What are your thoughts about the current era of Doctor Who?

It went down the toilet after Capaldi...

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

The Whittaker era had its moments but overall was disappointing

It's a little early to tell if this era will be 'unmemorable', RTD's first era is vey memorable and that's where he struck gold with the 'big hits' in the first place, and you will find there's a contingent of fans who always, from 2005 on, hated RTD's vision for the programme too, so it's interesting to see people who may have enjoyed his contributions a decade ago join the pushback against it now. I enjoy RTD, and I feel he is the only one who really knows how to promote and push Doctor Who to the masses in the 21st century, but at the same time, audiences who grew up on his era are just that...grown ups now, a lot of the whimsey they overlooked or embraced then won't work for them now, and might become unbearable for them if it's played out over multiple years rather than months due to Bad Wolf having the time and space to map things out it largely in advance. I hope you find something to like in the new era. I will remain hopeful the show can offer something new, but won't hesitate to call it out if it repeats the usual beats. As much as people say that DW is a show 'about change', it is often far too samey.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

I'm sure there will be moments, episodes, ideas etc. I can appreciate, I mean we already had Wild Blue Yonder, it just seems clear that for the most part it's going to be hitting the usual beats as you say

It's like even on the most BASIC level. If you REALLY look at the show in its current state when you consider the point of "it can be and do anything". Does this iteration of the show REALLY represent that? Like REALLY? Lets list it off: A logo taken from the 70s, a TARDIS interior that's just an unnecessarily expansive version of the 80s TARDIS with no character or identity, returning showrunner, returning writers, pretty bog standard title sequence with a pretty run of the mill theme tune even Ncuti's costume just doesn't really any unique identifier to distinguish him from other incarnations. Infact what I thought was the case and what I'd seen expressed online is his main costume was a post regen costume where he was going through the motions of trying to be all his previous selves before ending up with his tartan look. His jacket is a tennant/eccleston blend, his shirt and trousers are a Whittaker variant and so all he's got is...a pair of trainers? Not even just acknowledging that the whole shows aesthetic is no different than any other show currently on atm. It's honestly a real shame atm. Cause I couldn't be less hyped. All I like about the show atm is Ncuti. As The Doctor and as a personality.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

The show can literally pretty much go anywhere and be anything and yet it feels so uninspired right now

Yeah, so far I've been extremely underwhelmed by RTD2. At the moment it feels like a weaker version of RTD1. But it's still very early on so I'm not going to jump to conclusions. I'd say the main thing that's changed for me is that cautious optimism over RTD2 has changed to cautious pessimism.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

I'd like to be optimistic, but the show is giving me little to be optimistic about at the moment unfortunately

What are NMDs?

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

By NMDs I'm referring to the people who complain about "wokeness" and push their culture war agenda through Doctor Who. Often they use the hashtag NotMyDoctor

You articulated a lot of the things that have been bugging me about Who since it was announced that everyone from 2008 was coming back better than I've been able to thusfar. I do think Disney's involvement makes it even less likely the programme will be allowed to rest on any level, given how they treat their other IP (Star Wars, Marvel, etc.) as constant pumps to churn out endless, interchangable Content TM, unfortunately.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

Yeah I do fear it will go that way and perhaps is already going, Disney know how to milk a franchise to death

I didn't really take issue with RTD doing greatest hits for the 60th. It was kinda expected. But he said he wouldn't come back unless he could do new things and, so far, it feels like it is basically 2005 with money. As you say, even the writing tropes are exactly the same. And I don't think that's accidental

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

"2005 with money" is a very good way of describing it to be honest

I think its too early to tell, ive loved half of them so far, and the ones i didnt were alright at worst

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

None of the episodes have been particularly bad (with the possible exception of The Giggle) as RTD is a good writer, but it's just... more of the same, the mystery boxes, the camp, the mushy Murray Gold music, there's nothing new or inspired.

I dont think the new RTD era will be bad, but with each day passing by it makes you wonder how special it'll actually be. No doubt things are gonna be different from how he did before but, and idk if this makes sense, i mean that "by default", as in, he's older so some of this choices are different. But overall the biggest worry is the show feeling stagnant and unable to change, something the show is usually really good at. The 13th Doctor era is, well... Not great, but definitely different from everything else in New Who, regardless of the way it turned out. Also the "woke", now as an LGBT person myself, i have no problem with inserting these messages in the show... Until it gets in the way of compelling story telling. Doctor Who has always tackled political subjects that concerned the time the show was currently being written at, however most of the time it was always story first, message second, seamlessly being in tandem. However while I think currently only really The Star Beast forced it hard, it's a legitimate concern. Overall I'm still intrigued and want to see this new era actually succeed, but there are concerns to take note of

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

Yeah the problem with the political/social commentary in Doctor Who at the moment is not the messaging itself but its rather cack-handed implementation, like stopping The Giggle to have the Doctor rant about cancel culture etc., you know rather than actually incorporating that theme into the plot in any meaningful way

The problem for me is that I haven't watched new doctor who since that fan club episode but I still enjoy classic doctor who, so our interconnected algorithm world keeps suggesting me doctor who stuff I don't care about. See it's happening again!

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

It probably doesn't help my channel is split between classic Who and new Who content, so apologies for that. I do plan on reviewing more classic stories in future

I can definitely understand your concerns though I don't want to jump to any conclusions since I feel like the new series will be where this era TRULY begins and where we might see the NEW in this new era. The recent news of Steven Moffat's return I'm not a big fan of though... but we'll see. I'm still excited though! I mean it's Doctor Who, I love it in all it's forms but fingers crossed this new era really kicks into gear starting in May!

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

I mean let's face it, for all my cynicism I will probably still be watching it. As for Steven Moffat... at this point I'm not remotely surprised, that's all I can say

@friendlyotaku9525

4 ай бұрын

@@MidnightChimey I will say I feel a bit better knowing that RTD also asked Chibnall to return but he understandably declined since, well... he just left and he has said he just wants to enjoy Doctor Who as a fan again, this is why he's also asked Russell to not tell him ANYTHING in advance of the series.

i do hope they have some new ideas. Because i presune the new monsters will be one of them.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

We can only wait and see

RTD has engineered the stories so far in such a way that any dissent can be brushed aside with accusations of isms and phobias. Don't like silly Looney Tunes villains with big floppity arms, jaw drops and giant blobby faces? Let alone magic table salt barriers to keep them at bay, and some nonsense about all the walls having to flip over in order for the ship to self destruct? "No, you don't like it because they race swapped Isaac Newton and the Doctor fancied him. *Racist homophobia* " Thought the basic idea of a hypnotic trigger being disguised as a musical scale _in a silent_ broadcast, and the splitting of the TARDIS into two with a circus clown's comedy mallet were stupid ideas? "No, you didn't like it because there was a character in a wheelchair and ... erm ... oh, Bonnie Langford was in it. *Ableist gingerphobia* " Did you think "Oh, for ****'s sake when you saw a bunch of B&M gremlins singing about eating babies while flying in a magic pirate ship? "Oh, that is soooooo bigotted against RTDearies who think the sun shines out of his every orifice."

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

I've not really witnessed legitimate criticism being brushed aside with accusations of "isms and phobias" to be honest, though I have seen plenty of people being genuinely hateful and bigoted about the show and they SHOULD be rightfully called out for that. What does rub me the wrong way a bit is Davies's framing of the discourse in interviews as "well fans won't like it because it's new and different etc." which strikes me as a deflection

@zacmumblethunder7466

4 ай бұрын

@MidnightChimey I've seen a few such comments on KZread. Had a couple myself. I made a comment about wanting to watch sci-fi Dr Who rather than magical fantasy and got a reply saying "You're just mad because there were LGBT references". I'm always more than happy to explain my grievances in much greater detail than I have here. As a former manager said to me once "I want you to explain to ____ why we can't change the process. Go into detail. That'll shut them up."

@gilgameshofuruk4060

4 ай бұрын

​@MidnightChimey The woke arguments have certainly drowned out any discussion about the dearth of originality, ludicrously over the top CGI and the weird mix of Rentaghost and Eastenders acting styles. At least they've given up the pretence that the sonic screwdriver is anything other than a "get out of jail free" card.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

@@gilgameshofuruk4060 Culture war nonsense has been polluting discourse on Doctor Who, and a lot of media for that matter, for quite a while, hence what motivated me to set up a Twitter called "Criticism of Doctor Who Without Bigotry" at one point, to try and highlight legitimate good faith critique

@mayotango1317

4 ай бұрын

¿Silly Looney Tones villain? That was Jon Simms Master.

I agree with a lot of your points to be honest. I'm also worried that RTD2 might end up just being a 2.0 version of his first era with a better budget. I guess it's fair to say that we can't really tell until we've seen at least the first series or two to judge that though as the 60th was obviously going to be nostalgia bait to try and draw the people back in that left post-Tennant or post-Capaldi era. Also thank you for not spending the entire video crying about "woke" as so many others seem to be doing on this platform. It annoys me so much when I see all these people spending a 20 minute video crying about "woke" and getting an insane amount of views for it instead of actually providing constructive criticism like you did in this video.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

I'm not remotely interested in dumb culture war stuff, my aim is to promote constructive and good faith conversation

Even if it is (which fyi I’ve never thought for one moment so far), it’s doing a better job at being one than Stars Wars in my opinion

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

Maybe, but I wouldn't say Star Wars is necessarily a high bar

I was willing to forgive at least the nostalgia of the 60th and felt I was being too critical ... until the "season 1" episodes had the same problems and now im convinced Davies thinks soft fantasy is a get out of jail free card for needing any sense of drama or stakes. That both Space Babies and Devils Chord feature repeat moments of rtd1 verbatim was the quickest way to convince me that when RTD said he wouldnt come back unless it was new ... he was lying. Because if you want all new, the last thing you do is instantly plagiarise yourself. Its also hard to call it Season 1 when it references the 60th and the 60th references season 4 and it cant possibly feel like a fresh break when its a direct continuation of a direct continuation of something that never stopped.

@MidnightChimey

2 ай бұрын

Valid points, but if I was to give the season 1 episodes any credit, Devil's Chord does feel like a tone Doctor Who hasn't really done before, with just how surreal and theatrical the whole thing is

@B-MC

2 ай бұрын

@@MidnightChimey that is true, it does feel fresh and lively, but I'm concerned with it comes a sense of weightlessness. But we'll see I guess, if the mystery boxes pay off maybe it'll make sense in retrospect but if not it may shoot itself in the foot with style over substance. I'd say cautiously optimism but I fear the chibnall era (and stuff like Force Awakens, Wandavision, anything heavy on theatrics and mystery boxes) made me bitter and cynical. I was excited initially, it's just tiring.

Derivative sure, but its a business. How do they make a show with low viewership? They had to win back the fans

@MidnightChimey

20 күн бұрын

You win back fans by doing something new and interesting, by having faith in your ideas, not by repeating all the same beats you've done before

I agree and disagree. I found all recent episodes very entertaining, but yes, there is some nostalgia bait in there. It's not new though. During Chibnal's run he had some really out there ideas, but towards the end I feel he was forced to go down the nostalgia route by the BBC to try and get the viewer count back up. And that's the reason they brought back RTD. They're banking on the nostalgia. Some would say it's necessary.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

Trouble is while it might temporarily give the viewing figures a boost, nostalgia alone is not sustainable, all you are really doing is saying "hey, remember the time when the show was better" and that gets old fast

watching a bunch of grown ass adults be crybabies about a show that they are not the main audience for is hilarious to me

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

Who's being a crybaby?

@eow4317

4 ай бұрын

@@MidnightChimeyyou just look a bit insecure when you continually make videos on this subject and then reply to every comment trying to justify your points to people who obviously don’t care enough to respond

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

@@eow4317 I reply to all of my comments to encourage audience engagement, it's the same on every video I make, even ones nothing to do with Doctor Who. It's something literally anyone trying to build a following on KZread is encouraged to do

@TheSmart-CasualGamer

4 ай бұрын

​@@eow4317"How dare you make videos on the video sharing platform and write comments in said platform's comments section."

It cannot be watched in the rest of the world unless you pay for Disney it is dead to me .

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

Not sure if I would feel it's worth paying for to be honest. I do now have all the Chibnall era stuff on DVD, but that's mostly a completionism thing

If the return of Tenant & Tate were just for nostalgia, what does this make the 50th in 2013?. Some people have judged a book by its cover & loathe the upcoming series before its even arrived mainly because it now features a gay black actor in the role & there's a trans person in it too. Its part of stoking up dumb 'culture wars'...mainly from US-based youtubers who dislike Disney.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

Well my judgement is based on observable reality from what I have witnessed in the show, not what bigots or culture war youtubers have to say about it

@zacmumblethunder7466

4 ай бұрын

I don't want to watch it because RTD has said he's moving the series from sci-fi to fantasy. He should go and reboot Buffy then. Ncuti seemed quite likeable in the Toymaker one, and the thought of the *angst* going was a relief. But I saw the trailer with the singing goblins, and just thought "No."

Well im getting the old stuff of doctor who and even making my own story based off the old stuff.

Thanks so much for taking time out of your busy schedule to share your thoughts on this important subject.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

Guessing you're trying to be sarcastic here? (autism brain isn't very good with this stuff). It may not be an "important" subject necessarily, but it's one that a lot of people are clearly interested in

@zacmumblethunder7466

4 ай бұрын

If you're looking for videos about important things, you may need to search for those things rather than watching videos aimed at people who want a rest from those things and discuss a telly show instead. Not typing comments would save you valuable time in your busy schedule as well.

Isn't that what you all wanted? You harassed and hated Moffat for years for making Doctor Who very different from what the RTD era was, you despised him for not bringing back the RTD characters and for ignoring continuity in favor of more creative, powerful and insane episodes. Are you happy now

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

Huh? I have criticised Moffat for a lot but I don't remember ever specifically wanting him to bring back RTD characters, and I've never cared a great deal about continuity

@mayotango1317

4 ай бұрын

@@MidnightChimey And now everyone appreciates and loves Moffat.

@zacmumblethunder7466

4 ай бұрын

@mayotango1317 I don't.

@mayotango1317

4 ай бұрын

@@zacmumblethunder7466 Ah, a Rose/Tennant fangirl.

@zacmumblethunder7466

4 ай бұрын

@@mayotango1317 Nope.

The problem is modern Who sugar coats death whereas Classic Who kills off 3 companions and they stay dead. Now with the lousy Bi-generation even the Doctor doesn’t need to say goodbye to his body and can keep it! RTD ruined regeneration by scraping it and turning the Doctor into a tapeworm. I prefer Peter Capaldi playing the Doctor as he gave us back the more stern alien character we had with the original Doctor. I stopped watching after The Giggle due to the silly goofy tone we are getting. RTD was never my favourite producer as he tends to humanise the Doctor way too much.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

I'm generally not an advocate of killing off characters or doing things to darken the tone just for the sake of it, but Doctor Who could really use more teeth. I don't see why a character being killed or even just leaving the show in a tragic way (Donna, Rose etc.) has to be softened and sugar coated constantly like EVERYTHING has to have a happy ending or else. I listened to Lucie Miller/To the Death, the finale to the 8th Doctor Big Finish audios and halfway through it literally just takes a machete to the main cast and it's great

@PaulRichards-vz4pl

4 ай бұрын

@@MidnightChimey You’re right. It’s just good to have something shocking and darker in the show. If there are no stakes then it gets tedious and weak and lacking in impact. As a child I remember Adric’s death really shocking the viewers at the time and it felt like the universe was a dangerous place. Now they’d bring him back and spoil the heroic ending.

Its the same production team but now that team with Dr Who or as i now call it Dr Phoo has been handed over to Bad Wolf the production team have full reign control and this is why we have seen a shift in RTD's change in his approach to the fans on social media and also his woke approach to the show as i feel one Russel has always been like this but was heavily controlled by the BBC but now he doesn't care ( hence his rather unprofessional at best approach to fans online ) as he now has full control well his studio and also Disney are sharing control so with these two significant elements and being backed by a huge American studio he doesn't care and he is now showing his true disdained true self that we never saw and i feel this is probably why Eccleston left he saw this way back then and why he said that the only way he would come back is if this current and original team where to go. You got to admit it all fits together.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

According to Eccleston, he left because he didn't like the politics behind the scenes (and not politics as in "wokeness" or anything like that, I mean the production being a mess and the higher ups supposedly not taking responsibility for it)

Yes you do want to be negative about this era. You have just made a six minutes and fifty three seconds long hypercritical video stuffed to the rafters with you moaning about a company commissioned by the BBC to make Doctor Who actually making Doctor Who. To quote Basil Fawlty, "What did you expect, the Hanging Gardens of Babylon. herds of wildebeest sweeping majestically across the plain." And you did deliberately give it a clickbait title and thumbnail because you want clicks.

@MidnightChimey

4 ай бұрын

The clickbait part, fair enough I suppose, but I am a fan of Doctor Who and all my criticism is made in good faith, I do want the show to be good. Great episode of Fawlty Towers that, might watch it later