We've literally come full circle. From bare HTML that happens to ship extra JS for interactivity, to JS generating all HTML at runtime, to JS generating all HTML on the server and hydrating it on the runtime, to JS generating all HTML on the server and some being partially hydrated, and finally back to bare HTML (that just happens to be JS pre-generated) that happens to ship extra JS for interactivity. The next stage is to go through all this mess once again but with WebAssembly lol.

@personmcguy3537

Жыл бұрын

Looks like you got a startup idea on your hands

@oursbrun4243

Жыл бұрын

@_Hedura_ lmao;

@bossgd100

Жыл бұрын

Lol and each time "it was better " ( in theory)

@yeicore

Жыл бұрын

This

@Thorax232

Жыл бұрын

This is a naive and incorrect outlook. If you think there's no difference between what this is doing, which is basically just a smaller scope than island architecture, and PHP, you're out of your damn mind. Qwik ships 0 JS, and pieces, even down to the function, on demand. It's not statically built files.

There are three things guaranteed in life : -Death -Bills -New Javascript frameworks

@user-og7de8ih4f

Жыл бұрын

You forgot Taxes 🧐

@paulojose7568

Жыл бұрын

- People complaining about javascript frameworks

I have 10 years of experience in this framework, let me know if you have any project

@Fireship

Жыл бұрын

sorry we're only looking for people with 12 years of Qwik experience

@user-og7de8ih4f

Жыл бұрын

@@Fireship I have 2 yrs experience in Qwik we both can come together 😂😂

@AlexMusicX

Жыл бұрын

Lel

@thelatestartosrs

Жыл бұрын

i have an amazing project idea looking for 10 devs (paid on project completion (pay is good)) NEED PEOPLE Working now we will compete on the scissors market and sell scissors to everyone using blockchain to keep track of scissor owners and their corresponding NFT

@vice-108

Жыл бұрын

@@user-og7de8ih4f but 12==12?😏

I knew it was only a matter of time before JavaScript developers realized that what was making their applications so slow was JavaScript.

@SAL404w

Жыл бұрын

NO BUT THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE!!! **adds more javascript**

@florentarlandis1209

Жыл бұрын

@@SAL404w *frantically develops a new framework that will add more javascript to your javascript*

@cyberneticbutterfly8506

Жыл бұрын

@@florentarlandis1209 JavaScript is just trying to steal the thunder from Gödel's incompleteness theorems.

Жыл бұрын

Good thing there are plenty of alternatives to JS. There are alternatives, right? Right?

@AROAH

Жыл бұрын

@ WebAssembly and… *native applications*

Could you do some more Qwik content? As everything in this industry, it seems promising because a lot of negative aspects are just not mentioned beforehand

@andrewc8125

Жыл бұрын

can't agree more

@aniruddharao8735

Жыл бұрын

I expect there'll be more info on this on beyond fireship

@PabloAndresDealbera

Жыл бұрын

For me it seems that high latency internet connections are a nightmare with this framework because if I understood correctly, it needs to fetch the JS when you interact with certain components on the page. But I might be wrong.

@anush8

Жыл бұрын

LOL 😂.

@ronakmehta8106

Жыл бұрын

@@PabloAndresDealbera does high latency network have trouble with loading very small file even ?

This is the first framework since React or Vue that I am actually considering diving deeper into. This looks pretty dope.

@omanajz

Жыл бұрын

@@patrickprakash8 angularjs is dead since last year

@kokizzu

Жыл бұрын

Svelte.. kzread.info/dash/bejne/c5iCrJWfqcfLkdI.html

@Cromzinc

Жыл бұрын

@@omanajz Pretty sure he said Angular, not AngularJS :)

@patrickprakash8

Жыл бұрын

@@Cromzinc Yeah it's angular not the js one. But AngularJS was the starting point of all the framework creations

@jesseparrish1993

Жыл бұрын

I still use ES4 because I know it won't be long before another one comes out.

Now add a machine learning model to predict user actions and load the required JS preemptively :)

@NatoBoram

Жыл бұрын

No need to, you could load the click event on mouse hover

@JamilMaqdis

Жыл бұрын

What about touch?

@fallenpentagon1579

Жыл бұрын

I have a brilliant idea, we can just preemptively start loading all the required JS once the page is loaded 🧠

@suharsh96

Жыл бұрын

@@NatoBoram that's why I use my phone with a mouse

@wesleychan7575

Жыл бұрын

Hmm, now I just need to load the mouse hover event based on the prediction of mouse move trajectory.🤔

Yes! A new JS framework! 🎉🎉

@taab84

2 ай бұрын

That's why I paused to learn any JavaScript technology for now

I still remember when pages took around 15 seconds to load. It was great, times. You had so much free time between each interaction. Now in other hand, time flies.

@tkdevlop

Жыл бұрын

Tiktok, shorts make people's attention spans to sht.

@JorgetePanete

Жыл бұрын

part of it was old http versions too

@zeeshanmh215

Жыл бұрын

So true. Previously i could go poop and come back and i would still have enough time to see the page loading. Golden times 😔

@guidobit

Жыл бұрын

I remember going to the library to internet for 30 mins. Basically I loaded 1 gif.

Well, ThePrimeagen is gonna have a field day with this one. Great code report as always!

@udittlamba

Жыл бұрын

BLAZINGLY FAST!

@trollflix

Жыл бұрын

:P

@wliaputs

Жыл бұрын

Coconut oil 🥥

I was waiting for qwik. It's really promising, and something very refreshing in the javascriptillion amount of frameworks that exist.

@itsgoldmate8859

Жыл бұрын

It's not very refreshing since there is no hydration

@AbWischBar

Жыл бұрын

@@itsgoldmate8859 LOL

@persiancarpet5234

Жыл бұрын

@@itsgoldmate8859 GOTTEM

@Howtheheckarehandleswit

Жыл бұрын

I thought the whole point of Qwik was that you don't wait for it 😜

@MrEnsiferum77

Жыл бұрын

Good luck with that mind, that's why u are using frameworks to develop stuff. Observables are resumable by nature, so u can achieve the same crap that qwik is selling.

Thanks for posting this! Exciting to hear about these types of new frameworks from a voice that I trust ✌

For those wondering if lazy loading event callbacks is going to make your app feel sluggish in terms of response times. You can also lazy load on page idle, which AFAIK happens after initial page load / render and should not effect your lighthouse score (please correct me if I'm wrong).

Жыл бұрын

At least by the video, I would assume the `$` suffix as a flavour for async "chunks" - such as `onClick$`, but it something is mission critical I believe you can just use good-old `onClick`.

@violet-trash

Жыл бұрын

I use es modules all the time to load in JavaScript to get that 100/100/100/100 score and it's never made a site feel slow to me. Also it's more about the CSS than that JavaScript when it comes to making a site feel fast. If you're using JavaScript to animate the UI, you're doing to wrong. At most you should be changing classes/data-attributes.

@reedlaww

Жыл бұрын

I imagine it will if it’s not handled graciously. I haven’t used this framework specifically but in Angular for example a lazy loaded module can definitely suffer from stutter even in locally hosted applications.

@32zim32

Жыл бұрын

Why we just can not load all js and hydrate it asynchronously after html have been loaded? With whatever framework

@joshuarowe8410

Жыл бұрын

@@32zim32 That's what Next etc does. I think Qwik is just another take on that but with a lot of marketing hype on their website and maybe some slight improvement with "resumable" hydration - although I don't really know how much difference that makes for us with decent internet speeds and modern devices. It has more of an effect on old devices

This combined with Service Workers must be the faster thing ever. I wonder what is the overhead of that serialization though. Super excited about this! Huge respect to the devs for such brilliant ideia & execution.

That thumbnail is gold, absolute gold. Well done Jeff!

That ending... :) Excellent Jeff, thank you.

That sounds awesome. Can’t wait to start a project on this and never completing it before going back to making to making monolithic applications for a client with 0 tech knowledge

your presentation style is outstanding, entertaining, funny, informative. i'm not a programmer but love your stuff nonetheless.

I love your videos so much :D - keeps me up-to-date

It Worked perfectly after trying other methods this one was the best one, Thanks.

This is really something else. Can't imagine the scalability of the apps you can build with this. Would love to see more of this

@eus9

Жыл бұрын

If you're lazy loading everything then I'd imagine you want all your code in very small modules. I can imagine that wouldn't scale very well at all

@aonodensetsu

Жыл бұрын

@@eus9 it's literally the framework that compiles your code into small chunks, it's infinitely scalable as fireship said

@demonicious_

Жыл бұрын

@@aonodensetsu Yeah, it lazy loads EVERYTHING. Which means it scales to infinity without sacrificing load times but... what after that? Lazy Loading everything is bound to make for a horrible user experience in a large app with a lot of moving parts.

@askplays

Жыл бұрын

@@demonicious_ you can choose to lazy load or not with the dollar sign, and use a smart prefetching strategy for everything else. "By default, Qwik will prefetch any visible listeners on the page."

@eus9

Жыл бұрын

@@aonodensetsu I don't see anything in the video that suggests it's smart enough to take my modules (like the index.tsx file shown) and somehow magically break that apart into smaller files during compilatipn. Every event handler method (or other typical app logic) that you want to lazy load will need its own file. That sounds like it would become a directory structure nightmare on large applications.

this is the first frameworks that I am considering after jquery, angular, react, vue, svelte, solid, preact, inferno, marko, hugo, astro, remix, next, and the other one

@AngelHdzMultimedia

Жыл бұрын

Lit

Your gifs are on point! Well done sir!

Wating for this one. Thanks man.

Thanks, this inspired me to quit frontend 👍 Great video, btw!

@FalconTheFries

Жыл бұрын

How long have you been this to yourself?

@Virbox

Жыл бұрын

@@FalconTheFries did what? I have basic frontend knowledge enough to build good-looking pages, but without frameworks

@geledek573

Жыл бұрын

next generation of frontend is not framework, but AI-based frontend builder.

Okay so if everything is lazy loaded then how long does it take for some particularly large function to load in when the user clicks on it? That's a huge problem potentially I think. There are definitely advantages to Lazy loading in some circumstances but lazy loading everything might run into bottlenecks when the user actually tries to interact with the page itself. If you have a highly interactive site and everything is lazy loaded then what might occur is that the user constantly runs into roadblocks while trying to interact with the site which could decrease the time in which users care about using your site

@leonardomangano6861

Жыл бұрын

I was wondering the same

@some1csgo

Жыл бұрын

Maybe load the javascript part behind an action before it is clicked? Onhover etc

@yungbeong7664

Жыл бұрын

I mean it seems like you can opt-out of the lazy loading by just not putting dollarsigns everywhere. So then you will have some JS shipped with the initial load but you can choose wether or not you want to lazy load a certain functionality

@pwii

Жыл бұрын

I wonder if it can prefetch all visible interactive elements after the document has loaded

@zyansheep

Жыл бұрын

@@yungbeong7664 so less, "no hydration" and more, "micromanaged hydration"?

Thanks dude this really helped me a lot I did the steps that's you did thanks man!

Thanks Fireship, great video

cant wait for the next javascript framework with negative hydration

@TheMrOasdf

Жыл бұрын

Dehydration?

@itsgoldmate8859

Жыл бұрын

@@TheMrOasdf oh shit yeah

@theriser8751

Жыл бұрын

so the framework needs water

@fazazizeid5359

Жыл бұрын

Dessiccation

FYI, this video and the last one in Beyond Fireship are in 480p

Great moves, keep it up!

I imagine how much fun and pain you’re having while making these videos brother; You’re uniquely different in a better way.

Everyone knows you should bundle your javascript into one file to reduce http requests but everyone also knows you should split your javascript up into lots of chunks to reduce loading times.

@user-he4fd7ly3n

Жыл бұрын

Questions can come in⬆️…

@bluemondmc

11 ай бұрын

Why reduce HTTP requests? One request at a time doesn't hurt.

@1337cookie

10 ай бұрын

@@bluemondmc The joke was that you should do both opposing things at the same time. But doing one request rather than cascading requests means the client isn't waiting on network. Every cascade adds the ping time between server and client to their load time.

@bluemondmc

10 ай бұрын

@@1337cookie I guess I didn't get the joke

Jokes aside, what this does is actually quite excellent. Can't wait to see what improvements come after qwik gets a full release

Exciting stuff 🔥

Wow! This is awesome!

Hope that Marko 6 also gets a fireship video once it gets out. It's pretty wild from what I have seen and deals w a similar problem space as Qwik. Less focused on the whole lazy loading though, but also resumable and more granular/automated afaik.

This makes so much sense that it confuses me that nobody ever thought of this before

@MrEnsiferum77

Жыл бұрын

That's because u believe what frameworks are selling it to u. U can achieve the same with rxjs only.

WOW this is extremely cool

Nice man ty

Is it me, or is the video just 480p?

2:48 so definitely for online apps and not for any interactive webpages users may save locally since chunks for even minor button behavior would be missing; especially when offline.

Thanks!

Beautiful

Wow! This is kind of like serverless functions but for the client 😅

@MasterSergius

Жыл бұрын

Clientless?

@shreinikjain8599

Жыл бұрын

@@MasterSergius if clientless, will bots use the website😆

@MasterSergius

Жыл бұрын

@@shreinikjain8599 oh, I've got better idea - useless :)

@TheNewton

Жыл бұрын

@@MasterSergius lul "clientless" also rofl: Renderless On Frontend Library On a serious note this is all kinda leading to just connecting the browser to a RDP instance streamed through the . I thought I saw something like that about rustlang but cannot find it anymore.

@charlesm.2604

Жыл бұрын

@@TheNewton fuck accessibility and seo, who cares about handicaped or about making money anyway ?

To be honest if our counter for time since last JS framework was released is in days, it’s never going to move from 0, I propose moving from days to hours or maybe even minutes

@0jinx

Жыл бұрын

I seconds this

@exactzero

Жыл бұрын

That's the joke. It's always zero.

@JorgetePanete

Жыл бұрын

We should officially change pt (planck time) to njsfr (new javascript framework release)

Now this is POG.

Time to move my portfolio from jQuery to this! I was waiting for a perfect framework all these years

@MrEnsiferum77

Жыл бұрын

U need only rxjs

The way you ended this report had me in tears 😂 Keep up the good work!

@aakasheoran

Жыл бұрын

You can superchat now in the comment section of a not-live video?

Looks like it’s time to rewrite my portfolio again :) From Astro to Qwik we gooo!!!

Can't wait to write some qwik js code

Looks promising, time to learn to walk again.

This framework looks pretty cool. I can definitely see it causing web archiving issues though 🤔🤔

You cant just throw up 500tb and JS in the same sentence man shit gave me a heart attack

fascinating!

Seems revolutionary

Now may we ask why this was uploaded in 480p 🤔

We need more of Qwik please

thats actually kinda cool. wanna see some demo apps first before trying it out tho

03:22, oh Jeff, I laughed so hard 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

Finally something different!

So now guys take your 32nd Side project and write a fourth rewrite with the ✨newest framework✨

@p10tube

Жыл бұрын

sad but true. just finished rewrite from gatsby to sveltekit and now this?

Damn such a great idea

Please make video on your journey as a developer and the ups-downs you faced. btw love watching your video and it inspires a lot ^⁠_⁠^

@turolretar

Жыл бұрын

it’s been downhill so far

I have very high hopes from this framework. Just like AngularJS this might just bring next new revolution in web frameworks.

@TomNook.

Жыл бұрын

lol

@erickheredia8910

Жыл бұрын

Bet money there'll be another one claiming the same thing in no time, hehe.

I was not super thrilled with Svelte but this one I would give it a try.

Damn that's very coool

I missed the part about the cons. Also: that 10% gain thing does not really apply to all app-types. E.g.: apps which are now built az SPAs. Therefore this looks to me as a "last 1%" polish.

@vintprox

Жыл бұрын

Qwik is a bad fit for SPAs. Nobody would love if their dashboard brainfarted with pure client operation in sudden absence of network connection. It requires a lot of rethinking this chunking strategy to work well with the app, but again it doesn't bring anything on the table for SPAs, as framework was designed primarily for SEO.

@vasiovasio

Жыл бұрын

@@vintprox Yes! Non stop requests when the user click here and there make it useless... On the end of a day only On conclusion ( especially for me ) - Server Rendered Sites and Thats It! Forgot about SPAs because they are not what they need to be, even with hundreds of different implementations and frameworks...

@charlesm.2604

Жыл бұрын

@@vasiovasio I wouldn't throw SPAs out the window completely. They have their place like a dashboard or an user-protected section of your website. Basically anything that isn't initially loaded or require SEO is a good fit for SPAs. SPAs make for *really good* user-experiences (client side routing, skeletons, platform integrations, etc...). There is a reason why everybody use the gmail client.

You know, when I first heard of server side rendering and hydration I thought it was THIS. I was feeling dumb when I discovered it was not.

very interesting !

Well, that's it. Your best thumbnail. Not sure where else there is to go from here.

I think qwik is really cool from a technical standpoint. But loading JS as needed is not necessarily the right experience for all apps. Especially with slow connections, you could be waiting 1 or 2 seconds after each button click which may be a worse experience than waiting 5 seconds at a loading screen

@ple7y

Жыл бұрын

"By default, Qwik will prefetch any visible listeners on the page." - so no worries for that. However, you can simply not put in the '$' sign not lazy loading the code...

@dealloc

Жыл бұрын

Just like you, I was skeptical about it too, Kaleb. But seeing the demonstrations and answers to questions that Miško has done on live streams I saw the potential for scalability in larger apps/websites. Given that we already opt-in to lazy loading in other frameworks to split our bundles, this is just built in as a first-class citizen rather than an API on top. Of course they are going to show off the feature that deviates the most from other frameworks; but that doesn't mean you will be using this as the default. For most cases where you want immediate feedback you can bundle it together; however for things that would otherwise require networking (i.e. fetching data) or are of significant size but rarely used can opt-in to lazy loading.

@kalebercanbrack8857

Жыл бұрын

@@ple7y oh right that '$' syntax kinda makes it an opt-in thing.

@mfpears

Жыл бұрын

Imagine how bad it'd be to load all of it up-front then.

@JayVal90

Жыл бұрын

@@mfpears Right like imo a slightly sluggish interaction basis for a website when I’m on a slow connection is 100x better than waiting 20 seconds for the page to load.

Lol i just saw them on twitter and thought: Why isn't there a fireship video about them?

That "more" meme is on point 😂👍

Verrrry interesting

You know you are early when this video maxes out at 480p 👌

@Lightbringer7734

Жыл бұрын

Lol I don't even watch above 360, net is slow and expensive in here

i am more impressed with Qwik than most other recently-released bleeding-edge JS frameworks

You are awesome dude

like the excalidraw usage

Next time it would be cool to know the downsides of such frameworks at least a few. But otherwise its great video as always. One of the problems that may happen is that everything is lazy, meaning that if you have intermitent connection you will probably have the application freeze as if the necessary code is not yet loaded some of the functionality of the websitte that depend on it will be absent.

@askplays

Жыл бұрын

He really should of explained how qwik prefetch visible listeners by default, so that there is no freeze.

Having all of the javascript serialized into the html and everything lazy loaded seems like a nightmare to debug

@IainSimmons

Жыл бұрын

Why? The serialised HTML acts like a sourcemap. You can see the path to the component it was defined in, along with the event being handled, etc. It's probably easier than your regular stack trace to some anonymous function buried in your app

Yo< introduced me to rust and remix. Now this. You are amazing

Looks promising

Would be great to have a video on qwik inside bun js.

@wtho

Жыл бұрын

I think SSR can be run in node, deno or bun, or at least it's on their roadmap

@mfruehschuetz

Жыл бұрын

just tried running the qwik documentation starter and serving from bun. seems to be working.

Lazy loading all of the javascript feels to me more like a trick to win artificial benchmarks than something that would actually speed up real life applications since you´d be loading up potentially large blocks of code on user interaction rather than fetching it while/before page render. We´re basically adding extra load calls to fetch these tiny code chunks on interaction and that the user makes

@askplays

Жыл бұрын

Fetching on iteraction is a worst case scenario for qwik, it prefetches visible listeners on idle by default.

Thx for discord 👍

Your videos will never let me to learn other languages.

This sounds dreamy, wondering what the downsides are. Definitely going to check it out, thanks!

@tkdevlop

Жыл бұрын

Network delay?

@NostraDavid2

Жыл бұрын

Inline JS, which may mean more duplicate code? Not saying it's a fact, but a possibility.

@exactzero

Жыл бұрын

@@NostraDavid2 Duplicate code is only an issue during development.

@ShadoFXPerino

Жыл бұрын

It doesn't seem to utilize the browser cache well, since everything is serialized into HTML5 it will be different every time and therefore impossible to cache.

JS Frameworks are getting too magical. I really want to know more about if we actually need this level of optimization and real uses cases where is useful. I don't really know if 1s of delay while hydrating a LARGE page is actually that bad.

@TV4ELP

Жыл бұрын

I wouldn't say we need it. But being proficient in a framework allows you to be faster and probably better maintainable. Could you spend a few hours more to implement good native JavaScript or even web assembly? Sure, but does anyone actually want to pay you for that? And do you actually want to do that if you can instead do more projects in the same time?

@AMaplestoryFan

Жыл бұрын

it's not that magical, the concept of lazy loading has been around since forever especially after ajax, I suspect the reason why lazy loading and what qwik calls resumability has not been used often is its ability to be cached, which is basically impossible with dynamically served html

@dealloc

Жыл бұрын

Maybe you don't need it for your small apps, but larger apps/website that want to scale without hurting UX definitely could find a need for this.

@0jinx

Жыл бұрын

The reason it's needed is for enterprise level WebApps and boosts to conversation rates. I see this framework being useful to apps like figma. Finally cut down on that really long first load time. And as for the second thing, it's more of an economics thing I think. Faster webpages used to be a competitive advantage, now that every webpage is fast, that level of speed is now expected and thus no longer an advantage. This we need to go even faster to maintain that advantage and keep conversation rates high

@kissu_io

Жыл бұрын

1s is quite optimistic here, usually it goes far worse than that and also, it does so quite quickly. 😅

Gonna be great for so many b2b products with 2 users and 2MB circular dependent event listener logic

@user-he4fd7ly3n

Жыл бұрын

Questions can come in⬆️..

Not gonna lie, I tried it and now I'm in love with it. Time to migrate!

Time to convince my team lead to use Qwik in our next application. 🏃‍♂⚡⚡

@VirtualDarKness

Жыл бұрын

Much more fun to rewrite your current one. Bonus points if you finish before the next relevant JS framework is released 🤣

@voidemon490

Жыл бұрын

@@VirtualDarKness lmao

@Xaero324

Жыл бұрын

Just because it's new doesn't mean you should jump ship... Go with one where it'll make coding easier and faster. Is it also easy to implement 3rd party packages with it?

So I think finally we can do 3d/threejs stuff without worrying about too much of bundle size 🤔

@kissu_io

Жыл бұрын

Hm, not sure how this is related. If you use a big package, it will still be huge to load. Qwik will not change that.

@jesusbossa1070

Жыл бұрын

@@kissu_io of course, but that's not the point of what I was trying to say. I mean, in the imaginary project that uses threejs, this huge library and implementations only will be charged when the user plays with that. Because right now if you use that in a gatsby, nextjs or react, project this library will be charge partially or totally affecting some lighthouse metrics negatively.

The ending got me cackling LMFAO

sound pretty cool

I started smiling when he said it has functional components, jsx, hooks and vite. Am moving my code base to qwik starting tomorrow🔥

So, if the user has a slow connection or are physically far from the server, would they experience 300ms+ of latency every time they click a button for the first time?

@askplays

Жыл бұрын

"By default, Qwik will prefetch any visible listeners on the page." So in theory no.

Love u bro 💪

I'm going to learn every JavaScript library and framework until the end of time.

Resumeability is cool, but I feel like any other SSR meta framework also has code chunking. Been loving SvelteKit.