You can also find this episode on Spotify, iTunes, Google Podcasts and Stitcher! You can find it at the links below: Spotify - open.spotify.com/episode/1CeUphzxiki3xcmUpxM1KW iTunes - podcasts.apple.com/kz/podcast/mesopotamian-creation-myths-w-mythology-with-mike/id1514656609?i=1000582930704 Stitcher - www.stitcher.com/show/mythillogical-podcast/episode/mesopotamian-creation-myths-w-mythology-with-mike-207675643 Google podcasts - podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5saWJzeW4uY29tLzI3NDA3My9yc3M/episode/MzkxOTU4MWQtNGM4MC00ZDNhLWEyN2ItNTJlMGRiN2ZiYjY0?sa=X&ved=0CAgQuIEEahcKEwjQ-svCl5r7AhUAAAAAHQAAAAAQZA

@thelyrebird1310

Жыл бұрын

Wondering if a copy of Bulfinch's Mythology resides in your resource library

00:00 Intro 1:08 Guest Host: Mythology w/Mike 3:14 Topic 4:03 Sources 7:23 Mesopotamia: An Overview 11:45 Anunnaki (1st Mention) 16:08 Sumerian Mythology: surviving texts 20:06 Formalized Creation Myths 22:50 Sumerian Overview 23:08 Epic of Gilgamesh 25:29 EoG: Tablet #2 33:08 EoG: Text Dissection 40:20 Details; Outlines; Conclusion 41:35 Sheep and Grain; Sisters 45:16 Winter and Summer; Brothers 47:57 Gordon Inerta 51:12 Cain and Abel parallels 52:19 Barton Cylinder 54:41 Birth of the Anunnaki 58:10 The Deluge 1:00:01 Babylon: Overview 1:01:27 Hammurabi's Code 1:04:11 "The Flood" Overview 1:20:44 Babylon Creation Story: Tablet #1 1:31:31 B.C.S.: Tablet #2 1:34:17 B.C.S.: Tablet #3 1:38:31 B.C.S.: Tablet #5 1:38:31 B.C.S.: Tablet #6 1:43:12 Final Wrap Up; What's Next? Hints and clues (It's probably Anansi lol) This is my personal break down; Actual chapters: Charles' Chapter: 7:23 Mike's Chapter: 58:55 Edit to add: I always love it when people do breakdowns like this so I can skip to/around if I'm not watching all at once, I had time to kill so I made notes while watching. Thinking about doing this for every long form video I watch that doesn't already have a non-cape wearing hero in the comments. I appreciate y'all's appreciation! ☺️ 🩶

@Zarakikenpachi69420

Жыл бұрын

Thank you 🙏

@enriquehartmann8642

Жыл бұрын

Thank you homie

@nesmuelmnostromo5295

Жыл бұрын

ahh, was looking for time stamps! TYVM

@rmt3589

Жыл бұрын

You are a Saint!

@9786oof

Жыл бұрын

they should add these to the description

Thanks again for having me Charles!

YEEEESSS!!! This is becoming one of my most quickly watched podcasts in terms of release to listen. I appreciate the work you put into these.

@nietzchepreacher9477

Жыл бұрын

Why are you telling us this?

@IA100KPDT

3 ай бұрын

Why are all the middle eastern histories findings and deciphering are done by the westerners?

Ahhh sick, I'm having a good day today. Doing laundry, dishes and cleaning for my gf and I was getting bored after 10 minutes but now I'll be able to listen to something for the next 2 hours.

@WildWinterberry

Жыл бұрын

Exactly the same but for my husband

@HansWurst1569

Жыл бұрын

@Danny Al What do you mean? We live together and she's at work today. We do it in turns? Or are you one of those people who can't handle modern gender norms hahaha. A man can clean, it's allowed. Also it will probably make her happy as I did it on my own initiative, it's still a chore to me.

@tinyGrim1

Жыл бұрын

Awesome right 👍 same here with same ole , same ole. But we're do it anyway. You're a good, honest person 👍🙂✨🫂

@tinyGrim1

Жыл бұрын

@Danny Al maybe it's a woman. Maybe the gf is grandfather? And if it's a man, so what? Obviously it's working. A job is a job that contributes to home also. Don't assume BS. (Bullshit). Just in case 😵‍💫😂 . Chill . He, they, probably are treated well. Doesn't mean anyone finds needed chores bad or good. It's necessary. And it can and should be anyone as needed. Sincerely, ✌️🖕💀😐 SMH

@jackjones7062

Жыл бұрын

​@Danny Al you sound like a beta

CHAPTERS, CHAPTERS, CHAPTERS!!! Chapter markers, PLEASE!

@notinspectorgadget

Жыл бұрын

You make a good point.

@kyleflanagan8410

Жыл бұрын

You don't have to yell

@Rosegoldshawwty

Жыл бұрын

@@kyleflanagan8410 how else does one get attention

@gregorythomassr5485

Жыл бұрын

Go-Go gadget markers for that guy anyone ?

@SpydrXIII

Жыл бұрын

yeah i'm skipping a lot of content cause i hate intro preamble.

I just got the alert and I am here for this. I love the Mythillogical podcast and I've been waiting patiently for this.

Great stuff as always and well done to Mike for filling those shoes and taking on a fascinating but complex subject. Already looking forward to the next one.

Many people have pointed out the themes the Cain and Abel story share with the Manu and Yemo sacrifice story (right down to them having a favored youngest brother named Seth). But I've never encountered the Sumerian argument between Sheep and Grain, where Enlil favors grain. I really feel the Cain and Abel story is a synthesis of the Sheep/Grain argument with the Manu/Yemo tropes. So cool

@cuteswan

Жыл бұрын

Sheep and Grain instantly reminded me more of Abel and Cain more than the other too, mainly because it showed agriculture gaining dominance over shepherding. That argument still comes up here and there. (First time I saw it was in _Scientific American_ in the '90s, and recently in the latest episode of _Earthlings 101_ plus lots of strife between ranchers and farmers at times.) Those themes seem to keep coming up in the varied types of things I watch and listen too. (It may be a bit of Baader-Meinhof Phenomenon too.)

@fehmeh6292

Жыл бұрын

I mean.... Dude brought a field salad to a bbq. How was that supposed to go?

@kaijukojin4371

Жыл бұрын

I always saw those storys as an alegory to moving into agrerian lifestyles, and taming the land, not being a hunger/gatherer anymore.

@justinapps3047

9 ай бұрын

I've always believed modern religions was nothing more than the telephone game originating here

@PacdemonStudios1

5 ай бұрын

@@cuteswan Because of this I see the Cain and Abel story as a direct response to Mesopotamian agriculture-centric ideology by the more pastorally-minded people of the coast.

Thank you for all your efforts to bring this to us.

Good to see more Mesopotamia on this channel!

Wonderful video as always. I love just laying back and listening to you talk about various history and myths. I've learned a lot I never knew and you're pleasant and fun to listen to. Was nice nice to see someone else too, I did not know of Mike's channel so I'll have to go check their videos

Oh, wonderful! Love breakfast with Charles. Creation myths were definitely some of the most interesting to me growing up, so I'm excited about this one! Safe trip, Crofty!

I had Ira Spar as a professor in college! What a fantastic person, and brilliant teacher!

@infernalmachine64

Жыл бұрын

I had him too!

@AloisWeimar

Жыл бұрын

wow, yeah I had him as well

I am currently a GVSU undergrad (soon to be grad), so imagine my surprise when I heard my university’s name in your podcast! Cheers from Michigan!

Finally got to this, I'm a geek for anything antiquity. Thank you for your time and effort, I appreciate it !

RE flood myth..... I'd never really given any thought to the ever changing and natural processes of a river. The consistent giving and taking of land. Your mentioning of this coupled with my life along the Mississippi River struck a note. Many a city (and most likely past civilization) surrendered to the Mississippi or had been left far, far away from. Sometimes nibbling, sometimes rapid and dramatic. Much enjoying the long format content.

Yaaayyyy!!!! So happy for this!! Did couple papers with this as my focus so I'm STOKED YO!!!

Thank you for another amazing video

Yay! Another great video, thanks!

Mike did a great job! I think it's fascinating how similar events, characters, motifs, and ideas appeared in ancient mythologies all over Eurasia throughout history.

@ezrafriesner8370

Жыл бұрын

Gotta love that proto-indo-European comparative mythology!

@clintlechner4564

Жыл бұрын

Around the world even. Almost all ancient civilizations share a similar creation story. The Bible is pulled in large part from the Sumerians yet is seen as factual but the Sumerian stories are myth.

@danielbarker2522

Жыл бұрын

​@clintlechner4564 have you ever spoken to people lmao the bible is NOT considered factual, especially regarding creation, by most people

Well, that's TV sorted for tonight. Thank you very much!

The incredible long reigns for semi-mythical kings is something typical when a culture shifts from oral to literal. The oral tradition preservs exact dates for only as long as 80 years earlier events still remembered are separated by a tradition gap and then remembered as mythical easier to memorize figures / tropes.

@donnieboughton1730

Жыл бұрын

How is remembering fact over myth harder???

@peterdrieen6852

Жыл бұрын

@@donnieboughton1730 Myth can transform information into easier to memorize forms. Like in this case: It's forgotten how long a ruler actually was in power, just that he was for a long time. It's easy to say '100 years' or something like 7 times 7 years instead of 48 years and 6 month. Oral tradition strongly depends upon the sound of a language as well transforming fact into easier to repeat forms. I'm not a native English speaker so it's a bit difficult for me to find examples.

@Peak_Stone

Жыл бұрын

Maybe they just used to live longer.

@peterdrieen6852

Жыл бұрын

@@Peak_Stone Maybe, but very unlikely given everything we know of biology, human evolution and archaeological evidence.

@Peak_Stone

Жыл бұрын

@@peterdrieen6852 We know well of those things in the present, but we know almost nothing of them from that far past.

Extraordinary and very well done video here. Bravo for the hard work and it’s fruity endeavor. Thank You 😊

I love Mythology with Mike! That's one of my favorite channels. I (sadly) admit, I've never seen this channel before. This sounds like a perfect interview to listen to whole I do chores! 💜 18:00 If someone today were to write a colloquial article about presently prominent politicians, you wouldn't elaborate on the origins of democracy. It's a given that everyone would have a basic idea how government has developed in America. So, I completely concur with Mike.

So lovely hearing this discussed

Congrats on 420k subs!

y’all made my night with this upload yeehaw

Ah! Bigfoot part 3: Mesopotamian Squatchin'

back when i was studying for my ba in history, i kept thinking about the origin of all the known creation stories throughout human history. leaving out the nutty theories, i couldn't help but think, where was the influence or origin of these stories.

@runningman7674

6 ай бұрын

A small guess : 🍄

Another incredible video

I just love the topics you chose to cover. Never regretted subscribing to this channel

amazing video, thank u so much

Fascinating! I am guessing that the next episode will be about Anansi, right?

Love your stuff! xoxox

can you do a mythological talking about the parts that the Bible just rewrites older myths?

@danhtran6401

6 күн бұрын

Of course he can't...

Tolkein was also inspired by the Elder Edda. Plus these are all common creation tropes found in all creation stories.

Love your videos! May I ask what editing software you use? :)

awesome content here!

There is a really interesting and in my opinion plausible theory that the Hanging Gardens of Babylon were actually located at Nineveh. If you are looking for them there there seems to be a somewhat decent amount of evidence for them existing.

@robertomagnani8091

2 ай бұрын

Sizanogreen, interesting. Could you please share a little more?

@sizanogreen9900

2 ай бұрын

@@robertomagnani8091 well, it has been a year since I last engaged with the topic so you might just be better of researching it yourself, but from what I remember: The Assyrian Capital was also often referred to as "Babylon" I imagine in the way one might say "Washington is the US's London" or something while trying to capture some of the ancient prestige. There has been a king in assyria who built colossal irrigated gardens there suspiciously similar to what is described in the legend of the hanging gardens, of which we have found rather legit archeological proof while we haven't at Babylon.

Amazing !

Will save this video for my bedtime story tonight ❤

Awesome video!

Awesome listen

Always enjoy your show! FYI. Babylon was often code for the Empire of Rome by both Jews and Christians as it would be dangerous to mention them directly. So Babylon was not viewed negatively, it was referring to the oppressing power of the day. In fact, the rabbis of Babylon were held in high esteem and the Babylonian Talmud is the major text of Jewish Law studied to this day. The Jerusalem Talmud is pretty much the realm of scholars.

I cannot wait to get settled down with my takeaway and four pack to this one after the day ive had

I've never been so excited for the next episode!. If it's who I think It is then I will be a happy camper. 😳😳😳😳

Love your videos! What is the music at the beginning?

@castor9683

Жыл бұрын

It's in the description

I feel like sheep v grain sounded more like cain & abel than winter & summer. Thanks for this video it’s great!

@StazKodama

10 ай бұрын

sounds as if they both merged with time into the story of cain and abel

Mike was such an awesome addition to the podcast, very well made and done as always. Thank you for all the great content

I enjoy listening to your microphone's perfect sound, and any others of lesser quality are very noticeable. Please consider that!

Thank you

The passage beginning with "In those days, in those distant days...." sounds like song lyrics which would sound better in the original language. Having large and small stones thrown at a boat could describe a volcanic eruption, which would seem to the geologically naive to be a battle between the gods.

"The gods got tired of working and unionized" 🤣

The creation myths of Mesoamerica are vague and seem to have another back story that is not included... some suggests this is in part because there was a previous oral tradition that was just common knowledge to the people of the time and basically not worth writing down because the narrative was well known.

Thank you.

I thought Tiamat was only a dragon in dnd and like Final Fantasy

Already listened on spotify, when the podcast version was released, but I'm looking forward to listen/watch again here on youtube!

You guys should check out the works of Randall Carlson if you haven’t already …. He has documented evidence of mass floods and points towards possible causes . Really enjoying this bed time story 👀😂🙌 thank you for this content ✌️💚☯️

@intheloopwithlisa9925

Жыл бұрын

hr also into secret knowlege. and symbols. he is 33rd degree freemason.. very gnostic

@ezrafriesner8370

Жыл бұрын

No he hasn’t, he’s a pesudo-intellectual moron who makes things up and throws unsubstantiated claims at people who don’t know any better to convince them to distrust anyone but him. And of course as soon as he’s gotten someone only trusting him he’ll sell them a book explaining the “real” history of the world

@Robutnikon

Жыл бұрын

Yes, love Carlson - he's such a humble bawss 💪🏼🔥❣️

You tease yourself and call yourself KZreadrs but this is one of the best explanations I've heard thanks for your time 👍👏

1:37:00 well there are the Uruk-hai in tolkiens world. It would be quite the coincidence if that wasn't related to the mesopotamian city of Uruk.

is the new video going to be about Exu?

will be missing crofty this time tho! but excited for the guest host

1:07:19 The first, seventh, and fifteenth of each month? Aren't those the exact same days in each month the Romans used to mark when something happen?

Starting with the big bang no doubt

@J5X7

Ай бұрын

Your dear myth came long before honey.

@nerdvana101

Ай бұрын

@@J5X7 I doubt that treacle

@J5X7

Ай бұрын

@@nerdvana101 that leaves scientology then babes

@nerdvana101

Ай бұрын

@@J5X7 tom cruise all the right moves

@J5X7

Ай бұрын

@@nerdvana101 lol

Are your videos in podcast form anywhere?

Just watched this video today, but I'm in Japan, so giving him a wave!

Seems like the story of Cain and Abel is a condensed version of these this vs that stories. lol I wrote that seconds before Mike brought it up!

Ohhhhh snap!

The reason why the stories don't talk about early creation is because the stories are designed to document the Annunaki role in creation particularly. They create the earth persay. They reshaped it.

It's amazing that Mesopotamian religion still influences popular religious though five or maybe six thousand years on with the concepts of Heaven being "up there" and Hell being "down there".

You missed All the Nag Hammadi creation myths. Very interesting and worth looking into.

I am really putting shade on this transaction, it needs working on (at the King, the water at the bow of the boat) ? I would say keal not king and would it not be stern not stem, which would make more sense to the flow... There are missing parts or words that don't belong... What ever the case it leaves me with a lot of questions of its meaning.

You didn't read/use any of Dr. Irving Finkel's works? :'( But awesome episode nonetheless~!

My favourite.

@ezrafriesner8370

Жыл бұрын

Name checks out

@dubsar

Жыл бұрын

@@ezrafriesner8370 ካልእ ፡ መጽሐፍ ፡ ዘጸሐፈ ፡ ሄኖክ ፡ ለወልዱ ፡ ማቱሳላ ፡ ወለእለ ፡ ይመጽኡ ፡ እምድኅሬሁ ፡ ወየዐቅብ ፡ ሥርዐተ ፡ በደኃሪ ፡ መዋዕል ። እለ ፡ ገበርክሙ ፡ ወትጸንሑ ፡ በእሉ ፡ መዋዕል ፡ እስከ ፡ ይትፌጸሙ ፡ እለ ፡ ይገብሩ ፡ እኩየ ፡ ወይትፌጸም ፡ ኀይሎሙ ፡ ለመአብሳን ፤ አንትሙሰ ፡ ጽንሑ ፡ እስክ ፡ ተሐልፍ ፡ ኀጢአት ፡ እስመ ፡ ሀሎ ፡ ስሞሙ ፡ ይደመሰስ ፡ እመጻሕፍተ ፡ ቅዱሳን ፡ ወዘርኦሙ ፡ ይትሐጐል ፡ ለዓለም ፡ ወመናፍስቲሆሙ ፡ ይትቀተሉ ፡ ወይጸርሑ ፡ ወየዐወይዉ ፡ በመካነ ፡ በድው ፡ ዘኢያስተርኢ ፡ ወበእሳት ፡ ይነድዱ ፡ እስመ ፡ ኢሀሎ ፡ ህየ ፡ ምድር ።

Tolkien was probably inspired by St. George fighting the dragon which has (in my opinion) obvious parallels with Marduk and Tiamat and also Zeus vs. Typhon.

love this channel for the objectivity... no woowoo or quackery. Subbed for life

I've read or head the absu is where Enki lived. Which after him looking like dagon, after the flood, also I feel like if not enki and en lil as quatzecoatl. And quatziliapeechah gets him drunk so he can't marry a princess and gets banished etc. tbh I feel enki was vericocha, and maybe lived at bottom of lake Titicaca. If there was a global civilization it looks like the grains etc came from Mesopotamia. And quetzel, and quetzel soundmore like ninurya and nerghaal. I saw a thing where a guy lived under water for idk 480 days, said he barely aged cuz no sun or gravity messing with him.. idk. But if we find a lot of like Sumeria in like Titicaca. Idk .. also I thought the dilmun mean south America, at first I thought it was Africa the mining place but I think that had a different name instead. But idk I'm just saying ❤❤😊

Huh, I wonder if the grain vs sheep tale is basically them telling the story of how farming took over from a hunter gatherer lifestyle

you're beholden to the modern era / christian creation, which goes to the level of a start of universe. since these early religions gods were most importantly noted for introducing order in the world, chaos is equivalent in explanatory power for those people

this needs jazzing up. it makes me sleepy.

The second more ancient cuneiform script actually reminds me of the biblical story Cain and Abel... there must have rose a land dispute between the early farmers and animal herders over whose occupation was more essential; whereas these two groups rose up against one another and fought.. There must have been only so much usable land at thar time in those areas.. something like this happened in the 1800s in the western plains of America, where it also came to bloodshed among some individuals... I think that they more than likely wove it into a story attributing it to each group's Gods.. it is the story of Cain and Abel

You and study of antiquity and Middle Ages should collaborate

19:50 -- it's called an abstract.

Wait a minute Marduk's fight sounds A LOT like Gilgamesh's fight against Humbaba what's going on here ?

💖💖💖

Ishtar Rockstar!

It almost sounds like some of these early creation stories are not really creation stories at all. If you just substitute the word god for the name of a specific ruling family, all these stories make a suprising amount of sense. That add on to the epic of gilgamesh sounds a heck of a lot like a battle. I am assuming that most of these early cities were located on a river then descriptors like "underworld", "earth", and "heavans" make a lot of sense. A river would have been the main source of life for these early civilizations and so it make sense to think of the diffrence between city-states in relation to thier position on the river. Rivers flow down so cities dependant on a river would necessarily have to be at diffrent elevations and so a city on the highground could be refered as "the heavans", the middle could be "the earth" and the low point would be the underworld. Furthermore I know for example, that in Biblical hebrew the word for "heavans" and the word for "sky" are the samd thing so it would make sense to refer to a city above yours as a city above you. The big storm and the little ones seems to refer to diffrent sized armies and "stones of the hand" would likely refer to infantry while "those that made the reeds dance" would refer to wind or an arial attack (ie peltas or some equivalent). In fact I would surmise that most of these dynasties are named after the cities founder and that succusive dynastic leaders are refered to by the samr name because they are referanced only by their surname. (Kinda like how thr Austrian empire is commonly refered to as the Hapsburg empire and the emperor is often refered to as thr Hapsburg king). That would also explain why a lot of the creation myths don't actually describe the creation of the whole world but only elements of it.

@clintlechner4564

Жыл бұрын

Bingo. Because the creation myths are not myths. More and more people are starting to piece that together. We have some of our history right, but we aren't even close on other things. ~13,000 years ago a flood wiped everything out, and all these ancient civilizations have creation myths that start with a flood and then someone appearing to give them culture, farming, astronomy, etc. Somehow they advance almost overnight. We can then document every thing they know and their miraculous growth I to civilization, but apparently all their other stories of how they learned all this, well, thats not believable. As people go looking for the truth and more information, nobody wants to hear what they discover because it conflicts with our current timeline amd thought pattern. There's a zero percent chance humans evolved as we are lead to believe. Look at the various skulls from each supposed evolutionary period and you see there is no actual evolution going on.

Ham from bible was thrown out of the camp by Noah and he had one creation story of demons good and Noah worshipped God and therefore there was 2 creation stories!!Then basically ancester worship and demo demonic worship!Great podcast!

I think 4 is referencing omnipower bc 4 corners of the world

Heyy away videos look into the Dardanians

20 minutes in and we are still getting caveats

@erpthompsonqueen9130

Жыл бұрын

What?

interesting title Mythillogical, my eyes played a word trick and saw myth till logical. Why should a myth be deemed illogical, just because we have not made sense of it?

I wanted to listen to this but the difference between the 2 audio levels made me skip it. One i can hardly hear the other is way to loud.

Ooh, Anansi?

A Google 'context' Wikipedia link on this content?

I disagree that the "flood story" is limited to the Euphrates and consisted of small crop flooding as the narrator stated. Several historically documented civilizations have a flood story much greater in reach than they state as just regionally.

I like the apocalypse and we sure need one right about now

So did the Sumerians chop-off heads and suchlike, or were they the civilised people like we are told?

People probably only started writing down their myths and legends after conquering other people since you would need to educate people on their new culture. Or they had priests from different temples to the same deities arguing over their story like what happened in early Christianity, and still happens to some extent today, and so they started to write things down to keep track of the official story.