No, this is NOT blue meth.

@Ismail-xq9ry

6 жыл бұрын

NurdRage Obviously.....

@rakinkazi9780

6 жыл бұрын

NurdRage Demonetized!

@invetegon4596

6 жыл бұрын

I'll be the judge of that. Here give me a bite.

@AspentheGuardian

6 жыл бұрын

NurdRage can you add 91% alcohol to fuel?

@Ismail-xq9ry

6 жыл бұрын

NurdRage Nice video sir

As a 1st year electrical engineering student, I appreciate how some of your videos bridge the gap between chemistry and electronics.

@NurdRage

6 жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching!

@normanbenjamin9739

6 жыл бұрын

Yes me thinks there working with the stuff that reads the though wave! There just not telling us! But that is old tec. from the master race before us ! Look at Billy Mire stuff , the sound that ship is making is the sound of the colours . We know because we can hear the colours now ! Ect .. eyeborg

Thank you for making me interested in chemistry

Being much more of an electronics nurd than a chemistry nurd... these episodes are always welcome.

Look forward to seeing your future experiments down this path.

You are a scholar and a gentleman and I enjoy your content. I am very much looking forward to the through hole plating experiment!

@puppypi9668

3 жыл бұрын

Did it ever get made?

Cool. I've been hoping you might do a reactive copper ink, thanks so much for this.

if nothing else, watching a really striking blue turn to copper is really cool.

PCB related chemistry, a lot of electronic hobbyists will be happy getting more of it

@eatcookie8197

6 жыл бұрын

True, but the final result didn't look much promising. I think normal wire and rivets will still do a better job.

Great video!

I rarely understand what's happening but it's still cool to watch. Maybe someday I'll try making copper sulfate crystals as a display piece.

Awesome video could you do a show on making a copper strike solution . I've also heard of woods plating liquid. I'm looking for a way to nickle plate aluminium without having to zincate the aluminium first thanks for the info

That's brilliant and helpful! I'm going to try this myself! This might actually fix a problem in my research. I'll credit you if it does. Thx.

For a split second, I got formate and fulminate mixed up, so I got really confused why you wanted to use it as a conductive ink!

@S730SD

6 жыл бұрын

Fulminate based ink? You could write an explosive best seller.

@Unmannedair

6 жыл бұрын

Ouch. That would be a very dangerous pen. It might be mightier than a sword without even writing anything.

Neat! Is there much that can be done to make lower resistance tracks? Have you also considered trying your hand with Graphene? There are a lot of videos about making it. Would be interesting to see a chemist's twist.

The auto stirring tool is godlike

My hotplate stirrer will get here day after tomorrow :) I'm pretty pumped.

the way you made the formate of copper can be used to prepare almost every salt of copper by starting with cuso4 and the acid of the corresponding salt. I personally made copper chloride through this way. Also if fine cu powder is needed for being used as a catalyst this formate salt works great. love it

You could add some graphite powder to the formate solution to make a suspension and then heating all up. You would get some nucleation sites and the graphite being conductive on its own could help coat and bridge the gap in between individual copper metal bits. Maybe a bit of TiO2 for similar reasons. In both cases it would not take all that much to get the desired result, maybe a few tenths of a percent to a few percent by weight max.

Did you ever do the vijaeo on the process of making mini circuit boards what for the angry pixies as you said electrical enginerds use?

Can you use pennies before 1982 as your source of copper or would the other metals in the alloy contaminate it too much?

Would it be more usefull to use as a soft metal alloy i.e. add tin to improve the conductivity of the metal instead of what id imagine is just stacked layers of large copper sheets kinda like paint.

Thanks for the information. As electronics engineer, and also a PCB maker, i can say that this isnt suitable for Through hole plating, because holes has to be plated in around 35um - 50um thickness of really conductive metal (such as silver, copper, solder or other materials), but holes has to be "though", because you will stick component leads through them. Also, not reliable, but still, sience is in the 1st place :)

that's interesting! may i know the reference for the procedure? the journals maybe?

Cool video nuuurd

Is it possible to use the copper formate as a kind of filler for the silver? And if so how well would it conduct electricity

Great!

Did you try precipitating a second layer the same way? Might improve conductivity...

Nice camera!

NurdRage i have a question for you could i use this in a copper platting setup?

How is the conductivity after also using the tin plating process?

I've been playing around with trying to make something like that for a while now, without success. How small are the Cu particles? Can they be suspended in water or acetone, or are they too big and settle out too fast? Usually commercial conductive inks use incredibly tiny metal particles suspended in a solvent along with some kind of binder. Finding the right binder and how much of it is where I'm stuck. Either the particles don't stick together, or the binder is too much and there is no conductivity at all.

I have lots of enamel (magnet) wire in bits and pieces. Is there a cheap and simple process to make a pure solid copper nuggets through chemistry/electrolysis? I was thinking of dissolving it in battery acid and then electroplate a pure copper wire until its nice and thick. any ideas?

Can use ammonium hydroxide instead of formic acid ?

Is it possible to make metalized mylar films at home?

Im wondering that the problem is that silver crystaises much more easily than copper under these conditions, leading to a more structurally consistent product. Perhaps a ratio of the two copper, and silver reagents can be mixed so you get an intespersion of copper in the silver, though i don't know what if any advantagenthst may have if successful.

I think I synthesised it. I was dissolving Al in CuSO4, decanting Cu particles. They turned dark upon drying = oxide. So I tossed some formic acid 85% in and got substance of beutiful azure color. Much nicer than what I see in video, actually. But that may be due to camera or monitor or both.

wouldnt copper oxalate thermally decompose into copper metal, similar to iron oxalate?

I guess the problem is that copper particles at 200C are going to oxidize very rapidly, the opposite of what happens to silver... Maybe you could use some organic that will act as a reducing agent as (or after) the copper forms... like how acetone reduces hot copper. Also, I'm curious how a mixture of this and the silver diamine formate would fare. LOVE YOUR VIDEOS!

Also, i have seen Robert Murray-Smith make copper powder using vitamin C as a reducing agent.

Would it perhaps work better(e.g. form a better conductive path) if you were to let the evaporation occur more slowly? I could imagine the speed of copper formation could influence crystal size and therefore the conductivity between the crystals/pieces...

At the heating stage would keeping the copper formate tetra hydrate under an inert gas improve conductivity by yielding a purer product, ie is oxygen a factor with the poor bonding. Also would the conductivity improve by UV sintering of the final copper product

Nice

I've wondered whether copper formate could be used for through-hole plating. I know there is a way to do it at home which involves thermal decomposition of copper hypophosphite. It would be nice to be able to do the same thing with copper formate.

@SandeepKumar-jj7zi

8 ай бұрын

so copper hypophosphite forms better plating than copper formate?

Is there a way to forming Sodium hypophosphite monohydrate from sodium phosphate ?

There's an experiment where copper powder is made conductive. Oversimplified: By attaching an antenna to a jar of copper powder, the current induced in the antenna by lightning strikes in the area welds the powder particles together making the non-conductive mass conductive. *Perhaps an electric spark of the right amplitude could make the "ink" conductive after the reaction?*

Great

Why not decompose under a stream of N2 gas to prevent oxidation.

I think is Calcium carbonate and copper sulphate reaction is better than naco3 and cuso4 and calcium sulphate to insoluble

Did I make copper formate?... I had some colloidal silver I made. I made it with distilled water and it was the only distilled water I had available so I used it to make an electroplating solution for copper by first heating about one part baking soda to five parts water then using that to submerge two copper parts in attached with alligator clips with about a 5 amp power supply. One copper piece turned black, and one had the blueish greenish crystals I scraped off and filtered from solution. Is that copper formate?? Sorry I am trying to figure out a lot right now and never went to a proper school.

Vapour deposition with CO2 laser etching is probably the most controllable solution for at home hobbyists. That is.. if they build the units themselves already for other projects. Really interesting reaction, could this also be used as an additive in photonic cintering inks? A Xenon bulb might produce enough energy to decompose the solution into copper?

Try 2 or 3 layers of the ink?

Hi sir, can you do some more simple inorganic chemistry videos? 😁

one question: as the primary problem is (i assume) the carbon dioxide generated, coldn't mixing it with CaO make an inorganic epoxy of sorts? (CuCOOH + CaO -> Cu + CaCO3 + H2)

Thank's I'll give this a try (perhaps I will mess around with some solvent to precipitate it out because I'm impatient to wait for weeks to evaporate) maybe you can give it a try and cover the copper (II) hypophosphite since the literature is scarce and from H3PO2 (50% aq.) and the above prepared Cu(OH)2CO3 I get a dark brown precipitate that I expect to be metallic particles due to the reductive properties of the acid (which isn't forbidden here and I have enough of, though salts of it are missing from my collection). All I found was methods to prepare it in solution from Ca++ salt to be used for electronics... I couldn't even find info on the color of the salt which I intend to use as a catalyst additive. Keep up the good work!

Smart. That's the only thing I can say

Can you try adding a tiny bit of ascorbic acid to the solution to see if it will help the copper thin film form correctly. This would be ground breaking if it can be done because there are not many ways to chemically deposit conductive ultra thin films onto a non conductive substrate like glass. Only way I know is to either use the silver mirror forming Technqiue or to have an expensive PVD or CVD machine. First surface mirrors and ultra thin films are some of the pillars humanity stands on today and it's would be great to have a way to cheaply create such thin film using household equipment.

Does anyone know why the copper carbonate hydroxide looks green even though it has Cu2+ ions?

i used hypophosphite forwomething like this

So this has some interesting applications. Copper Formate might be able to dissolve chitosan. Usually, you use acetic acid to dissolve chitosan after sodium hydroxide digestion, but, if the pH in this is close, that could substitute and yield a copper bearing chitosan fiber. If it does, this has the potential to open up regenerated rayon, through cuprammonium rayon, into copper laced conductive fabrics. There exists stuff to that effect already.

Heisenberg would be proud!

maybe if you added some other copper salt to it, the formate can reduce the excess copper and form a more solid ink

Awsome! I made this when I was 12 but I jusz added 80% formic acid straight to copper sulphate. It is insoluble in the little amount of water used so when formed it just percipitated out.

@pietrotettamanti7239

6 жыл бұрын

AirsoftSlo But the reaction yield is much lower

@zanpekosak2383

6 жыл бұрын

Pietro Tettamanti true but still it felt like a fking big accoplisment starting out with chem. Later I stopped with this stuff cause i wqs doing waay to dangerous stuff.

I always thought that thermal decomposition would give CuO, interesting

@6alecapristrudel

6 жыл бұрын

The formate ion is in itself a weak reducing agent, that's why it gives copper metal. Higher carboxylic acids can also do that (acetate), but they also carbonize in the process, formate just gives off CO2 and water.

Since you have a phd in anorganic chemistry I want to ask you a question: There a two types of copper carbonate hydroxide: one is more blueisch the other is more greenish the internet sasys that the blue type is actually Cu3(CO3)2(OH)2 and the green Cu2CO3(OH)2 when you heat the blue type in water it forms the green and my experiments show the same result but when making the carbonate it is blue all the time. is it just stöchiometry or something else which effects the outcome?

@christianvn1

6 жыл бұрын

Zock4 The blue colour could be from additional water molecules of crystallization, since the Cu(II) hexa-aqua complex is also blue in colour. When the hydrated form is heated, the extra water is driven off and this could cause the colour change. Many water-insoluble metal salts and oxides can have hydrated forms.

try some polishing in this rusty copper.

maybe if the copper formate dry in inert gas (example: argon or nitrogen) the conductivity and strength would be better.

if it produces CO2, then why doesn't it react with decomposed copper instantly and make copper carbonate?

I don't know why it struck me in this video but I never really think of the vital role water plays in chemistry. I guess because I can drink it, I don't really think of it as a solvent or otherwise chemically interesting. Do you think the boiling action of the solution created the voids in the resulting copper? Would it be possible to evaporate it then heat it (not sure if the heat is necessary for it to convert to metallic copper)

@UnitSe7en

6 жыл бұрын

Revel in your existence as a chemical reaction.

@user-py9cy1sy9u

6 жыл бұрын

You need to sinter copper particles to increase conductivity

How much for 1 gram?

I would also love to have some good candidates for viscous conducter besides mercury

@Landogarner83

6 жыл бұрын

Galinstan? Or whatever other mix of gallium, indium and tin works at the temperature you want it to. Such alloys are available as "liquid metal thermal compound". Gallium and indium have a tendency to stick to glass however so the oldfashioned tilt switches would not work :(

@pietrotettamanti7239

6 жыл бұрын

fischX Alloys are poor conductors usually

Thats the problem with this series of metals. Though they can form cohesive structures with themselves, they tend to want to form particles rather than a plating without some sort of extra charge to guide their formation. There are a few things you could try, like charging the surface to be plated and dragging the cathode over the surface, but thats no different from standard electroplating. The other thing could be is to manipulate Cu ions in solution, let it dry and reducing them by dipping the surface in a reducing agent. The last techinque that comes to mind is to acid etch the surface so the copper particle settle into the micrscopic valleys. Getting copper to bond with itself as a solid without electrocatylitic techniques as you can with the mirror demo isn't anything I've ever heard of, and may require much slower decomposition rates than seen in the video, but is still likely to be too porous and brittle to be useful. If you can think of a way to form stronger bonds between the copper particles, this decomposition process has some promise, otherwise i think its just a novelty.

@boelwerkr

6 жыл бұрын

I noticed that in a reducing environment copper cold-welds quite well, so connecting the particles up with an external force could be possible. But that's hard to do in an application as ink. But it also forms alloys with zinc or tin quite well. Maybe this is a way to connect up the copper particles. Creating a two stage process. First creating the copper and then fusing it together with an other meal. This would reduce the conductivity but it would be possible to solder on it. Also an other reaction comes to mind. First creating iron particles and then reacting these with copper sulfate, to create copper and iron sulfate. This will make the particle "swell" slightly make it possible to connect up the different particles. Also a problem is to bind the copper to the underlying surface. To make copper hold onto the surface it has to form a continuous layer, otherwise it will disconnect from it. It's not an easy problem to solve....

@stamasd8500

6 жыл бұрын

I wonder if a mix of copper formate and silver formate would work better.

@boelwerkr

6 жыл бұрын

@stamasd Not sure it would work. The copper could force the decomposing of the silver formate. Instable chemicals are prone to decomposing in a impure environment. But my chemistry knowledge is not good enough to state that as fact.

@stamasd8500

6 жыл бұрын

I think there may be a way to find out. What could that be, hmm...

@boelwerkr

6 жыл бұрын

I'm reading up on mixtures of salts of formic acid, and it looks to me that silver and copper would form a complex. But i have no idea what that would mean for the forming of a contentious layer compared to irregular crystals while decomposing. Copper tend to build 3 Dimensional structures and this is the basic problem as far as i understand it. While searching i found this: www.nature.com/articles/srep45150 It describes the effects of mixing copper nano particles with copper formate to create better conductive incs. In addition reacting tin with copper format could produce such fine particles. Sadly while decomposing tin formate the tin oxydizes. (the same for zinc formate, as i understand it) Even in a oxygen free environment. I don't know of the top of my head an organic compound that decomposes at the same temperature as the formates to create an reducing environment strong enough to suppress the oxidation.

I think the formic acid did not react because you had too much water and the water might have reduced the concentration of the formic acid.

rusted layer before produced ? ))) try to make something more neutrally )

👍👍👍👍

Did you ever discover anything interesting in this area? I was looking for through-hole plating ideas recently, and I remembered this video. I know you shifted your attention to sodium metal shortly after this, but I'm curious if you uncovered anything before you moved on?

@SandeepKumar-jj7zi

8 ай бұрын

so you have found a way for through hole plating?

@nanolith

8 ай бұрын

​@@SandeepKumar-jj7zi The best process I have found so far is to paint the entire board -- including holes -- in a conductive spray paint, then electroplate the board in a copper sulfate solution. There are plenty of YT videos on this process.

were you successful with a better solution?

God damn it I saw the thumbnail and thought Nile broke bad.

i tested formaldehyde way HCHO(aq)+ NaOH → Na(HCO2)+ H2 than 2CuSO4+4Na(HCO2) → 2Cu(HCO2)2+2Na2SO4

@SandeepKumar-jj7zi

2 жыл бұрын

the equations are not balanced

No subtitles this time?

@NurdRage

6 жыл бұрын

being made right now. it takes awhile

Make more factorio vids.

@NurdRage

6 жыл бұрын

i don't do math.

Copper mirror?

@pietrotettamanti7239

6 жыл бұрын

Can't be done

@rakinkazi9780

6 жыл бұрын

I think thoisoi mare a video about it

Rant: consider the dedication and passion chemplayer put into his hobby chemistry videos, only to be shut down by KZread! Yet, dumb and pointless pseudoscientific videos featuring molten salt/aluminum poured onto oils or candies, or red hot knives cutting through everyday objects (e.g. plastic toys) with emission of toxic fumes, are allowed to stay on KZread. It is utterly outrageous!

Could we get a video of this done in a police station? To ensure it's not meth? I'd like to see a copper forming copper formate.

Please make the video regardless of if you succeed!

In the future multi-function 3d printers will build replicates of itself. Not only the structure but the electrical motor and printed circuits and all from recycled material.

Check out robert murray Smith. He did a successful video on this 6 years ago.

That's such a nice shade of blue, matches my state of mind, but the doc put my pill dosage up so I'm good... :P

@user-ux4gu2lh8c

6 жыл бұрын

...okie

CuSO4(s)+H2O+Al(s) = Cu(s) + AlSO4(aq) + H2O

I have used the carbonate - copper sulphate reaction to try to make cupramonium hydroxide cellulose solvent, but i found that adding carbonate to copper sulphate i would produce different coloured precipitates on different runs. I believe that the product is a mixture of basic copper sulphate (CuOH)2SO4, copper carbonate CuCO3, basic copper carbonate (CuOH)2CO3, and possibly copper hydroxide as well. What mix of products one gets seems to vary quite a bit with small variations in temperature or concentration. As an alternative i electrolysed solid copper anodes in carbonate solution to eliminate the possibility of making basic copper sulphate.

Aren't the views affected these days?

@Aereto

6 жыл бұрын

The one thing views are affected by: SCIENCE!

dr. manhattanate

fucking bad@ss if you can make it close to the silver ink

a comment

Nurdrage please acknowledge my existence.

@NurdRage

6 жыл бұрын

Hell no. Go crawl back into the faceless mire of mediocrity from whence you clawed your way out from. :P

@darryldixon788

6 жыл бұрын

I was prepared for a battle of wit but I see that you are unarmed. :P

@isaacthedestroyerofstuped7676

6 жыл бұрын

NurdRage Agreed

Overkill and not so on par with the application you want it to be: i.e: conducting. I use a simple Zinc spray on non conductive substrate then after the layer dries i dip in Copper sulfate for a "Single Displacement Reaction" - now the entire substrate is conductive and ready to be electroplated at once. not just areas close to the cathode. Simple & low cost. check out my Metallizing 3D printed plastic models on twitter hashtag #HomeElectroForming

hey...take the potato out of the mouth!!!

WTH i though this channel was dead!!