Yep, brake line installation is another project I need to tackle.

Need all this suspension stuff because our roads are so crappy!

These springs are a good idea. I'm thinking it would help significantly when I'm traveling on mountain roads that are not regularly maintained and that's where I usually go to camp like many other people. Reduction of the interior of the RV'S construction from shaking apart and hopefully will make it last longer before things get loose and start to separate. Great video. Thanks. 😁

I put a pair of these on my 2021 Power Wagon. It’s great because there is a 1” gap when unloaded so the ride stays stock, but when I drop the travel trailer on they compress and help SO much with overall towing control. I was shocked.

I have no issues climbing under raised/jacked up vehicles. I used to work as a diesel mechanic apprentice. I've climbed under all sorts of big rigs for one reason or another. As long as you are using the proper equipment there shouldn't be an issue.

@brianharper344

2 жыл бұрын

If you had to remove the tires or were wedged in there shoulder to shoulder on your side it'd be different. If it dont feel right, don't get tight.

@greglivermore8684

2 жыл бұрын

I would recommend supporting trailer with your stands. Gravity always wins during a jack failure.

11:00 not sure who installed those hydraulic brakes but you may want to take it to a professional. You never ever install brake tubing on the front side of the axle , tubing always goes on top or at the back side of the axle for safety reasons it you got something in the road , it can easily crush or break the line if it gets caught between the axle tube and brake line. The other huge issue is there is no rubber hose on the front line! No hose clamp or even a zip tie securing the Tee block to the axle . I would fail that trailer during the annual state inspection, not sure if you have an inspection procedure or requirement there but it fails a NYS trailer inspection . Nice job on the sumo springs !

Your brake line from your frame to your axle needs to be rubber, and Tee on axle needs to be tapped hole into axle, and secured with a bolt. Also brake line running across axle needs to be secured

you need a flex hose on that rear brake line and more zip ties on the cross line on the axles

Yes, I feel like these are a good add. I put them on my toy hauler which has under axle leaf springs. Made the towing smoothing on rough roads and things move around a lot less inside trailer…like my paper towels don’t unwind any more on the holder

Good job figuring the installation out, i guess the installation advice is: “if first you don’t succeed try, contact the manufacturer and then try again”. Move one to the Successful Category from the Fail Category. 😊👍👍👍

That up grade might be all good, but while watching it and noticed the steel brake lines moving against the axle when you bumped them and the fact that the tee fitting goes up to steel mounted to underbelly and no flex lines is a disaster waiting to happen. The steel brake lines will fail.

@johnathantucker4191

2 жыл бұрын

Saw that... Can't be how they plumbed that... Maybe it's just how it looks on camera?

@JohnDiMartino

2 жыл бұрын

That trailer would never pass inspection, disgusting how shoddy that work is

@richardaitkenhead

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah that is not a quality product, it shocks me how bad things are in America, there is no way that would be allowed In the UK.

@richardaitkenhead

2 жыл бұрын

I have watched 100s of hours of 5th wheel video in preparation for a tour of American I want to do and stuff like this worries me, Especially the momentum products. I'm down to a luxe 44fl, a vanliegh beacon rdb or a riverstone 39rkfb there is at least one of each available I like its finding a tow vehicle I like torn between a f450 or hgv with space for a toad car on the back. I still have over a year to prepare but its getting daunting.

From a layman’s point of view it seems this product would drastically limit available suspension travel. Taking away the springs ability to absorb bumps. Seems like adding shocks would be much more preferable.

@SuperSpringsInternational

2 жыл бұрын

SumoSprings are shocks. -Adam

@Mar--

2 жыл бұрын

@@SuperSpringsInternational they are not shocks. They are bump stops

@colortaco3298

Жыл бұрын

@@Mar-- bump stops don’t compress like that lol maybe they compress “technically” but cmon lol

@Mar--

Жыл бұрын

@@colortaco3298 go ahead and buy a pair for your truck. I guarantee you'll take them off in one months time. They do not act anything like a shock and make your suspension very stiff thats why I went with air bags instead

I enjoy your videos. Very informative! Please get those brake lines fixed ASAP! It’s a disaster waiting to happen! I wouldn’t haul it very far at all without getting those fixed.

The automatic leveling system on my Keystone Outback 328RL left me in a precarious situation on two accounts. The BAL LS 7.3 leveling system allowed it's functioning to lower the rear two height adjusters on less than level ground. Only when the system was at near full extension on one side did it set a error code about unlevel surfaces and the need to correct the level of the ground. By eyesight it didn't appear that far off, thinking the leveling system will correct for it. At the time the error set, I could not in anyway override it. Believe me I tried all features on the BAL LS 7.3 to do so. I had already disconnected my truck and could not reconnect the truck if I wanted to because I allowed a buddy to place his 5th wheel in the location forward of my RV. But that was not the problem. The error code would not allow me to raise the height adjusters and give me an opportunity to somehow get the RV level. I was stuck! I tried using a screw type jack under one axle end that had the lowest surface area. Because I had to lift the RV with the axle I could not get the hand jack to overcome the weight. Plus, lying under the RV working a screw jack Io it's limits was not a good thing and dangerous. Fortunately my buddy had a massive hydraulic telescoping pump jack in his arsenal. It did the trick, having raised the wheel/tire assembly off the ground high enough to place additional 2x6s under the tire. This allowed the automatic leveling system to sense a more suitable level limit within it's obvious narrow preprogrammed range and allowed for the retraction of the rear height adjusters where I could then reposition the RV and start over again. I never imagined a case where the system would allow you to NOT be able to retract the levelers UNTIL you corrected for level! Amazing! Not fun being under such weight trying to get out of a jamb when your leveling system helped put you there!

Good video, you answered all my questions as to why do this at the end. I've installed these in my tow vehicle and have been very happy with the comfort and ride results but had not thought about them for my RV. Thanks for the info!

I really would like a video after some towing time to see what improvement you observe. Thanks.

@ceimo856

Жыл бұрын

On another site, after install, they put a camera on the Dinning room table monitoring a cup of water on the table. He drove down the highway pulled off on a rough side of the road. The cup was still in place and no water spilled. That’s a huge improvement. His was a 40’ 5th wheel. Sold on these!!

just did wet bolt kit/bronze bushings and sumo's on my rig today... it still slays me that they put plastic crap in the spring eyes for bushings

Good stuff, JD. Based on your first vid I ordered two sets and installed them on my Momentum 354M. I did a little drive and hit some bad roads and could immediately notice a significant positive difference. Less jarring transferred to the TV and less trailer sway. Thanks again for your channel.

@ricbailey170

2 жыл бұрын

Were you riding inside to notice this?

@peteurban975

2 жыл бұрын

@@ricbailey170 not riding inside the RV. Seat of pants measurement from driver seat. Same road driven before Sumo springs (one week ago) had a noticable difference.

They pay me nothing. We install these on everything we own. Just outstanding. USMC/USAF Ret.

@kevinc5801

2 ай бұрын

Thanks for your service, Trump won

Enjoyed the video, saw the first where you couldn’t get them on and this video was great that you were able to figure it out and get them on. Great job!

Proper tools make you feel secure. In your case. As represented in the video you where at no danger to your self. Of getting crushed. Maybe getting scared sure. Hurt no.

I understand how some people would think these rubber springs are a great idea, but personally I think it is a disaster waiting to happen. The area of the frame that is taking the load from the rubber spring isn't engineered to take that load. After repeated loading of the area of the bottom flange of the I beam, I would expect frame damage of some sort. I would never use these without reinforcing the frame above the rubber spring. For the ride smoothing action, shocks would be a better investment and wouldn't compromise the frame.

Good video. The brake lines zip tied to the axle is a interesting mounting technique without the splitter not mounted and looks like the axle leaf spring clamps have migrated out of place.

With the van Leigh you can use the pad inside the compartment to retract rear levelers only

Good to know. Our Jayco 5th. Came with the Dexter axles. Thanks for sharing👍

I used the jacks I have intended to change a tire, they are designed to be a jack and a jack stand. I also used regular jack stands as added safety. That worked great and I felt safe while under my RV.

Those should definitely smooth out the ride. Just an FYI though, don't use lock tight with nylon lock nuts. The lock tight will eat away the nylon.

I just put all new leaf springs, equalizer, and shackles on my 22ft trailer. It only weighs about 5500lbs loaded but I was nervous as hell working under it. I have 8 jack stands plus the tounge jack and still didn't like it. It just made me nervous because there was no axles under it. If it would have fallen it would have went all the way to the ground. Nevertheless I got it done safely and everything is up to date now.

Great video as always JD. Interesting comment about the independent suspension, makes sense, I just never thought about the different torque put on a frame not designed for independent suspension. With all of the videos that you put out, I hope you do find the time to actually enjoy the 5th wheel and get a chance to get out and use it.

I noticed the clips on the leaf spring packs have moved one for and one considerably aft. Looks like the indentation to hold it in the hole in the leaf spring may have worn considerably.

I noticed your leaf spring band driver side front left leaf spring has moved out of the spring divot. You can see on the spring where the spring band is supposed to sit to hold the leafs together.

Great install JD! Hate going under travel trailer, but will if I have to with floor jack.

Love the idea. Will be looking into it further. I think how you went about it was the safest most effective way to accomplish it. Nice work.

Good video and I did not have any issues with using the jacks and crawling under the trailer. One item, the directions do require torquing the carriage bolt to 10 ft lbs.

I really appreciate your improvement videos and I am impressed with how we think alike. We must be kin. ;)

Looking forward to the road test. Thinking they would be a good purchase.

The person who installed those brake lines needs to be fired! What was he thinking?

The ground effect system has no problem lifting the tires off the ground. Put blocks under the rear jacks to shorten the stroke on the jacks.

I have sumo springs on my truck and like them. Instead of the pads I think I would have used 6 x6 blocks so the legs didn't have to be extended so far.

I had installed Sumo springs on my class A Tiffin Allegro motor home. The difference in side to side sway was amazing and the ride was much better overall. I have a fifth wheel now and was thinking about adding this but was not sure how they preformed on a trailer since no one is riding inside. Can't wait to see the test drive to help make my mind up. BTW: On the last video I guess you didn't hear me screaming to lift her up higher and take out those bolts and install them after you get the springs mounted. My wife heard me and I think the neighbors did too. I guess Georgia is a little to far from Texas for you to hear. 🤣

@SuperSpringsInternational

2 жыл бұрын

Thank you for the support! -Adam

I just watched this video again after seeing a much earlier video where you installed shock absorbers to your previous fifth wheel. I’m curious as to why you didn’t install shocks on this fifth wheel.

I'm hearing that the Lippert frames that have been manufactured thinner due to weight reduction demands by some RV manufacturers. I'm wondering if these Sumo springs may eventually result in overstressing frame areas such as cross members resulting in cracked welds and frame stress fractures?

How are these compared to having 4 shocks? Shocks would have resistance in both directions up and down, these seem to have it only in one direction with it only hooked to your axle only for the bottom and the top just has the weight of the trailer resting on it

@tomm_d

2 жыл бұрын

Shocks are an absolutely superior solution.

On the third axle you did, it looks like the strap that holds your leaf springs together has slid forward and is barely holding that leaf in place

That’s not a load bearing part of the frame, there have been a lot of complaints of the frame bending and cracking as a direct result of helper springs. In fact some KZreadrs have had their RVs written off as a result of using helper springs like these. In one such case a company that specializes in Rv frame repair wouldn’t even touch it. Stating that in their opinion the helper springs were the direct cause of the frame failure. They went on to suggest that in the future a modification such as this would also require additional frame reinforcement. Look it up I guess since it seems like if I share a link to the video KZreadrs get ornery and delete the comment. So good luck, this is one modification I wouldn’t touch with a 50 foot pole.

Just replaced/upgraded the axles on my toyhauler. A lot of cribbing underneath after you raised the 5th wheel off the ground and also Jack stands! Wish I would have seen these and I would have installed them during the axle installs. Can't wait for you to road test them.

Kinda sorta suggested the same thing the first time. Looks like the original bolts would have worked as well. Glad it worked out. The safety factor is as long as the tires are enough to protect you then you should be fine. If the tires are not tall enough always use axle stands.

I'd sure like the engineers to elaborate on the difference between your LCI frame and mine. I'm curious as to what would make mine strong enough for torflex and yours not. Also these things look like they sure limit suspension travel and might end up acting like a bump stop. Hopefully you'll update us on their performance.

I don't understand everyone freaking out about jack stands or safety. The tires aren't off. Nothing is going to happen

Is there a video of these in action as you are traveling down the road? If not, might be cool to make one even if it's just using a bump in the parking lot.

@SuperSpringsInternational

2 жыл бұрын

We've got a video on our page that shows them in action if you're interested. -Adam

It seems like height of the springs with suspension equalizer flexed would allow you to adjust the height of the springs unequally (if they were tightened to the height of the frame). I would think you'd want to install them, then let the weight down on the suspension (with the trailer level) to adjust the height with a loaded clearance.

@RobWisemanDeezFit

2 жыл бұрын

Smart take.

You’ve had shocks, it’ll be interesting to see your road review. Road Master Comfort ride shocks or these, would love some of the viewers feedback.

Can’t wait to see it in action. I wish there was a way to measure the vibration or force on the inside of the trailer before and after.

@SuperSpringsInternational

2 жыл бұрын

We did this at Navistar Proving Grounds. Showed average of 68% reduction of g-force / vibration in the trailer. -Adam

Not only the break line issue. As I had seen you cover on your.latest video but i had noticed thst the leaf spring bands that hold the upper leafs in line are also slipping around as well.

The install looks very easy...once you figure out how to safely get the suspension off the ground enough! If I could fit under the fifth wheel at travel height, I wouldn't worry about the coach coming down on me; otherwise, I would maybe want jackstands for backup, even though I have seen an entire side of a 22,000 lb fifth wheel lifted a good three inches off the ground by the hydraulic leveling system (and it held as we walked through the inside).

Surprised they didn't anchor the hydraulic line splitter to the axle with a zip tie or something.

I came across some info today that these springs would help with porpoising while towing. They talked about putting them on the tow vehicle. What's the difference in installing them on the tow vehicle versus the RV? Thanks! 👍

Going to look into this

If that disc brake setup was a factory install I’d be pissed… if that was after market, done by a shop, I’d want my money back… if you did it yourself you should not be doing installs… those lines are trouble waiting to happen…

@BigTruckBigRV

2 жыл бұрын

@@Itsa_Mea I certainly didn't do it. But it is being addressed

@Kevin-jy9kr

2 жыл бұрын

I agree with you. It needs to be addressed. There a plastic tie wrapped around axle and brake lines.

I would still put a jack under the frame to be safe.

@stevedenoyer5956

Жыл бұрын

Jack stand

At $225 a set they better be awesome as I’d need 3 sets for my THer. I’ll wait for your on the road tests given that investment. 🤔😉

@joshgarner805

2 жыл бұрын

I was just about to look into these until I saw your comment. How the hell can these cost that much? It's a piece of rubber mounted to a couple pieces of bent sheet metal. It would cost me $500 to do my tandem axle trailer. They better preform excellent for that money.

@SuperSpringsInternational

2 жыл бұрын

Our product is priced there as the material is not rubber, but a foam micro-cellular polyurethane. Additionally, we make everything in the USA, and offer a lifetime warranty. We know that means it will cost more, but we are passionate about those things and think they're important. -Adam

Would you recommend an equalizer upgrade or just installing the summo springs instead? I only can afford one for now. Thanks for the help.

You have a follow up video on your experience with these sumosprings?

I see RV manufacturers are recommending these springs be removed. They are a contributing factor in frame breakage.

So I had to put new springs on my fifth wheel 8000 K rated on the drivers side of the RV I only have an inch and a half a clearance between the wheel and the body and it hits because of the bad roads my passenger side of a fifth wheel. I have 3 inches of clearance and I don’t have an issue with that side. On my drivers side I have three slide outs entertainment slide kitchen slide master bedroom slide a lot of extra weight. How do I gain a couple extra inches?

I put Big Blocks underneath it so I got more room to work without error

What about using a ramp like Camco Trailer Aid Plus to roll on, lifting one axle at a time and letting the other "droop" enough for the install?

Just an add on....if you have wider "shock ready" top plates, the SumoSprings still won't fit even with longer bolts. Just confirmed this with SuperSprings, the only fix they offered was to replace the top plates.

Thought of doing something similar but with air bags

JD have you ever heard of a recommendation to rotate the tires on your trailer?

Which gives you a better ride the sumo springs or shock absorbers

Looks like a bracket for your brake lines is not attached to anything.

@guerro327

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah, I saw that, too.

Man all of these suspension upgrade almost makes me wish I didn't have dexter torsion axles on my fifth wheel

I'm thinking since you appear to be preloading the SumoSprings at normal ride height, you are going to have a pretty stiff ride. I use SumoSprings under the rear of one of my trucks, and have found they are best with about a 1/2" air gap as the truck sits at normal height. That way they only come into play once the initial 1/2" of travel is stroked into, whether from load in the bed or from normal suspension movement.

@SuperSpringsInternational

2 жыл бұрын

hey Matt - in the trailer sumo springs, they're designed to be at 10-20% preload. That's the sweet spot on the parabolic spring curve where they provide 68% g force reduction / damping. On the trucks, many folks have SumoSprings with more mass, or that are our higher density springs. In those scenarios, you want the spring with a gap to allow for minimal impact to factory ride when the truck is unloaded. -Adam

@mattcaser6581

2 жыл бұрын

@@SuperSpringsInternational good info. Thanks for the followup/clarification. I sure do like the Sumo Springs under the back of the truck.

Great info due to the algorithms I had just ordered a set yesterday this video came up so I watched I have same axles and brakes keystone montana, so you saved me a bunch of time know what I need before they arrive is there a part number for different bolt kit or I can just pick up some 4 inch carriage bolts thanks again safe travels.

So I’m installing the MORryde 3000 and the 5 k sumo springs as well what are your thoughts on this install ?

Jake, Is there a difference in using the Sumo spring compared to Timbren suspension ?

@SuperSpringsInternational

2 жыл бұрын

SumoSprings are made from microcellular polyurethane, which have superior damping and vibration reduction. Timbren is made from rubber - which is stiffer and does not have the same damping benefits. -Adam

I agree, that brake line installation is "jack leg" from the get go. Not properly attached, no flex hose. Sheesh! does anyone not have any pride in workmanship any more? The tee blocks should be mounted to the axle housing with a Tee bolt of some sort and a couple of metal clamps. The brake lines should have segments of polyethylene tubing over them with band clamps tight on the axle. Those wire ties will, combined with road grit and vibration, eat right thru those brake lines if they don't crack first.

@BigTruckBigRV wondering if you would still use these after your visit to the Lippert Factory. We have been told this was an automatic denial of frame/chassis warranty if installed.

@BigTruckBigRV

3 ай бұрын

I do. Only failures I've seen have happened after extreme maneuvering

Should use Jack stands always for safety!

I love your videos. I have a couple questions from this video. Would these be a good idea on a bumper hitch trailer 26ft? . I know that this may be a stupid question to some of the more veteran RV owners on this channel. But I noticed that this trailer has hydraulic disc breaks? How does that work on a 5 th wheel trailer? I thought this trailer had electric trailer breaks? .

Adding these helps with what exactly? When traveling? I have a 40' toy hauler and just curious how this would help.

@kylepokorski6045

2 жыл бұрын

Just cushioning and little less side to side roll

Can you do an update video of these?

JD. You did a video a year or so ago that you were in an RV park in San Antonio I believe to meet up with your daughter and you were doing a lot of bike riding around there and it looks really awesome. I don’t know how to find that, but I’m looking for the name of the RV park if that’s possible that you could reply to this that would be great.

Anybody notice the rigid steel brake line? Where's the other end objected too?

I don't like being under anything that's raised up. Please let everyone know which one you like better. The sumo or the comfort ride shocks. Also does it reduce the wiggling inside when you walk around? Thanks for another great video.

It occurred to me that a budget friendly way for a rv newbie to gain some of the benefits from these springs on a dual axle trailer would be to install them on one axle until a person could afford to buy another set. JD what are your thoughts about that? If a person was to only install them on a dual axle trailer and only had one set which axle do you think they would have the most benefit on the front or rear?

What makes you decide to do your add on projects to your RV? Another question, you do a lot of truck reviews, but i don't think I've seen a review on. Freightliner M2 106 truck. I would love to see you do a review on this truck!!

I’m a green horn at this looking to start with f250 6.7 xlt what’s the biggest camper we can pull with it I was thinking in like 9000lbs fully loaded maybe 10,000 can I do that about 30 to 32 ft length. Down the road maybe even sooner we r thinking adding a 5 th wheel hitch on it Ty for all the info very helpful

Drivers side rear looked crooked when you dropped it down, leaning outboard from the appearance.

I would have Jack stands placed to "catch" the RV incase a stability jack failure.

Thanks for the video I just did something similar to this for the shocks on my truck. Had no idea they had them for the fifth wheel. Also what are your ideas on this system , Timbren Silent Ride Suspension for Tandem Axle Trailers. ? Thanks

We need an update after you pull it!

Are those brake lines secured with Zip-Ties?????!

This addition appears to limit your spring travel. It puts additional pressure on the frame. Shocks might work better!

@SuperSpringsInternational

2 жыл бұрын

SumoSprings are designed to compress to 80% of their original height, allowing for articulation. If a trailer spring compresses more than that, it will most likely snap as they are all on about $40 of non-USA made springs. -Adam

What ply tires are those?

Why would you retract the front ? You could just go to hitch height and that would raise all but the front.

Question: if you lift your suspension (in some way) it does lift the roof hight aswell, correct? (I ofcourse assume as much - but it doesn't seem like anyone mentions it). So, your 13.5 is now a 13.9?

What was the tool kit sitting next to the Sumo's on your tailgate? When I need to work under the RV I use a 20-ton air jack and 6-ton jack stands...no sweat. This winter I'm doing disk brakes and sumo springs on my 2970RL, so looking forward to the next video for the road test.

How do these compare to the shocks you had installed on your older rig? Certainly a simpler installation.