The comprehension change is a 10/10. Literally no change to your code required but comprehensions become twice as fast.

@LambOfDemyelination

7 ай бұрын

twice?

@BrianWoodruff-Jr

7 ай бұрын

Looking forward to my coworkers comprehending twice as fast!

@ianliu88

7 ай бұрын

I guess this also allows comprehensions to be evaluated in pdb session? Dunno, must test

@nigh_anxiety

7 ай бұрын

Haven't checked it yet, but does this also mean that a list comprehension for a class variable can now reference are pre-defined class variables? Previously it would fail as class definitions are not an enclosing scope.

This is so cool, I can’t wait to use this in 2027 when it’s supported by all packages and about to be depreciated

@anon-fz2bo

7 ай бұрын

cant wait till cpp23 is fully supported in 3023 ⚰️

@squarerootof2

7 ай бұрын

Can't wait for humanity to be deprecated in 2030 and AI controlled cyber-organisms taking over the world.

@danmar007

6 ай бұрын

It's deprecated, but it's still funny.

Great to see Python taking some inspiration from C++ such as typing and incomprehensible syntax.

@headlikeahole6548

7 ай бұрын

Types in C++ affect your programs, in python they are just for IDE hints.

@jamesflames6987

7 ай бұрын

@@headlikeahole6548All of the complexity, none of the functionality.

@tuberroot1112

7 ай бұрын

@@headlikeahole6548 " in python they are just for IDE hints." Even hints would be better than the instanity of gender fluid variables and non binary booleans !!! Python is a mess on every level.

@nagoranerides3150

7 ай бұрын

@@jamesflames6987 But they've really internalised the lesson from C++ that you can say you're OO without having to actually enforce it, so you can still have functions floating around any old place and of course none of the flow-control is OO at all. But, you know - whitespace!

@squarerootof2

7 ай бұрын

@@jamesflames6987 LOL,🤣

the f string change is so helpful, ive run into that one quite a few times

@user-tc1ue4gt1h

7 ай бұрын

I usually use f"""{"somthing"}"""" if the double quote cannot be avoided. But usually f"{' something '}" would get the job done. Also use f"{{ {something} }}" when dealing with some command prompt requires {} as parameters.

@NoNameAtAll2

7 ай бұрын

you've run into using quotes inside quotes and deciding not to escape them?

6:30 Just a note that, as with any function, generation of the code happens only once, at compile time, but creation of the function _object_ (ref to code + environment binding) happens every time that statement is executed.

I think with `kwargs`, it's not that having the same type for each `kwarg` is a natural solution but it's more like it's consistent with the typing of `args` where it *does* make more sense to have the same type for each arg.

As someone who maintains a lot of packages.. 3.7 disappearing is definitely the best. Can we fast track it to 3.10? :D

@nigeltan7766

7 ай бұрын

is python 3.7 bad? im no expert but am curious so pls elaborate

@sid6645

7 ай бұрын

Losing 3.8 might be bad because of nvidia, as someone pointed out below.

@SuperGrimmy

7 ай бұрын

@@nigeltan7766 It would be "bad" to use it now since that version is no longer getting any updates including security fixes. Newer versions have the new language features and much better performance anyway.

@SuperGrimmy

7 ай бұрын

@@sid6645 yes, I the real world it would definitely be premature to fast track deprecation. It's just something some python package maintaners dream about because it can greatly reduce their work.

@aintaintaword666

7 ай бұрын

And I'm still using 3.6 for an old custom-build tensorflow version that was specifically compiled to run on an ancient GPU

im already excited for python pi (or just python 3.14) as it is now very very close

@Liam3851

7 ай бұрын

Ever since python 2 went out with python e (2.7.18), I've been thinking it would be aesthetically pleasing for the python 3 line to end with 3.14.15. Perhaps if GIL removal by default gets released as Python 4...

@obed818

7 ай бұрын

@@Liam3851cant wait for it’s end really..

@matthias916

7 ай бұрын

pithon

@jan-lukas

7 ай бұрын

Did python 1 stop with 1.414?

@Liam3851

7 ай бұрын

@@jan-lukas 1.6.1. Golden ratio!

1:52 and it used to be that you coudln't use backslashes in f-strings. Which bit a lot of people in the backside.

The new generic type syntax is sooo welcome

11:51 There's exactly one problem with `itertools.batched`, it's passed tense. All the other itertools are present tense, i.e. `groupby` rather than `groupedby`.

@negativeseven

7 ай бұрын

I read it as an adjective, rather than a verb. Like functools.partial.

@simp-

7 ай бұрын

never thought of that before, but It's pretty much same as in build-in python functions sorted() and reversed(). I mean we have ex. not mapped() but map(); not enumerated() but enumerate() tho I have never see anyone complain about it, even tho it's kinda not consistent

@piaIy

7 ай бұрын

​@@simp- Sorted and reversed are different, they suggest that the collection is not modified in place, but a copy/iterator is returned, whereas you can't really map or enumerate in place. As for batched, I think they chose that name because batch can also be interpreted as a singular noun. Kotlin also uses the name chunked for a similar method, and their naming conventions are pretty consistent.

@simp-

7 ай бұрын

@@piaIy oh, okey I get it, thanks a lot

As an NVIDIA Jetson which shipped Ubuntu 20.04 (i.e. python38) and lots of proprietary NVIDIA libraries which only have python binding for 3.8, I start sweating at the thought of 3.8 being dropped next year.

@cleverclover7

7 ай бұрын

you're not alone

@volbla

7 ай бұрын

Let's update them 🙂

@Squeemos

7 ай бұрын

I know exactly what you mean. As much as I love the new features of updates to python I get really worried the closer 3.8 gets to being dropped haha. Too many things would stop working for me :(

@SuperGrimmy

7 ай бұрын

You'd probably be fine for a couple more years until 2025 when ubuntu 20.04 LTS standard security maintenance also runs out. Probably Nvidia calculated it based on that. That's definitely within reason. Most consider a newly deprecated python version to have year or two more in them in enviroments like that.

@tuberroot1112

7 ай бұрын

@@volbla "Let's update them ". Let us .... ? That will be you and who else picking up the burden of the massive work load imposed by the lamers at Python constantly doing non compatible "upgrades" and breaking everything in sight?

Please let the 3.14 release be called “Pi-thon” 😂

@cardboard952

7 ай бұрын

uyese

Been waiting for a 3.12 take from mCoding. Awesome!

Hi James, if you are gathering points for a new "Nooby Python habits" video, I might have one. Not sure if I missed it in the list or it is just so stupid that you did not think about it. In most of my codes I initialized instance attributes as class attributes instead of initializing them in the __init__() method. Mainly to make the code shorter and more readable. I mean, sure... Those are shared by all instances of a class, but if they are immutable objects they work like instance attributes. I realized my very stupid nooby habit when I created mutable objects (list and dict in my case) which is then shared between all instances. I think for newcomer this behavior is not quite obvious and can lead to silent misbehavior. I thought it is worth mentioning. Thank you for your great videos. Even considering the statement above, I'd say they made me a quite good Python dev :)

10:15 PUBLIC STATIC VOID MAIN STRING ARGS 🗣‼

8/10 video. im gonna start using itertools batched. f string stuff was annoying having to use different quotes, etc. kinda wish single-quotes in python weren't a thing.

@michaelflynn6952

7 ай бұрын

I just wish they did something different than double quotes, feels like wasted opportunity to make two characters do the same thing

@RokeJulianLockhart.s13ouq

7 ай бұрын

​@@michaelflynn6952Yeah. Almost every other scripting language has different handling for the two characters.

"and python 3.8 has a year to go so I can start pushing clients to upgrade to 3.9" :D

10:14 That would need a “@final” decorator on the base class method. No doubt that will be coming ...

@peyco

7 ай бұрын

Actually, @final is already in the `typing` module since python 3.8 ;)

@lawrencedoliveiro9104

7 ай бұрын

@@peyco Ha!

2:05 spooky, I literally just got bit by that this morning; I had no idea that's being/been addressed

The buffer protocol is nice. Many times I've come across functions in the standard library that say they work with anything that implements the buffer protocol, when it's C api only and only bytes and bytearray implement it. Not that useful but kinda nice.

Would like to hear more about your other preferred utils. How is batched implemented over an unindexed object, does it cast to a list or uses a generator ?

@pranavbhamidipati8609

7 ай бұрын

Generator. Unlike batched_even which needs the iterator length, batched does not

Love this form of video with the ratings! Very engaging...

Only two more to go until we can start calling it πthon...

Finally!!! I've been waiting for this to start learning Python.

10:26: C++ typing is a good thing! Typing has the two purposes of 1. helping the programmer catch errors, 2. creating an efficient compiler producing lightning fast machine code (if the programmer chooses to). If the answer on purpose 2. is "use another language" then Python isn't that language.

Static type gang here 👇

Marvellous. Loved it.

wonderful update

Great vid as always 🎉

@bswck

7 ай бұрын

discord gang 🤙

I also have had to write my own batched function. Since itertools has pairwise you might think it should also have an n-wise, but not so until now.

woa! I love the static typing stuff

Finally a youtuber who knows how to pronounce et cetera properly. You deserve a like just for that.

Override is my favorite. I love it.

great video. thank you

How did you learn about all the python language features you currently know how to use and what motivated you to learn them? Many times I watch your videos and I see you use something that I wasn't aware of before like __slots__ and other items like that.

Not that I have a use case for it, but I am curious. How do immortal objects actually work? Is there a way from within python to mark an object as immortal or is that fully up to the C implementation to handle - so only code that is partially C can benefit from it atm?

Can’t wait for Py 3.14

Love your music by the way

Can't wait for python 3.14, python π

These changes all sound amazing.

Thank you!

one of the best updates ever

I'll be waiting for 3.14

Is the debugger improvement applied to the integrated vscode debugger or do you have to use the sys.monitoring yourself ? Sorry I don't really know how debuggers work internally

@WesYarber

7 ай бұрын

Bump

new way of creating types is a huge change.

man you are literally the best python programmer i've ever seen

I was waiting for release really patiently, the new type syntax and f-string syntax are such amazing changes

`batched` function is GOAT

Best reviewer 🎉 :)

Looking forward to 3.14 version. I hope they gonna call it Pi-thon

Let's gooooo!!!

Good stuff. Generics have come a long way. Now we need currying. Nits: is that min_max generic at 0:13 supposed to return triples? And at 0:49 shouldn't it return self.seq[item] or something?

@FrederikSchumacher

7 ай бұрын

Currying has long been in Python: functools.partial or functools.lru_cache

@lawrencedoliveiro9104

7 ай бұрын

We already have function factories and class factories. What more do you need?

0:47 is (float, int) here mean that T will be a tuple, or will it be either a float or int?

It would be awesome if you made a video about generic functions!

as someone who learned programming with java, the new generics make me so happy 😊

@gautam-narula

7 ай бұрын

Getting ready for the next billionaire to be someone who made “don’t Java my Python” bumper stickers

I don't really understand the type params section. Can someone explain it?

The new generic type syntax looks like GO. and i love it actually

I don't get why you would type hint kwargs that way instead of just type hinting the named kwargs after the "/, *," in the function signature, e.g. "def thing(self, /, *, kwarg1: int, kwarg2: str)"

I really hope 3.14 will be named Pithon

Can't wait for 3.14 - Python Pi 😊

The generic typing is the best! I'm disappointed of the performance though. 3.11 vs 3.10 was a clear upgrade, while 3.12 barely changes, some programs run even slower.

Yo the next version is 3.14 thats dope

kwargs typing is useful for framework-like code. Because it is not obvious which parameters are accepted by **kwargs.

Missed a great opportunity to put the Twitter logo at 9:00 haha

What about Linux perf support? I'd love to see a good example of it

Feeling like the error message update has been a long time coming, wonder if rust launching with readable traceback added to the push

I can't decide if a smaller update like this with less new syntax is refreshing or boring

Can't wait for 3.14 - then we'll have Piithon

Immortal objects would be a no-op in pypy. Refcounting is just inherently ugly if you care about performance at all. I wish that python3 had just dropped refcounting and used a proper GC in python.

Immortal objects may be useless to most projects, but for those, for which it is a problem, it may resolve a bit PITA.

Batched finally here! I no longer have to produce weird magic tricks with iterator multiplication

Wow, python has changed a lot. I learned 3.1 and haven't had a reason to keep in the last few years

I really hope python will be called as Pie-thon when 3.14 is released

Hey question how do u get this app like the same ui and stuff because i have to use windows terminal

@felixfourcolor

7 ай бұрын

looks like vscode to me

What's "type variable"?

10:25 you forgot noexcept(noexcept(L)) lol

Thank you for the summary. It was super useful. The rating at the end of ever ysection feels kind of subjective and arbitrary.

You mentionned setuptools. But not that *distutils* is completely removed from 3.12! setuptool still monkey-patches in its special vendored version. But that means if you never imported setuptools, then imports of distutils will fail.

Python 3.7? Was that the one that made me continue using 3.6 well into its "security updates only" stage?

Does immortality mean I can get rid of all the Py_INCREF(Py_None) that are in my code because I'm returning None from a function?

@Spencer-wc6ew

7 ай бұрын

Do you have to change the reference count for None anyway? I wrote a C python module a few years ago. And for numbers, I was told to not change the reference count when returning an integer from 0-255, because those are special objects that are never deallocated. It may be the same for None.

@fyellin

7 ай бұрын

@@Spencer-wc6ew If you use PyLong_FromLong(x), then you don't need to increment the reference count, because the object you've just received has had its count incremented. But you can definitely crash Python by calling a function that returns `Py_None` without incrementing it. Call sys.getrefcount(None), find None's refcount, and call your function that many times. I assume the same holds true for the small integers, True, False, etc if you save the Python object in a global and repeatedly return it, rather than calling a getter.

@lawrencedoliveiro9104

7 ай бұрын

I always set reference counts properly, for None as for everything else. I once wrote a test program that did nothing but decrement the refcount for Py_None until it crashed. I got up to about 512 decrements or so, maybe slightly more.

3:14 you mention PEP 648 when it's PEP 684 :P

Hmm... A video on Python 3.12 with a slightly over 12-minute runtime :D

Just two versions left

im strugle to find pyaudio for this version of python3.12

I love python type hints, but not gonna lie, without rigorous type checking, I’m skeptical whether this kind of “advanced” typing is actually useful…

What about the cool new error messages

Can't wait for Python v 3.14159 running on Raspberry pi.

When can we get 3.14thon?

For me the new Generic syntax and @override is 10/10. The generic syntax would have made it easier for me to read though!

@FrederikSchumacher

7 ай бұрын

You are aware that anything in Python is a generic? "def foo(bar)" means bar is generic (as is the return value). It's not untyped either, because of "object" being the base for all Python values? There's only limited amount of usefulness in something like "[X where Parent]" as documentation.

@lawrencedoliveiro9104

7 ай бұрын

I think the C++ syntax was stupid. And it still doesn’t let C++ (or Java, for that matter) expression Python concepts like function factories and class factories.

@SourabhBhat

7 ай бұрын

@@FrederikSchumacher Yes. Python is too generic, which doesn't allow to express the intent of the programmer. The generic specification is just a hint for IDEs to check the sanity of the code. For example, a class of type T, has methods that adhere to the same type T.

Will it be renamed to pithon in 3.14?

Holding out for Python 3.14159

❤

Do they rename Python to PIthon at Version 3.14?

i guess Typethon or something 10/10!

"...and then you have to learn about category theory..." 😆

My crazy mind though mathematicians just dropped a new Pi value 😭😂

Streamlit is not available in python 3.12

Mod... Whiskey?

very pythonic