"You can't make a career out of shitting on everything most people love". Actually, it's super easy, barely an inconvenience.

@lasarousi

4 жыл бұрын

Your movie sucks dot org made his entire career on that statement.

@theocean1973

4 жыл бұрын

You can! Just look at CinemaSins-oh wait, DON’T!

@diogenesdacynic8656

4 жыл бұрын

I laughed so fuckin hard at this ...

@roguebantha7324

4 жыл бұрын

Whoops!

@ShadowTheDeathhog

4 жыл бұрын

Yahtzee will trash your favorite game and you'll bend over and ask for more

I think the most important thing to remember is a film being "enjoyable" isn't the same as it being "good".

@travelingnome87

4 жыл бұрын

Exactly

@BrianZuma

4 жыл бұрын

I loved the old fast and furious growing up don’t mean it was deep and innovative ever movie and scene

@MarOne47

4 жыл бұрын

The room is enjoyable!!

@bobthegoat7090

4 жыл бұрын

I get what you mean but how should we then rate movies on for example IMDB? I think there you need to give the movie a rating by the enjoyment scale as people who see it would want to know if they would enjoy it too. Maybe it even should vary from one movie to another.

@sharilshahed6106

4 жыл бұрын

@@bobthegoat7090 IMDB isn’t so reliable either, you'd think movies with 6.5 are bad, or at least boring but when you see it, its actually pretty enjoyable, even see a lot of places which consider it an above average film. Even some solid movies these days would eventually slump to 7s from 8/9. It just comes to show how opinions can be divisive, but also hard to tell people would genuinely disliked it as a weak movie the movie or were biased against some specific elements (different adaptation, casting of lbgt, political, tone/rating, fatigue on the genre etc). Even when its the later, one can argue that some of these are part of the criticisms.

This begs the question: Is knowing more about movies decrease your experience of watching them or does it enrich the experience?

@keatonhanson43

4 жыл бұрын

Miguel Miranda a very good question to ask and one I’d like to see discussed more

@Gemnist98

4 жыл бұрын

I’m in the minority of people that learns TONS about a movie beforehand, including RT scores. Oddly enough, I tend to almost always agree with the scores, but that being said, I still keep a subjective opinion and make sure I know WHY I agree with the scores. Additionally, I habitually read plot spoilers beforehand, which I think actually enhances my experience as I can go in and focus on the execution of the plot rather than the inspiration.

@mandarinduck

4 жыл бұрын

It changes how you appreciate them. If you know about how movies are made you understand why certain shots, effects or stunts are impressive because of all the work that goes into it, which is great. You could also watch scene and go "that was cool" or appreciate that it's pretty and the acting is believable, and that's fine too. On some level part of the efforts of the filmmakers is to hide the seams and immerse you in the movie so you're enjoying the movie as intended.

@rapideye

4 жыл бұрын

Perhaps its both. You get too familiar with common themes to the point that they bore you. But you also get to uncover a lot of things which can only reveal itself once youve already seen so much movies in your life.

@goodial

4 жыл бұрын

@@mandarinduck I'd agree with that. Also, the more you understand what it takes to make a movie and how many different entities are evolved, the more you start to realise that getting a good movie is pretty much a miracle ...

"Are we taxing ourselves searching for meaning where none exists?" That's just life babe.

People: Critics are useless and their opinions dont matter Also people when their favourite thing has critical acclaim: see, the critics love it, this means my opinion is validated

@TheOmegaCloud

4 жыл бұрын

Critics are useless and their opinions don't matter, that sometimes they agree with the general audience doesn't change that fact, they're completely out of touch.

@daemonofdecay

4 жыл бұрын

im just a BEAN but thats ok Its funny how that works out. It’s almost as though people are more concerned with validation than anything else.

@somebodyiusedtoknow2012

4 жыл бұрын

TheOmegaCloud what is this idea that critics should have a use anyway? Critics are just people who express their opinions about art. In no way are they supposed to determine the objective value of works of art.

@ogfunk187

4 жыл бұрын

Name three films that critics said was shit but was actually great....

@diegodelafuente5056

4 жыл бұрын

@@somebodyiusedtoknow2012 except for the fact that they look at deeper aspects of movies than regular filmgoers: Shot Composition, Lighting, Sound Design, Production Value, Acting, Deeper Subtext, etc

Find a critic that shares the same sensibilities as you (much like when your friends recommends something). I trust Cecil Trachenburg to at least point out interesting stuff.

@GRAHFMETAL

4 жыл бұрын

Exactly. That's why aggregate scores make no sense to me. Instead, find the one or two critic(s) that historically match your interests and tastes and go with them

@roweproductions9424

4 жыл бұрын

Indeed. For me; critics who don't make their own films as well as critique others, don't make good reviews. Just a different perspective that most critics don't see. My favourite critic is a fellow Brit: Mark Kermode.

@fumblztv8979

4 жыл бұрын

I couldn't agree more. If I want cheesy horror I'll check in with Cecil or Joe Bob Briggs. For other genres I have other critics I trust. Aggregates and especially fan aggregates are useless.

@DarckT7

4 жыл бұрын

Screen junkies/fandom entertainment is my go to. They always have well thought out opinions and their cast is so diverse in thought so there's a critic for everyone/every genre

@mirosawirzyk5247

4 жыл бұрын

#quintessenceSL but like in the case of The Witcher do you think writing a bad review about something that you did not see is okey? Just asking..?

"You probably hate yourself." Me a millennial: You're got damn right.

You should do an episode about the obsession with "plot holes" in some amateur and online critics

Perspective was the perfect definition. Critics watch much more movies than regular movie goers. They can better place by comparison and context what that particular movie is doing right or wrong. They have the perspective of knowing the back catalogue of a director and other things involved in movie making. I used to agree with the phrase that all opinions are equally valid. Until you start realising that actually someone's opinion is only as valid as the information they have. For example, an opinion about climate change from a climatologist and from a politician graduated in law or something else non-scientific arent the same. Not at all. I really never understood people that watched like 3 movies one year and when the award season comes they get angry that none of those won anything or was even nominated. How can you be so close minded to think that because you watched only those 3 movies, those 3 movies are the only ones that should matter to the rest of the world? Come on!

@archangelrsr1326

4 жыл бұрын

Well said!

@piperfree4271

4 жыл бұрын

You can't really compare an opinion about climate change with an opinion about movies. Because when it comes to climate change we have verified objective data to analyse and compare. Movies on the other hand are an artform, which is completely subjective. While I agree that not all opinions are equally valid, but when it comes to movies it's all about the reasoning on why a film is bad or good. And people value things diffrently in a movie. The problem of flimcirtiques in my opinion are that most professional reviewers are politically biased. There are good ciritics, don't get me wrong but a lot of them have a political agenda. If a movie is woke you can be sure the critics gonna love it, regardless of the actual quality of the movie. I wonder why this isn't mentioned in the video.

@Rudykawa

4 жыл бұрын

@@piperfree4271 While I agree that art forms are subjective by nature, you can still analyse it based as I said in context and comparison. And to diferentiate defining liking a movie and saying it is good or relevant for the art form. Anyone can like a movie just because it has a cute cat and they are cat lovers, but that doesn't make the movie relevant or good. Regarding the agenda, it's basically the same thing than the example above. If you declare the movie good just because it says things you want to hear instead of analysing how it's communicating that idea, than yes, it's not good criticism of the form. But usually people that does that is, going back to the example from previous post, people that aren't really specialized in cinema and is like a politician talking about science. You just need to stick to the people that you know really has some formal basis or a long enough career in critiquing cinema.

@Rorschach1030

4 жыл бұрын

Extremely well said!!!

That 86% on Rise of Skywalker is just strange. I have yet to hear someone to say it is good.

@sanastela

4 жыл бұрын

I agree. I thought it was a mistake in the video.

@Celebrian13

4 жыл бұрын

Funny thing, because I got similar impression. No matter where I go everyone seems to hates this movie and I can not say the same thing about The Witcher. It's get even stranger when you go to metacritic.

@Peecamarke

4 жыл бұрын

That's ridiculous, I thought it was good and I'm sure if you go through the various movie goers all over the WORLD that have seen it, I'm sure you'll find quite a few people who liked it just like me

@cabellones

4 жыл бұрын

it is good if you go to see it with no hope....

@cabellones

4 жыл бұрын

like... as a film is awful, as just a star wars bite that i will not take serious, is good....

Hey! That 86% audience approval on RT about Star Wars is BS. It has been like that basically since it came out. On IMDB it has a score of 6.9.. sounds more accurate honestly.

@thedoublesmsdansk

4 жыл бұрын

the ceo of the company that owns rotten tomato used to work at disney and there has been many theories that because of that the review has been tampered with

@ReySkywalker2

4 жыл бұрын

The Audinece score is completely valid and reliable. It’s simple maths. The more reviews and score submissions the LESS the overall percentage will change. It’s stayed at 86% because 86% of people voted positive.

@runelt99

4 жыл бұрын

Some person even recorded it from start, how it never fell below 86, with most reviews being bot-like

@ReySkywalker2

4 жыл бұрын

Flaviu Vancea that’s called math

@ReySkywalker2

4 жыл бұрын

Flaviu Vancea It is math though. It’s called the law of large numbers. The more submissions to the overall score, the less the overall percentage will change. It’s really, really simple. You also don’t need a “verified account” to make an audience score submission. Your reasoning about the reviews only having 1-2 lines proving that the reviews are somehow fake isn’t backed up by any evidence or facts. I’ll explain the law of large numbers to you. When dealing with averages, especially when the average is rounded to 2 significant figures, like the Rotton Tomatoes audience score is, it is virtually mathematically impossible for the audience score to change after around 500 reviews. Why? Because the more reviews you have the less each review contributes to the overall score. Think about it. If only 4 people had reviewed TROS, 3 of which have positive (3+/10) scores, then the average would be [3/4=0.75=75%] all good. Now let’s say another person submits a negative score. The average would then be [3/5=0.6=60%]. As you can see, even after only 5 reviews, the score is only changing by 15%. Now let’s look at the same idea with 500 reviews. For simplicity, we’ll say that the average audience score is at 50% with 500 reviews. 250/500 are positive. Now, let’s say another person makes a negative review, just like in the previous example. The average would then be [250/501=0.4999=50%(when rounded to 2.s.f.)]. As you should be able to see here, as the total number of reviews increases, the amount of deviation from the average decreases with more reviews. Finally, let’s do the same with 90,000 and a score of 86%. 86% of 90,000 is 77,400. Guess what 85% (a mere 1% lower than 86%) is. You’d need a whole ≈ 1,500 negative votes to move the average percentage by 1%. 77,400/91,000 = 86%.2.s.f. Basically: The Rotten Tomatoes score for TROS is 100% legit and valid. The reason audience scores never change the more votes they get is due to the law of large numbers. Do the math.

Dave Chappelle: Sticks and Stones 2019 Rotten Tomatoes critics review stands out to me. at onetime it was at 1% from the critics and 99% from audiences.

@MagnumCreed

4 жыл бұрын

Matt Hook i think the issue is these ratings are being bought on both sides.

@ForeverInDreams237

4 жыл бұрын

That doesn't count. huge asterisk. also not a movie.

@teamhammerbros8466

4 жыл бұрын

it’s literally one of the few examples of critics getting something wrong. i’d argue 9:1 audience gets it wrong more often.

@fisharepeopletoo9653

4 жыл бұрын

@@teamhammerbros8466 The audience can not get it wrong. Movies are made to entertain, if the audience does not feel entertained, then it is a shit movie. The critics were entertained by the movie because they spent an afternoon with the director getting fattened up and gifts etc. While the audience has no such experience. If the audience doesn't like the movie, its a bad movie no matter what the critics say.

@teamhammerbros8466

4 жыл бұрын

Numbzie Audiences get things wrong all the time. Like how you just said movies are only for entertainment. You’re wrong there dude. Also wrong about critics being cozy with directors.

That 86 percent score never budged even after 92,000 viewers from the audience criticized it. Sounds like score manipulation to me.

@Russocass

4 жыл бұрын

Totally

@gregotox

4 жыл бұрын

it would not be the first time. Thats why Rotten Tomatoes has no credibility as a site.

@Kekkersboy

4 жыл бұрын

What people don't realize is that the more people you add to a percentage, the harder it is to change that percentage. The bigger the number gets, the more variance you need to actually change that number.

@db-du5l688

4 жыл бұрын

@@Kekkersboy yeah but to not deviate at all from the 86 to and a 82 or a 90 after 92,000 reviews is a little suspicious

@brasilianloser

4 жыл бұрын

Tinfoil hat out boisss

I would say the question isn't really "is film criticism dead?", but instead "are professional film critics still the best barometer of a film's value?"

@ScaryMason

4 жыл бұрын

It takes like two dozen skilled people to make a movie. Don’t you think a person writing about the movie should be just as skilled?

@JeroenDoes

4 жыл бұрын

Film critics have huge problems. The most noticeable are that they allow their own political views influence them, a lot, and they are buyable.

@denzelwenzel

4 жыл бұрын

@@ScaryMason What are their skills tho? Dont alot of them just rely on their reputation and name recognition? Are their degrees in film critcism?

@guysnacho

4 жыл бұрын

Imo they never have been. People should watch movies because they want to, not because a critic says it's good.

@James-ep2bx

4 жыл бұрын

@@ScaryMason sure, but which skills, and how to get and/or judge said skills? In the end while it's true a critic with the right skills will have a greater value then one without them, the subjective nature of art, and diversity of tastes, means the only way to know who has the right skills is though trial and error, meaning a random passer by may at times be more skilled then a nominal professional, and the question then becomes at what point does simply asking random selections of people carry more value, then asking nominal professionals

Critics aren't wrong. They're just looking at movies from a different perspective than we are. The critic is often analyzing a movie and comparing it to the other hundred movies they've seen that year alone. And because of that they're analyzing everything from the plot to the setting, props, musical scores and all the things lay folk aren't supposed to notice. Your average movie goer is only comparing it to a few and focusing on how the movie made them feel. They often can't even articulate WHY a movie made them react the way they did because they don't have the language for it. That's why critics and fans disagree sometimes. And also raises a good point about why sometimes it's better to ignore critics and decide how you feel about the movie yourself. Very insightful as usual. Thanks Wisecrack!

@WickedKnightAlbel

4 жыл бұрын

Seeing a lot of movies doesn't make you an expert on them, it makes you a pedant more concerned with finding tropes than their application

@HiDefHDMusic

4 жыл бұрын

WickedKnightAlbel mate you need to get that thumb out your bum.

@anternynova1630

4 жыл бұрын

You are assuming they are looking at a pure perspective of an ideal art critic without bias but they're own subjective bias...how about external sources such as those who source their paychecks? They are paid to critique their own way so as long as it falls in parallel with the money otherwise anyone can become a critic given they can hold the appearance via articulation

@austin-tyler5229

4 жыл бұрын

This comment itself is wrong on so many levels. Critics aren’t right either this is an industry entirely based on opinions to say that this is even considered logic is a blatant in knowledgeable opinion on the subject itself.

@captainmarvelwilson508

4 жыл бұрын

The critics who just like to compare the movie to other movies are annoying.

Critics look for different things in a film than what your typical average movie-watcher watches out for.

@fh5678

3 жыл бұрын

Both the "normal" audience and critics have audience narrative expectations and some cultural knowledge when they watch a movie. The argument of the video that critics start from some diffuse point of advanced knowledge, which renders them incapable of enjoying simple narratives, is not very convincing to me. Shouldn't a good critic be able to overcome such effect with his/her analytic toolset? The assumption that simple, but good narratives or narrative devices somehow get damaged by repetition comes also without a proof. The history of art seems to indicate otherwise. Both the audience and the critics also consume films with an expectation cultural participation. True is that critics often have different expectations of cultural participation than the common audience. For example being an audible and well regarded voice in the film scene and advancing that by mostly addressing that movie scene in their reviews. Which of course is something relatable, everyone wants to be respected in his or her profession. I could however live without the condescending , "hey, your opinion is also valid, you just happen to like trash" line of argument this video makes. Also, looking at the literature scene, the true mastery is to NOT to talk to the "common" audience as a critic, but still captivate them with the drama and the spectacle of the argument, even if they disagree. Seeking (unequal) friendship like the video does, seems to be neither beneficial for the critics nor the audience.

@mrconstantine6632

3 жыл бұрын

whats the point though, i mean like... the film is for the FANS. And the "fans" is the audience. i guess thats my opinion.

Here's a thought: without critic and user scores we'd not be having this conversation. IMHO keep them both, the disconnect in review scores is where it gets interesting and there's almost always differing reasons why.

@unlikelysuspect5491

4 жыл бұрын

I wasent eaven gun whach the whichr till I saw the controversy.

To quote some beautiful soul lost to history: "Everybody's a critic..."

@stevenpictures1

4 жыл бұрын

Geoff F. I’m pretty sure squidward said that

@Fer-on8mb

4 жыл бұрын

Ew

@Sireth

4 жыл бұрын

@@stevenpictures1 That quote has been around alot longer than Squidward.

@CAOSH78

4 жыл бұрын

Geoff F. O

‘ In many ways the work of critics is easy. They risk very little and yet enjoy a position over those who offer up their work and their selves to the opinion of others. They thrive on negative criticism.’ - Anton Ego , Ratatouille

This seems meta: “Critiquing the Critics”

@archangelrsr1326

4 жыл бұрын

It seems, but is it? Ever been to a history lecture or literature lecture at an university? One has to study a lot the context of any piece of art to understand it a tiny bit. Contextualising art is what professional critics do. What was considered trash by viewers 500 years ago is considered art today. What is considered trash today might become art tomorrow and what seems to us uneducated viewers as "art"/a "great movie" might be quite boring and worthless in its context.

@sblower9410

4 жыл бұрын

true, but the real question is: how meta is my critique of your critique of this video?

"In many ways, the work of a critic is easy. We risk very little, yet enjoy a position over those who offer up their work and their selves to our judgment. We thrive on negative criticism, which is fun to write and to read. But the bitter truth we critics must face, is that in the grand scheme of things, the average piece of junk is probably more meaningful than our criticism designating it so." ~Anton Ego, Ratatouille (2007, colourised)

@damianalejandro6959

4 жыл бұрын

so you are basically saying that every product of the cultural industry should not be touched because people put their time and work in it . even game of thrones and batman v superman?

@blueplayer6197

4 жыл бұрын

@@damianalejandro6959 He is saying that critics are just people who write junk you shouldn't care about and that you should make your own decisions and form your own opinion based on the product rather than based on some clown who wrote whatever. That's not to say cats isn't a horror show, it is to say - call it a horror show because you saw at least parts of it and understand it is what it is, rather than because some guy somewhere said so.

@km099

4 жыл бұрын

@@damianalejandro6959 I still don't get why people hate BvS

@Zelmel

4 жыл бұрын

@@km099 I mean, it's based on one of the most highly regarded Batman storylines ever published and does a pretty sad job of adapting it to film. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that people who both weren't into the comics and aren't traditionally-minded critics like it, but man is it a shallow weird pile of nonsense compared to the comic.

@km099

4 жыл бұрын

@@Zelmel Makes sense. I haven't read the comics so I guess I didn't go to the cinema with the same expectations.

The problem with Rotten Tomatoes is that it's "fresh/rotten" system is extremely flawed, which allows it to be misinterpreted. If you go and tap on the critic score to see their reviews, there's a bunch of 2.5/4 or 3 stars out of 5 reviews, yet it's clumped along with A+ and 9.5/10 reviews. RT gives any movie a "fresh" rating to any review that's over 60%, so if one critic gives a movie a 6/10 and another gives it a 10/10, they are the *exact* same value in the eyes of RT. This on itself isn't bad if we just wanted to know "is the movie worth a watch", but because they add a numerical rating, it gets misinterpreted as an average of reviewers scores when it's actually the average of "positive" reviews. Where those two critics scores would be a "100% fresh" on RT, it's actually an 80%. Basically if Rotten Tomatoes just dropped the numerical rating and just give it a fresh/rotten (good/bad) rating, it'll be interpreted SO much better. But this exact flawed system is what drives alot of traffic to their website and creates a bunch of publicity for them, so they'll never choose a coherent system when their shitty one rakes in so much money.

@Lordaramiz

4 жыл бұрын

MICHAEL_SCOTT_YELLING_THANKYOU.GIF

@yggdrasil3

4 жыл бұрын

Yep, couldn't have said it better myself. Also, the amount of mediocre and non controversial flicks that are in the 90-100 % area is pretty big. Probably because those are the films anyone can agree on.

@Peecamarke

4 жыл бұрын

A trend I notice is a lot of people will quote rotten tomatoes scores when it supports a point they're trying to make about a movie and say how useless it is when it doesn't support their point. Then you have the conspiracy people who always theories its rigged in some way shape of form and that's why said movie got high or low ratings. Really we're in an age where critics have become more of a tool to use for debates and arguments than actual criticism

@kingofthesharks

4 жыл бұрын

I was just about to say this. RT's Tomatometer is way too often interpreted as what Metacritic does. RT is not "how good a movie is" but "how likely you are to enjoy it based off critical reception". It's not necessarily "flawed" for this imo because it's a matter of audience misinterpretation. But it IS flawed when RT staff have to read critic reviews that DO NOT have a star/grade/numerical score, and they have to stamp it down as a "fresh or rotten" review even when the author left it ambiguous. CRITIC:: "Go see Captain America: Civil War if you've managed to keep up with the monumentally lengthy saga of Marvel's cinematic movie-tv series, the fan service will delight and the characters will challenge your expectations. For everyone else who hasn't kept up, this film will drive you nuts and the whole thing will be a waste of time." RT: "Uhhh, I guess we'll put this review down as rotten. I think. Maybe."

@MrDarrylR

4 жыл бұрын

Metacritic, which attempts to average critics grades/numerical scores (including its readers assessing text-only reviews for scores), does a far better job than Rotten Tomatoes, which just squashes every critic into a thumbs-up/thumbs-down binary.

Can we all just take a moment to recognize just how great of a show The Critic was?

@Proclaimfame

4 жыл бұрын

Bout to go buy his book!!!

@roguebantha7324

4 жыл бұрын

I hate it!

@kmaru80

4 жыл бұрын

It stunk!

I used to think movie critics lives were a tragedy, but now I realize it's a comedy.

"Cats is just awful"-- everyone

@theriffwriter2194

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah, I can't wait to see it and I haven't liked a musical since nightmare before Christmas but I'm really good at distinguishing the difference between a bad film and contagious groupthink.

@sarsky22

4 жыл бұрын

@@theriffwriter2194 do I have to use the word groupthink now ? 🤔

@theriffwriter2194

4 жыл бұрын

@@sarsky22 ?...oh I get it. I'm an idiot.

@sarsky22

4 жыл бұрын

@@theriffwriter2194 no cause you got it 😌

@robbietorkelsonn8509

4 жыл бұрын

@@theriffwriter2194 I probably take a look ... right after I binch watched all 11 seasons of the X files, all 6 six seasons of parks and recration and all 9 seasons of the office ... and I still remember cats exists

"86" percent.... ya... okay....

@SockPupet

4 жыл бұрын

Metacritic has user reviews at 49...

@kevinsmoon3257

4 жыл бұрын

Crustis yeah weren’t they messing with the reviews

@crustis5958

4 жыл бұрын

@@kevinsmoon3257 ding ding... its been locked at 86

@j.2512

4 жыл бұрын

fake reviews and bots can get you a long way, maybe up to 92%

@murraybeachtel8585

4 жыл бұрын

Most of the people I know enjoyed it. I left a positive review.

I think there is always meaning in media, even in the places where “none exist.” It can show us what kind of cultural norms we have, and what kind of things we take for granted, and even give us an insight into how the people making these films see the world. That being said, how much there is to say about it still is a matter of debate.

I was surprised you didn't talk about intent vs. interpretation when it came to directing the medium and which mattered more. I always find that interesting when looking for major themes. I end up referencing the Stanislavsky/Chekov interpretation of Chekov's The Cherry Orchard (good story, check it out). Mad props for you guys though. Love the channel and all the work you do!

The audience Rotten Tomatoes score is not accurate. Many fans didn’t like the movie and sent thousands of low scores on the opening weekend. Yet the score never moved below 80%....

@caleboden5087

4 жыл бұрын

Rotten tomatoes also actively takes down negative posts for films on occasion.

@t.b.m.5718

4 жыл бұрын

The audience score is far easier to manipulate than the critics score. In theory, you could program something to leave fake reviews on rotten tomatoes and I suspect some studios hire programmers to do just that.

jokes on you I already hate myself

@daltonhernandez721

4 жыл бұрын

Came down here to say the exact same thing.

@rafaelalodio5116

4 жыл бұрын

Yay me too!

>86% tomatometer on rise of skywalker This number has been locked about a month ago, you know that right?

@deadshot5007

4 жыл бұрын

No it's not idiot

If I watch a bad movie, I can usually go "eh" and move on. But if I watch a bad movie within a series I care about, I'm not as forgiving, because I want to see the series improve

@ritwikreddy5670

4 жыл бұрын

"Star wars fans are the biggest haters of star wars movies". People generally don't care about a movie if they didn't like it, unless it is from a franchise they love.

@ritwikreddy5670

4 жыл бұрын

Same can be said with captain marvel. Every fan watched it, but since it was subpar to the films that it was successor of, they hated it.

The Nostalgia Critic said it best: "Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Unless they're dumb and not mine."

@pickle5666

4 жыл бұрын

Leave the wall alone!

Rich Evans tells me all I need to know

@bradwright9477

4 жыл бұрын

RLM reviews are hilarious but I take their critiques with a grain of salt. They have become very much “let’s dislike what people are loving” which can annoy me

@diegowushu

4 жыл бұрын

@@bradwright9477 that statement is really inaccurate.

@Zefo_No

4 жыл бұрын

@@bradwright9477 other than Joker for Jay, where he personally wasn't having any of it, I can't think of a single example of that. So, what do you mean?

@the_regular_dinosaurus_rex

4 жыл бұрын

@@Zefo_No probably talking about marvel? ... RLM seem to be annoyed by all the comic book movies and can understand why... My marvel fatigue set in after the first ant man. I didnt even watch end game (in cinema that is... Will give it a try when one of my friends buys the bluray)

@Thallod

4 жыл бұрын

I understood that reference so I clapped!

It's simple: friction means "interaction", so critics will shit on something and almost instantly they'll get a lot of reactions / angry comments calling them names

I have sometimes wondered if you guys put more thought into the philosophical implications and bases for certain shows and movies than the creators did...but at the end of the day, I absolutely LOVE hearing your takes. I have learned a ton about philosophy from your shows and podcasts. So please, keep it up. :)

0:25 of course that 86 percent has not moved at ALL... so it seems funny. (What dosent help is rotten tomatoes has been shown to "tamper" with scores.) Look all humans are not the same so the same can be said about critics or viewers. Saying this the real question should be "is rotten tomatoes actually helpful or harmful to movies?".

@JasonPrice1

4 жыл бұрын

Frankly, that one point both proves that RT is useless now and that the writer for this video is either oblivious to everything that RT has been up to over the last 2 years or is willingly ignoring facts.

@k.s.n.7342

4 жыл бұрын

WiseCrack did not do their RT research on SW-TROS which makes them look like DumbCrack.

@darkain666

4 жыл бұрын

Yup, 1 minute into the video and already a flawed analysis... Jared absence seems to be impacting the quality of the videos.

@theboss572

4 жыл бұрын

I think you guys are missing the point of the video. Yes they use RT but RT is not the point of the video.

@k.s.n.7342

4 жыл бұрын

@@theboss572 I get that. But when you start you point with false data your point is by default: Invalid.

You do realise that Rotten Tomato froze the audience score at 86 percent, right?

@Icepick614

4 жыл бұрын

These scores are averages and the more reviews that add to an average the harder it is for an average to change that's why scores of all movies fluctuate when a movie releases but as more get added then it's going to stop and settle into its actual average. RoS has almost 100k reviews which means it would take hundreds of only negative reviews to move it.

This is my first time watching a video on your channel. A channel I didn’t even know existed. And I simply could not go away without giving you a thumbs up. You’ve given me an entertaining and thoroughly informative video. And I’m grateful. Needless to say, you can consider me a subscriber.

4:10 actually you can just go watch any zero puctuation episode

KZreadrs are basically critics of critics.

@Kekkersboy

4 жыл бұрын

Except for the youtubers that are critics. A lot of people don't realize that the " KZread Critics " that a lot of people follow. Are actually on rotten tomatoes as listed critics.

@comicbookguy83

4 жыл бұрын

And the comment section is meant for what again?

@chowyee5049

4 жыл бұрын

@@comicbookguy83 critics of critics of critics.

@racheljohnhyatt4028

4 жыл бұрын

Kekkersboy true

@davidlewis6728

4 жыл бұрын

movie critics are not critics. youtubers have integrity, these assholes don't. know the difference.

This is funny because every single person i know/follow on social medias that watched the new star wars hate it, but loved the witcher

@lasarousi

4 жыл бұрын

Maybe just maybe you follow those people in the first place because they trigger your confirmation bias and will always agree on those things?

@ruancomitre

4 жыл бұрын

@@lasarousi yes, you are right, the people i know/follow are not exactly a sample size that can be trusted from a statistical standpoint, and also social medias tend to put us on bubbles where we don't face opinions we dont agree with. im not giving a "correct opinion", because no such thing exist, was just stating what i saw from my perspective, because i thought It was a interesting thing.

@stephanl2409

3 жыл бұрын

I hated both. Can anyone Tell me why when the witcher haggles with a peasant the peasant then pulls the exact amount out of his tunic in a nice little sack. Lazy storytelling

" . . . Claiming formal or symbolic intricacy where none exists . . . " can be directed at all forms of art. I can't imagine half of the pretty patterns that adorn the walls in most galleries could have the hefty and lofty meanings dribbled out by their curators. The artist slapping the paint down more than likely just thought, "That works well". Sometimes you just do what feels good and right at the time. The "Deeper Meaning" gets applied later.

I love you guys and everything you do. Thank you for your overanalysis, your perfect analysis. Your love for media and philosophy and thought brings me so much joy.

Conclusion: Rotten Tomatoes is useless. Don't use a counting algorithm for your opinion on the quality of a movie you wanted to see. Use your head. 😒

@blakemeads9225

4 жыл бұрын

Shit, I’ve been saying that for years

@poliestotico

4 жыл бұрын

Blake Meads i think it is a pretty good estimate to take into account before spending big bucks to go to the movies

@darkecofreak23

4 жыл бұрын

poliestotico I disagree. I’ve found RT to be on the opposite end of the spectrum regarding a lot of the movies I really enjoy, so I’ve never really given it a lot of weight.

@TheLumberjack1987

4 жыл бұрын

@@darkecofreak23 i personally look at rotten tomatoes, imdb and metacritic and then I ask friends and coworkers. That's been working pretty well for me.

@JBaughb

4 жыл бұрын

Its a single data point. To discard it completely, or treat it as gospel are both equally wrong.

Any movie goer has the right to be a "critic", holding what you enjoy to high standard should just be the norm for anyone.

@cadenglass1387

4 жыл бұрын

True, but someone ranting about McDonald's is just bad taste.

@raymondthrone7197

4 жыл бұрын

@@cadenglass1387 Someone arguing that McDonalds is equally as good as prime Fillet Mignon and because their opinion is as valid as anyone else's, who can _really_ say what's a better piece of meat? ...is in at least equally bad taste.

@Peecamarke

4 жыл бұрын

I don't think everyone's opinion on a lot on any subjects is equal but when it comes to art and entertainment, they're so subjective its hard to really be an expert on any one thing to have a more valued opinion

@babyboomer6272

4 жыл бұрын

Unless it's a movie both Tge Critics & Audience hate.

@GirishKumarBhat

4 жыл бұрын

My friend told me 6 underground is amazing, a must watch. It fucking sucked balls, critics disliked it too. I mostly agree with them. Norms have stupid taste in films.

“A man is a critic when he can’t be an artist in the same way a man is an informant when he can’t be a good soldier” - Gustave Flaubert

@amandacoelho9524

4 жыл бұрын

But still better than the average joes opinion 🤷🏻‍♀️

@JohanStarDragon

4 жыл бұрын

Amanda Coelho I prefer to come to my own decisions. Which is why I don’t pay attention to critics or “fans” when they start hating on movies. Just seems like these days that just because everyone has internet access that they know everything.

This channel is definitely one of my favourites, thanks guys! But this clicking sound or noise, when typing something on the screen, is just so annoying.

_"No one is more or less right"_ Tell this to the bunch of KZreadrs who call their oppinions "objective critiques".

@Catholictomherbert

4 жыл бұрын

Well they are objective critiques lol stop turning your brain off bruh your ad hominem is not an argument lol

@ComatHam

4 жыл бұрын

@@Catholictomherbert Where do I make ad hominems? Their critiques are not more or less objective than anyone elses.

@RomeoDeJuliette

4 жыл бұрын

@@Catholictomherbert objective criticism in art doesn't exist. - Att a Performance Arts Graduate

@RomeoDeJuliette

4 жыл бұрын

@Joshua J that is not objective criticism, again that doesn't exist.

@bbrbbr-on2gd

4 жыл бұрын

mint_tommy15 I think you might be confusing Objective with Subjective?

Citing audience scores on RT for TV shows(and most movies prior to mid 2019) is pointless. They aren’t verified, unlike newer movie scores which require you to prove you paid for the movie. If you actually read the watchmen reviews you’ll see most of those “negative” critiques aren’t exactly made in the best of faith.

@walkinmn

4 жыл бұрын

Exactly, that's my problem with modern critics ratings and also from audience, because a lot of times the movie or series content won't really matter, what matters is what the loud ones are saying in social networks no matter if they're right or wrong. That's why I don't really care for criticism when I'm going to watch a movie. Right now I can bet, no matter whether the Mulan movie is good or bad, the reviews are going to be bad because of the political situation with Hongkong and even about the Coronavirus, right now the western media won't be on the side of China even for a movie about a westernized fictional character (yes based on true events) from Disney, a western studio.

@colinmcleod3314

4 жыл бұрын

even then sites like Rotten Tomatoes delete bad reviews

@cptrelentless80085

4 жыл бұрын

Alex Angerman The Tulsa Massacre was an actual thing, so if you don’t like white people being blamed then maybe they shouldn’t go round lynching black people. But that’s not really what the series is about.

@MrMctastics

4 жыл бұрын

Alex Angerman the show is about fighting a terrorist white suprmacist group so there are a lot of bad people who are also white and racist. The comics wanted to make people uncomfortable.The creators of the watchmen wanted everone who watched it to be uncomfortable. There is a lot of good comics movies and tv shows that want the people who watch it to be uncomfortable. I recommend you watch it. I consider it the best tv show of the year.

@cdfox85

4 жыл бұрын

I'm a very progressive person, so my dislike for Watchmen isn't rooted in any discomfort with progressive themes. I just thought it was a silly and nonsensical show. I just...didn't like it. 🤷‍♀️ And I am baffled at the praise for the show. That said, you are correct that a lot of the criticism is from people who just don't like the themes and ideas being put forward.

Enjoyed the video, guys. Still curious if/when Jared is coming back and whether or not he's alright.

Thanks for not having in video ad, much appreciated

Rumor (I repeat *rumor)* has it that Rotten Tomatoes has algorithmically fixed the audience review score of _The Rise of Skywalker_ to go no lower than 86% by only allowing reviews to post/actually affect the score in proportional batches.

The Rise of Skywalker doesn’t deserve that high of an audience score.

@Kekkersboy

4 жыл бұрын

Dear god that movie made me angry watching it. It was just so bad.

@Sandul666

4 жыл бұрын

@@Niop_Tres I love the pest. It has John liguazamo in it and my wife hates it but generally stress my taste is otherwise fine lolol

@jinnlee6582

4 жыл бұрын

So many stupid plot hole and bad action. It is overrated.

@samboujaiteh3331

4 жыл бұрын

@@Niop_Tres Valerion and the City of a Thousand Planets

@mariot8732

4 жыл бұрын

I think it does for a simple reason: just the one who love Star Wars bother to watch and/or rate the movie

4:10 I Hate Everything: "Am I a joke to you?"

@theriffwriter2194

4 жыл бұрын

Oh the irony. The most respected critics, of any media, get 0 respect from the "real" critics of said media. It's a tale as old as time. They feel threatened by the new guard. So they do everything within their power to discredit them. A (ex) popular, Rolling Stone music critic wrote a hit piece saying Anthony Fantano, who couldn't be further left, was a secret alt-righter.

It's strange. My only interaction with Rise of Skywalker has been seeing the thumbnails for fan videos complaining about it, so I assumed that it was the opposite. I thought that the critics loved it, and fans hated it.

@billbutton8468

4 жыл бұрын

I thought both hated it

@RegPentagon

3 жыл бұрын

That's the case for The Last Jedi, 90% vs. 42%.

@iammariasoledad3295

2 жыл бұрын

That's what I thought too...

Personally i think Critics had a role in the age before the internet. As they ware often the only way to find out if the thing you ware gonna watch is worth the money. Nowadays its much easier to find opinions on media from people who may have similar tastes to yours thus making their opinion more viable.

@MorroTreece

4 жыл бұрын

Have to agree, a lot of them seem to feel like they need to be overly critical or hold a movie up to an unattainable pedestal in order to validate their time spent in film/theater schools. So you have critics with summaries of movies like, "New Star wars movie is no God Father" or something along those lines. Just take the movie Titanic, it was hated by several critics when it was released.

@djukor

4 жыл бұрын

@@KingSigy I agree 100%. But then again when is say people who who may have similar tastes to yours i mean this about all forms of media not just movies. Finding someone who has similar tastes to yours may give you a different outlook on a movie that is critically panned but acualy looks interesting to you. If the person you know has similar tastes to yours says its bad than you know its probably bad. But at the same time i am not petty enough to not watch a overall positively rated movie or series if my favorite critic thinks its bad. This is extra true for video games as game critics can often give negative criticism to games in a genre they are not familiar whit.

@lasarousi

4 жыл бұрын

But are you getting the correct opinion for you though? You can follow progress opinions that directly contradict your tastes. Opinions in general are useless when talking about consuming media because you might like shit.

"Are Critics Useless Unless They Tell Me What I Wanna Hear?-Wisecrack Edition"

GREAT VIDEO! Great job man, I think you're a great critic. Keep up the awesome work!

I would love a website that recommends movies based on what I have seen and enjoyed. Not just a "you might also enjoy" algorithm that shows me every other MCU film because I like Iron Man but a system designed to recommend films I might not otherwise see. Spotify has dramatically expanded my musical tastes through their system.

Before watching this video, here are my thoughts based off the title, most critics (hopefully) are educated in the arts of film so in a way you could say that a critic review is telling you how good it is as a piece of art whilst audience review shows how enjoyable it might be, at the end of the day neither of which can provide an answer of how much an individual viewer will enjoy the movie because everyone has different tastes, the best way to find out if a film is something you like is to find a critic or reviewer who shares similar interests to you, that way if they like it then you will very likely enjoy it as much

@Sophistry0001

4 жыл бұрын

IMO making a judgment that critics / audience scores are useless essentially means making a statement that a certain type of film is objectively wrong. And since film is art, that is saying that a certain type of art is incorrect. Which seems like a pretentious and absurd statement to me.

@typemasters2871

4 жыл бұрын

@@Sophistry0001 I am not saying that art can be "objectively wrong", what I am saying is that some art can be thoughtfully thought through and has tons of meaning and symbolism, some art might not be as expertly crafted but aims to entertain rather than use the full extent of film knowledge, and some are just rushed through in the hopes of making a quick buck whilst giving no thought as to how enjoyable or thoughtful the piece is.

@Sophistry0001

4 жыл бұрын

@@typemasters2871 For sure. It's like junk food vs gourmet meal. Some movies just have no substance or nutritional value.

those are not real audience scores

@sharilshahed6106

4 жыл бұрын

depends on the content

@luminusprotect

4 жыл бұрын

@@sharilshahed6106 no literally they froze the 86 on the audience

@gamingguru2k6

4 жыл бұрын

RT doesn't count reviews lower than 3.5 stars.

I love writing reviews but can't read reviews until after I consume the media. I've been testing my Nostalgia Blinders quite a bit; It's interesting to see shows you still love 10 years later vs ones that fail to make the cut.

At the end of the day there’s only one way to know if you like a movie and that’s to watch it.

Well, my personal rating usually is closer to the critics rating than the audience rating, so to me critics are not useless.

@j.2512

4 жыл бұрын

same, Witcher and Star Wars sucked, fan reviews is usually what the company wants you to see since they bot the shit out of it with fake reviews.

WAIT, people didn't like Watchmen? It was an amazing screenplay.

@archer1949

4 жыл бұрын

Mathieu P. Corbeil The user ratings got bombed by a bunch of diaper-wearing Incel Neckbeards who were triggered by the show’s implication that their Red Pilled hero, Rorschach, was not necessarily a good guy.

@mohammadnaghizade3544

4 жыл бұрын

@@archer1949 pretty much every character in the movie was an asshole. They were different aspects of super heroes. Jesus how could you miss that?

@cabellones

4 жыл бұрын

@@archer1949 to be fair, he isn't, but then again... no one is on watchmen... they all are flaws, insecure, and hiding something, hell even comedian with all his shit had Redeemer qualities too... that's the point. now in the series, as I see it, it was a distortion of what Rorschach believed. they only use him to legitimize their agenda.

@archer1949

4 жыл бұрын

Christian Cordoba You guys are assuming that the morons who bombed the ratings actually read the book. I can almost guarantee they hadn’t. They just saw Zach “Ayn Rand is my waifu” Snyder’s circlejerk of a movie and found a “hero” they could identify with. The show completely ignores the movie, to its credit. But to the average Neckbeard, that sin is unforgivable.

@DarckT7

4 жыл бұрын

@@cabellones by "they" do you mean the white supremacist group in the show? Because if you do then yeah that's the point of the show: people distorting and making a martyr out of a super flawed character to fit their agenda. But the triggered people review bombing never saw that far

Really great analysis and I enjoyed the video, but any chance you can lighten up on all the dings, whooshes, and snap sound effects?

Enthusiastic people like you are effectively film professors and deserve more attention than any film critic. Comparing to film critics you are film educators.

"I'm a film addict, absolutely crazy about cinema."

@komickid833

4 жыл бұрын

Jules Vox nice nice very nice

Yeah that 86% for RoS is about at stages as you can get. It hasn't moved after thousands and thousands of reviews. By standard mathematics it should have moved up or down at least a point or two. So yeah just don't believe Rotten Tomatoes at all for either side.

"Ep 9 was trash and they should feel like trash" Doctor Zoidberg

Boy, I really find hard to believe that 86% audience score for The Rise Of Skywalker. From almost every corner online I can only see negative comments and dissapoinment, maybe the people who liked it doesn't speak to much about it? I dunno

@Virjunior01

4 жыл бұрын

Vocal minorities are often negative, but in the case of Star Wars, theirs is a glassy-eyed cult of consumption. Like for real.

@darriusbethea2373

4 жыл бұрын

Ignore other guy it was the last movie in the trilogy and people expectations where low given how awful the previous one was the Rise of Skywalker was bad but it wasn’t compared to last Jedi and while had to a Star Wars fan the rise of Skywalker is probably enjoyable to your average person going to see a blockbuster film. Critics for Star Wars movies are never really good indication because most aren’t actually fans of it.

To me the role of the critic can be either help you avoid spending money/time on something or teach you about what you saw. For most of the times and most of the people, the second one is not gonna be useful, cause most critics (and even more of the modern-online ones) are not up to the task and most people don't want it. For the "saving" one the issue is finding somebody (a critic or source) that shares your tastes, so when you read them then you know your gonna like it. There's never a correct answer of which movie is good or bad, so finding somebody with similar tastes is the way to go. And if you wanna learn something, then go find it (that applies also for different POVs, cause I hated Black Panther, but it's interesting finding people's perspectives of why it's supposedly so good).

@p.bamygdala2139

4 жыл бұрын

Great comment!

@SergioR00

4 жыл бұрын

Why do you hate Black Panther

Find a critic with similar tastes to yours, ignore everything else. Also as everyone else has stated, Rotten Tomatoes has blatantly altered the Star Wars score to keep it at 86 so it's scores should be taken with a hefty grain of salt.

@02:00 I see what you did there :) Happy Groundhog Day to everyone at Wisecrack! Especially - Be well to Jared and everyone in his family!

I look forward to every video y’all make

Why did this eventually devolve into death of the author

@magvad6472

4 жыл бұрын

At the core of all life's problems...lies one simple solution. If you aren't willing to accept the fact Death of the Author is our greatest problem as a society...that is a society...you just aren't awake yet.

@TheDSasterX

4 жыл бұрын

Long live the author!

Critics: "Watchmen is a thoughtful examination of modern day race and class conflict through the lens of Alan Moore's exaggerated Reagan-era far-right neoliberalist cautionary alt-universe." -- 92% 'Fans': "Why did they make Watchmen political!?!? Go Woke, Go Broke!!!" -- 54% Critics: "Hackneyed, unfocused, bouncing from one incomplete plot point to the next with no regard for logic, The Rise of Skywalker is not just the worst Star Wars story but barely a story at all." -- 52% Fans: "DEW IT!!!!! *proceeds to make Reylo fan art*" -- 86% I mean... it is what it is. Take a man or woman. Students of film. Years of study. Force them to watch movies they would rather not over and over again. Crucible, attrition, refinement, like a chisel to stone, repeated. Differing tastes and points of view. One day this critic likes this thing, the next day that critic likes that thing, and on and on, bringing to the table an endless stream of experiences and references, exposure to the best and the worst, fishing gold from troughs of pig slop. And then, over time, you see it twist into something fascinating. A sloping hill with a particular shape of a thing, a group reflection of the nature of a work as funneled through as many perspectives with as many points of reference as possible. Alternately, take a stadium. A high school gym teacher, a nine year old girl scout, an incel, a Nazi, a firefighter in his 40's, a single mother of three, the president of the United States. Maybe they see a movie once a year, maybe they only like cop procedurals, maybe they dress up like a princess to watch The Little Mermaid for the fifteenth time. Who knows. Nameless, endless, wave after wave pouring into that stadium, and then when it's full to standing room only you ask the grandma, the Imam, the tennis coach, the camp counselor, the Mormon minister, you ask all of them to answer with voices of equal weight, "So, did you like Mad Max Fury Road?" This is why I don't get upset when critics have opinions different than mine. This is why it's absurd to be selective about when and where you choose critics vs. audiences, this is why it's incomplete to pick one critic out of a hat and hope that of the hundreds of possible critics you can easily access in one place that the two or three who GOT TO YOU FIRST are the ones who share your tastes the most. Just stop treating critic reviews like a personal attack on your identity. And once in a while stop watching movies just because the trailer looks cool and ask the critics their opinions. You might be surprised at what people who do nothing all day but watch movies based on necessity rather than marketing end up liking most.

@Gemnist98

4 жыл бұрын

Dude, this is beautiful.

@devilsadvocate4081

4 жыл бұрын

Exactly my thought.

@fredorpaul

4 жыл бұрын

For critics it's their job tho. If they have a bias against a certain type of movie they should out with that and state why, maybe make a profile for how they feel about different types of movies so their customers can do a better job of determining if their review is relivent to them. Frankly I think we need a distinction between critics and glorified opinion piece writers. As a low hang fruit example If a critic reviews "God is not dead" and want to spend a paragraph calling it a bad dumb piece of christian propaganda and tear into its logical falicies, thats fine as long as they spend several paragraphs critiquing the film it's self. But an article that reviews it by saying bad writing/directing/acting....... and then spends most of its time shiting on ideaology of the movie and on a political tirade should not be called a critique of the movie, and the author should not be called film critics. also if you(not saying op) think that alan moore's writing are not political, you are nuts. That said alan moore prefers wizardry, kinda like what Legion did, over beating you over the head with mace disguised as big blue cock, like the watchmen tv show did.

@siematonieja

4 жыл бұрын

Preach it

@TheWatcher328

4 жыл бұрын

This is amazing.

Also, don't trust the RT Audience scores. Just don't. The only reason that the Critic scores might be able to be trusted is that you can go through every one of them and verify them, and do the calculations yourself. 400 data points? Lots of work, but not impossible. For the Audience score? There is no way that 86% of the Audience liked RoS - and it's almost impossible, statistically, that RoS has had 86% approval from 12K fan reviews to now 96K fan reviews. Fresh? Sure. But staying the exact same percentage over 84K extra votes? (Particularly when it started to drop around 24K, and was sitting at 77%.) Hell no. And that isn't even taking into account the manipulations that we've seen RT commit to game the Audience Scores in the past two years. Maybe going back before that as well, but it seems like Review Scores have only gotten Political enough in the last 2 years or so to demand some kind of manipulation. tl:dr - Don't trust the RT Audience scores these days. Always cross-reference with another source, like IMDB. (which, incidentally, gives TLJ a higher audience score (7.0) than RT does (43%)- showing that perhaps the Audience Score for TLJ was more of a political battleground fought on RT than an actual representation of the Audience reaction? Another reason to discount the audience score at RT.)

@krombopulos_michael

4 жыл бұрын

My main reason not to trust it is that a lot of the time, the split represents some kind of political or identity backlash rather than anything to do with the quality of the film itself. Groups with a bone to pick can easily organise and flood the sincere audience reviews without even seeing the film. If you want to get a better idea of audience reaction, I agree that IMDB is a better place to turn. They have algorithms that minimise deliberate review bombing, and tend to have an audience that is a little more more tuned into films than the drama around them. Or look to Cinemascore, which is an industry firm that polls regular people as they come out of theatres to get a read on how audiences liked the film.

@fredorpaul

4 жыл бұрын

To be fair RT and IMDB have different audiences, but to be balanced I you're probably right and that would make sense, because while I can see large a large portion of the population liking Ros and some fan boys refusing to admit it was bad, I find it had to believe the majority of internet dwellers liking it.

@LimitedSpartan

4 жыл бұрын

Well yes, but also no. Sure, the audience score won't be 100% correct, but it's still a decent indicator. You make the argument that RT has gamed the audience scores, they did that with critic scores as well. For every person putting in multiple reviews, or troll reviews on one side of the spectrum, the inverse is usually true as well for a good amount of movies LIKE TLJ, and this tends to balance it out. Most importantly, it is entirely possible 86% of the Audience liked RoS, and wherever you go you see that to be true. You can say to not "trust" the audience scores but the truth is that it'll always be close. It's possible that 76%, or 96% liked RoS on RT. But it isn't going to vary wildly. Cross referencing with IMDB isn't going to do much either because different people use different sites. I don't know many people that rate something on both IMDB and RT. IMDB as a whole tends to be a lot more positive as well. Critics scores can be trusted for the fact that yes, that would be the percentage, but it can't be trusted on whether or not the movie being reviewed is a good movie. My bottom line and the thing that really needs to stick, is that you shouldn't bother with rotten tomatoes or IMDB at all. If you care that much about other opinions, find a critic, or friend who's tastes align with yours and find out what they think.

@stefanradebach2889

4 жыл бұрын

The interesting thing is that the RT audience score for The Last Jedi was initially 57% at 83,000 when it was first released and afterwards dropped to 43% with over 200,000 reviews as of now. The fact that The Rise of Skywalker score hasn't changed after that surge baffles me.

@aaroncornish9955

4 жыл бұрын

That Other Guy yeah they are definitely gaming the metrics at the very least, or using bot like tactics or paid reviewers or something shady. Studios are investing a lot to make movies this day and if they can inflate the audience score and capitalize on the rising trend of not believing in experts they will definitely do so.

great vid, love you Michael, I hope Jared's doing okay

The 86 from fans in Star Wars has kept the same since the start, something statically imposible

@Z3R0M0N5T3R

4 жыл бұрын

It's almost like Disney is a multibillion dollar multimedia company that has methodically controlled the narrative around all of their properties, And comparing them to Netflix is laughable.

@TorquemadaTwist

4 жыл бұрын

The Dark Side of the force is strong.

Well, I find critics very useful to learn about movies I wouldn’t see otherwise. And I mostly agree with them. I also loved watchmen and hated episode IX. I just disagree about the witcher

Also, keep on the good work, the channel is always producing great content, cheers drom Brazil! (leaving a nice comment for that midnight burst of crippling self doubt to make you feel better)

The "The Witcher" case was the worst demonstration of how some critics aren't being professional with their jobs. How the hell does a critic write in their own material that they didn't watch certain episodes? That they skipped to the final and etc. and think they can provide insight and score a show? It's lazy job and should receive all the backlash it's receiving.

@DrHashbrowns

4 жыл бұрын

João Renz the Witcher is fun but not narratively solid. It didn’t do anything profound or original so critically it’s not good but as a normal person it’s fun to watch. If you watched it knowing nothing about it from the perspective of a critic you would assume people wouldn’t like it because it’s hard to follow and kinda bleak. That said if the critics like it but the audience doesn’t then it’s probably original and artistic but boring. If the audience loves it and the critics don’t then it’s fun but has narrative problems.

"If you're just an everyday movie goer you'll probably love it (RoS)" those are not real audience scores. Everyone I know either despises RoS or thinks it's a "so bad it's good" kind of movie.

@TheGeorgeD13

4 жыл бұрын

That anecdotal evidence on your part. It’s largely considered good by the general audience. Your friends are the barometer for the entire general public. When they say general public, we’re averaging out to the most milquetoast people in society. Those are the ones that ROS pleases greatly. Upset just about everybody else, though.

@foxdie1001

4 жыл бұрын

Rotten tomatoes. The website that deleted negative audience scores. Just saying.

@quietcourage1133

4 жыл бұрын

@@foxdie1001 Are they known of deleting negative reviews? Because I've only seen them delete troll reviews from review bombs Like when Captain Marvel got more reviews in one night then Infinity War got in an entire year.

@rashidtorn3709

4 жыл бұрын

@@quietcourage1133 🤫🤫🤫 That didnt happen. Every single review of Captain Marvel was legit and criticize the movie. Even the thousands of "I am Robbie the Synthetic comment" reviews.

@ericvcod2133

4 жыл бұрын

@@quietcourage1133 it was the anticipation score not the actual reviews, people bomberded the movie's anticipation score for trolling's sake unless that the general public somehow managed to watch the movie before it was out in theaters.

Understandable. At the end of the day, audience and critics, even to each other of either, have their own ways to watch and understand the movie. Your perspective might be different from others, and that's not a big deal. What's not understandable, is skipping few episodes, and claiming to review the whole season... and still admitting that to the internet Or (maybe) manipulating the film ratings' platform So silly...

In the video, they discussed about why critics hates a movie/show that a general audience loves. However I would like to know why/how situations where the critics loves but general audience hates come to be?

I feel that an interesting parallel could be drawn between early film criticism being so bare bones in its analysis, and then moving to this bigger space of lenses and meaning while maintaining the craft talk with what we have seen with games criticism moving from a purely technical report of performance to what is done today. Not only because I think these two parallel each other on the one side but also because the fan response is related but not the same.

You can easily leave the Rise of Skywalker having had a good time - the visuals were dazzling, the score is as epic as always - it's only when you have time to reflect that problems bubble up like plot beats and character work

I thought Star Wars was garbage, The Witcher was really good, and Watchmen was transcendent.... but who cares. Rotten tomatoes is pointless because honestly who cares what anyone else thinks about what you personally enjoy or do not enjoy. Art is subjective.

@rangergxi

4 жыл бұрын

Most critics are people that can't enjoy films they disagree with. It's all a waste of time.

@bradwright9477

4 жыл бұрын

Star Wars was a really good time. Buy yeah, I listen to critics but form my own opinions

@marktyler3381

4 жыл бұрын

I enjoyed the Watchmen, even though it's white supremacist message is laughable.

@mikejohnstonbob935

4 жыл бұрын

@@marktyler3381 What was their white supremacist message? My take is that their racist fears and pursuit of power to quell those fears ultimately lead them to their own destruction, which is pretty true considering America's political climate. There was also the secondary theme of the captain hiding/ashamed of his racism and the separation of the internal and external racial views. This secondary theme wasn't well flushed out.

@Peecamarke

4 жыл бұрын

I thought Starwars was great but that proves like you said, you cant listen to everybody else and gotta watch things yourself to form you're own opinion.

Film criticism is that tricky blend between spectating on the cultural and emotional significance of a movie within the spectrum of "Film," and the effort to determine whether a movie is worth watching because or despite it's foreseen metaphorical importance, as movies are coping mechanism for our own thoughts and experiences, so whether a movie will aide or simply be worth our time and thought would be the aim of voicing any opinion, or criticism, for others to consider

Wisecrack, I genuinely love and appreciate your takes on... pretty much everything. I don't want to say you're always hella on-point and correct... but you're pretty much always hella on-point and correct. Even the little jingle at the end sounds like it's saying "sorry if you were wrong, not sorry for being on-point and correct all the time." You asked for nice comments. If that doesn't help you sleep at night... I dunno, try sleeping during the day, or try fucking off because I'm not your sleep doctor.

“There is no wrong opinion” is an opinion that might be wrong.

@CountOrlok22

4 жыл бұрын

All opinions are wrong. That is why they are opinions.

@caldw615

4 жыл бұрын

Opinions are subjective. Saying they are right or wrong is like pointing at the Mona Lisa and saying "This painting is wrong". How? In what way? What do you mean? Aspects of an opinion or painting can be right or wrong like saying red is blue but the concept of it can't be.

@CountOrlok22

4 жыл бұрын

Subjectivity is also wrong. It's not the painting that is wrong. The painting exists. It is our limited and biased perception of it that is wrong. Humans aren't infallible. Everything we see, say, think, and do is subject to that, subject to our own flaws, and therefore our processing is wrong by default of our perceptions.

@caldw615

4 жыл бұрын

@@CountOrlok22 Again that's you only basing it on something objective you can say about it, like the colour, if it's realistic to a real life image etc. You cannot flat out say the painting itself is "right" or "wrong", you can only say an objective aspect to it that you can compare or fact check is wrong.

@CountOrlok22

4 жыл бұрын

Nobody is saying that the film, painting, or work of music is right or wrong. They are saying that having an opinion of it can be wrong. "This movie sucks," is an opinion and it is wrong because it's egocentric, shortsighted, absolutist, facile, and it doesn't require thought. It doesn't provide any evidence or evaluation to support itself as a statement. The people who attack critics often engage in primitive discourse like this which just emphasizes how little they actually understand critical evaluation as well as how little they are processing what they see. "This movie was boring and slow" is hardly any better.

I really want to know who and why liked the last Star Wars movie.

@archangelrsr1326

4 жыл бұрын

Kids and those with a child-like mentality. This is what the movie aimed for. Flashy lights, quotes from old movies and ultra simple dialogues are what children like, but not what an intellectual is interested in. Nostalgia may target an adult group, but not an intellectual group. This is why intellectual viewers like writers like Rian Johnson or Todd Phillips better than JJ Abrams or George Lucas. None of these writers is bad, but they target different groups

@rafaelferes4362

4 жыл бұрын

Everywhere I read a majority of negative comments about SW latest movies. I can't say my opinion about the latest because I simply didn't find the will to watch it

I generally don't care for critics or what they sometimes have to say about a new movie that I liked to watch. But I always refer back to them to see what they've said about a movie I'd just watched that I either liked or didn't like at all just to see how much my opinion about just recently watched movie differs from theirs, or whether my sentiments towards the movie is similar or not to theirs.

Thanks for a no sponsored video :)

Wait, people didn't like the new Watchmen series? It's like the perfect show, who review bombed it?

@bummler1000

4 жыл бұрын

VeritabIlIti alt-rights 🙄

@iamjofo

4 жыл бұрын

Racists

@HeadCannon19

4 жыл бұрын

I thought he was talking about the Zack Snyder movie

@aaroncornish9955

4 жыл бұрын

Homophobics and racists. Soooo the alt right.

I love how they use Stuckman as the new "democratic" (i.e. anyone can do this crap) critic

I think it's fair to say that when someone is paid to do something, their views are more easily influenced. In the days of the internet, the best critics are independent lovers of the film industry. There's for sure an argument to be made that people can give movies way more credit, but professional critics can just as easily do that, and in the event they do so the paycheck they receive raises a question of what influences their overabundance of praise.

One of the best ways to use critics is to keep track of when you agree with a critic, when you find critics that you find yourself agreeing with most of the time, and then those critics recommend a movie, you can be pretty confident that you'll probably end up liking that movie.