Like the video says, my head agrees with Tommy, my heart agrees with Roman. Another consideration, the BFGs are too heavy for this rig. Get a P rated A/T tire like the geolander so you can improve traction without all the weight. Roman is right, Subaru is leaving $ on the table by not offering a legit off road subaru.

@JDS-Dalton

4 жыл бұрын

I just got the wildpeak a/t trails for my forester. Those tires are specifically made for crossovers and while they're not as capable as a KO2, they're more than enough all terrain for my subie and only weighs 5 pounds more per tire than the stock ones.

@jakebiel8979

4 жыл бұрын

The geolander g015 is a pretty decent tire

@rodneydecormier1504

4 жыл бұрын

The dealerships are doing one-off upgrades. My dealership has a lifted crosstrek with 2" lift, method 302 wheels, off road tires, push bar, basket. Looks great.

@CurtGodwin

4 жыл бұрын

@@JDS-Dalton I did the same with my Outback XT. Subaru should've made the Wildpeaks standard equipment on the Forester Sport, Crosstrek, and the Outback XT Onyx Edition.

@87gunsnroses

4 жыл бұрын

I have ko2s on my crosstrek and they are far from too heavy for it.

I drive a lifted Tacoma 4wd, and I like the Subie community. Most of the off road groups just want to go rock crawling some boring rock obstacles at 1 mph while denting and scratching their rigs, while most subie drivers just want to see nature and go on scenic trails. The latter is much funner to me.

@krover01

4 жыл бұрын

The beauty of the Tacoma and similar is that you can do both! Where as the Subie can on only do one. I love technical rock crawling and scenic trails so thats what I do with truck. There is no reason with all new tech, that you cant build a vehicle that does everything, including rock crawling! A Subaru will get you far enough get into a situation you cant get out of!

@Agent.K.

4 жыл бұрын

Another thing the taco does better is dune bashing. I prefer smashing the gas pedal, climb a huge dune, and then slide all the way down. Occasional jumps are not that bad! Off-roading is so diverse and everyone has a favorite!

@christopherwilson9140

4 жыл бұрын

I'm an oddball with a gmc envoy. Its got a 2in lift, 32in a/t, and some odds and ends. It rocks for long off road trips seeing nature and has the guts to deal with some obsticals. Well I went out with a jeep group this weekend where the whole trail was a rock obstical and your top speed all day is 6mph. I was amazed my rig made it and one of them even got stuck. But that kind of off roading I think im going to save for every now and then and I am more interested in the long distance overland-ish trips I was doing before. Which could be done in a wide variety of 4x4s.

@bigjermini

4 жыл бұрын

I want my vehicle to where: if i suddenly get the itch, i can just yeet the bad boy off the road and up wooded the mountains going full steam ahead. Or with snorkel...hop into the flood zone and pick up some stranded folks, and get out to a hospital and store.

@leggoman1000

4 жыл бұрын

Exactly

Lifted my Subaru after watching this video.

@connorgoldy7706

3 жыл бұрын

Lmao this made me laugh

@bigblizzhigh

3 жыл бұрын

My brother is about to lift his 2015 legacy because he tows a boat and if he has to go a lil off the road he can lol

@Homecar220

3 жыл бұрын

I lifted my 05' forester. I got as big of tires as I could fit, used a 2" lift, as well as King lift springs all around. I added aluminum skid plates on the engine/oil pan, transmission and rear diff. I've lived in Alaska for several years and drove my subaru twice from Ohio through Canada to Alaska. I've driven through multiple Alaskan winters and NEVER gotten stuck anywhere. In fact, I've pushed and pulled several trucks out of ditches, when their overconfident drivers forgot that 4-wheel drive doesn't mean much on ice! I've driven up mountains, through streams, over sand dunes, beaches, downed trees and the deepest mud or snow you could imagine driving through. Usually when my "truck" friends go for an off road ride in my subie, they tell me how they wish their trucks were more like my vehicle. I'm by no means saying my forester could out-climb a tacoma or similar vehicle. I'm just saying, (short of driving specifically to a rock climb event) my forester has taken me EVERYWHERE I've ever needed it to, and some places I didn't!

@flowerasteroid6241

3 жыл бұрын

@@Homecar220 i used to have a 02 forester that I loved but wrecked it had to get a new car. Thinking of getting another one thats a few years newer and getting a lift kit and roof rack tent so i could go and stay literally anywhere. But i was worried about how reliable/worth it a lift kit would be on a subaru vs a truck/realSUV. This comment has given me much more confidence in thinking about the subaru thanks lol.

@Homecar220

3 жыл бұрын

@@flowerasteroid6241 For sure. I live in Ohio now, but the snow still gets serious from time to time and with everything going on in the US, I still may need those skid plates!

Sickest part about off-roading in a subie: Jeep boys- “how the hell did your lezbaru wagon get up here?!”

@somebodyelse5

3 жыл бұрын

That a Jeep people issue haha

@JIMIIXTLAN

3 жыл бұрын

Lezbaru that's a good one

@brucelafone2910

3 жыл бұрын

Haha, I always thought Lezbarus were specifically the Forrester

@Sinn3246

3 жыл бұрын

@@brucelafone2910 I thought it was the Outback... cuz baby got back.

@C10Build

3 жыл бұрын

I'm a lesbian stuck in a man's body. 🤣

Just bought an Outback. My first Subaru. I know 90% or more of driving will be on the street but I want to explore light offroad and get into camping spots. I think there are a lot of people like me out there and why Subaru is doing so well.

@big.gib.4L

Жыл бұрын

Totally agree, that's the whole reason I got my little 04 outback, subaru fills the casual outdoor niche very well

@Embarrassed4U

11 ай бұрын

​@@big.gib.4Lit doesn't even really need to be casual. It's just not for rock crawling. People take subarus into some of the harshest environments. Obviously the old ones with low gears are better for some things.

@DielectricFailure

6 ай бұрын

That’s about 60% for why I wanted my Outback. Just trail driving deep into the Green Mountains in Vermont!

why does off road have to only mean rock crawling all the time?

@dzroc

4 жыл бұрын

Exactly, most of these lifted subarus including mine, are used mostly on dirt roads a little more clearence and better choice in meaty tires. Deff not rock crawling

@jouruji

4 жыл бұрын

There's no right or wrong here....

@WeatherWarriordotnet

4 жыл бұрын

EXACTLY. Not me. Need FAST speed over Texas farm roads and can get out of deep sand.

@lilymae4131

4 жыл бұрын

Sometimes they seemed focused mostly on where they live and how they might use vehicles, but owners are all different and so are our needs. I didn't lift my Forester, but did up one size to an A/T tire with next to no sacrifice, but understand how it could benefit some doing a lift. In our 4X4 group we had outings of various difficulty and you knew ahead of time if you should take the CJ or if a CUV would be adequate. We had outings just for fun to get out in the woods and enjoy nature, and also had completion events for those into such. Sometimes we were amazed by the ability of some vehicles, and a couples times vehicles which looked impressive like an old style full size Blazer that looked like it should be on the cover of an off road supply company's catalog, but had to be rescued more than once by a plain old bare bones CJ or Landcruiser who just went through with ease. Don't know if the Blazer was the problem or the driver. TFL seems to really enjoy knocking Subaru. Toyota and Honda each have a vehicle which imply it is off road worthy, but you don't see them taking shots at them. They are getting like the grocery store tabloid of automotive reporting, headlines that make you look and no substance.

@davidalejandro8470

4 жыл бұрын

It doesn’t. He tailored his definition to fit the intended outcome of his video.

This argument boils down to your definition of “off road”. Not everyone wants to rock crawl, but just because you’re not rock crawling doesn’t mean you’re not “off road” and that’s where I think the elitist thing comes into play. Jeep people feel like the only true off roading is taking your rig to some boulder filled oasis and running it up 60 degree canyons and if you’re not doing things like that then you’re not really off-roading and I disagree. To me off roading is simply that, running your rig where there are no roads and there are plenty of places where suped up subies are capable of going that fit that definition. So to me the whole debate is simply based in the elitist idea by traditionalist Jeep guys that if you’re not doing it like us then you’re not really doing it and that just simply isn’t true. Great video guys ✌🏽

@AWDfreak

4 жыл бұрын

I couldn't have said it any better., that's well-explained!

@joeyoung1498

4 жыл бұрын

I agree. People do this with everything. Check out gun vids. Gun snobs have a problem with any gun that doesn't start off at $600.00 plus. Do what works for you.

@saifuddinahmadable

4 жыл бұрын

What you are talking about falls into overlanding and not necessarily offroading. Tommy is making a case of a stock subaru where the user is not necessarily imcreasing the vehicles ability to offroad better relative to the money they are spending.

@clwade10

4 жыл бұрын

Hell a big percentage of Jeeps never even see dirt! All that matters is does it work for you? Are you happy with it? Then who cares! Still paying off my daily driver jeep so the last thing I want to do is break an axle on boulders!

@salsa83

4 жыл бұрын

Subarus as they stand currently are no more off-road worthy than a Prius. So no it’s not an elitist thing, matter of fact these Subarus owners never ending boast about how off road capable their “battlewagons” are. Meanwhile anyone with a true 4x4 knows they could never hang off-roading.

My wife has a completely stock 2018 Crosstrek and i drove it up some mining trails in Ricco Colorado where only Jeeps are normally allowed. The trails were made of basketball sized boulders and the Crosstrek drove right up it. I bottomed out a few times but took no damage. The only damage was from hitting a tree branch and breaking the window. I even have it on video.

@michaelbell390

Жыл бұрын

I've had my outback go through muddy steep hills simply stock and moderate jeep trails one must just pay attention.

@Embarrassed4U

11 ай бұрын

​@@michaelbell390the key is don't be a shitty driver.

I actually have my 2019 Subaru Forester stock besides some deeper tread, and I've tackled black diamond, and wrangler dedicated trails with ease not to mention drove through the 4-6 foot fresh powder that was dumped on Big Bear lake this last year, and did it with stock tires, with ease. I got this car for my two children for safety originally, and being an off road enthusiast I thought it was a minivan at first. After owning this car, and seeing how truly capable it is off road, I completely understand needing a lift, and a bit of extra clearance. I'm 29 and support the fathers opinion entirely. -Angelo

@Embarrassed4U

11 ай бұрын

Yeah the CVT sucks argument is old. You can't charge every hill but you also don't have to take the dumbest possible line every time to try to prove how much they suck for your youtube channel.

Never lift a Subaru *Subaru:* sells a lifted Legacy Wagon as the Outback

@smrtguy77777

4 жыл бұрын

Claudio Bizama And a lifted Impreza as the Crosstrek

@MoreSatori

4 жыл бұрын

The market for used Toyota 4wd 4Runners and Tacomas is absolutely ridiculous. Way overpriced. So I got a 2005 Forester and lifted it. Works great for my use case.

@solarfry

4 жыл бұрын

You definitely will get a hernia.

@johnsmith-gt3po

4 жыл бұрын

Outback is lifted legacy.

@Y10Q

4 жыл бұрын

but they lift it correctly in the factory. They actually raise the body so it is at the correct angle for the axles. When you do it yourself, your axles will not last too long.

I’m lifting my Subaru, not to rock climb but to go on the trails and travel around with it.

@bernardodehoyos3762

3 жыл бұрын

same here

@bernardodehoyos3762

2 жыл бұрын

@@mondo_burrito it's awesome , lifted 2" , KO2 tires and a roof top tent i am going to the beach tomorrow will post on Instagram @bjdehoys_

@amykading

2 жыл бұрын

@@bernardodehoyos3762 I wanted to check out your IG account to see your subie, but couldn't find it! :(

@JohnHarvey

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah same. Even on non maintained dirt roads extra ground clearance can help quite a bit. Just want to be prepared for the sketchy stuff.

@Flsubuwu

2 жыл бұрын

@@JohnHarvey it’s great, I have 12 inches of ground clearance and can go pretty much wherever I need it to go.

I just want to go with my outback to the coolest campsite without scraping the life out of it, thats why

@alexnelson8

2 жыл бұрын

Word

I had a 2016 cross trek. I went down 1 size on the rims and put on general grabber AT2 tires. That little car took me everywhere I wanted to go. Now it wasn’t a “rock crawler” but with smart decisions I was able to get down most trails. I loved that car and eventually gave it to my daughter

The same argument can be made when trucks are lowered. Even though it limits the capability the truck was meant to have, it's ultimately the decision of the buyer.

@pattyfluegel7816

4 жыл бұрын

I drive a lifted 88 GL wagon with 4 high and low and I love it. Its very upsetting to me that Its falling apart and I cant get parts etc. I dont want to drive one of the new peices of computerized junk. I dont want to trade true mechanical capability for a bunch of tech bells and whistles I dont even want. Its BS

@maurobeltran3072

4 жыл бұрын

No kema cuh

@OhPhuckYou

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah, but Lowered trucks can't even drive on pavement half the time. I can understand a lifted Subie, but a lowered truck owner needs their license taken away for their sins.

The offroad community sure does get in a twist because some subie boys want to go camping at some national parks lol

@UtahBigfoothunter

4 жыл бұрын

That's fine, if you feel safe protecting your home and family with a squirt gun, that's your prerogative.

@MK-yv7ng

4 жыл бұрын

@@UtahBigfoothunter I'll use my shotgun, but you can overcompensate if you want.

@0xsergy

4 жыл бұрын

@@UtahBigfoothunter lol ye, since they need 38" tires and 6 inch suspension plus 2 inch body lift to conquer gravel roads.

@ezakustam

3 жыл бұрын

@@UtahBigfoothunter It's hard to protect your family if your wife rolls the thing on a commute and kills her and your kids when the body crumbles. Different tools for different jobs, I guess. But it would be really nice if some of these 4X4s had roadworthiness and IIHS / NHTSA safety ratings as good as their off-road capabilities. I get the on-road trade-off, but I never could understand why "tough" trucks seemingly can't have good crash ratings.

@papermind4010

3 жыл бұрын

Utah Bigfoot Hunter my 2005 Impreza has seen more mud than most people I know with lifted trucks

I want to lift my Subaru, so I could go anywhere, and I could sleep inside of it.

Lifted my forester simply to get bigger tire clearance to put snow tires on it for snowboard trips. That's it. I dont want/need a jeep or truck.

@Stickyickygnar

3 жыл бұрын

I have a bigger wheeled Chevy pick up to go to the mtn in that gets 14mph.....I also just got a bad ass AWD outback to go to the mtn that gets 29mph.

Totally disagree with Tom, there are plenty of Subaru's down here in Australia that are effectively some of the best multipurpose cars on the road. Fantastic handling, comfort and safety, but with a 2" lift a bullbar and some spotties they are incredibly capable. I deny the idea that people lift Subaru's to keep up with a Jeep. The reason people lift Subaru's is to get "that tiny bit further", without comprising on road dynamics. Jeep v Subaru on road there is no comparison, Subaru's stick like glue. A lifted Subaru is an ultimate best of both worlds. In saying this, I don't believe my argument stands true for the newer CVT Subaru's. They are trash!!! Old 5 speeds are way better. My Forester XT had over 210kw, a small lift, snorkel, recovery gear and there was not a single national Park it couldn't reach! That thing had torque in every gear on a steep incline. There's people that go off-road to reach nice secluded campsites, beaches and rivers. Then there's the people that use there car to mount cliffs and rocks. Subaru people (generally) are practical and outdoorsy

@danieljohn589

4 жыл бұрын

@@dispatchesfromtheoutbackan8407 Wonderful, exactly.

@procrastinator1842

4 жыл бұрын

Agree, I'm running a 2" lifted outback with 1.59:1 custom dual range AWD box, 12kgf centre diff, AT tyres etc and I love that it's super comfortable on a 1200km touring day, safe as houses on a wet twisty mountain pass or gravel roads out of town (I live in Tassie) but I can look down any shitty side track and not worry (famous last words) about getting stuck. This dude just doesn't get it, a Jeep is (very) good at one thing only. The (slightly modded) Subie is a swiss army knife.

@marcusmartinez7725

3 жыл бұрын

Exactly, big disconnect on this video. moab monster? these are built for function. Whole other segment / market being skipped here.

@tbabashoff

3 жыл бұрын

Love it, perfect reply! Lifting mine now!

@chir0pter

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, the whole TFL vs Subaru saga is really about how bad the Subaru CVT+AWD combo is.

I lifted my Forester 4 years ago without any problems and it gets me over bigger obstacles and the driving hasn’t changed. Cv joints are still looking great.

@Karen-pl8kd

4 жыл бұрын

One with cvt?

@reinenruud390

4 жыл бұрын

Norse Viking Æsir 3cm

@reinenruud390

4 жыл бұрын

Ari Gonz manual 😉

@om617yota8

4 жыл бұрын

What did that do to your MPG?

@vhssociety

4 жыл бұрын

I wouldnt take it personally. They just really hate the outback for some reason lol. It's like this weird biased they put in all their videos. Every test they have done its completely biased lol. I actually love in a place where we get real snow unlike they do, and my outback has literally taken everything it's gotten thrown at it.

"buy a used Touareg" - Lost all credibility at that point :)

Honest review. Main point: Subaru could and should offer options for different transmission and lift kit (like Jeep does with different mechanical AWD packages) for the customers who want/need it.

There was a time when 4wd Subarus had a lever , near the center console, that allowed the driver to select 4wd hi or 4wd low. Subaru should bring that back.

@simonbroddle754

4 жыл бұрын

I agree, I have a 2017 Forester diesel manual which is great. Continental A/T's and it's great. Would love the low range but also an Eaton Truetrac would also be nice.

@jOoomOooo

4 жыл бұрын

they also had 2 wheel drive

@subaruanon

3 жыл бұрын

They still do have low range gearboxes in other countries, and always have. Subaru of America just had their head up their butt and won't offer it here for some reason. If you really want one you can import the transmission, lever, and interior trim and slap it in relatively cheaply.

@ridelikeagirlaus8751

3 жыл бұрын

Jacob Burnette it’s probably because they don’t have a market in the US for it. In Australia they don’t sell a manual Subaru because they simply don’t sell.

@soundsolutions

3 жыл бұрын

@@ridelikeagirlaus8751 is that why I haven't come across a manual Fozz here in Oz yet?

There are hundreds of Outbacks and Foresters lifted 2" running BFG KO2's and doing it well. Y'all need to watch Utube more often.

@BittyVids

4 жыл бұрын

The Subaru hate in this channel is pathetic. It’s clear they are butthurt because Subaru doesn’t give them free cars anymore.

@karlsturzebecher9463

4 жыл бұрын

Harlan Mccoy - Yup ! Some folks are all too worked up about jeep brand verses enjoy the great outdoors.

@solarfry

4 жыл бұрын

They proved that subaru outback could go up that mound o rocks and dirt shown in this video on a second video. The Subaru is way quieter than the Wrangler on the road. Now with Xmode all it's missing is the lockers, which are available. The CVT is warranted now for 100k miles. I like the Wrangler Unlimited but I hate the wind noise at any speed over 15

@karlsturzebecher9463

4 жыл бұрын

Solar Fry - I am going to try this later on since I don’t have x mode on my Crosstrek. www.torqmasters.com/torq_locker_tl_r1605b_subaru_r160_five_bolt

@davidalejandro8470

4 жыл бұрын

Mine is on of them. 2” lift. 235/70r15. No issues. 20k miles on the old used axles. Daily driver and off road rig.

I’d say your argument against prepping and off-roading is entirely mitigated by the fact that you can get the forester and crosstrek in manual transmissions. If CVT is your main issue Subaru has a solution.

@Andy-df5fj

Жыл бұрын

Not anymore..

@chevydavidson9220

Жыл бұрын

Yeah can’t get a manual in the 2.0xt turbo we bought in 2015.

@codybrackett812

Жыл бұрын

I literally just seen a 2023 6 speed manual crostrek

@dr.borisbalinkoff5756

Жыл бұрын

@@codybrackett812 Bought one last week to replace my 2015 manual Crosstrek.

@skateboardkid420

Жыл бұрын

2003 wrx doesn't have this issue either.

I have a 23 wilderness and while I know this is an old video, my OBW is more than capable on moderate logging roads. I haven’t lifted it yet, but there were times where I would’ve felt a little more secure with an extra inch. The CVT did great and has yet to let me down.

Gents, I climbed a HUGE mountain here outside of Austin yesterday with a bunch of Jeeps around me (I have a TRD Pro) and there was a kid there with a Subaru with a 2" lift, a winch, etc, and he had zero trouble in some really impressive areas. I think it's also 95% skill and 5% vehicle. I don't think I'd have the skill to motor a Subaru but he certainly did and well.

@bigjermini

4 жыл бұрын

To be fair, i take my 06 Saturn ion 2.2 ecotec 4spd manual, in places a lil family car probably shouldn't be lol. The life of a delivery driver in a crater county. The lil brat has handled 80k miles of unpaved, potholed, muddy, washboard road, curvy back road abuse. Suspension has gotten loose and floppy...which ended up making it better lol.

@brucewaldbauer7216

4 жыл бұрын

That is so true I’ve said for over 40 years that a good driver can make a shitty truck look good , and a shitty driver can make a great truck look like shit .

@MySlugger

4 жыл бұрын

Where at...I live in Austin and want to try it...

@JasonWh

4 жыл бұрын

@@MySlugger Hidden Falls Adventure Park. They have tracks from easy to HOLY SHIZ.

@edwinmedina4338

3 жыл бұрын

Was this outback blue by any chance 😅?

Subaru needs to bring Baja back since people started lifting their Subaru’s

@mdanenome91

4 жыл бұрын

Alex Kostenyuk I have a Baja 5spd and took it off-roading stock and it did amazing. just bought a wrx to be my daily driver. So plan on beefing Baja for off-roading fun.

@godemperorhoover2131

4 жыл бұрын

I lifted my Baja 4" and put 31" Boggers on it... much fun

@alphafert608

4 жыл бұрын

100% agree. I daily an sti & looked for a baja for utility but ended up with an older Toyota pickup.

@tomrichards6207

3 жыл бұрын

The Baja prototype/show car at introduction actually featured a low range transfer case. Unfortunately never made it into production.

@denverspin

3 жыл бұрын

The Baja is just an Outback with the roof cut off the trunk. I own a Baja and an OB. Same vehicle

"thousands of dollars" quality lift kit with trailing arm spacers - $400 New set of AT tires - $600 i live on 3 miles of dirt roads that looks like a world war 1 battlefield full of craters and trenches during the rainy season, not everyone wants to "ROCK CRAWL"

@vikingselph5475

3 жыл бұрын

Hi. Wherr do i get a lift for my impreza?

@soundsolutions

3 жыл бұрын

@@vikingselph5475 Ebay will have 2" lift kit with trailer arm spacers for about $400-AUS. That's a good quality kit with camber adjusted spacers you can fit with a few simple mechanics tools in a day.

I lifted my Subaru Crosstrek 2" with Geolander G015 tires and a roof rack. Loved it. Had people always asking me about it and wanting to buy it. Not a serious killer offroader, but did modify approach and departure angles. I think it had right at 10.8" clearance.

*In Texas It's Social State Law to Lift your Vehicle* 😂

I laugh at this because the trail you were using is adopted by a local Subaru club in Colorado that has several lifted vehicles.

@kootsmike5833

4 жыл бұрын

SR3711 I scratch my head at these guys a lot, but still enjoy their content.

@frankiedesam8624

4 жыл бұрын

Michael DeJong they are just coming up with some type of content so we can watch you know need to think out side of the box lol

@hackonefouryou

4 жыл бұрын

They just wanted to see if anyone would notice.

@promiscuouscrab4040

4 жыл бұрын

They have been so consistently bias they reject all evidence pointing otherwise. Subaru’s in other countries are sold with low range and are regularly used for more serious off roading.

@AmirPomen

4 жыл бұрын

@@promiscuouscrab4040 low range transmission in subaru died when they went to cvt instead of conventional auto transmission

As a Subaru owner myself here was my thought process. I originally wanted a 4 runner but there was a significant price difference. Not a few thousand but like 10 thousand. Not to mention the gas mileage difference. I was able to get my Subaru Forester sport with a lifetime power train warranty. I wanted something that was reliable to take camping all over. I'm not doing rock crawling. I'm not going to Moab. I just want to be prepared for some sketchy dirt or gravel roads of I need to get through it. If I hit a muddy dirt road on an incline I can confidently get out with my Subaru. I'm not purposely taking it mudding or through creeks and stuff. I did lift mine 2" and put all terrain tires because I camp in the North Carolina mountains all the time. That setup maybe cost me 1200 more. There's a lot of non maintained sketchy roads that do require a little more clearance. I've been through many spots where my buddy's Tacoma would get stuck or slide in 2wd and my Subaru easily glided over with no effort. Sure xmode is just software but the newest version does help quite a bit. Motto of the story is I don't think most Subaru owners are wanting to go rock crawling. Most of us just want to travel most anywhere and want an affordable reliable vehicle to get us there. I think I made a great choice.

@RaulEdu33

Жыл бұрын

Hey John, have you tried taking your lifted subaru in very loose and/or wet sand at the outer banks? I'm looking for a small suv for surf trips and daily commute to work.

@JohnHarvey

Жыл бұрын

@@RaulEdu33 yes! I have actually done quite a bit of off roading since that last post including on the dunes in outer banks and in Ocala Florida. I own a 2019 Forester sport with the dual x mode along with a 2" lift and 245/65r17 falcon wildpeak all terrain tires. Helps quite a bit.

@RaulEdu33

Жыл бұрын

@@JohnHarvey Awesomeness, thank you for sharing, I think a new Suby it is 🙂🤙

@teitaafu461

8 ай бұрын

This is helping my decision making🤙🏾

So I am a Jeep owner who has just purchased a 2003 Subaru Forester in the past three months. I have put a 2” ADF lift on it and added Cooper AT3’s to it with rims. Now the Subaru does have the 4EAT automatic transmission, 4 cylinder 2.5L and I have found that this little beast climbs really well and drive very nice with all the mods. So I have to say Tommy your wrong on off-road capability but right on it won’t go everywhere a Jeep will go. This rig is a very capable vehicle for the more moderate off-roading and highway use. By the way, I haven’t lost much of the handling with the lift and tires. This little Fozzi rocks for just pure fun.

@jieiku

7 ай бұрын

Notice any extra Vibrations after the ADF lift? drive-ability is still ok?

@williamsiler9116

7 ай бұрын

@@jieiku no vibrations at all. I did get the transmission bushing for it as well but never used it.

Me in my supercharge BRZ like; "I guess I have to lift it now."

@supercooled

4 жыл бұрын

Still slower than a Kia stinger. Lol

@pellcio

4 жыл бұрын

But still only 2 wheel drive

@forresttm

4 жыл бұрын

Weld the diff and it'll be fine :D

@frederickevans4113

4 жыл бұрын

@@supercooled maybe so, but I'd trust a Japanese vehicle over anything Korean, most European vehicles (including the kitty from Hades), and all American cars. Maybe I'm biased, but my bias was hard earned driving and fixing my parents' Dodge/Plymouth cars (and others owned by other friends/relatives), the 5 VW cars my wife & I have owned, several 'Benzes (including my wife's current W210 E320), and my 1998 Toyota Camry with well over 452,000 original miles. After doing a handful of head-gaskets on various vehicles, my first complete overhaul was a 1977 Datsun 280Z. In my current Camry which is approaching half-a-million, I go camping, tow a trailer, and otherwise erase "gentle" & "cautious" from the dictionary. Have fun with a Stinger, just don't cry when it becomes a money pit. Toyota owns 20% of Subaru now. I'm looking for a used Forrester with 5-on-the-floor and I'll keep my Camry too.

@A_Degenerate_with_Glasses

4 жыл бұрын

That's a Toyota with a Subaru heart transplant (engine).

Lifted Subaru is a better choice than a lifted VW Bug

@kootsmike5833

4 жыл бұрын

notinside1 *new school* VW bug. The oldies are a sweet choice for a lift

@Captain_Brown_Beard

4 жыл бұрын

At least the Bugs flat 4 wont eat its head gasket

@michaelrodriguez8345

4 жыл бұрын

I wish VW had shoe horned the alltrack into the beetle. Then it would've been a "real" Dune. 😭

@alecsolano5472

4 жыл бұрын

The bug couldn’t even make it through 3 inches of snow what a joke honestly

@0xsergy

4 жыл бұрын

@@kootsmike5833 except their frames are too weak for offroad use

I'm on my second Subaru Forester. First a 2002 with regular automatic and now a 2017 with CVT and 'X-mode". I like both cars. The 2002 is superior off road hands down. Not long after I bought the 2017 I took it to a steep dirt hill I had been up and down many times. I put it in x-mode and attempted to climb the hill. It made it about half way and powered out without spinning a wheel! I learned later the computer had cut power to protect the CVT. If you want to off road in a Subaru you DO NOT want the CVT.

My 07 forester is just amazing how it handles dirt roads. I've done 5 000 km at about 90 km/h and I had no trouble at all, and a lot of fun, burning less gas than a wrangler !

When you compare the Subaru at the end of your video against the Honda CR-V being no more off road Worthy. Do you ever consider the symetrical all wheel drive to be a much better system than the Honda's front wheel drive bias all wheel drive system. It seems alot of reviews don't really dive into different all wheel drive systems.

@d-leut5125

3 жыл бұрын

Subaru awd will smoke rav and cr-v awd.... not even the same. I agree

@scottwarden6738

3 жыл бұрын

Right? How could car guys miss this?

Offroading a Subaru is fun in the same way it's fun to drive a slow car fast but not fun to drive a fast car slow. I promise you they aren't modifying them to rock crawl or do what a Jeep will do. Good off-road oriented tires make a huge difference and a lift really depends on what type of terrain you're on if it would be beneficial.

@shellcracker18

4 жыл бұрын

Snewflake very well said! Why does off road translate to rock crawling? Insane

@soundsolutions

3 жыл бұрын

Very thoughtful, I put truck ply tyres 215/60/16 with a slightly more agressive pattern for trails and gravel roads and have better puncture resistance. Still undecided about a lift kit. I have King springs in the rear so is a little lift or "stance". It is still great on hwy use and only a little noise comes from tyres. Am happy with its overland capability.

I love my Crosstreks! Got one of the first ones in 2013 and have since upgraded to a 2019. Its perfect for highway driving and it will also get me to most all of the trailheads. I thinks its cool to add visual mods, but Im not doing anything to jeopardize the comfort or good gas mileage.

Road comfort be damned. I want a racecar that can drive in the snow. Why isn't there an Sti Crosstrek?

@connorgoldy7706

3 жыл бұрын

Fax

@Gringorican

3 жыл бұрын

I've been asking that for years. I need one T_T

@christianhernandez9172

3 жыл бұрын

Would you pay 40k for a Crosstrek? We have a 2021 Crosstrek Sport, the one with the 2.5L engine. 1.5 inch lift, offroad tires and rims. 37k. An STI Crosstrek would be around 40-45k. It doesn't make sense from a business standpoint.

@joek4238

3 жыл бұрын

The existing sti is a 40 grand Impreza, and they sell that.

Crosstrek and Impreza come in manual. Or buy an older Subaru without CVT.

@kickyadick

4 жыл бұрын

darin desroches love my 3rd gen manual OB

@Stuka87

4 жыл бұрын

The problem is the manual version of the Crosstrek is terrible. It has even less power and without a low range even small hills will stall the engine at lower speeds. Basically it comes down to Subaru's (modern) being terrible for even forest roads because they lack a low range.

@pattyfluegel7816

4 жыл бұрын

I drive a lifted 88 GL wagon with 4 high and low and I love it. Its very upsetting to me that Its falling apart and I cant get parts etc. I dont want to drive one of the new peices of computerized junk. I dont want to trade true mechanical capability for a bunch of tech bells and whistles I dont even want. Its BS

@pattyfluegel7816

4 жыл бұрын

@@Stuka87 I drive a lifted 88 GL wagon with 4 high and low and I love it. Its very upsetting to me that Its falling apart and I cant get parts etc. I dont want to drive one of the new peices of computerized junk. I dont want to trade true mechanical capability for a bunch of tech bells and whistles I dont even want. Its BS

@hmpeter

4 жыл бұрын

@@Stuka87 Exactly! The SG MT low range Forester I owned was already not that great in that regard. The combination of a weak clutch, basically no low-end torque and way to high throttle response made you to not want to crawl anything. Good luck backing up a hill with a trailer... The 6 speed manual is even worse quite a bit. The CVT with all it's weaknesses is still better for that task in my experience.

It’s funny, I was on the fence of getting an Outback for a long time, but thanks to these guys and their videos it helped me make a decision. I figure if Tommy has to work as hard as he does to hate on this car, it must be pretty good. Overall, I love my Outback, so thanks, ha.

@faust7619

4 жыл бұрын

An outback is a great vehicle.

@pistolpeds

3 жыл бұрын

Blind leading the blind

@Dahawk427

2 жыл бұрын

You made a mistake bro because Subaru is image over substance.

@TripedalTroductions

2 жыл бұрын

@@Dahawk427 And jeep isn't? Jesus Christ

@Dahawk427

2 жыл бұрын

@@TripedalTroductions Solid front and rear axles with lockers is the real deal bud.

For me I love my Subaru Forester. This is the 2nd one I have owned. I love it for road trips, good space, mpg, awd, and the ability to go off roads. For me off roads and nice trails I find in nature. Maybe some hills, camping, etc. I never cared for rock crawling and love my Subaru for everyday drive.

Well let me start with, I own a 2000 Jeep Cherokee on 35” tiers for rock crawling. In 2015 I purchased a outback for work travel (~2000mi/mo). I am 6’6” and I chose the outback because it’s overall a great vehicle and I fit in it with room to spare. I live in Northern California and the Rubicon is my playground. As I started venturing out into the Nevada desert and the outback is the better option for comfort. I was amazed at how well this vehicle work in an overland environment... until I was met with an approach angle I could not handle without ripping off my front bumper cover. So I turned around, I had just came down a rather long steep smooth decent and let’s just say I figured out the hard way that the outback had a climbing impediment. This was inconceivable to me, such a simple task. No go, like an blown torque converted. I tried everything . I was stuck in the NV desert 100+ degrees without cell service. One good thing was my buddy and I each had small shovels and we’ll we had to literally dig our way out re-sloping the terrain to allow passage all the while keeping my bumper covers intact. My outback is now outfitted with method wheels with cooper AT tiers, I will be lifting my Subaru (haven’t decided how much 1, 2, or 3”) not so it will become a rock crawler but so it will have better approach and departed angles in similar conditions mentioned above. I will carry at least a come along if not a small electric winch (just in case). The idea here is to advance its off road capabilities without disturbing the on road drive ability. The rim / tire combo has improved on and off road drive ability 500% with the byproduct being 50% tire noise increase and 10% fuel economy decrease. By far a huge improvement IMO. This car is all about comfort and drivability for me. My outback will never do what my Jeep can do, that why I have both! Also Subaru Outback does have a manual transmission option in some countries! This surely would solve the can’t climb issue. Thanks for all the great videos! David

Hey, that’s actually my Crosstrek in a few of those still shots that I brought into the TFL offices for a video, but it’s not lifted. It stock heigh. And truth be told, I’m very realistic about the abilities of said car. I know its shortcomings. I don’t beat it up. Hell, 99% of the time, it’s used to drive to work, the kiddo’s daycare, and whatnot. I just put the KO2’s on there for a little bit of better off-road/snow grip.

@TFLcar

4 жыл бұрын

We love your rig Joey! Perfectly done.

@luchaDor

4 жыл бұрын

Your Crosstrek looks great!

@markthomas4483

4 жыл бұрын

Joey Henderson what tires/wheels do you have on it? They look great.

@supercooled

4 жыл бұрын

Mark Thomas k02 he said

@markthomas4483

4 жыл бұрын

The Yellow Cursor: I see that but what about size? Wheel brand and size? Sorry, I should have been more specific but I don’t know how to replicate that look on my Crosstrek, and I’m not a sophisticated modder.

I just lifted my outback yesterday and saw this video this morning and got very worried 😂 but, I don’t regret it! I don’t rock crawl occasionally will go on rough dirt roads or along shorelines at lakes, so having the extra clearance looks cool and does it’s job! Love the videos guys.

@thewheelneil1379

2 жыл бұрын

Hows the lift been? What brand?

I lifted an Impreza 2.5rs and sti swapped it. It has 10 inches of clearance and rock rails. It rips and I love it. I’ve climbed tons of mountains around Montana and I love it so much

“Why hasn’t Subaru met that need” That’s the question I keep asking GM about making a factory Raptor competitor. My next truck will not be a Chevy that’s for sure, all my adult I been working my up in my career to afford one. Once I pass my current truck down to my kid, I’ll be getting the Raptor.

@Otterplus

4 жыл бұрын

Since the Blazer was announced I knew GM would go the "safe" route instead of the dynamic route and make another vanilla crossover with it. They didn't need another one. That was their number one opportunity to build a direct competitor to the Raptors and Wranglers that already existed. They could have brought it back as the utilitarian off-road monster with tech and esthetic upgrades. The 4Runner is still beyond capable off-road but maintains a comfortable street presence. Sure, the market dictates what sells and risk is rarely rewarded in the auto industry. The trouble with that base argument is that interest drops with stagnation. Ford didn't need to make a full Raptoor package but they did and it works. Ram doesn't need a Power Wagon but it works. GM taking the safe route with Z71 and Traill Boss packages may have worked in the past, but this current market wants substance. Don't dress up a Silverado LTZ and call it special. No one cares about a Colorado ZR2. Anyone who's serious about what they want to do with their money and hobbies wants, needs, that factory direct offering. Unless someone has a large sponsorship or an insane amount of personal funding they're not going to spend $50k on a trim level just to double that in aftermarket accessories to make it functional. What GM should have done? New Blazer, starting price $35-40k. That price including current tech packages and comforts, decent ground clearance for overlanding, and only available in RWD or 4WD. Engine options starting with an NA v6 but includes options for a turbo i4 or v6. Upgrades could include locking rear ( and maybe front) diff, articulation/ lift packages, accessory pre-wiring, skid plates (of course), and other useful off road items (think winch, roof mounted gear basket, brush guards, snorkel). Sorry for the rant, but sometimes the careful route only works offroad, ironically enough, where GM dares not tread.

@KingAlphaLion81

4 жыл бұрын

Crixus I like my truck in the full size variety, I’m a tall person.

@johnburkard3121

4 жыл бұрын

Subaru doesn't have all the money that jeep has

@WeatherWarriordotnet

4 жыл бұрын

Ummm The Colorado ZR-2. Reliable and built!

@KingAlphaLion81

4 жыл бұрын

WeatherWarrior ummmm the Colorado ZR2 isn’t a Silverado. Full size pick....

I love how your world view here seems to assume that the very next stop after well graded dirt roads and light snow is extreme rock crawling. I agree that a lot of drivers are probably over modifying their Subarus. The approach and departure angles are too shallow for any modest lift to be of much (any) help in rock crawling situations. While that may be what shows up in Subaru KZread videos (guys doing heavy off roading in their heavily modified Outbacks and Forresters), day to day most Subaru drivers who are going off road just need a little extra clearance to make it through the small short rough sections that pop up here and there while exploring off road. Adding 2" oversized tires on 1" smaller wheels makes a big difference in capability off road here, and while that change does not require a lift on these cars, adding an extra 1" - 2" of body clearance will help at least a little in modest off road situations. Can you make a stock Outback to the same stuff as a lightly modified one? Probably, but at least I'd feel too close to the limits of my vehicle then. Another point I totally disagree with is the cost factor. When I bought my 2016 Outback last year (leaving behind two decades in Toyota Land Cruisers and Tacoma's) I did so because my comparable vehicle of choice, a similarly aged 4runner, was always going to be at least $8 - $10k more than the Subaru. I can change out the tires, wheels, add a 1.5" lift and maybe a little underbody armor up front for when I forget my limits, for less than half that cost difference. I think you guys are making sound arguments in general but it ignores the middle ground where I suspect most Subaru owners are when it comes to off road use.

I have only added the lift, tires and wheels to mine (so far), but I have had zero issues with my Crosstrek going over rough terrain. I built mine as an overlander, not a crawler, which I'm pretty sure most of the modified Subies you see out there were designed to be. I do plan on dropping a lot more mods into mine, but I bought it and built it with the mentality that I wanted to go places that normal cruisers couldn't. I've taken it over rough desert terrain and some rocky. I also don't agree about the sacrifice of comfort for the lift, at least in the Crosstrek's case. Yes I did definitely lose some of my EPA but the comfort is still there. I do plan on starting my own KZread channel for the car once I get further along in the build. I hope this has given you some insight to at least this lifted Subaru owner's mentality. Also didn't you guys just do a segment on a lifted Subie?

@RaulEdu33

Жыл бұрын

Hi Luke, could you share the specs on your lift and tire/wheele choices? And how do they feel on tarmac or any tire rubbing on tight turns? Thanks 🙂

I had a 1st generation manual Forester with a high/low range selector. 2 litre natrual asp. With a full set of Maxxis Bravo It was awesome and handled all sorts of gnarly situations from mud and rocks.

I learned how to drive in a Justy, 5 speed push button 4x4 on the stick. I drove that down ATV trails, logging roads and horse pastures in the Adirondacks. I would buy another one today and drive it any where while feeling 100% confident!

@chicagohh

3 жыл бұрын

I had that awesome little car! What a beast in the snow - so wish they still sold it.

I use to drive a 2015 Forester XT and when I lifted it the driving dynamics were drastically changed (for the worse). The CVT died in that vehicle, so I traded it in for a Honda Passport (because the Pilot and Ridgeline did so well in your videos and conquered gold mine hill quite easily). The Passport has the same 4-low thats in a Jeep renegade/compass trailhawk. Anywho, when I lifted it, there was no noticeable change in driving dynamics. For those that are looking to live the Subaru life with a bit more capability and comfort, the Honda Passport is an awesome solution. The reason for the trade in was due in part to the CVT failure, because it would just happen again, and then I’d be stuck with a $8-9k repair. But it was mostly because i saw how much more capable an older Subaru was with the 4EAT transmission and I knew that the CVT could never compare. Now in case anyone might wonder why I didn’t get a 4Runner, I use to drive an 2008 FJ cruiser and that thing made a terrible daily driver and consumed way too much fuel. I wanted no part of that.

@pizzasaurolophus

2 жыл бұрын

I have an R51 Pathfinder, it's body on frame but independent suspension all around. It's comfortable as hell and really a good/unique compromise to get the best of both worlds. There are lift options from 1.5 up to 7 inches suspension + body. With a modest 2" suspension lift and 32's it drives better than it did from the factory. On road its biggest drawback is fuel economy though (I average 12.4l.100km (19 mpg I believe), and offroad the only real drawback is the articulation, but the suspension travel is better than crossovers. It also stopped being made in 2012 so there is that too :)

Great advice from both of you...but here we are in 2022 and a used 2020 Crosstrek is going for $25k and the same model year 4Runner is running $37k. Yes, I wanted a 4Runner but my wallet dictates something less. Appreciate the video.

I know I'm late to the game on this old vid but wanted to toss my 2 cents in. I took my 2019 Forester Sport up nearly all of Colorado's class 3-5 4x4 "jeep" rated roads. Including the Lead King Basin Road and up to 9800' on Lake Como Road(no, I was not going to attempt Jaws). I had installed the scrape plate, 2" ReadyLift kit(pre and post fix), and K02's. Yes, the Subaru's have their limits and cannot do what hyper dedicated off-road vehicles can do. But they can go up many roads with solid knowledge of how to drive them. And the x-mode does work(sometimes). You just need to give it time to figure itself out. Now I have a Forester Wilderness and plan on lifting it either with a full suspension swap or spacers again. And I'll keep crawling up with all the Jeeps, 4Runners, and Tacos. :) Happy Trails y'all.

Subaru may not be doing the lifts from the factory, but many dealerships are doing them as dealer options. Every time I take my Forester up to gillman in Houston. They've always got a couple of lifted XVs or Outbacks or Foresters on the lot. With at least one in the showroom. Sitting on a 2 inch lift and more aggressive tires and wheels.

@rickeycooley9139

4 жыл бұрын

Leave those Subaru’s alone, shit🍀

@rickeycooley9139

4 жыл бұрын

Just kidding do what makes you happy bro’s and sis🍀

@rickeycooley9139

4 жыл бұрын

TFL is OK🍀

@JuanCarlosPachecoMoncada

4 жыл бұрын

My son lives in Portland and he has an Outback. While visiting him last summer, we went to his local Subaru dealer for service, and I noticed a couple of brand new lifted Outbacks in their showroom! So, dealers are doing this all over the country.

@tomhorn8556

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah the small dealer in Tyler Texas does the same. A salesman said they can barely keep them 24 hours before they get sold. They really look awesome!

Turn off the traction control give it the pedal, I don't know what they're talking about but my Subaru will go up that hill 😂

A Jeep is only good off-road when it's actually working.

I put a two inch lift and an LED bar on my 2006 Legacy. I could have just bought an Outback, but I like the way mine looks. It’s fun to drive and great in the mud.

Great conversation. Appreciate your approach to this discussion. As a new Outback owner I quickly was taken by the lifted and big tire modified Subarus on social media. I personally like the look and know that it’s not going to make my wagon a rock crawler. I camp and backpack and just needed a car that would handle the backcountry roads to a trailhead or campsite.

Tommy, no matter how wrong they are, Dad's are always right.

My Ascent with A/t tires & 2" lift is great for mountainous National Forest roads and still very comfortable for long distance road trips. Turn on X-mode in steep and deep & can qualify as a decent off road vehicle. I've been places where I've navigated around stuck Jeeps and F-350s while they watched me drive by in the same stuff. I think the AWD diff control is very well done, especially in X-mode crawl, and the turbo helps too. Not doing any rock crawling, but have certainly been rocking on 3 wheels in some heavy terrain and angles...

Greeting from Australia I’ve got a Subaru Legacy wagon with a 2inch lift kit. The vehicle isn’t used for extreme off road like rock climbing etc it’s used to drive on fire trails to access hunting spots etc.

My 2105 outback had a 2” lift and another 1” from overload springs then able to add larger tires on smaller rims. Loved it and hit Moab twice a year. I had no Offroad experience before the Subaru. No locking diff, no problem. It was significantly more comfortable than any Jeep or truck. That said, I replaced it with a Power Wagon.

"Why hasn't Subaru made a car to fill that need", bcause their sales are still growing, and they don't really need to. I get a lot of their surveys, and one of their surveys focused on off-road capabilities a lot, including low-range.

They need to build a Subi with about 10.5in of ground clearance, locking diffs, all terrain tires, and shorter overhangs. I don't think those modifications would take much from the factory, nor would they significantly compromise the road worthiness of the vehicle. the hardest part would be engineering the diffs and beefing up the CV joints to deal with the increased angle of the slightly taller suspension and larger tires. A two speed transfer case would not work well with the symmetrical all wheel drive they use without some major re-engineering of the transmission but maybe a wider range within the CVT would do the same trick but again that is significant reworking of the design.

I want to know if you've ever tested this with the 3.6r as it uses multi clutch CVT transmission for the extra power and torque and the 2.5 has a different type of transmission, I'd be interested to see the difference

You probably have heard this before, but can you guy's get your hand's on a MT and give those hill's another shot ?

I am going with Roman on this one. It’s pretty amazing where you can actually go with a Subaru right out of the box. Not everything needs massive skid plates, supper low gearing and lockers everywhere plus a $2500 set of knobby off road wheels and tires. As a kid, I remember seeing plane Jane economy cars up mountain trails where a street car had no right to be. One day I was with my dad. Looking for firewood. But really, he was just out having fun. He decided to follow this steep seriously rutty trail up the side of the mountain. Probably a quarter to half a mile long. He was in his 69 ford F100 pickup. He had special ordered it with the options he wanted. They included a FE 360 engine, a heavy duty 4 speed transmission with granny gear, uprated springs, 15 inch wheels, 6 ply tires with town and country grip tread on the back and a heavy duty limited slip rear axle with 4:10 gears in it. This was a tough solid truck. The first one he bought he could not break. Anyway, getting up that hill was not easy. Lots of spitting rocks out the back, tire smoke, bouncing around, multiple restarts, noise and dust. Kind of like the hill you broke the Ram Rebel transfer case on. After we got to the top of that road, we crest the hill and what do we find? A mint green with white roof 1962 AMC Rambler American 2 door coupe with stock tires and hubcaps, a six cylinder, automatic sitting there covered in dust. Without any scrapes, dents or scratches. How it got up that same road we had just come up was truly surprising and amazing. Corvair pickups were darn good off road too.

While I agree that the CVT and lack of a low range transfer case does limit what you can do, new stock Subarus are surprising capable off road. I wouldn't take my Crosstrek Moab, but it will get me as far into the mountains in California on remote national forest roads as I want to go. While it would be nice to have better tires and a little more ground clearance for some of these gnarly roads, I don't plan to lift mine because I do most of my driving on the freeway and don't want to lose the MPGs or highway performance. But if you want to lift your subaru the extra ground clearance and better tires will make a difference off road. They look cool too.

I have an 2016 Outback that I use as a daily driver. I go camping monthly via a teardrop trailer (timberleaf) , as well as a annual two week road trip to national parks. I sometimes need off-road capabilities here and there, mostly just some mud, snow, or a modest trail. Apart from putting a small roof rack for gear, as well as tow hooks and new rims for aesthetics, I haven’t done much else besides some solid Falken Wildpeak AT Trail tires which are the only thing really helping me much off road. I chose the Falken tires over BF Goodrich ko2s because of the weight difference and my desire for less noise during highway driving, since they were built for crossovers and vehicles like subarus. I think this choice was a good compromise. I might add a modest 1in lift, a spare tire mount (miss it from my RAV4), and a small front grille guard for aesthetic reasons - I don’t see any real reason to do anything else, for the same reasons you discussed in this video. I bought a Subaru cause it had great fuel economy that also had awd and a little clearance. I agree it wouldn’t make the best over landing vehicle.

I wanted to touch on a couple of points that you guys have made, the first one is the cost of the additions. Subaru lift kits in general are actually quite affordable and when we install one here at the shop with tires, wheels and an alignment our customers are paying on average $3,000. Of course the tire and wheel option plus other products we have will move that price up and down. The other is the lifts do help the cars off road from the added ground clearance. Everything we sell will not hinder ground clearance so the customer reaps all of the benefits of being able to tackle the trails with more confidence over a stock height Subaru. 3rd, the road manners. I have lifted all different kinds of trucks over the years and can agree with enhancing off road capabilities will take away from road handling. A RalliTEK lifted car with the top hat spacers and springs actually handles quite well on the pavement and in some cases actually handles better than a stock car. We are doing some cool things with Subarus over here in Oregon, it would be great to have you guys out to tag along with us!

@TheKrisBunch

3 жыл бұрын

I got my 2016 3.6r lifted at RalliTek with their 2 inch body spacers and springs. I can say my OB handles better on the road now because of the stiffer springs. Less body roll in the corners.

So then is the advice to get a manual transmission Subaru (e.g. Crosstrek in a manual)?

@SuperGunsnstuff

4 жыл бұрын

Kicked around this idea. But ive heard from many that the cvt will make it a little bit farther up a difficult trail.

@nomercy4521

4 жыл бұрын

I considered this when I got my crosstrek. I think there ability of the CVT equipped AWD is better. It will actually shift power front to rear and vice versa. In their video with the Outback going up gold mine hill, when you set it up right, the vehicle just takes a minute to figure out where the torque should go.

@R3aperTwo8

4 жыл бұрын

My two cents, but I ran my 2019 Crosstrek in 6MT up hills with softball sized rocks and sand while crossing a few small creeks with relative ease. It has enough power for what's within it's limits. Ultimately, I believe it comes down to the skill and confidence that the driver has in their vehicle and skill set. But that's just my opinion, friend.

@MrMusicforthemass

3 жыл бұрын

I love my 5MT xtrek

What would you recommend for an zippy off road rally car that has some good storage space and hauling capabilities while also having fuel economy?

Hi guys. Great video! I have a 2008 non-turbo Forester. I want to give it a MODEST lift of 1.375" in the rear and 1" in the front, with only SLIGHTLY taller tires than stock(215-70-16s instead of 215-60-16s), but a mechanic told me that this would be too much for the ball-joints, end-links, CV-axles, etc. to handle. I can't imagine that it's that bad. What do you think? Thanks for your thoughts.

I really appreciate you guys for bringing up an idea for a specific off road capable model. The solution doesn't have to be purely mechanical, it can be software based but at least a capable one. And one more thing, give an option for 6 spd AT.

I’ve lifted probably 15-20 new and some older Subaru models and installed BFG tires while working at a subie dealer. One of my own included. Not counting the rest of the shop probably over 100. I have not seen one major issue as a result of the lifts. The only problem we’ve had has been dialing in exhaust by the rear subframe to prevent a rattle. Your handling will be compromised. Fuel mileage as well. Definitely tire noise from BFG or general grabbers. So basically all the things you deal with when lifting a Jeep. Or anything else. Yes traction control can cut power but that’s less likely to happen if you maintain contact with the ground with more ground clearance and more aggressive tires.

When I lived in Michigan I had a stock 2016 outback and often went on dirt trails and old logging roads, especially in the UP, with no problems. I've never done anything too extreme or went rock crawling, but for what I used it for I never had a problem. Even pulled off into a huge snow drift on the highway in Canada, snow was up to the door on the passenger side, and got out with x-mode. I am sure a different more capable 4x4 would have been better and faster, but for what it is the outback is a great car. I would not lift it though just because for what I've done the clearance now enough. Now I live in Japan and got a 2009 here. Edit to say this: the suby community is amazing. So many cool people who like hiking, nature, and helping each other. I can't speak for other communities, but from what I've read in the comments it seems the negative rumors have some weight.

Question. My Jeep WJ just died -- loved it but not installing another engine and tranny (yep, lost both). So I purchased our second Subaru in two years. First Subi is a 21 crosstrek -- -perfect for you daughter. The second I bought is an 11 Subaru Impreza Outback Sport with a the 4-speed auto trans (50K original grocery-runner miles). Issue: It is VERY low to the ground. So I'm inclined to lift it to have it more at the height of the cross trek... I hear spacers are an okay to get up to 4", which could be perfect. Also hear that using springs from an Outback or Forester is an easy way that also keeps it nice on-road (but rougher for any rare off road we do. Any thoughts on best way to accomplish better visibility for daily driving? Yes, I will probably put spacers to widen the wheelbase if we do anything over 2". Will the 4-speed auto-trans will be better than the CVT off-road? We will access some camping spots or do some trail rides, but not much more than that... unless I hear that my tans might handle more fun (and of course a BIGGER LIFT and BIGGER WHEELS! :P

With the more modern Subarus the key is to keep it simple. Tires and lights and it will get you to any campsite off the beaten path. It won't climb rocks, it won't do what a jeep can, but it also won't cost what a jeep can

@tomhorn8556

4 жыл бұрын

John Taylor exactly correct!

@gwlane5509

3 жыл бұрын

YES! Adding lights to mine as we speak...gotta find a reason to swap tires thought as mine are only 2yrs old....all seasons....07 Forester Already got new headlights and Baja wheels....made the car look updated and modern...only has 118k on clock...

@Noah_E

3 жыл бұрын

And it also won't break as often as a Jeep and will ride better the 99% of the time you're not on trails. They act like it's a point of pride to break inferior Jeep OE parts and upgrade them with better aftermarkets. I've gotten scratches and tore a bumper, but never broken anything mechanical offroading my Subarus.

I have a '19 Crosstrek with the 6MT. I really don't have plans to lift it, but I am considering putting on some A/T tires like the Geolander G015 or the Falken Wildpeak A/T Trails. I don't need the ground clearance, but some of these Oklahoma back roads get pretty tough when it rains hard. The red dirt (mud) is completely different than the desert trails I grew up running in. So my question, have you guys tested the 6MT on the same trails that you've tested the CVT Outback?

@subierekt

4 жыл бұрын

i have a manual wrx swapped forester and it gets tough on the clutch if you get stuck, but its still capable. I would rate the transmissions like this for offroading AT>MT>CVT

@radcheckinski6300

3 жыл бұрын

Lift it, and if you get CV bind, drop the subframes and components slightly to decrease cv angle. DONE.

Agree with all points. Here is my issue: I have a 2019 Limited 3.6R. I am a retired professional photographer who now travels, camps, and shoots remote wilderness landscapes for enjoyment. My Outback is great BUT I need something with the "3 peaks" on it for mountains in winter....but often spend time in warm climates too in winter too, so winter tires are not really suitable. So an AT tire (with the 3 peaks) like the Geolander or KO2's would fit the bill. No lifts, no mods....just some nice AT tires to handle my challenging gravel, and dirt road excursions. Make sense ???

I had a trd pro 4runner and wasn't using it for it's capabilities only getting 16mpg I needed something different. So I traded it in for a 18 Crosstrek instantly lifted it with rims and tires and it's been absolutely perfect. I've had it for acouple years now and I'm still enjoying it and it works perfect for my needs. Simple fire service roads leading to rivers and lakes. I don't have to climb over a boulder to have a good time. Uncomfortable? I haven't noticed that big of a difference mpg maybe dropped by one I'm still getting 24mpg. Just my 2 cents. Do you guys own a lifted Subaru?

My 2018 Outback is comfortable, spacious, fuel efficient and a great 4 season (although winter often endures through April here in Wisconsin) vehicle. This is my 3rd Outback and will be the last one; in fact, I am done with Subaru. Next in line is a Tacoma Off-Road when the lease matures. The CVT performs atrociously in cold weather; it strains and whines until it reaches optimal operating temp. I cannot imagine taxing the transmission with more weight and tire diameter. Tommy is right on!

@jason7231

4 жыл бұрын

I love my Tacoma. 19 sr5, lifted and better tires. It's a beast.

I've got a 2019 forester that I just slapped some A/T tires on, and I do want to get a 1.5 inch lift on it. The tires I got are the new wildpeak A/T trails which are meant for crossovers and only weigh 5 pounds more per tire than stock, and are more than capable of handling the kind of off road I'll be taking it on. Granted, I've been wanting a 4runner for years and have done a ton of research on them, but the cheapest 2wd new 4runner, is still 6k more than I paid for my forester, and the 4runner gets worse fuel economy than my old car which was from '92, and I live in a city. The forester is more than capable of going on rugged forest roads, and I'd like the lift just to help clear rocks that could be sticking up on the center of the trail. I ain't gonna be climbing mountains or going rock crawling.

@JDS-Dalton

4 жыл бұрын

If I decide to go on way more rugged roads than the forester can handle, I'll get a cheap Cherokee XJ, but as it is, I needed a daily driver that was good on fuel economy, wasn't a new jeep, and could handle the trails near me.

@app1mxh

4 жыл бұрын

@@JDS-Dalton A lot of reliability issues with jeeps

@JDS-Dalton

4 жыл бұрын

@@app1mxh exactly why I would only go for a '90s model Cherokee.

@DaciaProject

4 жыл бұрын

@@JDS-Dalton You mean like Matt from Winder Towing?!

@JDS-Dalton

4 жыл бұрын

@@DaciaProject lol, didn't even think about that Haha. Nah just had a few friends that had XJs and they loved them. Built like tanks.

I was really torn between a dedicated 4x4 and a subaru for my last vehicle purchase. But when I was really honest with myself, I drive hours on the highway to get somewhere interesting to do 30 minutes to an hour off pavement. And when I'm off road, I'm mostly interested in scenic drives and accessing remote trailheads, not crawling over bashy rock ledges slower than I could walk them. Subarus are popular because they straddle the divide for people who have to use their cars on pavement too and only want to own one vehicle. The new wilderness editions in particular do a really good job striking a balance between competing priorities. It is kind of a bummer though once you own a subaru it starts to become glaringly apparent how certain segments of the offroad community really seem to enjoy gatekeeping and judging. I guarantee I've taken my subaru into a much larger array of remote environments than the average jeep owner

I've taken my 06 Outback into some pretty steep and gnarly conditions. Never been disappointed.

My 2003 forester with a 2 inch lift and larger tires as done everything my 4wd GMC truck with 285s could do. Mud, river crossing and deep snow, the forester has been a lot better on trails bc it is small I can easily turn around on tight trails..... with out hitting trees like with my bigger truck!

Great Video!! Subaru sells every vehicle that they make and are at capacity so they really don't care at this point about lifting or putting a transfer case in it. It's the same reason why Subaru isn't putting a turbo in the Crosstrek; they sell every one they make with the weak engine that gets mediocre fuel economy. I have a 19 Crosstrek and it's a great car but it's pretty boring and I wish it had a darn Turbo. Also if you cut power to the CVT and it can't make it up the hill they won't break and there won't be a warranty claim. Subaru is making a safe a sane car that's profitable. Their marketing shows young people with an active lifestyle taking their Subaru to the camping spot with mountain bikes, camping equipment and kayaks. So use the vehicle to get you to the active lifestyle spot. They also market it as a very safe vehicle that we should pass down to our kids and then buy another new one for yourself. You really don't see them climbing difficult trails or rock climbing. I'm not disappointed with buying my Crosstrek; its just a really reliable, conservative, safe and sane car and not very exciting which is really why I bought it in the first place.

@RKmndo

2 жыл бұрын

Install a rear locker for $400. The CVT isn't cutting power. The TCS is. Get a winch and some recovery mats/boards too.

Having both a 09 JK Wrangler and a 06 Subie Baja. I love both. One of the notes the younger guy (sorry forgot his name) notes about the Subies failing due to the computer giving up. My Baja has a winch to assist it and a Torq Locker that helps it when a wheel (or two) goes airborneto retain power and control. Of course it won't crawl or climb the same trails my JK will but will tackle most trails and even impressed some of my Jeep "elitist" friends. One thing I love about my Baja is the fact it is great for most overlanding trips fun trails.

I’ve been thinking of modding my 2003 Subaru Outback to be able to drive off-road ( trails and beaches) and I just wanted to ask if it’s worth it instead of having to go through the process of buying a new car. if it helps it’s got the dual range transmission. If I could just get a general idea of pros and cons that would be great.

I had a 98 Forester with 2.5" lift and some general grabber at2 and it was pretty capable until the center diff went out lol😆😆

Hi guys! Let me say first... I love your Channel! You guys hit the topics just right! Always enjoyable!!! I have to respond to this one... Tommy ... you are too funny! My opinion it’s not about the ultimate Moab monster it’s simply enjoying Overlanding and like Roman said modifying your rig while knowing your limitations. I have a 2017 Crosstrek and have been planning my mods slowly. Reality is it’s my daily commute and when like when the my tires need replacement I will buy a set of Black Rhino rims with KO2s. Small steps. Point being is some folks don’t want to spend over $50 k on a rig. It’s more the challenge of upgrading what you have and can afford and what off-roading I want to do. Roman said it ... this is AMeriCa! Like I figured out how to use my Garage door opener button on the rearview mirror to turn on the off-road lights with out going through the firewall. Will I do Moab ... no. My point is: I can enjoy getting out there on a budget, and there are a lot of channels out there for Subarus along with basic Overlanding channels like Ronny Dahl (Australia) who explain the basic techniques on what you need to do Overlanding for any vehicle with safety in mind. (Tommy ... there is safety involved here. Knowing your vehicle limitations and basic outdoor survival) You know it would be cool to see you invite Donald from Softroadingthewest and watch what his Forrester can do. Just a thought. Ps.. there is a new Torq locker product for a Subaru. Another cool innovation for us Subaru folks who want to off-road the next level.

@macmichaelhenson-rogers9850

4 жыл бұрын

This. I’m really hoping to buy a 2020 Outback or Forester. I don’t need anything crazy or overly capable and expensive (4Runner and Wrangler). Just some light off-road fun on a budget.

@karlsturzebecher9463

4 жыл бұрын

MacMichael Henson-Rogers I hear you! The cool part is to put together street worthy and off-road capable. It can be done. Sure it’s not a super capable 4Runner or Jeep... but the cool part is support out there for Subarus. I’m not gonna get a VW T because I’ve already fooled around with air bladders, and they are expensive to replace. I had a Range Rover 2006 nightmare! Check out this outback: kzread.info/dash/bejne/pYGll7NmerzIf8o.html

@time4dirt

4 жыл бұрын

Exactly! You nailed it.

@macmichaelhenson-rogers9850

4 жыл бұрын

Karl Sturzebecher that’s pretty sweet! I’m debating whether to go Limited with more options or Onyx XT for the turbo. I’ve heard Subaru turbos don’t last, and that’s a concern since I supposed to keep my next purchase long term.

@karlsturzebecher9463

4 жыл бұрын

MacMichael Henson-Rogers - I agree. Wife bought the 2019 6 cylinder last year. I heard the 2020 would carry the turbo. Maybe you can find a 6 cylinder or look at the Forrester.

How does a 5MT factor in for off road capabilities? I have a 2017 xtrek. She does pretty good. I've only been stuck in ice and its stock.

I have the 2.0diesel outback. Manual 6 speed gearbox. It can handle some pretty intense offroad but I do wish it had a little more ground clearance.... and a low range case. I don't know why they wouldn't include the low range as they had it on some of the manual 5 speed gearboxes in the older sx foresters and my brothers vintage 2.0 liter impreza even has one. It's really a simple mechanism on the 5 speed transmission. Seems like a missed opportunity. But the diesel does have great torque at low revs. So given its a manual diesel would a lift kit be a good idea?

Eh? Tommy thinks 8.7” of ground clearance is “tremendous” and “plenty” for deep snow? That’s absurd. There are TONS of places I can’t take my Outback because it’s not high enough. The CVT has NEVER been a limiting factor for me - it’s ALWAYS the ground clearance that limits the car first. Another 2-4 inches would make worlds of difference in capability.

Subaru was always known for rally racing. There cars only come in Awd, and has been a partner to national parks for the past 30 years. Adventures is what Subaru was built for.

Any chance y'all can test the Crosstrek offroad with the manual transmission? It would be interesting to see how it does in comparison.

I lost about 2mpg when I put KO2s on my outback. It became much noisier but I think it was a very wise choice the performance and safety is sooo much better. Even the peace of mind that my tires can take some abuse is worth the noise and cost. They are holding up very well. Over 50k on them and have many more miles in them. In consideration for lifting is approach and departure angles. They are terrible on the outback. I think a couple of inches of lift might be helpful in that regard.