The way nVidia gpu's aged so badly is just ridiculous.. you pay extra and you get .. nothing.. Back in 2017, i really hesitated between the GTX 1050ti and the RX 570 because they were called "similar in price and performance" but i'm really glad i chose the RX 570 because, not only, it was a bit cheaper, but clearly more powerful and had much larger framebuffer (i bought the 8Gb model btw) and now the difference is even larger in newer games making the GTX 1050ti basically irrelevant in today's market considering that you get 570s for around 100€ used and still play decently at 1080p EDIT: As said in the video, such comparison as "This GPU was cleary more powerful than this GPU" is pointless. Comparing two different GPU, from two different brands, with two architechture is not what i meant. MY point is that nVidia need to adress the architectural obsolescence and lack of vram on their products.... even tho i know they won't because they such in a strong position compared to AMD. And NO btw, i'm not an AMD fanboy, we can criticize big companies without necessarily endorsing what others competitors do, keep that in mind.

@blebekblebek

Жыл бұрын

It's only Kepler, nvidia did so poorly they had to rush releasing maxwell which is by far the most impactful gpu upgrades in years, the only limitation that nvidia always do is skimping on vram which was corrected in pascal, which by far the longest period of gpu lifespan, and it still performing very well regardless, and yes this is including the infamous GT1030/1040. As much you want to praised AMD for doing they supposedly to do, RX Series at launch is very scarce, specially RX 480/470/580/570. It's only became abundances after etherium crashes in mid 2017 (or 2018 I forgot) since miners are scraping them away. High performances GPU was always targeted by miners regardless, even before eth switch to POW RX 570 is still sought after even after they being resold as mining rig because demand is so high. I bought RX 580 used for $90 in 2018 and sold it at $200 in 2021, it's so ridiculous what we've got so far, and now we can't even get "high performance" GPU within $400 price range, few months ago GTX 1660 was sold for $600-900. What I dislike the most about AMD is they always lump few generation GPU's togther and cut the drivers support within that range, for example, HD Series was released in 2011 (GCN1.0) and R9 series last released was in 2015 (GCN3) but they cut everything down at the same time, sure we get long time before it was end, but before that HD3000 and HD6000 was also cut at the same time, the worst part is HD6000 only released a year before they stop drivers support for that series (which I bought back then) I was stuck with "new" card and no more driver support.

@baoquoc3710

Жыл бұрын

the problem here is Kepler arch are the most complex architecture that developers had to work on which does affect developers work time and thus people at the time tend to work on GCN, which is indeed more dev friendly.

@Nintenboy01

Жыл бұрын

no the 1050 Ti is only about as powerful as a GTX 960, whereas the RX 570 was around GTX 970 level

@mck8292

Жыл бұрын

I understand that Kepler was probably a bit of a pain to develop for and im honestly impressed that they kept the driver support for such a long period but Maxwell and Pascal have drawback as well, they tend to perform worse on DX12 those days and let alone Vulkan where Polaris is destroying nVidia I don't want to just praise AMD tho, they do some shitty things as well, people just overlook that aspect some times.. Exemple: That stupid RX 6500XT with its PCIe 4.0 limitation and 4Gb framebuffer (even though AMD stated earlier that 4Gb was "not enough" to tease nVidia on "lack of vram") They're just companies, motivated by profits. But AMD give the impression to be more "aware" of what the consumer "need" and always improved some aspect their product over generation (TDP, Driver support, RT performance..) nVidia tho don't give a sh*t on what the consumer think about their products, even tho (some of) their gpu's suck in terms of price to performance, they think it will sell anyway because peoples are dumb.. which they are not apprently considering the RTX 4080 sells.. But yeah, that situation whith micro-chips crisis is insane and even AMD is rising prices but keeps them lower than nVidia to maintain "good value"... soo yeah.

@HardwareLab

Жыл бұрын

@@Nintenboy01 watch a video bro, there is no such a thong as relative performance

Damn, the 780ti was my dream card back in the day, I should've dreamt of something else instead.

@ogaimon3380

Жыл бұрын

lol

@MechAdv

Жыл бұрын

My first desktop build was with a used GTX970 just before Pascal dropped. Needless to say, it wasn’t the best money I ever spent. Lol

@ivankovachev8835

Жыл бұрын

Yeah, and AMD had the superior architecture from 2007 to 2015, yet people bought Nvidia, AMD was also more worth it from 2016 to present, and I'd say that tehy won the RX 6000 vs RTX 3000 series generation, because Nvidia lied about prices, yet people refuse to buy AMD GPUs. Hell they buy Intel GPUs half as much since AMD has about 10% market share and Intel has about 5% right now... And before anyone calls me a fanboy, I own both AMD and Nvidia and have had both AMD and Nvidia for the majority of my life, rarely only one brand at a time. Both have driver problems and other minor problems, so it's not just drivers.

@juicecan6450

Жыл бұрын

The Radeon HD 7970 GHz edition was my dream card. Sapphire even had a Toxic 6GB model of it. literally 2x of what the 780Ti had

@ivankovachev8835

Жыл бұрын

@@juicecan6450 The 6GB variant was made for crossfire, the HD 7970 didn't have enough bandwidth to utilize more than 3GB of VRAM effectively.

gonna be interesting to see how the 6800xt ages vs the 3080 10gig cards

@TheAnoniemo

Жыл бұрын

8GB on the 3070 is basically a crime at this point, while the RX6800 gets a cool 16GB.

@Winnetou17

Жыл бұрын

@@TheAnoniemo Less of a crime than 10GB on 3080, I'd say

@waifuhunter9709

Жыл бұрын

And i bought 3080 over 6900XT when 6900XT was 20% cheaper. And now i started sweating profoundly

@AshtonCoolman

Жыл бұрын

The slower ray tracing performance will plague AMD GPUs as time goes on. They'll probably be faster in raw rasterization though.

@MechAdv

Жыл бұрын

I traded my full hash rate 3080 10Gb for a LHR 3080 12gb the week that they came out. Lol, the guy was like, “are you sure!?!?” I didn’t give a fuck about the mining perf, I just wanted a brand new card with a brand new warranty and 2gb more Vram. Shit was brand new in the box with the plastic wrap still on, my card had been used daily for like a year by that point. That was a good day for capitalism. Lol

It's extremely impressive how the 290x demolishes the 780 Ti while being $150 cheaper. I kinda regret not buying the 390x now because that would have probably lasted me a lot longer than my 970.

@alksonalex186

Жыл бұрын

If you're not bothered by lack of driver support and downloading custom drivers for little juice, then maybe it could be a better buy

@doompenguin7453

Жыл бұрын

@@alksonalex186 Not bothered by that at all.

@vogonp4287

Жыл бұрын

GCN cards aged so well. My old RX 580 8gb consistently outperforms the 1060 6gb in recent games.

@azz09444

Жыл бұрын

@@vogonp4287 yeah im also using an rx 580 8gb runs all games on very high 60fps, perfect for 1080p gaming

@Sam-cq9bj

Жыл бұрын

@@vogonp4287 no gtx 1060 and rx 580 are still similar in terms performance .

Correction to the video: While Kepler and Maxwell V1 (750) support some more features than just DX11/DX12 Feature Level 11_0, they are NOT in fact Feature Level 11_1 capable. So a game demanding 11_1 such as God of War doesn't actually work.

@HardwareLab

Жыл бұрын

Interesting. Maybe I’ll research more about that and try to do am addition video. Don’t promise btw. Thanks for the comment :)

@NUCLEARARMAMENT

Жыл бұрын

You can play God of War and even Halo Infinite and SpiderMan Miles Morales just fine on Kepler GPUs, you just need Intel SDE (in case you lack AVX on your CPU like older Nehalem/Westmere and Phenom processors) and VKD3D to translate DX12 to VK calls. As long as your GPU supports VK 1.2, and all Kepler cards pretty much do, you will be just fine. The only limit is VRAM.

Love to see a channel that has only 600 subscribers push out such long videos of quality content.

@HardwareLab

Жыл бұрын

We had less than 400 when published 🗿

@KiraSlith

Жыл бұрын

Really shows there's still people out here doing great KZread content out of passion first.

@DragonOfTheMortalKombat

Жыл бұрын

now like over a 1000.

I bought the R9 390 back in 2015 over the 970, and looking back I am very glad I made that decision. I was using that up until this year until I had to upgrade because the lack of driver support. If AMD didn't abandon driver support for the 300 series cards so early I could've easily had gotten another 2 years of use out of it, but since it was over 6 years ago I didn't mind upgrading to a new GPU (from AMD of course). I learned from past experiences not to buy NVIDIA cards do to how poorly they age, I'm glad to see people are starting to see past the hype.

@unlimitedslash

Жыл бұрын

If you run linux or decided to use the hacked drivers that 390 is still a damn good card tbh.

@towertooth24157

Жыл бұрын

Absolutely loved my R9 390. Had to retire it when they stopped supporting it and games like Cyberpunk came out. I picked up a 3060ti as a stopgap before finally getting the beastly 4090. All on the same PSU lolz

@doueven

Жыл бұрын

Had an R9 390X that died in 2020 amid the pandemic. Picked it over the 970 for the bigger vram. Built a whole new system at the beginning of 2021 (fortunately) with an RX6800XT It's been a beast so far but I must admit, the second hand prices are quite bad vs NVIDIA. Was thinking of getting a new card next year but would probably get bugger all for the 6800XT

@josephdias3968

Жыл бұрын

Yeah nimez drivers kick ass on the r9 290

@ExalyThor

Жыл бұрын

How is the driver support? Oh right...

Remember when everyone said "you will never need more than 2gb of vram, its not important", so many people were wrong. Also somehow nvidia gpu's become less powerful when time goes by just like my Vega56 beats 1070 most of the time. Also that is a quality video, hopefully you get more subs.

@arenzricodexd4409

Жыл бұрын

Vega 56 have always been faster than 1070. That's why nvidia release 1070Ti to counter Vega 56.

@dandeson9723

Жыл бұрын

@@arenzricodexd4409 yes and no, at the release Vega 56 struggled to beat 1070.

@arenzricodexd4409

Жыл бұрын

@@dandeson9723 if vega 56 only matching 1070 performance then nvidia will not release 1070Ti in the first place

@dandeson9723

Жыл бұрын

@@arenzricodexd4409 you lost me there

@arenzricodexd4409

Жыл бұрын

@@dandeson9723 Vega 56 and Vega 64 comes out roughly a year after nvidia release 1080 and 1070. Since the very beginning AMD have adjusting vega 56 performance to beat 1070 consistently knowing how it perform in games a year before they release vega. So vega 56 struggle to compete with 1070 are not the case at all when AMD had a year looking at 1070 and 1080 performance before releasing vega to the market.

The 290x was a great card. Still can't believe it holds out that well despite being older than the ps4 and xbox one. I bought a used 290 in 2015 for $200 that lasted me years.

@classicallpvault8251

Жыл бұрын

It's not older than the XBOX One and PS4, the reference model was released almost simultaneously, but the most common type by far, the Sapphire Tri-X version, came out in December 2013, a few months later. Also note that the 290X is a generation ahead of the PS4 and XBOX One in terms of microarchitecture, both consoles use GCN 1.0 (so the same architecture as the 7970) and the Hawaii XT is based on GCN 2.0, which itself was first released in the form of the 7790 in February of 2013.

@Protector1rk

Жыл бұрын

290x ≈ Rx 580. Of course it's great.

GPUs all perform very differently under different conditions and in different applications/APIs, so direct comparisons can only report results in specific cases. But we need reviewers to give us those specific comparisons so we can "generalize" to some degree as a basis for choosing one GPU over another. I still have the R9-290 I bought when it was released. It is no longer running in any of my active systems, but when I last installed it, it was still working. Great card then, and still adequate for a lot of games.

I agree - those TPU performance charts based on geomeans from reviews do have their place but they can't tell the whole story at all and one should really consider their use case before buying. This is why I went for a second hand RTX 2080ti earlier this year and overclocked it rather than a 3070 or 6700xt as I want to target 4k60 and FSR was non-existent (and infinity cache does not work well at 4k offsetting a 256-bit bus) , and 8GB of VRAM is not enough. (This card will follow the same fate as the 780ti IMO very quickly). The R9 290X considering its age has held up extremely well.

@LaurentiusTriarius

Жыл бұрын

It always depend at what prices you could get these cards, here last year the 2080ti's in good condition I was finding were about the same price as many current gen budget kings...

@DragonOfTheMortalKombat

Жыл бұрын

3070 will not last long, I have a card with low VRAM, so I know. 6700xt does not have enough memory bandwidth but can be a good option at less price.

@raresmacovei8382

Жыл бұрын

Getting a 2080 Ti instead of a 3070 or even 6700 XT is always a smart choice.

@tourmaline07

Жыл бұрын

@@raresmacovei8382 DLSS for me was the deciding factor , playing at 4k on a 27" 60hz panel I knew I needed a good upscaling solution.

Interesting to see these older cards put through their paces today and see hold they do or don’t hold up today. Keep up the good work!

@maxwellmelon69

Жыл бұрын

Im still running a powercolor 290x 50-60fps mid settings in new world it still relevent enough for me

Upgraded from a water cooled RX480 to a Vega 64 and the performance increase was insane in GTA V. Not as insane as going from a RX480 to a 6900 XT in my main though!

@hrayz

Жыл бұрын

I went from the RX 580, to trying Crossfire RX 580 (good in some games, dx12&Vulkan do have multi-gpu modes too), to Vega64, then the RX 6900XT.

@michaelzomsuv3631

Жыл бұрын

The performance was not insane in GTA V. We're talking about a ~40% difference to Vega 64. 6900XT would be insane though, that's like 300% difference.

@raresmacovei8382

Жыл бұрын

Water cooled RX 480? But why

@raresmacovei8382

Жыл бұрын

​@@michaelzomsuv3631 Nah. RX 480 to V64 can be up to 70% performance difference, depending on game, API and GPU clocks.

@Wasmachineman

Жыл бұрын

@@raresmacovei8382 Because why not. the RX480 Nitro+ stock cooler is absolute garbage too.

Relative performance charts such as that one GPU website's global chart are amazing for finding GPU's to look into. Saw the 2080 Ti was close to a 3070, remembered that it really was, looked it up and it really was but had more VRAM so I grabbed that for like $300 cheaper than a 3070.

Awesome video, my man. It's really nice to see how these cards stack up over time.

Very good retrospective work -- more of this kind of benchmarking is needed. I was surprised to see so many performance issues with Vuklan API titles on Kepler. Is it just the VRAM size limitation or memory asset mismanagement in the driver -- who knows. One big difference between Kepler and GCN architectures is the inability of the former to run compute and graphics kernels at the same time. This is probably the reason for the extra performance drop in Doom Eternal with its specific implementation of forward rendering, that certainly causes GPU pipeline under-utilization in Kepler, on top of the chronic Vulkan run-time problems.

@Degalfox

Жыл бұрын

i think you pretty much answered your question. other then that is the memory buss of the 2 cards 384bit for the 780ti and 512 for the 290x. pretty much what ever gddr5 the cards have, the r9 will have more bandwidth.

I've had two 290x's in crossfire when they were relevant, and ironically enough during the height of the pandemic I bought a 290 blower card for my living room pc for $80, where it still plays witcher 3 at 60 fps with a mix of high/medium at 1080p. This was a golden era for gpu's until the 10xx cards came out, and we all know nvidia will never make another 1080 Ti - a card I've also owned 3 versions of.

A few things: 1) Everyone should understand that TechPowerUp's GPU chart is based on how each card runs games at 1080p Ultra settings for all cards up to the RTX 2080 Ti, where the chart switches to 4K. It doesn't mean "This card is ALWAYS 4% faster than that card"; it means that it is 4% faster on average when accounting for a wide range of games. 2) Furthermore, it is not fair to test games in Vulkan using the 290X and then *not* test them in DX11 using the 780 Ti. The best API for each card should be chosen and then tested against the other. 3) This video is good, but it is TOO LONG. You could have shortened the video to 30 minutes by talking about the games' performance *while* the footage played in the background instead of waiting until it is over. Your audience has both eyes and ears, and you should make use of both of them.

@HardwareLab

Жыл бұрын

1) And my point is that this data is just useless because it represents nothing 2) Didn’t you see that we are testing games for representing a specific API? I mentioned that in introduction. Alright then, tell me in which game I should switch from Vulkan to DX11? Wolfenstein? Strange Brigade? RDR2? Definitely these games have DX11, 100% true 3) You are not my audience since your understanding of the video and the ideas that we were trying to explain is poor. We show around a minute sections to demonstrate how the game behaves based on different scenes in the benchmark section, this is the thing why a few words with test on the background with numbers doesn’t show the whole picture, moreover, the work with music and visuals and all the timings is done for an artistic purpose, so this structure is a concept of the video

@cyjanek7818

Жыл бұрын

@@HardwareLab I would agree with only one thing that person said - the video is too long. Maybe I am not a target but I liked everything about that video. Thing is I was skipping as much of video when no one is talking etc as I could (that is just my trait, really problematic but well) and Tought video was like 20 minutes long, when I read his comment that it could be 30 mint I was like "what? It was shorter than that". I dont mean it in any bad way but I think there is no need for longer presentation of a game if nothing special happened during that test. Obviously do as you wish but I thought it might be usefull to share that I agree with that one point when I dont agree with any other in his comment.

@HardwareLab

Жыл бұрын

@@cyjanek7818 okay, i get your point, but again, this is an artistic choice and many other people in comment section got the vibe we were trying to create

@Folsomdsf2

Ай бұрын

The reason they used vulkan is because the 780ti DOES NOT SUPPORT certain features for some games. You want to make a level playing field as much as you can having them run like for like. dx12 is the major problem for the 780ti as there's several things that it just has 0 hardware support for so it's going to shit it's pants.

О, новый канал Краба, сразу узнал по голосу, и по манере подачи контента ))

I had a whole pile of 290s and 290Xs, did some quad CF benching which was fun. They were right garbage for gaming though when they were new, very common to have black screen crashes and a bunch of other issues. TBH the better card out of all of them was the OG Titan, that thing was a monster under water.

APIs were also optimized over time for PS4/XB1. Both consoles running on AMD-GCN based apus for more than seven years also means that devs had to ensure a good compatibility for AMD-GCN GPUs over a longer period of time. The PS3 and the 360 launched with Nvidia GPUs so games were running pretty good on Jensen side for a while too. It just depends on what most people play on.

@kishaloyb.7937

Жыл бұрын

PS3 had a Nvidia GPU. Xbox 360 had a ATI/AMD GPU. So in that generation, it was pretty tied. PS4/Xbox One onwards, every company moved to AMD cause of how horribly Nvidia treats it's own customers.

@arenzricodexd4409

Жыл бұрын

@@kishaloyb.7937 Anything bad have always been associated with nvidia so even when certain client no longer use nvidia people assume it must be because of how bad nvidia treat their customer. AFAIK sony does not really have issue with nvidia. They simply go with AMD with PS4 because AMD can give them both cpu and gpu in without needing to look for separate company to do it. With MS if you look back the issue with the original xbox you should know that it is not nvidia fault entirely. If nvidia was really that bad nintendo will not going to do business with nvidia with the Switch after using AMD GPU for generations inside their main console.

@garbagemousemat678smith2

Жыл бұрын

Its amazing how well CP2077 run on PS4 Pro now considering it has Jaguar cpu. Mechwarrior 5 totally get cpu bottlenecked with Jaguar.

@kishaloyb.7937

Жыл бұрын

@@arenzricodexd4409 Apple, Sony, MS all left Nvidia. Linus Torvalds himself has publicly "showed the bird" to Nvidia. I think that is evidence enough that Nvidia is a very bad business partner. That is even stated by Linus himself. Then comes all the hardware requirements. Considering how badly Nintendo rips off their own customers, they are finding it at home when dealing with Nvidia xD Though considering how good AMD APUs are now even in the mobile/handheld form factor, Nintendo might just switch to AMD for their Switch 2 hardware requirements.

Another reminder that graphics cards with more vram age more gracefully. I remember when others insulted my decision to purchase a 2gb GTX 285 in 2009 claiming how it was a waste of money, yet that frame buffer gave the headroom to keep texture settings reasonable until I upgraded in 2015 and again in 2021. Unfortunately some will never listen and then wonder why performance of cards with less vram decrease significantly after only a couple years. Been paying attention to prices of workstation cards being sold off by mining farms like the Nvidia A4000s; based on prior experiences it wouldn't surprise me if those aged better than the 3070 or even 3080 because of its 16gb of vram, that is despite performance similar to a 3060ti in 2022. There are some impressive deals out there for those who have patience. Thank you for taking the time to run all those benchmarks and make this video, condensing 10 years of experience into just under an hour.

Im still using a watercooled 290 and love it cause of how affordable it was (and is)!

@bdhale34

Жыл бұрын

The first gen i7 875k I gave to my niece for minecraft/roblox/fortnite has a R9 290 4GB reference card in it and that thing still slaps hard at 1080p for less demanding and esports titles.

While i enjoyed the video (good work btw), everyone remotely in the field knows and understands the points you make. Yes, these are generalisations and yes, generally they are not okay but for better or worse, we lack better means of measuring the relative performance of competing products, so such a generalisation gives a pretty good top down general view of what a certain GPU can do. Different architectures give different results, so do the different amounts of VRAM but that is normal and very well understood. Yet, reviewers aren't wrong - they present the new products as they are percieved at launch. Noone can singlehandedly redo their reviews of all past generations of products since 2012 every year to check if something has changed. And ofcourse it has. I'm still rockin a r9 290 but imagine if that 780ti had 4 gigs of RAM and full DX12 support, would it lose to the 290x today? I don't think so. Yes, nGreedia skimped on the specs (as they always do) but how long did it take to show? Answer is 5 years. 5 years in tech terms is alot and most people who would of bought these at launch in the first place, most probably have moved on 'cause they can afford it, obviously, there is always something better comming out. You also failed to mention the frame timing comparison, which in these 10 past years has been a bane, where 60 fps can look like 40 on AMD cards because of the way our eyes work. Drivers are always a hit or a miss. I've had problems with both companies, i've had minor video issues with AMD, didn't like the colors reproduced by an nVidia card even with corrections but what i found really frustrating was that i had AUDIO issues, FRIGGIN AUDIO ISSUES, caused by the nVidia drivers at the time.. It's a videocard, why did it bugger my audio drivers.. Anyway.. Lastly, when the r9 290x launched, it offered very competitive pricing, TITAN level performance for half the money... Well, count me and the whole town in. But.... And this is a big *butt*, in 2022 AMD offers slightly worse performance for 20$ less (talking mid - high range) and basically no ray tracing. Why should i buy the inferior product? Today's GPUs will be irrelevant in 10 years time. If i want ray tracing today AMD sucks, whereas a 3060 with dlss/ fsr will deliver and is cheaper than 6700xt and has more vRAM... If AMD went ( like they did with the r9 290x vs GTX TITAN), "Hey, here's a 6700xt, it does not have the ray tracing capabilities of the 3070 but it has 10 gigs of vRAM and is only 349$" i'd be all over it. But they didn't, they got nGreedy. So thanks but no thanks. p.s. I was always a fan of AMD GPUs since 2008, they always delivered value for money until 2020 when they decided that value for money has no place in their corporate world. We'll see how that works in the crypto crash of today. Now i'm a fan of second hand GPUs.

This video is on a similar level to Digital Foundry - especially in terms of research quality and script writing. Very impressive piece, boys! This channel is going to be really big if you keep up the amazing releases like these.

Techpowerup’s relative performance isn’t quite accurate these days. I think buyers should just watch KZread benchmarks and comparisons, or go to Tom’shardware GPU hierarchy page, which isn’t 100% accurate but still better than Techpowerup

@HardwareLab

Жыл бұрын

The problem is not the exact database, the problem is the whole concept that different gpus can be placed against each other on different “levels of performance” and the equivalents could be found there. That’s wrong, it doesn’t work like this

This was interesting and useful! My child's friend is still using my old 780 (non TI). I think it's time to push them to upgrade at least a few years, even though I'm impressed with how long both the cards in this video held out.

Great video. R290X was a beast when it came out but it was hot and loud that is why NVIDIA could ask for the extra price. Relative same performance doesn't mean both GPU will behave the same under every game and condition think about it as GPU performance tier. So like R9 290X, R9 390, RX 470, RX 570, GTX 970, GTX 1060 3G likely to performe almost the same in most of the games. Back then they were neck to neck in most of the games as we can see it your test. Nvidia usually makes GPUs for the present while AMD likes to put future proof features in their GPUs. But peopele don't care about the future they just buy the GPU which is currently the best because they think like if the GPU becomes slow they will buy a new one even if the other one could last in their system one or more years before it becomes slow.

@HardwareLab

Жыл бұрын

But it was never relative. The difference can reach 50% or whatever higher in some games, but be less than 5% in others. That is why it’s not correct to speak about any equivalents, it just depends on the game A LOT P. S. You don’t care != people don’t care. If you don’t care - buy whatever suits you, but who cares - will buy something different. This is the point.

@ozzyp97

Жыл бұрын

It really wasn't all that hot and loud under a proper cooler, it just got that reputation because AMD's reference design was legendarily awful. The more obvious reason is that the 780Ti was clearly the faster card at the time, it took years of driver updates and more demanding games to really show what the 290X was capable of.

@varungupta8241

Жыл бұрын

@@ozzyp97 the newer games didn't show how capable the 290x was it showed how bad the 780ti was

Hey, really good video. I really like the concept of taking a few games from each year, gives a really interesting view of how the driver and api support evolves. The editing and the transitions are really well done, they look really proffesional, that said i agree with other comments that the video is too long, maybe thats just inevitable if you want to show some actual gameplay and go over so many games, oh well. Although you don't like relative performance, a relative performance vs year chart would have been really interesting!

it's absolutely insane how well the 290x still holds up in modern titles. it's still perfectly usable as a low-end option for playing 1080p at medium to low settings. I have no idea why amd killed driver support for it. I feel very bad for the people that invested more in the 780ti for the maybe 10% advantage it had in the popular titles around when these cards were released. I also wonder if the 290x aging so well is also due to the same architecture being used in the 8th gen consoles. that being said, I wouldn't be surprised at all if a similar situation ends up happening with the 3080 vs the 6800xt. the 6800xt launched with just a little bit slower performance than the 3080 but had a much bigger framebuffer and was (intended to be) 50 bucks cheaper. it's also the same architecture used in the 9th gen consoles.

Watching the video in 240p (because of slow and expensive Internet connection), I couldn't tell whether the racing car footage in the beginning is a game or actual real life video.

Insane video, I can see so much work put into it. Everything is clear and easy to understand. Keep it going bro! Oh, and music is really good too! Thank you for that video!

Wow, awesome video. How well the 290x held up in some of these modern games is impressive

Clicked on the video so I would see the difference between those 2 gpus but stayed for the music. Great video and even better music choice. I hope you continue to grow!

Thank you for your dedication to make this video

Your videos in this channel are good offering another perspective. I like that. Keep it up guys.

For the same reason I picked 390 instead of 970/980. Also recently I swapped 1080 Ti for 6700 XT. 3070 with its 8 gigs of VRAM feels more like downgrade.

I recently gave my MSI R9 290x Gaming for a nephew , i built rig with i5 4670k , hes happy now with hes "new" pc 😊 this card still kicks ass in newer games like horizon zero dawn (50fps avg on medium settings) .

I got a MSI r9 290x gaming 4GB back in 2015. Something must of been faulty with the cooler because it ran at 94C which was significantly higher then the advertised box temperature of 78C. Even replacing the thermal paste came to no avail. The card died in 2017 refusing to boot to windows with lots of graphics artifacts in the bios. I returned it to MSI and got my money back and switched to a MSI GTX 1060 6GB which ran at a much cooler 64C and gave me no problems in multiple PCs until I sold it in 2021 . Never had a good experience with AMD cards.

Relative performance can be measured based on usecase. saying (x) card is 105% of (x) card is silly mostly because that 105% will fluctuate based the load Basically the way most people measure things is just bad, you can still measure relative performance as long as you don't oversimplify it, but people will always tend to simplify it.

I think saying they are "wrong" in their opinions is not really an accurate claim. They never claimed that the Relative Performance is 100% indicate of every use-case and scientific measurement you should use. They are perfectly aware that whatever numbers the sides use for determining the Relative Performance is a vague average across multiple games, benchmarks and programs to determine a general power level for each one. None of them have claimed to use Relative Performance to determine that "The 780ti is 4% faster relative to 290x so no matter what game or app you are using, that's what you should expect". So I feel like you've misunderstood their messages and spent 50 minutes trying to correct them on claims they have never made. It is good that you are reminding people that relative performance should be taken with a grain of salt and to look at specific applications to know what product is best for you. But throwing other creators under the bus to get that across doesn't feel right.

Great video , congrats 4you;)

I bought the R9 390 8gb many years ago when it launched...my son was still using that GPU to play games at 1080p until just a couple of weeks ago and it was still providing +60fps in most games with decent quality settings. I replaced it only because after so many years AMD has discontinued driver updates.

@ismaelsoto9507

Жыл бұрын

If you don't mind using modded drivers NimeZ Drivers are quite decent, at least it allows these GPUs play modern titles at acceptable frame rates.

Finally getting the performance you should have had is somehow a good thing, it isn't, having it from the word go or years earlier is

I Love the BALLZ @ 6:30 !!! Instant SUBSCRIBE. Much success. Monetization is coming soon! Keep it up!!!

I had 2x 290x in crossfire until early last year. Served me well for a long time. Would have kept them longer if mutli-gpu didn't lose so much support over the years since 2013

@likeclockwork64butbetter58

Жыл бұрын

Its a crying shame too. Multi GPU had some crazy success. Resident Evil 5 had scaling with upwards of three GPUs. Triple crossfire always made more sense since you could pair a dual and a single together and use the single when crossfire wasn't supported, the dually when regular crossfire was better supported, and all three when the game was supported really well

This era of hardware always catches my eye as I never owned any of them. Pre-ordered my ps4 right when they opened the first round at E3 time and the 780ti launched a week before my console arrived. Served me well for about 10 years but I've since switched back to pc exclusively. Hopefully my 6950XT has the longevity of the 290.

This is a good content. Informative and Entertaining. You deserve a sub. May Allah grow your channel. Ameen!

Really interesting video, love these experiments with cards. Really good job man

I have not seen Hardware Unboxed make claims that one test in one game is indicative of definitive "relative performance" between two cards. In fact, they always make it a point to add "in this title".

@HardwareLab

Жыл бұрын

Sure, but I said that the section with average fps is pointless and creates confusion. As I said - not blaming them, they are great in general

@kuyt20

Жыл бұрын

@@HardwareLab Not really, as they have always specifically listed all the games(usually the most recently popular games) they used to come up with that average. Its also why they often "re-visit" their previous head-to-head matchups with newer games and updated drivers to see if anything has changed.

your reasoning for vram is just partial correct. give gamers just the bare minimum of vram so they are force to upgrade even to the card would still deliver the performance is one reason. the other is to protect the enterprise market at any cost. cant have consumer grade GPUs used in render rigs or AI applications train on consumer GPUs. the tesla m40 was the equivalent to the maxwell titan but had 24gb ram and i think was priced in the 6k dollars range. nvidia begrudgingly gives us 24gb consume cards at the top end and if you need more memory the enterprise version of the rtx 3090 is the A100 with 40/80gb for 8000/1600 dollars currently on amazon. I am at the point where i just have pure hate for nvidia an there anti consumer tactics. amd did a good job getting back in the game on the CPU market but there GPUs are still behind. i believe the radeon 7xxx will gain amd some mind share and there chiplet design gives amd room to grow while nvidia is maneuvering it self into a corner where monolithic dies will hit the physics brick wall. however as long as amd has the thumb up there ass when it comes to supporting the enterprise or even profesional market will give nvidia a leg up. there software stack is soooo ahead of anything amd, its just pathetic at this point and anybody requiring to use there GPU to do anything but gaming will buy nvidia and are happy to pay does prices.

One of most inreresting tech video i watched in these year. Ty, GL!

The biggest reason why Nvidia could beat the 290 was the drivers using more CPU on Nvidia for FPS, while the 290 was hardware scheduled. This later backfired when games needed the CPU, and Vulkan DESTROYED dx11.

Thx for this awesome video. Can you do the same comparison between GTX 1060 and RX 480? It would be interesting.

I bought the 980Ti launch week, upgrading from GTX660, on the marketing hype that it could push 4k resolution gaming. This was not the case and left me without a reason to upgrade monitors as well.

@OCtheG

Жыл бұрын

Same. That card single-handedly soured me on 4K entirely, I prefer 240Hz 1440p these days. Worse than RTX on in terms of performance loss for no real benefit

This is the content I was looking for. In-depth and detailed benchmark comparisons.

R9 290X was the 4090 of it's time. That shit was a beast

This channel seems to be something different from the much larger channels out there. I like your technical knowledge and how you presented the data. Just want to know, if I want to get the cheaper AMD cards for Blender, is the reason AMD is behind Nvidia for Blender a lack of support or a hardware limitation, and is it possible to find open source plugins to help with AMD cards? Also, is VRAM more important for rendering or GPU speed?

Me right now: **Cries in 3070 8GB**

Nice vide and music selection

The 290x may seem like it's lacking in most Game tests but it doesn't dip as bad as 780ti and can't keep it's frame rate steady as the 290x. One reason why I'm buying the new AMD GPUs.

AMD was ahead of the game and the market had no clue.

you sir have one of the rare hardware channels worth subing Very NICE vid , thanks for the huge effort

Man, you're SEVERELY underrated, hope one day you'll become as big as LTT)

fun fact: at some point in 2016-2018 AMD unintentionally ripped out optimizations for UE3 engine titles, knocking performance down in games like Unreal Tournament 3 by up to 30% and necessitating the use of DXVK to claw back what was lost.

wow great video. thanks for all the work you put into it.

great video. congrats on all the work done. hope you hit 10k subs soon!

Really good video saw NVIDIA Driver video from linus he actually explained well about 780ti techpowerup should refresh that performance chart by playing new game until driver discontinues

While this is true, I don't think this applies to most people, since most people replace their GPU after 3 or 4 years (some rich people every 2 years), so they wouldn't see the effect of this aging

Having 16gb Vram has already proved that 8gb for 4k these days isn't enough

@tryharder1053

Жыл бұрын

I easily ran into vram limit on 3070ti thankfully I sold mine for over msrp in the shortage and now I got the 3090 for the same cash I got on the 3070 lmao

@Wasmachineman

Жыл бұрын

Even at 1600p 8GB isn't enough. t. 13GB VRAM usage in VRChat

@joemarais7683

Жыл бұрын

@@Wasmachineman not exactly a fair assessment, considering VR chat is horribly unoptimized for vram. It’s like saying there’s not enough vram on any card cause my shitty college game project used 32GB VRAM at 4K.

@cyjanek7818

Жыл бұрын

@@joemarais7683 not really fair comparison since there are much better choices than shitty college game but there are no other options for VRAM. Doesnt matter who is at fault, what matters is that now it is either playable or not

Well if you still have any doubts about TechPowerUp Just check their RX 6000 series Notes or conclusions.

This is an excellent quality video, congrats!

I kinda feel for anyone who bought into 780/780ti series. (cash grab) When the following spring came along little Maxwell came out. (750ti) I managed to get a GTX 680 on launch day back in 2012 and wasn't ready for an upgrade until the GTX 970 released. AMD's fine wine really does shine years later.

Great Video. Thank You

neat channel, subscribed

I wonder how the older games would perform using dxvk

Nice review REALLY NICE REVIEW I had to comment when you showed how Metro Last Light actually favored the R9 290X in dynamic scenes

good info graphic visual!

FINALY someone talkin about it

I feel like I need your entire music playlist

I know that obviously my GPU is still considered new but: In January 2020 I had the choice between an rtx 2060 and an rx 5600 xt. I heard that they were neck in neck but AMD came out on top in some games, and that overall it was like 3% faster. At first I was actually devastated because the game I mostly played back then was Minecraft, and Minecraft HIGHLY favours nvidia cards, so I was already at a reasonable disadvantage against nvidia cards. I put that aside though, and through me optimizing my stuff I managed to get it to the same level as an RTX 2060 in a game where it's supposed to have half the FPS. In every other game though (CS, Valorant, Quake Champions, BeamNG, Automation etc.) the GPU flew. By mid 2021 the drivers had gotten so optimized that my card could actually be compared to an RTX 2070 (it was like 5-10% slower but still way closer to a 2070 than a 2060). In early 2022, I discovered Nimez drivers, which allowed me to enable SAM on the card, which brought it even closer to 2070 levels of performance (still slightly behind). In Summer 2022 AMD dropped a BOMBSHELL with the new 22.7.1 driver which gave a performance boost as high as 97% in OpenGL applications. I downloaded it and my FPS in Minecraft SKYROCKETED from 2000-2400 ALL THE WAY to 5000 (although to be frank I stopped playing a while ago so it wasn't that important). This leads us to today. Where, by using NimeZ 22.10.2 drivers and having a healthy 1820 all core oc with 1860 on the memory, I managed to surpass an rtx 2070 (it was the lowest spec 2070, but a 2070 nonetheless. Keep in mind the card was worth like 300$ when I bought it. I think I made a good decision.

I have a pc which i built throughout 2012-2013, intel 5570k and r9280 (or 280x ) 4gb, started with 8gb ram now i run it with 16. Most games still run in medium to low settings, i can even go high in less demanding titles. I have run in some optimization problems in the past and even now there are games that go 100% on CPU while GPU is more like 50-70%. Unfortunately due to budget limitations back then i could never get 100% the experience and performance i expected from my build, that 8gb ram haunted me for years but i am not doing the same mistake this time. But i cna legit say that i can efficiently run titles before 2019 very efficiently.

Man, the 780Ti is shameful on not even starting up on newer AAA games. SMH. the 290X on the other hand aged like a very fine wine.

I'd also say the 780ti is atleast more future proof than a 3070(ti)/3080 the 3070 doesn't even have enough Vram for some 1080p games at very high settings. Its powerful enough but the Vram won't let it. And considering both of them costed more than 1000euros at the time, its unacceptable to need to tweak the settings that much already for some games.

@Kiporino

Жыл бұрын

3GB of vram still enough today, i have 1060 3gb, and i gonna use it for 3-4 more years

@tilburg8683

Жыл бұрын

@@Kiporino even for 1080p 3 gigs is lacking on mid to low settings depending on the game. You can make do, but its a big issue.

@Kiporino

Жыл бұрын

​@@tilburg8683 lol people still use 750 Ti. 3 GB ezzzz for high enough

@tilburg8683

Жыл бұрын

@@Kiporino not even close sorry. For max settings 8 isn't enough at 1080p in fh5. Like at low with some mid settings 3 is enough but just enough.

Amazing study! Subbed.

There is even a more recent example of AMDs forward thinking. remember the gt1030 being the pick for small ultra budget "gaming pcs"? Compare it now with a rx 550 in recent games.

@HardwareLab

Жыл бұрын

To be fair 1030 always was a pretty bad gpu in comparison and 550 was almost always an obvious choice. However, 1030 was a bit cheaper and easier to find

@HardwareLab

Жыл бұрын

I think better example of 2016 is rx 580 and gtx 1060

amazing video on the topic!!! not a lot of creators cover older hardware and how valuable it can still be to people with a very low budget. one minor complaint i have with the video is how you present the benchmarks with no voiceovers for honestly an annoyingly long time. the video could be a few minutes shorter without the full benchmarking footage while getting the same idea and data across. having 1%/0.1% lows to better show off stutters could also improve the data presented more.

Food for thought.... TPU's Relative performance chart rates the GTX 780ti ahead of the GTX 1650... but there's a benchmark from Testing Games that shows the GTX 780ti being trounced by the GTX 1650 in modern games. Although Kepler aged poorly because its terrible at handling newer API's and they lack VRAM. People were literally giving their GTX 770's away come 2017 because of this.

I wached everything start to finish. Sir you got a subscriber here. Do a 390 vs 980 next. I had both cards and I think the 390 still to this day a great card

great comparison, love to see a video on rx 580 and gtx 1060

I choosed _XFX merc319 rx6750xt black_ for 599€ in June 2022 over used RTX3070 of any kind starting at 650€, i don't use RT and i'm already getting same perfomance in nvidia sponsored titles and better avg scores + consistency/latency in all the others games. We will see if this gpu will keep me outstand a 3070 in raster 1080p@144Hz and 1440p@144hz until at least rdna4 🤔 I went from gtx970 directly to this rx6750xt and the jump it's 💥 edit: i use s.a.m. with r7-5800x, running the vram maxed out at 2312mhz + fast timings along with oc at 2823Mhz + small undervolt at 1152mV and +6%PL. I got 14530pts (gfx score) in 3Dmark TymeSpy, 14988pts in furmark donut 1080p, 9380pts in furmark donut 1440p. (1000+ pts than a 3070 in 3Dmark, better scores than a 3070ti in furmark donut ) _i can tell amd framerates feels smoother_ like JayTwoCents said 🤣

17:54 the music in BMG sounds like 2010 pop : Electronic

good video! keep up the good work!

the only problem that i am still skeptical is the age old meme of "is the AMD drivers good">?. i could of got a rx 480 but sadly couldn't get one during the whole Crypto era 2015. i just can't live with out RTX VOICE/Broadcast on my rtx 3060ti. But that Steamdeck on AMD APU is such a great fit

Great thumbnail!

The Fury cards were limited by extraneous factors. Once AMD decided to go with HBM, they were limited by the size of the largest interposer on the market, and the size of HBM chips themselves. 4GB is the max they could have had at the time. Still, it took quite a while for that to become a real handicap.

Thats why I love AMD cards! I'm a litle bit worried about 8GB Vram on mine 3060Ti, the card it's a beast but it's in the limite of Vram.

@crisschan2463

Жыл бұрын

its only limited if you want to run games in ultra settings (games this day have 4k textures for ultra and some games have more) games should put a texture resolution in their setting so we are not fixated by a mere word of "low", "ultra" and/or "extreme" because it gives us a fomo if our cards would even be decent enough for that settings

@86FCS

Жыл бұрын

@@crisschan2463 Cards that had much more longevity from amd vs nvidia: HD7970 3GB vs GTX680 2GB, R9 290x 4GB vs GTX 780 3GB, GTX480 8GB vs GTX1060 3GB model...

I was thinking of getting a GTX 780 but this made my mind up for a R9 290 or Fury

@MasoMathiou

Жыл бұрын

I'd advice you to go for something less high end but more recent for better drivers support. Something like the GTX 1660 for exemple or AMD equivalent

@satoshi649

Жыл бұрын

@@MasoMathiou I’d like to but they’re incredibly overpriced for what they give

@Wasmachineman

Жыл бұрын

Just get a RX580 if you're poor.

nice production, well done

I really wanted to see a comparison chart (charts) at the end. Show averages by year. Chart % by each API. Etc.

@agsel

Жыл бұрын

But he is against summarizing and indexing, that's the whole point of the video