Purchase R3 Meta: tinyurl.com/ymap4wbx (Audio Advice) howl.me/ckfhwunFcAg (Crutchfield) amzn.to/3KqJuq2 (Amazon) Purchase R3 (non-Meta): howl.me/ckiCaAHf2Lc (Best Buy) (Note: Reference 1 Meta can only be purchased via dealer) Support the cause: Patreon: www.patreon.com/erinsaudiocorner Contribute via PayPal: www.paypal.com/donate?hosted_button_id=CLHSW4L9SBSLY If you are shopping at any of the above stores then please consider using my generic affiliate links above to make the purchase through. Purchases through these links can earn me a small commission - at no additional cost to you - and help me continue to provide the community with free content and reviews. Doesn't matter if it's a TV from Crutchfield, budget speakers from Audio Advice or a pair of socks from Amazon, just use the link above before you make your purchase. Thank you!

@niente58

11 ай бұрын

Hello Erin, it would be really nice to compare and old reference 3 or 5 against a new r11 meta..

@ac7183

11 ай бұрын

Best Buy's website also has the Reference 1 Meta.

@bacon.dumpling

10 ай бұрын

That’s crazy! I wonder how many R1s BestBuy has sold.

Neo magnets have a few benefits over ferrite (they have some negatives too). One is that since they are much smaller you can focus the flux into certain areas more easily and avoid magnetic field going outwards (this leads to automatic shielding for around electronics). Another is that they generally don't need shorting rings to have some form of inductance control. You actually saw this in your testing a long time ago with your Honda civic driver. You were surprised that a cheap car driver had inductance control. Well, it didn't have it in the traditional sense, the neo structure just had the inherent benefit. Of course, additional measures can be taken to lower inductance and inductance swing as well that you would see on higher end drivers. Another thing that neo drivers help with is airflow and reflections off the basket. With a smaller neo magnet and a transparent spider you get much fewer reflections off the magnet/basket structures which can effect impedance measurements (audibility of that is still out for debate I believe). Another commonly overlooked factor is manufacturing ease. Neo magnets are much less brittle than ferrite, so smaller parts are easier to produce. This can lead to better quality designs. Some downsides are that heat doesn't dissipate quite as well because there is less metal to draw it away, so you need a larger voice coil or louder cooling compared to ferrite. Luckily, since neo is so much stronger you can get away with a larger diameter coil without losing much. Another key thing is that neo drivers can actually lose magnetism if overheated. This point is actually not as serious as it sounds because most drivers never get close to these temps, but high power car subs and possibly pro audio stuff that was HEAVILY abused could suffer from it. That's nowhere near exhaustive, but I hope that gives some insight.

@bigjay1970

11 ай бұрын

Aren't you Mr. smarty pants.🤔🤫😛😉😇 Thanks for the indepth info.

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

Thanks for those reminders!

@NosEL34

11 ай бұрын

Very cool 👍

Ty. A very good comparison =) I would love to hear these kef speakers or just one of their coaxial driver some day. And if you don’t play too loud I think u can go cheap,but if you have large room and/or play loud go for expensive way.

I learn something new with every video. The dynamic range graphs at the end make sense now. Thanks!

@ErinsAudioCorner

9 ай бұрын

Great to hear!

The by far best review & comparison available.

Cool comparison thank you for the review! The price differences are so big that for those who own the Reference 1 at least the data show it is a better speaker, but spending that much for a bookshelf speaker doesn’t make sense to me especially if it is crossed over with a subwoofer! Plus the R3 Meta had a cool blue color!

My close friend last year purchased the R1 ( non Meta ) last year. Floor sample and trading in his LS-50, he got them for $4500.00 - no joke. And what a fabulous sound - I was literally blown away. R1 from KEF are made in the UK.

@KenM

11 ай бұрын

You are probably referring to REFERENCE 1 at that price and level of performance, not the R series.

@EricBurbeck

11 ай бұрын

@@KenM I had the same thought

@Audiomainia2310

11 ай бұрын

@@KenM I think you're right Ken. My mistake

Man, on paper that Reference 1 Meta looks phenomenal. Like wow. I'm really digging these comparison videos. Good stuff

@Pete.across.the.street

11 ай бұрын

You don't listen to paper though, so it doesn't matter.

@NosEL34

11 ай бұрын

@@Pete.across.the.streetI get what you're saying but I don't totally believe that. It's a pretty good indicator that the speaker will perform and sound pretty dang good. Get it in your house with your equipment there may be some things about it's performance you don't like.. preferences and all. A speaker like that Kef 1 is going to be easy to deal with... with placement and response and any eq. I'm not saying a bad measuring speaker can't sound good or fun to listen to but if I'm spending that kinda money that Kef 1 type data is what I'm looking for. Minus that low sensitivity..but even that is workable. Just my personal thoughts and opinion.

@Pete.across.the.street

11 ай бұрын

@@NosEL34 it can point you in the right direction for sure.

Outstanding video, friend. These references look phenomenal. Thanks!

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

Glad you enjoyed!

Good engineering analysis as always, well done!

Great comparison, Erin! At the point where you add a sub or two with a quality crossover (like DLBC) to the R3s, I question how important the differences you highlighted would then be. The subs may not be able to fully compensate for all the differences you identified in the mid bass between 100-200 hz, but it would be close. I think the remaining big differnce is the wider dispersion.

One reason why Ref 1 costs more is because its fully manufacfured at KEF's factory in Kent England. AFAIK Ref cabinets are made for KEF by a supplier in England. R series is made in China in Kef's factory so that is one reason for the price disparity.

@we8463

10 ай бұрын

Please that’s just an excuse! Twice the price ok but more than three times the price please give me a break!

Thanks for this comparison, I've been eying these different metas for a while. It's weird how uncommon it is to see comparisons across jumps in price, as if customers are expected to have decided a strict budget before they know what it will get them. In between the R3 Meta and Reference 1 Meta are the Rx Meta floorstanders and centre channels. I'd imagine the R11 Meta for example can give out a lot more volume and bass extension than the R3, but it'd be interesting to know if the Reference 1 Meta has considerable advantages over it for the extra £2000. I can't in kindness request you review the floorstanders at this time though, thinking of your poor back. I wish you a speedy full recovery.

Really interesting comparison, great stuff.👍🙂 Regarding the radiation width, yes the drivers may be the same dimensions however the chamfer around the driver's is somewhat different. This will cause the radiation pattern to be different as the chamfer can actually have the effect of virtually increasing driver size. Most manafacturers seem to use the chamfer on woofer's to make bass faster sounding, less boomy due to directing energy away from interacting with the baffle front so much and helping minimise any diffraction. I'm surprised KEF didn't expect directivity to be different depending on changes to this area.🤔

@FOH3663

11 ай бұрын

I instantly flipped back and forth comparing the radiation over and over. There's obvious differences, ... however, it appears mostly similiar tendencies, yet presenting a differing level, ... somewhat akin to a changing of the scale.

By far the most interesting comparison is the one KEF avoids. It's the comparison of the R3 Meta and Reference 1 non-Meta.

Wonderful informative comparison Erin.

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

Blind test with tad drivers showed preference for neodym above alnico above ferrite drivers in mids....also in bass 15" al ico was preferred above ferrite...

Honestly, the biggest reason for the price difference is that the Reference Line is all made in England (drivers inc) so you are paying for that mostly... anything under Reference is made in China

Hi Erin - many thanks for the video/insights! I'd like to get your thoughts. Specifically, does my ol' school NAD 7225PE integrated amp (with 25 watts per channel at 8 ohms) have the energy to drive the R3 Metas? How do these stack up to the B&W 606 S2? And, are they "too much" for an office that is13 feet by 13 feet? Please let me know your thoughts! Thank you.

Dig the OTT shirt.. ✊🏼… A Stallone classic IMO.

Great review. Thanks for sharing.

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

Thanks for watching!

@6:20 I heard from some transducer engineers before that neo magnets have lower inductance and distortion... can't remember who said it though.

I am running the Reference 1 Meta with a Technics SU-R 1000. Good combination. I enjoy it every day….

Ferrite vs. Neo - one of thr biggest differences is MOQs lol! Neo motors are usually available in smaller quantities 😅

Erin, I would be very interested in your opinion comparing the KEF R3 Meta and the Buchardt S400 MKII. Maybe this is worth for a future video. Thanks Ralph

R3 Meta plus a sub seems like a good compromise.

One difference with neodymn is that it resists eddy currents better. So one dont need as much shorting rings etc. Or conversly can get lower distortion when combined. You see from some manufacturers that have drivers with both neo and ferrite that the neo ones can lack shorting rings while the ferrite one have them etc. This does not mean that neo always is better. A good motors tructure is always better.

Curious how the difference in dynamic range would look between the two if both were paired with crossovers and subwoofers.

What amp and dac did you use?

How would you eq the non-meta R3 to be as good as the R3 meta?

Thanks for the video

That Ref 1 looks great!

Great comparison. Without factoring affordability, it boils down to 1. If one likes the sound i.e. enjoyability. 2. If your room 'likes' the sound and 3. Am i still smiling after listening for 3 hours continuously. As a former sound engineer, i have always maintained that everyone should audition speakers 1st, in an audio inert room and, 2nd, in their listening environment. I was fortunate to audition the Reference 5s at home with a few different stereo amps, a little while ago. Whilst not being able to afford these at the time, relative to price and compared to speakers costing far more, these would have been my retirement speakers. Recently i 'accidentally' auditioned the KEF LS60 + KC62 and the recent Bluesound node x. Using the Xover management/DSP i was able to get these sounding 'perfect', in my room, with room to change for poorer recordings. I have studio speakers which sound poorer. What more could one want?

@morespinach9832

10 ай бұрын

Upgrade from Bluesound to Auralic or Lumin.

@DH-og5yr

9 күн бұрын

You had them in your room while you couldn’t afford them?

I got a chance to do a AB testing between LS50 Meta and Reference 3 Meta. The difference is evenings and days. Ref 3 brings out a lot more details than LS50. I have LS50 Meta for 3 years and now I lost all the interest on it. I need an upgrade it to Ref 1

Kef Ref 1 dynamic range is very good, 116db if crossed with sub as its the same mids and tweeter as the ref 5 which are rated 116db.

I did this exact same thing, trying the ls50 meta over the original ls50 and I listen pretty close to things over they years after experimenting with many different speakers, honestly I couldn't tell much of a difference at all between the two models, it wasn't worth he extra, I would just stick with the original ls50 for the money.

so I take the R 3 which is on sale at kef for 1399 and marry it to two HSU subwoofers. Now how does it compare to the R1

What other bookshelf other than the Tef 1 is in that league?Harbeth SLH 5 ,?

For every 3dB loss in sensitivity, you'll need twice the amp power for the same sound pressure level.

@CC-xu2yz

11 ай бұрын

That's what he said.

@NaregChakhbasian

10 ай бұрын

But you would only need 100 Watson in even 85db speakers to produce enough sound to cause ear damage.

@bobtaylor7197

10 ай бұрын

Surprisingly few audio people seem to be aware of this fact😂

@marcgallant5270

10 ай бұрын

Common knowledge

@julianklietz6558

9 ай бұрын

​@@NaregChakhbasian 105db certainly isn't gonna permanantly damage your ears for the lenght of a record, especially because its only the peaks that are that loud.

R11 Meta vs Reference 5 Meta next!!!! Anyone have some speakers to send to Erin? 😁

When Lincoln Hawk adjusted his grip..you knew he was going Over The Top!!!

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

YES!!!

@qboogie

11 ай бұрын

And the backwards cap!

@kenhiett5266

4 ай бұрын

He's lucky Devon Larratt wasn't waiting for him at the end of those brackets.

Great video! Thanks! I'm wondering, March Purifi vs Kef Ref1, why one over the other?

@giangpham6348

11 ай бұрын

I think the same. March Sountuiva seems to beat Kef reference 1 meta in both price and performance 😂

@RennieAsh

11 ай бұрын

In Aus, R1 ref meta is $15k Sointuva is $6k R3 meta is ~$4k

Erin thanks for the great data based reviews! I'm trying to decide which Kef center channel to get, the R2 Meta or the Reference 2 Meta. Any advice? Do you think the performance of the R3 meta and Reference 1 should reflect the performance of the corresponding center channels? After watching your review of the R2c, the older R2c didn't appeal to me. Thanks.

@ErinsAudioCorner

6 ай бұрын

Oh, goodness! I can’t say for sure, but I will say that my impression of the reference one meta was phenomenal. If the reference 2 meta is equally as good in its own right then it’s a no-brainer.

Impressive F3 on the R1M! It is pretty bizarre why they used LESS waveguide ribs on the lower models... Must make a big difference, then.

Will the R3 work as a bookshelf? I'm stuck for placement on this one . . . '

sending love and peace to everyone...

Its all on paper ... where are the speakers ?

Not a speaker designer here, but I reckon with Neodym magnets you can get a greater magnetic field density, provided the magnet isn’t proportionally reduced in size!, and in turn you might have a voice coil with less loops thus a lower mass of the moving parts, overall?

@iikatinggangsengii2471

6 ай бұрын

they all different and worth owning, tm11 more for tm9 owners imo

I'd love to see the KEF Reference 1 compared to the Genelec 8361A.

@we8463

10 ай бұрын

Or Genelec The One 8351

thanks for script. It will be good for non-english people ~! :)

Erin, what would you say, when Reference1 is too expensive and R3 is too weak in bass, just get a R5 + Sub (since with a R3 a sub crossover at 80Hz would be tricky) while simultanously not having to get a stand? Edit: I just noticed that KEF R series always comes with that bass droop for room compensation. Say maybe R3 is still fine with Xover at 80 Hz?

hi mate. I was thinking to get AVR such as Martanz cinema 60 dab or ONKYO TX-NR6100 but you said "you dont suggest to get avr" would you mind to say why ? Your opinion would help me

@ErinsAudioCorner

23 күн бұрын

Usually when I'm talking AVRs I'm talking more budget friendly AVRs. The two you mentioned are of good build quality so I don't know if it's as much a concern. That said, both these speakers dip down below 4 ohm for a bit and this may present a bit of a problem for higher volume listening; especially for longer listening sessions at full tilt. What I typically suggest is that the user start with the AVR they want and then add a separate power amplifier later if they feel they aren't getting the SPL levels they need/want. The Marantz you mentioned has pre-out RCAs to feed an external amplifier while the Onkyo does not. So there's not much room for future expansion if you want it. I'm gonna throw a cheap plug for myself here... if you do buy the AVRs you mentioned, would you mind using my affiliate link below? It doesn't cost you anything extra but does earn me a small commission which I would definitely appreciate it. Marantz Cinema 60: howl.me/cmy27cUAF12 ONKYO TX-NR6100: howl.me/cmy27zEH3SC

i'll echo the sentiment that considering the market right now, by far the best and most useful comparison would be Reference 1 NONMeta vs R3 Meta, as you can get great deals on the former

How about the kef ls50 with a very good sub and eq. Vs the Reference 1?

@al3xandrion

3 ай бұрын

I'm really torn between a pair of ls50 meta at 700$ and a kf92 or a pair of r7 at around 1900$.

What smoothing level do you use in your data?

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

1/20-th Octave.

Hi Erin, I know you from diyma, I have a Zapco AP 4 channel amp, can I use it with R3 meta? Would it be a good idea? Thanks

@ErinsAudioCorner

7 ай бұрын

I suppose you can.

@Chaudhrynaveed

7 ай бұрын

@@ErinsAudioCorner Thanks, I have ordered R3 Meta and waiting for delivery. I heard you say don't use an AVR, I planned on using Marantz SR7011, but I know I need a amplifier. I only have. Car amps :) I'll try to find a psu and test it. Thanks for your response.

R3 Meta vs Buchardt S400 mk2. Which one is better, sound wise. Thanks.

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

No experience with that particular Buchardt model.

i havent read all the coments. but my understanding of why KEF as not made a "meta disc" for the midrange is just size. the crossover for the bass driver is about 420hz and then it would be needed maybe allt he way down to 300hz or somthing. and then you'd end up with the longest chanel of 50cm due to it needing to ba half the wavelenght of about a meter in that frequenzy span.

@larskvaloy

9 ай бұрын

im not a designer of speaker boxes either, but i gues you also want a enclosed box behind the lower part of the midrange, rather than just aborbing everything.

The more interesting question to me is not if the Ref 1 meta is worth it over the R3 meta, but is it worth it vs other speakers in the $9k range.

@user-xg6zz8qs3q

11 ай бұрын

You could get an artisanal speaker build with the finest fullrange driver and a transmission line cabinet (it doesn’t get much better than that) and no crossover for $9k. Yeah the bass won’t be as good as a 3-way design. But everything else will sound so much smoother and more immersive. Fullrange drivers deserve more recognition. The negatives of using only 1 driver are diminishing over the years.

@NaregChakhbasian

10 ай бұрын

​@user-xg6zz8qs3q yeah the new seas 6inch driver in the seirra lx is a true champion. it pretty much negates having the need for a tower.

You should also review the Yamaha NS-5000. Because to quote Yamaha: "Setting a new standard in performance and quality by which all other Hi-Fi speakers should be judged."

Sensitivity is at the bottom of the list for my complaint about any speaker. Sensitivity must fall to improve linearity. That is simply a fact of physics. For professional use, that is a non-issue. Power is almost free today.

nice comparison

Thank you. very helpful

Glad I bought the original R11s and R3s in the recent mega clearance sale. R3s were going for less than $1k including tax NIB. 2.2k plus tax for the R3 metas? No way the R3 or R1 metas are/were worth the extra $$$, but that doesn’t make a KZread hype video. I will buy the “metas” during Kef’s clearance before the launch of the super-meta” in five years. 😂

@iikatinggangsengii2471

6 ай бұрын

it wasnt exactly day after actually more like a week after, i remember trying to 'workaround' it by using rca to 3.5 cable sound was distorted everywhere

Kef is doing a great job following science on its speaker. I feel fool saying, but, the only downside for me is the aesthetics of its drivers. I prefer a more tradicional looking speaker, like JBL or Revel. 😂 If I buy a KEF, I’d put a grile on it. Ok, ok… my fool moment is gone. Good job, Kef! Erin, thanks for the review.

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

Thanks!

@VioletGiraffe

11 ай бұрын

I totally understand that these are not cheap speakers and as such they should look good in your interior, not only sound good. That's a perfectly valid consideration. But I also think that KEF products do look pretty good :)

@caioferrari

11 ай бұрын

@@VioletGiraffe it’s weird for me that hidden driver suspension and it’s speaker without a central dome. Looks like a fake speaker 😂

@1337sim1

11 ай бұрын

At the price these sell, you are not a fool. Speakers are part of your home decoration, you better like how it looks, you live with it! 😊

To me the Ref 1 is competing value with the LS60.

Watched the video right when it came out, but now many months later I have a comment to add: After recently getting to demo the Reference 1 Meta vs R11 Meta in the listening room in my local Best Buy, I have to say that my current dream speaker is probably the Reference 1 Meta, or maybe one of the Reference towers if I end up living somewhere a bit less cramped. Of course this is more of a dream than anything that could ever become a reality, but what are dreams for, right?

The real question is, if you have subwoofers, would you prefer the R11 Metas or the Reference 1 metas? Price range is similar...

@marcgallant5270

10 ай бұрын

Reference 1 meta for me

KEF really needs to release all back versions of their R3 Meta and LS50 Meta speakers. I mean blue and copper? I don't think so!

shoulda bought those damn Q150's when they were $300 :(

@joelopez7459

11 ай бұрын

is it me or they're not on sale as often? I'm not in a hurry, enjoying my Jbl 530 and checking out the Hsu 8'' coaxials........

@805alpal

11 ай бұрын

@@joelopez7459 oh yeah, as far as I can tell, they're back up to $599 and staying

Ok so now I see what you're getting, they shouldn't be more than like $5K but i get it. I've noticed how most bookshelf speakers really fall off a cliff ~80Hz........

Kef R11 beats these two in comparison test 😜 and bass extension. And now cost about 3k new. With dirac live these are end game speakers (running with two subs with dirac live bass control)

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

Prove it. Send me the R11 for me to review. :p

@richm4402

11 ай бұрын

Yeah, good price if you only want one speaker 3k each

@Audfile

11 ай бұрын

Yeah, but it won't sound as good. There's a reason the R1 isn't also 3K. Then there's the Blades. I have LS50 Metas. They are great. I don't have any illusion that they will sound like Reference 1.

@junior-OG

11 ай бұрын

yeah but reference 5 meta > r11 meta

I am in the market for new speaker system for “pure audio” and a 5.1 home theatre system. If I picked the R3 Meta as my front fight and left, what would be a good tonal match for the centre, rear surrounds, and subwoofer?

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

Can you do r3 meta for sides? If so, there you go. For center, R2C or R6C meta versions are the best options.

Do you think the Reference Meta is overkill for surround sound?

@ErinsAudioCorner

8 ай бұрын

Yes and no. Yes, it's not entirely necessary to spend that much money on a surround speaker. But no if you can comforatably afford it and you like having awesome stuff.

@we8463

8 ай бұрын

@@ErinsAudioCorner Thank you very much for your response, what if you like to listen to multichannel music such as symphonies on SACD or BlueRay audio? Also do you know if the cabinet is different inside?

Thank you for the comparisons. Now when you start to reach the $9k price point the Kef Reference 1 face some serious competition. At $10k retail the Joseph Audio Pulsar 2 Graphene will deliver better tight quality bass, significantly better imaging, and equal micro detail delivery compared to the Reference 1. For $7k in the slightly used market the Paradigm Persona 3F will outperform both the Pulsar 2 and the Reference 1 in every category. The better purchase decision in the Kef line is indeed the R3 mets. Very good overall sonic performance for the price.

@64493552

8 ай бұрын

where is the measurement that support this subjective opinion?

@katie_0258

6 ай бұрын

Or instead of the JAP, just buy the SEAS drivers and DIY. Then you get the worlds best speakers, and make a decent cabinet w/o the horrid gloss.

How much better is the R3 meta v the LS50 meta , cuz that’s the obvious upgrade. Also the R3 meta appears to be a more sensitive spkr n that wld benefit us class A tube amps that put out max 50W

@user-xg6zz8qs3q

11 ай бұрын

Just get the Closer Acoustics OGY. They can do anything that the LS50 Meta can do but better. And the OGY are 91db sensitive so you can power them with any amp under the sun, even a cheap 10W class D amp with a TA2024 chip. It’s mind boggling that nobody except Jay’s Iyagi reviewed the OGY.

@Nick_2i

11 ай бұрын

​​@@user-xg6zz8qs3qHave you heard both? not trying to be confrontational, just genuinely curious. I cant find much info on them, and the only measurements ive seen are atrocious (literally +/-25db) but I dont know if those are acurate or how they were taken.

@user-xg6zz8qs3q

11 ай бұрын

@@Nick_2i I heard the LS60, LS50 and I own Closer Acoustics OGY.

@Nick_2i

11 ай бұрын

​@@user-xg6zz8qs3q Thats really interesting. Id love to see more reviews/data on them.

@praetor47

Ай бұрын

@@user-xg6zz8qs3q any measurements to support your claims?

I just noticed nobody has taken measurements of the Sierra-LX 🤑🤑🤑

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

I’m trying.

Please review the R7!

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

I wish.

Keep me coming🤝🏾

could buy 2 kef kc62 subs for 1500 a piece and still be 3500 dollars cheaper

Reference 1 Mets is gonna sound boomy with room gain in the bass region.

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

Depends on placement.

I'd love to see a Reference 1 (non Meta) review. These are quite "affordable" at the moment and they are amazing (I do have them). For many people it can be a great purchase if the difference with the Meta is not so high.

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

I don’t have any experience with that model.

@harrislevinson2877

11 ай бұрын

i owned the Reference 1 (Non meta). Owned them for about a year (Used with a sub). Was very happy with them. Sold them only because my KEF dealer offered me a great deal on a pair of Reference 3 (non-meta). The Reference series is the most revealing speakers I have ever owned.

F3 on meta is 77Hz? jeeesus. Sensitivity for $9000 speaker is 82.5dB? oommph. All metallic membranes? What else, maybe cabinets are MDF/HDF not even baltich birch or aluminum? How they are better than Kali Audio IN 8?

well for $9k we can have JTR NOESIS 215RT which go down to 18Hz, are 95dB , birch cabinets and have high end compression driver

LS60 would be a better choice than Reference 1. The benefit of active speaker plus lower extension.

@Nick_2i

11 ай бұрын

Reference 1 Metas hit 30hz at -6db, the LS60 hit 26hz at -6db Im also very skeptical that the ls60 can do that at 100db+ The Reference 1 will never suffer from technological obsolescence or amplifier failure. The Reference 1 is also much easier to move and pack. (niche benefit, but important for me given I move every few years) If you don't need the wireless/streaming features, I would argue that the Reference 1 is the better speaker. If you do need the features, the LS60 might be a much more cost-effective option.

@whitecrowuk575

11 ай бұрын

@@Nick_2i well ls60 has 4 5.25” drivers ref 1 has one. Both rated at the same 111db at 1 meter. Active speaker has amplification before crossover and huge benefits of that are well known. You can’t achieve the same with same sized passive speaker - it’s impossible. So why pay 100% more for ref1 (including suitable amplification) ? For shiny front plate? While reference 1 won’t suffer from amplifier failure your separate most likely expensive amp can - and will cost you more to replace like for like than repair ls60 with new amp from KEF. The only advantage it has is resale value. But if you buy a speaker you’re happy with and want to keep it long time than ls60 is a good choice - gives you a taste of what high end sounds for less.

@Nick_2i

11 ай бұрын

​​@@whitecrowuk575A passive speaker also has amplification before crossover. I'm a big fan of active speakers in general, but nothing you have said explains why, specifically, the LS60 are better than the Reference 1. Yes, the Reference only has one woofer, but, as you said, they can acheive similar end results. And I wouldnt be surprised if the price of shipping and repairing an LS60 is more than $1k, which can buy you all the amplification you could ever want. Again, not arguing price, but there are other benefits to the Reference one that I listed above. edit: to be clear, mea culpa on the 100db+. If that spec is accurate thats really impressive.

Even more important for the Reference speaker than bass extension is the elimination of that big, nasty rise in the 15kHz area on-axis. You will hear that in every kind of program and it will propagate into any well-designed space. What an amazing speaker the R1 is.

Interesting 🤔

I have the opportunity to get a pair of Reference 1 Meta at about half price and this video has made it *really* tempting. Regardless, your videos have been incredibly useful and informative. I would have never been able to understand the difference between these two beyond "hey that one sounds better" Which barely means anything when I'm not able to directly compare them in the same room.

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

Thank you for not just the donation but the kind words. I appreciate it.

@Nick_2i

11 ай бұрын

@@ErinsAudioCorner You deserve plenty more of both.

Even the Reference 1 needs subwoofers. You need to step up to the Reference 3 to have a speaker that doesn't _for music_.

6dB means a difference from 1 to 10 watts……..

The dispersion looks wider on the Kef 1 because you’re looking at the color scales, but the data isn’t normalized. You can see the darker color in the middle of the Kef 1 diagram that isn’t present in the Kef 3-they’re just louder, not wider.

Erin, polar responses, 19:30 and on: R1M is not wider... the are exactly the same. You correctly wrote that it is not normalised. SPL colors are 6 db lower on that graph. There is 3db difference in sensitivity between speakers, and colors on polar look 3db "wider". Thus, the difference is that exact 6db, so the polars are exactly the same. The KEF guy is right. Your ears have deceived you, because it looks wider in polar graph, so you expected it. And we know how subjectivity in audio listening works...

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

I was with you until you assumed I expected it because I saw the graph. I always listen first. Measure second.

@Nick_2i

11 ай бұрын

​​@@ErinsAudioCornerIs there a compelling reason to normalize or not normalize the polar plots? Intuitively, it seems much more useful for comparative purposes to normalize them.

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

@@Nick_2i I provide both on my website. I use both depending on what it is I’m looking for.

Great Speakers but the all new MACO Acoustic GRANITE Open Baffle Speakers takes Speakers to a whole new level !😇😍🤩LIVE IN CONCERT.... They will be at Axpona Show 2024 Room 686 !

Hey Erin, I’m a subscriber, do you still have those Elac speakers to give away? I’ll pay shipping 🍻 Sorry you couldn’t make it to Audio Advice, hope your back gets better! Really looking forward to your Arendal shootout.

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

I'm going to set up a giveaway for my Patrons with them.

Reference 1 is quite audibly a superb speaker. Up there with Dynaudio Contours or ATC SCM. R3 Meta is an upgrade to those fell for the LS50 hype.

Not a fair fight I would expect the Reference One Meta to wipe the floor with the R3 Meta! Too bad the Reference One Meta does not have blue finish! I own the R3 Meta and I love it!

@iikatinggangsengii2471

6 ай бұрын

always been that way friend, had to preorder mdr1a back then, vsonic kind of lucky timing

Anyone who pays for the Meta over the original of the respective models is getting ripped off. For the Meta on the R line, they just added some goofy maze thing behind the tweeter that no doubt makes no audible difference, but hey, marketing. Also the port is off-center in the back, which is really annoying.

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

The crossover and response profile on the R3 is quite different with the Meta being more neutral. I discussed this in the video.

@mikelanier5617

11 ай бұрын

So you derived the "goofy maze thing..makes no audible difference " by using what type of testing equipment other than your ears? Neither did you read Kef's white papers regarding their findings did you? 🤔 I'm not a Kef fan boy but the Meta design is quite remarkable and respected by many engineers for it's function and overall simplicity. Certainly not "ripping off" anyone by constantly evolving their designs with new technologies and materials.

@ec6843

11 ай бұрын

@@mikelanier5617 I think you fell for the marketing, but by all means, go off.

@mikelanier5617

11 ай бұрын

Guess again. I'm building my own as these don't use the class of drivers or crossover components I prefer and for the price I will DIY. Great design as I mentioned before and the marketing wasn't ever in the equation. Retired from the audio industry so I have had and still own multiple systems made up of stuff from around the globe that I enjoy 😉 Rock on 👍

@user-xg6zz8qs3q

11 ай бұрын

1. The Meta material doesn’t seem to do much more than a round piece of cork. But the cabinets and crossover components are most likely improved. 2. Older models shall always be cheaper than newer models. So if you buy a newer model you’re inherently ripped off. 3. The entire KEF range is competitive with other major brands like Focal or Sonus Faber. Hi-Fi is just more expensive since the last 2 years. 4. Hi-Fi is like furniture. If you buy new you overpay.

9000 $ speaker to start with and then you need another 4000 $ amp to pair with it. Sorry I am not thaaaat Audiophile. Instead of wasting you hard earned money, just treat your room my friend the way it should be. Your current 1000 $ gear will sound like a million dollar setup. I am happy with my Elac unifi also a reference, paired with leema elements Amp.

@RennieAsh

11 ай бұрын

You don't need a $4000 amp with that

@64493552

11 ай бұрын

Misinformation. 2/3 Hypex NCx500 amplifers cost less than $1700 put together by some manufacturers. One of the best measured amplifier in the world. No matter how you treat your room, you cant turn your Elac intos something they are not and they are certainly not on the level of the reference ones.

@Jamy4ya

11 ай бұрын

@@RennieAsh I was a bit sarcastic there for sure 😉

@Jamy4ya

11 ай бұрын

@@64493552 Misinformation here too.. 1st of all, have you done an A/B comparison of both Elac and Kef reference in your listening space to claim one is better than the other ? Secondly, I am in not in to measurements much, when buying an audio gear because perfect measuring gear doesn't mean its the perfect sounding or at least for my taste. When I was talking about the AMP, I was actually referring to an Class AB AMP and the current capability of the AMP rather than watts in numbers as those KEF references will cry for it as those are very hard to driver speakers/Not very efficient/ Ohms dipping to ~2. KEF speakers usually are reported bright and I wouldn't pair it with an Class D amp for its Sharp edges signature to begin with(This only my guess)

Lincoln Hawk thinks the R3 is over the top

@ErinsAudioCorner

11 ай бұрын

Turns his hat around.

Not worth the extra $7000 over R3s

@Richiv77

24 күн бұрын

But what if you can get the Ref 1 Meta for 5.5 K?