"The mouth vowel doesn't have to run away from the goat vowel" - this is a good example of how context really matters.

@musicalmarion

3 жыл бұрын

I want that on a T shirt

@Boylieboyle

3 жыл бұрын

@@musicalmarion lol

@dannygoulding

3 жыл бұрын

Ed Balls

@Symphing12

2 жыл бұрын

Instructions unclear: the mouth ran away from the goat

So after years of people claiming my accent is weird, it turns out i just speak a more traditional version of English

Voice: Insightful observations in the morphing of English vowels over time. Video: the great magpie pigeon conflict of 1687.

Let's all be glad they didn't call it the great vowel movement

@paulhood7316

3 жыл бұрын

LOL.... A SOFT VB SOOUND AT THE BEGINING LIKE SPANISH AND WE ARE ALL I TROUBLE !!!

@jakubpociecha8819

3 жыл бұрын

The great bowel movement

@SamTheMan12

3 жыл бұрын

@@jakubpociecha8819 lol

@jakubpociecha8819

3 жыл бұрын

@@SamTheMan12 I once saw someone misspell "bowel movement" as "bowl movement" lol

@SamTheMan12

3 жыл бұрын

@@jakubpociecha8819 lol

In Lanarkshire it's quite common to pronounce 'whole' as 'hale', as in "the hale lot o' them"

@insanegaming3908

3 жыл бұрын

Something similar happens here in Rural Ireland. In my area, heap is pronounced as Hape, tea pronounced as tae, meat pronounced as mate and so on.

@chrisinnes2128

2 жыл бұрын

In East Central Scotland its pronounced like hill

@b-i-c7969

2 жыл бұрын

@@chrisinnes2128 Almost a Swedish/Norwegian pronunciation :D

If you know this much about a field you are only peripherally interested in then you must really rule in your specialty.

@bakters

3 жыл бұрын

It's basically a rule, that the advancements in the field are made by the outsiders. Which mean, that he's in a prime position to do something in linguistics, but he probably sucks at archaeology... ;-)

@rogeriopenna9014

3 жыл бұрын

@@bakters a rule? can you give examples? how many physics, chemistry, etc, nobel laureates were outsiders to the fields they won the nobel?

@bakters

3 жыл бұрын

@@rogeriopenna9014 Albert Einstein - A clerk in a patent office. Nobel in physics. Francis Crick - A physicist. Nobel in Biology. Marie Curie - Private researcher, no funding. Initially no recognition too. Wilhelm Roentgen - Mechanica engineer. Hendrik Lorenz - Well, he did have the BA in physics... Svante Arhenius - Physicists who discovered a lot of chemistry. I mean, seriously. I'm not gonna go through all the list. Lots of examples.

@rogeriopenna9014

3 жыл бұрын

@@bakters Albert Einstein was graduated from the Polytechnic Institute and got a PhD in physics in 1905. He is not "outside the field" just because he was working in a patent office. Crick is considered a molecular biologist. He has a PhD in the field. He got into the field in 1947. Marie Curie had a degree in Physics at Paris, was already involved with the "natural sciences" community of the time, so much that she was introduced to her future husband Pierre Curie, by another physicist, when she was looking for a larger laboratory space. She had no funding from the university although her research was sponsored by metallurgy, mining companies as well as various organizations and governments... and she became a professor at the University of Paris in 1906. The first woman to do so. Maybe before we go on, you should clarify what are your standards to consider someone as "from outside the field". 1 - having a job outside the field (like Einstein)? 2 - not corresponding or having involvement with people on the field? 3 - graduating at something else? Because all your examples above fail in only one of the 3 points I listed, so I would never consider them from "outside the field".

@76rjackson

3 жыл бұрын

@@anniestacietravels I believe he said he is studying archeology.

Top channel of all YT about the English Language and its history

Oh, what sad times are these when passing ruffians can say Ni at will to old ladies.

@johnridout6540

2 жыл бұрын

Yes, do Northern ruffians use the same vowel?

Your videos are fascinating! Thanks for making them. Your talk about Chaucer made me think - Have you ever investigated Joseph's speech in 'Wuthering Heights' for a case study of northern dialect of the time? Charlotte Bronte described Emily's phonetic rendering of the Yorkshire dialect as 'perfect' (but therefore, she complained, near incomprehensible to southerners); unfortunately Charlotte edited some of the dialect to make it more intelligible, so-called, in later editions, but the first edition of the book was published as Emily wrote it. I wonder if that first edition is at all available online? The two different renderings could be interesting points of comparison and insight, and at any rate, the high praise for the speech's accuracy may point towards fruitful studies.

11:33 is soooo funny for me as a native speaker of Hungarian: [heil] and [he:l] cause no problem whatsoever as both are possible morphemes in Hungarian. However, distinguishing between [si:d] and [sı:d] took me many years of effort, and I still can’t always hear the difference between “man” and “men”... it’s obviously not the actual “distance” between the vowels (whatever it is) but what your ears got tuned to as a kid.

@ralphedwards9839

3 жыл бұрын

In modern times we are exposed to a variety of realizations of the phonemes, and group them as equivalent, so (EI) and (e:) are two realizations of the same phoneme, so no distinction is heard except by geeks like us. After a year of learning German, I realized I had taken naturally to vocalizing R after vowels, probably because it is such a common part of English.

@Ateesh6782

3 жыл бұрын

@@ralphedwards9839 This too is relative based on your first language. In standard Hungarian, there are no diphthongs, so any word like “fiaiéi” is as many syllables as it has vowels (yes, this word exists and yes, it is five syllables). So for a Hungarian ear, [ei] will be automatically recognised as either two syllables [e+i] or as a VC syllable (as if it were ‘ey’). “Fire” is definitely either a two-syllable or a three-syllable word for a Hungarian ear (fa-ee-er or fa-yer), but it is haaaard to teach kids to teach that diphthongs and triphthongs are monosyllabic. (Interestingly, ‘rural’ dialects if Hungarian do have diphthongs, and imitating them is a mean way to characterised uneducated speech-stigmatisation at its best.)

@poliorcetix979

2 жыл бұрын

The same as a French, we don't have long vowels, diphtongs and affricates, so we confuse man and men, sheet and... , beach and..., choked and shocked, and we say the diphtongs such as mine /maIn/ like /majn/

@tairneanaich

2 жыл бұрын

@@Ateesh6782 thank you this is fascinating! I know so little about Hungarian as it‘s just So Different to anything I‘ve studied

@Ateesh6782

2 жыл бұрын

@@tairneanaich The feeling might be mutual 🤣❤️

Great content. But the best part was the magpie vs pigeon stand off. In my backyard the magpies generally win so good to see a hard core pigeon fighting back

@ijunkie

2 жыл бұрын

I was going to add a bird watching treat at the end

at 5:00 that 'Northern English' pronunciation is the EXACT same as the pronunciation of those words' Dutch equivalents (except 'home'), especially in Flemish dialects. And the spelling of that sound at 7:00 is also the same as Dutch. We write steen, been, and een instead of stone, bone and one.

I like that the first book mentioned in a video about Northern English is by an author called "R Lass".

your research and insight is exceptional I hope you receive the recognition you deserve for these videos MANY THANKS

Simon - a distinction has to be drawn between the ‘goose’ words and the ‘one’ /’home’ words. The vowel in the latter examples is derived from OE ā (i.e., /ɑ:/), while the vowel in the former is from OE short o (i.e., /ɔ/). In Northern Middle English, the vowel in OE hām (‘home’) remained unrounded and was fronted and raised, over the ME period and early Modern English periods to /ɪə/, via /æ:/ > /ɛ:/ > /e:/. In the North Midlands, Midlands and South, OE ā was rounded and raised to /ɔ:/ in the ME period. The vowel in ‘goose’ ( < OE /ɔ/, lengthened in open syllables in ME to /ɔ:/ in all dialects) was raised in Northern ME to /o:/ and then fronted to /ø/. This vowel was later raised and diphthongised to /ɪə/ in some of the Northern dialects, thus arriving at the same vowel as that derived from OE ā but via a different route.

@msclrhd

2 жыл бұрын

John Wells has the GOOSE (RP /u:/) vowel for "goose", LOT or CLOTH vowel (merged in RP as /ɒ/) for "one", and GOAT vowel (RP /əʊ/) for "home". In Northern English dialects "one" and some other words, which is more like the FOOT vowel (RP /ʊ/), appears to have split from LOT-CLOTH and merged with FOOT-STRUT. I'm originally from Derbyshire and personally struggle to differentiate between FOOT and STRUT (in some accents STRUT sounds like FOOT, and others it sounds like TRAP). I pronounce "one" with the LOT vowel.

When I was a college student in the early 1970s, I became fascinated by how sounds evolved. (I had studied Spanish, Latin, German, and Greek by then.) I spent so much time saying sounds out loud to hear how they might have mutated. I love the modest thoughtfulness you give to the subject.

This reminds me of the expression "hale and hearty" . Now I realize that "hale" is "whole" except it went down a different path during the Great Vowel shift. It makes me wonder where in particular that phrase came from

@tairneanaich

2 жыл бұрын

Ah, whole ie. Unharmed, without bits missing. Nice catch!

This is so fascinating! Language is in deed like a living creature.

@sinsemilia70

3 жыл бұрын

limba este un organism viu

@dorsvenabili5573

3 жыл бұрын

@@sinsemilia70 For a second I thought you wrote that in Esperanto, and I was going to say “How ironic!” haha! It’s Romanian isn’t it?

@sinsemilia70

2 жыл бұрын

@@dorsvenabili5573 yeap! ☺️

The pigeon was a language purist.

3:20 Chain shifting can also happen quite rapidly - we've got recorded samples from the mid-20th century (and, if I'm honest, I've even heard it in some more conservative contemporary speech communities) where Australian and New Zealand English use a fairly similar set of short front vowels. Then over the space of what seems to be only a few decades, Australia's short front vowels open up and drop lower in the mouth until /æ/ finds itself well below the bottom teeth, while New Zealand's highten and close to the point where /i/ becomes a central vowel. It's an interesting change, not least because it moves the short vowels away from the quality of their formerly-equivalent long vowels (this is also probably what has made it so easy for conservative and/or isolated speech communities to avoid the change - all they need to do is maintain short vowels with the same quality as the long ones, which have remained relatively more stable even in mainstream dialects). Also, this particular example makes native speakers of one group of dialects very obvious to the other, and vice versa, while still sounding similar to people from outside the region. Which is always funny when it figures into conversations of who sounds like whom.

@tairneanaich

2 жыл бұрын

I‘m a Scot but my mum‘s Aussie and I‘ve lived in Australia for ages and I‘ve always said that a New Zealand accent is like the Scottish form of Australian. Makes sense to me seeing as it was colonised more by Scots

I love this channel, and I love the way he incorporates videos from his natural surroundings to it, such as the birds in this one.

The problem with trying to lump the dialects of the ‘North’ together is that what is perceived as the ‘North’ culturally and geographically is not matched by the linguistic divisions. For example, the apparent differences between the realisations of the ‘mouth’ and ‘goose’ vowels ( [ʏ:], displaying the fronting associated with those dialects descended from the Anglian varieties of Old English (in this case, north Mercian)

@herrfister1477

3 жыл бұрын

Hmm... sounds a bit broad brush /simplistic. North of river wharfe this, south of river whatfe that.... Blurred lines/shades of grey, surely.

@blewjonny

3 жыл бұрын

@@herrfister1477 Nothing simplistic /broad brush about it whatsoever - it's basic linguistic theory - dialect areas are divided into entities based on particular phonological features, seperated by isogloses, both major and minor. One of these major isoglosses seperates the general North Midlands dialect area from that of the Northern dialect area. These isoglosses rarely coincide with political divisions and, in this instance, the isolgoss is defined by the Rivers Wharfe and Lune (this is based on data collected from the Survey of English Dialects [Orton, Dieth] 1947-61). Of course, these isolgosses are not hard and fast and there are usually mixed lects around the divide and there may also be a dialect on one side of the isogloss that appears to be more similar to those on the other side.

@herrfister1477

3 жыл бұрын

@@blewjonny Apology accepted.

@blewjonny

3 жыл бұрын

@@herrfister1477 No apology given - you complained about reference to south and north of the River Wharfe, as if it is irrelevant and "simplistic" - needless to say, it isn't - regardsless of the linguistic situation in the border regions, the River Wharfe defines the North Midlands dialect area to the south and the Northern area to the north (as politcal borders define nations). It is not a difficult concept to understand and there are numerous academic publications dealing with linguistic geography (too many to mention) that use isoglosses (in reality, isophones) to identify and define diaelct areas , which are then mapped, often with their boundaries being defined by geographical / topographical features such as rivers and mountains. And, of course, it is not just English dialects that are defined thus - dialect study around the English-speaking world, across Europe and further afield have all used linguistic geography to define dialaect areas. Of course, you are entitled to think that such theory is "broad-brush" and "simplistic" but perhaps your opinion might be validated if you could come up with a new theory for defining dialect areas that becomes generally accpeted in the dialectology and sociolinguistic spheres of research.

@herrfister1477

3 жыл бұрын

@@blewjonny Laugh. Ok chum. Let me guess - just completing your first year, keen as mustard, learned some new terminology that you’re trying out? Good for you. Obviously geography plays a part in linguistics or we wouldn’t have language, let alone dialect, but it’s shades of grey, otherwise we in Britain would still be speaking some celtic gibberish. Look I’ve accepted your apology so stop digging!

It would be amazing if you could do a video like your one on the evolution of London accents but with a Northern English accent. I assume you'd choose Cumbrian accents/dialects because you're most familiar with them. Edit: I just watched the end of the video and I'm so happy you're planning on doing this!! I'd also like to hear an American version if possible. You could even get an American do record their voice for it for the more modern accents.

I love that someone is interested in this and can convey his interest to others. Great wee videos. Thank you.

This is one of my absolute fave uploads, Simon. The setting, the birds---and the content was fluid and lucid. I felt like I was learning, really interested, and when ever I came to a conclusion---or had a question---you were right there to affirm/answer. Nice One.

Any idea as to why Northumbrian has "whee" and "twee" for "who" and "two" but Scots has "wha" and "twa"? Wouldn't you expect "twae" and "whae" just as you get "dae" as a reflex of Northumbrian "dee" meaning "do".

@simonroper9218

3 жыл бұрын

I'm not actually sure about that one, although I've definitely seen this referenced in grammars of Scottish English/Scots dialects before. There might be some finer conditioning factor (for example, 'wha' and 'twa' both start with labial consonants whereas 'tae' and 'dae' don't), but I think that would take a bit more investigation to properly draw out!

@paulhood7316

3 жыл бұрын

@@simonroper9218 look at the Scots of Rabbie Burns poetry .. borrowed pronunciations from Scots mixed in with English perhaps ? My Grandparents spoke a mixture of Scots /English and a Norse Gaelic dialect of Scots Gaelic .... had one hell of a time keeping up with it as a child being raised by them in the Deep South of the North Georgia mountains when they came to the US ... icould be way off base but I've heard it with my own ears prior to their passing

@janclarke6501

3 жыл бұрын

Northumbrian who has never heard "twee" for "two"- although "whee" for "who" is commonplace.

@tairneanaich

2 жыл бұрын

Not totally unheard of in Scotland I think- like if someone said it to me I‘d get it but I probably wouldn‘t say it myself

@harpingon

2 жыл бұрын

@@janclarke6501 The folk song twa sisters is the only time I pronounce two anything remotely like twee. Although I'm born and raised Northumbrian, I've sadly not got the mid Northumbrian dialect or twang, having lived in the south of the county , I sound more Geordie than Northumbrian . Some good characters to listen to up in Rothbury and other such villages though.

Your channel is a breath of fresh air. Fascinating, unique, and relaxing in one. So glad you had that London accent vid go viral so I could find you!

When I was a kid we used to play chases and someone would be “het” presumably from the German or olde English hetze meaning chaser or hetzer meaning rabble rouser.

@paris7904

2 жыл бұрын

'Het' means the the/it in Dutch. Like: "Ik ben het!"

@bustavonnutz

2 жыл бұрын

@@paris7904 I mean, that's what it was when I played tag as a kid. Someone was always "it"

@k.umquat8604

2 жыл бұрын

@@bustavonnutz Weird,when children play tag in Turkey, that someone is called an "ebe". Ebe normally means midwife...

@bustavonnutz

2 жыл бұрын

@@k.umquat8604 "Yare yare..."

I confess to playing at least one of your videos every single day. Keep them coming!

13:51 I like how the gnome looks like it's both chilling out casually and horrified about the magpie sniffing around it at the same time

Stumbled across this video after seeing Simon in another creator's video and it has been fascinating. Great work.

This stuff is just addictive to me. Not so much anyone else I know though lol. I'm currently in Yorkshire too so it's doubly interesting. Thanks!

Thanks a lot for all of your videos. I would love to see one about why the great vowel shift happened in the first place. I find the change in English language throughout the history quite unique and fascinating.

I was searching about this and saw you uploaded

The glorious work by Geoffrey Chaucer, aside from the contribution by Christopher Marlowe, he was potentially the best author this country ever produced. And included in that is also Tolkien.

Thanks Simon for another really interesting video. Please do the video of Northern English from 14th century to today, as you mentioned.

I didn’t know that Chaucer tried to replicate dialect in the Canterbury Tales. That’s really interesting

Hi Simon. Fascinated by this and your videos in general. Long long long ago in Manchester, I first came across middle English studying Sir Gawain and the Green Knight. So easy to understand if read aloud in a northern accent. But I hail from Blackpool that, while it has a sort of general northern accent it isnt as lovely as the Lancashire accent as spoken even as close as Preston and certainly further east I now live in Andalucia and, in running a language exchange group, have learned more about my native language. I have also come across the you tube videos of a young chap who specialises in teaching modern pronunciation to foreign students of English. It occurred to me that, if you dont know of him already, some of his stuff and yours sort of cross over. He is ETJ English.

I love your videos!

This is such an interesting channel. 'Not quite sure how I came to be watching it but it is, in my opinion, one of the best of its kind and I am glad it pops up in my recommendations. Thanks to Simon for posting his clearly very detailed and masterful research and whether or not he does so in a professional or amateur capacity, it is very much appreciated. ('Not sure if Simon has covered this already in other videos, but I'm really interested in learning more about the tendency of Northern speakers to drop or silence the "h" at the beginning of words. I 'aven't 'eard anything to explain why this 'appens.)

True so true Me and My whole family sharing one pack of Ramen Noodles. But Your video have changed me and my family life forever. So My Children And Wife and Myself feel truly Honored watching this Life changing video. Thank you most Honored One🤝👨‍👩‍👦‍👦

For someone who claims not be an expert, you really are awesome.

Thanks for another interesting (and short enough for me to watch) video. :) Don't know if it's relevant but I noticed that a vowel change that occurred in Old Norse - Icelandic is represented in English dialects. Pronunciation of á . If you consider English nought and Northern nowt.

Meanwhile, Spanish is stuck with the same five vowel qualities for milennia...

@marinaaaa2735

3 жыл бұрын

lol I was just thinking that. Old Spanish (or iberian romance, cant remember which) did have open e and open o like modern Italian but those ended up going away. We do have vowel shifts at least like some latin e > ie and some latin o > ue

@Ugly_German_Truths

3 жыл бұрын

isn't that as they put all their energy into shifting their esses?

@Crow-sr7xj

3 жыл бұрын

the five vowels are a really solid set though, thats probably why many languages have them. the germanic languages just decided they wanted to spice things up a little i guess lol

@ralphedwards9839

3 жыл бұрын

o->ue

@ashtarbalynestjar8000

3 жыл бұрын

Even then there’s some variation. Most notably, some forms of Andalusian developed a 10-quality system with vowel harmony after deleting final /s/: la casa [laˈkasa] vs. las casas [læˈkʰæsæ].

4:15 that "price" made me think of the word we have in swedish that is similar "pröjs/pröjsa" wich mean "salary" or to "buy" something

Many of the goat vowel words you mentioned also have e in north germanic languages, eg Swedish whole - hel, home - hem, goat - get, bone - ben..

@dan74695

3 жыл бұрын

In Norwegian: heil, heim, geit, bein.

I mistakenly clicked this video thinking it was the great bowel shift and was about that Manchester butcher shop who sold E. coli pies to loads of people.

Living in Newcastle I didn't expect pronunciation in the Scottish borders to be massively different, only the accent they speak with, but many words I would have said with o sound, such as floor or cold, are said more like flair or caild

I'm curious about your video-making process. These videos have a lovely simplicity to them

This is why some words for example in Glasgow, Scotland sound a little different because the vowels haven't changed for instance the word 'father' is pronounced as 'feather' like that of a birds.

its so interesting how vowels shift all the way from an "u" to an "e" to an "a"

That old pronunciation is exactly how we talk in West Cumbria, Whitehaven

I've been binging "Burnistoun" episodes recently. The Glaswegian accent is fascinating and worth listening to in detail. The way they say "thing" as "heng", "standing" as "stonnin'", "clothes" as "claythes", "wrong" as "wrang", etc. I find it almost impossible to string a sentence together in the accent because there are so many drastically different pronunciations from my boring Surrey accent. Worth looking into if you get the chance. I'd be impressed if you could speak a sentence in the dialect.

@lea6555

2 жыл бұрын

I've also been binging Burnistoun! I have a real fascination for the Glaswegian accent, almost lyrical and impossible (for me, kiwi) to imitate. Watched Limmys Show a while back and had to use subtitles for a while, but I've got an ear for it now. "get y'sell in a cell by y'sell" is a great line 😊

Love your videos! My friend is currently learning German and she is currently on getting to grips with the difference between "wissen" and "kennen". It got me thinking that pretty much every other language I know has this distinction but not English. So I started digging around to see if Old English had it, and yes, there was the "witan" and "know" but could not find many sources about when the "witan" use just faded away. Would be interested to see if you have any sources on this :) or a video idea?

@holdyourbeak8644

2 жыл бұрын

witan is modern english wit. And witan meant the same as "cneawan". The Old English "other" know verb gives modern english "can" "con" "could" "canny" "cunning" etc. Also English has a cognate of "kennen" which is "ken", though only used in parts England and Scotland, and it can be used for both knowing facts and also for knowing or recognizing people.

Interestingly, Stone - Bone - Home - One in the Scottish pronounciation sounds exactly like Dutch: Steen - Been - Heem - Een ('ee' in Dutch is pronounced more or less like the 'a' in the English word 'bane')! The words also have the exact same meaning allthough Heem is a somewhat archaic word and not used very often anymore.

@tairneanaich

2 жыл бұрын

That‘s so cool! Brb gonna pop over to the Netherlands and see if anyone understands me better than the English do

@kfrommirrorland

Жыл бұрын

In Norwegian (Bokmål/Nynorsk): - sten/stein - ben/bein - hjem/heim - en/ein

Incredible content really. Would love a video about Scots leid.

@blockheadgreen_

3 жыл бұрын

You've describes how Chaucer wrote his characters extremely well here too; a video about the Canterbury Tales from yourself would be fantastic.

It's really interesting to see how some of the older ways to say things in English sound a lot like Dutch.

Wow,I pointed this out particularly in your CoVid hit video!!Thanks again!!

RIP Billy goat beard 2020-2021

this was so interesting I loved it!

Really interesting. I am a Northumbrian and can't manage to say a southern pronunciation of ay in game or oh in phone but say it however hard I try. In our dialect we also say hyem for home and some of our words sound like Scandinavian words that my Swedish penfriend uses eg boat. (pronounced almost like bowat)

Just here to say how much I love the bird footage Truly an underappreciated section of the video

Nice to see you bare-faced again. I've always found Dostoyevsky a little bit disturbing, but I warm to the visage and voice of young Simon Roper. I know it's cheeky of me to leave that thought here.

Years ago I used to holiday with my son at a farm south of Appleby. Miles from anywhere. Recall telling 'the boss' (the farmer) we had visited Warcop. Pronouncing the a as in war. He pondered and then pronounced it something like waaarcp. 😯 im sure you are familiar with the local pronunciation.

In my part of yorkshire we say "Shut thi maath" "What's thaa on abaat?"

What would Elivagar hypothetically be in Old English or one of the dialects of Old English? Ive found many Norse names in Old English like Thunor for Thor, Wan/Wen for Vanir, etc. Im trying to find what Elivagar would be.

There is a documentary with Simon Armitage looking into the origins of Sir Gawain and the Green Knight and there is in an interesting bit of it looking into northwestern English dialects/accents if you aren't already aware of it

Loved the footage of the magpies and the pegeon

The pronunciation of the goat vowel used at 4:53 puts all of those words very close to their modern scandinavian equivalence.

@grijsje2000

3 жыл бұрын

They are virtually identical to the pronuncations of the cognates of these words in Dutch 'steen' 'been' 'heem', 'een'.

@dan74695

3 жыл бұрын

4:53 sounds like Norwegian, and 4:58 sounds like Swedish.

@dan74695

3 жыл бұрын

Stein, bein, heim, ein in Norwegian, and sten, ben, hem, en in Swedish.

These vids are so interesting. I had no interest in linguistics….except clearly I do! Thanks for this.

Where did the oo sound come from like broon doon i live in Durham

Thinking about it, I think my mum used to say school in that way that Northerners used to. This would have been in the 90s/00s before her accent was changed after we moved from Derby to Norfolk.

Fantástico parcero!!!

Best channel on youtube this

I think your realisation of heal (what is now hale) makes sense, I just wonder if there would be any other words that could show us this being systematic. The word head is right next to it and it is now /hid/. Of course /l/ could have changed how the vowel progressed as It's more sonorous than /d/.

A fun little tidbit, the ie realisation of oo could actually have some analogues in certain accents that have fossilised. My grandmother and mother used to pronounce oo as /u:i/ /‘sku:.il/ in certain environments when they were purposefully mocking each other’s accents

@ 11:24, what words are you saying there? seed/said/seared?

@k.umquat8604

2 жыл бұрын

Seed,Sid,seared.

The part where you were showing how you think vowels shifted based on where the vowels had room to move was really cool. Do you think there are any vowels in any current English dialect where there's a lot of room for movement? And if so, what vowel is it and how would you expect it to move? Also I'm glad you shaved the beard lol

This man just keeps blowing my mind! Damn!

The dialect of folks who live in the Hampden neighborhood of Baltimore has some really interesting vowels.

I remember watching something on Ulster-Scots and an attempt to revive the language in a literary way. That is more books and such written in Ulster-Scots. Some council decided to change the road signs and street names to what they presumed was Ulster-Scots. The people were furious. They said they couldn't make heads or tails of the new signage. What became clear was that people in Ulster read the standard English. It is just the way they pronounce the standard English with their Ulster-Scots accent. When the council spelt the names as they felt was the Ulster-Scots pronunciation they failed to consider that the people were reading standard English words and letters with their accent. They couldn't read the made up dialect.

@erinmac4750

2 жыл бұрын

The perfect example of when politicians dabble in areas outside their areas of expertise. You'd think with examples like these more of them would've figured out how silly this is. 🤦

Fascinating

This is a highly random thing but, I’ve heard that Shakespeare when spoke with the accent of the time has puns or jokes or even meanings that it doesn’t when spoke in a modern accent. Is this true?

@blimibarker4089

3 жыл бұрын

Google David Crystal. He started a whole movement to popularize Shakespeare performed in the original pronunciation.

@tolmuncica1

3 жыл бұрын

I watched Ben Crystal videos on YT about that topic, maybe you find them useful.

@EnigmaticLucas

3 жыл бұрын

Yep. An example is “if reasons were as plentiful as blackberries” in Henry IV, because “reasons” and “raisins” were homophones at the time.

@sarahpassell226

3 жыл бұрын

Here's Simon on Shakespeare and Ben Crystal. kzread.info/dash/bejne/ZqaWkqqJdNHJaLw.html

@nowvoyaging8881

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you all!

I have a question: when and/or why did the letter U gain a consonant and become YU (or maybe [ju] to be a bit more proper)? What do we know about this? Also: my money's on the big fella, that pigeon means business!!

@sinsemilia70

3 жыл бұрын

vowel

@Sprecherfuchs

3 жыл бұрын

The vowel /ju/ in cube, few etc. descends from various Middle English vowels, including /eu/ /ɪu/ and /y/, so it was never pronounced as just /u/ although in many American and some British accents it has become just a /u/ after alveolar stops, such as in "tune". And in almost all accents after alveolar liquids, such as in "flute". In some Welsh accents, the /ju/ vowel is closer to an /ɪu/ pronunciation, meaning they actually maintain the phoneme in words like "flute" and are also able to make the distinction between pairs like "chews" and "choose"

11:40 Not quite - one vowel moving out of a space opens that space up to allophonic realisations of other nearby vowels, which _can_ then move into that space depending on the whims of the speech community at large. I wrote in my other comment that Australian and New Zealand English had their front short vowels move respectively lower and higher - but I should now qualify that that's more of an on-average statement that applies more to the most extreme end of each shift; the high vowels in Australian English did not necessarily drop very much*, nor did the low vowels in New Zealand English get appreciably higher* (though modern speakers of the dialects on the opposite side might _hear_ it this way, as their own vowels in these positions _have_ moved). So the shift can be thought of maybe more as a radiation - an increase in the average distance between the realisations of each vowel, resulting in all of them becoming more distinct and recognisable, and having more space for allophonic variation. It is still a chain shift - a set of sounds with similar properties affecting each other's realisations - but at least in this case it's had a larger effect on one end of the chain than it has on the other. As for whether this is the case in all chain shifts (or whether the one I'm talking about here has even reached its maximum effect), I couldn't tell you; it's just been the case thus far in this one, and thus is demponstrably one possible outcome of sound changes in language. *Compared to the change in other vowel qualities at the other end of the chain; they _did_ move, but less so

‘You have passed your ASNaC interview’ 😂

Brilliant as usual! A coupe of questions. You use the term 'broad' a couple of times to describe accents. In modern terms, this is used to mean 'very different from RP' in a somewhat judgmental way. I can't really think what it might mean in a historic context. I was surprised that you say you have a three-way distinction in your own speech: /si:d/, /sɪd/ and /sɪ:d/. I've never come across the third one. How do you spell it?

@quinterbeck

3 жыл бұрын

Those'll be 'seed' /si:d/, 'Sid' /sɪd/ and 'seared' /sɪ:d/. Most modern non-rhotic british accents have smoothed RP's /ɪə/ diphthong to /ɪ:/, and/or broken it to /ɪjə/. For me, both /sɪ:d/ and /sɪjəd/ are valid pronunciations of 'seared'.

@simonroper9218

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks for your kind comment, David! I mean 'broad' in the sense you describe - different from whatever the local standard is (generally RP in the UK). However, I can absolutely see what you mean about it coming across as judgmental - I might seek out an alternative word to use in future ('conservative' might cover roughly the same range of meanings, although some regional dialects innovate quite a lot). And the three-way distinction is as the other reply says - 'seed,' 'Sid,' 'seared' (I probably should have put that on the slide!)

You should do a video on consonant difference bewteen different English dialects (if there are any)

@EnigmaticLucas

3 жыл бұрын

There are some dialects that preserve the distinction between /w/ and /ʍ/, such as Scottish English, Northern English English, Texan English, conservative Southern American English, and extremely conservative RP.

12:56 That sounds kind of how Bill Wurtz pronounced Baekje in History of Japan lol

When did the Great Vowel take place in Norfolk County, England. I have found different spelling for my ancestors surname. They spoke Norfolk Broad English.

If you see this, I have a question, do you consider Scots a dialect or an accent?

@Nosirrbro

3 жыл бұрын

It’s a full language entirely it’s own by a lot of linguists’ estimation, though neither he nor I are linguists.

Forensic ornitharchaeological philology. Because of course! Delightful, Simon

It makes me sad that these unique northern ways of speaking are slowly fading away

@dgrjazz

3 жыл бұрын

Yea I feel the same way about the accents in New England in the United States

@anon8740

3 жыл бұрын

It's happening everywhere. Even down here in Australia. It really is a shame.

@kubafrank96

3 жыл бұрын

@@EresirThe1st not even a problem of globalism as dialect merging happens in a local, national context. I see it as mainly a matter of dominace of the national common language which is a necessity for finding jobs around the country. Another thing that a lot of language enthusiasts can't seem to come to grips with is that most people simply don't care about dialects or languages being taken over. Sure, there will always be some clinging onto a way of speech, but that's about it. Even looking at Wales and Ireland where the languages are taught in schools and people have a strong sense of identity with the culture, but hardly anyone who's not grow up speaking Welsh or Irish at home will put in the effort to get some sort of proficiency in it.

@Nathan-yk5km

3 жыл бұрын

@@kubafrank96 I’d say it’s a lot more to do with peoples’ ready access to more ‘common’ accents - via the television, KZread, radio etc.

@iohannesfactotum

Жыл бұрын

Ironically, the Canadian "hoser" accent is becoming more pronounced, Mostly because the lads immersed in hockey culture do it on purpose.

They still pronounce meat as 'mate' in parts of the West of Ireland in particular. I was once in the middle of a conversation between my two Galway cousins. One who was been educated in Dublin said 'meat man' and other was confused. My father had to interject and say she means 'mate man" (meat man).

You'll hear a remnant of that old "school" pronunciation among the countryfolk from Appalachia and parts of the US SE. There you will hear it pronounced like "skiewll".

Well, they do call it the Great vowel shift and not the Crummy vowel shift. This is fascinating. I've said that a lot. At some point, Ive got to binge on these.

That last diagram was a little hard to follow, but great stuff.

The western Norwegian pronunciation of whole=hel is approximately heal

Hi Simon. Was Welsh not spoken before English? Many thanks

@matthewrichards1364

2 жыл бұрын

Certainly was by probably a thousand years