I had several of those Twin Turbo cards in blue and white G3’s in my “garage pile of Macs”. I wasn’t aware that they were high-end workstation cards.

@billdolar9995

Жыл бұрын

do you mean that capture Miro cards? F.. expensive but the only way to import analogue video into mac for editing. Very few years later mini dv solved the problem and decimated the costs.

@JohnDoe-wq5eu

Жыл бұрын

@@billdolar9995 I was going to say that came along with like the iMac and stuff didn't it. Really early on with Steve Jobs return.

The clone era is always so interesting, it's wild to me how Apple let others build machines when nowadays it seems like the last thing they'd ever do

@RisingRevengeance

Жыл бұрын

The best era, shame it was downhill from there.

@wavefront9221

Жыл бұрын

Pre-iMac Apple is pretty wild. Clone machines, upgrade cards from 68K to PowerPC (imagine if they did that for M1), cases that could disassembled with a single screw… as I much as I prefer the later Macs design-wise, I wish Apple would reemphasize that kind of modularity.

@DanaTheInsane

Жыл бұрын

@@RisingRevengeance because it was unsurvivable. It was killing. Apple as a company.

@tarstarkusz

Жыл бұрын

There never was a true "clone" era as there never were any "clones" in the PC sense of the word. What they were is rebranded Macintoshes. This is probably one of the major reasons it was never a success. Why buy a real Mac with its overpriced accessories when you get a real mac with cheap and common accessories? Also, Apple learned the wrong lessons from IBM. They saw the clones as the key to the success of the IBM PC, but apparently didn't notice IBM was on the verge of leaving the PC market it created because it simply could not compete with commoditized PCs. While the PC became undisputed king, IBM went into irrelevance.

@RisingRevengeance

Жыл бұрын

@@DanaTheInsane For sure but it was far better for the consumer. Apple may be doing better now but it's worse than ever for their customers.

I wouldn’t say the Apple clones nearly killed Apple, it was Apple’s stubbornness by making too many overpriced products and limited specs! Apple was also screwing retailers and educational buyers. The clones were cheaper and more customizable than the original Macs!

@James_Ryan

Жыл бұрын

Fully agreed on all points, but the clones were just ugly - I only lusted after Apple's hardware despite the high price tags and lower specs...

@Markimark151

Жыл бұрын

@@James_Ryan the clones look like bland PCs, but most computer buyers care about price and quality, not style! My school had a desktop Mac clone, because it was easier to upgrade for libraries and they only bought the all in one Macs because the built in monitors and simplicity.

@danimayb

Жыл бұрын

@@James_Ryan A classic Apple sheep lol This is why the company has hit an unprecedented level of success.. They can, and do, get away with 'almost' anything because their loyal fan base will continue to back them to the hilt while holding their wallets out freely. I mean, That is true power! You have to admire that at least. Who said BRAND isn't everything? Steve proved that wrong 😂

@1sonyzz

Жыл бұрын

Apple still goes their proprietary route with not swapping to usb-c connector on iphones and making more waste with proprietary stuff when nearly all manufacturers already swapped.

@Markimark151

Жыл бұрын

@@1sonyzz I really hate most of the proprietary connectors, because most third party accessories aren’t going to work with those awful connectors, and you have to get a dongle just to connect a common peripheral! That’s why I love USB connectors, because we hated those printer connectors!

10/10 video as always. Editing, pacing, narration, camerawork. All top notch. 👌

I remember the PowerTower quite well! My local library had one specifically to provide a Mac for the public's use... amidst a group of Windows boxes that were built by a local company before those quickly became outdated and were replaced by a bunch of Gateway machines. The PowerTower never got upgraded or replaced because very few people used it for much of anything beyond running a few programs that the library only had available for Macs. In fact, I spent quite a bit of time playing Myst on that machine because they didn't have the Windows port. But it was a beast for its time! It survived for nearly a decade -- as a matter of fact, I think it was still there right up until the library moved to its current building in 2003. I don't know what became of it after that, but that move included a complete tech overhaul, and I never saw it again, so it could very well (sadly) be in a landfill somewhere.

Interesting! I was never an Apple user, but I appreciated this trip down memory lane.

I remember having a PowerComputing clone for a short while. It was a desktop model, not a tower. Had to be in the early 2000s when I got it second-hand. I don't think I ever did much with it, sadly, as my real Mac assimilation didn't happen until the Intel switch a few years later. Watching this video made me a bit nostalgic for physical computer media, too. I loved me a good Zip disk back in the day, and there was always something so satisfying about the (pretty much Apple exclusive) floppy eject mechanism - and the sound that came with it!

This is why I like you and Action Retro.

@ShiggitayMediaProductions

Жыл бұрын

Yeah they both rock for different awesome reasons lol

@SPARTAN_Cayde-26

Жыл бұрын

How did you comment 3 days ago if this video just now????

@poble

Жыл бұрын

@@SPARTAN_Cayde-26 patreon

@ShiggitayMediaProductions

Жыл бұрын

@@SPARTAN_Cayde-26 he's likely a patron like I am...

I used to use one of these back when I was a graphic artist to render complex 3d graphs in mathematics. They were definitely necessary back in the mid to late 90s for that

i love how u make videos its relaxing and good to watch everything just feels right love to see a video on old hardware running morden stuff but keeping the look with newer os from win or mac keep up the great video man

I have a lot of nostalgia for these. My parents had a StarMax 3000 tower. Think it was the 200Mhz model. Thing was a beast at the time. I saw it in their basement recently. Dunno if it still works.Would be an interesting world today had these Mac clones actually taken off.

What a gorgeous machine, and an outstanding tour as always, Colin! I was going to look and see if I had that cache module around, but looks like you solved it (I picked up a few boxes of misc memory at VCF East a year or so back with some cache modules).

Great video as always. I do enjoy the relaxed vibe your content has. Keep up the great work.

Hey Colin, how’s it going? I love all the research and company history offered in this video, fantastic video!

The audio jack and volume dial on the CD burner..... I love that.

@ian_b

Жыл бұрын

Back in the day, CD-ROMs normally came with audio out, which meant you could play CDs with no load at all on the CPU. You had a headphone jack on the front and internal connection to the soundcard. Some also had digital audio out to connect to the soundcard. Much more convenient than pointlessly having the OS decode the audio then re-encode it, and have the audio stall if you're doing something CPU intensive. We've gone backward.

@TheT3rr0rMask

Жыл бұрын

@@ian_b Yup grew up with a Dell XP machine, too young to get into upgrades but would've been so into it. If I still had that machine I'd be searching for drives like this.

7:45 since this power clone uses a 604e and probably the same base logicboard/chipset/cache as the powermac 8500/9500 higher end models, you could try a their cache module into the power tower slot; I bet if it physically fits it will work (electrically).

@Madrrrrrrrrrrr

Жыл бұрын

I may have one of those as spare

Ali USB cards were a massive PITA on the PC market too - they were known for it when I was building those "early" towers.

You do do an incredible job with your videos and I loved this one!

I had a Umax tower at one time growing up, I remember it being quite a lovely little machine for what it was, and it played Mac Quake in software mode nicely too, but it had OS9 and was kind of sluggish with that.

"Some even had 2 processors. But that's a story... for when I aquire it and shoot a video about it..."

Cool, cool, cool. I had a PowerCenter 150 (604 @150 mhz, 1 GB HDD, 56 MB of RAM, Mac OS 7.5.3). Man, I WISH I'd hung onto it, it would be a great retro & collector's item now.

You should give a class on YT narration. So many creators seem to end up in this grating volume and cadence, you and Techmoan and LGR manage to be really informative AND listenable.

As an avid Mac user back in the 90's, I remember the Power Tower Pro and was very tempted to switch from my Mac IIsi. Thanks for the memory refresh. Great video.

I have some kind of Mac Clone like that in my storage shed. In about 2004 I took possession of it for a lawsuit - the lawyer asked me to keep it intact for when the case went to trial. And that was last I heard about the trial! I think that 18 years later it is probably safe for me to stop storing it.

@moccamixer

Жыл бұрын

Please elaborate on That 😜

i love the relaxed vibe, a fine example of how to make a video

Brings back memories... Thank you!

Great video. I still have my PTP225 that I got in 1997. It's been sitting under my desk for years and is quite dusty. I pulled the battery after your recommendation here. Power Computing really aced Apple's product line in terms of features and price (though I don't recall paying $5K for my 225). I remember looking at the Performa line and the PTP just offered so much more at what I remember being a comparable price. Mine is pretty dusty but it does have a Newer Tech CPU upgrade card (with gold cooling fins - don't recall whether this was a faster 604e or G3) and no problems with the original cache. It also has an upgraded ethernet card and USB card in two PCI slots, as well as the original video card and a second video card to drive the twin RasterOps 19" CRT monitors I used back then. I added a Yamaha 8-4-24 CD burning drive and it was also kitted out with both a Zip and Jaz drive from iomega. As far as RAM, it has four matched cards but I don't recall how much RAM. This was a great machine and I loved using it. I later replaced it with the grey G4 with the funky handles, but it's great to see this video about one of the best Macs ever made. I think I might have that RasterOps monitor somewhere in the basement, if you're interested.

I found out that XLR8 was bought by Interex (Bankrupt in 2000 then bought by Tripp Lite), a computer peripheral business from my hometown. Between that discovery and the papers about NCR's R&D dept in my home city talking about their contribution to the creation of SCSI, I've been learning all sorts of things about my hometown I didn't know before.

@davidreynoldsx

Жыл бұрын

You should look into Daystar Digital. They where out of Flowery Branch, right up the road. Their clone was the Genesis MP and they are absolute beasts.

I’ve never heard them called bird connectors before, I usually only called them floppy power connectors!

Always an interesting to look back at what was cutting tech.

That Sonnet Crescendo G3 card at the end. Wow I remember that being lusted after in the day. That purple colour was everything.

@JohnDoe-wq5eu

Жыл бұрын

Back when I was going to my local JC back in the late 90s I wanted one so bad but there was no way I was going to afford that. Especially after they started getting crazy hard to find.

Excellent report!!!

14:55 This is a very nice shot

Having USB on older machines is really great as it makes data transfer so much easier. Gladly my Pentium 233 MMX mainboard already has USB, so I can use modern USB sticks under Win98SE and even DOS6.22 (the latter I have to reboot when plugging ins sticks though). Also have Zip drives lying around but don't use them.

I had one of these. The expandability on it was awesome!

This was an amazing trip down memory lane. I bought a used Power Tower from a friend in 2000. It's somewhere in my garage under an inch of dust. I don't have the heart to throw it out because of its nostalgic value. Also, I love how you mentioned "SCSI voodoo!" I thought I was the only person who used that phrase. LOL Back in the day, getting all of the external Glyph Tech narrow SCSI HDD's, 1GB Jaz drives, and Yamaha 2x CD-R to work was always a crap-shoot. Great video - thanks!

@felsinferguson1125

Жыл бұрын

If you remember the "fun" of SCSI, you likely remember the line "Have you tried waving a dead chicken over it yet?" when discussing SCSI problems... Put a terminator on the last device on the chain - no, put a terminator with a passthrough directly on the SCSI port on the computer! No! Put the terminator after the third device! AUGH!!! I give up! Somebody find me a dead chicken!

Had a PowerBase 180 (603e processor) mini-tower that I ordered new from Power Computing back in the day, with that same 17" Sony trinitron display shown here. I remember how excited I was when UPS dropped it off - that thing was a beast of an upgrade from my LC II, and very well-built. I remember getting the very letter you showed, from Apple also... wish I still had it!

Great video as always! Thnx

Enjoyed this article and thanks keep it up

What camera do you currently use for your videos? Looks great!

PowerComputing was the top performance clone maker because they pushed the machines as hard as possible. They were supposed to release a model with a 60MHz bus but I don't think it ever happened since none of Apple's Tsunami custom support chips were rated over 50MHz and PCC probably couldn't get enough that were stable at 60MHz. Also, if I had the choice between the sturdy and easy-to-use case of a PowerTower Pro vs. the cheaply built and difficult-to-service 9500, it's not hard to see why more people would've preferred the PowerTower Pro (or Umax S900 or Daystar Genesis): Apple's desktop designs were atrocious in the mid-90s. That "L2 cache" card you found is actually a ROM for one of the earlier G1/NuBus models (they used ROM SIMMs, both Apple and clones), and the similar G1 L2 cache modules would also be incompatible here. If you want to go back to the stock CPU, check around for a G2/PCI cache module. They're not uncommon, but you may have trouble finding a 1MB variant. As for USB, look for anything with an OPTi FireLink chipset. These were shipped onboard USB-based Macs for years and are trouble-free. Also any NEC USB 2.0 chipset (though you won't get the 2.0 speeds in Classic Mac OS).

Coming from someone that was born in July of 96 that was cool to see the disk drive come out and seeing JULY 1996

I worked at a graphic design and pre-press business during this time. When the clones became available we immediately stopped buying Apple products and bought clones. The print business was already starting to decline at the time and our profit margins were very thin. Being able to get faster cheaper machines was key to the business surviving. Although I left that business to start a different career, when I visited the place in the early 2000s they were still using many of the clones to do work on - of course running older versions of the Mac operating system.

This is a very interesting machine, as my first PC, back when I still so young I was barely able to speak or walk, was its contemporary, only it was a Windows one, not a Mac. Granted, it was either from a smaller company or assembled on demand, as, at the time, I don't think there were any major computer companies in my country.

I seem to remember 3rd party USB cards having their own drivers most of the time. These days it's a little easier to find drivers by the chipset and get yourself a deal, but in the classic Mac OS days it was so challenging to find Mac compatible cards unless they were by a Sonnet or OWC or something.

Thanks for the interesting video Colin

Importantly, these machines were supposed to adhere to the new "Common Hardware Reference Platform" which was supported by Digital (Alpha) and MIPS and would have ultimately allowed running Windows NT, which vs MacOS 7, was a no-contest. Apple absolutely did not have a proper OS to compete at all and Jobs knew it.

I remember back in the day so many people in tech journalism were saying how Apple needed to ditch their hardware and just become a software company. The idea was that they just licensed their operating system the way Microsoft did. My question has always been, what software did they make besides Mac OS? Later after OSX they were building a lot more software, but in the System 7 and System 8 days? I don't think they'd have very many products besides Mac OS and Mac OS was pretty antiquated compared to many other operating systems. I was a PC girl, dual booting Linux and Windows but you couldn't help but see all the articles, it was a fascinating time.

I had a PowerCenter Pro 210 which I absolutely loved.

I was in my early 20s and three years out of art school (SCAD) when the clones hit the market. My beloved Quadra 700 was no longer cutting it... so I splurged on a PowerComputing PowerCenter 132 (my first / sadly not last / significant credit card purchase). Did some of my best animation work on that machine (Form•Z and Electric Image). It was a solid machine. That said, the MiroMotion DC20 capture card that came with... I never was able to get it (or the warranty replacement card) working. PowerComputing compensated with a TwinTurbo video card. For the time, it was a solid performing video card and made 21" CRTs just sing with Premiere, Photoshop and Form•Z work. Such a great era, the early-and-on 90s. It was the wild west for digital graphic design, burgeoning WWW, Mac gaming... really fond memories.

Best compatible USB PCI card needed to have the "NEC" chipset.. remember the closeout sale at the PowertComputing site in Round Rock TX just a bunch of cases and parts, just enough to build a Frankenstein PowerBase 240 ($159 CHEAP in those days) Tower with Powerlogix card.. miss those overclocking days... great video

Beautiful Mac! I've become more enamored of clones lately ❤

Lol missing the Power Computing website held the above image 16:58 saying "Busted for Speeding" as their tech is what brought on the G3/G4 which included a hardware hack to the 603e and 604e which allowed them to rebrand them as G3 and G4. It was a pleasure to work on the great many models of PC macs as I did. I did keep one of the older tower for years as my daily mac driver, replacing it with a second Gen iMac blueberry.

Okay, I want one of these for my collection.. Also, a video on the creation of L2 cache would be neat.

The trouble is back then the hardware was decent but the OS was not. These days the OS is a lot better and the whole ecosystem is lightyears ahead of the Mac OS classic days. Plus while I detest their "OSX appliances" I really wish everyone could use their ARM processors.

We replaced our aging compact Macs at my college newspaper with Power Computing machines. They were not the tower models, but the horizontal desktop models. They were night and day performance-wise compared to what we'd been using up until then. We even got approved for a tabloid size printer to replace our old LaserWriter. Gosh, we felt so professional after all those upgrades, and they helped us be more creative with our layouts and graphics. Good times.

The 'cache' card at 7:40 looks like a ROM DIMM to me, with it's HH and HL marked chips indicating Hi and Lo.

I remember back in 99, I got a PowerMac 7600 as part of a school closure sale lot on Ebay, wasn't just one 7600, since it was a lot of 10 per sale. Sadly I ran into the same issue with the L2 cache as you did, and IIRC, Apple was notorious even back in the day with variations between models, even 603/604 based PowerMacs. I remember I got a L2 cache stick, and it was apparently meant for the tower PowerMac's, similar board to that of the PowerComputing one, not the desktop models from about the same time. Funny enough, one of the Mac's in the lot had a Twin Turbo 128, and was exactly what I needed to get on the journey of learning graphic design and 3D as a teen.

I was just commenting about this on another forum. Way back in 1998 I had gone over to a friend of a friends house here in Japan. This guy had a PowerComputing PowerTower Pro! It was the fasted PowerMac compatible computer when he got it in 1996 or 97 when he got it. It was still freaking awesome at the time! By that time, Jobs had returned to Apple and I think they eventually just bought PCC or something.

Thanks for bringing me back the memory of my old days when working in that industry. BTW, your tone and pitch sound very much the Lock Picking Lawyer alike.... 🙂

You sometimes cannot boot from 3rd party CD drives/burners in an older Macintosh. The Apple 8x drive was most likely installed to allow booting from CD (especially 7.5). Having a CD-drive _and_ a CD-burner was often used to copy CDs. The 4x/12x Teac CD-R55s was a very widely used CD-burner with the Mac in the late 90s. The 'cache-module' you showed was most likely a ROM module. The PowerTower should allow up to 60MHz bus speed but you might have to remove the older 32 and 16 mb RAM modules. 256Mb ist most likely all you need for typical tasks nowadays.

Nice! Just a heads up, when cleaning such as you did, better to spray the cloth and not the keyboard.

I really love how you can easily replace the CPU as if it was a game cardridge. you don't need knowledge on what CPU socket you need, what heatsync, what thermal paste, you just need to know if it fits.

@EmergencyChannel

Жыл бұрын

Modern CPU's can't be passively cooled and a lot of them practically need water cooling. Hard to implement a one size fits all air cooler when there is so many case sizes as well.

@James_Ryan

Жыл бұрын

Yes, I loved doing that with my Pentium II cartridges of the same era, it was such a breeze to upgrade!

@JohnDoe-wq5eu

Жыл бұрын

I do miss those days though. Very different than now in a lot of ways but yeah passively cooling is so different than the space heaters that they've become now, that basically need to be constantly cooled off lest your entire computer system meltdown.

I had a Umax Mac clone in my office at my first IT job, using this 2nd device to manage the small Mac environment along with the Windows/Novell one.

i have a 2012 mbp 13 inch and to keep it relevant i did the usual upgrades plus the latest macos 12.6....not a huge mac fan but they do some amazing work within that ecosystem!

Would it be able to run MasOS 10 if I would like to see it done in a feature video

I got a PowerCenter 132 in 1996. It was an awesome machine!

Great video! I actually brought my power tower pro 250 back from my parents house this weekend. It’s booting but no video. i’m assuming the problem is the stock video card? I tried it on a different monitor, no joy. I also put the video card into a different slot, no joy. Is there anything else I should try before I go look for an old legacy video card? Thanks!

(9:24) I never heard of that! I'm going to have to really look into getting one for my 2001 iMac so I wouldn't have to adjust the CRT screen settings every time. I do like the creative name!

XLR8 is probably pronounced "accelerate"🙂 One of the first PCs I used was an old Mac of a similar era, but I've never had the pleasure of using one of these clones before. Looks amazingly expandable. I wish more modern PCs were as upgradeable.

Fun video! I had a UMAX C500 which used the 603e, and I loved it. It cost me less than a grand (barely.)

Had this exact model, it was a blast - louder than it needed to be, but nice to expand and work with. Keyboard was terrible.

I used one of these for a short while. I remember the fans being extremely loud. Not sure if it was this particular clone, or another manufacturer. Long time ago!

I worked at Power Computing the last few months of it's existence. I was as a member of the company's support team for it's foray into the Wintel market- a decision made after Jobs killed the MAC Clone licensing program. They never grew into a sizeable company. The building that housed the company is now a Gold's Gym that is situated just across Dell in Round Rock, TX. I was one of the last people to leave the company as it began to shut down operations. Handling multiple functions from technical support, RMA and regulatory processes and public relations. Unfortunately I didn't qualify for any of that Apple stock that Apple gave to Power Computing employees.

Please do a video on AlphaSmarts! Such an interesting and all but forgotten word processing idea for classrooms. I remember using them in elementary school before the possibility for kids to have access to computers in the classroom all the time.

Brilliant. As usual.

It's funny to see that even back in the 90's Hackintoshes still had better specs then current Macs.

In October 1997, you could get even a branded PC with a Pentium II 300Mhz with 4x the RAM, 7GB HDD for 1000$ Less than one of these. Apple would come out with the Powermac G3 Beige later that year, which was a big step forward. :D

So strange to see a MAC so upgratable without any parts soldered to the mother board

@ryanvacation7319

Жыл бұрын

To be fair, throughout the 2000s, Apple offered very easy to open and upgradable towers like the Powermac G3, G4, G5, and the Intel aluminum cheese grater Mac Pro.

@ronlevon4294

Жыл бұрын

@@ryanvacation7319 Not since tim cook came to head of Apple. Since then each year it is getting bad

@Sashazur

Жыл бұрын

Honestly most customers don’t care about upgradability anymore, which makes sense since unlike decades ago, the technology advancements have slowed down a lot. Back in the 90s even though it’s a joke from a weird Al song, it was really true that machines went obsolete in months. These days without customer pressure it’s cheaper to design and build systems without upgradability, and of course it probably also helps sales by forcing people to replace machines more frequently.

When stating the price of these machines, always include the official apple prices for a similar machine ;)

Power 120 with a Radius VideoVision Studio. Oh the memories!

did you try looking on the original hdd for the usb drivers? This is why i never wipe and reinstall, i always back up the original hdd incase you have something unobtainable thats not archived.

I had a PowerCenter 132. It was a nice machine, even though it was based on a 7200. I eventually put a G3 CPU card in it and a better graphics card.

Have you done any videos on the Radius Mac Clones? I had the 110 Mhz PPC 601 tower with a Media 100 kit and the RAM maxed out using IBM branded SIMMs. Extremely heavy, all thick steel case that required removing a huge number of screws to remove some components. To achieve a high enough write speed for Media 100 I had to stripe a RAID 0 volume across drives connected to both SCSI buses.

The Mac clones are so much fun to play with.

A PowerComputing clone is high on my dream list of vintage Macs to add to my collection. Still wish I hadn't gone with a Performa 6220CD and waited just a little bit to get a PowerBase 180 or something.

A friend of mine had one of these. He ran a beta of OSX on it - the first time I had ever seen OSX.

Is this 1MB 2nd-Level cache compatible with PM6100 ? I am searching such a thing for years!

ISTR I had an AIX PowerPC 'Bull Escala' running my Social Services Oracle DB . 40 users for that system. Tough as old boots and replaced it with another Bull/AIX machine. mid to late 90s then early 2000.

Your analysis was flawless. It's explain clearly why Apple never try to license the OS again.

Other people do videos on boring old computers they acquire. Collin gets the ones which have all kinds of crazy sh!t inside. That is why his channel is so awesome! 🖥️

My 1st Mac - Second-hand PowerComputing PowerBase 180.

Interesting that it goes from Mac OS 8.5 to Mac OS 8.6 partway through the video. Necessary for the G3 card?

Wow ! They are in such good conditions

Why did people remove the L2 cache card when upgrading the CPU? Was there a real technical reason?

I myself had a powerbase 200 which was also a powercomputing product, just wasn't impressed once mac os 8 came out, that I couldn't use. Apple wouldn't allow it. So yea and my brother to at the time was testing waters on his own computers with Linux, I later joined in 2010 onwards as I felt more comfortable with all the distros available.

At 6minutes When you set the graphics card down on the grid and the line matched perfectly between the pins! omg, heaven

I had one of these - it was awesome.

I looked at one of those, years upon years ago - Would have been a replacement for my PowerMac 7500. But I found a couple of toys to fit it, including a dual G4 processor card, jacked up the RAM, and ended up with a machine hotter than the PTP for less than a quarter of the price. Ran it until it became impossible to run the new x86-only 'ware, and update/upgrade paths became nonexistent. That was one helluva machine...

What a trip down memory lane. I had this exact Power Computing Power Tower Pro, running an imagesetter. And had planned to buy more, due the speed, expansion and price. I was sad to see them go, but Steve Jobs brought Apple back and made some excellent machines. I use Power Macs now and grumble about the prices every time I need a new one and contemplate switching to Windows… but never do.