Damn Rob, you are unpacking some absolute charmes the past few days, aren't you? Amazing! Glad you got the chance

Going full MrBeast with the video thumbnails

who cares when Pinion drop massive bomb - motor combined with gearbox!

Why are we so preoccupied with the weight? Unless you need to lift the bike what difference is it making really? Ok my bike is around 23kg but i have no issues going anywhere i need to atm.

The power of the bike tells you how fast you can pedal and move forward. It's like how quickly you can make the bike go. Torque, however, is about the force that helps you overcome resistance, like going uphill or starting from a stop. It's like how hard you can push the pedals to move the bike forward. So, power is about how fast you can ride the bike, while torque is about how strong you can pedal to overcome challenges like hills or starting from rest.

@kangsterizer

11 ай бұрын

also nm isnt that complicated if you keep in mind some equivalents: 1kgf is about 9.8nm (so nearly 10). so 55nm is about 5.5kgf. thats like 5-6 large water bottles on a 1 meter stick of force from idle. 85nm motor is 8-10 water bottles. way more force. in other words a 600w motor that cant do more than 55nm will never pull you up steep hills like a 85+nm motor, no matter how many watts, because youd be going too slow to use all the energy the system can provide. in other words, 600W means nothing but speed or consumption, newton meters tell you how useable the bike is on the trail. now if this was a road bike id probably care more about watts than nm, since they dont need as much force to get up the steep bumpy hills. based on all this i suspect the new bosh motor isnt bad but also nothing magical compared to a fazua. perhaps if it can sustain 55nm it is better (fazua does 60 for 10s...). i wonder if marketing folks literally told youtubers to talk about watts to make them look better.. ffs.

@Kefir0

11 ай бұрын

Come on, power = torque X rpm, that is it. To get a full picture we need a graph of torque vs rpm, but manufacturers won't show us those.

@leedove7255

11 ай бұрын

@@Kefir0 This tells you that you have to pedal at a high cadence to get max power. Rob mentions that it has to be over 100rpm. The other motors design peak torque to be at a lower rpm so as you go to high rpm the torque drops quickly which means less max power. I wish manufacturers would publish Torque and power curves so we could make an informed comparison between brand's. As it is we are at the mercy of the Marketing speak numbers.

This makes a great system for a folding or commuter bike!

Yes this frame is most likely a new model from Bulls for this specific motor. I see clear similarities to the existing EVO EN/AM SL series.

started following Rob at around 500subs. Rob has grown with his subs. great quality videos gr from Spain

After a quick test ride I can say its pretty punchy, low down grunt seems really good, and I love the Over Run that this motor provides, very similar to the existing full fat bike! basically full power lite!

@nateums

11 ай бұрын

do you think we'll ever get a 30lb emtb?

@jerryofthebikes

11 ай бұрын

lets be honest, new Pinion motor-gearbox is what Emtb really needs!

@EmandSz

11 ай бұрын

Oo yeah

@TanvirKabir0461

9 ай бұрын

How much does it cost🤔

@adrianhrusca4067

14 күн бұрын

Yes, but at a very high cost, and low reliability​@@nateums

I wouldn't give up my CX for this.

I'm getting kind of excited about ebikes finally. I'd dig a very light helping hand.

The torque rating makes more sense as a measure of oomf. The watt rating doesn't say how many of those watts are turned into heat.

cant wait to see the video you make when it comes out!!

@RobRidesEMTB

11 ай бұрын

Cheers, was too short a test to to get a full opinion on it, but early first impressions were good. Had approx 1 hour on it only.

Exciting times. Can’t wait to see a new 1KW full fat system in the near future. I’m out in the alps, and range anxiety is REAL ! 😅

@Lee-ic2yn

11 ай бұрын

Doesn't that mean your way back is mostly downhill?

@GlennRacing1

11 ай бұрын

Unfortunately not.

Rob, interesting video as ever. A couple of comments: torque is the raw material of power and unless combined with the context of rpm is utterly meaningless. I see this a lot in car and motorcycle specifications. The power curve is all important to determine where in the rev range the power lies.

Really excited about this one. I'm still on my pedal bike, but looking for some electric alternatives, however as I am fairly fit and not heavy at 72kg full powered ebikes are feels too powerful for me, was waiting for some SL options, however none of them looked appealing, there was no middle ground option, I think this Bosch is perfect for my case, now I just need to look for more bikes coming with this new SX motor.

@tonyhowell5283

11 ай бұрын

if you are fit then you should spend 4 hours on a ff before you rule it out I am sure you will be amazed at what you can climb and the speed you can climb and your fitness will mean you can spin on low power and get mega range, also I think heavier FF suspension can work better than on a light bike

Does the range extender fit the Orbea Wild's mysterious blank plate on top of the downtube?

Awesome, excited for the market to be flooded with lightweight ebikes soon so that prices come down...lol Good that the battery seems designed to be removable too.

Curious how it will compare to the TQ, just bought a Fuel EXe!

Last week i tested bosch new motor caled Race...omg sooo powerfull

Bafang m820 has 75Nm and weight 2,10kg :-)

Are those composite cranks? If so, where can one get these?

The 250w battery pack can be connected to the smart 750w system but how? with the normal recharge connector?

Hi Rob, what is the range (up/km)?

I need the New yamaha race❤😮

Another awesome video Rob thanks!!!I'm confused yet again,sx-55nm and 600watts compared to cx-85nm and 650watts.Hows the cx making 30nm more with only 50 watts more?

@e_mtb

11 ай бұрын

When I remember right from another video, it's about the cadence, the CX is offering the full power already about 70 rpm, while the SX needs 120 for the same max output

@glennmorgan8691

11 ай бұрын

@@e_mtb ahh interesting that makes sense thx for your reply!!!

Nice, but if it rattles when not under load I'm out. Why can't Bosch make a motor that doesn't rattle when not providing power?

How’s the motor rattle?

Now we just need safer and less volatile battery tech to get with these improvements!

@Lee-ic2yn

11 ай бұрын

When was the last time you heard of a decent ebike exploding?

You know it better Rob - my 2 years old E10 has a Dengfu 840 Wh battery 48V 13S5P that weights exactly 4kg. This beats the Bosch by 5%….

would the extender battery work on trek rail with 500 battery

Neat little motor and also that low overall weight is very interesting. However I wonder about legal consequences: As a previous commenter stated, this seems to have more power than allowed. Also, for the EU the limit is 250W permanent and 500W peak power. That could cause you some real trouble if you'd ever run into a thorough traffic check on public roads.

@leedove7255

11 ай бұрын

Hi . The only country I know of that lists a max power is Austria which has a 600w limit. Can you point me to where the 500w limit is specified. the Swiss say 500w but I can't find if that is max or continuous.

Are Bosch able to make a modern motor that doesn't rattle since Gen 3 days things seem to have gone downhill....perhaps a visit to their factory to see what's going wrong or would that not be great for any future arrangements with Bosch / KZreadrs like yourself?

1kw is easy but only with big mid-drive on Enduros running Bafang Ultra engines. But these are meant for gravel or flat trail like the Watt Wagons Hydra Archon X1. I actually own a Luna Cycles X2 V2 Ludicrous weighs 52lbs. Plan to get it down to 50lbs if I can. Love my X2 @LUNACYCLES

Gotta Look at BAFANG mid-drives. Or Luna Cycles in California. These bikes are in the low 54lb range for medium but has over 1000watts of power. New M600 should be 750watt-1000watt and weigh 3.1lbs I think.

Why have you got Yr cap.on backwards ..

Rob, Nm is not difficult to understand - it is basics at rotational motion! Maybe hard to understand to people, who dont know mothing about physics or motors. And more over - torque is the primary parameter with rotational motion. Power is secondary and you just calculate it over simple formula through the rpms. Therefore we should give the peak torque and still to tell at which rpms (in ebikes at the chainring). Then easy to calculate peak mechanical power. And it is diffetent to power we taking from dc battery (which would be that 600W). Could be even up to 20% less at chainring (motor and controller efficiency)

I agree

Ok what is the crack with 15.5 mph and max 250 watt power to be UK legal now on the gov website? only one i can see being legal worth having in the old levo sl @ 240 watts?

@leedove7255

11 ай бұрын

250 continuous not Max. I have never been able to find out what this really means, the legal docs must specify a test method for it to get approval, I need to keep looking. BS1727 method is quoted in UK law but at £100 I will not be buying a copy to find out what that is 🙂

Good insight 👍🏻, shame about the required cadence, 100 rpm is crazy fast, most people pedal at 80 ish, no way you can pedal 100 rpm with flat pedals for example, so really the 600w is a pointless number and wont be seen by 99% of people. Its a good headline number for marketing but that's about it

I'm a 1400cc biker so I know nothing about these things. What range does this have on a charge?

M820 when?

Sounds like lightweight performance at a sky high price.

Shame that there is no smaller / lighter ~160wh range extender offered

I think the bike is the new Norco fluid vlt

So do fit legs

WELL SAID, CHEERS

i think you got your watts and newton meters mixed up, any motor will produce more watts at a high cadence, it's the torque that goes down, watts is the total "work" done by a motor, speed is the multiplier here, to simplify you could say that watts = torque multiplied by speed, so no, the watts do not go down with speed, in any motor, electric or not.

PRICE?

A kilowatt of energy density? Or a kilowatthour of battery capacity?

@leedove7255

11 ай бұрын

Energy Density is wh/KG (Specific) or wh/cubic meter (volumetric), I think he meant KWh. Doing all these number to camera it must be easy to get it wrong ;-)

This range extender wouldn’t work with the 625Wh Rail, would it? Is it only compatible with the 750Wh model?

The drip feed of marketed new products in the ebike world stinks ! Bosch changed all the fitment and connection types when they changed from the CX to the CX smart system for no apparent reason. They didn't dare make the range extender not backwards compatable, but they would have if they thought they could have got away with it.

@neutronpcxt372

11 ай бұрын

It's not drip feeding us advancements. It's worse: they are doing this on purpose so that we have to buy new stuff.

@Lee-ic2yn

11 ай бұрын

It's a joke, trying to treat us like iPhone customers

@neutronpcxt372

11 ай бұрын

@@Lee-ic2yn Apple is honestly better in this regard. Last I checked, you can use any good old USB battery pack to give your phone some extra charge at least...

Norco has just announced their new Fluid VLT with this motor. Bike will be all carbon with 130mm and 140mm travel options. In my opinion they should have called it the Optic VLT, but whatever.

New for 2025 the Bosch SSx only weights 800 grams and produces 600watts at cadence of 500 RPM. Reports from beta testers is its pretty punchy. similar to the existing full fat bike! basically full power superlite. will come with recommendation to have your heart checked before riding.

Straight up motorcycle.

@leedove7255

11 ай бұрын

What?

It is so mutch marketing talking going on. For DIY ebike builders 1000wh battery is nothing special for very long. I would not say it is bad, but the market is so controlled and not open for individual tuning

Good to see 👀 but getting a battery of 400kwh is not enough! 550kwh minimum! Putting often the range extender is not the way!

⚔️💪😎👌👍(stroke)

If its 600 watts peak thats getting more like it but dont charge me 15 or 20 k for it...!

hmmm really understand , i think no make sence , because cx motor have 85nm

Its about 40wh/kg more 😅 in 6 years

I think the demo bike is a Trek

no offence, but after the video of Pinion MGU - everything else seems outdated

@Lee-ic2yn

11 ай бұрын

Yeah but how long will that thing last Well have to wait a few years to find out if they're a disaster or not

@finroddd

11 ай бұрын

@@Lee-ic2yn I hope it will be a success but let’s see

Hey Rob, I am an ex semi-pro mountain bike racer and final year mechanical engineering student. I'd like to offer myself up to go over your scripts for an hourly rate, making sure you use scientifically correct terminology. Get in touch if curious!

the super light giant still punching out everything :/

Battery tech is still in it's infancy. Soon every EMTB will under 40lbs, have lots of Nm to spare and run 'forever'. A team from the Institute of Physics at the Chinese Academy of Sciences recently tested a lithium battery at 711.3 Wh/kg with an amazing volumetric density of 1653.65 Wh/litre 😲 So within the same parameters of the 2.2kg 400w Bosch battery, future tech would provide over 1400 watts and take up less volume than a litre. Think about the applications for that. E-flight comes to mind.

@I_THE_ME

11 ай бұрын

Chinese universities make such claims every single month, but these ideas pretty much never can be implemented in large scale manufacturing. The same claims were made about titanium oxide batteries, but after worldwide hype, nothing came out of it.

@leedove7255

11 ай бұрын

@@I_THE_ME Better voltage and Energy density are not claimed for LTO batteries. In fact along with higher cost the Energy Density is one of the negatives when compared to Lith.

@sjaan7370

11 ай бұрын

@@I_THE_ME So do American universities. Power storage is the future and everybody's got skin in the game. It was purely a successful a lab test which gives us a glimpse into the future... with lithium for that matter.

I wonder how long it will last and how much engineered obsolesce it has built in . I would prefer to buy Japanese as its designed to last

@leedove7255

11 ай бұрын

Unless it is made by Shimano. I am on my 4th E8000 (18k km) as they are non serviceable. It would seem that all motors are very similar in the real world.

@RSADYNAMICS

11 ай бұрын

@@leedove7255 German products have more engineering insolence in my experience at least when I compare my German cars to my Japanese ones

@leedove7255

11 ай бұрын

@@RSADYNAMICS engineering insolence ???

@RSADYNAMICS

11 ай бұрын

@@leedove7255 obsolescence

Backwards compatible 😂 I am watching to much digital foundry

FFS just pedal your damn bike... like they were supposed to be propelled

55nm? 💩

Rob singlehandedly redefining English language. Rob the woke ebiker. When 600watts and 55Nm are considered a 'Huge punch'. Some would call that a misrepresentation. More honest people would call that a lie. In any event, Rob is going for clicks and needs someone to hold his Bud Light.

@SuperiorNo1

11 ай бұрын

Rob Is A Posh Boy 😂😭😈

Bosch is ടhit in home appliances!