Correction: Ross Barnes married Ellen Welsh in 1900. The union did not produce children.

I'm a little bit surprised that you didn't mention the biggest factor that both helped Barnes' stats and probably hurt his historical perception, the "fair-foul" hit. During the 5 years of the National Association, and the first year of the National League, any ball that landed fair, then spun foul, was considered a fair ball, which meant that if you could put some backspin on the ball, it would get away from the corner infielder in foul territory and you could run for days. Barnes was undisputedly the best there was at this particular skill. In 1877, they changed the rule to the present "fair past first base" rule, and this is also the year Barnes stats crashed. While I totally agree with your assessment that there was much more to Barnes' game, and that his downfall was probably much more due to health than this, many observers have taken a casual glance and concluded that Barnes had a weapon, that weapon was taken away, and the numbers crashed, therefore, he was a cheap gimmick player, not worthy of more than a footnote. I disagree, both because he did other things well, and even if he didn't, being that proficient at a skill that helps your team win games should be credited. Great job as always and Merry Christmas.

@gus473

7 ай бұрын

😯 You ARE the big dog! 😎✌️

@thebaseballprofessor

7 ай бұрын

I deliberately didn't mention fair-foul hits because it requires a pause to explain what it is. Even then, it can be a bit difficult to imagine and I wanted to put emphasis on Barnes' five-toolyness, especially his impact as a fielder. In my mind, Barnes' number of extra base hits should put to rest any doubts about his offensive capabilities. But it's true enough that people tried to denigrate Barnes for doing something everyone else did at the time (fair foul hitting) except he did it expertly and combined that technique with hits to all fields.

@gus473

7 ай бұрын

@@thebaseballprofessor ⚾ You both are in another league! Amazing! 🫡✌️

@big8dog887

7 ай бұрын

@@thebaseballprofessor Funny I thought it was spelled "tooliness". The SABR website has an interesting quote from Fred Cone, one of Barnes' teammates, describing the fair-foul hit. “The trick was to cricket the ball with a hard swing so that it would strike fair and bound off into foul territory,” said Cone. “If the ball could be cut hard down near the base line, it would get away from the fielder and roll on for two or three bases.” Retrosheet doesn't go back that far so we can't prove this, but apparently, a lot of Barnes' extra base hits were also of the fair-foul variety, he wasn't just drag bunting. This is possible because the minimum distance to the backstop was established in 1870 at 90 feet (see Richard Hershberger's article on the Protoball website) so there was a lot of foul territory, and also, batters requested pitch location until 1886. Truly a fascinating game, too bad video doesn't exist!

Matt Kilroy and Sam Crawford should be remembered. 513 SO in a season, and 309 career triples. Two of the most outstanding stats in the history of the game

@thebaseballprofessor

7 ай бұрын

Sam Crawford had an amazing career. Would be amazing to see film of his kind on the basepaths.

@csnide6702

3 ай бұрын

Wahoo Sam was quite the player

very interesting.....Rockford has a history in baseball that most are not aware of and being only two miles from Greenwood cemetery . I shall look up his headstone next time I am there., Greenwood also has the very first burial sight for the GAR [ Grand Army of the Republic ] veteran group of the civil war and many civil war veterans are buried in this cemetery.

Excellent video. You asked about forgotten players. Lou Boudreau. In 1948 he was the best defensive player, offensive MVP, and World Champion manager, all at the same time. No one will likely ever be eligible to try and match that record.

Jackie Mitchell. Hardly ever meet people who've heard about. 17 year old pitcher for the Chattanooga Lookouts, and a fascinating story. After striking out Babe Ruth and Lou Gherig back to back at an exhibition game, she was expelled from the league, insulted, sidelined as a novelty, retired, and came back for the All-American Girls League. She's a uniquely significant figure in baseball history, if not necessarily a once in a lifetime talent.

@thebaseballprofessor

7 ай бұрын

Jackie Mitchell's story is fascinating.

this dude was winning MVP every year in my OOTP historic save

@thebaseballprofessor

7 ай бұрын

Interesting. Thanks for the comment

David Wright, Prince Fielder, Jose Fernandez, & Ross Barnes.... if only...

Ross Barnes hit the first home run in the history of the National League

@thebaseballprofessor

7 ай бұрын

Another one of his accolades

Thank you this was very well done. I am a huge baseball fan and i feel i know a fair amount about the history of the game. But had never heard this story.

Nice video

Wild that he had 6 WAR when playing 66 games.

@thebaseballprofessor

6 ай бұрын

I know! He was a beast!

And let us not forget the great Max Doddlewinker.

As with so many 19th century players, totally ignored/shunned by the HoF. Number 1 would be Pete Browning, followed by Bob Caruthers.

@big8dog887

7 ай бұрын

Not one player who played the majority of their career in the American Association (including the two you mention) is in. Winners write the history, I guess, that's why Dr. J. is never in the NBA GOAT discussions.

The power that Hollywood has the cement public remembering versus the lack of responsibility they take in representing it is beyond unfortunate for the culture as a whole.

@thebaseballprofessor

18 күн бұрын

Agree

May be some debate, but I think it was Charles Roscoe Barnes...

Great video! But wiki said he did get married. Its just a small mistake.

@thebaseballprofessor

7 ай бұрын

I'll add a pinned comment to the video. Thanks for catching the mistake!

cobb is the only post 1900 player that is on my list of favorite ball players of all time but not even he hit 400 in 4 seasons! Barnes deserves the Hall of Fame enshrinement as well as a Lotta other 19 century ball players. In my opinion these players would run circles around the ball players today you played with no gloves no equipment broken fingers pitchers were unstoppable pitching 500 600 innings a year. The national Association is a major league, regardless of what people may say. And they deserve much more acknowledgment. players like Joe start, Cal McVey, Lip Pike, Levi Meyerle, Dickey Pearce, Jim Creighton, Pete Browning, Paul Hines, Jim Devlin, etc all deserve praise for the records they set and the way they played the game. Spalding is in a class by himself but other ball players that I find so intriguing and so fascinating deserve praise as well. great vid! I love the 19 century

The Spanish American war definitely faded from consciousness.

@thebaseballprofessor

7 ай бұрын

True. There is fading memory of the "splendid little war" that made the United States into a global superpower with Asian colonies and military bases across the Caribbean.