Organising a Novel Is a Nightmare
After a couple of years writing only short fiction, I'm back to writing novels.
This is a different type of writing video than I normally make, but I'm trying something new because things feel...different.
I've got big plans for this new novel project and in this video I talk a bit about that and how it's going so far.
The start of any novel is one of the hardest parts of writing it, so there are lots of little problems to contend with already.
I'll keep you updated as the project moves along, win lose or draw.
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I'm currently in the trenches with the third draft (first full re-write) of my first novel. I've amassed about 350k words of content and am looking to strip some of it away while growing the essential sections. If I'd be bold enough to give any advice, it would be to focus on what you focused on with your shorter work: character. Write characters you enjoy writing; write characters who, as the author of their journey, you care about. Write characters who make you laugh. If you come to the desk wanting to develop your characters, wanting to see what your characters will do next, you will find more joy in the process of finding their story. In my experience, the plotlines and themes all merge and begin to make sense in subsequent drafts. I'm amazed by how what felt like loose ends or seemingly random bits of information ended up connecting and making for a much richer story. Another blurb about characters: you talk about wanting to create a story that will immerse your reader, but characters are what will immerse you, the writer, in the writing process, and keep you going when the plot feels stale. Anyway, don't get discouraged by the discouraging moments. Writing is hard. There would be far more novelists if it weren't. Best.
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
Wow, 350k and your third draft is incredible! Your advice about following character I'm definitely going to follow. You're absolutely right on that, it's incredibly important. I'm hoping I can do a good job with it. This is the first time I've had a real cast of characters, and they've all felt significantly different to me from the outset, so I'm taking that as a good sign. Just got to keep unconvering more about who they are. Thanks for your thoughts, definitely the kind of advice that can set a writer back on course, I appreciate it!
@gamewriteeye769
Жыл бұрын
That's tough; I wrote a zero draft that could've, by estimation, reach that word count, although they were mostly skeleton scenes with minimal narration, focusing on dialogue, character thoughts, and action (lacking description). My suggestion would be (from my experience) with each subsequent draft, focus on developing plot point scenes that truly matter to the characters (and, by extension, their voice). While I pantsed my way through several drafts already (5), none were able to reach completion because scenes lack structure due to writing what I'd call habitual “inconcise writing”, lacking clarity. If you discovery write, you're bound to run into these structural problems, and my best suggestion to you, would be to return to the drawing board, list plot points, and start outlining what you have. Use Save The Cat or The Three Act Story Structure to place “key tent poles scenes” that point a general backbone to your novel, so you don't meander (exposition, info dumps, long stretches of introspection), and end up leading breadcrumb trails of plot points (they don't go anywhere). Use “focal points” of a scene to draw the narrative focus in. The key is to trim and have all elements interweave as a scene plays out uniformly together. At the very least, discovery writing identified key character traits.
My go-to organization method is FigJam! It's not for writing strictly, it's just a whiteboarding tool that basically functions as a digital version of a corkboard. It's free and lets me have that disorganized google doc laid out visually with images and diagrams inserted in wherever I want.
@KierenWestwoodWriting
Жыл бұрын
That sounds really useful, I'm going to check it out. Thank you for pointing it out!
This is me all the way! So many storylines, a complex world that borderlines the real world but in a different Era, and little plotting because I write best in the moment. I have been getting complaints from beta readers because my story world isn't clear enough even though I know what I mean for it to be.
I have had that problem where I'm not sure where my book will fit, but I generally find a spot somewhere and hope for the best! Good luck with getting back to novels!
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
That's what I'm going to try and do to! I'd rather write in to be a bit of a misfit than change it into something I don't like as much 😊 Thanks Joey, feels good to be back to it.
Novel Factory is a pretty good software solution. They have character sheets, Location sheets, count words and tell you how many words you need to write each day to hit your projected goal and it udpates as you go. To the best of my knowledge there is only a web version now as they scrubbed the desktop version.
Love your approach to writing man. Rooting for you and this project 💪
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you so much! 😊
I wrote first drafts of two novels but then realized I'm better at short stories. No more novels for me..Re-writing short story drafts is challenging enough.:)
What's interesting to me looking back on this video is we've started our novels around the same time; how's yours going, Kieran? If you're interested in exchanging advice, chatting, working together, whichever you're comfortable with really, do let me know. Currently I'm on a 6th draft and applying scene structure to a lot of the skeleton scenes I wrote, having finished writing most of the background information and thought process in regards to the plot and characters, while still leaving room for the writing to change in/of itself. I've taken the holidays to look back on things, reflect on what I might do going into next year, where things may go, and I thought I'd just share I understand these struggles you go through as a writer, the goals you want to get out of your writing output; its hard, and I want you to know that you shouldn't overdo it, alright? What I mean by that is don't push yourself to commit to a specific writing routine if it negatively impacts say, your health. Take things one step at a time and you'll learn to figure out your best method when it comes to the input of your writing.
Write what you feel. Don't worry about genre, plots, rules etc and see in the end. I think why we get bored with our writing is because we comb over constantly. My opinion. If you like, try this. I become a journalist in my stories. I write what I see, hear, smell, touch and feel. Break the rules, experience the journey. That's a story. I'm part of it.
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
Absolutely. I'm with you on that. I'm at the stage where I'm enjoying telling myself this story and I don't want that to change. If I can sustain that feeling the entire way through, I think I'll have something well worth keeping at the end. Write what you feel is some of the best writing advice there is, thank you 😊
@clintoreilly
2 жыл бұрын
You got this. As it sounds like writing's in your blood. So you can't ignore it. Cheers
@gamewriteeye769
Жыл бұрын
So, pretty much how I'd approach the starting process. However, you should really be writing the story **you** want to tell first. Then second. Then third. Then fourth. There's no right or wrong answer, but the way you feel about your novel(s) will change overtime as you find the writing process quite the discipline. It's not about writing what you feel, it's actually writing about what you want to share. What you feel will end up being trimmed down to a bare minimum, anyway (even if I'm guilty myself of long, immersive descriptions in real time of a scene). But those parts won't service a completed story in the end, unless you're willing to axe the wood in your story.
Hi Kieren, Great video! I really enjoyed this one. I like the combination of videos between writing tips and your own findings. No VANS Cap? There's a glitch in the Matrix!
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks! Haha yeah, I'm purposefully not wearing them until Vans sponsor me! (not really).
Have a look at papyrus author writing software. I wrote my first novel using scrivener and it worked okay. Papyrus author has better features and interface. I like the thinkboard part of it for planning a story out. Enjoy your videos, keep up the good work.
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Steve, I'll take a look, it's another one I somehow haven't heard of! My requirements for writing short fiction and novels are a lot different, I'm discovering.
Kieren! Hey man, good vid
Hi Kieren, thank you for your honesty and candor. I too try and write stories/books that would excite me to read. I don't think that's too ambitious, I think it is courageous. Keep it moving. You've got this! -Josh Columbus, USA
@KierenWestwoodWriting
Жыл бұрын
Thanks Josh! Likewise and I wish you all the best for your writing as well 🙂
I didn't realize how much I needed this until I watched it 😍. Great job. I'm probably partial but I do love your tips more 🤣 but I'll watch whatever you throw at me. ❤️
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you so much Brittany 😊 The tips certainly won't be going anywhere since I think I'm going to have to refresh myself/learn more as I'm writing this thing! I appreciate that so much though 😊
@jameskeretses5272
10 ай бұрын
😊😊😊😊😊
Here is prime example of the value of the writer’s ‘sock drawer’. Finish the manuscript - store in sock drawer for at least a month. Edit. Publish. Works more often than not if there is a spark of a story there. The story sleeps in the sock drawer while the brain percolates it over and over while you sleep and hohns it to perfection.
@KierenWestwoodWriting
Жыл бұрын
Great analogy, you’re absolutely right.
I can strogly relate to your curent situation as i am doing somthing familir and my approach to writing is also simaler. when working on the organizeation and tplotting my fav program to use is called campfire write, it could help you if ur looking for aprogram.
Love this Kieren, more videos like this please 🤝
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks mate, this one seems to have been well received so I'll definitely do more 😊 Thanks for sticking with me for over a year! 👊
I have this problem too. Sci-fi portal fantasy. Dragons, comet mermaids, and space ships. I have a ton of characters, though. I kind of want to write this as a set of companion novels. One for each character. I really like when TV shows give an in depth background for main characters and show all the little details that were hinted at but not explained, explicitly. But I don’t want to have to do that in the middle of the main action. So my solution: companion novels!
@KierenWestwoodWriting
Жыл бұрын
Definitely sounds like you've got plenty of material and ideas for multiple books!
@MagnetMagicGirl
Жыл бұрын
@@KierenWestwoodWriting literally soooo many books. I'm kinda daunted by the whole thing. Excited, but daunted.
How's it going, friend? P.S. I bought Gold Fury.
@KierenWestwoodWriting
9 ай бұрын
Thanks so much! I really appreciate it and I hope you enjoy it :)
Brilliant video, I’m actually trying a crime thriller novel. It started out as a short story but there’s a lot of questions to answer in this one. I think if you create more questions in each scene, you will eventually get to novel length. I see that focus lamp in the background, does it work for you?
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
Awesome mate, it's always good to feel a story growing into something even bigger! Since you've spent the time writing shorter stuff too, did that help you identify that the idea felt bigger and could be a novel? I think you're right on questions, they do give you something to write about and also keep a reader's interest I find. Always good to have that. I've got two of those lamps, that one and a bigger one on my desk. I don't honestly know if they have any influence on my state of mind really, I pretty much bought them because they're a softer light source and they look nice!
I just write bullet points ( sometimes using different colours or fonts depending on the story) then as I am writing the story and I have covered a bullet point I then delete the bullet point.
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
That sounds like a good system. Is that in your main manuscript document, underneath your story? Or do you have separate one for it?
@ADSmallAuthor
2 жыл бұрын
@@KierenWestwoodWriting The document starts of as just the bullet points as my loose plan. I will then start writing and deleting the bullet points as I go. Once I have finished the story the bullet points will have been deleted then. Sorry, yes it is all in one document.
Loved your video but two quite different thoughts struck me as I watched it. First: hard to imagine an agent who has difficulty in thinking about where they might push your work if you mention other authors and their work as being similar to yours. They may disagree with your assessment BUT that assessment tells them what publishers to approach. The other thought that struck me was about your approach to writing. What I heard was that you were thinking less about this first draft as simply a means to mine the raw material for your novel and more about writing what feels like a final draft. This may not be helpful in light of how you work but a first draft does not look like Michelangelo's David, it is the hunk of marble that needs first to be hewn and then observed to see where you can find the figure inside the stone and chisel out all the material that hides the sculpture. In other words, your first draft is going to weigh tons but will weigh 150 lbs when finished; will have all kinds of events many of which will be left on the cutting room floor long before the book will be sewn between hard covers, many characters that may be merged into fewer and minor characters that may succeed in taking over the tale. All that said - good luck. I am looking forward to hearing and reading more.
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
Hi Bernard, that's a really good point about making comparisons to other authors when querying. I've sort of done that before, but I've always felt like I was just naming authors I liked rathrr than ones my work was actually comparable to, so could be my error. It's definitely something I'll try to do again if I reach that stage and I already feel more confident about that aspect of this book. In terms of drafting, I haven't typically re-drafted multiple times in my past novels. I think that's because I've felt some of my books weren't fundamentally strong enough to merit the work it would take. That's definitely an area for development for me - my own outlook on what I've written and learning to accept imperfection and work on it. Writing more slowly, which I'm doing, I think will also help with this. I'm thinking more, instead of forging blindly ahead just so that I get something written. Thanks for sharing your thoughts, these kinds of comments are really valuable to me as I find my way with a novel again!
if you're still looking for software: try Obsidian I've used Scrivener before, but as soon as I got into Obsidian I ditched Scrivener
Im in the middle of a book, and then i watched your videos. i realized my book is a flop. Should i keep writing or start over on a new
@KierenWestwoodWriting
22 күн бұрын
Stick with it! Apply this stuff in editing if you want to, but keep going, you’ll be glad you did.
Aspects of your book sound similar to mine.
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
Sounds like we're both writing pretty great books then! 😆
I'm still not quite sure i want to write novels or not. But, i think i can write short stories better than anything. Still confused which genre suits me.. Fantasy, Supernatural, or Mystery thrillers. What do you think? @Kieren Westwood
@KierenWestwoodWriting
2 жыл бұрын
There's absolutely nothing wrong with writing short fiction and not novels. I've loved spending the last couple of years on it, and a lot of time before that too. Writing will always be at it's most fun and rewarding when you follow the stories that you're excited by, in my opinion. That goes for genre too. My advice (for whatever that's worth!) would be to write the story first and worry about what genre it is later. That's what I'm going to try to do anyway. Best of luck with your stories!