quality gives you 117fps. You're correct with Miles Morales but other games where there is no RT like Ghosts and Horizon the FSR performance is the same as DLSS or better which you failed to mention by handpicking numbers.

@ArchieBunker11

25 күн бұрын

@@12coco100 it is absolutely truth, watch the HUB video again, but try listening this time. Its literally timestamped “performance testing” Horizon fsr has less uplift, steve even says in HUB’s video for horizon “if amd users want to match the performance uplift of an Nvidia user using DLSS Quality, they need to use balanced”. Same story for spiderman, and miles morales. Ghosts was in between Dlss Q and balanced for uplift. Not to mention FSR looks far worse in comparison

@HanSolo__

23 күн бұрын

@@ArchieBunker11 The difference in performance gains is not that important. The same goes for frame interpolation. Nobody needs 3x the base frames if the input stays low.

@ArchieBunker11

23 күн бұрын

@@HanSolo__ If one card can use DLSS Quality that is already miles better than FSR Quality, AND it gets the performance gain that FSR balanced does, its an absurdly big advantage.

It's an embarrasement that Intel can do better with their first generation of Xess than AMD with their 3rd generation of FSR

@KingVulpes

25 күн бұрын

Because for some reason AMD won't do what Intel is doing and put their AI cores to use for Upscaling

@MLWJ1993

24 күн бұрын

Likely because Intel & Nvidia have a massive advantage when it comes to monetary resources. They can easily invest some money in R&D to make this possible without really breaking a sweat about budget anytime soon.

@gametime4316

24 күн бұрын

@@KingVulpes XESS DP4a not using the AI cores and looks way better on the same AMD cards.

@KingVulpes

24 күн бұрын

@@gametime4316 Doesn’t it switch to AI acceleration on Intel GPUs tho?

@gametime4316

24 күн бұрын

@@KingVulpes all version of XESS use AI, but not the AI cores (on AMD and nvidia) on intel cards its automatically change to the XMX version and run on the XMX "AI" cores

Man, DLSS is still so far ahead its not even funny. Glad FSR is getting better though.

Oh no I think Alex needs a break He’s been FSRing way too much lately 😜

DLSS is still the most reliable upscaler for now. Can only think of 1 time where DLSS has been implemented poorly and thats Jedi Survivor.

@115zombies935

25 күн бұрын

Warframe is another. It’s sadly very broken there.

@AndyHDGaming

25 күн бұрын

Only DLSS frame generation has a ghosting problem in Jedi Survivor. All you need to do is downgrade DLSS frame generation .DLL to the older version.

@srn7254

25 күн бұрын

@@115zombies935 how so? I've been using the Quality preset since it pretty much dropped on WF, and it looks pretty much perfect at 4K - far better than native w/ TAA actually.

@115zombies935

25 күн бұрын

@@srn7254 I got pretty horrendous artifacts in the star chart, and saw a lot of ghosting on particles compared to FSR. Which is really odd because in almost every other game it’s the opposite with DLSS having significantly less ghosting.

@thomaswhite9160

25 күн бұрын

Dead space remake has tons of ghosting tho

Nice to see improvements in FSR. It's incredible how good DLSS is though

Nice to see AMD trying, but that fizzle is too noticeable and bothersome.

love the use of the Glover soundtrack in the video 👍

@no1DdC

25 күн бұрын

I knew it sounded familiar!

Been waiting for this one, thanks for covering it Alex! That shot with the confetti with SSAAx4 just looks so much better than both 3.1 and 2.2, it's amazing how much particle detail is lost.

@Chasm9

25 күн бұрын

And it's amazing how much of those particles does DLSS (and XeSS) retain despite rendering at 58% of 1440p resolution.

Great video Dic...Alex!

Hey DF, Your description states that FSR 3.1 is a spatial upscaler but it isn't.

I'd like to know how real the extra frames in FG are in FSR 3.1 because some games lead to ghosting like Ghost of Tsushima, while others look smooth like Spider-Man Remastered.

Thanks Alex, great work as usual!

Fizzling Shimmery Reconstruction

@techsamurai11

23 күн бұрын

Price: 3 Trillion Dollars! AMD must have really deep pockets to afford losing 3 trillion dollars.

Me personally, I really hate that pixelated look FSR gives you in every game. I genuinely just prefer playing at a lower resolution and applying a sharpening filter like AMD's own CAS from Reshade.

@12coco100

25 күн бұрын

rsr on amd software is really good. Instead of spending frames at 2160p, you set it to 1800p and use rsr to give you some clarity. Its pretty much what I do on every game and you get like 10 - 15 frames for free.

@LewisHamiltonMSPR

24 күн бұрын

Same here, it's horrible. I play close to a 55" TV so FSR makes everything worse. When it's the only upscaler option in a game, I go without it.

Would have been nice to see a comparison with Insomniac's home made ITGI upscaler

Will we get a follow up comparing FSR3.1 FG to DLSS FG in these games? Primarily as I'm curious to see if the difference in cost of using DLSS FG vs FSR FG manifests here as it has been recorded in more titles lately and i have a theory it may be due to OFA Latency mandating a minimum % frametime cost to the internal framerate that then gets multiplied

@Alovon

25 күн бұрын

The key thing that makes me think this is how the frametime cost has a recorded lowest value, and how that is consistent on the 4090, but not the 4080 (the 4080 sometimes having the same cost in Cyberpunk PT, but not Alan Wake 2 for example)

Good work, Alex. I was waiting for this video. I was expecting a significant improvement based on what AMD showed, but we only got a slight improvement. WHEN will AMD get their machine learning-based upscaling solution in their products??

Would love to see 1440p quality comparisons too

@selohcin

24 күн бұрын

I'm sure would.

Nice video Alex. I recently purchased a ROG Ally, and have noticed a big difference in these techniques versus my gaming PC. What's odd to me, though, is that on AMD hardware, Xess seems to give a little better image and even a tick or two up in framerate over FSR, which follows exactly what you said in this video. I don't notice it as much on my gaming rig because it has more brute power and doesn't need to rely on these supersampling techniques as much. I do wish ROG would have DLSS available, but I'm sure that wont happen lol.

Is SSAA actually an option in the game, or was VSR used?

@DigitalFoundry

25 күн бұрын

I ran the game at the higher res and downsampled it in post

@gametime4316

25 күн бұрын

​@@DigitalFoundry Alex I HATE U ! u reminded me how good SSAA looks about 15-20 years after i stopped using it back when i had the 7800GTX... so amazing how sharp and clean the image look, but it's just not useable those days when u start with 1440P or 4K resolution and when 165-240HZ monitors are so common, the image looks SO good but it's just painful to give up so much FPS. great video like always :)

@no1DdC

25 күн бұрын

@@gametime4316 Use a very slow old monitor for a couple of days. Then going back to a modern gaming monitor will feel amazingly smooth, even if it's just running at less than 100 Hz. Or do what I did and only now upgrade from a 14 year old screen to a newer one (the 14 year old one was very high-end though, which is why it lasted for so long).

@darudesandstorm7002

23 күн бұрын

@@no1DdC an 85hz crt still feels smoother than a 240hz oled (i have both) in terms of motion clarity. maybe the newer 480hz ones close the gap but i tried using one yet.

DLSS is still ages ahead tbh. The only thing I like is that they decoupled the upscaler from FG, using DLSS + AMD's FG is golden.

@Dorraj

22 күн бұрын

AMD Frame Gen with DLSS on 20 and 30 series cards is a huge middle finger to Nvidia, so I love them for that. But the upscaling part is still ages behind.

Really hope AMD takes some hints from what TSR is doing, that Tekken example is brutal, atleast there is an improvement here. Would it be better to run with IGTI Ultra Quality or FSR Quality in Ratchet and Clank? I preferred the results from FSR in Spiderman but I can run that game at basically native 1440p with High RT on my 6800, will prob have to rely on dynamic resolution more in R&C.

FSR 3.1 looks more blurry to me compared to the older 2.2, like it has an extra smattering of FXAA applied to it.

I wonder if AMD would put in the effort to improve FSR if their current architecture would feature a tensor core equivalent. I honestly doubt it.

@viet0ne

25 күн бұрын

No more than nVidia improving DLSS on older GPUs. The capability is there, nVidia chooses to only allow it on newer GPUs.

@olnnn

25 күн бұрын

If only their most recent cards had it it might have been akin to XeSS where it had a fallback which worked on older cards but ran slower (compared to newer cards with HW accel and compared to current FSR)

@slyseal2091

25 күн бұрын

@@viet0ne which will backfire, because that means most games in the next few years don't take advantage of this technology available only on a fraction of all cards. And eventually the 40xx's are gonna be priced like GTX cards, meaning they'll be faced with a wave of consumers that "just don't feel the need to upgrade to 50/60/70xx cards yet". All courtesy of the magical fps injectors, running alongside games that were made for a majority 10xx market. Suddenly everyone is in the fps bracket of playing then-contemporary games with hardware that Nvidia won't have received profits from in a long while.

@DanielFerreira-ez8qd

25 күн бұрын

@@slyseal2091 ... that doesn't sound accurate at all. They still make "entry-level" cards, overpriced as they are. WHEN the 40 series cards actually get down to the price of GTX cards, that will have been several generations of hardware, which will most likely feature new functionalities that the 40 series cards just can't do.

@Okusar

25 күн бұрын

​@viet0ne Nvidia allows DLSS on all cards that have the hardware to support it. Unless you're talking about DLSS frame generation specifically. Turing lacks the hardware Optical Flow Accelerator (nvOFA) necessary for DLSS frame gen; Ampere does have hardware OFA, but it's not fast enough to support real-time frame generation. Ada Lovelace improved the speed and efficiency of the nvOFA by around 4×, which is what makes DLSS frame generation viable on those cards. Nvidia could technically enable frame gen on 30-series, but it likely wouldn't offer any meaningful improvement to performance.

i'm confused. fsr3 is frame generation, but fsr 3.1 is image reconstruction? after nvidia made the same goof you'd think amd would avoid it

I've been wondering if studios should even bother to still support FSR instead of XeSS. I have an AMD GPU but whenever possible I will always default to XeSS, it still has some issues but overall image quality is way better than FSR. For older gpus they could maybe offer TAA or a simple Checkerboard rendering to increase resolution.

Sounds like a solid 3.0 -> 3.1 update.

@jorge69696

24 күн бұрын

Considering it was compared to FSR 2.2, this is more like 2.3.

'FSR' is an acronym for 'Flickery Super Resolution'.

@gametime4316

24 күн бұрын

when AMD will finally move to ML based upscaling FSR will be remembered as Failed Super Resolution :P

@darudesandstorm7002

23 күн бұрын

flickering. shimmering. refund. 🤣

@OmnianMIU

20 күн бұрын

LMAO 😂😂😂

@saul8510

7 күн бұрын

​@@gametime4316Atleast it runs everywhere and gives great performance.

Really love how fsr native aa looks on Forbbiden west and Ghost of Tsushima

Update: I was mistaken and thinking of XESS 1.3 which uses different internal resolutions for performance, balanced, etc. rendering modes and not FSR3 FSR3 uses a lower base resolution versus FSR2, isn’t that right? That’s how they claim a performance boost. Was this taken into consideration? Seems like using the exact same base resolution is something you wanna get right. (FSR 3 Balanced ≈ FSR 2 Performance)

@waltuhputurdaway

25 күн бұрын

yeah this didnt happen, internal res is still the same.

@macmacsk

24 күн бұрын

@@waltuhputurdaway oh really? Am I crazy or was this something AMD planned on doing?

@waltuhputurdaway

24 күн бұрын

@@macmacsk just crazy, only company to change internal res for upscaler so far is Intel's XeSS

@macmacsk

23 күн бұрын

@@waltuhputurdaway damn I’m coockoo and I know it.

Have the frame timing/stutters been fixed yet?

I'd rather have a lower resolution than smears and blurs and trails and disappearing particles.

I'm still happy with my 3060 Ti. But I'm still wanting some form of frame generation in my games, while upscaling with dlss

@gametime4316

24 күн бұрын

i have RTX 4070TI and i don't use any form of FG its stupid, it's just better to run low and responsive 40FPS and not 60FPS that feel like 25FPS. (60FPS with FG wait for 2 30FPS frames to be rendered and have total latency worse than 20-25FPS. even with with 50FPS base (100FPS FG) it start to feel ok but u still end up with latency of 40 real FPS

The fact that FSR 3.1 doesn't even try to AA the image before upscaling makes me wonder how all the upscalers compare in their native AA modes. I'd be very interested to see that type of comparison seeing as some folks out there have GPUs capable of maxing out settings at their monitor's resolution and/or refresh rate.

Can someone clarify a thing or two about DLSS reconstruction: Does a game dev need to setup the motion vectors availability into the game engine or does nvidia tech manages to calculate them based on previous frames ? In other words, does a developer need to think of the dlss implementation in the early stages of game development, otherwise dlss may not be possible ? (ex: Helldivers 2)

@gametime4316

24 күн бұрын

that information is already part of the engine, it is based on the information that TAA needs. so if game have TAA implementing DLSS/XESS/FSR is not a that of a big deal.

It seems that FSR has a big hurdle to compete with the other reconstruction techniques. By my eye, it appears that once an object is occluded, FSR no longer remembers where it was before it was occluded, whereas DLSS and XeSS do. However, it seems that FSR also does a poor job at reconstructing detail from motion vectors in general. While it's able to move previous pixels to their new location, the way it then samples those pixels together to generate the final resolve is quite poor, with the resulting image showing much more of the raw pixelation you would see before the final upscaling of those samples in the other techniques. Even if they just did the motion blur step AFTER the FSR step, it would look a million times better than it does here, but they need to have some form of recognizing the colors and borders of objects to reconstruct the samples together in a better way. Even without AI, you can produce a much better sampling than FSR is doing here.

Very nice comparisons. I wonder how TAA compares with FSR. Is it more stable or causes even more flickering issues

@MLWJ1993

24 күн бұрын

Likely more ghosty since TAA strives to use as little resources as possible as a post process AA. However with increased compute resources thrown at it EPICs TSR is what you'd end up with.

This was a great sales pitch for high end videos cards showing how much better super sampling it, I don't want to settle for less.

I'm honestly impressed that the "newcomer" XeSS holds up against DLSS so well and leaves FSR behind by a pretty big margin. How did Intel pull that one off?

@gametime4316

24 күн бұрын

they use the generation of upscaling and same techniques... its only AMD that is stubborn and try to use non ML upscaling, and the longer they do the deeper the hole will be i.e more games will be released with the old FSR and wont have support for ML FSR when it will finally come out.

@srn7254

24 күн бұрын

different technique coupled with an access to metric f***ton of computing power necessary to train deep learning models like that - same reason Microsoft's Auto SR is turning out quite good. a better question would be how Epic managed to vastly outdo FSR with its TSR though, given that it doesn't rely on AI at all.

Native FSR3.1 as anti aliasin g is really great. It's heavy, but millions times better than the bad TAA in Ghost of Thushima. Much more stability and sharpness. It's my preferred way to play, especially since in at 1080p and quality FSR is too low res for that resolution.

What does 4x super sampling mean exactly? At 1440p What’s the performance impact of using it instead of DLSS, XeSS and FSR? It looks the best by far.

if intel ever gets to a point where they're dropping equivalent higher power GPUs as the Radeon cards then I think AMD might be in trouble

@gametime4316

24 күн бұрын

both RDNA 4 and intel battlemage will peak at around RTX4080 performance and if intel have the better upscaler and good drivers AMD will be in serious problems, but the vast majority of people will just buy 5070 that will be around the same performance as well.

I really do wish someone as thorough as @alex would do and an in depth of DLSS being used with FSR3 framegen and the image quality difference, how and when in the process the DLSS in used in relation to the interpolation. Also how that works with the Uniscaler mod from LukeFZ as in the config folder for that you can change the upscaler used for the fsr3 framgen algorythm. I'd love to know more about how this cross use of tech works. :)

Surprised that.fsr actually is removing things like confetti and particles..literally stripping detail right out of the game. Didnt know it was this bad.

Well said and well demonstrated!

FSR is still 4 years behind DLSS it seems

@OmnianMIU

20 күн бұрын

No. DLSS never has this trash pixelation, even on very first versions like 2.1

Seems the disoclusion fizzle is not improved at all when they specifically mentioned it as an area of major improvement?

7:36 ... The shiny things disappeared in DLSS 3.7 and FSR balanced but is present in XESS quality

@NANOTECHYT

25 күн бұрын

If you go frame by frame, you can see the particle animation is different every time, the animation doesn't do the same thing every time you run this scene in the game. Look at the 4X Supersampled one for instance which is the crispest image, it's different to XeSS or FSR or DLSS ones because of the particle animation being unique every time. You can run this scene 10 times with XeSS and no settings changed and each pass would look slightly different to the last. What you can see is that yes FSR has less quality because certain elements of the animation are missing at points like the horizontal lines being wayyy thinner, but XeSS and DLSS are pretty comparable to each other and DLSS is the closest to 4x Supersampling. No technique is perfect out of the three, but DLSS is the closest and tends to hold the most detail.

Does anyone know if it's possible to replace a dll or something to update FSR like it is with DLSS and if it is possible is there a program like DLSS swapper but for FSR?

@TheTaurus104

25 күн бұрын

No need for a Swapper.

@santiagoescobarortiz202

25 күн бұрын

As far as I know you'll be able to do it for future versions after 3.1, but you can't replace a dll to update from versions bellow 3.1.

Is there a reason we didn't see quality mode a single time...?

Glad to see my favourite game Ratchet and Clank getting so much attention on the channel for pushing new technologies!

Thank you DF!

I'm not going back to AMD GPUs anytime soon, but I like how they offer their upscaling technology to everybody

@cromefire_

25 күн бұрын

Once their rumored ML based version is released (maybe with the next gen or so?) that might change at least a bit, I'd think they'd do it similarly to Intel, where their competition (and maybe even some of their older GPUs, especially RDNA2 and lower) get a lesser version.

@no1DdC

25 күн бұрын

To be fair, so does evil Intel.

@RickySao

25 күн бұрын

@@no1DdC Intel can't even manage to be evil anymore with their upcoming CPUs 😅😅😅

@jeofthevirtuoussand

25 күн бұрын

if you realy did care for that sort of stuff , you would have got an amd gpu No need to justify your prushase of an nvidia or intel gpu, the quality of an upscaler is simply too important these days , especially at lower resolutions, meaning that can you can get more from the gpu a little longer ,😅

@RickySao

25 күн бұрын

@@jeofthevirtuoussand I had a Radeon 5700 since 2019, dealt with many issues, lately upgraded to a RTX 3070 for dirts and the difference is night and day. I'm sure the newer AMD GPUs are way better than it was but, I can't with their drivers anymore...

This tech is available for current gen consoles ?

Always great to see Ratchet & Clank in greater fidelity than ever.

Insane how the confetti dissapears

Shoutout to the Glover music!

Image stability is the biggest thing FSR needs to improve on. Flickering can get really distracting, especially if it's something high contrast like light reflections on a dark surface.

@Ray-dl5mp

24 күн бұрын

Yuppers. If they fix that, I don’t think most gamers would care about other details. But that sticks out like a sore thumb.

I think TSR works that well without ML because it's deeply integrated into the engine. Maybe it is not possible to do the same thing in a generic way as FSR does.

Might be nice to see the PS5 version as well in the comparison, because when I play on the PS5 it looks great but its not using FSR correct? How does the PS5 version look so good and stable. Chances are im not looking as close as you guys but would be a nice comparison. Good work as always btw.

Any performance difference?

I have been using FSR 2 in cyberpunk to scale to 4k and it only really seems to struggle with foliage compared to native TAA. If it continues to improve, FSR 3 is going to be a strong competitor to blurry TAA implementations as it resolves pretty sharp at 4k

@12coco100

25 күн бұрын

FSR in Cyberpunk is good, you don't see the blocky pixels like the video shows in Rachet and Clank. Using a sharpening slider fixes the blurry look fsr can have. There's still changes cdpr can do outside of fsr to fix the pixel crawling in the game. There's a mip map mod thats supposed to clean up decals on the road and in the distance.

@lordfunkatron9732

25 күн бұрын

@@12coco100 FSR main issue is it looks bad at lower resolutions, all modern upscalers at 4k are doing pretty well these days and vastly outperforming old blurry TAA. It's a shame it gets kinda a bad name because devs are pushing it too far

@12coco100

24 күн бұрын

@@lordfunkatron9732 Exactly, I saw Vexs video and he was using 1440p performance mode for comparisons and didn't find much improvements over FSR 2.2. But when you watch other videos of 1440p quality or 4K testing, you see that FSR in a few instances gets close or matches DLSS. You could see in places FSR match can DLSS in this video too.

does FSR save more resources than DLSS? or is it worse on every axis?

Uh! you use AVI as intermediate format? I thought that was well in the past!

The AMD FSR 3 frame generation in Spider-Man and Ratchet & Clank is fantastic! It’s nice and smooth, unlike the very stuttery frame gen for me in Avatar FOP. Starfield frame gen is also buttery smooth.

@Angel7black

25 күн бұрын

Its still pixelated and shimmery as hell though. It needs AI reconstruction. They’ve been stubborn as hell with it. It was meant to be a boxcheck and a way to get credit for giving upscaling to everybody while waiting for DLSS to prove to be a gimmick and die. That hasnt happened and Upscaling is becoming more and more important as these games launch unoptimized as hell and cards get older and stuck on lower resolutions. DLSS and XeSS are real selling points and AMD still refuses to acknowledge that flaw in their cards and just pretend they have something equivalent. KZread fanboy comments can cope about how theyre basically equivalent now but every single normal person is just gonna try FSR for a few minutes and think “UGH” whenever they use it at 1440p or 1080p. Even at 4K its pretty mid

@nintendoconvert4045

24 күн бұрын

@@Angel7black I’m not using the upscaler- just the frame generation. And with FSR 3.1, you can use other upscalers with frame gen if you wish.

I may of missed this ..but why isn't super sampling used more often ..? looked by far the best image on my 65in tv

@JDelwynn

25 күн бұрын

Because it takes a lot of power. If you're on a weaker system, supersampling is rarely worth it to get decent framerates.

@Okusar

25 күн бұрын

Super sampling is expensive. Rather than taking a lower resolution image and upsampling to a higher resolution, you're instead taking a higher res image and scaling it down. Running 2× super sampling at 4K, for example, is scaling down from 8K internally. The goal of upscaling is generally to improve performance without sacrificing image quality; super sampling improves image quality but often at a big cost to performance.

@jorge69696

24 күн бұрын

1440p SSAA here was basically running at 5K.

12:34 I think the FSR 2.2 Kick looks waay cooler, way more menacing, i mean the kick desintegrated the character to atoms, he kicked the pixels away from his face.

i find the FSR AA has bad smearing in HFW

Can you guys do a video on First Descendent please whenever you get the chance.

why not use fsr or dlss in quality or native ??

damn this game super sampled is so damn good looking

I wonder if there is a room for noticable improvement to DLSS in its current state. And if yes, would Nvidia be willing to give it to the current gpus and not gatekeep it for 50xx series. Btw I more often than not hear people recommend using amd's fg even on nvidia card because it gives more fps and eats less vram. It would be nice of them to give an FG update for their 8 gigs cards, considering rumored 8gb 5060. It would be hilarious if they will gatekeep that for 50xx series though

9:35 FSR 3.1 also loses the transparency of the sign above the character. Taking on an opaque look, where the lines than run through the sign are blown out and it just takes on a solid, brighter color. Its weird, almost looks like extra gamma applied since you can't see the detail, or that cool strobing CRT look. Totally lost in the sauce.

I purpose grading the different upscaling techniques using a scale that goes from upscaled original TAA to supersampling with whatever range you want to pick. Just saying one is better than another is loosing how close or far these technologies actually are to one another.

Why does games like NFS unbound have the latest FSR but yet other older games have it even though they're older titles 😅 if I were to mod it in then I'm stuck playing offline mode

Alex you are a gentleman and a scholar. A man’s man.

THANK YOU FOR TESTING 1440p BALANCED I think most people will be using Quality mode anyway, but still. Not using 4K as a base is a HUGE WIN for common sense

“It was a tick better than it was before” that’s exactly what was shown in the comparisons. The improvements, in terms of image quality, are minuscule. Glad Alex made this video. But I wish the video focused on frame generation instead.

There's basically no visible confetti in fsr it looks so bad comapre to ssao

14:00 FSR 3.3 ???

Really is interesting. I saw a loooot of AMD fanboys talking about how FSR 3.0 was going to stomp DLSS let alone XeSS so it's very interesting to see the new kid on the block XeSS beat out FSR 3.1 in a looooot of areas. I'm starting to think that FSR has some fundamental processes that just don't work well when compared to other techniques.

@Lanen8210

24 күн бұрын

because its not using ai

I guess the positive thing about using an AMD card is that it will be fast even without 3.1. just turn that shit off and do normal 4K kids

I’m glad all of these upscaling and frame generation techniques are being implemented and improved over time, but I still can’t help but feel like at least with fsr it has been a step back in terms of image quality in an attempt to have higher granular detail. When I go back and play games like Skyrim or doom 2016 the overall image may not be quite as detailed as more recent games but image stability is practically perfect. No pixel crawl, no fizzling textures or shadows. It just seems like developers had image stability figured out before the introduction of image reconstruction, and I don’t find the increase in overall detail to be THAT significant most of the time. Personally I’d be okay with slightly less detailed visuals if it meant no distracting visual noise.

@LutraLovegood

23 күн бұрын

Skyrim came out over a decade ago though

This was a great video explaining the new FSR 3.1 tech, and I think Alex nailed it. The confetti in the side-by-side shots was clearly the star of the show here, because FSR v3.1 just looked terrible when compared to Nvidia's DLSS and XeSS. The confetti has absolutely no shape to them and just looks like colored particles in the wind. Also the sign above the robots head was the icing on the cake. I'm not sure how much further AMD can enhance their FSR technique. Sure, it's a great piece of tech that has its place, but we have seen time-and-time again that AMD is struggling. Whenever we see a new FSR update, it is never a substantial update that knocks our socks off. So, I doubt that this AMD FSR reconstruction system will ever succeed. AMD should try something brand new than wasting their time tweaking it. Windows Auto SR looks to be doing a much better job with it's new upscaling compared to FSR, and Microsoft just launched it. We will have to wait and see what AMD decides to do. AMD can do better, they know they can do better, so it's time for them to do better. I am not completely trying to crap on AMD, since I think competition is healthy. Most gamers look at something and may call it trash, but that doesn't mean gamers want to see a company fail. I would like to purchase an AMD graphics card, since they are much more affordable over Nvidia's GPUs, but I just can't make the switch until I see AMD take image quality upscaling much more seriously. Again, excellent video as always Digital Foundry. This tech is so fascinating to me.

Digital foundry always has the best image quality analysis hands down. I never make my mind up on a new upscaler before I see Digital Foundry's video. Who would've thought that SSAO would appear under sampled in one version compared to the other? No other outlet is going to pick up on that.

I just can’t stand the shimmering and flickering. I haven’t tried FSR but it’s the same with DLSS. I’d rather just have a lower frame rate. Although looking at your comparisons in this video, DLSS looks allot better than when I tried it in Cyberpunk. It was really bad.

Every time I play a game where I don't have another option other than FSR...I usually just go with no upscaling and suck up the massive performance loss, lock to a solid 60 FPS, and enjoy a sharp image. In stills and slow motion, it's very obvious what the problems with FSR are, but in terms of real gameplay...I liken it to some of the Samsung G-Series monitors, they have this ridiculously pronounced anti-glare material that literally makes it look like there's film grain by default. That's what FSR is like in gameplay, like there's some kind of substance stuck inside my monitor, sloshing around as the picture moves, but it can't quite keep up.

i dont understand why are you awlays comparing dpa4 xeess rather than xmx

@gametime4316

24 күн бұрын

because he can use 1 nvidia GPU do do all 3

@mertcanerdem3390

24 күн бұрын

@@gametime4316 why would i care about xess on nvida if i jave nvida gpu i would use dlss if they are not nvdia shills(they are nvida shills) they would show xmx performance rather than sitting in their asses using the same gpu without chaning

If you've got the headroom to supersample, why use upscaling tech at all?

@techsamurai11

23 күн бұрын

Most games don't have the headroom to supersample. In demanding games, even the 4090 struggles. Also, the ideal way to run a game is to maximize settings at 1080p-1800p depending on the card and then upscale to get the best visuals and performance. 4k has 4 times the pixels of 1080p so it's extremely expensive to render natively and the better the graphics, the more expensive.

@CorePixels

23 күн бұрын

@@techsamurai11 I know all of that, but that doesn't answer my question.

@techsamurai11

23 күн бұрын

you would not use upscaling technologies. If you have a 5090 that can run Alan Wake 2 at 4k with max settings at your desired frame rate (say 240fps) after supersampling, you would run it without upscaling. That's why some old games run at 4k on current consoles as they have the headroom to render it at 4k.

You guys should compare FSR native, DLAA, and native TAA.