Wendell: I've been a little forlorn with Ubiquiti stuff lately (especially for high-end home/soho stuff) so I thought I'd get EnGenius a try. They're Senao hardware with EnGenius special sauce and branding. I am very impressed with the hardware, so far, but the software has a bit to go. Full review of the ECW120, ECW240 and PoE+ switch ECS1112FP and PoE++ switch ECS2512FP coming soon. Hello everyone! This is part 2 of the POE video we did recently. It goes through installation, known bugs, and tips. Let me know your thoughts :) ~Editor Amber

@100radsbar

3 жыл бұрын

I use Fritz!Box 7590, 2 FritzWLAN 1750 repaters, and one 3000 Repeater in Mesh, and i have no issues covering my house (basement, ground floor, and first floor. Each floor, including the basement is approx 95 square meter. I bundle the 2.4Ghz, and 5 Ghz in one SSID, and the devices figure out whether to use either one, often going to 2.4 Ghz when you move out of reach of 5 Ghz. I have approx. a little over 900-950 square meter property where my house stands. I have no issues getting WiFi coverage in my garden. On average my Wifi has 500-600 Mbit/s which is 5x times my internet connection (100Mbit/s Fiber). Handover between the devices is as far as I can tell pretty seamless.

@UberArchangel

3 жыл бұрын

When did you get a Nessy shirt?

@ig33ku

3 жыл бұрын

Forgot to turn on the aircon?

@cdoublejj

3 жыл бұрын

cloud based????? why not look at say netgear insight as well? they have competitevley price switches and APs. hell netgears has switches HALF the cost of ubiq when looking at PoE+ AND 10G uplinks! hell TP link has STRAIGHT clone Unifi with decent prices! grant it i buy all my unifi used for decent prices if i i hunt. D link, netgear and tp link units have been running fine for me. no heavy use on their management though.

@cdoublejj

3 жыл бұрын

THIS IS WHY I SUBSCRIBE!!!!

Am I the only person who DOESN'T want my LAN to be cloud controlled? The only time I want my WAP going online is for firmware updates.

@NobleHays

3 жыл бұрын

I don't even want it pulling the update. You're local controller should push to APs, the APs themselves should never phone home

@kcocgibkcusuoy

3 жыл бұрын

Same here. Really not happy with the direction of this stuff. UniFi is borderline, but at least you can have a controller on-prem (for now, at least). But, stuff like EnGenius, Meraki, Verkada (cameras, but, same thing)... All MUST phone home and get nerfed or lose all functionality if they lose connection with the mother ship. Gross.

@alangarde2928

3 жыл бұрын

They do seem to have an on-prem managed version, EnSky Pro, with a VM or hardware device to manage them. It'd be interesting to know how stand-alone it is.

@kcocgibkcusuoy

3 жыл бұрын

@@alangarde2928 dang it. I missed that during my initial poke around their website.

@nukedathlonman

3 жыл бұрын

No your def. not the only one - I don't either. I'm a firm believer that certain things don't belong on a remote cloud (esp. networking configuration information) - it's asking for too much trouble.

The very reason I do like Ubiquiti is because I can run the controller in my own network and it can enroll new APs without any internet. I wouldn't want my APs internet controlled!

I understand Wendell's points but EnGenious has some deal breakers for me: 1 - Cloud register per AP - This is nothing eco friendly, only generates e-wate, destroys the second hand market and resell value. I like to keep an ap for 2-3 years and upgrade it. 2 - WTF you cant stop the device to keep trying to update? In unifi, if a update doesn't work, you can always 'dont try again', and if the current firmware is unstable, just roll back! 3 - Beta channel by default is not acceptable for a production env. 4 - If isn't broken, dont upgrade the firmware, unless is stable LTS or you dont care about you can risk your network stability atm. The controller update that Ubiquiti pushed a month ago was BETA, not RC or Stable, anyone who upgrades to this versions could expect ir. I'm not a Ubiquiti defender, I have problems with the lack of focus and some broken products as well but they grew kinda too fast and started trying too many things. The current stuff in EA I find interesting to look forward.

@jpw5996

3 жыл бұрын

Rollback isnt that uncomplicated and i didnt realize that update was beta... Now im suffering from disconnects with my ac ap pros

@Geopirate3

3 жыл бұрын

@@jpw5996 You can roll back. The cloud situation with this really turns me off though. Unifi isn't great, but as long as you stick to stable updates of their APs you are fine. I'm still looking at a unifi pow switch because I'll never light up more than 3 or 4 poe devices.

@brunosalezze

3 жыл бұрын

@@Geopirate3 The switches and APs are really solid, Routers I dont like and neither use it. But with just aps and switches you can manage your network really well through the controller.

@Gaming_Biker

3 жыл бұрын

@Brad Smith For my application, the USG-PRO-4 works fine & will continue to be my router until I put more time into learning pfSense. I like how solid the Unifi switches & APs are built, but I'm not a fan of being used as a beta tester, so I update LTS firmware when I need to & I won't ever buy Ubiquiti equipment as they drop. The Dream Machine Pro is one of a few examples of why. I'll look into EnGenius, but not totally sold yet.

@EduardoReyesDPM

3 жыл бұрын

@@Gaming_Biker I bought a unifi router once... Didn't offer a simple way to clone the Mac address for a cable modem and sent it right back... Pfsense for the last few years no regrets

WAP has been ruined for me.

@rednammoc

3 жыл бұрын

They had to drown so many poor kittens to do so...

@pkt1213

3 жыл бұрын

I wouldn't have know what you meant before yesterday. 3 minutes of my life wasted.

@WafflesOinc

3 жыл бұрын

@@pkt1213 I’m sorry for your eyes and ears

@breakupgoogle

3 жыл бұрын

i still have a mop and bucket ready

@Gaming_Biker

3 жыл бұрын

@@pkt1213 It wasn't yesterday for me, but same.

I think its funny I just replaced my EnGenius with Ubiquity because EnGenius was giving me to many issues....lol

@jay-uo2bi

3 жыл бұрын

Ubiquiti has been perfect for me. Never had any issues. Just a couple times AC Pro needed a restart and that's it.

@levielbers8585

3 жыл бұрын

got lots of trouble on new products of ubiquiti. Quality is not as good as it was in early years. EnGenius cloud solution just blows my mind after 6 months of adoption

@marksapollo

2 жыл бұрын

@@levielbers8585 Me too and I only have an AP point and a UDM and I've ditched it to go back to my Google WiFi! But I only use it at home.

I use ruckus APs and switches at home. Lath and plaster home as well, a single R730 gets coverage everywhere. Their antennas are amazing. Their unleashed product is great even for medium sized businesses. I deploy them all over. Also not happy with ubiquity at the moment, we are trying out fortinet aps recently, time will tell if they are good.

Funny that you make this I actually just upgraded my home to a pair of EnGenius EWS357AP a week ago. I went with the on prem APs with their ezMaster controller since I am highly skeptical of cloud solutions but they have been reliable with good performance so far. Nice to see them get some attention.

I've got ubiquiti ac pro and ac lr in my house (with the ac lr-6 on the way) and have no complaints.

Can I host my own controller with EnGenius? I'd rather not depend on the manufacturer's cloud services for my equipment. At least with a controller I host, I can control what versions I'm running on all the equipment. Because of that, I wasn't affected by Ubiquiti's recent mistake that was the version 6 release. My controllers are still on version 5.

I love the design on your shirt. Its very subtle and low key. Unless it's sweat.

Dude...thank you for this episode. About 5 years ago a network buddy and I worked together on doing a couple of small office upgrades on switches and wireless. He recommended the Engenius AP and I have used them exclusively since. I have done a 2.5 acre compound with solid concrete walls with a main house/basement and a huge dance hall and used all the Engenius AP and it has worked very well. I have other who swear by Ubiquiti but all I hear is complaints from the users (yes it could be the installation that is causing problems). Again thanks for doing this video. I like Engenius products and I am getting ready to redo my house with POE, Cameras and AP.... One last thing. Glad to hear someone else say that they want a faster backbone than what most people put in. They don't realize how nice it is to transfer files between systems at higher speeds. I even looked for switches that had a huge backbone speed between ports so I could transfer files between devices on the same switch without bogging it down.

Currently learning about CCNA WiFi networking and RADUS server at TAFE This just made my day :D

This video came at just the right time, as I've been shopping around for a Ubiquiti/Unify system lately to improve my household wifi. Very useful information, and gives me a better idea of alternatives 👍

@christopherfoote3395

3 жыл бұрын

Go with Ubiquity. I've installed both Ubiquity and EnGenius in multiple locations for clients and also manage the networks for them. As far as Wifi hand off and coverage I'm calling BS on that. The difference is that you have more configuration options and features for Ubiquity compared to EnGenius. Yeah you just plug and play Ubiquity but to get an optimal experience with multiple access points you have to tune it. I have all Ubiquity in my house now. I've had EnGenius and SonicWall Firewall along with their access points previously.

Disillusioned, not disenfranchised. Love the content!

@ruagod

3 жыл бұрын

Or disenchanted, perhaps?

Calling home? No thanks.

@backupaddict1356

3 жыл бұрын

Agree

I’ve been rocking my ubiquiti AP and security gateway for almost two years, zero issues. Rock solid!

I recently moved a client from older EnGenius APs to Ubiquiti. The VLAN tagging for guest wifi networks seemed to be much easier to implement for Ubiquiti as when I tired to implement it on the older Engenius models it would not tag correctly. It could just be a difference in generations though as the EnGenius AP's were 5+ years old. I'll have to keep an eye on it for the future. Thanks Wendell!

Solid info. I'm still holding off upgrading my APs till wifi6 becomes more standard on end devices.

@colinpye1430

3 жыл бұрын

I’ve been seeing too much politics lately. I first read that as Wife 6!

@bayareanewman1566

3 жыл бұрын

@@colinpye1430 hey leave Melania out of this! .... okay okay I’ll see myself out 😂

We need this type of videos to continue, like a series testing network gear, specially Access Points with mesh and handouts. I like Ubiquiti a lot, but i also think they are sleeping in their laurels, while others might be getting better. Try to ask for samples of the following - TP-Link Deco X90 (or X60) - Aruba AP-515 - ASUS - ZenWiFi AX - Cisco Catalyst 9115AXI-B - NETGEAR Orbi Whole Home Tri-Band Mesh WiFi 6 System

13:25 We're reaching Steve Ballmer levels! Get this man a towel!

I tried an Engenius AP at home back around 2012 and had nothing but problems. Had to reboot it at least once a week, but 8 years is at least 2 eternities in IT, so I'd be willing to try them again if they don't force you to use their cloud.

Level1Techs 2020: Cloud-crippled network equipment TekSyndicate 2020 (in alternate universe): build your own x86 Linux Access Point using spare hardware and HostAPd What the heck, Wendell?

@malteehlers9784

3 жыл бұрын

on point

"cloud managed" is a guarantee that the device will be dead at some point. and standalone devices live faaaar past their eol dates.

Good for you on moving out of ui eco system. I too have been burned by ui with ckg2+ battery swelling and hw revision changes. Though hardware revision changes was my fault because of impatience.

What about the "on-premise" access points and not their cloud managed?

@davidg4512

3 жыл бұрын

@aussiebear22 looks like a cloudkey. The question is, how far can it scale?

I have some speed/connection issues with my Ubiquiti AP in the house. My outdoor one works great. My Router in the main house is just the ER-X while I have an EdgeSwitch 8-150 in the GarOffice for my Outdoor POE powered AP and all my devices in there.(couple printers, couple computers, Streaming boxes, etc.). After watching this I am tempted to stay on the UI Router and Switch and get the EnGenius AP for the house to test it out.

"the future of ... stuff" Wendell is such a poet!

Im buying these. I have had some issues in my house with Ubiquiti and have been looking for a change.

I appreciate the PTZ pan edit when Wendell mentioned the Security cam. Haha

Cisco does provide innovation in wireless products with location services. These cheaper suppliers don’t offer these extended services - especially where location services is important.

Ruckus Unleashed is showing a lot of potential especially with the switch management that they've added to it.

I own no ubiquity gear but all of my encounters with ubiquity gear has been failures. It's nice to know of other good options out there

I cant stand having cloud management, then thy go away or thy charge for cloud management you have a brick. I been looking at Ruckus Unleashed gear

So engenius hosts the api gateway and gets your utilization info? No to keen on that... Can you host the gateway yourself?

@jay-uo2bi

3 жыл бұрын

And?

@halo64654

3 жыл бұрын

@@jay-uo2bi What do you mean "And"?

@ADKAdmin

3 жыл бұрын

The alternative to their API is their EzMaster controller software or their cloud key solution

@cdoublejj

4 ай бұрын

@@ADKAdminreally!? is it like unifi or tp link omada?

Ruckus unleashed might be a good option to try as well, as it doesn't have a cloud dependency AFAIK.

As someone that uses both professionally, I have to say there's no competition. Ubiquiti does everything better and lasts longer. Engenius WAPs last a year, if that.

@1Vaudevillian1

2 жыл бұрын

engenius waps I have installed all have lasted years. Hell I got 2 at hope that are 6 years old and still trucking along. But yes you will run into the odd lemon.

@killabandit

2 жыл бұрын

Umm no. And lots of buggy issues with ubi

Extreme/Aerohive has been pretty decent for me. Only wish that local management was more robust, but the cloud management is pretty strong.

Wendell they did kind of did give a drilling template in octagon box ring. you just use the holes in it for a template.

Hey Wendell, you mentioned Ruckus in this video which I am curious about, how would you say their system handles compared to Ubiquiti and EnGenius?

Man our Ubiquity system just randomly started dropping its access points from the mesh, no change on our end, save for the firmware update. So frustrating.

Fantastic video! Do you have any experience with Aruba / HP networking gear? I've seen that they got a lot of different hardware for sale and a lot of it seems quite affordable, but its equally confusing.

I was wondering why they discontinued the square APs glad you mentioned it

@MikeCarter

3 жыл бұрын

i'm still running two square UniFi APs complete with brown discoloured plastic from heat - i thought i was the only one 🤭

Nice. Can't wait for the next part.

2020, the year that redefined WAP.

Won't go through lathe & plaster? Thats why I bought my first engenius radios back about 10 years ago. I had a site where an additional building was added, and we needed connectivity. A VPN meant going through Comcast limited upload. Dsl was the only other option. Couldn't put an antenna on the roof. Couldn't trench. No Los through building windows. Ended up getting a pair of 1000mw ap's in bridge mode with sector antennas. Shot bridge link out the window of one building through a brick wall into the other. Got about 48mbit across the link on 802.11g.

I have a full unifi stack and have had no problems but I do not like the cloud connection they are going to, I have a udm pro and I was very let down with the cloud part, I'm looking I to mikrotik for a revamp of my setup, glad I did not already start upgrading to the new line of unifi switches

I early in the year tried to find engenius hardware in Australia and came up short, so I wonder also how they would handle the cloud management for seemingly unintended markets

Did we ever get the speed test follow up? I can't seem to find one.

Small quick tip on terminating RJ45 for everyone. Pull the TP's out slightly out so that when you correct for length and push the plug on, the jacket slides neatly inside and gets locked at the back of the plug. Easy and makes it want to twist and kink less with the added rigidity from the jacket.

Lmao we all know Wendell is a master of WAPs

@bayareanewman1566

3 жыл бұрын

Get a bucket and a mop.....

So if their cloud service is completely down, you can still manage locally with CLI and WebGUI. Would you consider the product under these conditions only?

How's the spacing with the EnGenius WAPs for the ethernet cable? I initially ran some for my Unifi WAPs but with how the mount works and how tiny the gap is it ended up breaking the wires in my thick Cat6a. I ended up having to install an jack in the attic and run a thinner prefab 6a that could bend more easily to the WAPs

They also have on-premise versions.

Wendell: "Cisco, I mean, they know what they are doing..." Me 3/4 of the way through a Cisco bridge call when the network engineer states, "It's the end of my shift and I will be passing you to an overseas support center": Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!

@MikeDawson1

3 жыл бұрын

did you at least get to hear Opus Number 1 during the transfer?

@johncnorris

3 жыл бұрын

@@MikeDawson1 - It's the tech version of being Rick Rolled!

@btschaegg

3 жыл бұрын

That statement confuses me, too. I mean it feels like not a single week goes by without yet another hard coded Cisco password or some other vulnerability. I seriously doubt that they know what they're doing.

amazing! make more of these! is there any open source software APs and switches?

Would love to see Ruckus WAP's thrown into this comparison as well. Been very happy with mine personally.

Couldn't you use the mounting ring as a template for direct mounting?

so for the home with a 1gb internet, the 2x2 access point is sufficient for 5 people?

I like tp-link WAP because I don't need a separate controller or one of their routers. I can log into the WAP itself or run the controller software off a server. APs don't phone home unless I want them to check for firmware.

Just found your channel, thanks! We’re an MSP that has used Meraki exclusively up to this point. I’m curious about 2 things with enGenius: 1. Do you worry at all about their business model if they’re not charging any sort of ongoing subscription? 2. Have you had any experience with enGenius firewalls? Do they even make them? I’m currently testing Zyxel Nebula. They offer a full stack (firewall, switches, APs). Really trying to get the Meraki-like consistency and simplicity in the cloud dashboard of a lower priced product line.

I'm running 2 Unifi AP-AC-Lites on running along the spine of the house and they've been working well for me so far. I've managed to avoid too many software issues by lagging on my upgrades :P But if the EnGenius software is better I'm curious because the Unifi Controller software is pretty good already. Is the EAP1300 comparable or a straight upgrade because I think it's around the same price bracket as what I paid for my WAPs awhile back.

everybody should hire Wendell as the consultant because they need that *What are you doing* guy from making crap products. Great video as always. Give us moar of this stuff.

I have a UAC Lite and after a firmware update I'm having huge issues with it dropping out on every WiFi device I have and the controller. I'm Looking for something else. Been looking at the Cisco 240AC.my switches are cisco so. I don't want cloud based controllers neither

I like my Unifi gear. I have a HD Nano + ER-X + Rpi w/ mgmt server on it. Only moderate complaint is wanting 2.5GbE backbone for local backups. Literally nothing from Unifi is 2.5 GbE+PoE. And 10GbE is $40+/port. For a small time homelabber I might go with the QNAP unmanaged switch (QNAP QSW-1105-5T) to fix that. If I was doing it all over again I'd totally look at EnGenius.

7:33 I've had that issue before on some trash consumer AP (we were a poor startup), AFAIK it was an issue with the AP thinking it knew better what the subnet mask was and limiting our /21 down to /24... so some devices received their data (our servers on static, low, easy to remember IPs) and some others with long-term dynamic DHCP leases (we had fleets of raspberry pis) the AP didn't know where to send, since it didn't have its ARP/routing table or whatever built up correctly. Switched to Mikrotik and everything was great after that.

DID a firware update on mine today and it bricked my device downloaded it from there website ran it it rebooted and the only light that came back on was the amber power light tried resetting it same thing?

I’m looking at setting up WiFi 6 at home - I have a home office and want both indoor mesh (2 or 3 if one goes in the basement), and at least one for the backyard (could also add one to cover the property/out front, but this is not critical).. so I want a pretty small setup here. Is there any guidance for what gear to get/how to provision the setup or am I basically on my own?

I had unexplainable wifi dropouts that I attribute to my Engenius AP's. I setup a secondary wifi network with Unifi AP's and switched my users to it, and the problem stopped. They were from 2016 so maybe the new stuff is better, or maybe I just have some lemons.

This is reminding me of Open Mesh. Great in idea and simplicity for setup but hardware had 20%-30% failure rate for me. After 15 locations with multiple AP's per site, it was a deal breaker. No money in going back to site to replace what was recently installed on warranty repair.

Is there a chance future videos will provide more elementary/entry-level options switches? I also wanted to ask why you didn't add a little bit of details about the switch itself. Unless mistaken aren't these multi-layer switches?

What was the problem that SFP modules solved (that couldn't be solved with lower cost options) other than a way to nickel and dime people by making them pay for extra adapters?

Ubiquiti for sure slept on their own success for awhile. USG is one of such products that should get an upgrade unless you run it with less then 100 Mb uplink.

@anasel-mahdi2185

3 жыл бұрын

An upgrade to the USG is currently in the works it’s called UXG Pro and in early access

9:08 confused me a bit. You said 2.5Gbit uplink while your mouse pointers are pointing to the 2.4GHz and 5GHz frequency indicators on the AP. Does the AP actually have a link indicator to show 1Gbit/2.5Gbit links?

Still hoping to see coverage of the Mikrotik SFP+ switches at some point! 4 10gig ports for just over 100$ is nut's!

Reesidential I'd kinda like a primer on using SFP+ modules for 10gig fiber with single or multimode fiber cabling.

We deploy Ubiquiti AC Pro's in office and warehouse environments. Note I stated industrial warehouse environments where it's hot, cold, and dusty. We have zero problems with the gear performance is great.

Hi, can I use the Engenius WAPS with our exsisting Ubiquity POE+ switch? I currenty have the Unifi Cloud Key Gen 2 controller and AP AC-Pro and have nothing but issues, I have updated the firmware and have issues with DHCP and I'm tired of rebooting these over and over...

So I bought two EWS377AP after watching this video . One of them only connects at 1/100 link speeds with the switch . The other does full 1gbps . I’ve had to reset settings on the one that doesn’t keep the 1gbps link . Both are on the latest firmware. I was wondering if there was an easy fix . It seems like I can get the one to connect at 1gbps until it’s unplugged and then I have to try again with the factory rest and restring default settings .

They all really need to start supporting IoT gateway in their AP's, EnOcean, Zigbee, Z-Wave, what else is also there? Aruba supports EnOcean already, which is great since it covers all possible home automation cases.

Question, did you test mu mimo or have it enabled in these APs? Does it help with wave 2 ac and lots of random devices, phones, TVs, stream boxes, Apple stuff, etc??

Maybe take a look at the Aruba instant on line of APs next

@Level1Techs Is there going to be a follow-up video about Wi-Fi 6 APs from EnGenius?

As a networking professional. I have removed alot!!! Of those junk enguinus ap's and installed Unifi. No roaming issues, no random drops.

@novice46

3 жыл бұрын

What equipment would be your recommendation for bridging 600Mbps over 1 mile with few tree tops in the middle of the path? Thanks

UniFi is awesome, I have it deployed in many environments. It has worked great for me so far. The new Wifi6 APs are fast!

I had bad experiences with engenius PTP configs. The old ENH500 were far from pleasant to setup as PTP but as wifi AP were pretty good in range and reliability. The last multi AP installation was TP-Link. The Amada system seems more mature that what Engenius would be IMO.

Multi part video, okay. Different names for the parts and no links to the others? Bad puppy!

does EnGenius have a way to use open vpn client? I purchased a udm pro thinking it would be able to do this basic feature but nope

I know this video is mainly about APs, but how is EnGenius' deep packet inspection? I'm running a Ubiquiti network at home and am happy with everything except the DPI.

What would be recommendations for an ultra dense WiFi for a wisp setup in a Internet as a service format with the ap outside? Think a fair setting but as as a wisp in second world countries as the customer primary home internet service in the slums. So network hardware recommendations. 10 GB backbone is a must in my wisp setup.

Yes, floor plan in AP software is failing to estimate the correct quality for me in ubiquity.

Keep thee great videos coming

would you be willing to do a router overview as well?

That ap is phisically identical to the Watchguard ones!

Thank you! Ubiquiti went to crud. Every new update would just degrade performance or something else would break. Ran their cloud controller on a Ubuntu server and they never updated software to work with the latest packages. They didn't want anyone using their controller without buying a hardware controller. Tons and tons of issues during a migration. Just never ending problems across the board. Flashed my Ubiquiti APs to openwrt and removed their controller from my network, never looked back. Oh and I also had their gateway which would lock up every couple weeks due to thermal issues. Threw that away too. Only thing I wish Engenius hardware had was the second ethernet port that bridged the incoming line.

Can you combine engenius + ubiquiti products with OpenWRT, avoid the condescending configuration software and also have better handoff?

Theres some ports in the studio. Theres some ports in the studio. Thats some wet ass protocols you got there

can you do a review / test if the newer Extreme Access Points, in particular the Extreme AP 305C , they recently purchased AeroHive and I am interested in your thoughts.

How about the TP-Link Omada stuff? I really can not find a lot of info about those

Speaking to your point on the switch rebooting during firmware upgrades - does that actually kill the PoE layer? I know my Ubiquiti switches leave PoE up while rebooting for firmware updates. So the APs will lose connectivity, but not power, so if they're in the middle of installing an already-downloaded firmware, no worries.