several of the designers were pro-British and played British a LOT. The reason we were forced to remove the minimum range on longbowmen was the result of a couple playtests in which melee-armed units got in close on groups of longbowmen and massacred them while they tried to re-position themselves to shoot. The pro-British designers basically went on strike till me and the Sheriff removed the minimum range. We did sneak in some other nerfs on Britons to try to make up for this boost.

@FloosWorld_AoE

Жыл бұрын

What kind of nerfs did you sneak in?

@MrFacu809

Жыл бұрын

The man, the myth, the legend himself

@dj_koen1265

Жыл бұрын

Goated comment tbh

@Nazuiko

Жыл бұрын

I saw the "we" and went "huh?" The man Sandy Petersen HIMSELF commenting? Congrats Spirit, and thank you for the insight.

@sandypetersen6935

Жыл бұрын

@@FloosWorld_AoE It's been over two decades. I can't remember all of them. I know we fiddled with price and hit points. But kept them long range.

*Notes 1) 1:34 The Chu Ko Nu having +0 against buildings isn't actually strange at all. It's been pointed out to me that ALL archers have +0 to make the Saracen team bonus work. 2) 5:40 The graph for 2400+ elo should say 2nd, not 1st. They jump around between #4 and #1 depending on the time frame you look at, but the overall pattern holds in any time period.

@dieblauebedrohung

Жыл бұрын

the Moment you were talking about the +0 Damage Hidden Bonus I scrolled down, and I found exactly what I assumed I'd find :D

@sergeykwk4761

Жыл бұрын

Pin this comment pls.

@achaean4780

Жыл бұрын

Same as knights +0 against archers for the persian bonus, I was equally surprised the first time I played around with the genie editor

@ggmr399

Жыл бұрын

Where is bengalis Overview

@Alexplainow

Жыл бұрын

I would love to see Chinese gets revamp like Indians. We know during the AoE2 time fram there are multiple Dynasties that some co-existed as shown in the Genghis Khan campaign. There is also Ming Dynasty that defeat the Mongols and appear in Korea campaign, and they are famous for gun powder and Navy.

I'd like to see the Conquerors civs too

@Ahmed_Malrogi.750

Жыл бұрын

Video was released 33 mins ago, how ur comment is 20 hrs ago ?

@CatafrascosDeElite

Жыл бұрын

@@Ahmed_Malrogi.750 pre-release for supporters maybe?

@1988rastafari

Жыл бұрын

He did mayans and aztec before iirc

@HazmanFTW

Жыл бұрын

@@Ahmed_Malrogi.750 Patreon supporters get early access

@TheNjahNjahNjah

Жыл бұрын

Yes plzzzz

When I said it was a "major screw to have 6 villagers" I meant that it was a colossal advantage to the Chinese. Honest.

@yewchoobes

Жыл бұрын

ah major screw to the opponents as in

we were always running kind of scared watching the Chinese in Age 2 because the Shang in Age 1 had been so unbalanced at top levels of play. We tried to fix them with the Conquerors and I think partly succeeded.

@darthteej1

Жыл бұрын

dude thank you for sharing all these insights!!!

The Britons were my first love when I played aoe2 as a kid, and the Chinese are my wife's favorite civilization to play now! Couldn't ask for a better pairing for this episode.

@edwardblom2661

Жыл бұрын

Your wife’s 2400+?

@Lonezewolflonewolf

Жыл бұрын

I used to love Britons, till I encountered the ongers, after that, I've swapped to a more diverse playstyle.

@gherlwinfireson8582

Жыл бұрын

When I had only the demo version of AoK, the fun was to convert as many longbowmans as possible in the William Wallace campaign 🤩 Then with the full version I loved the Chinese castle

@robbylava

Жыл бұрын

@@edwardblom2661 IQ? Probably! ELO? She's cardboard tier lmao

@robbylava

Жыл бұрын

@@gherlwinfireson8582 Holy shit dude, I LOVED the East Asian castle as a kid. I used to call it a "hotel" because it didn't look like any castle I'd ever seen before, and I was always so jealous that I couldn't build one as the Britons... could've just changed civs, of course, but kids are kids.

You’re a man of the people SOTL. Too many people focus only on the high level plays/players. Love that you take everyone into account ❤

@jamaly77

Жыл бұрын

Which is also why I like AoE II and dislike AoE IV. It offers very little for us casuals and seems like it was made for the few people playing it competitively..

Don’t forget the Chu Ko Nu’s buff thanks to DE changing how bonus damage works for garrisoned archers. One of the most, if not _the_ most, dangerous garrison unit in the game.

@solorollo9756

Жыл бұрын

When I play michi, I always tell my teammates to make bombard towers 😆 They almost never do btw 😔

@bristleback3614

Жыл бұрын

but its historically acurate since chukonus usually used for defensive weapon, when on offensive they prefer a traditional bows

@SkreltNL

Жыл бұрын

China buying the world and its showing in AoE2

Pretty sure I watch almost every video of yours when it comes out despite not having played AoE 2 for four years and not planning to even remotely get into it. So in that sense, excellent job being both knowledgable and extremely entertaining

@Achilles75

Жыл бұрын

What happened that u lost interest in the game? Or is it some other reason that had to do with life and not related to aoe

@darthjump

Жыл бұрын

Play it!

@voidgods

Жыл бұрын

@@Achilles75 if I can use my own experience, the more I know about the game the better I expect to play, but it also means I get more frustrated by my own mistakes. It's that weird spot between "I'm not good enough that I can confidently play competitively the way I wanted to but I'm not bad enough to have fun in casual games stomping actual casual players". Yeah I know that both these cases are caused by my own mentality but between life, other games and the commitment that a complex game like AoE requires, I'd rather just watch it. I do get on and off every few years though so not ruling out playing it again soon

@l.o.b.2433

Жыл бұрын

@@Achilles75 I just never was very into it to begin with. Played a couple of rounds with a friend against the AI

@Achilles75

Жыл бұрын

@@l.o.b.2433 Huh i see so u have very little knowledge about the game?But u watch Sotl extensively?

Was there ever any doubt we wanted you to continue this series into every expansion in the game? At this point, we are more than fans. We're addicts and we need our SOTL fix NOW!!!

Cannot wait for the conquerors &etc civs, love the series as a commentary /data point on game design.

I played Age 2 back in the early 2000s as a teenager and just came back to it a few years ago in HD and then DE. This video showed me how much influence the community really had on the game over the years. I am glad it´s still going strong and getting better even still.

Ah, that closing clip of the HD longbows being systematically mowed down by the siege onagers while the paladins pile in amongst the maze of fortified walls is like seeing an old friend again that I haven't seen for a very long time! :D

It may be strange, but to me you are like the Bob Ross of AOE. It's just so much pleasure on hearing your voice 😆

@martijn9568

Жыл бұрын

You should then check out his original civ overview for the Mongols.

It's really wild looking back at the game when it first came out and realizing just how drastically different the meta was back then, and how much the game needed to be rebalanced again and again to have what we have today

love this series so I´m very happy to hear you´ve started on the next ones! always great content

Yes, would love to see the conquerors! Also the history series is one of my favorites, hope there's another one of those in the near future!

Yes! Please continue this series. I think a major and very important change for archer civs was adding the helbadier. What I (Elo 800) also struggle with Chinese are camels. Somehow they do not work out well. Additionally, Chinese seems to be too open and after teching in to many awesome option, missing ress for units kills me.

Make a Through The Ages video on the Dravidians. I wanna see how they changed in the decades they’ve been out.

@krankarvolund7771

Жыл бұрын

In today's video, I travelled to 2042 to study the game future twenty years and give you an evolution of the Dravidians.

Keep the series "Through the Ages" going! really like it! Thanks SotL. Always awesome work!

I really expect the Conquerors civs. I think Koreans deserve a video specially for them considering they had the most broken development cycle in the history of the game.

I just rewatched this series, and still thoroughly enjoyed it. Thank you for the research and documenting the game’s history

Interest in the series is had. Please continue.

Yes, finally the Britons! Please continue the series, Spirit!

I love this Series, so happy to see this in my Feed today

Pls continue the series i love it and it takes me back to being a young kid playing against the AI not really knowing what the hell im doing

Love yours videos and dedication to it!! ❤️

Koreans would be a nice civ to take a look at, their old onagers were insane

@nemou4985

Жыл бұрын

I weep about the range nerf every day, siege onagers actually being able to SIEGE castles with like +3 total range is what made it unique... we don't even have any equivalent.

Ironically the chu ko nu is a niche weapon in China used by palace boys and women for self defence and rely on poison. Their one shot crossbows are some of the best but underlooked

@yamao4938

2 ай бұрын

Its low draw power makes for a self defense or hunting weapon. Militarily speaking, it's effective to a certain degree against very lightly armored targets

@HistoricalWeapons

2 ай бұрын

@@yamao4938 hunting isn’t really allowed for peasants so it was a niche military weapon for specific senarios or self defence PDW

I absolutely love these videos and would love to see them through all the civs up to the current expansions even.

Love this series! Cheers!

Yay, the next episode of my favourite series!

Yaay! Was looking forward to it. Please continue with the Conquerors civs, it's very interesting! (And maybe Forgotten after?)

@krankarvolund7771

Жыл бұрын

He already did two of them, the meso-american civs, so I guess he'll continue ^^

I think I'd say the Chinese also got an interesting indirect change over the years, at least in terms of the styles of civs. For a long time, Chinese were basically the only civ with a very weird opening. Huns were similar, but for low ELO players the house bonus doesn't really impact your skill. But now, there are a bunch of civs with similarly strange starts - Cumans, Gurjaras, Poles are all significantly different, the Meso civs have the huge difference of no stable, etc. So the Chinese went from being the only weird start, to one of a handful.

Really enjoy this series. Release the Conquerors!

Great video as always.

There is no joy like watching maxxed Imperial Age Chu Ko Nu or Longbows rain mass arrows on the enemy town.

Keep going with all the expansions' civs. The content is worth it

I love when you make a lot of videos

+1 supporter to continue this series

You completed Age of kings. I have been waiting for long

I would love to more man, don't stop!

I really like the series and would love to see The Conquerors covered in full as well.

A Sunday with a SOTL video upload? Nice

Finally! Thank you so much!

_SotL_ videos, gotta love them. Also, I really wished I could have that outro track as my in-game music for playing AoE.

Keep it coming!!

this is the video like i always want when i was young but never had

Very nice series

Please keep this serries going!

Please do the conquerors! this was so cool to see the changes over the years! and as someone who grew up on AOE2 I love seeing how the old civs used to be!

Please continue the series ! :D

@kristianlykke

Жыл бұрын

Have I won a give away?? Where to contact??

@nemou4985

Жыл бұрын

@@kristianlykke Nothing, ignore the bot

Some time in DLC the chinese and teutons swapped some of their TC bonuses. Chinese gained the Teuton +5 LoS, while Teutons gained +10 garrison space.

Thank you!

Crossbow and arbalest upgrades being more expensive hurts a lot in 1v1s with archer civ vs cav civ ( in low elo ). The meta is FC into knight or FC into boom into knight, and it's so much harder to actually do damage in castle age, where you have to prioritize techs more, and essentially just taking worse fights overall.

The longbowmen are in an interesting position as unique unit because in AoK the game was really designed to where unique units are powerhouse units. But the longbow wasn't really the best ranged weapon available individually; they were more like the AK-47's of the medieval world in that they are relatively cheap and easy to make but very reliable, easy to repair and maintain, and close enough in power to more expensive weapons. The drawback (pun intended) is the strength required to use them. Which is why the English forced their civilians to train with bows and outlawed other sports. So yeah, realistically they should be cheaper to produce and slightly weaker than arbalesters, but with a longer training time.

@EMCF_

11 ай бұрын

Longbows were not like Ak47s. The required a lifetime of training to use effectively. They were also made from wood that became rare in England (yew) which made them difficult to make. The advantage of crossbows is you could use them effectively with little training. Sort of like an Ak47, if that helps you.

@Lightning_Lance

11 ай бұрын

@@EMCF_ I was comparing them to other bows not crossbows. Crossbowmen being the upgrade to bowmen instead of another unit type is also a bit weird in AOE 2, that throws a wrench in my comparison I suppose. What I meant is that compared to composite recurve bows, longbows were more reliable and easy repair / restring / keep dry but not easier to use as it requires more strength for roughly the same results. I didn't know about the wood type becoming rare, I suppose they would have stopped using them eventually when that's an issue.

As a Chinese, I can confirm that once we move to a new area and build a town center we get 3 new people popping out of it. That’s how we became the most populous country.👌

Keep it going.

go go go you do amazing

For the conqurors version, can you go through Koreans with their OG 12 range onagers

yes yes please keep the serious going

Britons did not use thumb ring historically

YAAAAAAAS MORE!!!!!!!!

wait, Sandy Petersen? The same that designed all the Call of Cthulhu RPG books also was an AoE game designer? Wild

@PhotonTrooperGaming

Жыл бұрын

He did some interviews to another channel regarding his experience with aoe design. Pretty nice to hear him!

@FloosWorld_AoE

Жыл бұрын

He also was involved in Doom 1 and 2 as well as Quake

When I was young I would pretty much only play Britons because I was British but also because longbows man

Kepp it going

Yes, there is interest!

Back in the day Britons were my boys and I still love them!

Thank you. These are always super interesting. I know a still image of a black and white print out isn't super dynamic, but the floating tech tree with the gameplay in the background makes me dizzy

7:11 Hey mom I made it to a SotL video! :O

As expected, their archer units are still a bane on civs fighting against them. Also a blessing on civs fighting with them.

Yes, there is interest! Please make the AoC civs!

TCs costing only around 125 wood must've been crazy, on maps like black forest they would be unbeatable with this possible boom

I love these videos! It's fun to be reminded of where civs were at when the game came out, and it's really a testament to how well designed the AoK civs were that they haven't really fundamentally changed.

I used to play a lot Aoe 2 when I was a kid and did it through my teen years but it was 99 version and I had no idea about the expansion! Until HD version came out! XD

Please do continue

Age of Kings civs revised: Check The Conquerors civs revised: Aztecs and Mayans I wonder which civ(s) will be revised in the series if it's continued. Overall, it's still a good work. I liked it very much.

@PhotonTrooperGaming

Жыл бұрын

Huns would be a cool one

Can't wait for the Conquerors' civs, especially the Spanish and the Huns

I would love to see this expanded to AoC civs.

Honestly, I think minimum range on Longbowmen is a pretty good idea, and it would match their historical reality of needing defenses to keep cavalry away in order to be effective.

@pax6833

Жыл бұрын

Longbowmen already are a mediocre UU so there is no need to nerf them more.

@micahbush5397

Жыл бұрын

@@pax6833 Maybe they could also be given the ability to build palisade walls to compensate?

Why did you even bother asking if we want more? Go for it! :D

When I was a kid, the Chu Ko Nu was generally considered among my peers to be the best unit in the game, and the reason why Chinese was the best civilization. Only the Britons with their Longbowmen were in the same league. Then I discovered the Huns, and proceeded to wipe the floor with the others for one glorious summer with my combined knights and cavalry archers.

I hope to see you all in another 24-25 years, hope the game's still alive then 🤣

great 🙂

Hey guys, Spirit of the Time travel here

Finally

I love going Britons and trying my "you can't touch me" strategy 50 longbows fully upgraded 2 monks 8 Trebuchets Units can't get to the trebuchets Buildings can't take down archers Monks heal any light damage inflicted. Repeat build order as many times as you can depending on population.

I would suggest that Chinese have their resource nerf lessened and that they start with fewer villagers, maybe more like 1 villager to start. But would gain two extra villagers at each age. This means they are less technically challenging to start with, wouldn't be terrible or OP on nomad, but still maintain the character of the civ. They could also buff Great Wall tech by reducing stone cost, making it more viable to turtle in castle age. Perhaps the tech could also increase wall building speed.

When you're that single sub 800 Elo person that doesn't suck playing Chinese.😅

I miss those china nomad years. 😢 instant domination and best feeling when randoming into them

First time hearing about a planned minimum range for Longbows!

I think this series could go as far as the tail end of HD edition tbh so you could go to Rise of the Rajas and stop there. Though I think at that point you'd have to lump all the new civs in one video to make it worth while.

Franks/Britons/Genoa/SiciliansPortuguese Crusader (Kite shield+Nasal helm + chainmail) sword and spear infantry,Knights,crossbows, monk, Trebuchet civs. (Britons - Longbow archer skins) Add some more special units to represent the knightly,chivalric Crusader orders , such as a Templar knight or a Hospitaller knight to the Franks/British/Italian/Sicilians , Templar having the option to convert 1 unit for every charge up and the Hospitaller having the option to heal 1 unit for every charge up. Templar and Hospitaller knights do extremely little damage to enemy villagers (Right clicking on an enemy villager will either convert the villager (Templar) or heal the villager (Hospitalar) but they gain a +2 attack boost + 25% HP(Or conversion resistance) when within LOS of a Relic or friendly church containing one or more relics..Gains attributes from all monastery techs except Redemption: Templar + Hospitallers are very weak to siege damage. Genoa - Only Hospitalars Franks/Britons/Sicilians - Both Hospitalars & Templars Portuguese - Only Templars Or perhaps add these as technologies that can be researched in the Church 'Templar Order' & 'Hospitaller order' that will grant the already existing knights of the British/Franks/Italians/Sicilians/Portuguese these abilities. (Portuguese only gain access to Templars (Ordem dos Cavaleiros de Cristo)) Messo/SA civs do bonus damage to Templars/Hospitilars so you don’t want to make them when fighting in the New World. Hospitallar skin sketchfab.com/3d-models/knight-hospitaller-game-ready-character-animated-31333109719e4457b2052f8b2feb435f drive.google.com/file/d/1w5KGwMdhM6CxTBHLOhELgrr4PCk4F07N/view?usp=share_link Templar skin drive.google.com/file/d/1waT5xjY2vvMSN7RrTcOpub-8PvmGb4s2/view?usp=share_link drive.google.com/file/d/1FRo0mECvqtnh9Kch42whad-vsQpsKKZ-/view?usp=share_link The Ayyubids allowed Baldwin IV of Jerusalem to enter Ascalon with his Gaza-based Knights Templar without taking any precautions against a sudden attack. Although the Crusader force consisted of only 375 knights, Saladin hesitated to ambush them because of the presence of highly skilled generals. Saladin and his men were surprised near Ramla in the battle of Montgisard (possibly at Gezer, also known as Tell Jezar). Before they could form up, the Templar force decimated the Ayyubid army. Initially, Saladin attempted to organise his men into battle order, but as his bodyguards were being killed, he saw that defeat was inevitable and so with a small remnant of his troops mounted a swift camel, riding all the way to the territories of Egypt. Islamic civs In turn the Islamic civs:Saracens,Kurds, Turks, Tartars,Afghans, can receive a tech in the mosque called: Jizya tax, for every knightly unit they convert, you receive 10gold in castle age and 20gold in imperial age. Mediterranean Pirates: Saracens,Kurds,Berbers,Turks: Warships Destroying a full trade cog allows the gold to be looted and added to your stockpile. Saracens ‘’Counterweights’’ tech gets replaced by a new tech; Arabian horses +10% cavalry speed. (Cavalry not Camelry)

Chinese and Britons; the 2 civs that had to sacrifice historical accuracy for game balance. XD

Chinese were also considered not so great in the past because of how map scripts worked. The starting 4 sheep used to spawn much further away and not even in vision of TC, so chinese used to perform much worse leading to other civs like azt, maya and huns being prefered.

3:58 according to the subtitles chinese apparently start with 6 billion villagers

Am I the only one who thiks the original graphics look better than the modern ones. I like the snappyness of the movement.

Looks like you can start on the conquerors civs now ;)

'Which I havee started already' It sounds to me like you follow the spirit of the law more than the lett-OOOOOOOOHHH!

Definitely do the conquerors civs