"If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world." -Tolkien

@BingleFlimp

8 ай бұрын

As someone who is renowned for being grumpy, antisocial and has a lot of money invested in gold; Tolkien is very correct.

@thatDUDEfromMAINE

4 ай бұрын

we've all got a little smaug in us

TO CLARIFY: (I believe this was implicit in the video, but never the less), I am not saying the new films WILL be good. I am saying there is a chance, and a few reasons they might be. And until we know more, we catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. And even though we have been burned many times, it's up to us to be the bigger people. And ultimately this video is not about new adaptations, it's about teaching a lesson through what I perceive to be Tolkien's own themes about fatalism, nihilism, defeatism: doomerism, in an effort to save this fandom, and any other, from devolving into negativity and tribalism. That is truly how fandoms get destroyed. If you love Tolkien's work as it is written, if you guard the gates with me, we are friends, we are allies in this. But we have to know, that not everyone that approaches the gates is an enemy. But they surely will be if we treat them like that without cause. Also for the record, at least for now, the intention does not seem to be to reboot and remake the original films and tell the same story again. That would be a huge problem if they did that, but it seems like they plan to tell other stories, not the story of the Fellowship again.

@Donnirononon

Жыл бұрын

At this point i am just sick of reboot XYZ. The world has become unoriginal

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Just made an edit to clarify this as well. At the moment, these don't appear to be reboots of the original movies, new stories in new films.

@Donnirononon

Жыл бұрын

@@LivingAnachronism The issue i mean is that generally nothing good came the last 20 years from touching something already perfect again. Be it a reboot or an original, i assure you it is going to be written by inclusion-facists just like any other show or movie today.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

@@Donnirononon Yes, I said a similar thing in my videos on RoP. Very differently here, we have the chance to influence these scripts before they are written, unlike RoP. RoP also helped us to prove that this is not a subvertable IP, the fans are too strong. Given this new set of circumstances, there is a better chance that we may be able to turn the tide if we are able to positively influence these new films to break the mold. We'll push back if we need to. But I think now there is a chance to turn things around, where there wasn't enough momentum before. Now we have it, thanks to RoP rallying the fandoms together.

@reek4062

10 ай бұрын

We meet again at last. I'm sure the new films will not be good, especially if Peter Jackson, Fran Walsh or Philippa Boyens is involved. My hatred for the PJ movies has grown. As bad as RoP is, it has exposed all the PJ fans pretending to be Tolkien fans. The movies are not the Lord of the Rings. And fans of the movies aren't Tolkien fans.

“There never was much hope. Just a fool's hope."

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

Either they quit the social justice crap forever, or we boycott them until they are DESTROYED. No ifs, no buts. No negotiation. This is an ULTIMATUM.

@veeclash4157

Жыл бұрын

@@mirceazaharia2094 Hollywood is never gonna stop Hollywooding. The only question is can good content still be released DESPITE the evil and morally corrupt nature of the beast?

@ThaCouchpotato

Жыл бұрын

​@@mirceazaharia2094 oh they won't stop. Bringing down a studio? A win Movie hit? Win, sheep programming sucess Only failure in their eyes is if they all get fired and the studio actually makes something good. Keep on the lookout for a diversity manager. That's a clear sign it will suck

The dose of maturity you bring to the table is a breath of fresh air. As fun as it is to dunk on bad stuff that is bad, you're totally on the money when you say we shouldn't be throwing the baby out with the bathwater when it comes to some new adaptations. There were (and still are) puritans that are harshly critical of Jackson's films, even. I wouldn't want to become like them.

@mikem9001

Жыл бұрын

Who is throwing out the baby? Everyone continues to love Tolkien's work. Most people love the Jackson films (even more since ROP demonstrated how badly it could be done). ROP is incompetent film-making as well as quite untrue to Tolkien.

@aleksamrkela831

Жыл бұрын

@@mikem9001 I never said otherwise; ROP is an absolute disaster, and that's a fact. What I am saying is that the upcoming New Line films could be good, and that we shouldn't reject that possibility just because a lot of things being put out nowadays suck.

@mikem9001

Жыл бұрын

@@aleksamrkela831 Thank you for agreeing with everything I wrote. ;o)

Well spoken, Kramer. I think you just put words to how many of us all feel. You certainly did it for me, at least. Let's keep that hope alive.

"If they feel they are never going to please us, they aren't going to try." Very good point...

@jameswalker199

Жыл бұрын

If you must not have hope, at least be willing to be pleasantly surprised when you are proven wrong. That said, punishing the people of the present for the crimes of those in the past is what another group of people would wish to do, let's not fall into the trap of doing that ourselves.

All I want is a Silmarillion movie man. There's so many good stories in it that would work so well on screen, ROP genuinely only got 1 thing right, and its the opening recap of it. Even though it touched on literally nothing, it referenced a lot of the things that could've been extrapolated on into greatness.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

More like a Silmarilion mini-series. But only if there is zero wokeness and they stick very close to the source material, and the spirit in which it was written.

@rump438

Жыл бұрын

@@mirceazaharia2094 well yeh thats what im gettin at, though i think a could movie work if they decide to only tell certain chunks. a series would be great for the overall book, but with the way its written they could totally write around something like Beren and Luthien.

@NastyCupid

Жыл бұрын

The Silmarillion is way to traditional and Christian inspired to be adapted by modern media industry. And beside that, the Silmarillion is really not made to be put to the screen, it is fundamental background information for the world building, but it is not a fleshed out story like lotr and the hobbit.

@rump438

Жыл бұрын

@@NastyCupid That doesn't mean you can't derive narrative from it. House of The Dragon is fundamentally a history text and that's one of the best TV shows HBO has had in years. Traditional and Christian??? I guess? If you want to act like you're a victim because people want to explore other things thats fine, but I dunno whats so christian about elves having a rock opera and creating the universe.

@mikem9001

Жыл бұрын

@@NastyCupid Like Shakespeare you mean? Or Jane Austen? Both continue to spawn modern movies on a regular basis. The Silmarillion provides plenty of material that could be used for movies. It just requires showrunners with talent and creativity to work with it...

ill be cautiously optimistic. i harbor doubts given the way Hollywood is right now.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

Let's hope you're vindicated. If it's woke, however, it's virtually guaranteed to be sh*t.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Yes

If I could say one thing to people making adaptations it would be: If you want to write your own story, then create your own new story. But when adapting someone else's story you need to have respect for the original work and not think you can write it better. Any changes must still be rooted in the original, and not just because you think it would be cool.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Yes

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

Damn right.

I'm so happy you mentioned The Northmen. Thst movie is freaking amazing!! I loved it and rewatch it often!!

I love how you use lessons from Tolkien's writing. You did the same thing in your videos rebuking ROP and it was brilliant. Thanks for this, Kramer.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Thank you, Rebel Scum

i just hope that warner bros and new line cinema will have the common sense to NOT repeat the sh!t show that amazon did with the ring of power

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

>common sense >contemporary major media companies Pick one, and only one. Anything good nowadays is a statistical anomaly, a deviation from the norm, which is mediocrity and woke sh*t. But hope springs eternal, I suppose.

Give me a war for Dale during the War of the Ring

"There is always hope." Thank you so much for this video, Kramer! This was perfect, and exactly what needed to be heard at this time. I love your faith filled mindset! And I agree completely. This is the way we need to be thinking as we move forward. It's the same kind of faith and hope we should have as we walk through the rest of life with God. Never despair.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

We reject despair, we reject fatalism. Often evil is the cause of its own undoing. There is always hope, the light will always win eventually

@benjaminblack4345

Жыл бұрын

@@LivingAnachronism amen!

I remember they said they are going to make LOTr for "modern audiences" aka 9% of the population of fanbase.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

It's treason, then. The new Warner Bros movie will be a disaster, the usual circus of boycotts, social media dumpster fires, deleted dislikes / negative reviews. The pattern repeats once more. The Wheel turns, as it always have, as it always will.

@thehoodedvagabum7375

Жыл бұрын

I still don´t know what the fuck does that mean. It´s like... Hey let´s make Taxi Driver for a more modern audience. We all know it´s to keep sucking the cow´s tits.

@veeclash4157

Жыл бұрын

I would wager far less than 9% of the population believe nonsense logic like a Rock looks Down, and a Boat looks up, therefore the boat floats and this is the deep, ancient WISDOM of the Elves! LMAO.

@reek4062

10 ай бұрын

The PJ movies are modern movies made for generic movie audiences

There's zero chance it won't be Middle California again. Tolkien's world is a Saxon mythology and not a modern American one. It should look the part.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

I agree that's how it should be. But I disagree there is a 0% chance, even if it's just like 1%, that's room enough to encourage them to do it right. If there is a 0% chance we might as well give up now, and live a life of being defeated subjects forever. There was pretty much a 0% chance Frodo would destroy the ring too, and yet the ring was destroyed. Take heart!

I tend to stick to the assumption that any given new thing will probably be "okay" unless reason arises to think otherwise. If new materials come out showing this to be a new rings of power, that sucks. If it turns out looking great, that's great. That said, the old movies set a ridiculously high standard, so I'm a bit skeptical. But I'll withhold actual judgement until I actually start seeing the material. I find your stance on this to be reasonable and respectable.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

If it's at least slightly better than The Hobbit trilogy, true to the source material and contains ZERO WOKENESS, I shall applaud and support them. Not for a success, but for a promising first step. But any step taken backwards, any attempt to kowtow to the woke mafia whatsoever, and I burn all bridges forever with Warner Bros.

Absolutely spot on and well said Kramer, bravo!

I absolutely LOVE these videos when you make them, Kramer! Keep up the good work! And I think you're right: at the very least, presumably WB and NLC have been watching the Rings of Power discussions, so I think they'll navigate the waters accordingly

Warner Brothers, PLEASE don't mess this up. You've seen what Amazon did. Do it right!

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

They won't. The most they could achieve is to make a mediocre, moderately woke thing instead of an awful, turbo-woke thing. This is the most likely outcome. Best case scenario, a miracle occurs, the planets align, and somehow, they manage not to monumentally screw up, and in an instant of astounding, galaxy-level big brain IQ, manage to produce something actually good. Maybe. I mean, it COULD happen.

Cautiously optimistic works for me. Very well spoken kind sir.

Thanks for being a voice of reason, in the midst of all the extreme skepticism of the new LOTR expansion films. But I also want to thank you for standing up against the bastardization of Tolkien's works. I know that everyone has their biases, and I'm sure you have yours. But so far, you've maintained one of the most objective stances I've seen throughout all this. We need more people like you to anchor this fandom; to keep us from fracturing, due to tribal mentality.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Thank you GeneSys, I will always say what I think is right, not what people want me to say, regardless of the side. Otherwise, we are completely lost, both as a fandom, and as a people.

After your comments around 13:50 - I said "HELL YES" out loud - very measured and fantastic pre-reaction and warning to all Kramer. Nicely done, and great decision to include the Tolkien points about mercy towards Gollum, and other evil-doers - nice!

2:44 We won-and by 'won' I mean 'we are all lost collectively.' That's actually deep and relatable.

The best way I can think to describe the current LoTR situation and actually this video in itself is watching a really good cooking show while being completely starving. I am now too ‘hungry’ and will be going to rewatch the LoTR films yet again. Thank you and goodnight.

IMO, Peter Jackson's minimum involvement needs to be a cameo appearance, eating a carrot.

I wish they would consult YOU on these projects. I strongly feel you are a fantastic ambassador for the Tolkien Fandom. You're articulate, passionate ,respectful and learned of the lore.

100% agree. At first a I had a knee-jerk negative reaction thanks to ROP, but once I saw we know nothing about what's coming, I set that aside until actual information comes out.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

I am of the opinion that there's a greater than 99% chance that it will NOT be good or respectful towards the source material and the fan base.

@aetherial87

Жыл бұрын

@@mirceazaharia2094 no offense, but in light of having no information and it being made by companies not involved in the ROP fiasco, that is both overly presumptive and foolish.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

​​​​@@aetherial87 Maybe. But if people known to hold woke beliefs are involved with this project, and if such people are the majority in this project, and hold all the decision making power, it can be safe to assume that the project itself will be woke, and thus an absolute travesty.

Fantastic video and fantastic dive into Tolkien themes. LOTR is such a beautiful demonstration of a lot of good morals which is why it has survived the test of time.

Wonderful video, Kramer! You have convinced me with your wise and fair words. Thank you!

I may have chose to do evil, but at least i'm not Sauron, Kramer..

Preach it, brother! Thanks so much for this, Kramer! I needed it, and I 100% agree. It's precisely in the darkest times that we're told to lift up our heads - because our redemption is drawing near. We have to be discerning, but we can never give in to despair. God bless! To the King!!!

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Thanks Morgan, you're absolutely right! Despair is for the losing side. We are hot off the momentum of a fantastic showing from the Tolkien fandom. Now we need a positive one. We will win.

'Hope for the best, plan for the worst' applies.

Totally agree on literally every level (even that Beren and Luthien should never he adapted to screen). HOPE (estel) needs to be the core of our fandom but we should be fierce in our defense of the material when need be (especially since the estate doesn't have our back anymore).

As long as they stay true to Tolkien.... But I do agree with your sentiment, great video!

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

They won't. The producers and financiers will be INCAPABLE of NOT attempting to shove the pseudo-morality of "social justice" down our throats. They're counting on the modern audience to be brainless consoomers, that gorge themselves on whatever slop they are fed, no matter how bad, without complaint. We must prove to them that we are not like that. If they are incompetent, if they are disrespectful, if they are malicious and try to alter the source material in disrespectful ways, WE MUST REJECT.

@patrickbateman3146

Жыл бұрын

Lol

First, I want to say, that I genuinely hope you’re right, and I share your sentiments throughout. Second of all after about minute 13 you started channeling the spirit of William Wallace! I actually got a little excited there for a second and anticipation. But I can’t say that you’re wrong in anything that you said. Great video, great take!

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

The problem is that we have been far too tolerant of the masses of imbeciles and scum that nowadays run and dominate entertainment and show business. We must give an ULTIMATUM. If the wokeness continues, we walk away, sponsor alternatives and NEVER RETURN. They will not learn any other way.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

@Mircea Zacharia, the point is that we can encourage these me films to be the alternatives. But we have to show them it's socially safe to do so, and that the fans will support them if they make something that isn't woke. Otherwise they are going to do what they feel is safest, and go to the RoP root so they don't get canceled. It starts with showing people that it is safe for them to go against the modern narrative.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

​​​@@LivingAnachronism How? They have to go against The Message to begin with before I can begin to trust them farther than I can throw them. It would take a MIRACLE for them to achieve more than mediocrity. However, miracles do happen, once in a blue moon.

@juryrigging

Жыл бұрын

​@@LivingAnachronism As long as they go back to Peter Jackson's original statement for LotR, that they want to stick to Tolkien's themes leaving their own biases out of the story, and learn from the mistakes of the production mess that was the Hobbit, there is a hope. The problem is that there is going to be an awful lot that needs writing for any new film rather than just making cinematic tweaks, as the most comprehensive stories they have the rights for have already been told (iirc they have the same rights as Amazon, but for films. So the Hobbit, LotR and the appendices). How they tackle that problem will ultimately tell us a lot (and the less Simon "the films were too faithful" Tolkien gets involved in the whole process, the better). War of the Rohirrim will be a good litmus test. My vote is the Angmar War and the Kin-Strife in Gondor. It's a long period, but a good LotR style prologue can cover a lot of early ground. During this time you have Gondor's budding, if internally controversial, friendship with the Eóthéod which paves the way for the later ties with Rohan. Malbeth's prophecy about the reunification of the Dúnedain and Arvedui's failed claim to the throne of Gondor setting up Aragorn's story. Eärnil sending his son with a large fleet to the Grey Havens, resulting in the battle of Fornost and the Witch-King's defeat at the combined forces of Gondor, Arthedain, and the Eóthéod for Men, Lindon and Imladris for the elves, and even hobbits from the recently settled Shire…and the prophecy of Glorfindel about the death of the Witch-King. It could end with the remnants of Arnor becoming rangers, watching over their lands at a distance and entrusting their heirs to Elrond's keeping, have Bucca of the Marish becoming first Thain in the absence of the king, and finish with the twist of the gathering of the Nine in Morder and the taking of Minas Ithil, leading to the reign of the Stewards in Gondor. Maybe the Barrow Downs could finally make it into the cinematic universe, the Witch-King bringing forth the Wights to terrorise the men of Cardolan with their dead. So much material, just in the sources they have (even before being be "inspired" by some of the other texts, without using them in a rights violating way). Common sense says I'd not get quite what I'm envisioning even if we do get that period. But the possibilities, if all the Company remains true, are certainly exciting.

The Peter Jackson movies are what inspired me to take the time to read Tolkien's work. In this day and age it can be hard to slow down and take the time to pick up a book, but that's what a good adaptation can do. And I would love for this new adaptation to do the same for others so we can all get to know and love Tolkien's work, and inspire a love of reading.

@reek4062

10 ай бұрын

''A good adaptation''? Where?

1. Commenting for the algorithm. 2. This is the best take on the news of new LotR movies I’ve seen so far. Thank you for the reminder to not give into despair for the future of our beloved franchise, and that fighting for the love of something is more powerful than fighting against that which you hate.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

1. Commenting for the algorithm 2. Really glad you liked the video Alexander. I think some people are misunderstanding the purpose of it, but I'm heartened to know you got it

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

​@@LivingAnachronism It is indeed a fairly good take, even if I disagree with your (unfounded) optimism about this project.

You've convinced me. I say we use "War of the Rohirrim" as an indicator of what's to come. That's produced by Warner and New Line as well. When that release comes up, we'll find out how the marketing is conducted, which will tell us all we need to know.

Very,VERY well said... Cheers from Greece...

I just got to say, you would be amazing at speeches. Like you give me such aragorn vibes, like if they do end up making a reboot, you should be casted

the sheer amount of lotr analogies to help us understand😂 hes speaking our language i just hope they take care and sweet time with it. if they do it will pay off WELL

KRAMER, you know what I to see in any new adaptation? You. And the lords and ladies of the realm as extras. And all the fan music playing (it's all Tolkien's poems set to music). Folks like Timbo Took as his regular, Hobbitty self, somewhere in the background painting a scene with little Hobbitty children sitting in attendance. Cheyenne van L.("Dancing Bardess") poignantly playing a key instrument of some Elvish sort in the retelling of the Nirnaeth Arnoediad. Maybe you in a battle alongside Jeb Brody, fighting orcs... the possibilities are endless. Something for the Fandom that will potentially lift the production to the highest of success.

Just to voice this, since I think it is important for it to be seen, I also dont think PJ needs to be involved or be the director or whatever. If he does join because he wants to, that's great. But I am okay with WB and NC picking someone else. Tolkien fans dont NEED PJ to be the one to bring us another movie. Many Tolkien fans dislike PJ, too. So long as they pick leadership who cares about the books and wants to tell stories from the books, or in the same vein as the books, we will be happy to watch their movie. They CAN make another world shaping monument of a lotr movie. They just need to be sincere, and they just need to try really earnestly. But they can do it.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Hit the nail on the head Glorfindel, 100% agree with you.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

They COULD do it. But I don't think they will. There's a better than 99.5% chance that they'll screw it up, maybe even badly.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

@@mirceazaharia2094 I'm being 100% serious here, you need to stop trying to get people to take the black pill. If it's bad, we'll call it out, we all know what to do. Doomerism is antithetical to Tolkien's message. I even agree with you, these movies being good is unlikely, but it is strategically unhelpful to get everyone depressed and rile up the fanbase. We will react as necessary in when the time arrives, whether that be for good or evil, have faith in that at least.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

​​@@LivingAnachronism It's just that I find your attitude and Tolkien's message as admirable as they are frustrating (to me at least). I cannot believe and trust in people, not anymore. In their potential, in general? Maybe. In them individually and collectively? Not very much. As far as I'm concerned, Rousseau Was Wrong. Every time I encounter a new person, I'm always suspicious of them. I always wonder, "How will my fellow man deceive me, use me, disappoint me this time?". Every instance of human goodness and greatness I notice, I celebrate as a miracle, man going against his own pathetic and contemptible nature to be something better than he is. I wish they were better than I believe them to be. To answer the question you haven't asked, the reason for my beliefs are childhood isolation, bullying and trauma. They didn't want me, so I don't want them either - the philosophy of Jack London's White Fang. My soul is a fortress-city, and few prove themselves worthy of passage within. My trust is hard-earned and easy to lose. I offer life-long loyalty and demand the same.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

@@mirceazaharia2094 I understand, and I understand the position of being afraid of who you can trust, our modern wasteland of a society is the dystopia many great 20th century authors wrote about. So while I am not attempting to dissuade you from your line of reasoning, and I understand the justification, I will say that my belief, is that to still hold hope, is in fact a stance against the division and the subversion of our modern times. I am not saying we should be naïve or blind, certainly not. Guard your heart, yes. But they way we make things better is by choosing to take action, to reject the world that we are being forced into where neighbor no longer trusts neighbor, where you fear your own family members. That is the final stage of 5th generation warfare as outlined by Yuri Bezmonov. I will not be tricked or taken advantage of, but I will also not treat everyone as an enemy, just to protect myself from being hurt or ridiculed. That is a path that leads only to darkness.

Greetings Kramer !!! It would be legendary if they stick to the canon, we fans would be eternally grateful. It would be epic if the first trailer or poster comes out before the second season of Rings of Power. & ther financial gain will show them that.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

I'll abstain from adding my customary dislike to the new trailer when it comes out. If the movie is bad, I shall return to it and correct my mistake.

Well said. there is the potential for an absolute dumpster fire, it also can be absolutely amazing. Too early to know for certain at this point but I would guess that the odds are against us getting something amazing. "There never was much hope. Just a fools hope" sums it up nicely.

excellent as usual. cautious optimism for now, until we know more.

You are breaking "their" ability to manipulate the crowds. Well spoken. May people take what you have to say to heart.

HOPE! Exactly! I need something to look forward to, no matter how many times I've been hurt by bad media recently, I need to have hope for something better. That said, I completely understand if people are apprehensive. We were optimistic about so many things that turned out bad. Star Wars sequels, Boba+Kenobi etc.., Hobbit movies, Wheel of Time, Witcher, Halo, ROP... How can one still be optimistic? But Day shall come again! PS. I have absolutely no hope for ROP at all. Couldn't even finish the first season.

Valid comments and perspective, excellent video.

A STRONG emphasis on 'cautiously' optimistic. New Line Cinema is not separate from the Hollywood machine. We've been burned one too many times. I agree with your sentiment, but as fans, we must not give an inch, lest they will take a mile.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

We must deliver an ULTIMATUM. They either choose wokeness, or continued survival and relevance as participants in the entertainment industry. Either one or the other.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

I agree. We aren't giving them anything, aside from the chance to do the right thing. If they don't, it's go time, just like RoP.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

I agree, but, when you are dealing with people who have pride, as most people do, you can't approach them aggressively. No one likes to be made to feel stupid. And approaching them as if they've already started screwing up the movies when they haven't runs into the problem of them ruining them just to spite us. RoP was already written and shot when the blowback came. This is different because we have the ability to encourage them to write the scripts the right way, if we don't make them enemies in the process.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

​@@LivingAnachronism But if they screw it up? Do we give them more chances? How many more?

So much wisdom here in your words, Kramer. Thank you for being bold enough to share, good sir. ❤

Well put. Though I'd argue that not wanting them to produce more films is a very reasonable position. I don't believe any serious production house has the ability or will to pull a new LotR off. I also think that what we have in the Peter Jackson trilogy is good enough to not risk tainting the IP further.

Sony treated Spiderman with respect, gave the fans exactly what we wanted, inserted no politics, and thus made huge bank because of it.... Yet Disney didn't take a hint.

A Robert Eggers Lord of the Rings film project might actually be really darn good.

Man ur takes are wise and on point more of this pls

What I would LOVE more than anything is a Non-Woke, Non-Deconstructionist, Non-Hateful, and Respectful adaption of the Civil Wars in Arnor, culminating (tragically) in the Defeat of the Northern Kingdoms by the Witch King of Angmar. Not sure exactly what timeline would work, but I wouldn't be against seeing at least a bit more of Elendil to set the stage in an intro overview (although I definitely would love a film/series about him someday - pipe dream I'm sure) although I absolutely think that the Wars in Arnor are ripe for storytelling. Just not RoP levels of crap. I would MUCH rather they leave it alone if that would be the case.

i have no faith

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

I DO have some faith. I simply have very little.

IF Peter Jackson agrees to make more Middle Earthe films (no reboots!) I hope he gets all the time he needs for it to make them as good as the LotR films. The Hobbit was okay, but I always felt like Jackson was rushed and didn't have time to think everything through and make it right. In case of new directors/producers, I hope they'll sign some contract to not insert their own beliefs/agenda into the project, and stay true to the source material.

Spoken very eloquently. This is the statement that I think should reflect not just the Tolkein fan community but is applicable to nearly every fan community out. The time is not yet right for us to draw our swords. Now is the time for us to use our pens, quills, and keyboards to reach out and help promote and guide the studios.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

But if they screw it up? If they spite us, then lie that they'll do better next time, that we must give them a thousand more chances? What then? How many more chances? How many more opportunities to spit in our faces? HOW MANY?

Good video, Kramer👍 (but I am still waiting for a film adaptation of "The Dragon Riders Of Pern😊."

I agree, it's too early to say anything about new LotR media, we'll be ready for the worst, but hope for the best.

Men of the West do not forget your strength of nobility and honour. Do not be hasty to pass judgement and close your ranks. Maybe keep your sword ready in its sheath, but lead with a hand opened in greeting and weary hope in your heart.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Well said Riley, well said.

Not often is a such clarion call heard, but these words ring out as loudly as the strongest calls for battle. (My very humble attempt at being fancy with words.)

There were too many parts in this video that I absolutely agreed with, to mention them all. I very much hope you're right in your assessments.

I needed this. I’m actually majorly a Star Wars fan since I can remember, and I’ve been DEVASTATED by how they’ve been treating it. And i also feel that I’ve been betrayed a second time, with the Mandalorian, which looked very good to me and then just… while my passion for LOTR might not be as strong as what you have, I still love it very much, and coming from marvel fatigue, and then Star Wars, I was once again very sad and tired to hear the news of what I could only think of more money grab. But this. You are very right, super valid point that would have not convinced fatigued me if it wasn’t so well put. I need a more optimistic (while still cautious) view at this time, thanks God for Tolkien’s messages of hope, and you for the reminder.

Preach Brother! Preach! (Secondary, where do you get all of your gambisons?)

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

One was made by a family member, my brown one is from Burgschneider

@kaleb03t.65

Жыл бұрын

@@LivingAnachronism Thank you. So you have shouted out good gambesons at Burgschneider and Shad lives by Steel Mastery. Do you know quality wise to price what seems better. Steel mastery is roughly $100 more per gambeson, I'm just wondering if it's worth it or not.

Well, now you've got me jonesing for a Beren and Luthien movie. Kidding! ;) Nicely put sentiments. The upcoming War of the Rohirrim animated movie looks promising. Keeping fingers crossed about Warner/New Line.

Pretty well said, one thing I would be happy to see is Rhun and Harad stuff. There are some interesting ideas for stories there.

@janetchennault4385

Жыл бұрын

And a wonderful opportunity for showing Amazon how other races _can_ be presented in Middle Earth - as a genuine part of the lore.

@sunrisesparkle6363

Жыл бұрын

@@janetchennault4385 Yea, that was my idea too. Which is weird that they didnt do it.

@janetchennault4385

Жыл бұрын

@@sunrisesparkle6363 Unfortunately, the most likely explanation I can come up with is that the producers deliberately did not want to create an in-lore vision, but were actively seeking to elicit a shock reaction from the fans by actively breaking the lore. It is illogical to me that the desire to deliberately offend a subset of the population that could have (as Kramer points out) act as a positive magnifier of the videos, and enhanced their success, would look like a good game strategy. Having watched/read many of the videos/articles that the producers wrote from their own POV about RoP, that did seem to be where they were coming from, however.

I will come at this with two viewpoints: 1. Did I enjoy Rings of Power? Yes. 2. Did I enjoy Rings of Power as a Tolkien Universe story? Not even a little.

I think that rop will have scared WB and NL into not screwing up too much, and the strikes and especially the financial issues that WB has had recently means they NEED to make good movies now. They can't afford to make mad LotR movies and they know it.

I totally agree, Kramer. Well said by the way.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Thanks Harry

Cautious optimism, agreed, and I do hope they explore Tolkien story content they haven't already succeeded in. Perhaps Silmarillion content? Beren and Luthien? Why do you think they shouldn't be on screen? Honestly would love to know your thoughts, Kramer. Thanks!

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Really hope they don't do Been and Luthien, that should remain in the books alone. But plenty of other stories that would be cool to see on screen if done right.

@alexhegel6811

Жыл бұрын

@Living Anachronism well holy cow you answered fast! Understood.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

​@@LivingAnachronism I hope that you're right and that I am wrong. But I know that it won't be so. I'm afraid to say that Warner Bros will disappoint you once again. The old entertainment companies had their chance. Now it's our turn. Now it's time for these dinosaurs to be out-competed and rendered extinct, by new and better ideas, creators, producers and IPs. Now is the time for the Iron Age of Entertainment. If the old culture is ruined, we shall replace it. We shall BECOME the culture.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

@@mirceazaharia2094 I anticipate being disappointed, and I accept that fate, and take the pain of that onto myself, because in that there is a better chance of swaying people to my side.

Hmm. I reserve judgement. Trepidatious best describes my attitude. I can hope, of course, and I do so. I have very real reservations about any more forthcoming films in Middle Earth.

For the people whos only experience of Lotr is from the Rings of Power series, i hope for their sakes and future generations sake that these new movies will be good and to show them what Lotr story telling is supposed to be like.

Is it just me, or does he sound like a football coach in the blood bowl games just before they take the field?

Kramer for president! So well spoken, I agree 100%. I have hope for this adaptation.

As members of the fandom, it is our duty to smash the like button and yell to the Algorithm Deity about the importance of the statements explained in this video.

Wise words my friend. Cheers !

I do love how you talk about Tolkien with such enthusiasm for the themesand ideals. I admire your courageous positivity. I had truly wanted the RoP project to succeed, and as info came out, I still tried to have hope that there was some kind of justifiable explanation... but I knew deep down. I will say this: my one reason why I can't have hope persay that WB/New Line will do right by this is the D.I.E. clause the studios all have which basically says "we are committed to putting our messages and values into this story above all else" ...when they are contractually obligated do that, it leaves no room for Tolkien's (somewhat contradictory) themes. Oh no, you're gonna get me crying if you start with that Eucatastrophe talk. 😢

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

If it's woke, it's sh*t. If it's woke, it's not just mere sh*t. It's just plain EVIL. We give them ONE CHANCE. If they spit on our peace offering, then we summon the Fandom Legion. And we do it the old way.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

I just noticed that you have a Dr Who themed pfp. Pray tell, what happened to that season with the 13th Doctor, the female one? Say, wasn't that the one in which they RETCONNED BASICALLY THE ENTIRE LORE? And you want to TRUST these... these freaks to do right? You are too kind. Entirely too kind and trusting. The world will spit on your outstretched hand, will rip out your heart and sh*t down your neck. No. You give them one chance. Then you don't trust them again, don't give them another chance to hurt you again.

you must see born of hope!

Great video, great message. My question is "Why make these new movies?". The originals don't need to be replaced, and the trends in Hollywood these days are all bad. I'd rather see remaked come out at a time when good writing is the norm. And honestly, I'd rather see a mini series, or a full size series, like Game of Thrones only good.

Hear hear! Wise words.

Got it. Well said. You have changed my reaction to the new thing.

This is VERY, very well said. You strike the heart of the matter here, and not just about the LOTR. You reflect Christ here, Kramer, and it is both words and actions like these that will be needed as the world darkens. On a bit more of a whimsical note, I, a mere Hobbit lass, would follow you into battle even though it were not my place to do so.

Exactly. I am very cautious, due to previous adaptations of media, however, I will retain my hope until something more solid is released. "What are we holding onto, Sam?" "That there's some good in this world, and it's worth fighting for."

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Exactly this Artemis. You get it ;)

@ArtemisDalmasca

Жыл бұрын

​@@LivingAnachronism I do, very much :) I did the same when Amazon first announced ROP. I was hopeful. The casting announcement they made helped to dash that hope -though I tried to give them the benefit of the doubt by thinking that maybe the variations in cast would make sense in the lore. Last year, of course, completely destroyed that hope. Now, all my hopes lay with the animated movie about Helm Hammerhand, and the new movies from WB. Until more is revealed, I'll continue to hope for something to bring back the spark of magic and return us properly to Middle Earth

I agree entirely with your point about having hope and not tarring the new films with the same brush as we did Amazon. There are other people who would wish to punish people of present day for the crimes of the people that came before them, and the best way to fight that kind of thinking is to refuse to do it ourselves.

Totally agree.

Denethor was done dirty: He was way more noble & mighty in the books. Not to mention he contended wills with Sauron for decades nonstop and ontop of that even now he was never broken nor could Sauron alter what Denethor would see in the palantir even then he couldn’t control what Denethor had control of which was how he chose to interpret the visions given to him. Using it all to Gondor’s advantage! ❤ he also lit the beacons and got the women and children far away from the city longer ahead of time. So the movie butchered him as well as faramir but they didn’t butcher faramir as badly thankfully. He could have been shown to give Pippen his newest order to light the beacons so then it wouldn’t change the scene much at all as presented! The story here is Faramir’s birth ended up killing his mother Finduilas which was a Numenorean woman of the Faithful which her ancestors survived the Kataklysm of Númenor by the way! He was hurt deeply by her death. But also Aragorn when he went by the name gifted to him as Thorongil Denethor’s father basically overshadowing him from his own father so he is as psychology goes: treated Boromir the same way his father treated Aragorn/Thorongil. Note that Boromir and Faramir are half Númenorean which is a big thing as far as the legendarium goes! Denethor actually did many things the movie shows him not doing or neglecting. He was VERY competent and mighty in many craft and (even a lore-master to a degree). He had quite alot of mental and “magical” might which is why he could contend with Sauron too without being harmed in there process in any way!

There is an alarming tendency in making movie adaptations- basically, those are adaptations ONLY in name and have little or nothing at all in common with the original lore. But I hope W.Bros. and New Line will make them at least better than Amazon... I really would love more GOOD movies in Tolkien Universum (give me elves, please :D ). Edit: 16:27 "Choose your battles!"

Oh lord, here we go again..

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

I'm looking forward to seeing how hard the new Warner Bros project bombs. Not IF it bombs, but HOW HARD it will bomb. If it's woke, it's automatically sh*t. And it WILL be woke, I guarantee it.

@InterpretingYou

Жыл бұрын

@@mirceazaharia2094 almost certainly. But I think they also taking notes of Amazon's backlash and almost whatever WB will produce would stand higher than Bezos' blasphemy

@patrickbateman3146

Жыл бұрын

​@@InterpretingYou it's classic push a lot and pull back a little. they're hoping that people will just say "well at least it's not as bad as rings of power". It's like saying, yeah it has a little bit of shit in it, but at least it's not a shit sandwich.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

​​@@InterpretingYou In other words, it will be a solid, well-compacted turd that hits out faces, rather than the diarrhoea that Amazon crapped out.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

​​@@patrickbateman3146 A sh*t sandwich and a sandwich that has only a little bit of sh*t in it are equally inedible and unappetising.

Wise words, young master Kramer. You have my bow!

A wonderful speech, I couldn't have said it better myself! I think there is good reason to be cautiously optimistic at this juncture; they have reached out to the great Trio which brought us the original trilogy, and they have every incentive to do this right. Yes, they are part of Hollywood, but they are not Amazon and they are trying to correct the course of their ship to some extent. I particularly agree with your point that being hostile without good reason would only serve to undercut our message and lend credence to the favoured tactic of fan-bashing. I do also hear that the RotK is supposed to be coming to theatres this December fir the 20th anniversary of its release, and it may be the Extended Edition. It is a good opportunity to show the world how much we love Tolkien's works and earnest adaptations of them.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

Yes, absolutely. RotK needs to explode when it returns to theatres another nail in the coffin for RoP and another reason for WB to do it right.

You're right. I will wait.

The original Lord of the Rings movies were a success because they were movies by Tolkien fans for Tolkien fans - and they stayed true to the books as much as possible. The reason why Game of Thrones was the most successful TV series of all time was because of the quality of the first 6 seasons - when they stuck to the books. Those same fans then turned on the show in disgust in the last 2 seasons, when scriptwriters decided they could do an equal job to the original author (when they clearly couldn't). And this is exactly the reason why Tolkien fans have turned on the Rings of Power. I hope and pray that Warner Bros & New Line Cinema have learned these critical lessons. JUST STAY TRUE TO THE BOOKS - THE WRITINGS OF THEIR AUTHORS ARE THE VERY REASON WHY THESE STORIES ARE KNOWN AND LOVED IN THE FIRST PLACE! There is so much in the Lord of the Rings books that are not in the movies, or epic parts in the books that were nothing more than short scenes in the movies. They could make 6 movies based purely on what is written in the books - there is NO NEED to add anything.

I see where youre coming from, Kramer, I really do. But consider that the original trilogy is probably as close to perfection as we're going to get out of a film adaptation of LotR, or really any film adaptation, I simply cannot imagine that Hollywood, especially the Hollywood we have today, could improve on Peter Jackson's adaptation while remaining true to the source material, much less that they'd have any intention to do so.

@LivingAnachronism

Жыл бұрын

I understand. But I imagine the absolute triumph, the utter blow that could be struck if these films were made well. And that at least, for me, is cause for strategic positivity.

A large thing for me, (as if done wrong it will ruin much of the immersion for myself) is accurate ethnic demography and homogeneity for all kingdoms/regions in middle earth. We know what the people of these places look like and there is massive diversity in the peoples of middle earth, its just extremely unimmersive when these things are not taken into account. For example, the people of Rohan, Rhun and the people of Harad have very distinct cultural and ethnic differences which when respected and represented accurately builds so much more character for these peoples. I Remember back when i played the tabletop game, I would paint my Men of Harad to meet their middle eastern style, and it added to their uniqueness. They were distinct from my men of Gondor with their mediterranean cultural and ethnic aesthetic, and and the men of Gondor were distinct from Rohan's Anglo-Saxon style culture and ethnos.

@mirceazaharia2094

Жыл бұрын

There will be Arabic Rohirrims, Asian Gondorians, a Black Gondorian female steward (yass kween slaaaayyy etc, etc), and Huwhite Orcs. This is to be expected. It will happen pretty much like I've said, I am 99.5% certain of it. But miracles have happened before, or so I've been told.

I dunno. Cinema has beaten us down so much lately it's hard not to be a bit pessimistic. I'll be pleasantly surprised if it is good but i will not expect it to be until proven otherwise.

Darn it. As much as I am on the cautiously pessimistic side, you do make a good case.

I hear you.