Dear "Ordinary Catholic", You really should have researched Cardinal Zen before you attacked him. He is a "white martyr" for all the suffering he has endured to protect not only Chinese Catholics from the Chinese Communist Party. He is a global Catholic hero who has devoted himself entirely to the good of the Church, and is held in the greatest esteem.

@OrdinaryCatholic1

Ай бұрын

@@richardbohler8980 I didn't attack anyone, I just think it's odd. We all should.

@BronxCat

Ай бұрын

Stay out of it, you're a woman. Stay in your place.

@OrdinaryCatholic1

Ай бұрын

​@@BronxCat I'm actually in a great place... speaking with concern.

@jamesottman6559

Ай бұрын

So what? Doesn't mean he can't be prideful or make mistakes.

@valwhelan3533

Ай бұрын

@@jamesottman6559 Exactly!

Lofton started critisizing Cardinal Zen. In public. It is only natural that he got the reprimand he was looking for in public.

It's not that odd. Lofton, with his typical "charity", talked about Cardinal Zen as though he was an idiot and borderline heretic. Lofton did this publicly, so odd that Cardinal Zen would post this on his blog publicly? And the fact that Zen is from Hong Kong is irrelevant. Lofton slandered him and talked nonsense and so Zen did a public service as a pastor of the Church by letting everyone know thay Lofton is a fraud and a grifter and that we shouldn't pay attention to him. Since Zen is doing this as a service to the Church, he obviously needs to make this public. Lofton has long been in need of having his ego checked, and Cardinal Zen's modest zingers weren’t out of place. St. Polycarp didmt hesitate to call Marcion a son of hell, and so Zen's language to Lofton is proportionally justifiable.

@Johnny-pj2fm

Ай бұрын

I didn't know reading from actual church documents and other sources is wrong? That all the guy does, it makes people like you get you panties in a bunch is hilarious. At this point you guys are no different then leftist.

@gerry30

Ай бұрын

@@Johnny-pj2fm Lofton "selectively" chooses what he reads. He constructs a narrative that is more for Ecclesial Lawfare than applicable to the reality that is going on. I can read selectively and more accurately from Church documents and papal statements and point out that Paul VI said the Church post-Council was in a state of auto-demolition, John Paul II, stated at the end of his pontificate his failures in reigning in dissidents and the Church had fallen into a "silent apostasy." You can find numerous citations of Benedict XVI prior to his papacy describing, "crisis in the Church" "collapse of the liturgy" "some councils were a waste of time" "the Novus Ordo is a banal, on the spot product put together by a committee." All of these are statements of reality that the Popes indicated major problems, the Popes essentially did nothing to curb the problems and other clergy stepped up as has happened in history against papal directives. Compare all of that to John XXIII's opening statement for the Council and it's easy to see that Vatican II is an utter failure and it's okay to admit it since the stated goal was presenting the Catholic faith to modern man over half a century ago and not defining anything new. That "Modern Man" of the 1960s is dead and gone for the most part and did not get the faith handed on to him more clearly than before. Consider it a bad idea, implemented badly. Time to move on and resume doing what worked. The ideas of Vatican II belong with the USSR on the ash heap of history.

@ghostapostle7225

Ай бұрын

Agreeing with him or not, Lofton actually gave points of why he thought the Cardinal was wrong. The response was "you're a man with a little beard". I mean, how authistic you need to be to think this is fine?

@Proclivitytolife

Ай бұрын

@@ghostapostle7225 I guess it requires as much "autism" as it does to think that St. Polycarp was justified in calling Marcion a "son of hell". I'm not suggesting that Lofton is a "son of hell", but that it isn't out of place for saintly people to use such expressions when warranted, and as I've said, Lofton has been asking for this for quite some time. Besides, the "big man with a little beard" is one tiny part of what he said. It was just a little zinger, which I suspect possibly makes more sense in Cantonese, and isn't the main message he was conveying. I do have to wonder about anybody focusing on such a little joke yet avoids the main point he was making - which is that Lofton is arrogant and thrives in an environment of ignorance. It isn't to wonder that Lofton, despite spending dozens of hours monologing on Fiducia Supplicans without anyone to offer pushback, refused to invite anyone with a contrary opinion on his show to dialog, and refused invitations to other people shows to dialog. He doesn't want to debate, he doesn't want to discuss. He refuses dialog and insists on monologue. That speaks very loudly about what's going on with him

@Kitiwake

Ай бұрын

​@@Proclivitytolifeso what if Lofton is "arrogant" (your word)? Is he right?

Either the Magisterium is supernaturally protected against error, or it’s not. If it is, we need to conform to it and not second guess every document coming out of Rome. Zen made inaccurate claims about FS that a cursory read through disprove.

I am not convinced attacking the papacy is a particularly traditional Catholic position.

In all honesty, if any Cardinal decided to publicly address me, I would be humbled and I would take the opportunity to retreat into meditative silence and re-examine my life and my choices. Lofton has chosen a much different route.

I literally was replying to another video on a different topic and I quoted Pope St. Pius X. The term "legalized cunning" for the purpose of oppression jumped out on me as the perfect descriptive of Lofton's methodology. From St. Pius X: "We ask Ourselves, Venerable Brethren, what has become of the Catholicism of the Sillon? Alas! this organization which formerly afforded such promising expectations, this limpid and impetuous stream, has been harnessed in its course by the modern enemies of the Church, and is now no more than a miserable affluent of the great movement of apostasy being organized in every country for the establishment of a One-World Church which shall have neither dogmas, nor hierarchy, neither discipline for the mind, nor curb for the passions, and which, under the pretext of freedom and human dignity, would bring back to the world (if such a Church could overcome) the reign of legalized cunning and force, and the oppression of the weak, and of all those who toil and suffer."--- Our Apostolic Mandate.

@a.t.c.3862

Ай бұрын

Are you taking what Joe Zen is taking?

A Cardinal mocking somoneones appearance is odd.

@TheLonestarofTexas

Ай бұрын

I mean not really.

@jaqian

Ай бұрын

Yeah weird comment about the tattoo

@MPFXT

Ай бұрын

Asian culture uses shaming as a form of instruction. People who are wrong about something as serious as homosexual relations that can result in eternity in hell should be ashamed. If you were seriously concerned about souls, then like Cardinal Zen, you would point out the rubber stamp contradiction that the CDF said, "No" the Church may NOT bless same-sex couples, whereas, Cardinal Tucho's heretical Fiducia Supplicans says "Yes" on "the blessing of same-sex couples". BE HONEST! Michael DISHONESTLY claims to stick to the arguments line by line while ignoring the elephant in the room as Cardinal Zen responsibly points out. Looks like you too are in need of a reprimand and should be more concerned with the salvation of souls not gossip & taking sides to the detriment of the Gospel Truth of Jesus Christ.

It is certainly very interesting that Cardinal Zen says that Michael Lofton is, essentially, a moron. He failed to demonstrate a single error, but did insult Michael's appearance. Anyone who has an ounce of honest sense and is being objective looks at that and immediately knows who has an argument and who does not. What Michael Lofton says is also not his own conjecture or his own views, they are views of respected theologians, whom Cardinal Zen did not refute. If the argument is valid, and the premises are true, then you have to accept that the conclusion is also true. If you wish to say that the conclusion is NOT TRUE, then you MUST show that the argument is either not valid (logically), or that there are problems with the premises. This is Introduction to Logic level stuff. Cardinal Zen failed to do this. He resorted to an ad hominem, a logical fallacy, instead. The trads need to reign this in. It's a bad position to hold. It's a losing one. You're turning the ire of God's Church against you. Let go of your pride and ego.

@soldierofmary984

Ай бұрын

They refute by slandering and mocking a person.

@valwhelan3533

Ай бұрын

I notice the ML is a moron theme where no one specifically refutes what he is saying. Calling someone names like popesplainer is not a rational argument.

@TheLonestarofTexas

Ай бұрын

Probably because whenever people who know what they’re talking about do refute and step-by-step go through the errors of Lofton, he blocks them, see Scholastic Answers as an example.

@a.t.c.3862

Ай бұрын

​@adjesumpermariam6515 'The Church and the Pope are wrong, and we the tradestants are right', is a very dangerous premise indeed on which to build your faith - and it is certainly not, in any way, Catholic. Your salvation is at risk.

@MPFXT

Ай бұрын

If you were seriously concerned about souls, then like Cardinal Zen, you would point out the rubber stamp contradiction that the CDF said, "No" the Church may NOT bless same-sex couples, whereas, Cardinal Tucho's heretical Fiducia Supplicans says "Yes" on "the blessing of same-sex couples". BE HONEST! Michael DISHONESTLY claims to stick to the arguments line by line while ignoring the elephant in the room as Cardinal Zen responsibly points out. Looks like you too are in need of a reprimand and should be more concerned with the salvation of souls not gossip & taking sides to the detriment of the Gospel Truth of Jesus Christ.

Michael Lofton is doing great work for the Catholic Church.

@JenniferWilliams-jy7rz

Ай бұрын

Don't be ridiculous!

@Dienekes678

Ай бұрын

Well...somebody has to speak up for the smoke of Satan, I guess?

@khalidNroses

Ай бұрын

@@Dienekes678maybe you ? 🤷🏻‍♂️

@Dienekes678

Ай бұрын

@@khalidNroses do you believe that smoke of Satan has entered the church?

@rayvanee277

Ай бұрын

Nope, he really isn't

Is this a channel that is dedicated to educating Catholics on the True Magisterium of Holy Catholic Church?

@chrisrobinson976

Ай бұрын

No!

@marystanley7373

Ай бұрын

Nothing but a pschobabnle from somebody that is in desperate need of a hobby. You'll learn absolutely nothing here and she's a NO fraud.

@sleepinglioness5754

Ай бұрын

No! It's an uneducated, opinion channel.

VERY odd!!

What seems odd is that you would engage in this kind of gossip from a cemetery. Please pray and think about it.

@OrdinaryCatholic1

Ай бұрын

@@stephenmcguire7342 It's my own grave, I've had since I was 13. My parents purchased 8 double plots (16 total). It's like my chapel, I like to reflect there. Yeah, it's a bit weird, but it keeps me "grounded". And no I'm not gossiping.

@marystanley7373

Ай бұрын

Amen, she's whacked.

@stephenmcguire7342

Ай бұрын

@OrdinaryCatholic1 The Catholic understanding of a cemetery is that it is sacred ground. A place to pray for the souls of the dead, recommending them to God's mercy that all may join the army of the faithful departed. It is not a place we should be visiting for our own sentimental comfort or to indulge in gossip. Which you did. Gossip is determined by God's criteria, not ours. I can not encourage you more on the need for humble prayer on the matter. Please, for the love of God and at the exclusion of self consider doing so.

@OrdinaryCatholic1

Ай бұрын

@@stephenmcguire7342 I can examine my own conscience, I definitely wasn't gossiping. I make that clear in my video . Like I said, it's my own grave... It's not like I'm sitting on someone else's. I know lots of people in this cemetery, it's not a random place.

@stephenmcguire7342

Ай бұрын

@OrdinaryCatholic1 You may have heard what I said, but you literally didn't understand a word of it. May I suggest you purchase a good small catechism, like that written by Pope St. Pius X, and prayfully study what gossip is. God bless, you are in my prayers.

Why would you do if the Holy Father was attacked? Think about it and do better.

@Kitiwake

Ай бұрын

We have a papal champion in Michael Lofton.

yes it does seem very sketchy and beneath a cardinal to engage in that way even if you don't like ML.

@mikazoftstrom2343

Ай бұрын

Unless he feels that what ML is teaching is dangerous.

@matthewschmidt5069

Ай бұрын

​@mikazoftstrom2343 which he's not lol.

@mikazoftstrom2343

Ай бұрын

@@matthewschmidt5069 maybe the cardinal doesn’t think so.

@matthewschmidt5069

Ай бұрын

@@mikazoftstrom2343 The Cardinal has been shown to be wrong, for instance on Fiducia

@enderoctanus

Ай бұрын

@@mikazoftstrom2343 If what ML is teaching is dangerous, he should be able to point out the dangers rather than resort to insults over appearance. Cdl. Zen could not do the former, but did do the latter.

I am appalled to see a Cardinal sinking to such a low level. He resorted to childish insults and ad hominems and did nothing to address the substance of Michael’s arguments. It reminds me of a quote attributed to Socrates: “When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.”

@TheLonestarofTexas

Ай бұрын

🤡

@MPFXT

Ай бұрын

Asian culture uses shaming as a form of instruction. People who are wrong about something as serious as homosexual relations that can result in eternity in hell should be ashamed. If you were seriously concerned about souls, then like Cardinal Zen, you would point out the rubber stamp contradiction that the CDF said, "No" the Church may NOT bless same-sex couples, whereas, Cardinal Tucho's heretical Fiducia Supplicans says "Yes" on "the blessing of same-sex couples". BE HONEST! Michael DISHONESTLY claims to stick to the arguments line by line while ignoring the elephant in the room as Cardinal Zen responsibly points out. Looks like you too are in need of a reprimand and should be more concerned with the salvation of souls not gossip & taking sides to the detriment of the Gospel Truth of Jesus Christ.

@MPFXT

Ай бұрын

Asian culture uses shaming as a form of instruction. People who are wrong about something as serious as homosexual relations that can result in eternity in hell should be ashamed. If you were seriously concerned about souls, then like Cardinal Zen, you would point out the rubber stamp contradiction that the CDF said, "No" the Church may NOT bless same-sex couples, whereas, Cardinal Tucho's heretical Fiducia Supplicans says "Yes" on "the blessing of same-sex couples". BE HONEST! Michael DISHONESTLY claims to stick to the arguments line by line while ignoring the elephant in the room as Cardinal Zen responsibly points out. Looks like you too are in need of a reprimand and should be more concerned with the salvation of souls not gossip & taking sides to the detriment of the Gospel Truth of Jesus Christ.

Whatever were cardinal zen's reasons he is wrong

@MPFXT

Ай бұрын

Asian culture uses shaming as a form of instruction. People who are wrong about something as serious as homosexual relations that can result in eternity in hell should be ashamed. If you were seriously concerned about souls, then like Cardinal Zen, you would point out the rubber stamp contradiction that the CDF said, "No" the Church may NOT bless same-sex couples, whereas, Cardinal Tucho's heretical Fiducia Supplicans says "Yes" on "the blessing of same-sex couples". BE HONEST! Michael DISHONESTLY claims to stick to the arguments line by line while ignoring the elephant in the room as Cardinal Zen responsibly points out. Looks like you too are in need of a reprimand and should be more concerned with the salvation of souls not gossip & taking sides to the detriment of the Gospel Truth of Jesus Christ.

I like everything Michael Lofton says. He is one of the smartest Catholics out there. Listen to him.

From KZread Catholics, deliver me Jesus.

Michael Lofton is doing great work for the Catholic Church.

@concernedcitizen780

Ай бұрын

????

@marystanley7373

Ай бұрын

You're as delusional as the owner of this Chanel. She needs serious mental help.

@MPFXT

Ай бұрын

Asian culture uses shaming as a form of instruction. People who are wrong about something as serious as homosexual relations that can result in eternity in hell should be ashamed. If you were seriously concerned about souls, then like Cardinal Zen, you would point out the rubber stamp contradiction that the CDF said, "No" the Church may NOT bless same-sex couples, whereas, Cardinal Tucho's heretical Fiducia Supplicans says "Yes" on "the blessing of same-sex couples". BE HONEST! Michael DISHONESTLY claims to stick to the arguments line by line while ignoring the elephant in the room as Cardinal Zen responsibly points out. Looks like you too are in need of a reprimand and should be more concerned with the salvation of souls not gossip & taking sides to the detriment of the Gospel Truth of Jesus Christ.

@marystanley7373

Ай бұрын

🤣🤣🤣🤣

@MPFXT

Ай бұрын

@@soldierofmary984 Cardinal Zen has pointed out the contradiction from Fiducia Supplicans and rightfully shames Michael Loftin for ignoring this fact. You cannot deny Fiducia Supplicans "blessing of same sex couples" contradicts the CDF's declaration that the "Church may not bless same sex couples."