Something to consider. A few months back, Hornady issued an edict that all employees would have to take the Fauci jab or lose their jobs. This was leaked to GunsandGadgets and he shared it. There was a tsunami of contacts made to Hornady from unhappy shooters. Hornady lied and said they never meant to force employees to take the jab, just make them aware it was available. Additionally, there were reports of a major Witch hunt at Hornady to find the employee(s) who leaked their memo. For this reason, it will be a long time before any new Hornady products come into my house.

@GeographyCzar

2 жыл бұрын

This is indeed something to consider!

@MrTPoops

2 жыл бұрын

if true, this is a huge bummer. I always loved Hornady's products, but nothing is more anti American than forcing an experimental jab on your hard working freedom loving employees.

@grigorirasputin5020

2 жыл бұрын

@@MrTPoops Exactly!

@EducatedBlackMan

2 жыл бұрын

Jeez you can't even look at an ammo review without people politicizing a company's health policies.

@grigorirasputin5020

2 жыл бұрын

@@EducatedBlackMan As gun people, most of us believe in personal freedom. Anyone, whether a company or governmental entity, who tries to force a potentially harmful medical procedure on citizens or employees against their will and better judgment, is not on board with the concept of personal freedom and liberty and therefore undeserving of our patronage. Get it?

We carry Critical Defense in our .380s. I love my LCP Max. It’s been a solid little gun so far

@miketyson8933

2 жыл бұрын

Critical Duty are better, but these American Gunners are better IMO, Underwood are the best for a .380 IMO

@jeremygarza3892

Жыл бұрын

Does anyone's lcp max shoot low.?

@jasonusaf6326

Жыл бұрын

@@jeremygarza3892 mine doesn’t, but I did notice a drastic difference in the grip angle from the Glocks that I was used to shooting which caused me to shoot low at first. I’d recommend shooting a few boxes through it and then evaluate the results

@jeremiah7855

Жыл бұрын

@@jeremygarza3892 mine does don't think it's me had some fmj that I was hitting elevation right on but was hitting slightly low was gonna move the sights but I tried underwood 68gr extreme defender what I was gonna carry but it shot way low left not sure what that's about gonna try to shoot it a Lil more and try underwood 90gr extreme Penetrator

@grigorirasputin5020

8 ай бұрын

@@jeremygarza3892 Mine shot all over the place when I first got it. Also jammed like a SOB, too! Two barrel and slide changes later it is much more reliable and accurate, now! FWIW, my LCP and LCP II were far more accurate than it was when I first got it. It is fine, now.

Something to remember, expansion with a .380 is merely a plus, penetration is the goal. If you obtain adequate penetration, any amount of expansion is a bonus. Any expanding hollow point (I prefer the xtp loadings in .380) that penetrates 12" or better is a winner and ultimately better wouding potential that the old "just carry FMJ in .380" adage.

@davidca96

11 ай бұрын

The best option if you carry 380 in a small pistol/short barrel in my opinion is the xtreme defender bullets. They penetrate like an FMJ but cause massive tissue damage regardless of clothing/etc. like a functioning hollowpoint does. When I carry 380 thats the only round I feel confident in.

Thanks! Just ordered some based on your video!

I use the LCP and the Critical Defense as my EDC. Thanks for a the videos.

Good information. Appreciate the time, energy & resources.

@GeographyCzar

2 жыл бұрын

Most welcome! At long last I'm finally getting paid to do this. If things keep going my way (and they haven't in January due to the weather up here) this channel will become fully self-sustaining by the end of the year! That means I can start pouring money into production value upgrades as well and maybe turn this into a "real" channel with better sound quality, and all the fancy effects you expect to see from a true gun-tuber. Maybe. LOL! Time is an issue for me as well, until the day comes when the channel can support not just itself by myself! This may become my full time job in a couple years. Then I can really get down to producing some hard science instead of this winging it style of just turn the camera on while I experiment with what works and what doesn't.

Great video. Thank you, sir.

American Gunner has been some of the best besides the Underwood. They really do shoot accurate as well

@skidmarkzuckerberg

Жыл бұрын

American Gunner is great. It shoots reliably in both my Glock 19 and LCP Max. Never once had a problem with it feeding and this test shows it’s effectiveness well.

Thanks this was very helpful. I have both types of Hornady hollow points and now have a way to chose the best edc round.

@GeographyCzar

Жыл бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

Perfect. Just bought the HCD for new carry and also carry the LCP Max. Guess I made a good choice!🙂

I had a failure in my lcp 2 380 with the Hornady critical defense. I everyday carry and work on a dirty/ sometimes wet construction site. After having the Hornady critical defense in the chamber for several months I went to target shoot and the firing pin left a nice ding but no bang. I was shocked as this was a first for the lcp ii. Thanks for the video

@tomlee6263

9 ай бұрын

Not uncommon. Good idea to rotate your chambered round out, if you carry all the time. Sweat, oil, and humidity can deactivate the gunpowder in the chambered round over time.

Depending on the test, Hornady FTX or XTP usually turn out on top for penetration and expansion, so testing them together was a good idea. However, I really think anyone carrying a .380 outside of warm weather for SD when people are wearing minimal clothing to when people are wearing multi layer cloths is pushing it. But I do think testing against 4 layers of denim was interesting to see the 380"s effectiveness. They did pretty damn good, and that FTX concept of starting with the little red plug to deal with clothing barriers obviously works. That's my .380 carry load. Ya know I have yet to find any testing of the light bullets concept in .380 like the liberty Civil Defense loads that some people swear by.

Good test. Thank you.

Good video! Thx!

Great test. The shape of the 2 bullets is just slightly different. Maybe it's the amount of engagement surface of the specific bullet to rifling on 1 vs the other. Critical Defense is one of the few 380 loads that will get close to or exceed 12'' of penetration and still expand after 4 layers of denim. It's not perfect in all aspects but it's a good performer. I carried it for several years in my LCP and LCPII. Now I carry the Underwood 380 +P 68 gr Extreme Defender. It creates a wound channel nearly as good as the best hollow points and penetrates 12-14'' in organic gel with 4 layers of denim

@jasonusaf6326

2 жыл бұрын

Only issue is the LCP pistols to include the max are not rated +p

@frankbrowning328

2 жыл бұрын

@@jasonusaf6326 That's true but I do see Rugers point as SAAMI has no standard for +P in 380 ACP. Tha being said many use "+P" loadings from reputable ammo companies. If it is used sparingly, I haven't heard of any issues with the LCP series. Except that on a couple occasions I saw the guns become unreliable. This could be due to several different factors. I guess it's up to the owner to decide what is right for them.

@richardefriend

2 жыл бұрын

Reviews that I've seen show that Underwood's standard pressure .380 90 gr. Xtreme Penetrator (NOT Defender) performs almost perfectly from a short barrel .380, and it avoids the issue of using a non-authorized +P loads.

@Followme556

2 жыл бұрын

@@jasonusaf6326 Most pistols are not rated for +P in any caliber, so what? I've been shooting +P ammo in 4 different LCPs since the day they came out. Just put a 13lb recoil spring in it and don't worry about it.

@Followme556

2 жыл бұрын

@@frankbrowning328 Just don't go putting light trigger springs in an LCP, switch to a 13lb recoil spring, and you wont have problems with +P. I've been shooting them since the LCP came out.

2 Good rounds for the .380 id use either. right NOW im using the XTP. Just picked up the LCPMax great little pocket pistol.

I ran into a feed failure problem with the Ruger LCP Max and the Hornady 380 Critical Defense FTP rounds. I got about 2 feed failures per 12-rd magazine. These weren't stovepipes. The top lug of the HP bullet would jam against the top of the chamber in the slide, or the shoulder of the case jammed against the top of the chamber in the slide. If you look at the geometry of the FTP bullet, it has a tapered edge from tip down to shy of the shoulder of the casing. Just before the shoulder, the bullet changes to a parallel face for about 1/8". You can even see the crimp marks in the bullet peeking past the casing. I've tried other brands of 380 HP, and they don't jam, but they don't change the angle of the bullet and instead are slightly rounded or go straight to the shoulder of the case. Just the FTP would jam. I'm trying to get some XTP to try them for feed jams since their geometry is straight to the shoulder (no sharp angle change). However, even though one Hornady FTP had decent expansion, I found your results showing they're poor for reliable expansion.

I hate when people point out things like oh it’s only 800ft per second. Getting hit with anything that’s going 800ft per second is pretty damn fast and there is no having a good day with that.

Thanks for the video...Have you tried the Precision One 380 90 grain XTP through denim?

I’m running these Hornady CD FTX in my LCP2. Happy with my choice. I also carry them in my 38 SPL

@GeographyCzar

Жыл бұрын

They're a great option in every caliber I've tested them in. If somebody just wanted to shoot one type of bullet and not do any homework or research, I'd recommend Hornady Critical Defense. In 380, I think they're the very best there is so far.

Good test. XTPs are good if they are going fast enough. IMO, the American Gunner is just a bit too slow. Precision One, Atomic, Underwood, and Sierra (among others) all load it faster without calling it +p. CD is ok. i wish it penetrates deeper. Federal Punch 85 gr goes 13" to 15" and expands through denim and has a mechanical "bond" or crimp. I load that in my Max myself. The Federal Hydrashok low recoil 90 gr does about the same in gel. Those are two other good choices for .380, without going to +p in my opinion. That being said, there are +p loads that perform even better if one wishes to go that direction.

I’d love to see you try the Norma MHP in 380 ! Give it a shot

@Followme556

2 жыл бұрын

In the tests of it on youtube it underpenetrates big time.

Ammo quest did extensive testing of many 380 bullets .. in genuine FBI organic gel blocks... Out of a short barrel Taurus TCP 380.. his results showed the three best rounds that expanded yet penetrated the best just past 12 in where all the xtp bullets... Hornady xtp... Fiocchi xtp.. precision One xtp.. in his test the critical defense FTX bullet did not expand in over penetrated this is in both 5 layer denim covered and bear gel

It would be nice for ammo manufacturers to put at least two fps readings on the box, from two barrel lengths. Most .380 acp is going into a short barrel, no?

@grigorirasputin5020

2 жыл бұрын

True! I would love readings from a PPK or like gun and from a "keychain" .380 like a KelTec P38T or Ruger LCP.

The American gunner expanded more in the ballistics gel at one point then kept getting pushed back, as seen in the wound channel

I have yet to see any 380 ammo out perform Underwood XTP 90gr or their 90+p ammo … I have shot hundreds of rounds from my LCP 11 through all types of barriers, expansion every time…Any 380 ammo that can travel through 2 1/2 gallon milk jugs stacked apart Filled with solid wet newspaper @ expands is a winner for me 👍🏾 there’s no need to look further…

@gk5891

11 ай бұрын

I only have 3 requirements for ammo. 1. 200 rounds through pistol with 100% reliabilty. 2. Minimum of 20 rounds into gel with 100% of rounds between 11- 19". 3. Shootability (Subjective). XTP is the only bullet that has met my criteria. It either modestly expands and travels 11.5-14.5" or fails to expand, tumbles and travels 14.5 - 18.5". 100% function through 3 pistols. Fiocchi Defense Dynamics in house bullet is my second choice, but had one bullet stopped at 10.5" and the very aggressive skives can be problematic in some pistols. 100% function through 2 out of 3 pistols. Fed HS Deep was promising, but I have been unable to source enough ammo to thoroughly test Critical Defense had 3 rounds stop short of 11" and 2 rounds that failed to expand and did not tumble, exceeding the 19". It was only 100% in 1 out of 3 pistols. Winchester Ranger T may have the most consistent performance of any expanding ammo I've tested. Unfortunately it's consistently short.

👍!!

Have you tried Federal Hydra Shok Deep .380? I have seen their HST and Hydrashok do not seem to expand from many videos on youtube but cannot find any on hydrashok deep .380 nor on punch .380 :(

@GeographyCzar

2 жыл бұрын

Can't. Federal never has it. Nobody does. But thanks for the reminder, I will check again now...

@Followme556

2 жыл бұрын

HS Deep is unobtanium.

@dh3302

2 жыл бұрын

@@Followme556 ​ That is what I carry in my LCP Max and it is currently in stock on Federal's website as of today.

@Followme556

2 жыл бұрын

@@dh3302 Thanks for the heads up. Until i see some 380 HS Deep gel tests i'm not going to carry it though.

@Followme556

2 жыл бұрын

@@dh3302 I just clicked on their site, saw their war propaganda and that they're donating 1m rounds of ammo to a corrupt state that is full of nazis and US biolabs, and decided i dont want to buy federal ammo at all anymore.

critical defense vs hydra shok deep and underwood?

Bit of a spread there. They would definitely both sting. That's for sure.

Try some Precision One XTP 380. They're my SB go to round for EDC.

@adamlarsen1566

2 жыл бұрын

The .380 ammo quest tests are pretty darn convincing! Definitely consistent performance from Precision One.

Id like to see you test the underwood 90gr xtp +p. I run it in my lcp max.

@sonnygunz9207

2 жыл бұрын

They’re out right now.

@Matts05jeeprubicon

2 жыл бұрын

@@sonnygunz9207 I've had the underwood ammo for a while now. When they come back in stock I'd love to see a test of them in the gel. I feel like the xtp running a little faster would really help against the clothing.

@carljohnson4996

2 жыл бұрын

Says in the manual to not run +p ammo on the ruger lcp max

@Matts05jeeprubicon

2 жыл бұрын

@@carljohnson4996 There isn't a designation for 380 +p as a standard loading.

@richardefriend

2 жыл бұрын

Reviews that I've seen show that Underwood's standard pressure .380 90 gr. Xtreme Penetrator (NOT Defender) performs almost perfectly from a short barrel .380, and it avoids the issue of using a non-authorized +P loads.

The velocity variation you saw in those seems exceptionally large, no? Almost 100fps on each.

@GeographyCzar

2 жыл бұрын

Yep. Haven't seen that with these before. Might be time to replace my "Aging ProChrono".

@andywilson8698

2 жыл бұрын

Could of just been one underloaded round ,it happens every once and while.

I think the HST's expand really well but suffer from less penetration. The Hornady stuff performed very poorly.

5:30 ... Never knew there were cavities between the lead and jacket before. I thought the lead was fully pressed/swaged into the jacket (not just for bonded, but most JHPs).

@GeographyCzar

Жыл бұрын

Yea, I don't think that XTP is bonded. That's one thing that bugs me about it.

Isn't Critical Defense loaded specifically for short barrels?

@BigFunkyy

2 жыл бұрын

No.

@justusbryant7366

Жыл бұрын

Yes

Reviews that I've seen here on KZread show that Underwood's standard pressure .380 90 gr. Xtreme Penetrator (NOT Defender) performs almost perfectly from a short barrel .380, and it avoids the issue of using a non-authorized +P loads. Perhaps for your next test?

@Followme556

2 жыл бұрын

What the heck is a "non authorized +P" load?

@vlogfriendsutopia

2 жыл бұрын

@@Followme556 There's No SAAMI 380+P.

@Followme556

2 жыл бұрын

@@vlogfriendsutopia So what?

@vlogfriendsutopia

2 жыл бұрын

@@Followme556 So, if there's no SAAMI spec, that means that companies could theoretically make it whatever chamber pressure they want, which could obviously be very dangerous.

@Followme556

2 жыл бұрын

@@vlogfriendsutopia And those companies would be sued into oblivion if their ammo was blowing up guns. Underwood and Buffalo bore have been around selling +P ammo in .380, and havent been sued into oblivion, because their +P ammo is not routinely blowing up guns. All US pistols are proof tested by the manufacturer, before being released to the public for sale. Proof loads far exceed what manufacturers are selling as "+P" ammunition in non SAAMI recognized configurations. I have personally been firing both Underwood and Buffalo Bore 380+P ammunition in 4 different Ruger LCPs for over a decade with absolutely zero issues. If you don't want to shoot it, don't. I do, so I do. 380+P ammo from these companies falls right between 9mm Makarov and 9mm parabellum in power levels, and makes the 380 a far more potent defensive cartridge. Which is why I use it. A Ruger LCP max with 13rds of 380+P xtp is a tremendously capable and shockingly light and compact handgun. As far as I am concerned, loaded with +P it is the ultimate CCW handgun devised to date.

I have the Ruger LCP Max because it is the best concealed 380 on the market. I use both Critical Defense and American Gunnner and stack them alternating. I also trust Liberty Civil Defense. With the shorter barrel in the Max, you won't get the advertised speed but they are effective.

@andrewsivak6946

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the comparison. Pls consider trying Underwood 380 xtp +p to FTX.

@DW133_

Жыл бұрын

That's debatable.

Barrel is 2.8 inches on the max .

@gk5891

11 ай бұрын

It's semantics. LCP measures 70 mm (2.756"). LCP II measures 70 mm (2.756") LCP Max measures 70 mm (2.756") Apparently marketing rounded the LCP to the nearest 1/4" and the LCP Max to the nearest 1/10". Then marketing converted the 2.8" back to 71mm on the publishing materials thus a myth that the Max has a 1mm longer barrel was born.

Everyone with the new lcp Max, I’m still edc the old original lcp 😂

American gunner has a gapping hole to kill aerodynamics. Critical defense is streamlined

Dont need 4 layers of denim, just 2, no one is going to have 4 layers on about 8 months out of the year.

So wintertime ya'd have a little more room for a nine in case ya had t penetrate more layers o clothing !

@GeographyCzar

Жыл бұрын

True.

No,No, FMJ FN Winchester for LCP MAX & Black Cherry for 80X Cheetah HP is no good in the .380.

I perfer the 380 hst

@Followme556

2 жыл бұрын

In STB410s tests that round failed miserably against denim.

@aaronmeeks1155

2 жыл бұрын

@@Followme556 I just went back and rewatched that video that you're referring too and we must have different opinions on failed miserably.

@Followme556

2 жыл бұрын

@@aaronmeeks1155 It didn't open at all vs denim. Which is why it didn't even make the finals in his 380 ammoquest.

There are way better choices for the lcp. These arent the best. Some underwood loads will perform much better out of the lcp.then these do.

380 hollow points don't penetrate enough!!!!

@GeographyCzar

2 жыл бұрын

LOL, they do when they fail to expand!

@journeyman378

2 жыл бұрын

@@GeographyCzar if it fails to expand you might as well go with fmj. When they expand rarely go past 10 inches.

@GeographyCzar

2 жыл бұрын

@@journeyman378 I agree. It took me a long time to reach that conclusion, but I think you're right.

@TADDs101

Жыл бұрын

@@journeyman378 so you don't consider 10" of penetration on an expanded hp bullet enough to stop a perpetrator ?

@journeyman378

Жыл бұрын

@@TADDs101 it may be. Will you get 10" and expansion? Maybe.

3 shots are not enough for velocity tests. Other testers get well over 900 fps with this load/firearm.

Looks like the ballistics does not justify the price. I'll stick with flat nose fmj's. Also, for those that believe in personal freedom, remember that includes women's right to choose.