re watched this today and have been watching VODs of geng all day - i take it back, i think Kiin is the best top in the world and I put him over 369 - i disagree with some of my own takes from yesterday doing this live - his champ pool is not an issue at all, reksai nerfs help him , also re watched his lane phase POVs that I did with irrelevant and yeah this guy is just unreal - will no long do tierlists live again, arguments arent strong enough because i cant draw exact examples of the ideas i have of players in my head without putting enough time into it - im disappointed that i have to backtrack on one of my opinions

@noedels3682

Ай бұрын

🧐

@kirisakiakali

Ай бұрын

xdd

@combeebrian247

Ай бұрын

Getting influenced by rats xdd 😂

@javi4591

Ай бұрын

Respect! hope he doesn't choke at msi

@ghoul1365

Ай бұрын

F

Now we wait for Doublelift to review this tier list. And then Dom to review the review of Doublelift. Then we wait for Doublelift to review the review of Dom of Doublelifts review of this tier list. Juicy stuff

@namfingerstyle8403

Ай бұрын

then pedro review the review of them

@mohammedsokrab1110

Ай бұрын

absolute content

@sandhinfk

Ай бұрын

WAYTOODANK

@desertreindeer

Ай бұрын

I can feel that Doublelift will get triggered when he sees Caedrel put Busio C tier

@mathieup.corbeil894

Ай бұрын

@@desertreindeer Admittedly, Doublelift would know better than anyone how good Busio is. The problem is, that he has no idea how good the others are compared. So I could understand DL defending Busio, but he can't, afterwards, claim Busio is better than Meiko since he didn't see Meiko play in years.

I swear if he put mikyx over keria

@fanwee5048

Ай бұрын

Just want Chovy to be recognized as he’s always been as the best. He doesn’t have inting peanut and dorunning-it-down-0-mercy

@LokiLiesGod

Ай бұрын

He put Mikyx in the same tier as Keria, which I still think is insane lmao. But at least he explains his points, even if I don't agree with some of them.

@BG1435q

Ай бұрын

@@fanwee5048 kekw cant wait for geng to not win yet another international. wonder whats the excuse gonna be next. geng botlane sucks? or maybe kin and canyon inted him? who knows we can only wait and see.

@SnowywolfRS

Ай бұрын

to be fair, at the time mikyx was better than keria because mikyx was peaking and keria was choking

@KlaidasM

Ай бұрын

I swear people never take into account the players CURRENT performance, like MikyX was a better support than Keria AT THE TIME, is this so hard for people to understand? Go watch Kerias Camille games

I actually find it so sad Caedrel has to preface this video with "don't be toxic and flame each other in the comments". People need to seriously get out of this funk in the online sphere of arbitrarily being toxic to people just because they can't physically do anything back. It is so evident it is taking a toll on him because you see in his videos how much he wants to avoid all this drama and unnecessary toxicity but people just can't help themselves.

@Dickless

Ай бұрын

People just need to stop giving a shit about toxicity, stripping it of power.

@RShurr1can3

Ай бұрын

@@Dickless that too, but easier said than done

@jacobcontreras458

Ай бұрын

I agree and disagree. People should be able to say whatever they want, and the internet being that barrier between people makes it so you can really put your opinion out there without consequence. But I’m just like everyone else, these commenters piss me the fuck off

@ndnd7614

Ай бұрын

Seeing Toxic comments are part of the fun tho 😂

@TriTexz

Ай бұрын

"It is so evident it is taking a toll on him" Holy parasocial. Bro is just trying to protect his image and distance himself from any potential drama or arguments. Caedrel knows how this community works better than any of us and he definitely understands that the toxicity/flaming are just a fact of life as an esports fan.

That disclaimer at the end Lmaoooo. He is tired of Doublelift drama

@combeebrian247

Ай бұрын

I think hes tired of drama in general. After T1 lose to HLE he was misquoted on what he said/read on-stream

@nirvash241

Ай бұрын

He is tired that he is being used by two people(DL and Dom) to earn views

@YourMomNDad

Ай бұрын

Doublelift is just a reaction channel now. He won't pass the opportunity.

@Dutchyman

Ай бұрын

There is no drama. IWD just tried really hard to make it into one. Absolute grifter.

Agreed with Guma, very much unappreciated or undervalued maybe because people don't like his arrogance or JKL playstyle but this guy has put 10/10 performances at 3 worlds in a row. Put some respect on his name

@luma7777

Ай бұрын

And he really does completely carry many games and completely destroys his opponent

@jaspherodon1054

Ай бұрын

yeah 3 worlds in a row he is a beast

@slendian

Ай бұрын

Problem with basing performances purely on a short tournament is hard. He hit, and performed incredible but he could absolutely just miss... as he has in most lck splits.

@dobbs663

Ай бұрын

he’s somehow underrated, i remember how hype i was for him when he first started playing with the main team and seeing his solo q clips from back then. he’s still insane, just players like viper and ruler overshadow him, Elk has been insane too

@applejuice6921

29 күн бұрын

@@slendian the thing is you'd rather have your players peak for that short time. It is incredible that Chovy is on a 4 peat but we all remember the MSI/Worlds more than the domestic dominance. Whereas Canyon and guma might not always be the best during domestic play but is just a freaking monster come international tourneys

KERIA OVER MIKYX AINTNOWAY

@freakinboost7941

Ай бұрын

?

@germandreamer5245

Ай бұрын

Keria in form the best supp ever

@YoNightmare7

Ай бұрын

@@freakinboost7941 meme from last year bc he put mikyx over keria

@NPCJordan

Ай бұрын

Aside from memes, putting MikyX in the same tier as Keria, Meiko and Lehends feels kinda wrong. Although he’s the best support from lec, internacionally he’s kinda invisible (Agaisnt Lck and Lpl). Idk

@offthegrid777

Ай бұрын

​@@NPCJordan I would put Keria and Lehends too together; the rest can fall off bracket A.

In Tian’s defense he did have to play against MilkyGoat all split.

@iyoub6931

22 күн бұрын

I'll never forgive Tian for blowing up FPX, that was my favorite lineup of all time.

I agree about Gumayusi. People tend to under-evaluated Gumayusi because maybe like he doesnt carry enough etc BUT THEY FORGOT T1 TOTALLY DONT PLAY AROUND THEIR ADC. Gumayusi mostly consistent on his game lets be real. Who's consistent enough in those 5 games spring finals? Its Gumayusi. People criticize him so hard when he played bad once, but once T1 lost because of other lanes r making mistake, they forgot that Guma held the core hard. Such an under appreciated ADC.

@t1tempestia722

Ай бұрын

i agree. Every important tournament or playoff bracket Guma will perform. Even in losing game, Gumayusi is stable af

@yaidelisgalvez5356

Ай бұрын

Exactly, I've seen so many people saying that keria could be a better adc blah blah, but at the end of the day keria can only take those picks bc guma can manage on his on

@offthegrid777

Ай бұрын

Guma owns and steals Baron on redside all the time that it changes the tempo in favor of T1! Guma's living up to his ADC hype fr.

@kentchico7636

Ай бұрын

Exactly! People talking trash about Guma saying he has no impact at all, But if you watch closely, the reason Zeus and Keria can play whatever they want is because Guma can manage all the shits.

@YuriEnthusiast

Ай бұрын

Omg based individuals agreeing here. Also think Guma has just been that stable rock/pillar throughout different series' the ZOFGK team played together

Dude, the saddest thing for me is that Milkyway's plot armor couldn't get FPX to MSI. I wish Caedrel would've had to go back and analyze his gameplay

@neko-otaku2935

Ай бұрын

But Milkyway do need better teammates if he or fpx wants go to the worlds in summer

@minhthang6789

Ай бұрын

@@neko-otaku2935 Just imagine FPX have TheShy 😳

@bylethhresvelg3434

Ай бұрын

@@minhthang6789 milkygoat and theshy would be insane

tian is my favorite jungler just because he represents the coinflip aspect of the game so well on one hand he literaly carries top esports through games and other times he solo loses the game in the span of 10 mins

@DanielDurham121

Ай бұрын

Still 10x better than any EU jungler. Put him in EU and he’d 1v9 every game. Put Razork or Yike in LPL and they get hard gapped every game.

@xsision5513

Ай бұрын

@@DanielDurham121 no doubt, the reason tian was so good at internationals is because of this high risk high reward plays that no one else in pro play does and chinese players have just studied tian as he is a world champ which is why theyknow how to play against his style

@cowboyent1309

Ай бұрын

@@DanielDurham121 Delusional

@theteamxxx3142

Ай бұрын

@@DanielDurham121 Tian in EU would lose unless u put him in G2 then he always wins

Regarding your point around 34:00, I think your tier lists should be relative to the strength of the players within it (i.e. worst player in lowest tier, best player in highest). It doesn't really make sense to rank MSI attendees against each other while you're mostly comparing them to players that aren't even in the competition. Putting Umti in C or D tier doesn't mean he's garbage, but he's obviously not on the same level as someone like Tian. Ranking them relative only to other MSI players helps fill out the tiers and avoids these top-heavy tier lists where half the players are in one tier.

@kuroseal8613

Ай бұрын

Exactly this. This is how tier lists should be done

@offthegrid777

Ай бұрын

Ranked 4 out of 5 BLG roles as S tier players with the exception of Bin. Yet, still rated the team as S+. So based, lmfao. There's a lot of clutch players in T1, don't ever count them out. I'll take the deal/bet: GenG doesn't get in top 2 in MSI they are never going to hyped by the rat kingdom domestically or internationally.

25:00 Bo is the best example for that. when he had a good team (+that spoke his native language so no coms issue) and a very good mid that plays around jungle he looked complete 1v9 in lpl. but then in EU on mid/bad teams with coms issues he crumbles.

Canyon is just another class monster. When he plays international he always has a part of the series where it is all about him. Last year those graves and Rhaast game. This year was K6.

@pronini-kun4571

Ай бұрын

I completely agree with Keria he felt unbannable and unstoppable during worlds, the meta was very free. now it feels like Delight over Keria right now. Keria also has the papa faker buff. for some reason it is a buff and no one can change my mind on it.

Seeing On go from being Swortarts replacement in Suning in 2021 to be considered the best support in the world now is quite a journey

@GUDZ12345

Ай бұрын

Same with Elk man. I’m so proud of these two, I love players like this that struggled and had to climb their way up to the top. What a showing they had last year.

Meiko is the all time underrated player. Bro is still here after 10 years and he can still play ranged very good, his duo with jackeylove feels like throwback to the Viper era. Last year he was very bad but EDG was collapsing and Uzi was giga washed. People don't rate him as high because he is rarely the best support in the world at X moment but he has been top 4/5 support for almost 10 years straight and there is only a handful of player who can say that about themselves in their position(basically only Faker and maybe Ruler)

@FitzgeraldStanburyWeissV

Ай бұрын

Meiko was inting super hard in 2022 as well (with Viper). He has been playing much better this year, but he had 2 really terrible years.

Time for the real Tier List, Vediussssssssssssssssssss

@alexastarflower4461

Ай бұрын

i will be waiting for the Prophet Vedius

Putting Zeus in A list is crazy and mark my word he will stomp every top laner like the last tournament.

@seppv.8937

Ай бұрын

probably, but this is current form and Zeus did not look extremely good in the final

@toxicfireball2690

Ай бұрын

Zeus choked got utterly gapped by Kiin

@tealover7058

Ай бұрын

If you watched lck finals you’d understand it’s clear you didn’t

@ronlanders7354

Ай бұрын

He is s tier, people only salty cause kinn played better.

@thesyrupdude

Ай бұрын

if you watched the video he literally explains skill wise zeus would be S if he was more consistent

Food just finished then come to sit down to a hour caedrel video. Pure bliss..the shys sons should have been a tier

I’ve only just sort of discovered Caedrel’s channel/commentary/analysis and I love it. I’d be interested to know if Caedrel would review how his tier list holds up after MSI and how his thoughts played out or how people surprise him in the international stages.

I agree Guma is the best player on T1 right now

@rodjonajjaci6293

Ай бұрын

i think Zeus has the higher Highs but Guma delivers every important Game, is selfless in draft and his baseline gameplay is simply insane

Drink a shot everytime Pedro says merchant

Yea i agree with the comments here, biggest miss is calling Kiin K'sante OTP when he was the only meta champ available after bans. Other than that solid list

That idea of giving each player ratings (referenced early in the video) can be done in Excel/Spreadsheets. Put their info/photo with the given metrics for each role. Then you can give them a number value, and if you want, give them the tier value also w/o having to make arbitrary tiers (B, A+, S+, etc.) You can also aggregate all the numbered values to decide which players are ahead of each other in raw criteria.

@-weedle

Ай бұрын

go ahead, no ones stopping you

I would love if you did a number based rating based on a few factors like lane phase, team-fights, etc. That way it’s a lot easier to separate them into different tiers based on their score

42:00 chovy said himself that he found out that the match up was decent in soloq if corki just uses w to dodge orianna's q w

@rayaqin

Ай бұрын

isn't corki W's cd much higher?

@mekero4643

Ай бұрын

@@rayaqin ori q is like 6 secs early, ori w is just barely shorter than corki w

@dlz5709

Ай бұрын

@@rayaqin I guess you’re right, if the ori knows this she can try to bait out his w, but if she doesn’t I guess the q w angles are pretty obvious for the corki. Dodging 2 q w’s is probably enough to change the dynamic of the lane, at least a little bit

I can't wait for the doublelift response followed up by the iwd response!

What made keria a contender for best in the world at some point when he started playing ranged support is that his meta picks like nautilus were also completly insane. you had to pick your poison now he's kindoff a weird pick merchant.

Because you have respect for Gumayusi so I have subscribed to your channel. Thank you so much!!

Is Kiin a K'sante merchant? Are you kidding me? T1 banned his Rumble, Twisted Fate, and Jayce at LCK final.

@lamawlamaw

Ай бұрын

T1 is known for not banning the enemy top onetrick champ. Just look at 2022 Worlds Finals😂

@onigiggles8758

Ай бұрын

K'sante merchant.

@KimShailee

Ай бұрын

His rumble is mid, they banned tf and jayce because they still think range support is strong. His Ksante is ice cold, scary good. But not on the same level as his other champs

@siorai2089

Ай бұрын

They banned his rumble because it was good against Zeus's champs not because Kiin is amazing on that pick. Also he can farm and use his ult wisely around dragon fights and it makes the game unplayable automatically.

@user-jj9fh4lq8n

Ай бұрын

you guys so foolish. Kiin is better than zeus.

Bro really keeps putting zeus in lower then S and zeus keeps proving he is the best top in the world, t1 just won worlds and he is still A mad.

@slanderingyourfav2755

Ай бұрын

For God's sake this is "MSI" tier list, based on their performance in Spring

@hastyhokage1505

Ай бұрын

@@slanderingyourfav2755 not completely he literally said he takes into account last years performance for some players (somebody didnt listen! ) absolute autismo.

@hastyhokage1505

Ай бұрын

@@slanderingyourfav2755 also a worlds champion is a champion untill he gets dethroned so womp womp

@guilhermeamaral4602

9 күн бұрын

i hope you watched zeus getting omega gapped by bin

@hastyhokage1505

9 күн бұрын

@@guilhermeamaral4602 didnt get mega gapped u high?

This tierlist is.. absolutely amazing. I really really like it, I think it's literally perfect.

The Creme analysis was really thin. Game one BLG had an entire comp to shut down Creme, and despite that he still performed very well. His game 2 he was the only person on his team doing damage despite 369 going 333 mode. Game 3 he was hard carrying and game 4 he saved the team so many fucking times. He looked extremely good even if he wasn't on his champs.

You gotta give Jensen credit, he's been playing out of his mind recently. Definitely edges out APA if not Humanoid too. His baseline is lower than both, but he's been playing like someone else recently, kinda like Impact.

I agree with the Noah take tho might be biased. Fnc topside has struggled this split. Razork looked off it at times. Huma did regular season huma things. And oscar had a rough split. So Noah and Jun picked the team up and brought them msi. Noah still has things to work on. But he is improving. His mechanics are really good and his synergy with Jun looks incredible

I actually completely agree with ur list and arguments.

There is no way there is a chinese equivalent of Caedrel is there? Someone who brings this much analysis and details to their league statistics content. It's so good for us interested, I bet people from all regions watch the rat king.

We must ensure caedrel holds up his agreement; if GenG choke this msi, never trust them in internationals ever again.

@xxargonautxx9790

Ай бұрын

Yeah i agree, if they choke with Canyon on the team then geng is just cursed internationally.

@user-ij5kt8xy4c

Ай бұрын

Faker is called Goat, but he is losing the final four times in a row to an overrated player This is a comedy😂

@offthegrid777

Ай бұрын

Taking the Rat King's wager (I love bets) but not only internationally but also in LCK. No hyping them up if they choke again. They left T1 to 1 v LPL both in MSI and Worlds last year.

I really enjoyed this free form process and hearing your thoughts. If you dont want to do this live for tier lists, just a "my thoughts on each team" live would be sick. Love your content🎉

So happy Caedral watched LCS this year. I've always been a big fan of Caedral, but only watch LCS during the regular split. Appreciate the content

GUMA 🙌

I mean, I could understand this tier list if I were on some kind of hard drugs or something

@felicihugo8554

Ай бұрын

😂

@xjnpng

Ай бұрын

I understand this list perfectly. (I'm not hired by CCP)

@samuel-nq6he

Ай бұрын

?​@@xjnpng

You had the right idea with Inspired initially. He has a strong pathing sense that is similar to how KR junglers operate. Mistakes are minimized, reads the game flow, and keeps progressing. He is definitely above the other Western junglers and honestly above Tian. If Inspired had what some of these others guys had? Ya, it would be incredible. Humanoid gets too many benefits of the doubt after his countless errors. The only individuals from FNC who truly stand out are Razork and Jun. Noah did horrible in many fight situations. Peyz teamfighting is not great in terms of taking ownership to win over pressure. He can clean up, make less mistakes. Overall though? Not that great and pretty much similar levels to Hans. Chovy helps bail him out in early game. Kiin helps out a lot in mid-late. Without those players he would never be considered there. Really liked the listings still though. The support pool is strong. AD's a bit weak. And the comment to reverse Kiin's placement is good. He excels in so many aspects while requiring bans vs him. He deserves the top spot.

I respect your choice. So don’t be intimidated and make a bold choice. your argument with DL is setting MSI on fire. Those processes are attracting attention. That's a positive effect.

Watching you think these through outloud really shows why people tune into your stream over the official one

As a g2 fan I have no idea how you are putting miky over jun, what does jun have to do more to go above a guy who runs down more than half the games he plays. Also i dont see why you dont apply to miky the same mentality you apply to tian, when half his ganes he's as bad as it gets and the only reason he doesn't solo lose like tian is because of the role he plays.

@PastaDiMama44

Ай бұрын

Thats the thing. Jun is performing the best he can. But i believe both Mikyx & Jun are equally providing what their teams needs even tho Mikyx is running it some games. Mikyx & Caps are the fundation of G2's success while Jun is just a really good support. Iknow it sounds harsh on Jun, but Mikyx's gameplay can change a game that should be lost to a win. With Jun's current team/gameplay, he can't do that.

@RodrigodelatorreTorre

Ай бұрын

Cause mikyx s better and he plays better xd

@RodrigodelatorreTorre

Ай бұрын

Mikyx has more champion pool , playes better , roams better and has more mapa sense , un eu terms mikyx s 10 but jun is 9

@lemonhaze1506

Ай бұрын

@@RodrigodelatorreTorre😂 no way you said that when Mikyx int the season looking like a bronzie in some games, G2 bias hits hard always

@noahhaller4540

Ай бұрын

Yeah his support list is awful to put it bluntly, even with him contextualizing it, Keria smurfs on bottom tier LCK teams that are still stronger than the entirety of LEC. Like if Keria is able to do the wacky off-meta against teams that are far above G2's competition in the LEC, and Keria can play meta and win against top LCK teams, how can Mikyx even compare when every finals and international performance Ive seen of him is running it down. I can understand that Keria is overhyped because of his style, but he is still a support vying for best in the world, and Mikyx ints every international. But he put Keria and Miky in same tier, and Busio, a support who runs down less than Mikyx, is 2 entire tiers below Mikyx. I dont disagree that Busio should be at the bottom, young new player from LCS definitely belongs at the bottom, but Mikyx doesnt belong within a tier of any LCK support. Final note, while generally the leagues are LPL > LCK > LEC > LCS, I don't think every player ranking from Caedrel needed to be the same. It just made his bias extremely blatant as two supports who both had good regular seasons and inted finals are separated by two entire tiers, one of them completely empty.

Serious attempt to start a civilised discussion about Tian: let’s say he is a coin flip jungler, either he wins his team the game or he loses it with 50% probability. This is clearly not true since his teams has always had good win rates in lpl. It is a bit extreme to think that he completely determines the outcome of a game. Therefore we say tian decides 30% of games by himself instead. he has some of the best teammates in the lpl, if hypothetically we would let his team play 1000 matches with caedrel jungle vs all other teams in lpl with caedrel as their jung. I think the win rate of the fpx line up would be 75%. Now we place back tian in the team. since tian decides 30 percent of games we remove them first evenly from the wins and losses( 225 wins and 75losses) resulting in 700 games remaining. This leaves 525 wins and 175 losses(still 75% wr of course). The 300 remaining games are decided by tian with 50 % win chance. This would bring the win/lose ratio 150 wins 150 loses and added makes 675 wins and 325 loses. Which is a decrease in win rate from 75 to 67,5. BUT if your team play vs better team(skt , blg , geng ) it will actually bring up your winrate. Let’s say fpx players excluding tian have 25 % win rate vs blg skt geng. You will have 32.5 % wr (525l, 175w +{150,150} -> 675l, 325w)with tian vs when you have identical jungle! Therefore, if tian is playing, their average end result may be worse, but in the scenario they reach top 4, you prefer to have tian over almost any other jungler

Botlanes should be rated together

Can’t wait for Bb and Miky to prove you wrong for opposite reasons

@kaihyua6666

Ай бұрын

They'll be smashed by asian teams lol

@cowboyent1309

Ай бұрын

@@kaihyua6666 Least NPC comment, typical Asian bootlicker glory hunter.

@nassimnassim9214

Ай бұрын

BB gets embarassed everytime he plays against asian teams, to the point it becomes a 4 v 5 for G2

@cowboyent1309

18 күн бұрын

@@nassimnassim9214 'BB' gets embarassed everytime 🤡😂🤣🫵

In order I got Top : Bin Kiin 369 zeus bb oscar Jgl : canyon xun oner razork tian yike Mid : knight chovy faker caps creme humanoid Adc : elk guma peyz jkl hans noah Supp : on keria lehends mikyx meiko jun

@bladesofglory100

Ай бұрын

not even rating NA players is crazy XD

@Introducez

Ай бұрын

Chek urself

@bladesd3v1l37

Ай бұрын

if you pick any player above chovy you are just out of your mind... he is the best in the world right now

@lemonhaze1506

Ай бұрын

Thanks for your irrelevant opinion 😅

@axel978

Ай бұрын

@@bladesd3v1l37 you dont watch lpl

37:39 Mission complete

only major thing id change is zeus to B, sure his potential is high but man hes been running it ever since he stopped otping aatrox, solo lost t1 playoff games and finals

That 369 evolved is just a wrong description, because he was a carry player before playing with ruler.

@echotheredeemer

Ай бұрын

I think he means that right now 369 is the most complete top laner in the world. He's in the top lane GOAT conversation, for sure. He was originally an incredible carry player, then played on a tank duty for the entire year and was the rock of JDG, now he's back with carry picks and still destroying everyone. He can play absolutely anything his team can possibly ask him on an insanely high level. If BLG win Worlds this year, 369 will be the GOAT top laner for me, because Worlds title is the only thing 369 needs.

@namfingerstyle8403

Ай бұрын

HUH ? HE WAS Renek orn malphite otp in 2022 .

@tinecchi3648

Ай бұрын

@@namfingerstyle8403 Most played 2022 are jayce and kennen. At least have some fucking clue before you start typing

@ghikira

Ай бұрын

no he wasnt, he used to only play tanks

@tinecchi3648

Ай бұрын

It would be so fucking easy for you guys to research this. 2022 his most played champs were kennen and jayce. Thx for beeing completely clueless but still give your opinion xD you guys belong to Reddit

I wish Oner's pathing would improve, his pathing gets in his way . Only exception was last worlds, my word his pathing and that Poppy vs Sej.

@GlideAndSlide123

Ай бұрын

Hard to really vary your playstyle when you cant practice, so you just usualy stick to the more basic safest stuff

last year msi bb was hard carrying g2 bro he aint invisible

Broken blade is probably really good at figuring out Player vs Player matchups, which would explain domestic success, as he doesn't have enough input data for international success

Glad to see the guma rating bc so many people flame Guma for being the worst player in T1 and its annoying me a bit. Maybe I should just get off twitter

Bin benefits from Camille buffs the most out of all toplaners. Not only he is the best pro Camille player but he is also amazing at countering her with his champ pool. He is also historically good at blinding her into counters. However, I have a feeling Camille is super overrated and won't even be a meta pick at all and more be in a similar place like Syndra usually is in mid - aka more of a borderline meta/niche sometimes viable pick.

@bishoyrashad5826

Ай бұрын

I still think 369 is better tho even if Camille is meta. He might be better then kinn in my opinion I am sold to idea that Kinn is just a ksante merchant and he will get exposed so hard in this msi.

I think it would be hilarious if ON OVER KERIA comes out of this tournament.

Agreed with everything besides Keria analysis. How do we forget his melee support performances? Dude is a legendary Tahm Kench, Thresh, Alistar player. He has straight up carried countless games on these picks

Kiin champion pool take is completely fried. Champion pool is one of his pros.

Canyon the 🐐

Let's goooo! this is gonna be a banger, I know it! ❤

its fair to be recency biased and base the tier on recent performance im a T1 fan and i do think T1 fell off a little bit in terms of their performance due to major circumstances but i wont go that far that assuming they won't work harder and ramp up going to MSI.

dw boys if you dont like this tier list just remember hes the guy who put mikyx over keria so take his list with a grain of salt.

kiin is k'sante merchant? 'merchant' mean OTP am i right? tf?

Good tierlist. Only thing I think is gonna be pretty contentious is jungle.

I think GenG is unbeatable if Peyz can perform on MSI. He ist one of the best mechanical players in the world. Hope GenG botside will avoid their small mistakes and can show up on stage. Would love to see Peyz perform as he did on his debut year 🤩

Kiins rumble was “ok”? Bruh. Did he not watch lck spring finals? His ults won them like 4-5 team fights back to back.

Ur worried abt Kiin's champ pool? Lmao

jackeylove vs noah would be insane

Not sure if you will see this, but would love to know if you have plans of casting, re- entering pro play, or coaching at all. Maybe a video about whats going on with the rat king!!

I can't believe he put mikyx over chovy mid, and mikyx over faker in the all time GOAT list. Rat king 🐀

니가 lck를 안챙겨 보니까 기인 챔프폭 이야기를 하지 ㅋㅋㅋㅋ 전문성은 개나 줬네 진짜 ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ

My stocks are on yike in the future, he is realy young and its only his secound year in the lec and he is still one of the best if not the best jungler in eu. And i think he will grow alot and on some point he will be the best western player i believe.

with Jensen too I also think it depends on what the team wants from him. having him on Annie is so troll man, I miss 2019 Jensen :/

theshy > all

@offthegrid777

Ай бұрын

Akali toplane make it happen

@DanielAlejandroFuentesToro

Ай бұрын

I mean, I don't know why you have to write the obvious here

my man couldn't hide his G2/Fnatic biais...

Putting Faker on the same tier as Knight and Chovy is some crazy glaze.

Caedrel basically said that Yike is the Ringo Starr of G2: good enough to roll with everyone on his team, always overshadowed by the teammates

remove healing BS tanks like reksai udyr in the meta, and bring back camille and carry tops, and zeus just smokes everyone again

@goozilla123

Ай бұрын

Bro you realize Camille is one of the most giga annoying HEALING tops you're bitching about.

@kaysaiah3000

Ай бұрын

@@goozilla123 since when was camille a healing top ? im preetyy sure its her passive shield

@Antoine-du5qo

Ай бұрын

@@kaysaiah3000 Camille W heals quite a lot and it's unmissable.

If camille is op, then Bin is op. He was at one point, the absolute best camille player in the world.

@tehmastawow

Ай бұрын

add fiora irelia gwen and gangplank to the list also. basically if carry top becomes meta bin's gonna thrive

@gold9994

Ай бұрын

@@tehmastawow he was never the best fiora gwen irelia gangplank. He was known as the 2000 lp camille onetrick, not 2000 lp fiora onetrick

@tehmastawow

Ай бұрын

@@gold9994 that was meant for the first part of your message. not that he's the best at everything i listed

@johnnyapplepiel3788

Ай бұрын

@@tehmastawow Jax as well

@johnnyapplepiel3788

Ай бұрын

@@gold9994 Best out of all the pros at least

I really like your tierlist, especially the viper take on the adcs :D (big viper fan)

we need a tier list after msi

WHERE'S JOSEDEODO MY MAN?

@juanpablocr

Ай бұрын

Son sólo major regions, no entramos las regiones wildcard

@martinweb

Ай бұрын

Él solo vio las regiones que aparecen en la lista, dijo que si hubiera visto las otras regiones obvio las clasificaría pero ya que no las vio pues no

Hey there Caedrel, just wondering if u r gonna be fine with me translate this clip to Chinese and post it on Bilibili. Would be great to share your insight to some of the more isolated place on the internet and see how Chinese community would react.

thanks for the content :)

Actually pretty solid tier list, good job rat king

Elk and Chovy should really be in a tier of their own

@spurscoys7385

Ай бұрын

Not at all. Elk gets gapped by ruler every time they play.

@liokostov

Ай бұрын

@@spurscoys7385 Can't find JDG in MSI this year

@quinnbrekker9467

Ай бұрын

@@spurscoys7385 what does ruler even have to do with this video or conversation bro what 😭

@turtumurtu3295

Ай бұрын

@@quinnbrekker9467 chovy doesn't get gapped by anyone while elk does so they can't be in the same tier

@spurscoys7385

Ай бұрын

@@quinnbrekker9467 shows elk ain't that guy

If T1 bans Kiin's ksante, they win one of those two games. CRAZY they didn't. CRAZY they banned Jayce lmao. Kkoma dropped the ball hard on that draft phase.

@nirvash241

Ай бұрын

they were too afraid of Jayce they decided to perma ban it instead of just trying to see if Kiin will perform on his Jayce again like how Gen G drop the perma ban on Orianna and let Faker get it on game 5... they lack flexibility on this kind of tight match

@jonathanlee6349

Ай бұрын

You think that if Zeus said “let TF and Jayce through”, Kkoma would say no? 😂

Great list man. Honestly really in depth info. Man NA teams idk. xD

bruh bb has shat on impact every time they've played against each other

You can't rate Zeus for MSI based on LCK playoffs performance, toplane meta in that period was atrocious, he never played Reksai, the main toplane champ for almost every "top tier" toplaner and he had to counter Reksai with unconventional picks, which he'd rather not play normally(over his main picks). That sad Reksai merchants meta is over, I think Zeus should outperform everyone now(in most of the games), as he did in worlds, free win toplane champions are gone.

@rhys8457

Ай бұрын

if they're such a free win why didn't he, the best toplaner, pick those champs and collect his free win? i like zeus and think he's the best but you can't deny it sounds like cope lol, or more accurately disrespectful to the people who outperformed him on those champs by calling them free win abusers

@ajaypersaud2040

Ай бұрын

@@rhys8457 Zeus wasn't playing much when the Rek'sai meta changed. Most of his practice started the second time they were going up against HLE in the bottom bracket. People can call it an excuse, but it is true that he didn't have the most solid practice with that meta.

@kaysaiah3000

Ай бұрын

@@rhys8457 U forgot t1 was DDSOD ? their practice was legit interrupted zeus was not to good at reksai and zac and these top lane picks i think its to dramatic ppl like caedrel making out he is just bad now losing one matchup to kiin one trick k'sante for not putting zeus S tier

@uuuu-he3mluuu

Ай бұрын

​@@ajaypersaud2040he kinda refused to learn it because he said reksai will nerf next patch at interview after winning hle if im not mistaken

@rachelheke5737

Ай бұрын

@@uuuu-he3mluuu Yes well its true right and they had only been able to practice properly with scrims 3 days before DK series then a week of practice before HLE and GenG so if it's going to be nerfed then why bother playing it maybe there will come a time when he can play it and be good at it till then whatever

great vid, i only disagree with saying that jungle meta isnt great for t1. you named the jungle champs that are good right now like xin zhao, lee sin, viego, poppy and oner is ridiculous at all of those champs. i think oner and t1 in general really thrive when he can pick scrappy champs and fight the enemy for camps or crabs and get leads that way. thats why the game where canyon played kha he looked bad because kha counters xin and nullifies that scrappy playstyle. rell is the only champ oner is really good at thats out of the meta, but you could say that for almost any jungler. if anything i think not being assigned to rell duty will free oner up to showcase that scrappy playstyle

I really wish the editor would also put chat in these videos

Gen G has an actual shot to win now that they finally have a top and jungle and aren't 3 v 5ing every international

Chovy is so fcking overrated. Dude consistently chokes in internationals and plays complete mediocre League of Legends but we always talk about how he's "best in the world". I'm sorry but no. I can see it this year I guess since they have Canyon (who I think is the ACTUAL best player in the world) but the problem with Chovy himself is that he is not aggressive early game, and is very susceptible to getting rolled by a team like BLG who choke you out early. He has no early game picks in his champ pool, he always prioritizes late game scalers like Corki, Azir and Aurelion Sol.

@bladesd3v1l37

Ай бұрын

by your logic only faker is the 'not so overrated' mid laner in this list since only he is good at internationals out of all of them ? the list here is current form , not who has more international titles.. and also by your logic elk is not better than deft right?

@rafayetrasti6191

Ай бұрын

@@bladesd3v1l37 the others don't have as much of a track record of consistently underperforming as Chovy does.

@kaysaiah3000

Ай бұрын

@@bladesd3v1l37 i get what you're trying to do here but nah no dice !! chovy has consistently sucked internationally for years now its tiring with the same narrative he is not the " best anything in the world" until he beat the best and win and dont get me wrong not a single measly msi will change that instantly but its a start

@user-ij5kt8xy4c

Ай бұрын

Why does Faker, called Goat, lose the trophy to a domestic champion for the fourth time in a row?

@user-ij5kt8xy4c

Ай бұрын

Many sports goats I know never lost trophies to domestic champions four times in a row

12:45 finally someone else sees the issue with BrokenBlade, I've been saying this since forever, G2 will never be competitive internationally as long as BrokenBlade is the best top in EU

@jackthomas3483

Ай бұрын

Mikyx and Hans just got done being gapped both internationals in a row. Be for real. Yike and Caps are the best pieces, maybe Miky can regain form. But Hans needs to go.

@backsii5317

Ай бұрын

​@@jackthomas3483you guys need to stop lie because last world miky hans Was the best part of g2 beside of caps

@nirvash241

Ай бұрын

G2 won't win anything with BB and Hans on their roster

@cowboyent1309

Ай бұрын

This is why silver players shouldn't voice their opinions

@jackthomas3483

Ай бұрын

@@backsii5317 yeah Mikyx surely wasn’t sprinting it and Hans could press R on Xayah. You’re right! World class bot lane!

I love Keria, I really do. But I always get the impression that he as a player is really emotional and rhat he performs incredible when T1 wins, and struggles a bit when theyre behind or losing or lost the previous game hard. He always manages to step up though so well see at MSI. Hype 🎉

@dinglshingle

Ай бұрын

yeah, him and zeus can be like that sometimes but they are also crazy carry players that are willing to flank or flash at very crucial moments. keria is often emotional, but he also seems like the type of person that is willing to put his team on his shoulder. and t1 fans can by very toxic

Can't believe you put Jun above Keria and ON man