They lesson of the peasant's revolt is never trust promises from people in power unless you can keep them under threat. The peasants took the king's word, and they paid dearly for that mistake

@kikijewell2967

14 күн бұрын

Same for America today... We're fed up with being lied to and close to desperation.

@skateboardingjesus4006

14 күн бұрын

​@@kikijewell2967 That's because both political parties have the masses at each other's throats over ideological positions, whilst they still serve the same corporate masters. Republicans unfortunately are pandering to religious zealotry and backwards sentiments, while a large swathe of Democrats are playing their version of the same fanatically tribalistic game.

@Blastoice

14 күн бұрын

We need to have a peasants revolt in the uk

@legateelizabeth

14 күн бұрын

The King was also 14. I don’t think he was really in control of much of anything - he agreed, and then went to meet the rebels after, at which point *somebody else entirely* broke the revolt in London. Which ironically was their point. The rebels wanted to keep their king, they just felt like his advisors and vassals needed replacing. Funnily enough, Richard seemed to agree - as he grew into an adult he clamped down quite strongly on the aristocracy, and between the pressure from above in Richard and the pressure from below in evoking the memory of the revolt, the peasants got their wish: no new taxes to that degree were levied again, and Richard did in fact try to neuter the people the peasants pointed the finger at - up until he was deposed, of course.

@alanfike

14 күн бұрын

​​@@skateboardingjesus4006The only ones keeping Americans from informing themselves are themselves. I say this as a disappointed American. Political parties aren't your parents to rebel against, but that's how it sounds from the whining.

When your tax collector is not only agreeing that taxes are too high but that it's so high that they are willing to join a revolt to storm the castle you know the taxes are bad. 😂

"The peasants are revolting!" "Oh, come on, they may be a bit smelly, but they're not THAT bad."

@glstka5710

13 күн бұрын

Or... "The peasants are revolting"..."Your pretty repulsive yourself"😆

@thelocalgoose

12 күн бұрын

I don't remember but is that an OVERSIMPLIFIED reference!?!

@Tjalve70

12 күн бұрын

@@thelocalgoose I don't think so, but I wouldn't be surprised if he's said the same thing.

@SchlossRitter

11 күн бұрын

History of the World, part 1 (It's an old movie)

Well if you’re one guard at a door, and a couple hundred people turn up, “Do come in. Mind the garden plants, thank you.”

"I think we should give the guards a raise" "Why would we want to do that?"

People always talk about how the peasants are revolting, but I think the nobility is often more revolting...

@doncook2054

14 күн бұрын

Agreed....cool stuff, but rancid all the same.

Adore your delivery of “someone let them in” made me chuckle :)

It's a great story... but also proof that real change takes a long time. Serfdom lasted another century and more. Some of what they asked repeatedly thru these protests and on to the civil war in the 1650s, and it still took another 250-300 years to become part of law and culture.

@seeibe

14 күн бұрын

Or it may be a lesson that nothing ever changes. Just a different group becomes the ones to be exploited.

@tonyharpur8383

14 күн бұрын

In fact Queen Elizabeth I 'sold' some 200 serfs to one of her Courtiers in the period 1560-1590 so that he could make money by 'selling' them their freedom. Not all medieval peasants were poor.

@Rumade

14 күн бұрын

There's a great quote by Ursula le Guin that says, "We live in capitalism. Its power seems inescapable. So did the divine right of kings. Any human power can be resisted and changed by human beings."

@thoughtfuloutsider

Күн бұрын

@@seeibe that's a little bleak... I think there are solid reasons to believe that the distribution of power, wealth and the nature of violence has transformed considerably through the 600 years. Suggested reading you may like to argue with is "better Angels of our Nature".

I for one welcome our new co-host, bird-on-windowsill

There’s an old saying: No wall is too high, for a donkey loaded with gold!

"That was new" The French taxing the peasants exclusively to pay for everything

One common thing to be aware of when looking at medieval history in Western Europe: most of the sources come from the societal elites (clergy, noble courtiers, or Church-trained clerks) for whom "literate" meant "fluent in Latin". Many merchants and wealthier peasants would have been quite literate in their native languages but not have access to Latin education and so not considered literate by Church-trained writers. And with most writing of the period being preserved by churches, monasteries, universities, and the private collections of the nobility, whatever writing the lower classes might have produced is mostly lost.

@bun197

14 күн бұрын

John ball’s sermons can still be read and he was a massive component of the revolt. We have plenty of vulgar/ vernacular writing especially from the middle english period

I love the bird didn't chirp. It chirruped. That's how you know it is a British bird!

@alanfike

14 күн бұрын

She had an adorable revolter at the window.

I really love that they just destroyed the tax records and not the other books!

The title made me think of an old Wizard of Id comic. Knight: The peasants are revolting! King: You can say that again.

From Mel Brooks: Lord: "Your majesty, the peasants are revolting!" King: "They certainly are!" :P

@denisphelan8987

4 күн бұрын

I was thinking the same thing while watching the video. 😂😂

I love your enthusiasm, it's lovely. Thanks again, British Lady

The fact that even the tax collectors thought it was BS says a lot! As well as the other revolters (revolutionaries?) allowing them to be there without automatically blaming them for their orders.

Who led the Peasants Revolt? Wat Tyler Who led the Pedants Revolt? Which Tyler

Its not a Poll Tax, its a community charge. Peasants - We'll give you a community charge... You lot ready?

“Long shorts” 😂 Love seeing the English Language developing lol

@fariesz6786

13 күн бұрын

you can't really categorize a video as trousers now can you? 😜

@thelocalgoose

12 күн бұрын

@@fariesz6786 lol good one 😂😆

@fariesz6786

12 күн бұрын

@@thelocalgoose always happy when a fellow avian approves ( ")

@hairyairey

4 күн бұрын

​@@fariesz6786US company - meaning the video would be pants

Please please please do a long version of this. I LOVE this chapter of British history.

‘When Adam delved and Eve span, Who then was the gentleman?’ Ideas were raised in the Peasants’ Revolt that wouldn’t really be revisited in England until the Civil War era - ideas of social and political reform that were still strongly rooted in Christian theology, because the secularisation of political theory in the Enlightenment had yet to occur. A fascinating event, centuries ahead of its time. Growing up in St. Albans, I used to walk past the site at which many of the leaders were executed every day.

@Rumade

14 күн бұрын

Sing John Ball and tell it to them all...

Thanks for making history interesting and in short snippets. Always interesting.

To be fair, the king was willing to hear them. The peasants didn’t want to overthrow the king, they thought he was being held hostage by evil advisors. But Watt Tyler basically acted a fool in front of the king and was very rude (because they don’t teach etiquette to serfs, duh). I once heard it described as like someone going up to the king, putting his arm around him, giving him a noogie, and patting him on the back saying “ayy, you’re a bloody good ‘un.”

'When Adam delved and Eve span, who was then the gentleman?' I'm mostly pro-Peasant's Revolt because of all the calls to abolish the nobility and hold all land in common. But they did do some absolutely disgusting massacres of immigrants, particularly targeting 'Flemings', i.e. Dutch speakers from modern-day Belgium. Definitely not cool.

@Orochimaruswife1

13 күн бұрын

Yeah, that's one of the issues with revolutions historically. Because maybe the revolution needs to happen, but if most of the people in the area hate a tiny group of people they weren't allowed to hurt as much or at all before, especially if that group was a scapegoat for the ruling class, things get real bad real quick. Studying history can be super frustrating when it's like "that guy was cool- oh no wait he did X messed up thing."

@karenk2409

12 күн бұрын

Thank you, real history is never neat and I've yet to find a group of saints (except self-proclaimed, of course)!

@LadyTylerBioRodriguez

7 күн бұрын

Its almost darkly funny that nobody could blame Jews for this because Edward 1st already kicked them out. So some people went ehhh Flemish people are close enough since cities like Ghent and Ypres were wealthy and many Flemish merchants did business in England.

@chrisball3778

21 сағат бұрын

@@LadyTylerBioRodriguez I feel pretty confident in saying that they'd have murdered any Jews they'd come across if there'd been any living openly in England at the time. I'm not 100% on why they targeted the Flemish, but I have a vague memory that the Flemish community was involved in wool processing and exports. Middlemen in any trade are uniquely positioned to rip off one or the other side in the transaction, and are frequently the objects of suspicion. Millers were also popular medieval hate figures for similar reasons. Wool was one of England's most important industries in the 14th century, and if the rebels felt 'Flemings' were holding out on the profits, then that might be why they were targeted by racist mobs.

@LadyTylerBioRodriguez

21 сағат бұрын

@@chrisball3778 Cloth yep. Ypres was the cloth capital of Europe for many many years, the Great Cloth Hall was the largest non religious building on the continent. A lot of cloth merchants traded with England and well some English citizens didn't much care for that. The financial advisor for Edward III was also Flemish and infamously corrupt.

This channel and Horrible Histories is what got me into learning about history

@theemmjay5130

14 күн бұрын

You might want to check out The History Guy, one of my favorite KZread channels. He covers a lot of forgotten and overlooked history.

What wonderful timing! I was just reading about Johanna Ferrour. Cosmic coincidence. Also what a name for an archbishop. Sir Simon Sudbury

@kimhill3614

4 күн бұрын

Looking up Johanna Ferrour now!

The background of this is the uniform wage laws of 1349-1351. After black death reduced the work force to keep nobles costs down. The death of Prince Edward in 1376,King Edward III in 1377 and the Ascent of his 14 year old Grandson Richard II. The Regents raised taxes and didn't allow wages to rise. Plus women where hardest hit as they earned less than men.

The peasants are revolting! Finally, something we can agree on.

@readmachine18

14 күн бұрын

Lol, Chicken Run semi-quote?? 😂 Or was Chicken Run referencing something else? 😝

@jeffdeupree7232

14 күн бұрын

@@readmachine18 It’s from Mel Brooks’ History of the World Part 1.

@readmachine18

14 күн бұрын

@@jeffdeupree7232 Thank you! 😄

I only became aware of this event recently. And not from a history book or docu. But from a novel called _Call Me Stan: A Tragedy in Three Millennia_ about an inmortal Hittite who in the 14th Century ends up in England working as a craftsman and unwittingly takes part in this revolt. Pretty good book, the author did a good job with his historical research. It did mention how the guards let them in, it also mentioned about the masacre of Flemish weavers. It prompted me to read further into some events, including the Peasants' Revolt of 1381.

With increasing rents and mortgages and ever decreasing wages workers might revolt again 🔥👷🏻👩‍🍳👩‍🏭🛠️🪚🧰🔩

@karenk2409

12 күн бұрын

Aaaand ... they have, many, many times!

I was just listening to ASMR Historian on the Black Death and he recommended learning about the Peasants' Revolt, so this video came at an opportune time.

@jestermon101

13 күн бұрын

ASMR on the black death? 🤨 I fail to see how that would be relaxing.

@sluggo206

13 күн бұрын

@@jestermon101 He does many, many topics, mostly on European history. The Black Death was an important part of European history: the depopulation and migrations affected Europe's economy and politics for centuries afterward. Most of it was OK, except the details of the diseases (three diseases); he warned, "You may not want to listen to this while you're eating." There also exists a kind of dark ASMR, meant to be spooky or a thriller. Only a few channels have done that, but it exists.

@jestermon101

13 күн бұрын

@@sluggo206 Dark ASMR? I had no idea that was a thing.

@sluggo206

13 күн бұрын

@@jestermon101 I made up the term to describe it. I've encountered a few videos with topics/moods I'd find unsettling and un-ASMR-ish, like ghost stories. But they're intentionally unsettling, and some people seem to like those. If ASMR is really about evoking a feeling, then people may start to experiment with evoking other feelings.

@jestermon101

13 күн бұрын

@@sluggo206 Huh. I suppose the term fits. I always thought ASMR was meant to relax but i guess any emotion will do.

It is always a pleasure to learn from you. Thank you.

This felt like a Quest for the Holy Grail skit

"Serfdom was unjust" Spoken like a true peasant!

Well said. Tony Robinson (who played Baldrick) was in a great documentary that explored this in depth. One of the great moments in British history :)

@cartoonraccoon2078

14 күн бұрын

"Yes, we know: Sod off Baldrick"

Always a pleasure to learn something from you...good job, as usual!

I'm fascinated by the storytelling and, as a hetero woman (that's intended as some kind of objectidication disclaimer I guess), also by J Draper's absolutely radiant beauty. I'd love to paint her. But I don't know her. Or how to paint.

@PhoebeFayRuthLouise

14 күн бұрын

Funny and true!

I was personally hoping to hear more from Mr Bird 🐦

They had the world's best slogan too! The Adam and Eve one...

She was acquitted of all charges

@tobybartels8426

14 күн бұрын

Presumably by a jury of her peers.

Posting about collective action on May Day is awesome

I'm reminded that the Castillo de San Marcos in St. Augustine, Florida was only taken by an enemy force once in its history. At the start of the U.S. Civil War, Confederate forces were able to take it from the one (1) Union soldier stationed there. He did insist on and received a receipt for the fort to give his commanding officer.

@prestongarvey7745

14 күн бұрын

It took a while but he was able to get a return. Eventually.

@ArdisMeade

14 күн бұрын

@@prestongarvey7745 Less a return, more that it was found abandoned when the Rebs fled the city because they heard Union troops were approaching.

The Peasants’ Revolt of 1381 and my family connection. The Rebellion began on 12 June 1381 and shortly afterward the rebels captured and beheaded John Cavendish Chief Justice of the King’s Bench before robbing his home at Hardwick Hall. His son John Cavendish was present when Wat Tyler met with Richard II and William Walworth, Lord Mayor of London. When Wat attempted to stab Walworth he slashed Wat with his sword across the head and neck. John Cavendish then delivered the fatal blow to Wat Tyler. John Cavendish the elder was the 9th great grandfather of William Cavendish 3rd Duke of Devonshire who married my 8th great Aunt Catherine Hoskins. I descend from two generations of indentured British orphan children who descend from a Liverpool pub owner whose parents were listed on page 300 of the Plantagenet Roll of the Blood Royal descended from King Edward III. About a decade ago while researching my family history I had a chat with a descendant of Wat Tyler and we had an interesting discussion on our shared connection to this story. It’s funny the places my research leads.

@VanderlyndenJengold

14 күн бұрын

The story I heard was that the two sides entered a parley and the toffs simply killed Wat Tyler is a dastardly, cowardly fashion. A terrible shame.

Would like a longer video on this fwiw.

I'd love to see this over the next few weeks

Have you ever heard an anecdote and then never heard it again in your life? My friend with a PhD in English Lit says that peasants revolts were MORE common during medieval times, and that it was not unheard of for peasants to completely obliterate the home of the landed gentry. Does that sound . . . like a real thing? I'd love more data on that.

The peasants are revolting. You can say that again.

@elizamccroskey1708

13 күн бұрын

Sadly many of the leaders are too.

@sjmww1235

13 күн бұрын

They stink on ice

Love ya, girl. Keep it up! 👍🏻 🎉❤

🗣breathtakingly beautiful analysis/dissection🖤

Oh look, it's May Day!

A second peasants’ revolt is not far off, given the current trajectory of the country.

@doncook2054

14 күн бұрын

yes, indeed.

@roguishpaladin

13 күн бұрын

Presuming you are talking about the UK, you're not peasants and have so many more rights than peasants had, including the ability to achieve non-violent change for your country through elections. Vote and understand that your neighbor very likely has a different political viewpoint and does not deserve death for that.

@doncook2054

13 күн бұрын

@@roguishpaladin You didn't get it ... the 1% is squeezing anyone not making 500K a year-they did away with the tax-breaks we had for generations-the conditions are way-too ripe for it--inevitable.

@roguishpaladin

4 күн бұрын

@@doncook2054 Well, that's a dose of slippery slope arguing. I agree that the 1% has too much influence, but the fundamental mechanics of voting are still untainted. People voted for folks who would do these things, so find out what makes them so appealing and work against it instead of calling yourself a peasant.

@doncook2054

4 күн бұрын

@@roguishpaladin voting is being interfered with by the 1% reich-wing tRitler SS--paid for by Putin.... now it's Very tainted....

How about short longs, "The peasants are revolting!" ...

I have to imagine the bird was just as curious as we all were! Also, if I may ask, what flavor of Monster was that? I'm curious what you have there versus in the States. Thanks much!

Perhaps leading to this observation by Orwell in the 1930s after he mentions how the working class are beaten down by petty inconvenience of bureaucracy "A person of bourgeois origin goes through life with some expectation of getting what he wants, within reasonable limits. Hence the fact that in times of stress "educated " people tend to come to the front; they are no more gifted than the others and their " education " is generally quite useless in itself, but they are accustomed to a certain amount of deference and consequently have the cheek necessary to a commander.--George Orwell, 'Road to Wigan Pier'

@mathew4430

14 күн бұрын

Yeah man I love that book it’s so well written

Awe 🤗💕🫶💐 Thanks for being so good to the little 🐦 birdy!! 💕👏👏👏👏

Have you been to Fishmongers Hall and did you see the statue of Sir William Walworth and his dagger before they cut the point of the dagger off the statue?

Twenty years later Richard 2 was deposed by the nobility and his cousin Henry 6. He lived like a King but died like the criminal tyrant he was. Served him right, he was a bad, bad King. You could say the Wars of the Roses were rival factions of the nobility deposing one another in turn.

@bentilbury2002

14 күн бұрын

It was Henry IV who deposed Richard II, not Henry VI - VI was IV's grandson. But yeah, basically. Henry VI got deposed twice in fact!

@bernardrex9706

14 күн бұрын

@@bentilbury2002 Yes, you're on point, it was Henry 4! Well done... Too many Henry's! Henry 6 was the mad one.... some might say that about Henry 8!

So why did all it take to stop it was to kill Wat Tyler? After forcing the King on a barge and executing the Archbishop of Canterbury, it sounds like they gave up pretty easily.

@cassandramiller4477

14 күн бұрын

The King made a lot of promises he didn't intend to keep. The rebels, who held the king in a kind of religious awe (it was all the other nobles and officials who they believed led Richard astray) believed them--so most of them went home after Richard made the promises. There was a much smaller force with Tyler when he died...and royal reinforcements were coming. (I wrote my undergrad thesis on the Peasants' Revolt.)

@hairyairey

4 күн бұрын

​@@cassandramiller4477so a literal revolting thesis?!😂

Same story over in China. The great walls are easily 1000 times more formidable but it's always somebody on the inside letting the raiders in.

I think these many of these guys were also something like Protestants before Luther, inspired by an Oxford Scholar named Wycliff.

That bird was either Johanna or the Archbishop wanting to tell their side of the story.

The chickens.errrr peasants are revolting! Finally we agree on something

@Weazel1

14 күн бұрын

They’ve always been revolting, my lord. Now, they’re rebelling! Thought I’d mix up the movie lines a little

Damn shame how it ended though

Is that why all those monks have all those schools? It's easy to forget that power isn't easy to monopolize. Elections are better. The bird was a fan anyway.

Terry Jones' Medieval Lives: The Peasant featured this as well.

Love your channel!

Didn’t they kill random workers of foreign birth in the trades? If so, this wasn’t due to some sort of anti-guild sentiment as the rebels themselves included tradesmen like Watt Tyler (a “tiller of roofs”) and even, as mentioned, some minor gentry (such as the priest John Ball).

Hey Draper, I was curious. Are you part of a tourism agency or an independent tourism guide because I’ll be going to London for the first time next year and was wondering if you had any tours available? If not, I understand but it would be awesome to actually have you as a tour guide.

@tremorsfan

14 күн бұрын

I believe she has a website.

@hannahk1306

14 күн бұрын

I think she's mentioned before that her main job is as a London tour guide. I believe she got into content creating during the pandemic when there was a distinct lack of tourists to guide.

@johndaily263

14 күн бұрын

Her website indicates no public tours scheduled, but private ones are available.

I'm a mercenary to my dying day.

wait dont leave me in suspense

So interesting love your blogs😊

Oh I love this. Could you make a longer format about this rebellion or others? Most accounts i've heard are decidedly from the establishment POV.

Thanks!

Peasants were the best

Great May Day post ✊

Any security system is only as secure as its least secure part. Guards, unlike buildings, can be bribed, persuaded, intimidated, infiltrated and so on.

@theemmjay5130

14 күн бұрын

"The chain is no stronger than its weakest link."

@hannahk1306

14 күн бұрын

This still holds up in modern security systems: a lot of successful cyber attacks are actually due to human error (or sometimes malice), for example an employee clicking on a link they shouldn't or a disgruntled IT worker building in a backdoor which is later exploited.

@digitaljanus

14 күн бұрын

@@hannahk1306 Good old social engineering.

America, are you listening?

@jamesthedog7783

14 күн бұрын

Trying to, but I think that's fascism knocking at the door.

People think the government holds power and it does but who gives it power?

Where is my mind.

Fascinating

All the 1% that are working very hard to make the rest of us serfs keep forgetting what happened to a lot of them throughout history. And that was without industrialization and interchangeable parts.

Thank you

Taking notes ......

A similar revolt happened in the same period in France, and also in Florence (though the one in Florence was a revolt of the industry workers, not of the serfs/farmers)

Well, the leadership was literate, but most of the members were not. And once the leaders were killed the uprising was put down pretty quickly. But their cause was certainly just!

Wish i had this 7 months ago lol

Yep. Most castles, and city walls, fall to treachery.

I can see it now...come on in!

I feel like this is an appropriate May Day video, but maybe that’s more of a US thing and really doesn’t develop until the 1880s.

We all know the Ravens let them in.

You can say that again

Can you make a video on King Arthur, his excalibur and whether it is fact or fiction?

@RAFMnBgaming

14 күн бұрын

almost certainly mythology, also generally speaking way more cornwall/west country/wales centred than london centred. That being said the tale of how various dark ages and medieval "historians" assembled the arthurian legend as we know it today from pre-existing ideas, historical and mythological figures and ancestors that various noble houses made up in order to give them more legitimacy is quite interesting. Hell, the historical idea of what a historian did before we started caring about stuff like facts and the truth and stuff is also super interesting especially in terms of the effects and little left-over marks it's left on our culture.

@hive_indicator318

14 күн бұрын

Cambrian Chronicles has some good videos trying to dig out what nuggets of history are in the stories

…did you get a pic of that bird? (Also didn’t know about the tax record thing, neat!)

As i understand it, the Peasants Revolt was 1st attack on serfdom in England. It finally ended in the 1500s. ... The US had, not so much serfs, but indentured servitude and slaves. It was replaced by "wage slavery", or so the new employer/employee relationships was criticised in the US, even by Abe Lincoln's Republican Party.

@IsmailofeRegime

14 күн бұрын

Your bit about Lincoln isn't quite correct. Supporters of chattel slavery argued that the wage system was bad because it led to a permanent white underclass that was prone to moral decay and would lead to revolutions. Lincoln by contrast argued, "When one starts poor, as most do in the race of life, free society is such that he knows he can better his condition,-he knows that there is no fixed condition of labor for his whole life. I am not ashamed to confess that twenty-five years ago I was a hired laborer, mauling rails, at work on a flatboat-just what might happen to any poor man's son. I want every man to have his chance-and I believe a black man is entitled to it-in which he can better his condition-when he may look forward and hope to be a hired laborer this year and the next, work for himself afterward, and finally to hire men to work for him. That is the true system." Eric Foner's book "Free Soil, Free Labor, Free Men" talks about the ideology of the early Republican Party for those interested.

@user-em4kb3gm8g

14 күн бұрын

@@IsmailofeRegime Thanks for the comment. Are we talking here about Lincoln himself or his political party? Nonetheless, Lincoln's thoughts didn't differ much from his party. Wikipedia (on Wage Slavery) quote from Michael Sandel's 1996 "Democracy's Discontent: America's Search for a Political Philosophy" : ".... the Republicans argued that the conditions of wage workers was different from slavery as long as laborers were likely to develop the opportunity to work for themselves". ... You cite historian Eric Foner, well known for his fine work. His uncle (i think the relationship is) Philip Foner has written extensively on "Business and Slavery" ... And, quite contrary to what is commonly thought, Karl Marx himself was quite in tune to the relationship between employee and slave. Monthly Review's lengthy article "Marx and Slavery (1 July 2020) goes into some detail.

@IsmailofeRegime

14 күн бұрын

@@user-em4kb3gm8g Lincoln's attitude toward wage labor was basically in line with the rhetoric of his party at the time. I just take issue with the argument that "the new employer/employee relationship was criticised" by either Lincoln or by Republicans in general. They were not opposed to wage labor as such, as Sandel makes clear in the quote you give. To quote W.J. Ghent: "The hired laborers whom Lincoln knew were not of the factory or the mill, sustaining only an impersonal and collective relation with their employers. They were men who hired out for a time-as a rule, one or two to an employer-subsequently becoming independent producers or the employers of other men. The frontier was developing rapidly, there were no class lines, and the workman of one day was often the employer of the morrow. 'There is no permanent class of hired laborers among us,' said Lincoln in 1854; and tho the statement was by no means correct as applied to the East, it was in a large measure true of the Middle West."

@user-em4kb3gm8g

14 күн бұрын

@@IsmailofeRegime ... Lol! WJ Ghant (1866 - 1942) wrote "Our Benevolent Feudalism" in 1902 where he proposed a return to feudalism ruled by "benevolent" wealthy and powerful individuals. ... Be aware there are as many forms of socialism - as there are of capitalism - but they all stem from or were influenced by Marx. ... i cited Sandel above precisely because he agreed with your previous quote from Eric Foner's account of Lincoln. (i wasn't looking for friction.) However, in his work "Politics and Ideology" Eric Foner also quoted 1850s Republican James Ashley who said in a stump speech : "I am opposed to all forms of ownership of men, whether by the state, by corporations or by individuals ... If I must be a slave, I would rather be a slave of one man, rather than be a slave of a soulless corporation, or the slave of the state." ... Although comparing being employed for wages to slavery goes back to the Roman orator Cicero, it was the women who worked in the textile mills in Lowell, MA, in 1840s who - most all writers seem to agree - invented the phrase "wage slavery" during the fledgling stages of American Industrial Revolution

@tobybartels8426

14 күн бұрын

​@@IsmailofeRegime: I don't see where you two are in disagreement. Lincoln and his party weren't against wage work as such, as long as the worker could become independent. But wage slavery is when the worker's wage is not enough to allow them to save up enough money to leave wage work.

0:40 crack a monni o'clock.

My shepherding ancestors were unlikely to be able to read.

@alexzander7386

14 күн бұрын

Your shepherd ancestors were not the only ones there.

@johanmilde

14 күн бұрын

Shepherds were unlikely to be literate, but we have a pretty solid archaeological basis to say that basic literacy was quite widespread among people in various crafts and trades in towns and cities - usually short, everyday messages and notes on disposable bits of wood, bark and similar: “Meet me at noon”, “I own this cart”, “Your wife wants you to come home now” etc. However, with official papers mostly being written in Latin, they would still need to go to a scribe for a lot more formal documentation. Still, it could well be enough to recognise a tax record or a record of debt without having to actually know Latin.

@markevans2294

14 күн бұрын

​@@johanmildesuch a short note could also say "Tax records look like this." It would also need only one person in a group able to read Latin to say "This is what we came for."

Wat Tyler ✊️

So peasants now have higher taxes and increased job insecurity, which, together with the debt trap, feels a lot like serfdom...

@dragon12234

14 күн бұрын

Well, the thing with serfdom was very much that you had job security for good and ill. One of the most common form of serfdom was usually that you and your family had a plot of land that could support you and your family, and the lord couldn't just kick you out. But the lord did have the right to a share of the surplus of your harvest, and you had to pay taxes on marriage, and you couldn't move, and you were obligated to work on the lords personal fields as well as part of taxation for the lord "protecting" you. But you still very much had the right to enough food to support yourself, but very little freedom.