You'll find a playlist of my grammar reviews here: kzread.info/dash/bejne/iaSkmbqyernddLA.html

@jeremiahreese6396

3 жыл бұрын

What’s your thoughts on, “Vine’s you can learn New Testament Greek, an easy teach yourself guide!” By W.E. Vine?

Most important for me is getting the student reading and translating the text most quickly, even with a very basic understanding, since that is the ultimate goal in learning the Greek. I find this helps motivate the student and retain interest by encouraging a sense of accomplishment, purpose, and genuinely connecting with the text. With that in mind, introducing basic parts of speech and then focusing attention on the verbs should come toward the beginning of the course. Too many disconnected rules and concepts without being able to see them in action can become frustrating and boring, so to speak. Obviously, progress is still in small bites and at a speed the student can achieve, but at least with a feeling of actually making progress over mere academic exercises. I will add, however, that accomplishment can be conveyed by other means, even by such things as, "By learning these words, you have learned 45% of all New Testament words", etc. Thank you for your insightful commentaries!

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Kevin! I also really like getting the student translating quickly - and not from made up sentences!

I have used a number of Greek grammars over the years. In my college Greek program, we used The Language of the New Testament by Eugene Van Ness Goetchius. One thing that I really appreciated in his approach that I have not seen in any other grammar is that he started a topic by showing how that topic worked in English and then went on to show the corresponding features in Greek. For example, he started his discussion of participles by explaining what participles do and how they are formed in English. Then he showed what Greek participles look like and how they operate in ways that are similar to or different from English. I found that this approach gave me something that was already familiar to me to relate the new information to--a peg to hang the new ideas on, so to speak. One thing that I wish had been more strongly emphasized to me when starting out is to just read something in Greek every single day, even if I didn't really know what it meant, just to internalize the sounds and rhythms of the language.

@davidrogers8516

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you for your comment!. I have been doing just that, listening to 1 John 1. I might of missed it but I haven't seen any grammar explaining that the spoken Greek they often run the end of one word into the beginning of the next work.

@davidrogers8516

3 жыл бұрын

Also it would greatly help if they spoke A LOT slower for the beginner.

@earlmorton1216

3 жыл бұрын

@@davidrogers8516, I'm not a linguist, but I suspect that running words together happens in most--if not all--languages. That's how contractions formed in English. We said certain combinations of words so often, such as "that is," and got so sloppy with our pronunciation that they merged together in sound, and then eventually in spelling, becoming "that's." The same process causes errors, too. The expression "a lot" is often misspelled as "alot" because people sometimes don't realize that it is really two words.

Great overview - It is extremely important to use a grammar that whets the appetite for lifelong learning of the richness of the original Biblical text.

Great video. Here's another vote on using multiple grammars if you are dyslexic. There are some folks who learn best by seeing things from many angles. As a student of Hafemann back in the early 2000s, I used Mounce/Wallace. Even so, the best way for me to really learn Greek was to buy four or five grammars and read through how each author handled the subject. Seeing the same subject from unique perspectives really helped me get the core concepts down.

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Great suggestion!

Several years ago I started to learn the Greek Language. I used Mounces' Third Addition "Basics of Biblical Greek" . It was very clearly written for someone taking a self taught approach. Then I read "Basics of Verbal Aspect in Biblical Greek" By Constantine Campbell which Greatly opened my eyes to see the NT writers thought patterns. Note: I have been in research over 40 years and greatly enjoy digging deep, leaving no stone un-turned. I have recently purchased the other grammar's you have mentioned but at the moment I am crossing over from using BibleWorks to Accordance.

Excellent. Two additional points however. First, and most significantly, what is the overall package.?- is the workbook included or separate? what additional resources can you access ? - Plummer et al and Mounce score high, though Mounce is more expensive, others not so much. This can make a real difference to the learner experience, especially if you are teaching yourself, or thinking of teaching a class. Secondly, a more minor point, but important for learning paradigms and if you are in a class or teaching one, is does the grammar use NGDA or NAGD order? - even Mounce agrees the latter is more logical and better for memorisation and teaching but he has not had the courage of his convictions to make the switch, but most American grammars follow the former now , whilst in the UK, and many other parts of the world , where the Moulton, Nunn Wenham, Duff tradition was and is dominant, the latter still prevails. I know I found having to mentally reorder Mounce’s paradigms to fit with my muscle memory of learning from Wenham was a bit of a trial and an unnecessary distraction. So if you are going to have two grammars to begin with best to make sure they match on that at least , and that they fit with how you are being taught if you are in a class.

@nawocydna

3 жыл бұрын

I have a feeling that Kennedy's Latin Primer was printed in a UK editions with NAGD, and a US edition with NGDA in order to overcome that difficulty... there probably isn't sufficient market for Greek grammars to make that possible, although you would think that a digital edition might be easy enough to customise like that. I wish Merkle/Plummer or Decker existed in the UK case order...

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks- the inclusion of the workbook is an important point that many students (especially self-study students) value. NAGD vs NGDA is a bigger issue for refreshing Greek than leaning the first time - and only if there is a mismatch with your first grammar.

One more factor to consider is what the ultimate goal of the grammar is. If you go through the whole grammar and learn everything presented, is the expectation that you will be able to read NT Greek? To be ready to try to start reading NT Greek but needing a next level course? To be able to understand and make use of secondary resources (including Bible software) that assume some knowledge of biblical Greek grammar? Back in the day when I was in seminary, we had four required semesters of Greek, and all the NT courses assumed that we would use and apply our Greek knowledge. I realize that it is anathema for an audience watching these excellent videos, but at the seminary where I now teach, only one semester of Greek is required. This means I have to use a tools-based approach counting on the software to handle all the parsing and vocabulary, and I spend most of my time teaching English grammar so that we can talk about how Greek grammar is similar and different and then focusing on Greek syntax. (tense and aspect, function of the cases, participles, subjunctive, etc.) I've had to compose my own grammar which is quite brief, much shorter than Zacharias' which is the closest comparison. My goal is to provide an introduction and reference that allows students--in one semester--to be able to use Bible software to make sense of the Greek, not misuse it, compare and evaluate English translations, and be able to make sense of commentaries that use Greek.

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Wow. At least you still offer (require) one semester! Send students who want to go further to me when they are done! 😉 A tools outcome is very recent, and we are yet to see what fruit it bears.

@MarkHoffmanVH1

3 жыл бұрын

@@bma We do offer electives for students who want to go further, and I do require those students who have had Greek to use it in subsequent classes. I've been teaching this way for four years now and evolving the class as I go. Some observations: 1) My wife (a pastor) had the four semester requirement back in the day and was a very good Greek student, but she, like so many others, pretty much had lost her ability to use it within a couple years after seminary. Yes, it's sad, but amidst so many other pastoral demands, regular Greek reading was a casualty. 2) So far, I've had better results with students still using their Greek after the tools based approach. Bible software is what makes it doable, and even apart from Greek, they appreciate all the aids the software provides. Consulting the Greek is less daunting, and when they have available grammar references to consult, they can still gain benefit. It does mean that in the class I teach, I have to spend a lot of time teaching the software in addition to English and Greek grammar! 3) One of the biggest things students are able to do is to compare and evaluate existing English translations and then check out the Greek. There is some presumption to think that anyone even with a couple years of Greek is going to come up with something better than that produced by committees of scholars. Still, all the nuances that go into translation become evident and can be understood. Thanks again for these fine videos!

@paulakahn9384

3 жыл бұрын

So sad...

Good content! I learnt with Machen (yes from the 1920's), which gave me good foundations to grab and understand modern grammar books and enrich my learning.

I am so happy for having found this channel! Warm Congratulations! ~ from a Greek psychologist :-)

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you and welcome! 😃

As a student learning the language I find grammars with a well thought out pedagogical best. You didn't review it yet, I think, but David Black's "Learn to Read NT Greek" does this well.

@ThriftStoreBibles

3 жыл бұрын

I'm using Black's grammar and it's worked well for me so far! It doesn't seem to get as much attention as some others.

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

I am working on a review of Black. Look for it soon!

Dr. Darryl your commitment to helping your subscribers is exemplary! Moving house and in the process producing 2 videos in the meantime/aftermath is over and above the call of duty. I would like to hear about your own Basic Greek Grammar, I know you have been teaching Mounce and you want to teach Plummer but is there a need to teach the Basics following your own system? For me the emphasis has to be to Read New Testament Greek, aswell as the reinforcement of learning through translation of New Testament Greek as you highlighted. My goal is to teach the Basics in Spanish with the end goal of Reading. I was taught with a little known text: Introducing New Testament Greek Using John's Gospel by Stan Bruce which incorporated an excellent emphasis of reading through John's Gospel and using the text as an introduction to the concepts.

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks for your support! I'm not planning to write my own grammar at this stage. Perhaps that will change one day. 😀 Thanks again!

Thank you for your review and recommendations today. Have you ever come across Gunther Zuntz's "Greek: A Course in Classical and Post-Classical Greek Grammar from Original Texts"? If so, would you recommend that for one who has taken Greek and wishes to review it and dive into more of the language? Thank you for your thoughts.

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

No - I haven't seen that one. For a refresh, Whitacre's Using and Enjoying Biblical Greek is worth a look. Thanks for the pointer!

I have to admit as a student trying to regain my Greek. I appreciate the accompanying exercises to reinforce the learning process. That is why I am using Mounce now with plans to read Decker after finishing BBG. I know in a previous video these two were recommended in pairing together.

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Both good choices, and an excellent pairing!

If one is learning Greek from the grammar-translation method, what do you think of supplementing that approach with reading material that would be appropriate with one's level?

Another helpful video on grammars. I hope you get around to Dana Harris's new grammar text book that came out about 2 months ago? ound to looking at Dana Harris new grammer book?

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Its in progress!

What do you think of the GK101 Course on Logos bible software, I am about halfway through it now, and finding myself struggling with verb construction and declination stuff.

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

I haven’t looked at it, but I will take a look! I recommend you use an app like ParseGreek or masterGreek.com to practice parsing and declining. That normally helps - as does writing out paradigms repeatedly.

Thank you for your video. Could you share your view on Stanley Porter’s Idioms of the Greek New Testament? Thank you in advance.

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

I will add it to the list for the new year! Thanks for the suggestion!

Hi Durryl. Thanks a lot for your videos. Can you please give me an advice? I finished the greek textbook by John Dobson and an another free one that you recommended. I am deciding whether I should buy Going Deeper With Greek by Plummer etc. or the grammar by Matthewson and Emig. When it comes to my greek level, I am learning vocabulary and aim at reading the NT fluently. Thanks a lot.

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

I would encourage you to go with Mathewson and Emig. I think it is better suited for what reading fluency.

@PlavitPOi90

3 жыл бұрын

@@bmaThanks a lot. God bless

Hi Darryl. A nice overview thanks. I think your links to previous reviews are missing. These would be helpful as I will post this video on our Facebook group as a summary. Great points to consider. I think the main obstacles for new students of Greek is the memorisation of paradigms and understanding of morphology. It is important that a logical pattern can be seen and that word endings and morphemes are not random changes. A system that presents the minimum memory work necessary with maximum understanding of how and why is going to be a winner in my book. This is why Mounce is still my preferred grammar. Important details such as the true middle voice, aspect and aktionsart should be introduced if possible, but not at the expense of confusing the student. These issues can wait till year 2. I didn’t find Mounce to have too much information. Anything less important was in the footnotes. Perhaps the big question should be what sort of grammar does the course require. Any course expecting students to just be able to use software tools doesn’t really need a full grammar. With the rise in self directed learning, any decent grammar has to be self contained with workbooks, answer keys and further helps available. I would encourage any learner to join some online community, however, in order to be able to ask questions and improve their own learning by answering questions.

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Neil! I've added the cards (the video took ages to upload and I ended up leaving it and forgot to come back). Thanks for sharing and your comments!

Very good! I'm looking for your review of Dana's book.

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Coming soon!

curious about Harris new grammar.

I would like to try your system, but I want to do modern pronunciation. Is that possible?

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Of course! I provide Erasmian pronunciation, but you're welcome to use Modern. I have a few students who use modern pronunciation.

Will this be the new office/studio?

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Yes... in progress.

I want review of A.T. Robertson Grammar :)

@bma

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks! I've put it on the list!