Blows my mind that people say “never trust politicians” and then completely trust the mainstream media

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

You assume that people who say never trust politicians are trusting the media

@ProsecutorZekrom

24 күн бұрын

@@keithparker1346 They clearly are if they decry Starmer for ruling out single market just by reading the headlines. Not saying there isn't anyone who doesn't trust any news or politicians, it's just a lot of times people are sceptical of some things but not of others.

@emm_arr

24 күн бұрын

@@keithparker1346 Some are.

@DavidMoxham957

24 күн бұрын

@@keithparker1346 I would say some will some won't but one thing I would point out to you, what do you think was the initial source of `never trust politicians?`

@howtoappearincompletely9739

24 күн бұрын

@@keithparker1346 It is almost always the case that such people unduly trust some source either as unworthy or even more unworthy of that trust than politicians are.

My God, I love having normal and rational people back in charge.

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

Normal and rational people don't condone w a r c r i m e s

@newblackdog7827

24 күн бұрын

You mean vermin who’ll betray the U.K. in a heartbeat!?

@Theforestbandit

23 күн бұрын

Wow. under labour life will get as exciting as a wet fart in your new trousers. life can only get better . not even a week has passed and starmer has plans on raising taxes ,pay per mile. just let the migrants in and the tax payer can pay for their new built homes .and lets release half the prison population to run riot on the streets. thats in the first week. what plans has he for next week.

@janewest2845

23 күн бұрын

It's fantastic isn't it? Sensible policies, no culture wars or cronyism.

@macflod

23 күн бұрын

@@janewest2845i don’t want to be all down but labour has its fair share of cronies too. No where as bad as tory and they don’t exist only for cronies as tories do but they do have them. That said nice to have people who i think are diligent and reasonably rational for sure!

Brexit, the biggest & most expensive self-inflicted damage limitation exercise in history.

@stewie7338

24 күн бұрын

No that is mass immigration, Net Zero and lockdowns.

@ftumschk

24 күн бұрын

... damage _limitation?_ Damage escalation, more like it ;)

@pirate_duck4985

24 күн бұрын

There's a certain German political party from last century that can lay claim to that "accolade" but I get your point 😄

@stewie7338

24 күн бұрын

@@pirate_duck4985 Yes exactly that party's symbols and praise for its leader seemed to be commonplace on the London Peace marches. Neither Phil or any of the Left Channels covered this for some strange reason.

@pirate_duck4985

24 күн бұрын

@@stewie7338 unfortunately their kind like to show up at any rallies really. Doesn't matter if they have any affiliation to current parties or not they'll always turn up where they can make their voices heard unfortunately. With the current "issues" in the middle east they're bound to show their faces.

Labour appears to me to be taking a "Common Sense" approach - unlike the previous crowd!

@teddypicker8799

24 күн бұрын

They're moving fast and some of the things they're doing are going under the radar too. They just uturned the military ignoring hearing damage to soldiers

@LeafHuntress

24 күн бұрын

How very dare you sir! The previous crowd was very big on "Common Sense," they were so big on "Common Sense" they even installed a minister for it!

@Theforestbandit

23 күн бұрын

Wow. under labour life will get as exciting as a wet fart in your new trousers. life can only get better . not even a week has passed and starmer has plans on raising taxes ,pay per mile. just let the migrants in and the tax payer can pay for their new built homes .and lets release half the prison population to run riot on the streets. thats in the first week. what plans has he for next week.

“A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step”

@frankoneill5675

24 күн бұрын

And it helps if it's in the right direction

@Theforestbandit

23 күн бұрын

Wow. under labour life will get as exciting as a wet fart in your new trousers. life can only get better . not even a week has passed and starmer has plans on raising taxes ,pay per mile. just let the migrants in and the tax payer can pay for their new built homes .and lets release half the prison population to run riot on the streets. thats in the first week. what plans has he for next week.

@mickrap6001

23 күн бұрын

And what a phrase-thanks

@TheHoveHeretic

23 күн бұрын

​@@frankoneill5675and not backwards, over the edge of a cliff they were warned was there, repeatedly singing the only two lines of the chorus of Rule Britannia they know, doing so badly out of tune .... and then blaming every other bu99er for it!!

@allenpayne6893

23 күн бұрын

Sen ri no michi mo ippo kara.

Can't wait for the inevitable Tom Shepperd troll post on this one. Actually, I can. "Something something unleash benefits of Brexit something something." Saved everyone searching for his comments now.

@alidawson6118

24 күн бұрын

😂😂😂 brilliant.

@JohnPark-xf2gq

24 күн бұрын

Tom shepherd leader of sheep.baa baa.

@MonsieurJimjams

24 күн бұрын

@@JohnPark-xf2gq Seems like his new schtick is to pretend to fawn all over Farage now. The idea of trolling this account for years now speaks to a desperate desire for attention. My only (generous) assumption is that he's a failed comedian in a previous life who tried stand up and got his backside handed to him by the crowd.

@ClannCholmain

24 күн бұрын

The benefits of Brexit are undoing everything Brexit has done. 😂

@DW-indeed

24 күн бұрын

I'm ready to make and win another bet with him. CRUK is owed 3x an MPs annual salary now 😂

Getting access to the EU single market should be easy. Just tell us that you hold all the cards, we need you more than you need us and we will certainly roll over onto our backs and let you brits have the lot. At the very least, the German car manufacturers should make sure that you brits get your way easy peasy.

@samhartford8677

23 күн бұрын

😂 Yeps. The same old British exceptionalism.

@ab-ym3bf

23 күн бұрын

😂

@jesusgallardo8685

23 күн бұрын

Ja, ja, ja muy bueno 😂

Labour knows the road back to Europe has a major problem. That problem is the Conservative Party and Reform UK. In order for any country to be considered for EU membership there must be broad political agreement in the country on the desire to join. It is not in Labours' power to make the Conservatives and Reform want to rejoin. So they are powerless to deliver rejoining. What they can do though, is everything possible to reduce the disadvantages of being outside the EU. What Labour promised to do was what they could deliver, not what was out of their control.

@mikkelv7020

24 күн бұрын

I think in about 20 years there is hope for a brejoin, when the old people are no longer here and the youth wants the opportunity

@garyb455

24 күн бұрын

You are about to see how the Left are always a disaster, just follow France over the next few months its going to be an education in the Loony Left and stupidity

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

Well I would say if Rejoining is based on the UK having a written constitution and pr perhaps we should actually concentrate on getting those in place before we even remotely consider an attempt to rejoin?

@alastairbarkley6572

24 күн бұрын

"there must be broad political agreement in the country..." Is that so, John? Which part of the Accession process requires that? How is 'broad' defined'? How is 'agreement' measured in this context? Page and paragraph number, please.

@chocolatesugar4434

24 күн бұрын

But not all reform and conservative voters all want a hard Brexit. And it’s not just labour voters that want a ‘brejoin’.

Phil The BBC has been on the last few days saying "2.5%.. defence spending" and then keeps asking the time table of this pledge... It's interesting how they keep plugging this and yes journalists should be asking and drill down to the nitty gritty. But my beef is they didn't do this for the previous government... "We are building 40 hospitals..." And that is it, the sound bite has gotten thru but no hard questions asked... Same with the red bus £350m a week to the NHS

@johnrussell3961

24 күн бұрын

Even Sunaks pledge was based on when we could afford it..

@tfive24

24 күн бұрын

Ur comment , it is what I would worry about. If the bbc is going to start to act like a professional news agency, they are going to get blowback from the people who will ask," Why weren't you doing this with the last government ?" When another government comes in, they will have less a fuss about breaking up the news agency.

@jeremymerrifield219

24 күн бұрын

The BBC were terrified of losing funding. Also all the big bosses are Tory donors or mates. Hopefully Labour can solve this issue. But it's not that important really.

@californiadreamin8423

24 күн бұрын

⁠@@johnrussell3961. Ohhh….trust a pledge from a Tory !!

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

Yes they didn't do it with the last govt but allowing Labour to get away with crap just because the Tories did it ain't going to fly

Still on Cloud 9 and looking forward to all the progress this government will make. I’m giddy with excitement. No more brexity eejits in power and it feels wonderful!! 🙌

@garyb455

24 күн бұрын

You are about to see how the Left are always a disaster, just follow France over the next few months its going to be an education in the Loony Left and stupidity

@amcc5887

24 күн бұрын

💪💪💪💯

@Gericho572

24 күн бұрын

Progress 😂😂😂😂😂 😂

@newblackdog7827

24 күн бұрын

Yes, let’s all look forward mass uncontrolled immigration, Islamisation of Britain, crippling taxation, bankruptcy and bending over for the EU!

@maccagrabme

24 күн бұрын

Well letting 100,000 criminals into our neighborhoods and having to provide free luxury housing for life and emptying the prisons, you call that progress?

Small steps in the right direction are better than nothing at all. At least we have grown ups in charge of negotiations with the EU again and not the likes of Boris Johnson and Lord 'Gormless' Frost.

@garyb455

24 күн бұрын

You are about to see how the Left are always a disaster, just follow France over the next few months its going to be an education in the Loony Left and stupidity

@ab-ym3bf

24 күн бұрын

"At least we have grown ups in charge". Before the elections a Labour delegation went to the Eu to test the waters with a list of items and the announcement they wanted to achieve all that, but without any ECJ oversight or other EU interference. They were send home packing with a pdf copy of "EU for Dummies" extract. Those grown-ups?

@californiadreamin8423

24 күн бұрын

⁠@@ab-ym3bf. Where can I get a copy of EU for Dummies, Dummy ?

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

What negotiations? We ain't getting a better deal just because we're more friendly with the eu

@californiadreamin8423

24 күн бұрын

@@keithparker1346 You think our new government is going to reveal their negotiation strategy to you ?

From Labour's manifesto: "There will be no return to the single market, the customs union, or freedom of movement.” The reality is that outside the SM/CU, UK is a dead economy walking. We simply cannot compete in our nearest market. Where we were once customers & suppliers, we are now importers ans exporters with all the additional cost that entails. SMEs within the SM do not need to trade with UK or if they do, have to incur the costs too making everything in the UK more expensive. Brexit causes greatest harm to those Labour claim to represent yet they still refuse to be honest with the electorate, choosing instead to squabble with the tories over who can best hide the managed decline of UK.

@mickrap6001

23 күн бұрын

Are you able to look into the future, so like the rest of us you have to read between the lines, and think what is true and what is a lie, and often you may be wrong who knows not even you.

@Bran9

23 күн бұрын

There's only one way into the SM and that's to join the Union, good luck with that 😂

@LeonLShaw

23 күн бұрын

The single market is predicated on uniformity of standards and regulations across the EU with enforcement done by the Court of Justice. Even if we manage to gain access to the SM, we would have no direct access to the Court of Justice as EU member states do, so standards could be breached and we could do nothing about it.

@JamesBoslem-fh9gr

23 күн бұрын

All true, but has Starmer got form for honouring pledges, promises, whatever ?

@francesconicoletti2547

23 күн бұрын

Your point is ? Britan has demonstrated itself to be a country of xenophobes with little or no knowledge of how wealth is created. To fight an election on refighting Brexit for the third time would risk getting the same result a the first two times. Now Phil may be right and Labour in power will reeducate on Brexit by deed or he may not be, but Labour in power is making changes that the conservatives were not willing to make.

If Starmer takes us back into the Single Market I will continue to vote for him even when he has retired.

@minischembri9893

24 күн бұрын

I am afraid he won't as he can't ! The EU still has a word or two about getting into the SM WITHOUT being a member !!

@ab-ym3bf

24 күн бұрын

he can´t

@shaneheff5244

24 күн бұрын

He will start the ball rolling and do much work to facilitate it eventually happening.

@RealMash

24 күн бұрын

@@shaneheff5244 He might. But to get your finances in order to be able to apply will take 20 years minimum. Not to talk from a lot of prerequists spelled out in the Copenhagen criteria. The sooner the Uk starts, the sooner it will be ready.

@shaneheff5244

24 күн бұрын

@@RealMash Starmer said it won't be in his lifetime so 20 years is valid. He is beginning the process to move towards it however.

09:20 - The UK had the "bespoke deal". I, for one, will happily relinquish my British Passport for a EU Passport, which reflects my entire life, as well as my family history, and not just my birthplace!

@Theforestbandit

23 күн бұрын

Wow. under labour life will get as exciting as a wet fart in your new trousers. life can only get better . not even a week has passed and starmer has plans on raising taxes ,pay per mile. just let the migrants in and the tax payer can pay for their new built homes .and lets release half the prison population to run riot on the streets. thats in the first week. what plans has he for next week.

@Bran9

23 күн бұрын

You appear still not to understand, you always had your british passport and your country could have chosen the burgendy colour while in the EU. A little too late flaying yourself now

@Nemothewonderfish

23 күн бұрын

No such thing as an EU passport!

@ulicadluga

23 күн бұрын

@@Nemothewonderfish Do you REALLY think that is what I said!? Look, I really don't care for your uninformed comment. I am devoting 10 seconds to trashing your comment!

@petergroves3153

23 күн бұрын

@@Nemothewonderfish Nincompoop!

Phil regarding Northern Ireland it’s important to be clear that it has special constitutional status in the UK union. NI is a constitutional hybrid and as such both a contingent part of the UK union and simultaneously a part of ‘the whole and indivisible island of Ireland which will one day be reunited’. Hence all born in NI are citizens of both the UK and of the Republic of Ireland and so are all EU citizens. This unique constitutional status is embedded in International law since the 1998 GFA is an international treaty brokered by the USA and registered with the UN Court at the Hague, embedded in EU Treaty Law which is why the EU has been very firm in defence of the status of NI, and embedded in UK law which are the 1920 Government of Ireland Act, the 1998 Government of Northern Ireland Act (which embedded the GFA and St Andrews Agreements), then the 2020 EU-UK Withdrawal Act in which is the Northern Ireland Protocol which is based on the realities set down in the past Acts and as such is a constitutional document for NI. The Brexiters in the last government attempted to unilaterally repudiate the NIP and take NI out of Ireland and impose a permanent hard border across the island. They were driven by a pernicious English ideology that’s been part of the Tory ideal ever since the days of the Jacobean rebellion in Scotland against George II - a political falsehood that the UK is a unitary state with all control from London. Historians call it British Nationalism and at its base is the very English idea that ‘Wales, Scotland and Ireland are ours’. Today it’s real focus is Scotland and British Nationalists are determined to never allow an independent Scotland. I have no doubt the sentiment is wider in England than just the Tory party - Starmer himself has said that a Labour government will never allow another independence referendum in Scotland which is the most godawful colonial sentiment The truth is that it’s a union of seven parts namely England, Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland (used to be all Ireland), Channel Islands, Isle of Man, Isles of Scilly. All linked by treaties made and amended over centuries and each with a different constitutional status. These treaties form the constitutional documents of the Union and the different status of each part is why there cannot be a single written constitution although there could be a universal bill of rights. The reality for Brexiters and militant Ulster Unionists is that GB can leave the EU totally but not NI. So the NIP is a clunky but workable solution to preserve the hybrid constitutional status of NI but it does make NI a little less British and a little more Irish and European because a customs border is needed between NI and GB. Of course if Westminster under Labour does sign up the dynamic alignment to EU rules & regulations and get such things as a Sanitary Phytosanitary Agreement with the EU then the new Irish Sea customs border will be much less real. Phil you posed the question that those in GB ask “why can’t we get the same deal as NI?” I’m afraid those in GB cannot get the same status since unlike the Northern Irish they are not EU citizens. Much of the benefits of the single market are mediated via citizenship of individuals - FOM, being considered as ‘domestic’ in terms of business privileges and employment, access to Erasmus and the EHIC which we in NI still hold.

@kfhroe8262

24 күн бұрын

You are right. UK did not fulfill NIP and now it's Keir turn to fix it. I think he will (try at least). Before it no serious renegotiation can start. EU will bend backward to fix it (see WF), but do not expect the same for GB. Fito-sanitarian agreements about checks between NI and GB? Sure. The same for GB? Forget about it. The sooner Keir get it, the sooner we can move on. We cannot enter EU/SM bit by bit: EU excluded it, they will not let us in using a backdoor. Keir excluded dynamic UK alignment to EU rules, prerequisite for any of the deals Phil speaks about. Either Keir reverse his tune or the deals Phil is talking about is as real as Brexiters unicorns. David Davis promise to go to Berlin to strike a good deal with EU, Lammy went to Berlin to repair EU relations. (sic.) Theresa May proposed security deal for a better trade deal, EU declined. EU proposed UK to align to EU standard for NIP, (Bojo and) Keir Starmer excluded such outcome (red line). Keir said we could have "mutual recognition", EU declined. UK proposed a Swiss style agreement, EU declined and it is dismantling the deal with Switzerland. "No more, either you enter or stay out". Why should EU agree one with us? Because we're "special"?

@rayc9539

23 күн бұрын

Interesting, thank you 😊

@RW-nr6bh

22 күн бұрын

Just for a bit of clarification, the Channel Islands and the Isle of Man are not part of the UK, and were never in the EU. They have a highly unusual constitutional arrangement and are effectively independent on a day to day basis. The Isles of Scilly are part of England.

@kfhroe8262

22 күн бұрын

@@RW-nr6bh They are "Crown dependencies" belong directly to the monarch, IIRC.

@Mtmonaghan

21 күн бұрын

@@kfhroe8262read the Good Friday Agreement, your wrong. We are on our way to a unite Ireland and nothing will stop it.

If the EU said "we prefer Coke to Pepsi" and Labour said "we agree" the tory press and Brexiteers heads would begin exploding straight away ! Well tough, we have a Labour government and that's just the way it is....................the people have spoken. LOL

The sad part is that people think they can fix all negative results within a week. They forget that the trust in your country is minimized due to your own behavior and we EU are tired of the behavior of the UK

@rayc9539

24 күн бұрын

Trust is minimised because of the behaviour of the tories and Nigel Farage... not labour.

@colinsmith1288

24 күн бұрын

Yes l thoroughly agree. The Uk treated the eu badly so no return. Just the TCA and that is final. I say this as a brit.

@LudwigVaanArthans

24 күн бұрын

​@@rayc9539oh yes, we are sorry, we forgot that not UK left the EU, but the Tories and Nigel Farage. The UK is still an EU member state, nothing happened

@rayc9539

24 күн бұрын

@@colinsmith1288 fortunately labour did say they would try and restore trust that the tories decimated.

@benfowler1134

24 күн бұрын

With some justification. Thankfully, the loonies and headbangers are out of power. Farage is just a court jester.

I mean that Guardian headline was pretty damaging. We talk about press reforms for the Tory rags, but the Guardian prints some utter bollocks.

@thecheesefactor

24 күн бұрын

The Guardian has damaged their credibility with this type of thing. I hope they aren't falling down the same rabbit hole as other UK newspapers.

@Theforestbandit

23 күн бұрын

Wow. under labour life will get as exciting as a wet fart in your new trousers. life can only get better . not even a week has passed and starmer has plans on raising taxes ,pay per mile. just let the migrants in and the tax payer can pay for their new built homes .and lets release half the prison population to run riot on the streets. thats in the first week. what plans has he for next week.

@TheHoveHeretic

23 күн бұрын

What do you expect from legacy media? It's ALL dying, along with it's readership.

It doesn't matter that you changed your governing political party for the first time in over a decade. The EU is not interested in accepting the UK back into the single market. The UK wanted out, now you're out. We can't afford to go through all the work required to get you back in. There are bigger problems for us to worry about.

@LeonLShaw

23 күн бұрын

so, on that basis, the EU will never let any other country join?

@RealMash

23 күн бұрын

@@LeonLShaw No, but they need to be trustworthy and not try to cherry pick even from the outside. The others follow the process and do not rely on unicorn mail to deliver the goodies they insist they are entitled to. Bit of a difference there.

@alea_iacta_est.rubicon

21 күн бұрын

​@@LeonLShawonly trustworthy, trusted, non superior, arrogant and non ignorant ones. That's not nasty angry ignorant anti European Uk. Out is out!

Thanks for the info I'd not know without your breakdown. Before this I had only my trust in Keir. I've known Keir since he was a human rights lawyer. His chambers are on my morning walk as used to be before Johnson gave me Covid. Then as public prosecutor where he also did good things lawyer friends explained. As my MP he's always been sympathetic and he acted for my Chinese partner. The Tories from Cameron/May acted foully towards her though she cared 24/7 over thirteen a half years for a friend, a very ill, Paranoid Schitzophrenic in his small flat. Still helps in his care home. A genius lawyer neighbour worked for the UN advising on Legal and Medical matters helped my partner's legal case and worked in Keir's Chambers. He swore by Keir in every way. So I have a lot of trust but knowing the facts of the case is always good. So thanks again. .

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

The same Starmer who cannot call a war crime a war crime

@LeafHuntress

24 күн бұрын

@@keithparker1346 I know you're either a ruzzian troll from st Petersburg or a bot programmed to react to every comment with some lie, but seriously, give it a rest. Keir Starmer pleaded in front of the European Court of Human Rights. He even wrote a book on it, which is used by law students in their university studies. He also pleaded in the Peace Palace in The Hague in front of the International Court of Justice. That case was about genocide. Now i'd like to invite people to think; what is more likely, a Human Rights lawyer of actual world renown(see the awards) that wants people to suffer in the most horrific ways OR biased right wing mainstream media that misquote his words. And consequently terrible trolls & bots who then go on to spread misinformation on social media. Thank you Peter for that story from one of his constituents.

I just read that the Environment Minister has just pulled in the water company bosses in for an emergency meeting

@rogerphelps9939

24 күн бұрын

About time too. They are failing but still declaring obscene profits whilst racking up record debts. Renationalised with no compensation.

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

​@@rogerphelps9939they will probably get a slap on the wrists and continue

@Teddysounds

24 күн бұрын

@@rogerphelps9939 absolutely

@LeafHuntress

24 күн бұрын

@@rogerphelps9939 I personally favour the Count Binface approach, make them swim in it. But neither that, nor your suggestion is workable. Renationalising without compensation is normally regarded as theft, very much frowned upon & you can kiss any inward investment goodbye. Better to screw tight the thumbnails, iow actually keeping the law on dumping in nature & fine them into oblivion, wait until they fail & pick up the companies for free. Remember, if you buy them out, not only is that way too expensive, you're also on the hook for all the debt they amassed.

@TheHoveHeretic

24 күн бұрын

​@@LeafHuntressWhat investment? That's rather been the issue.

So in the UK a Newspaper can Blatantly Lie on a headline and nothing happens.

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

Ok tell me how you would resolve that?

@theshadowoftruth7561

23 күн бұрын

@@keithparker1346 Keir Starmer has to call them out publicly and demand a retraction. You need to put the fear of litigation into the hearts of the Tory Press or they will walk all over you.

@stephenmorton2890

23 күн бұрын

How about requiring newspapers to come in plain packaging like cigarettes? They can still have their hysterical headlines but you have to buy the paper to see them. They would no longer be able to use their front pages as propaganda.

@TheHoveHeretic

23 күн бұрын

​@@keithparker1346Stop buying newspapers. Simples!

@keithparker1346

23 күн бұрын

@@stephenmorton2890 magazines like The Economist are political so would it apply to them? That is effectively censorship though

_Sigh_ For the umpteenth time: *there's no mechanism for the UK to return/ join/ have access to the Single Market, except by means of EU or EFTA membership* and how often does this need to be told?

@kfhroe8262

24 күн бұрын

You are right. UK did not fulfill NIP and now it's Keir turn to fix it. I think he will (try at least). Before it no serious renegotiation can start. EU will bend backward to fix it (see WF), but do not expect the same for GB. Fito-sanitarian agreements about checks between NI and GB? Sure. The same for GB? Forget about it. The sooner Keir get it, the sooner we can move on. We cannot enter EU/SM bit by bit: EU excluded it, they will not let us in using a backdoor. Keir excluded dynamic UK alignment to EU rules, prerequisite for any of the deals Phil speaks about. Either Keir reverse his tune or the deals Phil is talking about is as real as Brexiters unicorns. David Davis promise to go to Berlin to strike a good deal with EU, Lammy went to Berlin to repair EU relations. (sic.) Theresa May proposed security deal for a better trade deal, EU declined. EU proposed UK to align to EU standard for NIP, (Bojo and) Keir Starmer excluded such outcome (red line). Keir said we could have "mutual recognition", EU declined. UK proposed a Swiss style agreement, EU declined and it is dismantling the deal with Switzerland. "No more, either you enter or stay out". Why should EU agree one with us? Because we're "special"?

@Ooze-cl5tx

24 күн бұрын

welcome to the groundhog day club - we dont have t-shirts yet but it might be an idea for the future

@aukebij3193

23 күн бұрын

@@Ooze-cl5tx 😂😂😂😂😂😂

@TheHoveHeretic

23 күн бұрын

Oh, I daresay a few thousand times more yet. Luckily we've so much detoxification to carry out in the UK, that by the time we're ready and able to make a new membership application, the ordinary process of mortality means that most will have taken care of itself.

@frankoneill5675

23 күн бұрын

Yeah, I know all that but, can't we just join the Single Market?

"Access to" the Single Market is not the same as "participation in". As long as you understand why these are two different things, and that it has nothing to do with "EU rules" or "the EU being mean" but everything to do with international law and how it applies to jurisdiction of supranational courts, then you can immediately see the options open to Starmer if he wishes to pursue them. 1. Ask for extra "C" bits to be added to the TCA (the EU Commission has been mandated by the EU Parliament to entertain such requests). 2. Do not expect existing terms of the TCA to be renegotiated (the Commission has been expressly mandated by the EU Parliament to deny any such request). 3. Fulfill the UK's obligations as set out in the Withdrawal Agreement by which it conforms to WTO Agreement laws concerning countries wishing to embark on Free Trade Deals with alignment, convergence or divergence as a feature of their terms. Then ask for extra "T" bits to be added to the TCA. That is it. The first one is relatively easy to achieve, or at least certainly easy to embark upon. The second one should be even easier to understand - no renegotiation of existing terms is not itself a negotiable stance. The third one is presently your biggest obstacle to any meaningful improvement on the TCA but it seems no one in the UK even wants to talk about this, let alone actively start setting up the complex framework of standards definitions agencies, regulatory bodies and regimes, and legal enforcements required for other trading partners even to know what standards you apply to yourself, never mind those that you are proposing to bring to any negotiation table. As things stand in fact the failure to do this could well scupper the TCA entirely when its implementation comes up for review in 2026. Starmer better get the finger out. Note that none of this will (or indeed can) bring your country "into" the Single Market. The so-called "bespoke deal" that Phil mentions as an outside possibility to achieve such an aim is as much a unicorn-infested misunderstanding of international law as anything the so-called "Brexiters" came up with in their most ignorant ramblings. It cannot exist within international law for all the reasons that were stated in Granada earlier this year when the ECJ helpfully shot down "exploratory" internal discussions about enlarging the bloc through "associate membership" before the false notion could gain too much currency in the media where it might be presented as an "option". As far as I can see they succeeded in doing so - the principle of jurisdiction over an association currently constituted as a completely integrated entity is not that difficult to understand. Except of course in one country where "international law" appears to be regarded as a trifling and quaint practice that others choose to engage in, but which only applies to themselves when it suits them to believe so. A bit like treaty terms, apparently. Good luck with 1, 2 and 3.

@kfhroe8262

24 күн бұрын

You are right. UK did not fulfill NIP and now it's Keir turn to fix it. I think he will (try at least). Before it no serious renegotiation can start. EU will bend backward to fix it (see WF), but do not expect the same for GB. Fito-sanitarian agreements about checks between NI and GB? Sure. The same for GB? Forget about it. The sooner Keir get it, the sooner we can move on. We cannot enter EU/SM bit by bit: EU excluded it, they will not let us in using a backdoor. Keir excluded dynamic UK alignment to EU rules, prerequisite for any of the deals Phil speaks about. Either Keir reverse his tune or the deals Phil is talking about is as real as Brexiters unicorns. David Davis promise to go to Berlin to strike a good deal with EU, Lammy went to Berlin to repair EU relations. (sic.) Theresa May proposed security deal for a better trade deal, EU declined. EU proposed UK to align to EU standard for NIP, (Bojo and) Keir Starmer excluded such outcome (red line). Keir said we could have "mutual recognition", EU declined. UK proposed a Swiss style agreement, EU declined and it is dismantling the deal with Switzerland. "No more, either you enter or stay out". Why should EU agree one with us? Because we're "special"?

@LeonLShaw

23 күн бұрын

The idea of 'associate membership' of the EU was dead in the water before it even got off the ground. In any club or association, you are eother in or out, you cannot be half in.

Sector by sector SM access is what Switzerland negotiated in bits and bobs over the past 60 (SIXTY!) years. It's an ongoing process to boot. Because of the colossal hasstle this represents, years ago - prior to 2015 at least - the EU made it official policy to never again make a Switzerland - style deal in the future. So sorry, no dice. Especially since England cannot be trusted to uphold their end of any deal, as you say.😁

Labour are not talking about the single market .They are not asking the EU if they would agree to reverse Brexit.. They are just asking the EU to clarify the limits of third country status. It’s boring technical stuff. Starmer promised to be boring.

@VivaEuropa-ip6yk

24 күн бұрын

This is the correct answer. I’m not in favor of the EU readmitting Britain but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t welcome adult government in the UK. Starmer is EXPONENTIALLY better than any Tory government. Start there.

@peterebel7899

24 күн бұрын

John, 100% correct! BTW: Do you want to starve out British unicorns?

@jonmould2946

24 күн бұрын

I don't mind the Swedish woman coming over however i don't want the Kalergi plan.

@VivaEuropa-ip6yk

24 күн бұрын

@@peterebel7899What’s that mean lol.

@peterebel7899

24 күн бұрын

@@VivaEuropa-ip6yk Letting unicorns starve is a criminal breach of animal rights and it is boosting climate change.

A sensible discussion at last! Better access for us, and concessions where absolutely necessary. A practical approach, not one driven by ideology.

@ab-ym3bf

24 күн бұрын

"Better access for us, and concessions where absolutely necessary". Where absolutely necessary..... Don´t you see the arrogance of that sentence?

@minischembri9893

24 күн бұрын

Back to cherry-picking, are we dear Brits ???

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

​@@ab-ym3bfwe wont get concessions...why should we?

@ab-ym3bf

24 күн бұрын

@@keithparker1346 beats me, but a lot of brits seem convinced of it, all they have to do is behave like normal persons.

@maartenaalsmeer

24 күн бұрын

_Better access for us, and concessions where absolutely necessary_ Ah, wanting the perks but without the obligations, right? Same as in 2016, remember how that went?

If we get back into the EU it will take years and years

@brianferguson7840

24 күн бұрын

FOR HEAVEN'S SAKE ! You can't rejoin the European Union ! It's not your choice and never will be. When britain joined the original Common Market, there were a handful of members, and it still took eleven years to convince them to agree to have you. Now there are twenty seven member states, and you have proven beyond any possible doubt how untrustworthy and mendacious you are and that you have absolutely no concept of the true European ideal. You voted to leave, you left ! And we don't want you back ! Why would we ????

@WinstonMelbourne-vt2vt

24 күн бұрын

so what yes at least 10 years however in that time we will get closer to the EU and get the benefits, and when we do get back in we will be a better country

@philipdouglas5911

24 күн бұрын

And the tories as they are at the moment will be the permanent block to us meeting the entry criteria. The EU will only have us back if we are stable and the right wing nutters in the tory party will ensure that we are not.

@peterebel7899

24 күн бұрын

decades and decades ...

@benfowler1134

24 күн бұрын

Single Market access short of full membership is far more likely in the medium term. Nobody wants to feed the lunar Right like any suggestion of Rejoining surely will.

As much as I wanted to return to EU but however got to take it slowly

@brianferguson7840

24 күн бұрын

FOR HEAVEN'S SAKE ! You can't rejoin the European Union ! It's not your choice and never will be. When britain joined the original Common Market, there were a handful of members, and it still took eleven years to convince them to agree to have you. Now there are twenty seven member states, and you have proven beyond any possible doubt how untrustworthy and mendacious you are and that you have absolutely no concept of the true European ideal. You voted to leave, you left ! And we don't want you back ! Why would we ????

@stewie7338

24 күн бұрын

Yes and remember some people that actually believe in democracy might point out that Starmer has no mandate to do this.

@Noel-ji8nm

24 күн бұрын

​@@stewie7338He has no mandate. Period.

@shaneheff5244

24 күн бұрын

Phil is explaining that it will be gradual.

@samhartford8677

23 күн бұрын

​@@shaneheff5244 Phil can explain all he wants. The EU is not offering such a step by step approach. We have been very clear about it since day one.

Nice LOTR t shirt The whole problem of leaving the SM was the pure lack of understanding by so many what it did for the average Brit. Too long used by the Tories as the reason there were problems at home. It has cost all very dearly.

Speaking of "Level of Trust", can the British, as a Nation, be trusted to be Team Players? The rest of the EU are not stupid, like some Britians likely think. They will rightfully ask, what's going to happen in 10 or so years, when the British once again say, "We want our cake and eat it too"!

@RealMash

23 күн бұрын

Nothing. In ten years the first preparatory talks have happened, and we will ask the french to have a "strike" that closes the border for a week. If the supply of drinkable wine and good cheese is cut off for the tories a week or so, they will back down. If this doesn't work, the EU will nudge the french to have another strike.

@Keyboardje

19 күн бұрын

You *CAN* have your cake and eat it You *CAN'T* EAT your cake and have it too

The EU is about freedom of movement of persons, goods, services and capital. As I understand you, Labour wants only certain elements of the SM, sector by sector. That is cherry picking and will not be accepted. You are dreaming.

“Brexit certainly doesn’t mean leaving the single market!”

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

It did

@TheHoveHeretic

24 күн бұрын

(Sigh) Brexit means Brexit ... whatever the hell that was ever supposed to mean.

@dantownsend4246

23 күн бұрын

Come back in 15 to 20 years for more discussion

@rayc9539

23 күн бұрын

​@@keithparker1346Nah. It meant not being an EU member, which is what the ballot paper asked. Hence why the UK was offered EEA membership, alternatively (which would've kept them in the single market but out of the political institutions of the EU).

@patrikfloding7985

22 күн бұрын

@@keithparker1346 Not before the ref, it certainly didn't. It meant unicorns and sunny uplands before the ref. And NI didn't even show on the radar (blocked by unicorns shitting gold, probably).

The idea of unlocking things to gain access down the line is rather akin to a video game, gain the experience points, unlock access to features, until the end goal is reached, so long as the trolls don't come along and use their cheats, things would progress nicely...

@simongiles9749

24 күн бұрын

Trolls are more like spawn campers, just spoiling the experience for everyone else.

@samhartford8677

23 күн бұрын

Yeah, except that the EU does not offer much a game, because that's cherry picking and not in the interest of one single member state to offer to the UK. Phil's attempt to redefine cherry picking does not fool us. The front door is open once the Tories want to rejoin too.

@samhartford8677

23 күн бұрын

Yeah, except that the EU does not offer such a game, because that's cherry picking and not in the interest of one single member state to offer to the UK. Phil's attempt to redefine cherry picking does not fool us. The front door is open once the Tories want to rejoin too.

@roseanncampbell3168

23 күн бұрын

It's also the same as being a senior experienced barristers which Starmer was for years. He knows how to work difficult and different levels how cases can move slowly. That's why I knew he's the best man for the job. He makes the Tories, reform et al look like a bunch of amateurs, which they obviously were

The UK only wants the economic benefits, however as importantly the EU is also a political union. All this sounds a lot like cherry picking benefits again.

@rayc9539

23 күн бұрын

As a brit I don't mind being part of a political union. I believe we're stronger together. I'm not a culprit of British exceptionalism.

Well, given that the UK hasn't accomplished all obligations it committed to in the TCA so far, I'd say there's little room for negotiations that go beyond softening some rules from the TCA here and there.

@grokitall

24 күн бұрын

neither has the eu.

@peterparker219

23 күн бұрын

@@grokitall nope

@samhartford8677

23 күн бұрын

​@@grokitallCare to explain what rules we have not implemented?

@grokitall

23 күн бұрын

@@samhartford8677 the obvious one is the horizon joint research program, where we were supposed to pay into the fund, then get to continue in the joint projects we were involved in. unfortunately the eu had the attitude of saying thanks for the cash, and then right at the last minute disqualifying every uk participant from continuing to participate. its not the only one either. there are lots of things to do with northern ireland that the eu was supposed to implement, which we are still waiting to find out not only when, but even if they are ever going to be implemented.

@samhartford8677

22 күн бұрын

@@grokitall Yes, the EU stopped the negotiations on the Horizon deal when the UK was not implementing the WA and chose to explicitly violate the agreement. Had the UK not done that, we would have continued negotiations. But there's no point negotiating with assholes whose word is worth nothing.

Which part of "no sectoral deals" from the EU is not understood by the brits?

@Ooze-cl5tx

24 күн бұрын

The UK has a centuries old habit of simply repeating what they want and each time moving their cannon boat a bit closer. They just havent realized that this method is outdated. Give them a few hundred years, public school education is hard to overcome.

@Keyboardje

19 күн бұрын

Because... "But, but, but.... We're British!"

Labour has it's suggestions. The EU will not do Swiss-style sectoral deals. Why? Because there are plenty of small countries that do not want to keep giving Switzerland a better deal they have themselves. And in the case of the UK there is no country that wants to give the UK a better deal they have themselves. The UK can align all it wants, it provides no access. It's called the Brussels Effect.

Not even a week into the job and the major focus of Labour is clear: devolution, international relations and the path to undoing Brexit. I hope next up we see clear focus on their desires for electoral reform, starting with citizens assemblies and giving foreign nationals of the UK the right to vote.

@mrD66M

24 күн бұрын

Hear hear hear 👏👏👏

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

God no for that last part. Tell me a country which allows non nationals a say in their politics. It's a crap idea

@mrD66M

24 күн бұрын

@keithparker1346 good for paying taxes but not good to vote? Got it.

@owencarlstrand1945

24 күн бұрын

@@keithparker1346We already do ask loads of Aussies, Kiwis and Canucks. Also Irish by the way.

@XxHaythamKenwayxX

24 күн бұрын

@keithparker1346 what of all the people who can vote but don't live, work and pay taxes in this country (emigrants)?

Sounds awfully like trying to have a Swiss deal.... the EU have already been clear that that's not going to happen.

@rocketsurgeon2135

22 күн бұрын

As well as putting the kibosh on the whole notion of sectoral deals. So even if Phil is right about Starmer's intentions, it's still going to be barking up the wrong tree - one that's already been clearly marked, by the EU, as "wrong tree".

Phil assumes that the EU will listen to every little step that the UK government proposes to bring the UK closer to the single market. Don't see that happening. The EU doesn't want Switzerland-style tinkering with the agreement with the EU.

@uweinhamburg

18 күн бұрын

Right and Switzerland is completely inside EUrope (geographically) and has a lot of interesting technical products to offer...

He is. He's declared no FOM and that is a requirement .

Imagine anyone believing Boris Johnson 😂😂😂

@JZsBFF

24 күн бұрын

How did he make PM? Those who put him there did need to believe him. Bojo just needed to do as asked. That's how oligarchy and corporatism work.

Phil apparently thinks that 'having as much access as possible to the Single Market' and 'joining the Single Market' are two different things. Which is nonsense: a country only has *access* to the SM when it's *inside* the SM and that can only be done by *joining the EU or EFTA* which has been explained a ka-zillion times by now. The UK has access to the EU market via the TCA.

@ADifferentBias

24 күн бұрын

Northern Ireland begs to differ.

@geraldwagner8739

24 күн бұрын

@@ADifferentBias Phil, you know exactly that Britain won‘t enjoy the conditions NI got from the EU because of the very special circumstances of the GFA.

@maartenaalsmeer

24 күн бұрын

@@ADifferentBias The NI Protocol and Windsor Framework are there to prevent conflict and are in place for Northern Ireland only. Don't compare apples with pears while cherry-picking: too much fruit rolling around and since it's in the UK, probably expired already.

@Ooze-cl5tx

24 күн бұрын

@@ADifferentBias As an english exeptionalist you sure remember that the EU gave special treatment to NI because the UK was threatening to break the GFA and incite violence in Ireland. And those threats have not been forgotten. Bragging about what you extortet might not be the wisest approach to new negotiations.

@ab-ym3bf

23 күн бұрын

​@@ADifferentBiassimply the most delusional argument you could have made.

Phil you are dangerously woolly about the difference between a single market, a customs union and a free trade agreement, and yet again imply that close alignment with a single market can be similar to membership which is not true. Membership of the EU single market is a constitutional state of being and NOT a trade deal between third parties. In a single market all members are under a single overarching law and courts and so enjoy seamless borderless free trade in both goods and services. A far better term is it’s an internal market. A free trade agreement (FTA) is between third parties and these can vary enormously in depth. A deep comprehensive FTA such as the EU has with Canada (CETA) allows for Canada to trade in goods in the geographical area of the EU single market with as smooth as possible checks at EU Border Control Points (BCP’s) but in no way is it seamless borderless trade and its only trade in goods and NOT free trade in services. The latter is ONLY possible if there is a single overarching legal system and courts as you only get with membership of the EU. How is the trade in goods made as smooth as possible for Canada? By way of Canada and the EU having negotiated and signed scores of sectoral agreements of mutual equivalence of standards (MEA’s) to get over the myriads of technical sets of standards in for example, selling high tech goods or to sell agricultural goods in the EU. These sets of standards are known as Non-Tariff-Barriers (NTB’s). Built into any MEA is a legally binding mechanism whereby both sides pledge to maintain standards at time of signing and to update as these change. In a deep comprehensive fit for purpose FTA there is a high level of trust between the parties. The FTA between the EU and the UK (the TCA) is a low grade FTA full of friction for UK exporters and with pretty much zero trust on the side of the EU. Why? Because a) there are next to no MEA’s, and b) the Tory UK government burned all trust in such stunts as signing the NIP part of the overall Withdrawal Agreement and then after ratification openly boasting that ‘we signed it to get Brexit done but had no intention of honouring it’. Why no MEA’s? Because as Michel Barnier documented in his now published diary of the Brexit talks, Lord Frost told him that as a ‘sovereign equal’ of the EU the UK would never sign any binding MEA but that the EU must just accept whatever standards the UK has as being equivalent with no binding legal agreement. All UK goods exports could have stopped right there & then at the end of the transition were it not for the unilateral decision of the EU Commission to accept UK rules & regulations as equivalent for now based on the fact that on leaving the EU the UK passed a law embedding EU rules & regulations as current UK law. But absent a MEA and no trust the EU insists on inspection of every consignment of UK sourced goods reaching an EU BCP and that each consignment must have proof of meeting UK certification of standards. This has meant huge delays and added costs for UK exporters. The cliff edge coming up is that since UK rules & regulations are no longer automatically updated as EU rules & regulations change then the UK standards are drifting apart from those in the EU and not far off now the EU will no longer accept UK certification. Starmer has talked of ‘making Brexit work’ in the sense of negotiating & signing the myriads of needed MEA’s with the most urgent being a Sanitary Phytosanitary (SPS) deal. This will upgrade the TCA into a far better FTA and make UK trade in goods in the geographical SM much easier, but it is not even close to what the UK had from being in the EU. BUT the EU has made it plain that getting an MEA such as a SPS will mean the UK agrees to dynamic equivalence which means a mechanism whereby UK rules & regulations automatically follow changes in EU rules & regulations. Starmer has repeated refused to accept dynamic equivalence as it does mean the UK is a rule taker with no say in those rules- but it’s the price of zero trust. Lastly and quickly, a customs union (CU) is about trade in goods only and its where a group of nations decide to form a union so as to have a common trade policy with regard to others outside their group. The EU is a single market and a customs union in that for trade with third parties to the 27 EU members there is a common trade policy. The difference between the EEA (Norway, Iceland and Lichtenstein) and the EU is that EEA members are inside the EU single market but outside the EU customs union. Why do this? Because it gives them more control of their own trade policy with third parties.

@ab-ym3bf

23 күн бұрын

If only that could be summarised in a catchy 3 word slogan. There is another aspect to MEA's as one of the negotiators put it some years ago (besides trust). Both Canada and NZ have far reaching MEA's partly because they are on the other side of the world, and thus have less impact on the local internal market of the EU. UK being close by means any MEA will have far bigger consequences, and thus will be negotiated up to the last comma, with 27 possible vetos on every comma.

@epincion

23 күн бұрын

@@ab-ym3bf Your point about distance is well understood but it was too much to add in. Keeping the UK on a tight leash is particularly important given the trend to near-shoring trade (especially for vital supplies like food, energy, computer components, pharmaceuticals) which is becoming essential both fir reducing the global carbon footprint in terms of the transport, and just as importantly for security reasons as long supply chains could more easily be cut in conflicts. Britain must therefore not allowed to be the Shanghai on the Thames.

The main benefit of Brexit seems to be the UK having the same colour on the map as Russia.

@RealMash

23 күн бұрын

No, the main benefit of Brexit is that those smelly Brits around Fartage have left. And that the whining for favors come from farther away. And that thos rabid Brexists can be contained on plague Island. Oh for the Brits? Dunno, their problem. Out means out. So who of us cares about their problems?

Really informative and persuasive video. Thanks.

you cannot just simply "align standards" and majically join the SM. you need to be an EU accession candidate and implement and abide by the EU rule book, including the 4 freedoms. and then be accepted by the EU and then the member states, then the 10 local governments with a veto. it must be a unanimous vote. i believe it also would require a referendum in france and ireland too. another phil fantasy.

To be fair, Starmer did say a day or so before the election, and I heard it and saw it, that we would not be going back into the EU in his life time. That was enough for me to discount Labour and go Lib Dem.

@koenven7012

24 күн бұрын

it's true though. Starmer is 61, the average UK male life expectancy is currently 78.6 years (according to the ONS). Given that joining the EU would probably take 20+ years (remember, all EU countries have a veto on this, so no matter what the UK wants, it's the EU decides if they're allowed in or not), the chances are quite high that Starmer is not alive by the time it's done. He might want it different (I don't know his personal stance on the subject and I don't really care), but he's probably realist enough to know it won't happen soon.

@emm_arr

24 күн бұрын

"To be fair, Starmer did say a day or so before the election, and I heard it and saw it, that we would not be going back into the EU in his life time." If you want to be fair, say what he said and not something with a different meaning.

@TheHoveHeretic

24 күн бұрын

And why the Greens got my vote ... along with many others. Down here, enough of us did so to kick the tories into 3rd .... and that with no meaningful support for Reform Ltd.

@jeremymanson1781

23 күн бұрын

Starmer said he DIDN'T THINK the UK would....

Just for verification, those that claim Starmer said in an article he wrote for publication in the express: “Britain’s future is outside the EU. Not in the single market, not in the customs union, not with a return to freedom of movement. Those arguments are in the past, where they belong,” Have you personaly verified this to be false? Do you offically in public accuse them of lying?

@johnrussell3961

23 күн бұрын

He didn’t say how good it would be.

Thank you.

Thanks for this information! When you mentioned it taking TEN YEARS to even rejoin the Single Market, this confirmed that I'm right to continue with my plan of leaving the UK for the EU on an Irish passport! Thanks "Gan Gan" (i.e. my baby talk for Gran), although you never even had one!! Of course, the Conservative party are now finished in the same way as the old Liberal Party were finished about 100 years ago, meaning never able again to form a government. Reform UK only appeal to the small minority who support Brexit, which is smaller than the French RN.

@colinsmith1288

24 күн бұрын

@@paulbraun5657 Good luck mate. I wish you all the best.

@frankoneill5675

24 күн бұрын

The SM is for EU members

@TheHoveHeretic

24 күн бұрын

​@@frankoneill5675and Ulstermen (and women)

@paulbraun5657

23 күн бұрын

@@frankoneill5675 the Single Market is the EU plus the EEA only countries of Iceland, Norway, and Liechtenstein. Switzerland isn't in the EEA, but has lots of bilateral treaties with the EU that were made over a period of 20 years. The EU has said they refuse to do this again with any other countries. I think that, apart from rejoining the EU or the EEA (which the three EEA only countries might object to), the UK might be able to make a special agreement which is identical to EEA membership.

@frankoneill5675

23 күн бұрын

@@TheHoveHeretic That's limited for goods only

It makes perfect sense to remove some of the barriers where there is shared interest or agreements from both sides. Trade is trade whoever you are buying from or selling to. If we want growth as labour does this is essential to get it moving

@RealMash

24 күн бұрын

Mutual interest from the EU and the UK. But we can not remove any laws and regulations all other third countries would like to have removed also. The UK is just one of a lot of third parties. And the UK with ist "It is surely in your interest.." approach gets a bit annoying over time. You did not even implement the TCA in full, and are in constant breach of WTO rules. And you talk of any concessions from the EU? Are you flying on your unicorn to work, pray?

@samhartford8677

23 күн бұрын

Dishing out membership benefits to non-members is not in the interest of any EU country. We pay 1 % of our GDP to do deals that are in our interests.

@karstentopp

23 күн бұрын

Nope. There is a reason, why this will not happen. It is called MFN clause. If the EU would give one non-member privileges, other non-members could also force the EU to get similar benefits through the WTO courts.

The web edition of the Guardian on Wednesday 3 Jul ran with the headline ‘Britain will not rejoin EU in my lifetime, says Starmer’ Hands up if you saw this headline. Moorehouse, put your hand dow!

" No return to EU Single Market in my lifetime " K Starmer. A direct quote. I think we can all agree that rules it out ?

@RealMash

23 күн бұрын

His lifetime. Not the lifetime of the children.

@rayc9539

23 күн бұрын

He doesn't know how long he'll live nor will he be prime minister forever. It's a bit silly for him to say such a dismissive thing. He's doing too much to appease brexiters. He even campaigned for a "confirmatory referendum" remember?

I've noticed that cherry-picking is still a favourite past-time and national 'sport' in the UK, which doesn't seem to depend on where in the political spectrum one resides... 🙄.

@frankoneill5675

24 күн бұрын

Yes, but devoting a whole video to it. God almighty

@ab-ym3bf

23 күн бұрын

You do not understand. This is Labour cherry picking, so than it is ok. Mighty god, another comment section filled with joy about how the UK will be joining the parts that it wants, just via another non exiting back door.

@samhartford8677

23 күн бұрын

It's entertaining, though. Like Phil's attempt to achieve a Swiss-style deal by redefining what cherry picking means 😂

To be honest I accepted the Guardian headline at face value. On one hand I am disappointed in the Guardian, but on the other shouldn't Starmer's team have pushed back on that headline?

@jyvben1520

24 күн бұрын

pushed back how - why, they have a country to run, not to defend every step of every process to every newspaper/tv channel/journalist

@Turnipstalk

24 күн бұрын

No, because it helps keep the Mail and Express a bit quieter.

@P--B

24 күн бұрын

(1) this was during the election campaign, so getting the message right is kind of important (2) there are actually people specifically employed for public relations, and aren't 'running' the country

@pansepot1490

24 күн бұрын

Should learn to read the full article. Reminds me of what I heard from an American activist recently: “there is no more reliable media” even outlets or journalists who are considered “liberal” or “progressive” can spread misinformation, either because of clickbaity headlines, or because of what they CHOOSE to cover vs what they leave out, or because of some agendas of their own. This Guardian article seems a confirmation of that warning. Ofc there’s outlets more trustworthy than others but the rules is to always pay attention and being skeptical ESPECIALLY if the news is outrageous/unexpected.

@samhartford8677

23 күн бұрын

No, because they meant it. They are, just like Phil here, fantasising about a step by step path into the single market, which has been blocked by the EU a long time ago. Greetings from the EU. The front door remains open, however, when the Tories want to rejoin the ever-closer fiscal union too.

The final decision will be made by the 27 or more members of the EU. There will be NO outer ring of the EU half in half out nonsense. You are either a member of the EU or you are not. No British cherrypicking. All steps towards closer alignment is a minimum requirement for better trade..

@rogerphelps9939

24 күн бұрын

We shall see what happens. Whatever it is will be better than what we have now.

The issue is that for many people EU membership and the single market was an ideological issue rather than a fiscal one, so a statement outright ruling out a return to either (factual or otherwise) understandably gets people's backs up. It is hard to convince people to ignore what they hear reported about you if you aren't willing to stick your head up and actually correct them for fear of losing votes.

The fly in the ointment may be the comment from Michel Barnier that there would be very few concessions from the EU without freedom of movement.

@lukeneilson9799

24 күн бұрын

Totally agree with this. This is actually doable because although it's toxic. All Starmer has to say is that it was required in order to improve trade and that immigration won't be increased, as less visas would get issued to non-EU immigration. The right wing press will no doubt be hypocritical and scream about it, despite racists preference for EU migration over non-EU migration 😅.

@frankoneill5675

24 күн бұрын

Did he actually say that, or did he say the obligations of the SM? The four freedoms are indivisible.

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

​@@lukeneilson9799that's gibberish. People are not happy with any immigration...it's irrelevant whether the person is from Germany or India or Japan or USA...it's mainly about numbers not race

@lukeneilson9799

24 күн бұрын

@keithparker1346 migration numbers are never going to come down when we need them enomically, so it's best to educate people and explain why we need them. Immigration would come down a little bit if freedom of movement returned, as there would be more qualified people available for jobs where we desperately need them. Plus I still maintain that the racists would prefer migration from EU countries compared to non-EU countries.

@Ooze-cl5tx

24 күн бұрын

@@keithparker1346 i remember hearing about the referendum from UK citizens with roots in commonwealth countries that they voted leave because to them it seemed unfair that any european could work in the UK while their relatives had to go through the hostile immigration procedures if they wanted to come to the UK. So i would say that at least some people where not happy with some immigration and wanted instead some other immigration which seems to have worked so far.

Step by step alignment makes sense.

@geraldhewing2076

24 күн бұрын

​@@lasttempoinparisLes miettes puent chez vous?

@frankoneill5675

24 күн бұрын

Not to the EU. No cherry picking

@samhartford8677

23 күн бұрын

Only to the British exceptionalists. The EU said no to such an approach a long time ago. It's not in the interest of members to dish out membership benefits to non-members.

I asked all eight PPCs standing for election to become the MP for Croydon West to explain their plan to address the consequences of Brexit. Three days before 4 July, the Labour candidate replied. The answer was copied and pasted directly from the party’s manifesto: ‘There will be no return to the single market, the customs union, or freedom of movement.’ I have written asking for more details, as I believe that this is very bad plan.

Great video thank you keep smiling and be happy

There is quite, seriously, a lot of people still, clueless, as to what the EU is and how it works, I think Labour needs to begin a proper information/education, program, or campaign, to explain exactly what needs to happen before, during or even about, the process, of rejoining, and this needs to happen urgently, The EU will not entertain, the UK rejoining until, the Good Citizens of the UK, understand what the EU is, and What Membership is, Education is needed, ty,😊😊😊

@ab-ym3bf

23 күн бұрын

That assumes Labour has they level of knowledge themselves. As a Labour member and wannabe candidate Phil shows how much that is lacking as well

We want freedom of movement, the Euro, and Shengen - Max Rejoin.

@RealMash

23 күн бұрын

And who can grant that, and why should the EU do so?

@alea_iacta_est.rubicon

21 күн бұрын

But as much as I'd love it Britain will never get it. That's why I fought so hard against loud, proud ignorant racist British so that there would be a second referendum. It's all too late now. So a poor, isolated future it is.

As it happens, I think the Labour position is right. Easy to say all these people in polls want to go back. See how that looks when the conditions on opt-outs, no rebate etc are flagged up. Going to be a lot closer. And would the EU bother without more cross party support anyway?

Underpromise, overdeliver, as opposed to promise sunlit uplands, deliver a rough shaft.

The single market is a market in goods, services, capital and labour. Starmer has ruled out free movement of people with the EU, which is necessary for free trade in both labour and services. Negotiating fewer controls on the movement of goods is not rejoining the single market.

@frankoneill5675

24 күн бұрын

And it would also need the EU to take part in the negotiation, which seems to be a footnote in this video

@swangelok

24 күн бұрын

An this negotiations come at a price, a very steep one

@Nemothewonderfish

23 күн бұрын

Yes but he is a lawyer... people forget he used words carefully and didn't single out ways of getting FOM back.

@frankoneill5675

23 күн бұрын

@@Nemothewonderfish He didn't single out ways of getting FOM back because there aren't any, other than EU membership. The four freedoms are indivisible, central elements of the EU Single Market, and only available to EU members.

While many wish we could just jump back in the EU, we got to be realistic. The tories made sure to burn bridges and insult and offend the EU negotiators so to make rejoining incredibly hard if not impossible. And if labour do not take the right precautions, tories might say they are betraying the brexit vote. It’s important to take small but decisive steps. Remove barriers, allow the free flow of talent and products. And more importantly show how all of this could have been done before, whiteout the need to destroy the economy.

@samhartford8677

23 күн бұрын

Yeah, sorry, that's not on offer. It's not in the interest of members to dish out membership benefits to non-members. Greetings from the EU.

its not all about trade,, people want freedom, meaning our Four Freedoms, not just to make companies richer

Remember that the EU is far more beneficial to the UK than the UK is to the EU. Size matters. So for every cherry picked by the UK, the EU wants 10 cherries back. I don't think it is a fuitful (pun intended) approach. Besides that, the step by step approach is creating a bit of a bureaucratic mess for exporters on either side. I don't see it happening.

@frankoneill5675

24 күн бұрын

Of course it won't happen. It is all fantasy

Talking about sovereignty how about this for a headline from yesterday....."US blocks British court from British territory". Brexiteers comments below please.....

@ab-ym3bf

24 күн бұрын

AFAIK, according to the latest UN resolution the territory is no longer to be seen as british occupied territory but has to be given back to the original, displaced population. As usual, britain declines, backed by its master the USA.

@TheHoveHeretic

24 күн бұрын

Missed that headline. Would this be Diego Garcia perchance?

@trident6547

16 күн бұрын

@@TheHoveHeretic YES

The JRM approach should be adopted by all present and future British Government's. The Full Brexit Brexit Benefits won't be realised for the next 50 year's. There are *Only* 47 year's and 174 day's +/- a few left. This Harping on that the EU need the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is, So Old Hat. The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland at this moment in time if an application was submitted to Brussels would be rejected out of hand. Britain doesn't meet the Criteria. Its not like the 1970s when Ireland needed Britain. 🇮🇪🇪🇺

i'm glad you have such a consistent look to your thumbnails. sometimes i'm browsing youtube on the tv from bed and i can't read the all the text on the screen but th color combo/positions tell me this is your channel 🙂

@annalieff-saxby568

24 күн бұрын

And thank _goodness_ Phil's abandoned that dreadful AI look!

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

It's a standard thing of nearly every channel. You make it sound like Phil's doing something special or unique

This will make Tom Sheppard cry again.

Need to get back into Erasmus

@frankoneill5675

24 күн бұрын

Well, any education in England would be a bonus, by the sound of things

@TheHoveHeretic

23 күн бұрын

​@@frankoneill5675Wish I could disagree .... though much we've seen you can thank the old 'secondary modern' schools for. Wonder why boomers tend not to take anything on board not repeatedly thrashed into them? There you go, that's a big part of the answer.

@francocanuck

23 күн бұрын

You need to get back to the EU

I clearly recall Keir Starmer saying on TV that he wouldn't join the CU or Single Market.

@tonymaries1652

24 күн бұрын

But when the general public decide that customs union with our greatest trading partners is desirable ...

@ScandalUK

24 күн бұрын

True, this is speculation of a different deal - other countries have a similar arrangement.

@debugstore

24 күн бұрын

@@tonymaries1652 It is the government's job to advise the public what is their best interests. Brexit was clearly not in the best interest of the UK public

@shaneheff5244

24 күн бұрын

Watch the video. Phil said it will be a gradual rejoining with alignment and small trade agreements. Official rejoining will be a long way off but the conditions will be in place.

@frankoneill5675

24 күн бұрын

@@ScandalUK Which countries have a similar arrangement?

What guarantees can we give the EU that in five years time a Reform/Conservative won't undo any positive steps made by Stamer towards alingment. Also, the EU could not tolerate the wild west approach to banking and tax laws in the UK, giving the advantages to UK financial institutions (money laundering etc) over EU institutions. Can't see it happening and will be a graveyard for Labour.

@RealMash

23 күн бұрын

The wild west approach without proper oversight was exactly why Brexit happened, it was to avoid EU transparency directives. All the rest with appeals at greed, xenophobia and jingoism was just to make the stupid electorate to shoot itself in the face. It would be really hard for labour to work against those powers. But hey, surprise me.

Phil the EU is far more than the single market, therefore there is not a chance of access for Britain given your behaviour. I strongly suspect that is all you are after and there is no good will towards britain for very understandable reasons

@GoldMario5500

23 күн бұрын

He's a remainshit the EU has already said they won't accept the UK back plus all 27 EU countries are against the British

Can only hope so, just has to play it carefully. Boring technical discussions are fine. Hopefully at some point, full membership again (within our lifetime). The right wing will scream and scream but they were just totally m... Great to see some sensible discussions again

I am totally for reversing Brexit, but I have to admit I'm sceptical of the step-by-step process to single market access....

@ab-ym3bf

24 күн бұрын

don´t worry, there is no step by step process to the single market.

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

​@@ab-ym3bf I think the fact that we could not get a soft Brexit is proof that single market access requires EU membership

@shaneheff5244

24 күн бұрын

It's totally realistic. Membership talks go on for years as Phil says. So it's much the same thing to do all that outside the EU anyway

@frankoneill5675

24 күн бұрын

@@shaneheff5244 No it isn't. You don't decide what way you join the EU, the EU does. The same process applies to all aspiring countries. SM access is for EU members only. Make Brexit Work

@shaneheff5244

24 күн бұрын

@frankoneill5675 Try watching the video. Making Brexit work isn't possible without agreements with EU to improve trade and standards. This in turn aligns the UK and EU more closely and will lead to rejoining.

Minor point of correction: Article 49 states that there are benefits to be had before full membership is completed: "Transitional arrangements - the parties also discuss whether (and how) some rules can be introduced gradually to allow the accession country or EU Member States (countries) time to adapt. " - I think a much bigger obstacle is the Single Currency and adapting to life without the opt-outs and vetos that we would have lost.

A deal on chemicals will not happen any time soon, if ever. The reasons are rather obvious: 1) No such deal would be possible without ECJ oversight. 2) The UK would have to pay significant amounts of money every year only to be told what chemical regulations to implement. Starmer knows all of this, of course, which is why it is not going to even be discussed.

When Starmer was in Belfast did he make it clear what mandate he claimed that the elections gave him in the north of Ireland. He claims that the election results was a clear mandate from all four parts of the UK, a claim he has made numerous times. So with zero seats in the north of Ireland what mandate is he referring to?

@ab-ym3bf

24 күн бұрын

the mandate to not utter a word about NI?

@tonymolloy6165

24 күн бұрын

Starmer has a habit of saying things that he thinks his audience wants to hear. So different messages for different audiences. As you say he has no mandate from NI.

@LeafHuntress

24 күн бұрын

Isn't the SDLP the sister party of Labour in NI?

@eugdee7293

24 күн бұрын

@@LeafHuntress no they are not and they were very clear on that on the doorstep. They are an Irish nationlist party and also support Gaza. The SDLP may have historically had a small tie with the English Labour party but that tie was severed some time ago. So Starmer can not count the two seats that Eastwood and Hanna won as part of his mandate as both were very clear that the SDLP are not affiliated with Labour.

@tonymolloy6165

24 күн бұрын

@@LeafHuntress There is no formal agreement between the SDLP and the GB Labour party. There is actually a Labour Party of NI which has a rather acrimonious on/off relationship with the GB Labour Party. It ( or a renamed version of it ) has run candidates in some NI elections. You can read about it here. Just get rid of the spaces, inserted to get past KZread censors. https ://en.wikipedia.org /wiki/ Labour_Party_in_Northern_Ireland

Phil, i understand that the conversations about Brexit are still too toxic. U can kick the can down the road, but rejoining will have to be talked about. U might have to tell your friends or family to #$/× - off!

The UK more or less gave up the ideea of UK CA and just said , OK we will just accept CE

Its so easy to tell those who have had to pragmatically and methodically deal with various interests and build a project or business that needs to work, and those who are part of a political action group who meet once a month on a Thursday and write strongly worded letters to their MP.

Why would the EU take UK back?

@brianferguson7840

24 күн бұрын

FOR HEAVEN'S SAKE ! You can't rejoin the European Union ! It's not your choice and never will be. When britain joined the original Common Market, there were a handful of members, and it still took eleven years to convince them to agree to have you. Now there are twenty seven member states, and you have proven beyond any possible doubt how untrustworthy and mendacious you are and that you have absolutely no concept of the true European ideal. You voted to leave, you left ! And we don't want you back ! Why would we ????

@VivaEuropa-ip6yk

24 күн бұрын

That’s not what Phil was implying, try harder next time.

@abbofun9022

24 күн бұрын

@@VivaEuropa-ip6yk yes it was, not a word on what UK has to offer the EU

@WinstonMelbourne-vt2vt

24 күн бұрын

it is in their interest to have a big market, it is not just a one-way thing both sides will benefit

@VivaEuropa-ip6yk

24 күн бұрын

@@abbofun9022 No one with any political power in the UK is advocating for beginning the readmission process. Neither is Phil. Try to listen next time. Or is it you’re just a Reform UK type pretending to be pro-European.

Unless Labour truly screw up, the chances of the Tories getting back into power any time soon are slim at best. In addition the people the Right wing Tories appeal to are dying and because of the dasmage the previous government did to the NHS they are possibly dying faster, see, every cloud does have a silver lining. If the ageing and addled membership pick someone like Badenoch, Jenrick or God forbid Braverman, the Tories will quite possibly have even less voter appeal in 5 years time than they did last week.

@petertromans5599

24 күн бұрын

If only that were true . Unfortunately, very small changes in voter feelings can give huge changes in parliamentary numbers. Systematic reform ( with a small r ) is essential.

@LudwigVaanArthans

24 күн бұрын

Next election cycle the gammons will be back, don't worry

@rocketsurgeon2135

22 күн бұрын

When, in five years, it turns out Labour cherry picking attempts are just as unfruitful as their Tory equivalent, the UK economy has continued to deteriorate, national debt continued to spiral out of control, and Cost of Living is up while Standard of Living is down, it won't surprise me a whole lot if the Labour party will get treated similarly to how the Tories were in in this election.

It's all good news, thank you for the clear analysis.

Phil, David Davis promise to go to Berlin to strike a good deal with EU, Lammy went to Berlin to repair EU relations. (sic.) Theresa May proposed security deal for a better trade deal, EU declined. EU proposed UK to align to EU standard for NIP, (Bojo and) Keir Starmer excluded such outcome (red line). Keir said we could have "mutual recognition", EU declined. UK proposed a Swiss style agreement, EU declined and it is dismantling the deal with Switzerland. "No more, either you enter or stay out". Why should EU agree one with us? Because we're "special"?

Nope. A single market needs common standards and regulations for a FRICTIONLESS trade. Either you’re in or you’re out. David Frost, the lead Brexit negotiator wrote on X: “Except for free movement, people didn’t vote against any single subset of single market rules - they voted against having the rules set in Brussels.” Well no, you can’t have frictionless access to the SM without the rules. Sorry not sorry. And furthermore the EU is a political project. Always has been, hence the “C” in EEC.

@emm_arr

24 күн бұрын

"David Frost" The man should be on charges for misconduct in public office.

@ab-ym3bf

23 күн бұрын

​@@emm_arrand for being borne.

Even Labour won't fix the brexit nightmare which will go on and on

@seebarry4068

24 күн бұрын

It’s a start though.

@WinstonMelbourne-vt2vt

24 күн бұрын

You are right be we will but first step in the right direction

@peterebel7899

24 күн бұрын

According to the newest update Brexit is a promising candidate for UNESCO's world heritage list ...

@keithparker1346

24 күн бұрын

I predict it will chew up and spit out Labour as it's done the Tories. Guys we need to drop this fixation with rejoining and concentrate on actually dealing with the issues that lead to Brexit and those are issues we still have

@Noel-ji8nm

24 күн бұрын

​@@keithparker1346Labour created the Brexit problem.

The Windsor Framework is a special case for NI and depends on the EU trusting the island of Ireland for enforcement. Can never work for Britain, there is no trust. A lot of bridges need rebuilding and that will take a lot of time.

I agree that Government messaging needs to be sharp; heard (via ‘The Rest is Politics’) that Rwanda found out the planes had been cancelled via the press release (not the nation to nation diplomatic route!) UK must act in ways that build and sustain trust. Thanks for all that you do. You bring hope:-)

Love to see it, but will be knocking at the door and no one will answer - the EU got the best of our bad deal and has little interest in making life better for us. Slow convergence may come in some sectors, but at huge cost to us. Customs Union like Turkey possible? I hope so.

@brianferguson7840

24 күн бұрын

FOR HEAVEN'S SAKE ! You can't rejoin the European Union ! It's not your choice and never will be. When britain joined the original Common Market, there were a handful of members, and it still took eleven years to convince them to agree to have you. Now there are twenty seven member states, and you have proven beyond any possible doubt how untrustworthy and mendacious you are and that you have absolutely no concept of the true European ideal. You voted to leave, you left ! And we don't want you back ! Why would we ????

@markhackett2302

24 күн бұрын

Yeah, keep playing the zero sum card. A rising tide lifts all boats. So you, so filled with hate, will insist that the EU should cut its nose to spite the UK's face....?

Disappointed in The Guardian on this one. would expect it from "The Daily Fail," "The Times" or "The Cesspress!"

@ParaquatSC

24 күн бұрын

I think we should leave the silly nicknames to them

@annalieff-saxby568

24 күн бұрын

The Guardian always leans right when Labour are in power.

I want to rejoin,but I couldn't go thru it all again. Brexit cost me friends & drove a wedge between parts of family. I don't know the answers,but I doubt it will happen in the few yrs I have left.

We have sovereignty and we can use it to choose to align our standards with the EU. How can Brexiteers complain about that?

@rocketsurgeon2135

22 күн бұрын

Sure. You could also align with Indonesia's standards, if you like. Neither will change in any way how imports from the UK are treated at their respective borders. Though it does help domestic UK manufacturers, since it means they won't have to maintain one line for domestic products and a separate one for goods intended for export. With alignment, only one line is needed, and goods produced can either be sold in the UK, or exported to the market UK standards are aligned with. Other than that, alignment is only beneficial if it comes with an agreement with the one you've aligned with that they will accept goods covered by the aligned standards without requiring further documentation, basically to trust that goods made in the UK to UK standards (aligned with theirs) do meet those standards and that UK policing of standards is sufficient to ensure all goods adhere to standards. The UK won't get such a recognition deal from EU without dynamic alignment and ECJ oversight (i.e., EU court has jurisdiction over standards compliance in the UK).

Back in reality, as opposed to the delusional parallel universe where the UK has resided for a couple of decades, there is simply NO possibility that the UK can ever join the EU’s Single Market OR the Customs Union. The Single Market, otherwise known as the European Economic Area(EEA), is RESTRICTED to members of the EU(‘First Countries’) and members of the European Free Trade Association(EFTA), legally defined as ‘Second Countries’. There is NO legal mechanism whereby a ‘Third Country’ like the UK can participate in the EEA. There is less than ZERO interest among the 31 EEA members in creating any such mechanism. There is less than ZERO possibility of any “…bespoke deal…” for the UK. The UK has ZERO chance of succeeding in what would be its FOURTH EEC/EC/EU membership application for the foreseeable future. The UK has, equally, ZERO chance of joining EFTA. Both Norway and Iceland have clearly stated that they would both veto any such application.

@markhackett2302

24 күн бұрын

Ah, so afraid of a reversal that makes the EU stronger because that frightens you, you insist we will never get back in, so never try. So sad.

@rayc9539

24 күн бұрын

Where have Norway and Iceland officially announced this?

@colinsmith1288

24 күн бұрын

Well Starmer made it clear the Uk was not going back into the single market not even to apply to join.

@LudwigVaanArthans

24 күн бұрын

​@@rayc9539multiple times, over multiple media channels. Just search "EFTA members on potential UK admission" and Iceland and Norway are always absolutely against UK has a bigger population and would Billy the smaller EFTA members around, so eh

@rayc9539

24 күн бұрын

@colinsmith1288 He is being a brexiter puppet. We all know that deep down, he would prefer us to be EU members or at least in the single market. In 2019, he campaigned for a second referendum and wanted to make a case for freedom of movement. Right now, he is just playing politics - he did not want to alienate red wall brexiters, which cost labour the election in 2019. As a result of trying to appease everyone, he's turned wishy-washy, becoming notorious for u-turns. This is probably why he is often regarded as weak...