I forgot deepwood staff i'm actually losing my mind holy shit. Deepwood staff S tier, infinite ammo is insane on elf (SEE: Moonbow) and the ability to lift and just remove specials from the game at will makes it insane. Left click damage isn't super high but is surprisingly good if you can hit headshots. Also for my santiy and yours PLEASE WATCH THE DISCLAIMER I GIVE FROM 0:00 to 1:02 PLEASE I BEG YOU

@alecway1997

2 жыл бұрын

You should overlook all the weapons before you do these, this is i think the second time you forgot a weapon

@jetflash100

2 жыл бұрын

It's damage is actually amazing in the crit build against unarmored.

@gordonz88

Жыл бұрын

@@scardan1070why should I do [something that Olympians do] when I’m [a recreational athlete]? Dumb question. If you’re on legend none of these tier lists even matter, everything is more than viable.

@gordonz88

Жыл бұрын

@@scardan1070 Did you literally not read my comment? My point is that even considering which weapons are "better or worse" for Legend is unnecessary. You can literally just use whatever you enjoy (like Javelin). At CATACLYSM AND ABOVE (like Cata Twitch, Cataclysm 3, DWONS, Cata Deeds, Cata Halloween Skull...) where teamplay and filling in niche roles matter much more, the point of bringing sister is for the extra healing for the whole team and the deepwood staf. It's really only at Cata and above that you actually need to start taking tier lists seriously.

@gordonz88

Жыл бұрын

@@scardan1070 Learn to read. I'm not calling Jav bad on legend. I'm calling it bad on Twitch Cata, or Cata + Harder Better Faster Stronger + Seek and Destroy, or Cata 3 DWONS, or Cata + Halloween Skull. Deepwood staff will give your entire team a far greater success rate at these difficulties.

Greatsword's heavy attack makes me sad. It does such little damage for how cool it is.

@chungusbooper

2 жыл бұрын

"Special delivery, FUCKAAAAAAAHHH!"

Elf with drakefire is op

All shades in warhammer use repeater crossbows. It's their signature weapon. It's unusual that other elves races use it. It's like drakegun to irondrakes from the ironbreaker regiment.

While I agree greatsword is definitely slept on and also love it on handmaiden, having it ahead of spear is just wild. Also dual swords is actually pretty amazing on sister and even shade if you run javs since you’ll just be using those and sister ults to kill armor.

@prich0382

2 жыл бұрын

Being ahead of Spear is flat out wrong lol. The Eleven Greatsword is in between Sword and Dagger and Spear for something, I can't remember exactly what. Spear is by far the greatest Hoard Clear weapon she has, far safer then the Glave, also is very powerful when getting Headshots with that Heavy 2 attack. Speed is insane on Handmaiden, pretty much +50% attack speed all the time when fighting Hoard or unarmoured Elites.

@thebenvz.

2 жыл бұрын

@@prich0382 agreed, I cannot fathom how one would conclude that greatsword is better than spear. Spear has some of the best horde damage of any weapon in the game. And if you land headshots you compete with the other weapons in terms of armour damage. Boss damage is nutty too

@Winterhe4rt

2 жыл бұрын

@@thebenvz. Whats the go-to horde clear attack pattern with the Spear? I cant make this weapon work at all.. ^^

@thebenvz.

2 жыл бұрын

@@Winterhe4rt push block attack, light, light.

Disagree on Spear + Shield. On Handmaiden with Opportunist this thing solos patrols with Push Attack->Power Attack like nothing else. It perma stagger storm vermins, easy open up and kill shield stormvermins, stagger overhead SVs, Maulers and staggere non-overhead Chaos Warriors and has absurd attack speed on handaiden without Swift Slaying. With Shield Bash -> Heavy Attack or Shield Bash -> Heavy Attack -> Light -> Light it has no problem with hordes and mixed hordes with armor Push Attack->Power Attack with Opportunist stagger whole horde and you can easy pick of armor among hord without issue. Opportunist is a must but it's one of the safest and at same time great DPS weapons in game. Definitely SA tier in my book. DEFINITELY better than greatsword even if I agree with you that GS is underrated, I just can't stand where you put Spear Shield below it... just no.

Shield and spear - "SIGMAR BLESS THESE RAVAGED FINGERS!"

Remember jtc, don't say headshot multiplier, say headshot bonus, don't confuse those who don't know to think headshots are a damage multiplier when it's simply stacked on top of body shot damage when you hit the head. Also cus extra damage from headshots and Crits is a bonus and NOT a multiplier is why Crit Power generally sucks

I feel like it would be cool too see a video on the Greatsword in some matches. You've peaked my interest with your argument but I wouldn't say I'm fully convinced.

12:02 thank you for mentioning this, the spear and shield are soo exhausting

I've been playing with the greatsword after watching this and having a great time with it. Thanks for the heads up!

I'm so happy to see the Elvish greatsword get some love, I compare it to the Xsword and Coghammer for having solid intuitive hoard management left clicks and heavy deleting, heavy attacks. It'd be nice if it had a similar headshot bonus as they did, especially since it is an aimed stab.

After listening from 13:37 - 14:14 I had to pause…..THANK YOU 100% agree with you. I play Bardin most of the time so much that he was past lvl 30 before I played the other characters. I was disappointed that his throwing axe did not have the melee capability. The arc if you don’t preload is difficult to get used to. I got the Kerillian dlc while waiting for the warrior priest and was shocked at how amazing the javelin is. I have played entire games using the javelin. Other then not being able to block or push its flawless. IMO so after using the javelin and then going back to Bardin’s throwing axes. I can’t help but think they really missed the mark on this thing. Despite what other people think I use the throwing axes with the slayer because playing Random games I get a lot of bots and sometimes they’re just useless. Gotrek Gurnisson used throwing axes. Even Malaki Makaisson used guns, bombs and even what is described almost like an rpg. Possible prototype to the troll hammer. The level 10 tier skill of bardin hack and slash could use buffing as well. Sorry for the rant. ADHD got the best of me. In short javelin amazing < throwing axe needs work.

Dual swords with javelin for sister of thorn is quite fun, a throwable prodding stick and good horde clear.

@dustrockblues7567

Жыл бұрын

they cover each other's weaknesses well... Swords for clearing and javelin pokes for elites/boss dps

Spear is best on Handmaiden and Sister. Hands down no question asked. Go for headshots by doing 1 or 2 lights then heavy and repeat. With the heavy, aim above first then when it strikes, bring your aim down as the hit box lingers a short time after striking.

@graphicmage

2 жыл бұрын

Agree, spear is the best choice for them once you master it

Isn't sword and dagger has worst effective block cost than other weapon? For reference: Most weapon has 0.5 bc Shield weapon has 0.2 bc Rapier has 0.25 bc Then, sword and dagger has 0.75 bc, which is literally the only downside this weapon has

@jtcLIVE

2 жыл бұрын

listen math is hard ok

@madamclair8474

2 жыл бұрын

@@jtcLIVE you did the calculation alright, but you suck at math...

@VernonKun

2 жыл бұрын

well the term shouldn't be 0.75 *bcr* but 75% block cost, so sword dagger costs 50% stamina to block attack compared to 50% block cost

Cool to see a personal and opinionated tier lists. Some of these are very hot takes and I love it. Just remember that in the title he says "my" list guys :D

Dual daggers are situational, if your team has a good horde clean then take out the armoured elites with dual daggers. Longbows can basically one shot-headshot specials and armoured elite in cata and should be SA. Also, moonfire bow should be nerfed, at it's current state it's good against basically everything, and the AOE just melts infantry and armoured patrols. This is THE weapon we take out on 15-5-200% cata Twitch.

I’ve been using javelin as a melee weapon. Downside is no block, upside is stagger and great ap for elites.

Greatsword is awesome love to see it getting some love.

Hey bro, I appreciate the tier list. ive got 500 hours and even I cant derive some use from this. One thing you didn't make note of on the spear was the move tech. on the charge 2. Its insanely busted for speed running.

I still like to run longbow on waystalker since you still have great ammo sustain.

Quite late, Ive only been playing the game for a month or so, but what would you rank moonbow post nerf?

When you said Saltzpyres axe I used to think it was not good but I got a godly properties on it and my load out with WHC makes it a lawnmower

Looking forward for Sienna's tier list!

The 1-handed sword is good for hsing chaos warriors. Very centered heavy attack.

where does one find all this extra info on the sword and dagger and other weapons?

@leozaboudi8005

2 жыл бұрын

Armory mod for me.

is sword and dager still op or they nerf it?

Where do you check for a weapon’s inherit properties?

@PapaCritical

2 жыл бұрын

if youre on pc, all weapon stats can be found in the weapon compendium. i dont know how to access said menu in pc as im not a PC player, but hopefully youll know how lol

@janotil1778

2 жыл бұрын

The Mod is called Armory

@chris.p.chyken9899

2 жыл бұрын

@@janotil1778 thanks. It says block cost effective 1.75x . What does it even mean tho.

I am never a fan of character weapon tier lists as it fails to have the granularity of specific careers, and some of these placements really highlight that for me, such as hagbane (WS), spield (HM), spear (HM, Shade), and even Swiftbow (WS). I understand it might be unfeasible to ask for career-by-career weapon tier lists, but I don't find this useful enough unless someone is absolutely clueless about Elf weapons.

Can’t forget that the 1 handed sword on Kerillian is the only weapon in the game that gives you unlimited dodges, and for that it deserves SA tier.

I wish they would buff hagbane Not because it’s bad but because Moonfire exists and it just sort of knocks hagbane on its ass in most cases

@sorano9733

2 жыл бұрын

At least hagstalker is still stronger than moonfire

Have the Sword and Dagger been nerfed since this video?

@jeremytan739

Жыл бұрын

No

Swift bow is A Tier. It offers nearly unlimited ranged damage. Might take more time to kill enemies, but it's more ammo efficient (with ammo refund trait) against everything compared to Longbow or Hagbane. I have more opportunities to gain greater amounts of ammunition all while dealing damage from a distance. You wouldn't waste Longbow ammo on hordes, but you can with swiftbow. *You can maintain ranged damage against all units at all times. Hit your shots, never get touched.* As for shields... that's what your team is for.

@flpsnk4848

Жыл бұрын

I agree, I was surprised how low Swift Bow was rated. Honestly just switched from Moonbow and been happy Handmaiden ever since.

@taurvanath

Жыл бұрын

@@flpsnk4848 Handmaiden also has good ammo if I'm not mistaken. I barely play Elf, but when I do it's waystalker all day.

So how outdated is this list?

@dapowerofuwu7550

Жыл бұрын

a lot

jtc, i think you forgot deepwood staff and briarwood javelins lol edit: nvm javelins are there but rip staff

@jtcLIVE

2 жыл бұрын

i actually want to die holy shit

@PapaCritical

2 жыл бұрын

@@jtcLIVE im so sorry i brung it to your attention lmao

@razeit4987

2 жыл бұрын

@@jtcLIVElol

@fluffybat5421

2 жыл бұрын

@@jtcLIVE Where would you put it? if it was on the list

Dang, 2h sword is a better all round weapon than glaive?

@theannouncer5538

2 жыл бұрын

I would disagree

@janotil1778

2 жыл бұрын

it is actually yea

@Greamzih

2 жыл бұрын

I can't think of a reason why. Glaive is at least as good as two-hander against horde but has way better strong attack sequence in terms of damage and speed.

@janotil1778

2 жыл бұрын

@@Greamzih really? I mean glaive is cool ngl it is fun slicing through all that stuff with it but it is not that good. Horde Clear is ok armor damage is good but because the weapon is so slow you just cant hit often enough so it gets unsave. The greatsword is faster, has about the same Horde clear potential, has a higher dodge multiplayer and you can deal with armor better (At least if you can hit hs). Ah and Boss damage is totally doable with the greatsword but pain with glaive.

@sulphuric_glue4468

2 жыл бұрын

I feel like he should have specified that it is on handmaiden and sister. 2h sword sucks on waystalker and shade.

Something VERY important for new players and which veterans will probably not even remember, especially with the influx of new players after the game was made free temporarily: Some of these weapons can ONLY be obtained after purchasing the 3 DLCs bundle: Shadows over Bogenhafen, Back to Ubsersreik, and Forgottne Relics Pack (this last DLC is specifically required for Spear and Shield and Moonfire Bow).

@rubz1390

Жыл бұрын

Shadows over Bogenhafen doesn't have dlc weapons. Winds of Magic has though.

@picophd

Жыл бұрын

@@rubz1390 Perhaps, but the other two have important weapons, so it makes sense to buy the bundle rather than buy DLCs separately.

Surprising to see moonfire not in the nerf tier. Its probably the most power weapon in the game right now.

Spear, Sword and Dagger, Moonfire Bow, Hagbane S tier. Duel Daggers A tier best on Shade with Cloak of Pain build for the highest damage bonus for killing Bosses, highest single attack possible possible. Duel Sword B tier only works against armour with Cloak of Mist build for killing more than 1 armoured enemy in 1 attack, well when you are able to get back stabs, but I'd rather use Sword and Dagger as easier to use. Don't use Glave, I know it has good damage potential but it's no Spear, Spear much safer to use, maybe it's A/B tier, risky though in comparison.

@seattle_ice

Жыл бұрын

The glaive staggers almost everything. I almost never get hit using it. It is better than people think.

@prich0382

Жыл бұрын

@@seattle_ice Also this is old data, pre rework. Refer to the stagger breakpoint guide, can't seem to post the link, on Cats, you basically need Opportunist+10% Chaos in order to stagger SV, Maulers and Bestigors with Light Attacks

As a stonch Glaive enjoyer I have to disagree

One handed sword for me is S tier. It's definetly better than S+D for me, since it's better against elites, and is just as good agaist hordes, adn I would say that both aren't srong enought to be nerfed. I also don't egree than 2-hadned sword is that good. Shure, it's amaizing agaist hordes, but you really need to tryhard to get good use of it agaist elites, due to it's lack of range. My thoughts on Longbow : It's trash. It just cannot compare to MFB at all, hagbane and swift bow do his job as anti-elite to imo, as long as you hit enemies at least. Imo homing arrows (which it had in Vermintide I) would make it somehow competetable agaist other bows. rossbow for me is trash. Not as good agaist horde or elites as SB or HB, it's good only if there is some special right behind the horde, and you want to kill him as fast as possible. Spear and shield is for me definetly better than long sword, it's better agaist elites, and is just as good agaist hordes (if u use specific combo), plus has LOTS of stamina. Spear for me is also better than 2h sword for same reasons, also because it's better agaist elites, and is also great at dealing with hordes.

@halfassedfart

2 жыл бұрын

what parallel reality is this lmao

All f because its wielded by an elf.

deepwopod, javelin and moonbow are in "nerf plz" for me, just make all sienna staff a total joke....

Ppl legit angry at you for dumb reasons

These tiers give me a headache just use SABCD wtf.

Insert vague rude and mean comment about spear and shield placement

@xCheatah

2 жыл бұрын

grrr

@prich0382

Жыл бұрын

In the context of Cata 3+Deathwish

This tier lists are fun until you get harassed in the lobby to switch from the weapon you are comfortable with to what's believed to be an S tier. If it ever happens to you, don't do it under any circumstances. Better get kicked out a lobby before the level. Also 2h sword is trash don't even dare to use it.

@sulphuric_glue4468

2 жыл бұрын

2h sword sucks on waystalker and shade but is good on handmaiden and sister. With handmaiden you can get insane attack speed (negating its usual drawback of slow speed) and sister's crits also work well with it (with swift slaying).

@fluffybat5421

2 жыл бұрын

Uhh I mean didn't you littarly just do what you said not to do? tell people not to use 2handed sword? like I agree it isn't great but its a videogame, play to what you like.

@supermeuhmeuh

Жыл бұрын

My man couldn't chain 2 sentences without contradicting himself 😂

love your videos but everything is wrong. i have already unsubscribed. the bitcoin assassins i hired on a whim are already on their way. i'm sorry.

@vitaliitomas8121

2 жыл бұрын

Damn right, spear should be a D tier

Strongly disagree with all the nerf Moonfire/Sword+Dagger comments, they just aren't overpowered. Clearly you don't play Cataclysm. They are solid picks but not overpowered because if you nerfed for example the moonfire bow. It would immediately be never picked because of the fact you basically get 5 shots and have to wait a solid 20seconds to use it again at full charge or at east 4-5 seconds to fire a shot again. It has to be powerful because it has very limited usage if it wasn't then it would be trash. Same goes for Sword+dagger, if you nerfed it then Waystalker would have no truly effective melee option that could keep her in the game save maybe 1hand sword. The Sword+dagger is made for Waystalker which is why it has maximum potential drop off at certain power levels. Yes over all the moonfire bow seems overpowered because of sustained usage but that doesn't = needing a nerf or unbalanced(green circles don't fuqqing matter as much as everyone thinks omg.. as long as numbers are high enough to represent effectiveness that's all that matters.. if you're team is shredding you by 15k every round, then yes you need to fix something) Other ranged options for Kerillian may need a buff maybe.. I can't really see a problem with them but small buffs might be okay. That is all on that.. Swift bow I believe is slept on for one simple reason and its because people don't understand it's place or how good this weapon is with serrated shots, barrage or infinite ammo sustain(scrounger with max crit), yes I use it on Cata and no I don't have an issue with using it because I'm not a dolt trying to kill chaos warriors with it. I generally pull the most damage effortlessly because at the end of the day its just a better all round clear weapon than any melee weapon. saying its dwarfed by weapons like Hagbane is comparing apples to oranges. The short bows role is to be a all round clear weapon that syncs well with weapons that somewhat handle hordes and elites well but are master of none. Weapons like oh wait.. FUQQING Sword and dagger. The sword and dagger allows Waystalker to wield any ranged weapon to maximum effectiveness, because for her it can handle any situation that you need it to. The simple fact is that the swift bow is simply a pressure control weapon.. that's its singular purpose. If you use it right your team will never have to worry about being pressured by mass groups of maulers, Stormvermin or bezerkers and trash because unless you're a moron they are all already dead thanks to the swift bow. Proper break points in your build with swift bow, serrated shots on Cata and they die in 2-3 hits because of quick dots stacks.. which for the record happens in the same time frame as 1-2 shots from any other bow... it's swift. I also disagree with sword and dagger being overpowered. its effectiveness drops off at a certain point.. i.e. massive buffs that it can receive from careers like handmaiden.. in a pure power setup on handmaiden I notice it's max potential is quite capped where you reach a maximum potential when comparing it to other weapons. at a certain power point weapons like the glaive and spear overcome it in raw output easily. The point of the sword and dagger is to be a strong weapon for Waystalker because at the end of the day she is the least effective in melee by a considerable margin. all 3 remaining careers are at least 3-4 times stronger in melee compared to Waystalker so the sword and dagger fits the role of making her have an effective melee option.. which is why I'm certain fat shark designed it to have quite the fall off after a certain point. It still works on the careers quite well but not to a stupid degree. I generally agree with Wetmagic but I can never for the life of me agree on most points when it comes to jctLIVE. He/She fails to see how certain weapons sync with others. These tier list videos are stupid because these weapons have a certain place when sync'd properly it was literally the whole point of the big balance update. Do I think Fat Shark missed on some issues with BBB.. yes.. I think the swift bow could do with maybe a bit of tweaking, maybe slightly better mid armor damage but nothing dramatic. It's purpose is not to kill Chaos Warriors.

@carlcarlson5157

2 жыл бұрын

Also Elven Greatsword is great weapon, stop trying to use it incorrectly. It's not a weapon that should be wielded by anyone other than a handmaiden.. Certain weapons will never be amazing on everything because they had to be balanced for certain careers. The Greatsword is just borderline broken as fuq on handmaiden which is why it just can't be changed any further. This weapon has insane mobility with it's power attacks. you can literally chain power attack stab/back swipes till the end of time and never be touched as handmaiden. It has and always has had the strongest push attack and subsequent base swing chain speed in the game.(the attacks that follow a push attack sometimes have very swift base animation attack speed... i.e. saltzspyres rapier push attack.. when you push the next 2 strikes happen faster than they normally would) When fat shark added 10% base crit to every swing this made it just stupid for handmaiden.. they also upped it's horde penetration on regular swings... you just can't buff this weapon further without making it just stupidly overpowered for handmaiden.

@xenophon5354

Жыл бұрын

lol, silence wutelgi

Imagine if you just like, looked at the Armory mod or webpage to see all the weapons every character has. Too bad jtc is a furry.

@jtcLIVE

2 жыл бұрын

how do i publicly anti heart someone's comment youtube pls

@jackruby6696

2 жыл бұрын

Dude chill out

@xCheatah

2 жыл бұрын

are you okay?