If anyone still cares here apparently the supply trucks are not fake, but if they don't have means of getting to the industry they will teleport, if they have a way of getting there the traffic is very real, so if you play as "intended" and provide connection supposedly it works as expected.

Shoulda connected the commercial zone to residential by the footpath /subway so employees but not trucks could access, the # employees raises the company's efficiency and increases profitability score regardless of sales

@EVO_CS

8 ай бұрын

Good thought! ✌️Definitely would've resulted in more conclusive evidence regarding whether the increase in profitability was due to labor access or road access to the local industry area.

A thought coming to mind regarding the increase in company profitability after restoring the road connection at 14:00. Given that the profitability didn't increase after zoning local industry, another possible reason for it increasing after restoring the road connection is that the commercial zone has finally received access to the industrial zone. E.g. industry products were inaccessable to commercial zone buildings. - Rather than it having anything to do with the accessability of labor. This will be tested in a potential 3rd episode by adding residential into the same severed grid as commercial. - If reconencting that grid back to the main road and granting it access to industry also ends up increasing the profitability of commercial zones once again, the cause was the industry access. Rather than the labor access.

@Ranger89212

8 ай бұрын

yes I agree with this theory. since there was no roads connected to the commercial grid, it was "scriptly" allocating materials from outside while continuing to operate a lower margins, when you connected the roads. materials where easily accesible therefore theoretically increasing the business margins.

I think they are basically running several independent simulations based only on the population number. It is incredibly resource consuming to track every single citizen commuting, being educated, going to the hospital when sick, etc. It's also incredibly resource consuming to track every ton of freight at all times, associate all types of cost to it (import, export, time of delivery, availability, rarity, etc.). That's a lot of data to sync and track. So instead they just run the traffic simulation based on the number of people and buildings. Some parts of the simulation break when there's no road connection like the employees one, but not the profitability because it's another independent system They run the education simulation the same way and occasionally spawn a vehicle or two scaled tot the size of the population. I even saw a post about each citizen changing appearance for each respawn. By doing this they split the game simulations on different CPU cores with not much inter-process communication (which is extremely time consuming) to make the game faster.

01:00 - Disclaimer 01:15 - Self-sustainable commercial experiment (Investigation #1) 03:32 - Initial stockpile 03:58 - local services impacting experiment 04:42 - Commercial acknowledging severed connection 04:59 - Initial Commercial profitability overview 05:30 - Staring at stockpile again 06:40 - Staring at stockpile again, again 07:06 - Deleting Commercial to see if consumption remains 07:40 - Staring at stockpile after deleting commercial 08:17 - Deleted but not dezoned. Luckily sells different product. 09:11 - Shifting experiment. Full commercial, no industry. 09:42 - Observing industry zone with no access to supply / labor. 10:52 - Looking at company profitability with no access to supply / labor. 11:46 - Mass zoning industry to see if local industry still affects severed commercial zone. 11:55 - Returning to company profitability overview. 12:42 - Restoring road connection to commercial zone. 13:13 - Company profitability overview with road connection. 15:20 - Local Specialized Industry (Investigation #2) 16:30 - Zoning locally produced chicken 18:48 - Further increasing local production. 19:06 - Specialized Industry delivering to Local Industry 19:26 - Industry profitability overview after matching local chicken demand. 20:34 - Manipulating economy through taxation (Investigation #3) 21:10 - Industry Profitability after taxation changes. 21:46 - Rezoning industry to see if new companies lean towards livestock. 23:20 - Pattern amidst most profitable companies 24:24 - Adjusting Commercial taxation to see if it impacts industry profitability. 25:06 - Checking if Commercial Zone was impacted by taxation. 26:45 - Conclusion, Thoughts, Rambling. 27:15 - Severing Industry road connection (Investigation #3) 27:45 - Severed Industry Profitability Timelapse 28:14 - Recap and "conclusions" 28:30 - Unemployment affected by road connection / impact on profitability. 30:27 - Unemployment post road connection restored

I can't believe I paid so much for this game.

@DhruvBurman

8 ай бұрын

I can't believe I downloaded the crack for free -__-

@aresivrc1800

8 ай бұрын

Hey.... while I freely admit that the launch was dissapointing, overall CO and Paradox are the good kind of developers and publishers worth supporting. @@DhruvBurman

It would be interesting to redo these tests with the latest patch. There seems to be some updates regarding the simulation as well

You should have just connected the commercial zone for pedestrian

11:30 You can workaround the lack of labor by adding a pedestrian street to the commercial zone

Company profitability is definitely tied to customers. Once you put the connection back on, there were both employees and customers. I think a better way to test that out is to connect by pedestrian paths so workers and customers can still arrive, but cut off all road connections.

@EVO_CS

8 ай бұрын

Absolutely! 100% slipped my mind in the moment and is on the list for things to explore in a potential 3rd episode. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!

@Alexander_Grant

8 ай бұрын

@@EVO_CS Absolutely, looking forward to the 3rd episode! I've been trying to find someone to explore these mechanics more, and you're the only one I can find on KZread. I spent a ton of times in games like Workers and Resources, Factorio, and Transport Fever, so I'm used to my resources all being tracked. This game has really confused me with how it handles all of that with how I'm used to treating industry.

you could try disconnecting the comercials again, but also put some residential so u have no labour prolems...

@EVO_CS

8 ай бұрын

That's a good idea! ✌️ The intent of severing the connections was to see if commercial businesses could survive without any access to labor, outside connections, or industry zones. As well as to see if restoring the road connection would show any effect. The latter was the case, as the productivity of the commercial zone increased as soon as they were able to receive labor. That said, it is a good idea for another experiment focused on whether residential areas can sustain severed roads. Because if it could, we could simply zone residential and commercial zones together, like you suggest, and then have commercial just as productive as if it had a road connection to a functioning residential zone.

@aresivrc1800

8 ай бұрын

Idea: Maybe you should connect residential to commercial and industrial. First you allow outside connections so that people can move in. Then you sever the outside connection but still allowing an connection between residential and industrial and commercial. That way you could test commercial and industrial profitability with a workforce/mitigate the effect of workforce coming in.

@EVO_CS

8 ай бұрын

​@@aresivrc1800 Hey! That's a great idea. After all, the 'evidence' we found in the video regarding the increase in profitability after reconnecting the commercial zone to the road network wasn't conclusive on whether it was due to access to local industry or workforce. I'll definitely take some notes on further experiments. Another viewer also commented on his findings that, while taxes don't affect current businesses, they do affect what kind of industries newly arrived citizens choose to work in. So there are a few more things to test out on that list already.

Sad times when a sequel arrives 8 years after the first, within the month almost more people are playing the original than the sequel.

You also can build a working city without citizens its really funny how good the Simulation is 😅

There were vehicles traveling to the warehouse you should have followed them to see if where they were going. When you still had the hospital and the guy on the bike was delivering to them all you had to do was follow him and see if he went to the hospital.

@EVO_CS

8 ай бұрын

If you are talking about the timelapse at 6:50 and the likes, you can reduce the video's playback speed to 0.25 and see for yourself that these were only employees and police vehicles. As for the hospital bike. I certainly could've follwed it. But what I wanted to see was whether or not the commercial zone requested goods from the warehouse. The hospital requesting goods only scewed the experiment and was thus irrelevant for that particular experiment. - Good thoughts, though!

@arklainquirk

8 ай бұрын

@@EVO_CS I did go back and slow it down but it's still moving really fast, however there was another deliverer bike that showed up at ~6:64 (the medical stock dropped at the same time), and it looked like a white van parked but without clicking on them it's imposable to know if they are employes or delivery vehicles. I also know that with other warehouse buildings the delivery vehicles actual drive into the building where the garage doors are, and it looked like several of the vehicles drove into the building but at those speeds it was too hard to be sure of.

@EVO_CS

8 ай бұрын

Hey! I went through my local recordings again, and the vehicles that went inside the garage are always police cars. As for the other vehicles and "vans", those are the four-door, cube-looking civilian cars, which park on the parking spots in front of the building. If you're curious, I can upload slowed down versions of the raw footage and upload them for you.

@arklainquirk

8 ай бұрын

@@EVO_CS No that's ok you don't have to do that.

you have to use city statistics to check how many companies for each good you have

@EVO_CS

8 ай бұрын

Hey! Good catch. ✌️ I've actually tried this out after finalizing the video and couldn't observe any conclusive development. Simply changing the taxes and letting the simulation run for 1-2 months didn't change the number of industries in any way, and every re-zoning distributed the industries with a small enough margin to still be potentially random and not impacted by taxation. Due to the inconclusive nature of the data, I've not bothered editing, re-rendering and re-uploading the video given that it would've significantly affected the upload schedule. That said, thank you kindly for pointing it out. I've already put it on my list of things to revisit or test in a potential third video. Though, as things currently stand, other than for a complete deletion of outside connections as well as adding residential zoning into severed commercial zoning to see whether the increase in company profitability was related to workforce availability or having a road connection to local industries, I currently don't have enough things worth investigating on my list.

@Lemmy4555

8 ай бұрын

​@@EVO_CS I’ve discovered that the only way to alter the ratio of industries is by increasing the population. It seems that once citizens secure a job in a specific industry that produce a specific good, they are reluctant to change their employment. Therefore, adjusting taxes or rezoning doesn’t have much impact. However, when new residents move in, they tend to prefer industries with lower taxation. Furthermore, demolishing residential buildings doesn’t seem to work because residents will remain in your city as homeless individuals. Consequently, when you rebuild the residential areas, the population will rapidly return to its original number. About company profitability, seems like decreasing electicity fees and provide good internet connection have a much greater impact than lowering taxes but some industries are inheritably not profitable (eg: timber as you observed as well, in my city timber industries are always yellow/orange)

@EVO_CS

8 ай бұрын

That's great insight! Thank you very much for sharing it. I'll be sure to credit you. Should I ever find myself inclined to verify your findings in a 3rd video!

I love the game, but im having a weird problem. I have all the patches and i have zero garbage collection, no recycling, and no incinerator and neighborsing cities are sending garbage trucks to get my trash... for free?

@EVO_CS

8 ай бұрын

Hey! ✌ It's pretty well established that services provided by outside connections are too cheap. There also isn't any supply / demand calculation. E.g. outside connections will always pay the same amount of money regardless of how much electricity / water you sell. I have an episode in the workings, exploring the cost of outside connection services and a few other things related to the subject.

Its a new game give them time

I think its government assistance since your population is low.

Yikes... so workers and goods can "spawn" in to commercial with no connections whatsoever. Confirmed teleportation of workers and goods. I am glad I refunded when I had the chance. Hopefully they make the sim better.

It's called a facade. A false face or covering meant to hide or disguise what is occurring behind it. The entire game is a facade. A pale, almost translucent, facade.

There are failsafes to keep a city running if you bulldoze connections. Devs made this clear a few weeks ago...

@EVO_CS

8 ай бұрын

I don't recall having claimed otherwise. ✌️