Hi Alec, Had a gf who used a diaphragm. kidding. Now i know the difference between 1st stage regs. Your a cornucopia of knowledge, i truly appreciate your entertaining SCUBA videos. Fun to watch while learning. Your students must have respected you and still think of you with fond memories. Best Regards

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

Some did. Some were experts even though they'd never been underwater. Those ones didn't do well in my classes. You know what I mean. Alec

Great video my friend. I'm starting to service regulators at are local dive shop. I love piston and been diving it for 25 years. They are so easy to service. Keep up the great videos. Show us how the old 2 hose regulator works. And inside guts. Montana Mike.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

A piston regulator is a service technicians dream come true - 4-5 parts, mostly O-Rings, no adjustment - it couldn't be easier., I'm getting to the adjustment of regs first and then I'll start looking at different models including 2 hose. Take care Mike. Alec

This video advocates piston quite haeavily, but there are good reasons why diaphragm 1st stages are used (e.g. cold waters to avoid free flow). I'm not going to argue for one or another, everyone should decide on their own, but this video does not portrait the entire picture, so you should look for other information sources in order to get entire picture. I know, that Alec mentions that there's more to this topic, but if I were clueless then I would buy piston without thinking after watching this video ...

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

That wasn't my intention SS. Many divers shun the piston. I was just trying to even the field. BTW, the piston is just as good in cold water as the diaphragm. Note the impressive 40 year record of the cold water champ - the Sherwood Blizzard. The first USD Aqua-lung Calypso was a piston and it had a great reputation for use in cold water. Neither style has any advantage over the other in terms of performance in any environment so it comes down to cost, service and reliability. Frankly, the 1st stage is highly overrated. It performs a very perfunctory job - open/close, open/close, repeat indefinitely. Either style will do the job well. Thanks for watching. Alec

@SeekerOfTheAbyss

6 жыл бұрын

Thank you for pointing out Sherwood Blizzard, I didn't know that one. In any case, there are reasons why dry chambers have been introduced, but there's always also trade-off between various aspects. The only question is what's more important for your diving and what diving setup you're diving with. However, by all means, it was meant as constructive criticism and it would be appreciated if you can perhaps produce another video diving deeper into this topic in order to portrait the entire picture. I really enjoy watching your videos but I had an urge to point out that this video was produced with sort of bias (not obvious from the very first glance). In any case thank you for clarification and looking forward for more content from you. Kind Regards, Peter

@3DJunkieDude

4 жыл бұрын

@@SeekerOfTheAbyss I've had my Blizzard since 1986, when I used it for ice diving and wrecks in Michigan. Never once had a problem with freeze-ups or free flow. Had it rebuilt in 2018 with new, upgraded parts in the first stage. Still works like a champ, but want a newer, slimmer second stage.

Would love to see a video (or two videos) on how each style works, and detailed pros and cons (is one better for cold water, etc). Great videos!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

I'm planning on that. There seems to be a lot of divers interested in learning how these things work and there's a real lack of easy-to-understand videos. Thanks for watching. Alec

@nicoscuba

6 жыл бұрын

Agree with John, would love to see that. Tks Alec for another great tech tip.

@mikesmith3704

6 жыл бұрын

And another vote for how each style works.

Hi Alex, excellent video like always. I recommend you to all my students for you experience and non biased opinion. Keep up the good work.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

Thank you. I will try my best to never let you down. Alec

nice to see you again. they always tell me it depends on the water temperature one of them is less chance to get stock in cold water . but since my dives are all in tropical water it doesn’t make any differences

@JBernhard72

6 жыл бұрын

+1 I also want to know.

As always great informative video Alec.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Thanks Mule. Alec

Love your videos Alec. Makes my science of diving course more understandable with your videos.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

Great to hear!

Very Nice presentation. Explained it very clearly. Thank you.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

I'm glad you enjoyed it. I hope you picked up some ideas. Alec

thanks Alec, great information, keep videos coming

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

2 жыл бұрын

More to come!

Excellent video!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching. Alec

Great video, straightforward. No nonsense. Thanks Alec

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Thanks Kevin. Alec

With the small jack yves mention...can you make a new series on the history of scuba, how it started when, by who, different systems, the first dive tables etc... That would be great information for everyone, thank you,

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Wow! That would keep me busy for about a year. I'll keep throwing in little bits here and there when appropriate for now. Maybe eventually I'll be able to coalesce them into a video. Thanks for watching. Alec

Alec, thanks a lot for all the information you have shared in your fantastic videos! I am a rockie diver and being in the process of acquiring my first pieces of equipment I have found your teachings nothing but invaluable! Keep them coming, I will try to keep learning... I do love how you explain why something is the way it is! Thank you very much indeed all the way from Argentina! Cheers.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

You're very welcome Guillermo, all the way from Canada! You have so much to look forward to - I'm jealous. Alec

this is great info keep it coming Alec

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Thanks. Alec

I think diaphragms are still around because they can be more easily environmentally sealed. At least, sealing is their main line of marketing. I know some pistons also claim environmental sealing but their marketing material seems to be trying really hard to convince us that it is as good as that of diaphragms.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

You may be right about the marketing slant. Since diaphragms have been around so long it's natural for piston manufacturers to try to persuade divers that their regs are as good or better. That ought to change as it becomes more accepted that pistons are equal to diaphragms in performance and perhaps better in other ways. Thanks for watching. Alec

Just magnificus! Thanks!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Thanks K. Alec

Love the tips, only just found your channel, will certainly watch more. A Brit!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

4 жыл бұрын

Welcome aboard!

thanks, really love your videos

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Good to hear from your Karl. Take care. Alec

Dry air bleed first stage vs sealed? Concerns or thoughts?I think I was going through withdrawal without new tech tips, thanks for keeping them coming!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

The unique Dry Air Bleed design developed by Sherwood and now used on their Genesis 1st stage is excellent. I'd need a few minutes and a whiteboard to explain it and might just do that since it's so neat, simple and effective. Essentially it allows the first stage to react to the water pressure without letting any water inside - unlike any other regulator. So called sealed first stages try to accomplish the same by placing a rubber cap filled with silicon oil over the first stage. It works to some extent but also introduces other problems such as reduced sensitivity, increased maintenance cost and potential corrosion problems. I may do a video on that topic as well to explain some of these ideas. Watch for something called Cold Water Regulators. It's time for a story - the idea of sealing the first stage is not new at all. Before most of you were divers, say in the 60's, it was pretty common for us to seal our first stages when diving under the ice. I am from Canada remember! We didn't have any fancy Dry Air Bleed regs or Sealed 1st Stages so we made our own. It was simple job. We filled a condom with alcohol, usually Gin, and carefully put the first stage into the Gin and pulled the condom around the first stage. Then we held it all together with rubber bands (this was pre-Duct tape). If you've followed this so far you can see that the entire hollow of the 1st stage was now full of gin and the gin was held in by the condom. No water could get into the reg. I should have patented the idea at the time but was having too much fun to think of that. Soon Poseidon and then much later Aqualung came up with the same idea using a proper rubber cap and a clamp to hold it in place. So you see that Gin and condoms are a natural combination for divers too. Thanks Joe. Alec

@MrVincehannah

6 жыл бұрын

Very interesting!! Thanks so much for all the time you take to answer peoples questions, I (and everyone else I'm sure) really appreciate and enjoy the info and stories!

@alaind831

6 жыл бұрын

neat story as always! yes please do explore environment seals some more... I have the option on mine (looks like another rubber cap and longer piston) and was wondering about having no water enter the mechanism (already membrane based so little corrosion exposure vs regular piston ?)

Great information. Thanks!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

Great one sir! 🌈

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you! 😃

Thanks for taking your time and explaining their differences. I will purchase my regulator accordingly, I like my equipment simple, simplicity wins.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

FANTASTIC VIDEO

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

I'm glad you liked it Gino. Thanks for watching. Alec

I liked your explanation. Thanks

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching Pez. Alec

Don’t worry my brain does the same and you remind me of my self teaching fitting machining and welding love ya videos

Thanks for posting , the 1st stage have always been a mystery and never serviced mine, but I have serviced my second stage with no problems....

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

I'll be doing a follow-up on servicing both stages soon. Take care. Alec

Great video again. Hope next video will be soon :)

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Should be every week now. Thanks for watching. Alec

Great explonation video! Thank u!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

Жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it! A

I am a commercial shellfishing diver, stirring up the bottom, diving year round so prefer the diaphragm. But to reduce wear and tear I use my piston MK20 from May to September. Then switch to my Apeks ATX200 October-April. Shwiinng!!

Thanks again Alec. Always like your objective views on tech tips. I tend to agree that less is more - a bit like many things these days; if the basics are done well, who needs to over complicate the process!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

I have learned from personal experience and from watching hundreds of other divers struggle with gear that simple is good. But it's fun to have toys too. So long as your basic gear, your breathing stuff is simple and reliable, that's good. Thanks for your comment Ed. Alec

@briggsjaxon8059

2 жыл бұрын

Instablaster.

Good job ,Sir ..

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

2 жыл бұрын

So nice of you

Hello! Mr. Alec Peirce ... A warm greeting from the city of Santa Cruz de Barahona, Caribbean coastal city in the Dominican Republic, for less than a year my employment contract ended and I returned to this region that is my hometown for the purpose of enjoy this area of ​​great beauty and natural wealth, in this free time I spend my time to detect metals and I have a great interest to explore shallow beaches and spas in order to get something of value and thus acquire detector equipment metals that allow me to explore galleons and shipwrecks that are found throughout this southern area ... my interest is to have the basic knowledge in principle for a dive that does not exceed three meters deep .... In this part of the island it is impossible to get a school or course where you can learn everything related to rewarding and sometimes complex world of recreational and professional diving ... But thanks to you, your videos, explanations and good guidance cause confidence and security, Go ahead when you buy my first dive unit and make my first dives I know I will be totally familiar ... My respect for you and my greetings from the Caribbean Coast of the Dominican Republic ... Thank you!

Alec, I'm just getting started in diving, and have been watching a lot of your videos and had one that id like to see: Balanced vs unbalanced regulators, and their internal differences

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

The internal physical differences between regular and balanced are slight and hard to spot if you do not know what to look for. I have made a video on regular versus balanced regulators recently. Unless you purchase the cheapest regulator available today, it's almost guaranteed to be balanced. Thanks for watching. Alec

Excellent!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you! Cheers!

This guy explains things well

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

11 ай бұрын

I explain things so well even Kevin can understand it!!! HA HA A

From a very old ad for a seagull outboard "what's not there can't go wrong"

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

I like that Thomas. Good one. I'll use that in the future. Alec

Love your vids Alec, I have learned a lot from your channel. When researching regs I had a lot of people recommending the MK17 over the MK25 when looking at SP regs. Most felt that the sealed aspect along with its cold water performance and reputation for reliability put it at an advantage over the MK25.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

The MK17 is a good reg too. It's not been around nearly so long as the MK25 but it has earned a good rep. The MK25 has some features that help reduce the likelihood of freezing too. You can read about them on their website. Actually it was a piston reg that we used a condom on. It's very easy to seal. Thanks for watching. Alec

@robertemmerich9429

6 жыл бұрын

Alec Peirce Scuba You know you have to do a video on how you sealed a piston reg with a condom!

@cosmonauta2001

6 жыл бұрын

@Robert Emmerich Hi! I own a Mk17 and also I have tried the Mk25 a couple of times. Couldn't tell the difference, apart from the big deal on having my Mk17 serviced. I love the Mk17, but I certainly see a lot of advantages on the MK25. My best regards!

who is best in extreme cold ? like if you dont live in florida where the winter is 70 f .. but lets say norway where surface temp is more like -4 f ? the regulator i use is specifically made for extreme cold contidions. and its a diaphragm.

Awesome thank you.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Thanks Augie. Alec

I noticed the piston regulator shown is unbalanced and the diaphragm regulator is balanced. Is the a part difference between balanced/unbalanced of the same type?

So many decisions to make on gear.

Hey Alec. Thanks for another great tech tip. I understand the benefits of a piston regulator (simplicity, ease of service, lower cost) but I came away from the video wondering what the benefits of a diaphragm regulator were. Can you elaborate more? Thanks again!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

I'm sure that USD or Mares would like to see a list of benefits of the diaphragm over the piston but it wouldn't be easy to make such a list without stretching the truth or at least invoking a bit of marketing hype. I'm not bias in any way. My favorite regulator of all time was the excellent DACOR Pacer 900, a diaphragm. I was trained on an Aqua-Lung Mistral, a diaphragm (terrible breather by today's standards). And my first own regulator was an Aqua-Lung Aquamatic, a diaphragm. But the simple fact is that both types do exactly the same job - supply air at proper pressure to the 2nd stage. And they both do so perfectly well. The piston is just cheaper, has less parts so in theory anyway is more rugged and reliable and it's easier and cheaper to service. I'll think on that and see if I can a find a genuine benefit to the diaphragm style. To the diehard diaphragm enthusiasts I offer this - 99% of all 2nd stages are diaphragm. There. See I'm not biased. Thanks for watching Dan. Alec

hi Alec. i am currently in the market for my first regulator. (Yeay) after watching your video. im sold on the PISTON reg. now everything im reading is that piston regs are not generally used for cold water. That being said. im not intrestead in ice diving. how ever. will be diving our Ontario lakes though out the summers. so my question is if a piston 1rst stage isint ideal for cold water. how cold are they talking about. can i go to 130 feet in ontario lakes or can they still freeze up even though its summer? Or is any of this even an issue. really intrestead in what you think before i make a decision. ..joel

Thanks for another great intro level video. I am a bit of a gearhead so I purchased a near new and serviced ScubaPro Mk25 / S600 combo a month ago because of the excellent performance and reliability reviews. Probably more performance than I'll ever need, but the international status of SP will hopefully be beneficial in parts, servicing availability, and resale in South East Asia. The exploded view of the Mk25 shows quite a bit more components compared to the unit you disassembled, which I assume is because of the balanced piston design?

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

You're right - partly. Scubapro gear is one of the best and you now have one of my favorite modern regulators - the venerable MK25/S600. That MK25 has been around a long time and there have been numerous upgrades and improvements made over the years. It seems that each improvement added a part or two. It's still a pretty simple regulator and if you can look at one in action you would see that it too has only 2 moving parts - the piston and the piston spring, just like the one in the video. Most of the extra parts are static - they don't move and are there to enhance performance. Some increase the sealing surfaces, some soften the piston movement, some are there to make service easier and so on. They don't detract from it's simple reliability. The fact that it's balanced and so offers better breathing characteristics (note that I did NOT say easier breathing!) doesn't really add to it's complexity. Balancing a piston reg only alters the path of the air flow. The piston still just moves up and down. There are pictures of the MK25 showing the air flow on the internet. See if you can find them. You've got yourself a good one! Take care. Alec

@H-habilis

6 жыл бұрын

Yes I was able to find this cut-away view and operational video of a simple piston first stage here: kzread.info/dash/bejne/laVm27SKdNqre7A.html. Informative albeit in French, thanks for the tip!

@alaind831

6 жыл бұрын

french canadian version of 'how it's made' US show.

Thank you Mr. Pierce for your wise advices. I have dived for more than 10 years with a Mares 2T Diaphragm Regulator. I want to buy now a Piston Regulator. Please help to decide which Piston regulator do you recommend from these: Sherwood SR2 Balanced n Sealed , Atomic Z2 Balanced n Sealed , Scuba Pro Mk25 Balanced n Not Sealed , Scuba Pro Mk2 Not Balanced n Not Sealed , Aqualung Calypso Not Balanced n Not Sealed , Mares Rover 2S Not Balanced n Not Sealed , Oceanis SP-5 Not Balanced n Not Sealed. Your opinion is extremely important. Thank you and keep your wounderfull work !Sincerely, Jose Manuel Portilla from Acapulco, Mexico.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

That's quite a list Jose. Of course my opinion on what you will like the best is subjective but maybe I can help narrow it down. The cost of balanced over not balanced is small so a balanced regulator is the way to go. The Sherwood SR series has many years of solid performance behind it. It is one of the most advanced designs available, offering incredible breathing, simple diver control and inherent environmental protection. And Sherwood is a very large, international company with distributors and dealers everywhere. Sherwood is often the choice of training and rental organization and commercial divers because of its proven reliability. Atomic makes an excellent product. I have two concerns with Atomic. It is a small company so service and parts may not be available whenever or wherever you need it. And it's environmental protection is a pretty standard add-on designed to stop water from getting in rather than a feature of its design as with the Sherwood regulators. Atomic does a great job of promoting it's regulators as unique and "unmatched" in the scuba world but neither is true. Their cone-shaped HP seat is not the first such design and to claim it is the "most reliable in the industry" is unwarranted hype. So, it comes down to your personal decision as to which you like and which will ensure easy access to service in your dive plans. Either will do a great job for many years. I hope this helps. Alec

I think the piston 1st stage will deliver slightly better air flow (According to spec sheets from Scubapro Mk19 Evo vs Mk25 Evo) while the diaphragm 1st stage is sealed which allows to do ice diving, deep diving and diving under difficult conditions like mud, sand, toxic waste or oily water. Despite that the piston has better air flow on the paper (2000or 2500 l/min vs 1800 l/min at Mk19 Evo diaphragm) i figured out that both 1st stages are easily able to support up to 5 divers with air at about 10 m or 32 ft of depth for about 30 mins without any problems or anything so they are both built pretty good, strong and reliable. But the tech diver or commercial diver will always or mostly choose the diaphragm for the primary gas at high and low depths and the piston 1st stages for O2/deco stages or dives at normal depths and conditions. Personally i am using 2 Scubapro Mk19 Evo and 2 Scubapro G260. no yellow Octopus, but around 1,5m of hose at the secondary reg and a real 2nd stage without the cons of a downstream octo which i think is advantage for both cases: Me needing to change to the replacement reg and 1st stage because of primary 1st stage failure or anyone other needing air support because he got any failures. Anyone needing air from me will get the same reg i have in my mouth with fully configurable venturi valve and intermediate pressure plus an extra long hose to maneuver around or take some distance in tight sections to go one after another through. With this setup I tried to minimize/prevent any rabbit hole effects when stress and trouble are building up whilst unforseen happenings or failures.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

Ай бұрын

Thanks for sharing your detailed experiences. With all the choices in gear, I think it is mostly personal preference to which to use in rec diving. A

Thank You !

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

2 жыл бұрын

You're welcome!

Great video love this guy he is quirky

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

4 жыл бұрын

Quirky? Could be worse. Thanks for watching Josh. Alec

many thanks

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching Mark. Alec

Hi Alec, you say most first stages nowadays are piston based (@2:07). Not sure if that is completely correct. If I look at Apeks, Aqua Lung, Mares the majority if not all of their first stages are Diaphragm. The only exception is Scubapro who indeed mostly make piston based first stages, which stands to reason as they have always been the biggest in that area as far as I know. Of course things may be different on your side of the big pond and I have to admit that I have no insight in the other brands that are out there but these are the major brands in Europe. Apart from that, I do agree that in the end it doesn't make a lot of difference, they only have to do 1 thing and do it well. Most important thing is that the first and second stage combined make an easy to breathe fit for your purpose system.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

It's hard to know for sure which style is most common. I suppose one could look at all the different brands and add them up but to what benefit. As you say, they both do a good job. Sherwood (big in North America), Genesis and Atomic only have pistons. Cressi, Oceanic, Scubapro, Hollis, Beauchat and even Mares offer both piston and diaphragm. Aqualung has has pistons in the past. Originally the piston was favored because it was cheaper but now it has become technically equal in all respects to the diaphragm. It is not possible to detect any difference between them with respect to breathing characteristics. It's often a choice based on what your LDS or your dive buddies or your instructor favors. Take care. Alec

Thank you for the information. It’s very useful. How about balanced vs unbalanced?

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

2 жыл бұрын

Easy, watch S09E22 Balanced Regulators - Why/How?

@dazzasaussieadventures2896

2 жыл бұрын

@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter Thanks once again for the other video that you showed me. In that video, you mentioned a diaphragm (as opposed to a piston) in both cases (balanced and unbalanced). That leads me to another question: do piston regulators also come in two varieties, balanced and unbalanced?

Hi Alec, I need your opinion if you be so kind. I am looking at snorkeling in 12-15 ft depths, I plan on using a long flexible tube to breath with but am wondering if there is such a low pressure diaphragm mouth regulator i could use so that i can release my oxygen waste instead of recycling when breathing. Can you suggest such a mouth piece that may do the job? Any input will be greatly appreciated. Many thanks for posting your videos keep them coming!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

Sorry to rain on your parade but it simply won't work. One can not breath underwater through a tube that is longer than about 18". When I was actively teaching, I'd illustrate this principle by getting the biggest guy in the class to lie on his back in the shallow end of the pool and try to breathe through a tube. I'd stand on his chest which was about 2' down. It was great fun and a dramatic display to watch him struggle to take a breath and then struggle to get to the surface. Sometimes I suggested that he use the pool vacuum hose which is about 3" in diameter. That sure looked easier . NOPE!! Take a scuba diving course. You'll love it. Alec

Hi I enjoy your videos , very informative . Do you have any suggestions on getting certified as a repair tech . Thank you.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

4 жыл бұрын

Suggest starting with a certification from a manufacturer, ie Sherwood/Apexs etc., to see if you really want to invest the time and money into it as a hobby or full time. Visit your local dive shop and ask them about equipment courses or ask to watch your regulator be serviced. If they know your thinking of becoming a service tech technician, they may let you watch or help find a course to get started. Be careful of over investing time and money if it won't pay you back or is too stressful. Hope this gets you started Frank. Alec

Does one or the other work better at depth. I have a Dacor viper tec just rebuilt diaphragm reg and years ago when it was new I dove to 80ft and remembered how hard it became to breathe. I've had it rebuild before parts are gone by Brian at Lake Hickory Scuba but could never get an answer why it was so hard to breathe at depth past 60ft. At first he thought it was a piston and that's why but it's a diaphragm. 2nd stage is dacor viper tec as well. Any thoughts?

@michaelchristenbury552

4 жыл бұрын

The question is was it a balanced or unbalanced diaphragm? Balanced should breathe almost the same at a reasonable depth, wether it is piston or diaphragm, if it is unbalanced the work of breathing will increase the deeper that you go. It should not be that bad at 80 feet, it sounds like it was not properly adjusted.

Thanks for the video. I didn't know! Always assumed piston were the old school first stage, and that in order to get a balanced regulator (as easy to breath at depth or when running low on pressure) you needed a diaphragm first stage (what I have now) ? When I started diving in the late 70s you could tell you were running low on pressure well before as it became harder to breath, same at greater depth. Is it possible to avoid that with a simple spring+piston ? the spring tension is fix, so as the air pressure goes down you get less air flow wouldn't you ? also environmental seal with diaphragm, wouldn't you get less corrosion as you don't have salt water enter the spring chamber ?

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

In theory you can detect low air pressure from the increased breathing effort in any standard (unbalanced) regulator whether diaphragm or piston (maybe a bit more with piston for technical reasons that would require an entire new website to discuss adequately). However, either I'm not very sensitive (as all my wives have claimed) or I was always so in to the diving that I failed to notice, I've never really noticed such a change. Corrosion is an issue both without and with anti-freeze kit (sometimes called erroneously and All Environment Kit (AER for DACOR in the 70's). It can be even worse with a kit installed if it's not checked regularly. See my reply to wbatten1 below. However, in theory again, it's should be less of a problem with a kit installed. Thanks again Alain. Alec

@alaind831

6 жыл бұрын

Alec, with water entering the spring and piston chamber wouldn't a simple piston design corrode much easier than one that uses a rubber diaphragm to push a piston instead ? even in your video you see your spring and rode quite corroded (didn't slide or separate out easily). Does it mean a diaphragm reg doesn't need anywhere near the same amount of servicing, even if more pricey ? reminds me of my BMW requiring oil change every 15k miles vs my Acura every 5-6k. Cost more (synthetic, more quarts, etc..) but much rather do it myself less often :)

Hi Alec, I’ve been seeing the term “flow by piston” a lot on entry level/rental regulators. What does that mean? And how does it compared to other piston regulator used by high end models made by scubapro or atomic?

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

If it has a piston, it is a 'piston' first stage. They can add any other words they want but they ALL work on the same principle. Note that 'flow by piston' means the air flows by the piston, which is how its supposed to work. Like saying "gas in a car", it better go in the car, get my point? Thanks for watching.

Hi Alec, At about 330 ft underwater the water pressure is 150 psi. So I am assuming that deeper than this a first stage that delivers 150 psi will no longer work. Do divers who go deeper than this have to adjust their first stage to supply higher pressure? Or does the first stage supply 150 psi relative to the ambient? Thanks! Mike

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Exactly Mike. The first stage provides air at 150psi ABOVE AMBIENT! That's why all regulators have a hole or holes in the main body to allow water to enter and act upon either the piston or the diaphragm. The regulator is set to 150 and any water pressure is added to that. Regardless of your depth (pressure), the first stage provides air at 150psi above that pressure. Hence it works perfectly at any depth. In theory your regulator would work perfectly well during a dive on the Titanic - roughly 2 miles down. That's good to know because you'd have other concerns to address if you were down there! You don't need your reg screwing up! Take care. Alec

@martinbachmann6283

5 жыл бұрын

Alec, if you ever decide to get a group together to go dive the Titanic, can I be invited along please?

Alec, I need help picking a regulator, so far I know I need DIN because of HP tank and it has to be for cold water use, my previous first regulator was Tusa rs360, yoke. I bought it brand new about 8 years ago. I was looking for Tusa rs790 but its diaghram, I want something more simple, like the piston style. Then I start checking out Scubapro mk25, someone said its oring central, and that I dont remember what part but something is cracked internally from factory sometimes. Then I started to look at Atomic M1 or B2, m1 shows that it's freeze protection standard and B2 is optional on comparison chart. I also like the idea of servicing every 2years or 300dives. Thank you.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

The Scubapro MK25 has been around for a very long time. I think you'll find it's one of the most reliable regs on the market. It too has a 2 year service period but you may be able to get free parts and that's worth looking at. The Atomic is quite good too but service is not so widely available and parts are not cheap. Alec

@b13nissan

6 жыл бұрын

Alec Peirce Scuba thank you reply, I ended up getting brand new Hollis DC2/212 DIN for $209 shipped. I was looking at Used atomic m1 and scubapro mk25 and it should have cost me around $350-400, plus around $100 for service. I will be eyes M1 or mk25 for future most likely but they are not cheep. I asked one shop about Abyss pr MK25, they said hands down mk25.

Hey Alec.. can you tell me how to know if a 1st stage regulator .. like a Dacor 460 is a plunger or diaphragm regulator? I looked in the LP ports, all I see in the 460 is a small shaft that makes me think it's a diaphragm. My other regulator, had a thick spring when I looked in the ports. I'm not sure but it may be a sherwood that I traded something for and never needed it till last month when I bought new 2nd stages for both of my regulators.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

If plunger means piston, then the Dacor 460 is a piston model. First year of manufacture was 1989 and still a easy to use reg. Watch this video to see how to identify piston vs diagram regs S09E22 by sight. Dacor models 300, 350 and 360 are diaphragm's and 460, 600 and 760 are piston. Finally the 900, 950 and 960 are diaphragm's.

@hearsejr

3 жыл бұрын

@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter kewl thanks. I believe as soon as I get some new hoses or a set of adaptors, that this will be my primary dive regulator. The other two will become back up or the "loaner regulators". lol. Sorry about plunger thing. I typed "piston" but for some unknown reason spell check kept changing it to "plunger"!

love the videos. I am curious, I know the purpose of a balanced first stage, but how does it work exactly? are there different parts in a balanced first stage than in an unbalanced?

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Surprisingly, a balanced piston regulator is almost indistinguishable from a standard (non-balanced) regulator. Particularly in a piston regulator, it's the easiest thing in the world to balance it and doesn't even require any additional parts. In fact, there's 1 less part!!! BTW, NO! You can't do it yourself! Balancing a regulator is a mysterious concept that baffles most non-technical people - and I'm NOT referring to technical meaning technical divers. I mean technical as in a mechanical engineer. Scuba manufacturers and scuba store staff use this mystery to their advantage when selling gear and will tout the advantages of a balanced regulator to upsell a diver knowing that the diver probably has less understanding than themselves! I'm not saying that a balanced regulator is not worthwhile. I AM saying that it is not necessary for most divers despite most scuba store staff leaving you with the impression that you are playing with your life if you don't buy a balanced regulator. I'm going to make a video on Balanced vs Non-Balanced regulators to show how it works but I can give you a quick, easy description. Picture a tin can, maybe a soup can, that has a small hole in one end only. Into that hole insert a rod that is a tight fit, tight enough to seal a bit but not so tight that it won't slide in and out. You can fairly easily slide the rod into the can and pull it out of the can. Now if you increase the air pressure inside the can, it will tend to push the rod out of the can. Now it's much easier to pull the rod out of the can and much harder to push it back into the can. You will see the same affect in reverse if you increase the air pressure outside the can (or decrease the pressure inside). The rod is easy to push into the can and harder to pull out. That's how pressure changes affect a non-balanced regulator. Now punch a hole in both ends of the can and put the rod right through the can so that it sticks out on each end. The rod will slide back and forth through the can fairly easily again. And, magically, if you increase or decrease the pressure inside the can, it has no affect on the effort needed to move the rod! In a balanced regulator, the piston (in this case) will move as designed with no change in effort regardless of pressure changes inside or out. I hope this is clear and helps your understanding. Watch for my video - "Balanced Reg or Unbalanced - What's the Diff?" Take care. Alec

@12skullleader

6 жыл бұрын

Thanks much sir. I’m Tim from Knoxville TN, btw. Again love the vids

@alaind831

6 жыл бұрын

better explanation than the video which mentions the feature and benefit but not how it works...

Hi Alec, greetings from Norway.. Thanks for a excellent video. I was wondering if there is a difference between piston and diaphragm 1st stages when it comes to freezing and salt water intake. Here in Norway the temperature most often during the winter drops down to 35 degrees and below, which make the 1st stage prone to freezing. My APEKS not so much and there are several other more protected against it, but is there any difference between a piston and diaphragm? And again what if water comes in, lets say to forget to close the lid after a dive and soak it in to water, which is better to service? Logic tells me it is the one with the fewer parts.. Anyway, thanks to you and Kevin for yet another excellent video, keep em coming.. PS.. You already did a video about adjusting the 2nd stage, but I would rather know why a 2nd stage makes noise, kinda like a snoring sound when you breath in.. I suspect the venturi valve (is that what it's called?) making such noise, but kinda feel it does not make any difference moving it, it only free flows easier in water.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Jeez Tom - one question at a time OK?? 1. Certainly the piston is easier to service. Every serviceman would agree. It's also easier to tune (most cannot be "tuned") and it's cheaper too. 2. Which is better in cold water? That's a debate that has and will rage forever. You need to know that a regulator really doesn't freeze. It's made of brass, stainless steel and plastic - none of which freeze. They're already solids. What 'freezes' is the water in the air in the regulator. As the reg is used in cold water it gets very cold, much colder than the surrounding water. That's partly because of the cold water and also because of the adiabatic (look it up) temperature drop resulting from the pressure change within the reg. When the temperature reaches the dew point of the air (the temperature at which the water in the air condenses) water freezes on the high pressure seat of the first stage and prevents proper closure of the seat. The reg free flows. Of course the increased air flow from the free flow exacerbates the temperature drop, more water freezes, more ice builds up, the seal won't close at all and you have a major free flow which we interpret as a freeze-up. This process is the same in any regulator, piston or diaphragm. Keeping water out of the body of the reg by using an 'Anti-Freeze kit' or any other of the dozen methods sold as cold water prevention is a fine idea but since that is not what causes a freeze-up, they are largely a cosmetic or marketing thing. The regulators with the best reputation for good performance in cold water are the Poseidon Cyklon 300 (no longer available new), the Sherwood Blizzard, the Sherwood SR2 and the Scubapro MK25 (with the S600 second). 3 of these are piston style and none use any special anti-freeze system. Lots of others are good too but, regardless of what any diver will say, no reg is freeze-up free. That is, every regulator will freeze under the right conditions - yes guys, even double hose regs will freeze. I speak from experience on that! Preventing a freeze-up is a combination of actions that the diver can take (or not). a. Keep the regulator warm right up until your enter the water. If the 1st stage is warm it takes longer for it to cool in the water and that will delay the likelihood of freezing. b. Be sure the air is as dry as possible. Air standards require a dew point of -65 degrees fahrenheit. A good dive shop will give air with a dew point of -90 to -100 degrees fahrenheit. c. Don't allow any air to pass through the reg until you are under the surface. Don't test your reg on the surface. You should have done that before in a warm place. Don't breathe through it or blow up your BC or Dry Suit until you are down. As soon as air passes through the reg the temperature drops rapidly due to the adiabatic effect. When ice diving, I keep my tank and reg system in my hot car until ready to jump in. The I put it on, slip into the water, take a big breath from the air, put the reg in my mouth and drop down as quickly as possible. The first time I breathe underwater it's an exhalation and I'm down 10'. Realize that the water is warmer than the air and higher than freezing temperature. d. Try to breathe slowly and steadily underwater - no sudden big inhales or long blasts on the LP hose. e. Don't use your Safe Second (if possible). that's almost a guaranteed way to freeze up a reg. 3. Your reg is very sensitive. When you inhale it tries to give you lots of air but you don't want lots, so it has to stop delivering air, but you're still inhaling so it opens wide again, but it's too much air again so it has to stop, but you're still inhaling so it has to open again and this process continues accompanied by a farting sound from the rubber diaphragm as the reg opens and closes while trying to decide how much air you want. If you take a sudden big breath, there is no burping sound. This only occurs on the surface. Water muffles and it also softens the opening and closing underwater. You're reg is doing its job. Whew! Can I rest now? I'm old Tom.! Hope this helps or at least gives you something to think about. Take care. Alec

@TomKnudsen

6 жыл бұрын

Dear Alec, and you wonder why a package arrived for xmas. You rock!! I will however apply the geriatric approach next time with one question he he, but you inspire me to ask question so... Old? Not at all, think you still look young to this day. Also couldn't guess your age if I tried. Send my greetings to Kevin and your better half (also nice kill btw, you can add to that too). Thank you for this long and excellent well informed answer, learned a lot and also helped for sure! Take care! - Tom

@jacquespoirier9071

5 жыл бұрын

to me this not the construction principe that dictates the capacity to resist freezing, it is the capacity to transfer heat from the environment to the pressure change area of the first stage, with a so abrupt pressure change, it is sure that the temperature of the decompressed air drops well below the freezing point so any trace of humidity will freeze even in summer, when the water temperature is high, say 50 degrees and over, the surrounding water gives sufficient heat to the first stage body to prevent the accumulation of ice, when the temperature of the surrounding water goes near the freezing point, the heat transfert is greatly reduced so the ice can accumulate at the decompression point and this impairs the seating of the high pressure seat. I 've saw an industrial application where a fast cycling pneumatic cylinder was freezing in the mid summer temperatures even if the pneumatic system was equipped wiyh a refrigerated air dryer, the solution we chose was to install a 250 watts heater on the cylinder cap to prevent that.

Alec, Thank you so much for you awesome vids! I recently purchased an Atomic B2 regulator. Two questions for you: 1) It comes from the factory with the secondary hose already attached to the "in line" LP. I've read that this provides the "optimal" air flow? Should I leave it where it is or place it in a more traditional configuration and If I did change the location would I lose air flow. Additionally, I'm assuming in the current configuration that the second stage hose should be facing down? 2) Your opinion on the B2 regulator. I'm new diver and my biggest desire in a regulator is the ease of breathing. I'm still a little nervous when I'm diving and seem to be taking BIG breaths. Although, I understand that with time in the water will come more confidence and ease of breathing. But, in the mean time... This specific regulator has received some excellent reviews regarding breath ability. Beside your opinion on the B2, could you recommend a few regulators. Thanks in advance.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

The Atomic B2 is an excellent regulator. Relax. It is NOT all that unique. Atomic has done a wonderful job on their website and literature to explain how their regulators are the best of the best. In fact, they are among the best. But, everything they claim to be unique and special is actually quite common among all top end regulators. They have been particularly good at making up names for the "special" features. Other companies have not done that but they have the same features. This is not a knock against Atomic. It's just trying to point out the difference between marketing and production. You can put the LP hoses to your primary or secondary second stage, or the BCD inflator for that matter, into any LP port you choose. They all work equally well. Whether a hose points up or down does not affect performance. You should choose the configuration that works for you and is also recognized by other divers so they can assist you or you can assist them without having to check the instructions. As you get more experience you will begin to relax and your breathing will become more normal. With time you won't ever notice your breathing. On 2 separate occasions while scuba diving I fell asleep underwater. To say I was relaxed would be an understatement. It was only a problem on 1 occasion - the reg fell out of my mouth!! Take care. Enjoy yourself. Don't get too caught up in the technical aspects. Alec

@justinmartinez9730

6 жыл бұрын

Alec, Thank you for such a quick response. I truly value your opinion over other people. You present facts and let the consumer decide what fits their needs. It can be overwhelming walking into a SCUBA shop and trying to decide what to buy. They all have their biases towards certain gear and tend to only promote what is best for them, not the consumer. Thanks again. Have great Memorial Day weekend.

a bit off the subject but I noticed one regulator was stainless steel shiny chrome and one was satin brushed chrome(a bit duller) which is less likely to get scratched, dinged nicked etc easier? which will look newer longer? Ive got a chrome one and only 15 dives seems like its staring not to look new anymore . (maybe boat guys in Philippines a little rough on it) My next purchase will take it into consideration. is ti same brass under both?

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

4 жыл бұрын

The body is always brass. Chrome looks nice when new but it definitely scratches quickly and loses it's luster. That's one reason that I'm a fan of the newer Cycolac (plastic) bodies. They have a lot of advantages. Alec

@joejeans7913

4 жыл бұрын

@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter Ahhh interesting, definitely will take a look, considering one for my next purchase then. Im sure it would be A lot lighter. THUMBS UP !

@pheehzero

4 жыл бұрын

@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter I don't think you'd recommend plastic for cave diving?

@pheehzero

4 жыл бұрын

Alec, you neglected to respond to anything I said?

Hi Alec, nice video (as always). However, as you said, you hit a controversial topic. I felt you didn't explain the pro's and con's of both pistons and diaphragm 1st stages. I'd really appreciate a second tech tips on this topic, with more details.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

As I hinted, both work well. Neither has a big advantage and certainly not in performance. I may do another tip though to share a couple more points that I left out. Thanks for watching. Alec

Alec - I have the Diaphragm model that you showed in this video (Zeagle Envoy). I have had it for about 2.5 years and have 117 dives on it. Zeagle calls for it to be inspected annually, but does not have a schedule for a rebuild. What are your thoughts on when this regulator should be rebuilt?

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

Well, 117 dives is a lot! If you've not had it serviced, now's the time. Generally it's suggested that a reg system should be serviced every year or 25 dives. Most reg manufacturers are now suggesting every 2 years. The problem is that there are many factors other than time and/or number of dives. For example, if all your diving is in fresh water, every 50 dives is a good number to use. If you carefully rinse your regulator after every dive, dry it and store it sealed in a ZipLoc, maybe every 75 dives would do. At the opposite end are regs that are used daily (rentals or training) and are not cared for well. We used to check our training or rental regs every week and probably 1/2 of them required some service. Now comes the question of service versus rebuild. Quite frankly, while some dive shops will rebuild a regulator at every service (Why not? They make a lot more money!), a rebuild is necessary only if the reg demonstrates signs that it is not functioning perfectly. If the IP climbs, if the breathing effort is high, if it freeflows, if it looks abused and so on, the serviceman should rebuild the reg. It's tough to pin down the exact cause of some problems and they are often related to each other. Best to simply rebuild with a complete service kit than try to fix it by replacing 1 part or 2. So once the warranty period is over (if you even care about that), you need to make an informed decision as to when to take your reg for service and to tell the serviceman of any problems if they exist. Good luck. Alec

@rogerheuckeroth7456

5 жыл бұрын

Alec - Thanks for you advise. I take very good care of my equipment. Always rinse in fresh water. Most of it looks like brand new... on the outside at least. One more question: My regulator is a Zeagle. Do you think I should seek out a Zeagle dealer, or would any SCUBA Tech be able to competently do the job?. There is a local guy here in Myrtle Beach that caries mostly Aqualung. He said he can service any brand....

@user-ih4lk4di6q

10 күн бұрын

Alec, thanks for your answer. Even my reg was stored 25 years, it still looks like when I put it away, IP haven't changed and works perfect (in pools). Don't worry, befor I go diving in a lake again, I'll do a service 😊

hi, what do you think about the Atomic Aquatics T3 Regulator

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Atomics regs are well made and give great service. Be sure you have a good source of service for them. Take care. Alec

Hey alec, been diving for 2 years now and planing to get my own set of regulators and I’m looking at edge compact pro reason being it’s value for money Any opinions on it ? Appreciated sir

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

I don't make individual recommendations Jonathan as I'm not here to sell anything but to educate and entertain. For guidance, watch my video S05E09 $300 vs $800 regulators to see what the key differences are. It may help you decide what to buy based on your diving style not what looks nice. Thanks for watching.

You go into great detail it’s good I’m the guy that ask to many questions the reason why is i want to know when stuff goes bad what to do and not be that guy u read in the paper my flight instructors when doing pilots licence said u don’t need to know that I’m like yes I do think worse case

Is there any difference in operation if the ambient pressure is greater than the intermediate pressure?

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

In theory that can never happen. The regulator is always subject to ambient pressure and that pressure, regardless of its source or intensity, is added to the IP. Thus, if the ambient pressure at the surface is 15psi (1BAR) and the IP is set at 150psi (10BAR), at 33' (10m) where the ambient pressure is 30psi (2BAR), the IP is now 165psi (12BAR), and so on. If the ambient pressure is greater than the IP, the regulator is broken!! If you are thinking about what happens when the ambient pressure exceeds the IP such as at 330' (100m) where the ambient pressure is 150psi (10BAR), the IP would now be 300psi (20BAR). Take care. Alec

@robertbritton656

6 жыл бұрын

Alec Peirce Scuba Thanks very much. A nice clear and concise answer.

New workshop? You can build a new regulator with all of those spare parts on the wall!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Yep! I upgraded the old place - new benches, new test equipment and I brought the service parts closer to the bench where I need them. We service many different brands and they all have their own parts. It can get confusing. Looks good though huh? Alec

@seikibrian8641

6 жыл бұрын

I thought you sold Scuba 2000 and retired, and only came into the shop from time to time to do videos?

Balanced piston regulators vs piston regulators; can you explain the difference? I know balanced = good when tank pressure is lower

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

I may do another one about that since there are a lot of misunderstandings. I'm always shocked by the lack of knowledge among dive store staff and amazed at some of the explanations I hear. It's small wonder divers are confused. Thanks. Alec

It’s nice to watch your videos with the 0.75 x playback speed :)). I totally understand all with the normal speed as well, but as a foreigner sometimes it’s too tiring to focus your words for long periods 😁

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

4 жыл бұрын

Interesting! I do talk a little fast but thanks for watching.

@feddef

4 жыл бұрын

Alec Peirce Scuba thanks for the great videos! I’m a subscriber to your channel since long time back

For regular spearfishing weekly 4 to 5 times What kind of regulator is good Is good to be 2 hp output n 4 low pressure out put Piston or digraph Bal or un balnce Din or York or din adoptor buy separately Do bcd will play major role in spearfishing n how about dive computer to buy Please share ur wealthy knowledge for us so that i can make nice move before buying all diving stuff thanks alec If any things I miss please suggest me For me safety is first not price Which cylinders will be better 80 cubic feet or more

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

2 жыл бұрын

Lots of questions Caji so let me quickly start. First buy the best reg your can afford. Sounds silly but if you only have $300 then that is what you can buy. Check out my video S06E01. The rest of your questions depend on location really. If in North America, then its yoke, 80 cu/ft tank, otherwise its DIN and 12L. Remember its also the speargun and practice as scuba gear gets to near the fish, you have to spear it next. Good luck and thanks for watching.

@OnlyKaerius

Жыл бұрын

Din regulator and yoke adapter will let you dive any tanks, anywhere.

is it normal to hear a noise similar to "inflating a baloon" using an unbalanced piston first stage? (mares r2)

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

Generally and 'noise' coming from a 1st stage means service is needed. In piston regs when the O-rings are worn, high pressure air is leaking past the o-ring causing high pitched sounds like balloons. If this sound is not heard when new, then a service checkup may be needed Alberto.

@albertomosfetti3056

3 жыл бұрын

@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter thank you very much! I will make it check. By the way the noise is not high pitched.. it is like if you're inflating a "party" baloon, so basically an "air flowing" noise you could hear from your mouth to the baloon (I have no better comparison ahahah). This I a spare reg I have (very different from the reg I normally use which is scubapro mk10), and probably the noise was always there and I just didn't realize. Anyway Thanks a lot! Keep up your good work, as always!

Great video as usual. Alec one question. Your thoughts on the Cressi travel light patrol plz. I need a very light bcd.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

2 жыл бұрын

Cressi is fine but there are others. Key is to try it on as travel BC's are minimal everything to save weight; less clips, and pockets. Ask fellow divers their picks or try on several to see what fits well not what is just light.

Why not compare a Scubapro MK25 piston to an Apeks US4 diaphragm for complexity vs simplicity ?

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

The Scubapro MK25 has been around for many, many years. So long that it's become their most famous regulator. What's not remembered, or maybe not known, is that is has changed over the years. Most of the changes were to correct issues, some performance issues, some reliability issues and some maintenance issues. It is a very unusual design that employs a 2-piece piston (actually 3 piece but you cannot separate the stem from the head easily) and then they added a second piston head under the first so they could install 2 main O-Rings. Now a simple piston with 1 O-Ring has become a 2-3-piece piston with a second head and 2 O-Rings! In each case these changes were to improve reliability. For example, the second O-Ring was added because there was an issue with the single O-Ring blowing our. That was often caused by poor assembly procedure but it was a problem anyway and they solved it by adding parts. Then they added some buffers - sponge rings around the piston stem, at one time as many as 3, (I think it's back to one now) in an effort to stop noise coming from the first stage, either whistles or rattles. These were marketed as improvements but were actually necessary to address problems. The balance chamber on the MK25 is another interesting story. I think it now comprises about 5 parts (most pistons work well with 1 O-Ring). Then add their replaceable HP seat with its own O-Ring, adjusting screw, pad and threaded cap and you have a piston regulator that has as many parts as a diaphragm. However, it's a great regulator and I've used one a lot and sold hundreds. I've also serviced thousands but that's another whole story. They're not hard to service but they do require great care and lots of practice to do it properly. So now what you've done to me Bumble is take a very sophisticated (read:complicated) piston regulator and compared it to a very simple, straight forward diaphragm. To use your own words, that's an unfair comparison. However, even with that, a complete strip of both regs will show a similar number of parts. The US4 is described by Apeks as a "warm water reg, lightweight and light duty'. I'm not in complete agreement with that. Not having an environmental seal does not mean it's no good in cold water. It does mean that the diver has to exercise care in cold water as per my recent video on cold water diving. And in my books, having fewer parts does not mean it's less rugged - just the opposite. However, It really does not compare to the incredible performance of a MK25. It would be a favorable comparison to an Oceanic Sport reg and I mean in terms of sophistication (neither reg has much of that!!) and performance. Talk again soon. Alec

Please come open a dive shop in Indianapolis.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

4 жыл бұрын

Thanks K B but I have owned many, many dive shops in the USA, Caribbean and Canada over my 50 years in the business. I like retirement too much to start up in lovely Indianapolis. Alec

The question that wasn't answered is, if both kinds do the same job, why would a manufacturer choose one over the other? In my case, I didn't choose a diaphragm 1st stage, I chose a complete setup (Aqua~Lung Legend LX Supreme) based on the balance between price and features of the 2nd stage, and a diaphragm 1st stage is what came with it. I had no say in the matter.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

And that's normally the way it's done Brian. A diver would not normally go into a dive store and ask for a piston regulator. He would ask for a good regulator or a regulator system. The store would show him what's available, explain the differences and help him pick the best one for his diving needs and budget. And let me make it clear that it really doesn't matter which style one gets. They both work well. Aqualung has had several piston regulators over the years but the first ones were diaphragm and they sold them for a long time. I don't know if they have any pistons in their line right now but they are comfortable making and selling the diaphragm style so just haven't bothered to change. Most manufacturers offer both (Scubapro, Oceanic, Cressi, Mares, Hollis, etc) while some offer only pistons (Sherwood, Genesis, Atomic, etc). Only Aqualung and Apeks (same company) restrict their line to diaphragms. At the risk of irritating a lot of divers and dealers, a search of The Best Scuba Regulators often shows several sites that list the top regulators available today and those regs are #1 the Scubapro Mk25 and #2 the Sherwood SR2 both of which are piston style. I have used both, sold both to hundreds of divers and serviced hundreds of them. I can't argue with the their popularity. Talk again soon. Alec

The 1st stage is kind of like the reduction gearing on a turboprop engine.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

Uh. Yeah sure. It a way. The idea is the same but in practice it's much different of course. One is mechanical. The other is pneumatic. Thanks for watching. Alec

Thanks a lot :) Now, of course i prefer simplicity :)

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

Жыл бұрын

Glad it helped!

balanced first stage or not?! how deep do i need to go before there is a use of a balanced one? in meters. // Jony @ Sweden

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

You can dive to any safe depth with a standard (non-balanced) regulator with no problem. They work just fine. I've used them at 100' (30M) and more lots of times and the water is cold up here at that depth. When I started diving there were no balanced regs. As I mentioned in the vid, a balanced reg is not BETTER. It does give more consistent breathing and will supply larger volumes at deeper depths but they are no safer in a normal dive. Alec

@finnenjr

6 жыл бұрын

Tanx! Keep making your amazing videos, I've just started taking my Padi ow cert, and your tips help me to save money in the right places. //Jony @ Sweden

He is correct, 3 piece is cheaper then 12 pieces, unless it's made out of titanium or like metals.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Price isn't the only motivation, nor even the most important. Reliability and ease of service must be considered. Alec

Wow.... i usd diaphragm poseidon. I always thought that they are the simplest possible

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

The simplest reg made is the standard piston. It has 2 moving parts - the piston and the spring. Quite frankly, it will work without the spring so really has 1 moving part. Can't get much simpler than 1 moving part!! Take care. Alec

nice vid, but I do still prefer Diaphragm over piston, have you ever seen a Diaphragm reg first stage loosing air , me not, but I have seen a lot of piston 1st stages blowing from the piston O-ring, so simpler is better is arguable. If simpler was better, why are we not using two sticks to make fire instead of a Zippo lighter ?

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

2 sticks take too long!! Keep in mind that 2 sticks never breakdown - Zippos always. Actually, I have seen many diaphragm 1st stages leaking. However, properly maintained, neither style is more or less subject to breakdown. It's entirely a personal preference. My preference for pistons may be influenced by the servicing of thousands of regs over many years - not because it's a better performer. This video is not to change your mind but to make you think. Apparently, it worked in that respect. Thanks for watching Theo. Alec

What would you recommend a balanced piston or balanced diafragm?? For the 1st stage

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

Sorry Tomas it is not my place to recommend specific gear to individuals but to give information and options for divers to pick what works for their dive profiles and budget. If you watched this video then buy the best you can as you will keep it longer that something that is just cheaper.

Which one malfunction more

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

4 жыл бұрын

There's no real evidence available to answer that question Curtis. Both are incredibly reliable. Given the rugged parts and simplicity of design, I would guess the piston might have a slight edge in reliability but I have nothing to base that on other than my mechanical experience. Alec

@pheehzero

4 жыл бұрын

Think simply, a diaphragm flexes and a piston literally moves with 2 O-rings that require silicone lubricant! Diaphragms will work indefinitely and without maintenance. You CAN blow one out...but you'd have to back-off the adjustment with pressure on it!

We have a saying in the military, "keep it simple, stupid."

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

2 жыл бұрын

That works in many daily life situations too. A

but diaphragm regulator is better for cold water especially if it is environmental sealed.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

Жыл бұрын

Not really better, just different. The piston has 2 moving parts, the piston and spring while diaphragms have more. Cold water does not tough either system to its a preference on which style you like. A

can you do a comparison between a piston and diaphragm 1st stage after 100 dive in salt and chlorinated pool dive it will clearly show how dirty the inside of the piston regulator is specially if it was not wash properly

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

Yep. If you don't rinse your regulator, piston or diaphragm after use, it will get dirty. So that's why you do that. In both designs, water must enter the ambient chamber to press against the piston bottom or the diaphragm spring. They both need rinsing. BTW, it's much easier to rinse a piston reg than try to get any salt water or pool water out of a diaphragm regulator. I've seen some regs with the spring and diaphragm pad so crusted up I wondered how they delivered air. Both designs have merits but in your comparison, no rinsing, both will suffer. I have done a comparison between both designs. Look back at my older videos. Take care. Alec

@3DJunkieDude

4 жыл бұрын

@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter One of my regs is a Poseidon Jetstream which I don't think uses either. I guess the servo pilot valve would be most like a piston, but that's above my pay grade to know. In any event, I use a rubber cap filled with cheap vodka on the first stage to keep it environmentally sealed. I've never had a problem with environmental contamination in my Jetstream 1st stage, but it does mean I have to have it serviced at least once a year to make sure the vodka is still there. Good information. I also have an old Sherwood Magnum Blizzard reg (first and second stages), but am looking at upgrading to a newer second stage, and your video answered an important question for me. It seems not to matter which second stage is used on any given first stage (Poseidon probably the exception), so I could get a new Oceanic Delta 5 and pair it with my Sherwood first stage. I already have a Cressi octopus on that reg. Thanks again for the great videos!

Hahahahahahahahaha poor Kevin!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

Totally agree and Kevin reads all the comments too!

Don’t u mean piston regulator for the second one

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

4 жыл бұрын

Probably. These are completely unscripted. Sometime my brain can't keep up with my mouth. Thanks for watching. Alec

I agree until you talk about a balanced piston regulator. They are complicated with many parts.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

Only a little more complicated. Watch S08E14 How A Piston Regulator works for some insight. Thanks for watching mate.

@scubaphoto88000

3 жыл бұрын

I was talking about the Scubapro MK25

We called them: balanced first stage and unbalanced first stage. Some show the difference if the divers dive deep and breath heavily.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

3 жыл бұрын

There are a several factors in play before a diver really notices harder breathing with an unbalanced: depth, inhalation force, is a venturi assist on the 2nd stage, diver fitness, tank pressure. I dove unbalance 1st and 2nd stages for many years, could not afford balanced ones, and when I did convert over, did not notice much. It's not like going from standard definition TV to 4K, but some may notice it late in a dive.

@tinggiling

2 жыл бұрын

@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter was wondering as well when people say it good to have balanced regulator (trying a few balanced and overbalanced).. still dont think worth to have it tho. since the unbalanced just do the same. But of course if does feeel surreal to breath in with those balanced regulator (where u can inhale all the air by adjusting the knob of venturi (VIVA) to reduce flow resistance.

Less moving parts, less to break and wear out. Just like a Glock pistol.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

4 жыл бұрын

Ok. The principle is sound. Alec

Piston reg just as with a double hose reg! Simpler is btr! Fact!

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

6 жыл бұрын

Too often the "Newer, Better, Improved" version is simpler more complicated. Manufacturers will add features that are of no benefit whatsoever other than to increase sales to unsuspecting divers. This doesn't just apply to scuba gear of course. Think about automobiles which change every year for no good reason so that your new car from last year is now obsolete. What an incredibly stupid system. Or cell phones. Is the S8 really better than the S7? Thanks for watching. Alec

@schmedlywhiplash6267

5 жыл бұрын

Alec Peirce Scuba Ya Alex all the phones are the same! Fact! And all this new scuba gear is ridiculous! And I will stick w/ 91 f150 Lariat XLT.😀

Piston for me keep it simple

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

4 жыл бұрын

The piston is well-known for rugged reliability. I'm with you - reliability is job one!! Many divers tout ease of breathing but I want air every time I breathe. Alec

if piston is better than diaphragm why did the scubapro people make the mk11 and mk 17 for the longest time they are the one insisting that piston are better than diaphragm

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

5 жыл бұрын

The Scubapro Mark 25 is regarded as one of the best regulators of all time - a piston. Scubapro, since you picked it, has had many more piston regs in their line up than diaphragms. Their MK 11 and Mk 17 are both fine regs but not nearly so popular as the 25. I suppose the answer to your question is that every company wants to please every customer. Some divers want to buy a diaphragm regulator so Scubapro feels compelled to have one or two in their lineup. Sherwood, a major brand name for many, many years, has never offered a diaphragm reg. Their reputation was built on rugged reliability and easy maintenance. US Divers (Aqualung) like Scubapro, has both in their reg line. They tend to lean toward diaphragm regs at the moment but have had several quite famous pistons over the years - the Calypso, the Aquarius, etc. I don't think I've said that a piston reg is 'better'. I favor a piston reg because of its reliability, simplicity, cost and ease of service. Both designs do the same job. The choice, other than the factors I've mentioned, is really personal. If one was not as good or as safe as the other, it would be gone. Take care. Alec

Alec, you missed a few major drawbacks of the piston 1st stage...it requires more maintenance, as in, lube the piston O-rings. The diaphragm does move but it's only a small flex...simpler. Pistons can get contaminated with grit easier. It isn't as adjustable as a diaphragm 1st stage. It's easier to adjust a diaphragm if you don't have an externally adjustable 2nd stage. I think you lost your footing to the basics in air delivery.

what about environmental sealing? piston regulators are rarely sealed, which means salt water gets in and it's much harder to clean, so "everything else being equal" that piston regulator will give out a lot sooner than the diaphragm one. a dive table is also a lot simpler than a dive computer, but I don't see too many people diving with them. if you get them both serviced according to the manufacturer's spec, then both should last about the same (a very long time), I don't think one is "better" than the other, just because it's simpler.

@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter

Жыл бұрын

A piston is a very simple mechanism that also means cheaper service (less parts & time) an can have an environmental seal to minimize outside water goop. For a new diver on a limited budget, a balance piston is a good starting reg until they decide to move up. Thanks for the feedback my friend. A

@UNgineering

Жыл бұрын

@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter thanks. keep the videos coming, you have good content