In the story the magic is a genetic gift and doesn’t reside in demonic powers or anything of the sort. It is pure fantasy. The only problem is overindulgence in fantasy, which is more of a general issue that includes other things like Star Wars, Marvel, and even Tolkien. There are some people who have become invested in Wicca or whatever through overindulgence in Harry Potter fantasy but that is more so on those individuals and their problems, and is such a tiny fringe issue. It is absolutely silly to consider Harry Potter dangerous. Might as well condemn Halloween along with it. Liberal obsession with it is also annoying but reading into it too much is deranged. Demons can and will use anything to lead people to sin and self-destruction.

@jmclaughlin2009

Жыл бұрын

I read Harry Potter as a child, and I never attempted performing any magic because I never got my letter from Hogwarts, so I knew I was a Muggle. Plus, underage magic is illegal.

@Cwik878

Жыл бұрын

"Overindulgence in fantasy" is a perfect description and the key here!! I'm sure there are people who grow up outside of a Christian faith and become overindulged in Lord of the Rings, get involved in LARPing, and the like, and then fall into some serious sins after overindulging in that. It seems that there are degrees of indulging in fantasy... Just because some people overindulge, it doesn't then follow that Lord of the Rings (or other fantasy works) is evil!

@christianhiggins2342

Жыл бұрын

If I’m not wrong some of the spells in Harry Potter are actual spells and that’s the harm, that the fantasy takes place in the real world with some elements of real witchcraft

@Tvoj_Prijatelj_Vili

Жыл бұрын

Halloween with pumpking carvings and dressing as witches and going out to celebrate what? Halloween should only be to celebrate all hallows eve - all saints day. Not dressing up as some madeup (often demonic) characters

@maurac44

Жыл бұрын

@@christianhiggins2342 you are wrong, sir. Most of the spells are silly pseudo Latin derivatives obviously not meant to be taken seriously.

I first started reading the Harry Potter books when my children were in Catholic elementary school. The BEST English teacher I have ever seen was reading it with her 5th graders. My next door neighbor pulled her kids out of school and began to home-school them because she didn’t want them learning about witchcraft. It seemed ridiculous to me, but I began to read the books. They were so well-written and the stories were so engaging that I understood why this amazing teacher would want to introduce them to her students! My children and I have read all the books and seen all the movies. I think the message of good conquering evil is incredibly important in this day and age. The Weasley family is the kind of family that any Catholic family should be. We need to stop looking for problems where they don’t exist and focus on addressing the real problems in our world.

@mbld33

Жыл бұрын

Cardinal Ratzinger described Harry Potter as “subtle seductions which act unnoticed and by this deeply distort Christianity in the soul, before it can grow properly”.

@melissabowers578

Жыл бұрын

@@mbld33 Cardinal Ratzinger chose to step aside for Frank. He’s comprised.

@mbld33

Жыл бұрын

@@melissabowers578 So whatever Ratzinger said isn’t valid anymore because he stepped aside? He was prefect of doctrine when he said that. And is still the best theologian of our age. You keep listening to non-discriminating Bergoglio who’ll accept anyone or anything but actual Catholics.

@number5mom

Жыл бұрын

Fr. Gabriele Amorth, Vatican Exorcist was anti-Harry Potter, so is Fr. Chad Ripperger, exorcist. And former satanic high priest turned Catholic (Zachary King) also spoke out against Harry Potter.

@Cwik878

Жыл бұрын

​@@mbld33 When he said that, he was responding to an author who wrote a book saying Harry Potter is bad. Instead of investigating her case, he just said, “Thank you for the good work that you’re doing. Make sure to protect the young,” which is just a polite thing for a churchman to do who doesn’t have time to do a whole investigation of Harry Potter in this way. Can't any overindulgence in fantasy deeply distort Christianity in the soul, before it can grow properly? Even objectively good books like Lord of the Rings encourage people to go LARPing and I've seen things like that get overindulged.

I know if someone who got into witchcraft after reading Tolkien. Literally anything can be a door. I read the Harry Potter books as an adult and was puzzled why they were so feared. I was forbidden from reading them as a kid, but I ended up reading other stuff that was way, WAY more problematic. I think I'd be ok with my kids reading them.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

Catholics who want to stay on brand and repeat "Harry Potter is NOTHING compared to the richness of Tolkien!" (a line they parrot from Peter Kreeft) don't think for themselves. Tolkien (and Lewis) had a LOVE and PASSION for mythology, the same mythology JK Rowling uses throughout her books, and they would have loved Harry Potter I can tell you. (Her story even ends with Tolkien's archetypal Eucatastrophe--). The Lord of the Rings and Narnia could never have been written if Tolkien or Lewis had always turned up their noses and said, "Well, the only thing I'M reading is Lord of the Rings and Narnia, because they are Catholic Brand approved!" They read old myths and The Worm Ouroboros and the Völsunga Saga and The Faerie Queen and George MacDonald and many other old fantasy books besides that would give modern Catholics a heart attack, because they had a passion for literature, particularly fantasy and myths. They would have loved a fantasy series as long and complex and archetypal and fully fleshed out with an overarching MYSTERY, which did not exist at the time! Lord of the Rings and Narnia are linear quests. They would give credit where it's due. JK Rowling is better at writing mystery than either Tolkien or Lewis. She is also better at writing characters. Lucy from Narnia or the dwarves from the Hobbit don't inspire the same interest as, for example, Professor Snape, since they have little to no fleshed out dynamics with other characters. JK Rowling is not good at poetic language, but language is only the tool we look past to see the story conveyed. Making writing as clear as possible is a whole separate art, and JK Rowling mastered showing instead of telling that puts other lazily written children's series to shame. There is a reason we become so immersed when we read a single page of Harry Potter. Try writing so clearly yourself before you talk about trying to be poetic and pretty like Tolkien! (Kids were starved for this). As Cs Lewis said, "When we make art, we should not try to bring in specifically the Christian bits. When Our Lord made a wheel, He made sure first and foremost that it was a good wheel. We are not all called to serve Him in that way." Harry Potter speaks to more people than Lord of the Rings does on a daily basis (yes it outsold it by a landslide). Ask yourselves why instead of being so stuck up and missing something good right under your noses.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

(I rolled my eyes so hard when he said his wife was literate because she read Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky just because Jordan Peterson said the Russian classic books are Catholic approved. Do you ever read things just because you have a love of literature??? And understand them enough to see how other books can have Catholic themes as well??)

@KnightGeneral

Жыл бұрын

Please don’t. Let them read children’s version of Saint Stories instead. That way they can learn more heroic Catholic lives. Better than learning Witchcraft. Trust me I grew up a HP fan. Even with good intentions and just a normal fan, I still experienced demonic attacks because I read HP.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

@@KnightGeneral Oh brother! Sounds like you're paranoid.

@lunalee3021

Жыл бұрын

​@@KnightGeneral Do Catholics ever actually write enjoyable versions of the saint stories that compare to J. K. Rowling's quality writing for children (especially older kids and teens who are always shoved under the bus)? NO! Like C. S. Lewis said: write stories well and worry about bringing in the christian bits later. Just because something is superficially catholic (or catholic brand) doesn't mean it's well done or that kids are going to get a meaningful experience from it, despite the lame quality in comparison to a series that someone put decades of work into. Sick to death of people saying "just read about saints" while dismissing a whole genre with its own unique strengths and goodness because of FALSE WITNESS about "demonic attacks." Lying is a sin and so is slander. Harry Potter is objectively good. Please be more literate about what children and teens are seeking when they want to read a modern fantasy/mystery story with plot twists and character development and creative escapist world-building. No, a saint story is NOT automatically a substitute just because it's about a saint, without any care put into the writing (which catholics never do and certainly never fund either) although they like to tell people what they "can't" read.

I find that most people just don’t like HP. They don’t have any arguments against it that can’t also apply to lotr or Narnia.

The irony with the Christian opposition to the Potter books is that Rowling wrote the story as a clever Christian allegory. In fact, she went to great lengths to downplay her own Christian faith because she felt that reading her Potter narrative as a Christian allegory would spoil the storyline. The bitter irony is that dense Christians who have missed the obvious imagery and play on words have been some of her most fierce opponents.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

I've been rolling my eyes over the irony for years.

Thanks for this! I didn’t grow up in a Catholic home, although I was being sent to a Catholic school when it was popular. I was pretty lost and didn’t know what to believe… Harry Potter was like a whole new world to escape into when I was confused and, honestly, hurting for a lack of answers. I eventually delved into witchcraft, but to me there was absolutely no connection to Harry Potter. My interest was piqued about it when I first read about it in a Teen Vogue magazine - a little interview with a young woman who practiced Wicca. Anyway praise God I eventually logic-ed my way out of that with the help of my now-husband 🥰but even to this day, I love Harry Potter. We just finished binge watching the movies again after not having read or watched for years. Having said all that… I will not let my children read or watch HP until they are much older. I want their Catholic worldview solidified before they delve into that world ☺️

I grew up with Harry Potter, I watched all the movies and read all the books, played the games on PS. It's just fiction like Star Wars, Lord of the Rings, and Narnia. Some Catholics are not okay with Harry Potter but they love Lord of the Rings and Narnia which also have fantasy characters who are witches and wizards. Wizardry is a very British thing, it's part of its culture, and of course almost everybody knows Merlin and King Arthur.

@JeansiByxan

Жыл бұрын

Sorry, but who's a good wizard or witch in Narnia? Source? I just remember the uncle being a douche, and he wasn't even a wizard.

@Jerds

Жыл бұрын

The magic in LOTR is a very very different type of magic than in Harry Potter. I’m LOTR, the “wizard” (Gandalf) is literally an angelic being who has been made manifest as an ordinary human (Maiar) . He never conjures spells or uses magic to manipulate the physical world to pursue his goals. He never manifests items and spells in order to create or destroy anything. Harry Potter on the other hand, are people who are occultists who have generational abilities to conjure up preternatural powers in order for them to accomplish their goals (whether good or bad). They learn to cultivate these supernatural abilities by doing spells and reading grimoires and engaging in alchemy. Every single thing relating to “magic” in the books has been condemned by the church at some point or another. JK Rowling literally has a satanic alchemy tattoo. These books are not innocent. Ideas of self sacrifice and good vs evil are not inherently Christian ideas. Plenty of cultures have stories about these ideas, but that doesn’t make them Christian. In the same way these books can contain themes that may align with Christianity on some points. However the overall connecting aspects of occultism and alchemy are NOT Christian. JK Rowling allegedly consulted real grimoires when writing her stories. It’s not an innocent child’s story. Any seeming similarities between Tolkien and Rowling are surface level similarities concerning the accidentals of the story rather than the ultimate substance of it. Yes, Tolkien speaks of magic, but it is not a occult idea of magic, but to describe the supernatural world and things out of our realm of senses. The most magic he uses is the ring he wears which gives people hope. That’s not exactly the same as mixing a potion to manipulate people. Or casting a spell that kills someone. Or making enchanted objects. Lord of the Rings and Harry Potter are as different as the Church is from satanic occultism. While Rowling consulted Grimoires, Tolkein was a devout Catholic who would have never included anything in his writings that would have contradicted the church, which is why nearly everything has a seeming connection to the Church and Catholicism (even tho Tolkien stated he disliked allegory).

@pbg7225

Жыл бұрын

Lord of the rings are from devote Catholic man he writes about the battle of good vs evil ,things that are genuine things that are a part of reality the battle between good and evil and Narnia is devoted Christian and it tells about faith based stories harry potters has not much to do with faith no one can compare them to Lewis, Tolkien they have everything to do with faith this is why they been around for years and they will continue to be around for many years harry Potter pretends to be something good but it is not no Jk is not devote anything just in for the money a devote Catholic doesn't read these kind of books like harry potter the wants to fool people into assuming they harmless books but are not

@pbg7225

Жыл бұрын

Then are being fooled into assuming that these are harmless when they are not that is a disguise they use for people to believe that they are harmless when they are all fantasy people are not equal there are good books like Tolkien and C.S. Lewis books and horrible evil books harry potter no matter how people say that something when it is not doesn't make it good . In the Bible there is verse about people saying that something is good when it is evil saying something evil when it good people need discernment in things like this it can't be dangerous to your soul these are dangerous things because what you assume is harmless can actually dangerous to people don't endorse anything without knowing the facts do you want to the ask The HOLY SPIRIT to enlighten you to the truth and for extra help pray and fast to get real insight

@lunalee3021

Жыл бұрын

@@pbg7225 Harry Potter is ALL ABOUT good. vs. evil. What an ignorant comment! Slander is a sin too. Why did you just throw in that assumption that Rowling must have obviously "only been in it for the money"? Prejudiced much? You're obviously not basing your opinion on knowledge of the books or author, that's for sure.

I find the obsession with this topic strange because people who read the books as children (like me) didn't lose their faith because of them. We read them because we like stories that involve magic and fantasy, THAT'S IT. That's literally all there was to it. Reading Harry Potter isn't going to destroy a 12-year old's faith, bad role models and a poor environment for learning about the faith WILL. People who obsess over the mythical destructive effect of Harry Potter should be concentrating their efforts on providing good Catholic education for children, either by themselves or by supporting those who do. You could point to literally any novel or novel series ever written and say "this is harmful for a child's development because it distracts them from Christ". You could say it about any and all forms of entertainment. Your issue, in that case, would not be with HP, but with children indulging in far too many forms of distraction, which is a valid issue, but there's no need to single out HP to raise it. It's ridiculous. Utterly ridiculous.

@AudioEpics

Жыл бұрын

Exactly. Meanwhile, there's a very popular book series out there for younger audiences called His Dark Materials, which really DOES advocate some pretty Luciferian stuff - and quite openly - but nobody seems bothered by it.

An ex-Satanist spoke at Ave Maria University some years ago, and said he had interacted with the demon who worked through Rowling to write the books, and that the spells are demonic curses. It seemed (and still does) far fetched, but it was enough to prevent me from ever interacting with the books or movies again. When you add that Rowling made Dumbledore a homosexual to spite the Catholic Church, and that the “magic” has raised so much interest in the occult, it fits that it’s a risk at best and a trap at worst.

@gunsgalore7571

Жыл бұрын

Wait... Dumbledore was a homosexual? I thought that it was just Michael Gambon (the second actor who played him after the first one died) who was gay. It's been a long, long time since I've read the books, but having seen the movies very recently (every year around Halloween), I certainly did not pick up any homosexual messaging...

@SweetenedCondensedMilk

Жыл бұрын

@@gunsgalore7571 in Fantastic Beasts The Secrets of Dumbledore he explicitly has a romantic interest in Grindelwald. I didn’t watch the movie past the intro. It doesn’t really exist in the original series as it was certainly a later decision by Rowling and for that reason it can be disregarded.

@nickcapone

Жыл бұрын

@@OrthoLou Correct me if I’m wrong, but it would appear you’re a fan of the series and as such are hoping to defend it. However, in doing so you’re really reaching in order to justify it. 1. There is clear evidence online search results about spells and magic skyrocketed when the books released. 2. The author of the books is against the Catholic Church and altered her lore accordingly. This is no small thing. 3. Rowling was a leftist before she became rich, that’s documented. 4. The controversy around the book series didn’t originate with the ex-Satanist, he only corroborated the worries of many Christians. The concern is based on real understandings of the Faith. Are you aware many exorcists have witnessed the influence in exorcisms and have suggested strong avoidance of the series? I understand one can have a meaningful relationship with the Harry Potter stories - I myself did. However, let’s strive not to be intellectually dishonest on the matter. Immortal souls are at stake

@corysowers6326

Жыл бұрын

a point to be made is that the 'magic' in harry potter is far different from occultism and wicca etc. because in Harry Potter people are BORN with these powers/abilities, and they are simply learning to control them at Hogwarts. It'd be completely different if they were regular humans who were choosing to pursue these things for the sake of power, excitement etc. As it is, they are BORN WITH abilities, which, sets them apart from being regular humans (muggles if you like), which draws the line pretty darn clearly between Harry Potter being fantasy (which it is) rather than teaching actual real life witchcraft. Put it this way, no real life human child is going to be able to cause glass barriers to disappear in a zoo just by wanting them to. If it's not possible in real life, it's fantasy. Fantasy, while not necessarily useful in terms of strengthening one's relationship with the Lord, it's also not damaging unless one makes it (ie by devoting their life to some movie or something... which some people do, tbf, which is kinda weird). By the way, there are christians who talk about Harry Potter encouraging divination. As for divination, the main protagonists of the book clearly hate that subject. In fact the headmaster of hogwarts actually wants to discontinue the subject. Also there is a book called a parents guide to harry potter by Gina Burkart. It talks about how to use harry potter in the christian class room. “Since it is likely that children will encounter cruel enemies, let them at-least have heard of brave knights and HEROIC COURAGE. Other wise you are making their destiny not brighter, but darker. -Cs Lewis. Ps. A true christian would not be quick to judge a book series as demonic. This is only my take on it. Harry potter: the boy who lived, the chosen one and litterally comes back to life to defeat the self proclaimed dark lord. The books: the whole message and moral of the story is that love conquers all. That's the message. Love. Love for your family, friends, close ones and people around you. Harrys power and being special doesn't come from his power in witchcraft, he's above average, or his mind, average. It comes from his great capacity to love and those around him. The evil ones/bad guys in this story are ones without the capacity to love. The magic, you'd know all this if you had read the book, in reality is just a back drop for interesting stories and an interesting world where cool stuff happens. It's meant to hook you in with the escapist fantasy of leaving your boring life and be taken to a place where you can learn to make pots and pans move with a stick. And on top of that, it's just very well written. My thoughts on christians against Harry Potter: I get it. A fictional character is doing what the Bible says is wrong, therefore the books are bad. Knowledge, science and technology were treated the same way. Since so many Christians enjoy these advancements, how would their ancestors see them? Scientific theories and hypotheses are allowed to evolve, biblical thought is not. I don't have the answers but I do enjoy the questions. The Bible has a plethora of horror in it and we Christians believe every word of it. There's a difference in examining critically with our minds and condoning something that is wrong. Besides the magic spoken of in Harry Potter is NOTHING like the magic that is real and is condemned in Scripture. What about Wizard of Oz? One of the good main characters is Glinda the Good Witch of the North. A good witch, how dare they. All witches are suppose to be evil. Next we have a magical animated Scarecrow and Tin Man. Flying Monkeys with hats! Man this is terrible. On the topic of a story teaching and having a message. In the Wizard of Oz Dorothy runs away from home. According to the logic of christians against Harry Potter , it will make kids want to run away from home. Dorothy befriends a lion. What! That will make kids go up to lions without fear and want to be their friends. That is dangerous. Lastly what about the Wizard of Oz, the guy who the whole story is named from. He is a fraud and lies about his identity. This will teach kids that committing fraud and lying is ok. We know these things are evil, yet children know that these are wrong when a parent does their job and educates them. To quote my Favorite Character in Harry Potter: “The world isn't split into good people and Death Eaters. We've all got both light and dark inside us. What matters is the part we choose to act on. That's who we really are.” -Sirius Black I've recently become a Harry Potter fan, The reason behind that is that, unlike the people against it, I know how to differentiate between fiction and real life, and between a fairy tale and my religious beliefs and practices. Also if you are so Anti-Harry Potter, you should be anti Lord Of The Rings and Chronicles Of Narnia. Narnia has magical wardrobes and NECROMANCY and Lord of the Rings has magic rings, but their okay to read and watch. But a teenager with glasses who defeats evil and a book series with BIBLE VERSES is bad? Harry Potter is a Christ figure, J.K Rowling is a devout anglican. Not once did she ever practice witchcraft whoever told you that is a liar. A great example is the humanity of the character of Harry Potter. In the 5th movie we get possibly one of the best depictions of humanity in cinema that I think we’ve seen. Voldemort, responsible for mass murder, attempted genocide, and almost every single personal tragedy in Harry’s life if not all, is literally attacking him from the inside out. But Harry doesn’t curse him, or use his hate to overpower him. He shows pity. If you’ve read the books you know Voldemort literally cannot feel love and never could. People like this are labeled evil, but “inherently evil” people are just broken, mentally and or emotionally ill, and Harry recognizes how sad this is. Love was always Harry’s strength, and I think that’s what Rowling wanted to show u Here are a few of my fav Harry Potter quotes that prove that they're indeed books with a great message. "We must all face the choice between what is right and what is easy" Albus Dumbledore "Happiness can be found even in the darkest of times if one only remembers to turn on the light." Albus Dumbledore "If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look how he trets his inferiors, not his equals." Sirius Black "It takes a great deal of bravery to stand up to your enemies, but a great deal more to stand up to your friends." Albus Dumbledore

@lonewolfatari475

3 ай бұрын

Most of those ex-satanists are complete frauds looking for attention.

I’ve been a potter fan for ages. Glad to see other Catholics speak of it as what it is: a fun series with a depth that goes beyond the magical and fantastical surface.

a point to be made is that the 'magic' in harry potter is far different from occultism and wicca etc. because in Harry Potter people are BORN with these powers/abilities, and they are simply learning to control them at Hogwarts. It'd be completely different if they were regular humans who were choosing to pursue these things for the sake of power, excitement etc. As it is, they are BORN WITH abilities, which, sets them apart from being regular humans (muggles if you like), which draws the line pretty darn clearly between Harry Potter being fantasy (which it is) rather than teaching actual real life witchcraft. Put it this way, no real life human child is going to be able to cause glass barriers to disappear in a zoo just by wanting them to. If it's not possible in real life, it's fantasy. Fantasy, while not necessarily useful in terms of strengthening one's relationship with the Lord, it's also not damaging unless one makes it (ie by devoting their life to some movie or something... which some people do, tbf, which is kinda weird). By the way, there are christians who talk about Harry Potter encouraging divination. As for divination, the main protagonists of the book clearly hate that subject. In fact the headmaster of hogwarts actually wants to discontinue the subject. Also there is a book called a parents guide to harry potter by Gina Burkart. It talks about how to use harry potter in the christian class room. “Since it is likely that children will encounter cruel enemies, let them at-least have heard of brave knights and HEROIC COURAGE. Other wise you are making their destiny not brighter, but darker. -Cs Lewis. Ps. A true christian would not be quick to judge a book series as demonic. This is only my take on it. Harry potter: the boy who lived, the chosen one and litterally comes back to life to defeat the self proclaimed dark lord. The books: the whole message and moral of the story is that love conquers all. That's the message. Love. Love for your family, friends, close ones and people around you. Harrys power and being special doesn't come from his power in witchcraft, he's above average, or his mind, average. It comes from his great capacity to love and those around him. The evil ones/bad guys in this story are ones without the capacity to love. The magic, you'd know all this if you had read the book, in reality is just a back drop for interesting stories and an interesting world where cool stuff happens. It's meant to hook you in with the escapist fantasy of leaving your boring life and be taken to a place where you can learn to make pots and pans move with a stick. And on top of that, it's just very well written. My thoughts on christians against Harry Potter: I get it. A fictional character is doing what the Bible says is wrong, therefore the books are bad. Knowledge, science and technology were treated the same way. Since so many Christians enjoy these advancements, how would their ancestors see them? Scientific theories and hypotheses are allowed to evolve, biblical thought is not. I don't have the answers but I do enjoy the questions. The Bible has a plethora of horror in it and we Christians believe every word of it. There's a difference in examining critically with our minds and condoning something that is wrong. Besides the magic spoken of in Harry Potter is NOTHING like the magic that is real and is condemned in Scripture. What about Wizard of Oz? One of the good main characters is Glinda the Good Witch of the North. A good witch, how dare they. All witches are suppose to be evil. Next we have a magical animated Scarecrow and Tin Man. Flying Monkeys with hats! Man this is terrible. On the topic of a story teaching and having a message. In the Wizard of Oz Dorothy runs away from home. According to the logic of christians against Harry Potter , it will make kids want to run away from home. Dorothy befriends a lion. What! That will make kids go up to lions without fear and want to be their friends. That is dangerous. Lastly what about the Wizard of Oz, the guy who the whole story is named from. He is a fraud and lies about his identity. This will teach kids that committing fraud and lying is ok. We know these things are evil, yet children know that these are wrong when a parent does their job and educates them. To quote my Favorite Character in Harry Potter: “The world isn't split into good people and Death Eaters. We've all got both light and dark inside us. What matters is the part we choose to act on. That's who we really are.” -Sirius Black I've recently become a Harry Potter fan, The reason behind that is that, unlike the people against it, I know how to differentiate between fiction and real life, and between a fairy tale and my religious beliefs and practices. Also if you are so Anti-Harry Potter, you should be anti Lord Of The Rings and Chronicles Of Narnia. Narnia has magical wardrobes and NECROMANCY and Lord of the Rings has magic rings, but their okay to read and watch. But a teenager with glasses who defeats evil and a book series with BIBLE VERSES is bad? Harry Potter is a Christ figure, J.K Rowling is a devout anglican. Not once did she ever practice witchcraft whoever told you that is a liar. A great example is the humanity of the character of Harry Potter. In the 5th movie we get possibly one of the best depictions of humanity in cinema that I think we’ve seen. Voldemort, responsible for mass murder, attempted genocide, and almost every single personal tragedy in Harry’s life if not all, is literally attacking him from the inside out. But Harry doesn’t curse him, or use his hate to overpower him. He shows pity. If you’ve read the books you know Voldemort literally cannot feel love and never could. People like this are labeled evil, but “inherently evil” people are just broken, mentally and or emotionally ill, and Harry recognizes how sad this is. Love was always Harry’s strength, and I think that’s what Rowling wanted to show u Here are a few of my fav Harry Potter quotes that prove that they're indeed books with a great message. "We must all face the choice between what is right and what is easy" Albus Dumbledore "Happiness can be found even in the darkest of times if one only remembers to turn on the light." Albus Dumbledore "If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look how he trets his inferiors, not his equals." Sirius Black "It takes a great deal of bravery to stand up to your enemies, but a great deal more to stand up to your friends." Albus Dumbledore

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

"Fantasy, while not necessarily useful in terms of strengthening one's relationship with the Lord, it's also not damaging unless one makes it" WRONG. The purpose of fantasy is far greater than that. It can be a window humans have into things that are greater than themselves and the transcendent. It is "holding up a mirror of scorn and pity towards Man" (Tolkien in 'On Fairy Stories') in a similar way that poetry or any art is an exploration of that which is greater than ourselves. It has led people to Christ. Please never belittle fantasy like that again! I agree with the rest of what you've said.

WELL, THIS CAME 20 YEARS TOO LATE! Makes me furious that I was saying this for over ten years only to be mocked by the catholics with the loudest voices. (And now people listen because someone who drinks and smokes a pipe and acts stereotypically scholarly says it). I literally went through the whole etymology of each spell and name to prove it was fine and catholics would only say "you must be possessed." "you will die in your witch's cape" and "you must never read any other books." Yes, Harry Potter has value, and yes, women who read it can be "LITERATE." (Although I don't think reading Tolstoy and Dostoevsky is a requirement to recognizing this just because Jordan Peterson finally popularized them in the right wing sphere). Get back to me when another children's author makes a quintuple plot twist (Prisoner of Azkaban) and does 14 drafts of single chapters. The arrogance of comparing it to Tolkien, as if language is the only measure of quality. (It surpasses Tolkien in some areas like sympathetic character development). You are just learning about John Granger's analysis of literary alchemy, which you think is impressive because it sounds scholarly. Well, it was actually kind of superstitious. Actually J. K. Rowling's work is good because it's dynamic (due to use of mystery plot and not linear journey) and it's actually sympathetic (which engages children more than the archetypal Hobbit). J. K. Rowling's integrity always showed in her books; even before she proved that she lived them out herself, they had sincere themes. I have never seen a series so beloved and yet treated with so much prideful and unethical snobbery. God gave kids a book series that it actually good, and our society is so relativistic and stuck up that we can't admit when somebody made something really great for once?

@lunalee3021

Жыл бұрын

Oh, and don't get me started on how she actually made girl characters with a variety of unique personalities. Nobody else EVER CARES ABOUT GIRLS!

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

Catholics who want to stay on brand and repeat "Harry Potter is NOTHING compared to the richness of Tolkien!" (a line they parrot from Peter Kreeft) don't think for themselves. (If you haven't even finished Lord of the Rings and are saying this, stop talking now.) Tolkien (and Lewis) had a LOVE and PASSION for mythology, the same mythology JK Rowling uses throughout her books, and they would have loved Harry Potter I can tell you. (Her story even ends with Tolkien's archetypal Eucatastrophe--). The Lord of the Rings and Narnia could never have been written if Tolkien or Lewis had always turned up their noses and said, "Well, the only thing I'M reading is Lord of the Rings and Narnia, because they are Catholic Brand approved!" They read old myths and The Worm Ouroboros and the Völsunga Saga and The Faerie Queen and George MacDonald and many other old fantasy books besides that would give modern Catholics a heart attack, because they had a passion for literature, particularly fantasy and myths. They would have loved a fantasy series as long and complex and archetypal and fully fleshed out with an overarching MYSTERY, which did not exist at the time! Lord of the Rings and Narnia are linear quests. They would give credit where it's due. JK Rowling is better at writing mystery than either Tolkien or Lewis. She is also better at writing characters. Lucy from Narnia or the dwarves from the Hobbit don't inspire the same interest as, for example, Professor Snape, since they have little to no fleshed out dynamics with other characters. JK Rowling is not good at poetic language, but language is only the tool we look past to see the story conveyed. Making writing as clear as possible is a whole separate art, and JK Rowling mastered showing instead of telling that puts other lazily written children's series to shame. There is a reason we become so immersed when we read a single page of Harry Potter. Try writing so clearly yourself before you talk about trying to be poetic and pretty like Tolkien! (Kids were starved for this). As Cs Lewis said, "When we make art, we should not try to bring in specifically the Christian bits. When Our Lord made a wheel, He made sure first and foremost that it was a good wheel. We are not all called to serve Him in that way." Harry Potter speaks to more people than Lord of the Rings does on a daily basis (yes it outsold it by a landslide). Ask yourselves why instead of being so stuck up and missing something good right under your noses.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

(I rolled my eyes so hard when he said his wife was literate because she read Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky just because Jordan Peterson said the Russian classic books are Catholic approved. Do you ever read things just because you have a love of literature??? And understand them enough to see how other books can have Catholic themes as well??) Reading Harry Potter doesn't make you literate. But if you did not EVEN read Harry Potter, you are not literate. (Yes, all seven, if you want to open your mouth and have a scholarly opinion on the subject. That shouldn't be hard for someone the likes of whom has read Dostoyevsky! The kids who read it only finished them 10 times over).

@lunalee3021

Жыл бұрын

@@monkey6207 Interesting you mention the Faerie Queene, which was a literary attack against the Catholic Church, yet Lewis saw the good there. You're right; what bothers me about this sphere is that there's a tangible lack of love for fiction and literature; it's more about the appearance of being literate and reading what is "approved" or "recommended" by the in crowd (such as Peter Kreeft, Jordan Peterson, etc). Why are these kinds of Catholics always the ones speaking on the subject of Harry Potter? (A contemporary children's fantasy) when it's obvious this isn't a genre they'd ever be interested in studying fairly if reading at all. (Yes, I mean WAAAAY more than Hobbit and Narnia). As someone who's read over 1000 contemporary children's fantasy books, and analyzed, and compared many of them beat by beat (if not word for word) to Harry Potter... I am always distressed at how taken for granted they are. They accomplish many unique things Tolkien and Lewis did not. Conversations like this just sadden me that they took this long to even read John Granger's book on literary alchemy because they finally married one of the girls who grew up with HP and realized (shocker) that they are actually literate normal people who they don't have to constantly mock. It has taken catholics so long to admit Harry Potter is "okay enough to read." I think some HUGE apologies are in order for how much they slandered J. K. Rowling and her readers. Also pride needs to be swallowed; it has to be admitted Harry Potter is actually not just a good book series, but a great book series.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

@@lunalee3021 I too feel despair when someone with a microphone (usually a pompous Sesquipedalian smoking a cigar) blabs about this subject. Especially when they throw in "Now, I'm a little behind on this. . ." Do you think??? Well, why didn't you listen in the first place, may I ask? Were you imagining we were all reading Twilight the second? Yes, I just feel despair about this subject and how far in the sand some people's heads have been. . . Pride is a sin. I also want to add that some of the older people (and even priests) who have been very blasphemes and slanderous of JK Rowling have a lot to answer for. They desperately need to apologize where it's due. Saying things like 'she used to be a witch' (false) and calling her satanic??? These lies are very alienating and make me question the integrity and honesty of some Catholics. If I was not strong in my faith I would seriously question just how much integrity Catholics have at all if they always persist with lies like this.

And then there’s the fact that “fantasy” is a is a subset of literature. Would those who denigrate Harry Potter treat Beowulf the same? Chaucer’s The Canterbury Tales the same?

@lucascesar029

Жыл бұрын

​@@OrthoLou It's almost like if Homer's work was written in a time Christianity didn't even existed and that's why we're fine with it huh.

Why are we still talking about a series that is like fifteen years old? There are far more pernicious fantasy novels written today than ever before.

@danielhager8399

Жыл бұрын

...But none so popular and deceiving. As you can see in the comments, many have been fooled into believing a series influenced by demonic spirits is harmless!

@JeansiByxan

Жыл бұрын

@@danielhager8399 Whether or not Rowling was influenced is fairly irrelevant if she didn't include actual spells. On the other hand I can't stand this all-or-nothing approach which people have about these fictional books. Would I want my child to be rooting for witches, in spite of how the Bible says that all witches should be put to death? Probably not. But at the same time I have to respect that not everyone raises their kids to be critical readers.

@danielhager8399

Жыл бұрын

@@JeansiByxan You answered your own comment. There are negative influences in whatever Satan touches,especially on the impressionable, like our children, so we must protect them and inform others of evil influences and teach them to be more aware of the effects evil can have on them , whether you believe they are real spells or not . Fire still burns whether you think it is true or not .

@sienkiewiczmonika1161

Жыл бұрын

@@danielhager8399 In Harry Potter wizardry is genetic. Characters didn't have to ask any shady demonic entity for power.

One of the Saddest interpretations that I've heard of Harry Potter was the postulated idea that the whole story was the fantasy escape of an abused orphan child, the fantastical, heroic stories existing only in a boy's own tortured, fractured psychology. In that case, I understand why so many children with unmet spiritual emotional & psychological needs would strongly receive it.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

Simplistic youtube conspiracy, failing to acknowledge the art in execution (that other fantasy books never take pride in). Such as, crafting an immersive setting, crafting MYSTERIES (rather than just a linear quest), crafting developed characters (all with nuanced, larger than life personalities), use of clues and red herrings to add interest, excellent dialogue and dynamics, world building (lots of creatures/devices made up from imagination). Geee, maybe that is why kids don't like reading all those other cliche orphan series at the library, and only HP outsold everything else.

@joewat3982

Жыл бұрын

@@monkey6207 Nothing in my comment detracts from the complexity of Rowling's story telling. In the story, Potter is an orphan, under the control of neglectful, abusive people; Potter wants to escape & Hogwarts is his only path. Many many children have found escape, adventure, excitement, education & even peace within stories.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

@@joewat3982 When I read it as a kid that's not what I cared about at all. (Every fantasy book in the world is about an orphan, and I didn't like those)

@joewat3982

Жыл бұрын

@@monkey6207 I think the -caregivers- were a complex & fascinating part of Harry's background. They were the first _Muggles_ he was exposed to, and they had terrible disdain for him & his parents. I was surprised that they, and their abusive animosity, were not brought up more in the story as an *_emotional & psychological pressure-point_* to push Harry to be more *_Anti-Muggle_* and take the other side in the war. Perhaps that was an example of mercy, grace & forgiveness.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

@@joewat3982 If this was the selling point, you must greatly enjoy any fantasy book from the library you pick up. (Although I agree, even this cliche was better executed in Harry Potter).

3:26 The guy I read the warning of considered the spells so much more realistic in HP. What happens in Tolkien as far as Gandalf's "spells" are concerned: * he's an angelic being, like St. Raphael (and the magic world at Hogwarts aren't, they reproduce) * the two spells he uses seem very much within modern technology: a) "mellon" is a word recognition code (when did you last type in a code to enter a house?) b) "naur" is a voice recognition ... except that it's applied to non-technological matter, and in that sense this makes him able to do things because of what creature he is. The things effected by spells in HP look more like impossibles that are total sci fi, and as said, in real life beings that reproduce are not inherently magic, they get any magic abilities from somewhere else. Obviously, a comment Tolkien made himself about Orcs ... in each case, the answer _can_ be made that this is part of the setting and not inherently what the story is ultimately about (unlike Jules Vernes' story set in 2889, which very clearly is about the progress made and in some cases about progress which has since he wrote it not just not been made, but shouldn't be made).

Clearly the deathly hallows is an allegory .... Kings Cross, Harry resurrecting, the master of death, visiting his parents graves at christmas etc etc

I think it’s really important to have these conversations and perspectives. You can be a completely devout Catholic without being fanatical about media and ‘evil’. Some individuals just take it too far and it’s unhealthy. Some common sense needs to prevail. We alienate ourselves soooooooo far from every aspect of our culture at our and our childrens peril. Conversation not censorship is really important. I think the same thing about the yoga or meditation histeria. I haven’t heard a single word promoting other gods in either of those practices they’ve been so fully westernized in most of the us they’re just generic health practices and don’t need to be feared like satan himself will take over.

@meganpata9033

Жыл бұрын

I don’t have a well articulated point of view about Harry Potter, myself, but enough exorcists have warned about it that we don’t allow it in our home. It’s a well written and interesting story, certainly, but I don’t think it’s fanatical to stay away from it to be on the safe side. Same with yoga-except I’ve been warned by former practitioners of yoga that you can’t really separate the religious ritual from the practice itself. You can use stretch in a natural way-yoga does not have some kind of trademark on the poses-but to actually practice it, even without meditating on another religion, is probably not the best. You can be a good Catholic and disagree, but I don’t think it’s good to assume that people who are against these things are just extremely scrupulous. I’ve changed my mind several times on yoga as an adult. Harry Potter not so much. I read it as a kid and it gave me horrible nightmares for weeks so it wasn’t a surprise to me that others have encountered spiritual problems with it.

@lunalee3021

Жыл бұрын

@@meganpata9033 Oh I had the opposite experience of nightmares. It definitely brought my family together and gave us lots of good memories. I hate anecdotal evidence, there's always a bit too much in this debate, I think... 🙄

@meganpata9033

Жыл бұрын

@@lunalee3021 The plural of anecdote is data. I used to think that anecdotal evidence was useless myself, but that’s an easy way of just writing off someone’s experiences. I’m glad you didn’t have my experience. Not everyone is going to have a bad experience when they encounter something that’s spiritually dangerous. My point was that, in addition to the statements from Vatican exorcists saying that Harry Potter is dangerous, I personally had a bad experience after reading it and choose not to have it in my home. If you had a different experience, that’s good for you. I’m glad you didn’t have recurrent nightmares. But because I DID, I don’t think it’s appropriate for young readers. My children won’t miss it. There are plenty of other books for them to read.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

@@meganpata9033 Nightmares =/= demonic. What a slanderous thing to imply.

@meganpata9033

Жыл бұрын

@@monkey6207 I didn’t say that it was demonic because it gave me nightmares. I said that it is questionable because it gave me nightmares. You keep using the word “slanderous” and I don’t think you know what that means. “Slander” is when you purposefully tell untrue things about someone specific. I wrote my opinion about a book, saying nothing about anyone in particular, and not intentionally telling untruths. It’s just a book, not worth replying to every comment on this thread from 7 months ago over. If someone says they dislike a book I like, or even finds it inappropriate, it doesn’t bother me as much as you seem to be bothered by this. I would ask myself why if I were you. In fact, we were cleaning out the school library at my children’s school just a few weeks ago and some books that I personally own were tossed out along with Harry Potter. I didn’t complain. If someone doesn’t want their child to have access to a certain book, that is their right. I’m not going to try to force them to like it or accuse them of slandering the author because they found something problematic with it. And anyway, if it’s not demonic, it’s at least not edifying, and there are plenty of better books to read that will lift the mind and heart to God and truly teach one to love what is beautiful.

I'd highly recommend that you listen to what Fr Ripperger has to say about Harry Potter. As an exorcist he really knows just how dangerous it is. I've read all the books and loved the movies but after hearing what he had to say my eyes were opened. Worth a listen.

@jmclaughlin2009

Жыл бұрын

Has Fr Ripperger read the books at all?

@commonsense5905

Жыл бұрын

Didn’t Trent Horn rebutt him

@laraluna9365

Жыл бұрын

@@jmclaughlin2009 yes he tried reading them but didn’t finish the series bc he thought they were terribly written.

@PalmTreeDayDreams

Жыл бұрын

@@writer_racehochdorf Where can I find this?

@PalmTreeDayDreams

Жыл бұрын

@@writer_racehochdorf That's ok I appreciate you searching! I wasn't sure if I wasn't looking in the right place since I couldn't find it either. Oh well!

For the time will come when people will not tolerate sound doctrine but, following their own desires and insatiable curiosity, will accumulate teachers and will stop listening to the truth and will be diverted to myths. 2Timothy 4:3-4

I read the books a long time ago, but my take on it was the exact opposite: the books are absolutely devoid of compassion. In Rowling's world, characters are born either good or bad, and they pretty much just stay that way forever. There's not really an impulse to try to teach or rehabilitate sinners, sort to speak, but their only strategy to deal with evil is to just kill them all. Even though it's clear that Voldemort and others came to be evil due to the discrimination and cruelty in which they grew up, nobody cares about those issues at all. There's a group of elite people, who aren't good because they learned to be so but because it is in their blood, and they are also talented by nature, and what they do isn't try to make the world a better place, but only stay close to each other to defend their own interests, accumulating secrets and power, while looking with utmost contempt at the rest of the world, slytherin, muggles, elves, etc. And they never look at themselves and think they are actually guilty of anything, but blame it all on those other evil guys. I don't know, I just don't see anything Christian about it.

@SweetenedCondensedMilk

Жыл бұрын

Pretty much everyone comes to evil through evil they experienced. But you can’t always reason with people when they’re so far gone. It is up to them to repent. And a huge part of the story is that the bad wizards look down on muggles and want to reveal themselves to oppress them, but the good wizards understand that it is safer for everyone to keep to themselves.

@libertasinveritas3198

Жыл бұрын

What utter nonsense! The whole book is about Repentance, Change and the Victory of Love. Dumbledore even says "It matters not what we are born, but what we grow to be."

@GalaxiaTokyo

Жыл бұрын

@@libertasinveritas3198 But isn't the context of that quote that Dumbledore is trying to say that although the Malfoys are pureblood they actually grow up to the evil? And if Draco is supposed to be the counterexample to that trend, is a very half-hearted one, because it's clear that Rowling doesn't like him one bit to the very end, and uses his change of heart more as a dramatic device than as a human interest.

@JeansiByxan

Жыл бұрын

All the tropes in other words.

@GalaxiaTokyo

Жыл бұрын

@@OrthoLou There's like a couple or a handful, and all of those very halfheartedly.

I taught my grandson to read by reading them to him at first and, little by little, increasingly teaching him words for him to read. He’s now grown with 3 kids of his own and is a serious Christian. I’m about to start to read Harry Potter to his oldest, soon to be 8, daughter. I always thought the language in the Potter series was quite sophisticated for young readers. We would have to look up some of the more obscure British English expressions.

The depiction of magic is up in the air. On one hand it’s not expressly demonic but on the other, many exorcists have warned against it. My main issue is the moral ambiguity. I read and reread these stories constantly as a kid and I absolutely thought it was ok to lie, cheat, and steal if I had a “good reason” for doing so. Even the biggest sacrifice of the story is an act of assisted suicide. You could even say that Harry Potter WAS my moral worldview before I delved deeper into Tolkien and discovered the Catholic Faith. Do not recommend

@kyguy3242

Жыл бұрын

If you're talking about what I think you're talking about, calling that sacrifice an act of assisted suicide is grossly oversimplifying the situation.

@spencer2978

Жыл бұрын

@@kyguy3242 You’re making a consequentialist argument

@thomasreiter2367

Жыл бұрын

You are right. Amorth warned about it. Let us read Tolkien, CS Lewis, Chesterton etc

@kyguy3242

Жыл бұрын

@@spencer2978 You act as if such arguments aren't present in the Bible. Just look at Joshua with the Canaanites. The Canaanites were idolaters who would've contributed to the destruction of the Israelites, so God justified Joshua in the systematic removal of these people from their lands. Situations absolutely determine the morality of certain actions. Though it appeared Jesus broke the commandments of the Sabbath, he lived by the higher law in these contexts, seeking to heal and do good rather than limit himself within the confines of laws previously given. You can argue that he had a right to do that, because he was the Son of God, but I don't think he would've taught the higher law if he didn't desire us to also live it as he did, and to sometimes make exceptions for the rules when a situation demands it in order to perform objectively good deeds. John 7:17-18, "Even so, every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit." The character in question really didn't have much of a choice if good were to triumph over evil. Therefore, yes, the situation determines the morality in this context. Under ordinary circumstances, perhaps you can call it an assisted suicide, but when the actual fate of the world hangs in the balance, and the action is required to maintain the element of surprise needed for the forces of good to gain the upper hand, I'm fairly certain God would not judge such an act so harshly.

@spencer2978

Жыл бұрын

@@kyguy3242 You cannot do something objectively evil in the hope that good may come of it. This is basic moral theology. God has the right to take the life of any of His creatures and the Israelites were His means of doing that. That is not the same as the Israelites violating the Fifth commandment. Jesus elaborated on the correct understanding of the Sabbath. He did not violate anything. He corrected incorrect and hypocritical misinterpretations of how man ought to sanctify the Lord’s day. In the particular case you are talking about for Harry Potter, the characters always have a choice. The objective reality is that one chooses to murder the other in order to prevent a younger teenager from doing so. That’s assisted suicide and it is evil even if it was done with a good intention.

These are “subtle seductions which act unnoticed and by this deeply distort Christianity in the soul, before it can grow properly”. Cardinal Ratzinger on Harry Potter

@InhabitantOfOddworld

Жыл бұрын

When people say, “Well, Cardinal Ratzinger was opposed to these books,” well, no, he just politely responded to an author who wrote a book saying Harry Potter is bad. Instead of investigating her case, he just said, “Thank you for the good work that you’re doing. Make sure to protect the young,” which is just a polite thing for a churchman to do who doesn’t have time to do a whole investigation of Harry Potter in this way.

There is christmas in the wizarding world witch is weird. Although there are rules of magic in the books that could explain it. Like you cant raise the dead or multiply food. That would explain why wizards would be like "Whatever Christ is doing is much higher than magic".

@jeremysmith7176

Жыл бұрын

Food can be multiplied but inedible cannot be made edible. Magic would provide plausible explanations for other miracles and makes the swoon hypothesis possible for the ressurection. At the very least the wizards observe cultural Christian holidays and practices such as Christmas and Easter. We do know that Harry was baptized as an infant because Sirius is his God Father.

Ask Fr ripperger… he would disagree

@InhabitantOfOddworld

Жыл бұрын

Absolute tosh. Superstitious nonsense. It's not satanic or anything else you might hear as misleading claims people have heard from Fr Ripperger et al. Contrary to popular opinion: - the "spells" are not real. They're just latin playwords. They're no more magic than going to latin mass. - Rowling has no history with witchcraft, wicca, or the like. She took classical studies in university and merely has an academic interest in greek and roman myth. No different to Tolkien in that regard. - the books do not contain the real names of demons. Believe it or not, few demons out there are named Ronald, or James, or Hannah. In fact, the books contain more biblical names than anything resembling the demonic. I can post more examples of what Fr Ripperger has got outrageously wrong

Harry Potter is a book with true black magic and children have been possessed after using those spells... I recomend you the book of Gabrielle Kuby "Harry Potter - Good or Evil". Joseph Ratzinger told in a letter to Kuby: "It is good that you explain the facts of Harry Potter, because this is a subtle seduction, which has deeply unnoticed and direct effects in undermining the soul of Christianity before it can really grow properly." If he doesnt convince you, no one can. Dont go that way Matt...I really like your Channel, Im watching from Poland, but this dissapointed me so much...

@Mish844

Жыл бұрын

it's funny when entertaining work of fiction is a danger to your faith. If you write from Poland I'll just say this - priest Natanek got into you a little too hard.

@corysowers6326

Жыл бұрын

a point to be made is that the 'magic' in harry potter is far different from occultism and wicca etc. because in Harry Potter people are BORN with these powers/abilities, and they are simply learning to control them at Hogwarts. It'd be completely different if they were regular humans who were choosing to pursue these things for the sake of power, excitement etc. As it is, they are BORN WITH abilities, which, sets them apart from being regular humans (muggles if you like), which draws the line pretty darn clearly between Harry Potter being fantasy (which it is) rather than teaching actual real life witchcraft. Put it this way, no real life human child is going to be able to cause glass barriers to disappear in a zoo just by wanting them to. If it's not possible in real life, it's fantasy. Fantasy, while not necessarily useful in terms of strengthening one's relationship with the Lord, it's also not damaging unless one makes it (ie by devoting their life to some movie or something... which some people do, tbf, which is kinda weird). By the way, there are christians who talk about Harry Potter encouraging divination. As for divination, the main protagonists of the book clearly hate that subject. In fact the headmaster of hogwarts actually wants to discontinue the subject. Also there is a book called a parents guide to harry potter by Gina Burkart. It talks about how to use harry potter in the christian class room. “Since it is likely that children will encounter cruel enemies, let them at-least have heard of brave knights and HEROIC COURAGE. Other wise you are making their destiny not brighter, but darker. -Cs Lewis. Ps. A true christian would not be quick to judge a book series as demonic. This is only my take on it. Harry potter: the boy who lived, the chosen one and litterally comes back to life to defeat the self proclaimed dark lord. The books: the whole message and moral of the story is that love conquers all. That's the message. Love. Love for your family, friends, close ones and people around you. Harrys power and being special doesn't come from his power in witchcraft, he's above average, or his mind, average. It comes from his great capacity to love and those around him. The evil ones/bad guys in this story are ones without the capacity to love. The magic, you'd know all this if you had read the book, in reality is just a back drop for interesting stories and an interesting world where cool stuff happens. It's meant to hook you in with the escapist fantasy of leaving your boring life and be taken to a place where you can learn to make pots and pans move with a stick. And on top of that, it's just very well written. My thoughts on christians against Harry Potter: I get it. A fictional character is doing what the Bible says is wrong, therefore the books are bad. Knowledge, science and technology were treated the same way. Since so many Christians enjoy these advancements, how would their ancestors see them? Scientific theories and hypotheses are allowed to evolve, biblical thought is not. I don't have the answers but I do enjoy the questions. The Bible has a plethora of horror in it and we Christians believe every word of it. There's a difference in examining critically with our minds and condoning something that is wrong. Besides the magic spoken of in Harry Potter is NOTHING like the magic that is real and is condemned in Scripture. What about Wizard of Oz? One of the good main characters is Glinda the Good Witch of the North. A good witch, how dare they. All witches are suppose to be evil. Next we have a magical animated Scarecrow and Tin Man. Flying Monkeys with hats! Man this is terrible. On the topic of a story teaching and having a message. In the Wizard of Oz Dorothy runs away from home. According to the logic of christians against Harry Potter , it will make kids want to run away from home. Dorothy befriends a lion. What! That will make kids go up to lions without fear and want to be their friends. That is dangerous. Lastly what about the Wizard of Oz, the guy who the whole story is named from. He is a fraud and lies about his identity. This will teach kids that committing fraud and lying is ok. We know these things are evil, yet children know that these are wrong when a parent does their job and educates them. To quote my Favorite Character in Harry Potter: “The world isn't split into good people and Death Eaters. We've all got both light and dark inside us. What matters is the part we choose to act on. That's who we really are.” -Sirius Black I've recently become a Harry Potter fan, The reason behind that is that, unlike the people against it, I know how to differentiate between fiction and real life, and between a fairy tale and my religious beliefs and practices. Also if you are so Anti-Harry Potter, you should be anti Lord Of The Rings and Chronicles Of Narnia. Narnia has magical wardrobes and NECROMANCY and Lord of the Rings has magic rings, but their okay to read and watch. But a teenager with glasses who defeats evil and a book series with BIBLE VERSES is bad? Harry Potter is a Christ figure, J.K Rowling is a devout anglican. Not once did she ever practice witchcraft whoever told you that is a liar. A great example is the humanity of the character of Harry Potter. In the 5th movie we get possibly one of the best depictions of humanity in cinema that I think we’ve seen. Voldemort, responsible for mass murder, attempted genocide, and almost every single personal tragedy in Harry’s life if not all, is literally attacking him from the inside out. But Harry doesn’t curse him, or use his hate to overpower him. He shows pity. If you’ve read the books you know Voldemort literally cannot feel love and never could. People like this are labeled evil, but “inherently evil” people are just broken, mentally and or emotionally ill, and Harry recognizes how sad this is. Love was always Harry’s strength, and I think that’s what Rowling wanted to show u Here are a few of my fav Harry Potter quotes that prove that they're indeed books with a great message. "We must all face the choice between what is right and what is easy" Albus Dumbledore "Happiness can be found even in the darkest of times if one only remembers to turn on the light." Albus Dumbledore "If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look how he trets his inferiors, not his equals." Sirius Black "It takes a great deal of bravery to stand up to your enemies, but a great deal more to stand up to your friends." Albus Dumbledore

Both Trent Horn and Kendra Tierney have great, reasonably responses to the weird Harry Potter fear, which I thought was exclusive to Protestants up until VERY recently!

@jameswood450

Жыл бұрын

Well, if you like to read it, then it must be good, right?

@Mish844

Жыл бұрын

back when it was work in progress, priests in my country had this weird vibe of thinking HP would posses you. Same paranoia as with pokemons video games and anime in 90s

My grade 4 teacher at a Catholic school was a religious sister and she read the first book to us

Just like our fallen nature - we usually want the forbidden fruit. With all the great literature out there, why bother with something like this that's questionable??

Well he didn’t actually lay out what value it had but vaguely referred to “some good things I’ve read about it”

I feel like there's way more important things to discuss

I won't say which famous traditionalist Priest said these things, but the claims that 80% of the names are demonic and that the spells are real are super ignorant.

We have seen posts proclaiming both "Vatican Condemns Harry Potter" and "Vatican Endorses Harry Potter". But they both have to be true.because they're on the INTERNET!

In that same year on Hallowe'en, James' love for his wife and son caused him to stand face to face with the darkest wizard in a century (Lord Voldemort) on his own in an effort to give them time to escape. Also in the same night, Lily's love for her son Harry protected him from Lord Voldemort. He became the only known person in history to survive the Killing Curse, because of the power of Lily's loving sacrifice.[16][17] However, it could be that while love was the motive, the cause of Harry's protection was that Lily had lured Voldemort into a binding magical contract so that having killed her, he would be unable to kill Harry, because he had already promised to spare Lily, and only her offer allowed him to kill her.

I find it to display good virtuous friendship. Which is what we want kids to learn, LOTR and Harry potter are certainly not comparable. But the commonality of strong virtuous friendships and character development is great.

I agree with every word in this video. That's a nice feeling :)

Just had class with this guy lol

Oh dear the comment section is gonna be mayhem

I have read all seven books, I watched all the movies and enjoyed them at the time. With that established, I am deeply concerned about the books now. It opens kids up to the idea that witches can be good. I was asked by my middle school students about this after I told them witchcraft is of the devil. They then asked, “so there are no good witches or wizards?” I had to tell them no. If I had not told them this, they may have looked up witchcraft and how to participate out of pure curiosity. This is a concerning aspect of the books. This is different from Tolkien because with Tolkien 1. It is a fictional world and 2. The wizards are angels that have supernatural abilities as part of their nature.

@Thedisciplemike

Жыл бұрын

Define a witch

@thomasmcanerney1534

Жыл бұрын

@@Thedisciplemike a woman thought to have magic powers, especially evil ones,

@Thedisciplemike

Жыл бұрын

@@thomasmcanerney1534 define magic powers. Would you call Wonder Woman a witch? Princess Leia? Elastagirl?

@JeansiByxan

Жыл бұрын

YES! Thank you! The level of naivete Christians show towards these books is unbearable. I have no problem with fictional fantasy, but when you trivialize witchcraft and make it out to be innocent and cute it’s no wonder that witchcraft is on the rise.

@thomasmcanerney1534

Жыл бұрын

@@Thedisciplemike the power of apparently influencing the course of events by using mysterious or supernatural forces

I think there is a difference between the magic represented in Harry Potter, and the magic represented in Lord of the Rings... Growing up with Harry Potter, the movies cultivated in me a deep desire for magic and fantasy to be REAL. In contrast - Lord of the Rings I found BORING because the magic wasn't fascinating. Not sure if this means anything....but there seems to be a difference

@JeansiByxan

Жыл бұрын

I’m not even sure there is any ”magic” in LOTR. Gandalf has a staff that does some cool stuff.

@commonsense5905

Жыл бұрын

@@JeansiByxan Gandalf the grey WIZARD, The WITCH King of Angmar, MAGIC rings (the one ring?) bro there is so many magic beings and objects in lotr

@AprilGracecatholic

Жыл бұрын

Same, I wanted so much for the Harry Potter magic to be real that I broke the 1st commandment over it. I have since confessed the sin and renounced my affiliations with the franchise.

@Mish844

Жыл бұрын

might have something to do with different magic systems

YEAAH I think father Ripperger and the rest of the exorcists know what they are talking about on this subject!!

@TheJmlew11

Жыл бұрын

What would makes you say that?

@mauritsderuiter2673

Жыл бұрын

Fr Ripperger makes unsubstantiated claims that are debunked over and over. Trent Horn has a nice fact check of his claims.

@theden3162

Жыл бұрын

@@TheJmlew11 well they have first hand experience with the demonic, and the occult elements of Harry Potter are of demonic nature and origin

@theden3162

Жыл бұрын

@@mauritsderuiter2673 you seem to have an attachment to Harry Potter and you are clearly triggered by the fact. You underestimate the demonic influence

@mauritsderuiter2673

Жыл бұрын

@@theden3162 lol

Please pray for my best friend Taylor whom I've known for 17 years - since kindergarten. Today she is a witch who worships "Pluto", has traveled into doing "dark magic", and is engaged to marry another witch who started transgender hormones recently. As kids I had no foundation in Catholicism, and she was barely exposed to it during the same time. Recently, I am more solid in my faith and finally understand the basics of what it means to be a Catholic. A week or two ago I decided to put my foot down and tell her the witchcraft and the LGBT stuff is no good, and she completely cut me off from her and her family - people whom I considered as my own family. I ask you to help me pray to St. Monica for Taylor's reversion. She has told me that she would rather go to hell because she wants nothing to do with God - whom she sees as the bad guy. Despite those horrible mindsets, I am confident that God will do the impossible if I persistently advocate for the necessity of her reversion. And if many faithful people beg on her behalf, "Pluto" doesn't stand a chance.

@Mish844

Жыл бұрын

well, if you are more interested in them being obedient to your faith and "reverse", rather than being interested in their wellbeing, then cutting you off isn't entirely a bad idea, as from an outside perspective you could give a cultist-preacher vibe. You'll have to accept the fact that people don't have to be interested in your god, otherwise you're the one with horrible mindset. And if all you have to combat Pluto is prayers, then Pluto likely has nothing to fear.

@ComicRaptor8850

Жыл бұрын

@@Mish844 don’t you realize that Christians believe that repentance and conversion is what’s best for people?

@Mish844

Жыл бұрын

@@ComicRaptor8850 I know, that's why believers thinking in OP's way are dangerous - they're ready to do most horrible things, destroy lives, act entitled, stalk and all this in this weird belief that they do it because it's best for people, while in reality they serve themselves

@ComicRaptor8850

Жыл бұрын

@Misha you mention “doing the most horrible things.” What is your basis for morality?

@Mish844

Жыл бұрын

@@ComicRaptor8850 I'm reading your comment for the 7th time and I still can't find how my morality and its basis ties into the topic

First, look at its fan base. Almost all pronoun pushing pink haired progressives. You gotta ask yourself, why? Secondly, Snape murdering Dumpledore cannot be squared with morality no matter how you slice it. As the decisive act in the entire series it taints the whole series. If you like wizards, spells, and English public schools, read Enid Blyghton.

My fundamental question is, should we take the spells used in the books and movies seriously? Most Catholics would say yes, as witchcraft and such is explicitly prohibited. Then you have to ask, are kids prone to emulating or copying things they see in said books and movies? Often, I would say yes. So the fear of kids getting into this stuff can be understood and is well founded in my opinion. For adults, again we have to ask, is the magic used in this franchise from the “dark side” so to speak? If so, it seems that watching and reading wouldn’t be recommended. If it’s not, I suppose you could argue that it’s neutral at best. You might also say that everything could be construed in media as “demonic” or evil. But my counter to this would be; witchcraft, wizardry, soothsaying, etc is very clearly laid out as off limits in the Bible. You could argue that other media does cross over into the wrong territory but it’s far more circuitous to argue and harder to see. Doesn’t mean it’s not there, but not nearly as blatant. Remember the fear around the Pokémon franchise? Look into that and what the Vatican said on the subject.

@InhabitantOfOddworld

Жыл бұрын

They're not real spells. They're either in latin or broken latin, and in literal translation mean exactly what they do. If harry potter "spells" are real, then every priest who gives a latin mass is now a wizard

And how would someone who claimed to be a Tolkien nerd, even begin to say that there is "magic" in LOTR as well, without making the stark comparison between the two. In LOTR those who do not know who Gandalf really is, call him a wizard. But there are no spells for him to learn. He is the keeper of the eternal flame. This is not magic in the sense that Harry Potter has magic.

@GaserBeam-hi4ez

3 ай бұрын

The magic in Harry Potter is innate, a thing in your blood. The spells (not real, it’s fantasy) help harness the natural born power they all have and exhibit and can’t control from birth.

@TimothyGott

3 ай бұрын

​@@GaserBeam-hi4ez ... The CANA website has the best explanation on this that I've ever seen, which has really helped me flesh this out for myself. I wish KZread would let me link to the site ... '-*-'-*-'-*-'-*-'-*-'-*-'-*-'-*-'-* CANA (FAQ) '-*-'-* '-*-'-* '-*-'-* How are Tolkien and Lewis different from Harry Potter? This answer cannot address all the differences, but will address some of the main ones involving the occult. The characters in Tolkien who have powers have them inherently; that is, they don’t learn them through occult study or methods. Also, these characters, such as Gandalf, are not human but are part of angelic type beings created by Tolkien. The use of these powers is not a central focus in either Tolkien or Lewis, and their central characters do not practice the occult. I see no parallels between the references to Gandalf’s powers and to the active and ongoing study of real occult practices present in Harry Potter. Harry is learning divination - including astrology, arithmancy (a type of numerology), spell casting, and potions. These things are not fictional nor are they fantasy; they exist today and information on how to learn and practice them is easy to find. Furthermore, there is a moral center in both Tolkien and Lewis that is lacking in Harry Potter. In Tolkien, in fact, one of the themes is the corruption of power as seen in the contact Bilbo and Frodo have with the Ring. Their desire to use the Ring’s power pulls them toward evil, and the Ring corrupts character; therefore, the central characters develop integrity and character in resisting the temptation of the Ring. In Harry Potter, we see Harry increasing his power through knowledge of spells and magick in order to fight Voldemort. In Tolkien, the heroes must resist the use of power; in Harry Potter, it is sought after and admired. Additionally, in HP, the power is tied into actual occultic practices, and the source of power for both Harry and Voldemort is the same. It is my view, as a former Literature major and as one who has read and written stories and poems since quite a young age, that the literary quality of both Tolkien and Lewis far surpass Rowling. In fact, the differences are so great, I find it difficult to even compare them. For a more detailed look at a comparison between Harry Potter, C. S. Lewis’ Narnia series, and Tolkien’s books, see Harry Potter, Narnia, and The Lord of the Rings: What You Need to Know About Fantasy Books, Movies and Games by Richard Abanes, available from Amazon, Christian Book Distributors and other book outlets.

@TimothyGott

3 ай бұрын

The cana website has the best academic answer that I've ever seen so I'll paste it below ... - CANA (FAQ) - How are Tolkien and Lewis different from Harry Potter? This answer cannot address all the differences, but will address some of the main ones involving the occult. The characters in Tolkien who have powers have them inherently; that is, they don’t learn them through occult study or methods. Also, these characters, such as Gandalf, are not human but are part of angelic type beings created by Tolkien. The use of these powers is not a central focus in either Tolkien or Lewis, and their central characters do not practice the occult. I see no parallels between the references to Gandalf’s powers and to the active and ongoing study of real occult practices present in Harry Potter. Harry is learning divination - including astrology, arithmancy (a type of numerology), spell casting, and potions. These things are not fictional nor are they fantasy; they exist today and information on how to learn and practice them is easy to find. Furthermore, there is a moral center in both Tolkien and Lewis that is lacking in Harry Potter. In Tolkien, in fact, one of the themes is the corruption of power as seen in the contact Bilbo and Frodo have with the Ring. Their desire to use the Ring’s power pulls them toward evil, and the Ring corrupts character; therefore, the central characters develop integrity and character in resisting the temptation of the Ring. In Harry Potter, we see Harry increasing his power through knowledge of spells and magick in order to fight Voldemort. In Tolkien, the heroes must resist the use of power; in Harry Potter, it is sought after and admired. Additionally, in HP, the power is tied into actual occultic practices, and the source of power for both Harry and Voldemort is the same. It is my view, as a former Literature major and as one who has read and written stories and poems since quite a young age, that the literary quality of both Tolkien and Lewis far surpass Rowling. In fact, the differences are so great, I find it difficult to even compare them. For a more detailed look at a comparison between Harry Potter, C. S. Lewis’ Narnia series, and Tolkien’s books, see Harry Potter, Narnia, and The Lord of the Rings: What You Need to Know About Fantasy Books, Movies and Games by Richard Abanes, available from Amazon, Christian Book Distributors and other book outlets.

I think that the concern may be warranted- depending on the person reading the stories. Any kid with a strong faith that has their questions answered well, will view fiction as just fiction. Nothing to base their worldview on. Kids that don’t have a set faith or resources to help them answer questions could be impacted negatively. Also, all stories are created by flawed humans, so even the best story could be used to mislead someone with those faults reflected in it.

I still think that it is an introduction into the occult. My opinion

I think the danger comes from obsession. I think it’s a bad idea to give the books/movies to a child that gets easily obsessed. I got obsessed with Harry Potter as a kid, and I allowed demons into my life through it. I didn’t believe it could possibly be a bad thing until I started seeing demons. Do I believe Harry Potter is inherently demonic? No. Would I encourage anyone to read it? Absolutely not. But that’s just me.

@AudioEpics

Жыл бұрын

I honestly don't understand. What's the connection? How can you allow demons into your life through Harry Potter? There aren't even any demons in the books.

@winter-wb7cf

Жыл бұрын

@@AudioEpics I allowed it through obsession. Just like some exorcists talk about people getting possessed by an obsession with rock music. Yes it is unique to me and not an inherent problem with Harry Potter

@AudioEpics

Жыл бұрын

​@@winter-wb7cf I had never heard of that. Thanks for clarifying.

@lunalee3021

Жыл бұрын

"I allowed demons into my life through it." It's very dangerous and wrong to say something like this lightly. Catholics seem to think it's morally acceptable to slander Rowling and imply (if not directly call) her and her fans satanists. This is bearing false witness. If individuals have personal demons, that's okay to talk about. I don't like the slanderous and misleading attitude that implies Harry Potter or Rowling are particular portals for the demonic, when this is objectively false and more clarification is needed for what you mean. Too many people use anecdotal experiences to set up a false narrative in this debate, which is unethical. Harry Potter is inherently good and the people who enjoy it are objectively innocent for doing so. Period. Anything else is personal and far from the norm. (So much so that you're more likely to make people aware of satanism and likely to participate in it by insisting on seeing it where it's not).

Each person must honor their own convictions regarding the matter, there isn’t a right or wrong. However, I think one of the most beautiful quotes come from one of the movies (can’t remember which one). Harry is battling Voldermort and he says, “You're the one who is weak. You will never know love or friendship. And I feel sorry for you.” He is in the heat of battle with his enemy and still exhibiting compassion and concern for him. Truly beautiful.

@pbg7225

Жыл бұрын

You are wrong if you say there is no right or wrong in this because there evil is these books the evil it disguises that seems harmless but it is not

@pbg7225

Жыл бұрын

You are wrong there is a wrong and there is right there good and there is evil and yes we at war this battle is real whether you believe or not the battle for our souls like it tells in Lord of the Rings even though these books are fiction they write about the battle that we are in the battle between God and satan and caught in the middle which side are you going to be on Read Revelation 13;16-17 don't let your guard down don't take take these warning lightly we are a battle don't take harry potter lightly either no Catholic should read these

@bilbobaggins9893

Жыл бұрын

@@pbg7225 you are misunderstanding my comment with all due respect. Of course, I believe there is right and wrong and good and evil in the world. I'm saying that given this particular instance there is no right or wrong, it is subjective. This is a Christian liberty issue, if your convictions tell you watching Harry Potter is wrong then by all means honor those convictions and don't watch it! However, because you have the conviction does mean everyone else does. Others can watch it and perhaps even be edified by the good triumphing evil theme that runs throughout. To say otherwise is to be legalisitc.

@pbg7225

Жыл бұрын

GOD didn't say live according conscience bit should live across the Commandments we need to put the full armor of God there is good and there is there is evil don't only living accounting to our conscience how many people have not developed a good conscience and they just do things how they feel and only what they want and don't see the danger that is around them these books are dangerous like it says in the Bible in Proverbs 3:5-6 trust in the Lord with all your heart, lean not on your own understanding but in all things acknowledge Him and He will direct your path. life is not always about how you feel and want listening to your conscience because in like this people can be lead astray we need at times to ask God to help us and enlighten us this is very to our souls

@bilbobaggins9893

Жыл бұрын

@@pbg7225 ok, you are now taking my comment out of context. I think your passion is making you unable to understand what I’m saying. I’m not going to argue with you anymore, take care!

What’s the controversy? It’s literally a work of fiction.

@JP2GiannaT

Жыл бұрын

Welcome to the wild wild world of Christian cultural paranoia...

I would not read them to my children. I enjoy the thoughts and characters because they where a huge part of my childhood but the occult part is just too present. The influence to like witchcraft is huge. Like, no. Tolkin has another depth upon his "wizards" than Rowling. So, I think u can compare then especially u are more likely am adult while watching/reading the material. U understand Tolkins philosophy. Rowling is for kids who don't understand such philosophical difference.

0:00 - Is Theism OK for Catholics? Some guys seem to be very willing to pretend of any Theist, saying that God created by omnipotence and ex nihilo (it actually is in a Catholic Bible) is "appealing to magic" and bring up Harry Potter. Btw, a certain Bergoglio seemed a bit Snape to me on this issue back with the "omnipotent magic wand" quote.

Matt! I’d love for you to have Fr. Donald Calloway on to discuss this topic;)

Doesn’t LOTR get credited with demon possession occasionally?

We're living in a Michael O'Brien novel 🙄

@JeansiByxan

Жыл бұрын

Which one?

@tonygville2969

Жыл бұрын

@@JeansiByxan I'd say Fr Elijah 🤔

@tonygville2969

Жыл бұрын

@@JeansiByxan I love his writing and insight. I used to read his blog 🤔 I need to check him out again. How are you familiar with Michael?

Ah yes one the most pressing questions concerning Catholicism. Also this is me making a little joke. Don't take it so seriously.

@GordonGartrell27

Жыл бұрын

That's a weird point of view.

@YovanypadillaJr

Жыл бұрын

@@GordonGartrell27 I was making a joke

@InhabitantOfOddworld

Жыл бұрын

Exactly. They'll ignore real issues like pachamama and the synod on synodality, but start borrowing 20 year old protestant talking points about Harry Potter lmao

@loretta3203

Жыл бұрын

You may be making a joke, but I think your comment is 100% spot on!

3:12 In the nineties, I read a warning against the books in the German newsletter of FSSPX "Mitteilungsblatter der Priesterbruderschaft Pius X" The guy warning seemed to have read if not all in the books at least significant detail. He claimed that one major difference to Tolkien was, spells are actually given, specifically, he considered the one involved in the Avada Kevadra curse as being antitrinitarian. His point was, Tolkien and Lewis can't serve as practical instruction books in magic, HP can. Would like to know what Alex Plato has to say on that one? As to morality of the story, I think his warnings about rebellious minds being put up for admiration is overdone. Schools are as bad a menace to juvenile schools as Hogwarts, which to me is licit satire on boarding schools. I have a much deeper problem with HP than the theological warning. I went to one. Since then, I am somewhat allergic to boarding school novels. My point on that one, as opposed to possibly too realistic instructions for committing the sin of magic, is, if you can't keep your children from schools that are worse than Hogwarts, and in some cases worse than Slytherin, don't complain if their behaviour is somewhat Harry, Hermione and Ron. It could be worse .... (yeah, Draco Malfoy, looking your way, without even knowing the details). Then there is another aspect. Magic persons vs Muggles. There is perhaps a kind of superiority complex from a secretive group, which mirrors things like Judaism and Freemasonry. Yes, I know, Harry, Hermione and Ron as well as their mentor ... what's his name? ... Dumbledore (I had to look it up) are all for being nice to Muggles. But they also are for being secretive, so for instance Muggles wronged by for instance Draco cannot get at them and punish them. I for my part have two other pet peeves (apart from boarding school), these being: * so much depends on a mentor (as it happens, the guy I had to look up) * staying friends in a love triangle like Ron and Harry both being in love with Hermione is not the best recipe for purity. Both of these are obviously very prevalent in society.

@JP2GiannaT

Жыл бұрын

I don't think Harry was ever in love with Hermione. At all. I think it was always a friendship.

@hglundahl

Жыл бұрын

@@JP2GiannaT "were your parents thieves?" "why would you say such a thing?" "they stole two stars and put them in your eyes" + Rowling regretted matching Hermione with Ron in one of her tweets.

yes, there discussion over

Loved the series as teenager, but honestly... when I did read it recently, as an adult, I did not like it so much anymore. Harry is such a brat for the most time... hah. Honestly, I've had similiar immersion reading Hunger Games and honestly, Katniss is so much better character. Loved the story and movies are suprprisingly good too.

I remember when Harry Potter first became popular, there were so many Protestants screaming about how it was evil because it promoted witchcraft. Reminded me of the Satanic Panic in the 80s and the ridiculous paranoia surrounding D&D. That being said, Harry Potter is pretty mediocre and you could find better stuff for your kids to read/watch.

There is nothing weird about trying to distance oneself from real spells said throughout the books and that were also written through the inspiration of demons proclaimed by these evil spirits to exorcists. Obviously not just Protestants oppose these books but Catholic Exorcists speak out greatly against these books as well!

@InhabitantOfOddworld

Жыл бұрын

Absolute tosh. Superstitious nonsense. It's not satanic or anything else you might hear as misleading claims people have heard from Fr Ripperger et al. Contrary to popular opinion: - the "spells" are not real. They're just latin playwords. They're no more magic than going to latin mass. - Rowling has no history with witchcraft, wicca, or the like. She took classical studies in university and merely has an academic interest in greek and roman myth. No different to Tolkien in that regard. - the books do not contain the real names of demons. Believe it or not, few demons out there are named Ronald, or James, or Hannah. In fact, the books contain more biblical names than anything resembling the demonic. I can post more examples of what Fr Ripperger has got outrageously wrong

@TitusCastiglione1503

Жыл бұрын

Harry Potter doesn’t teach real spells dude.

@loretta3203

Жыл бұрын

Real spells??? Seriously??? Obviously you haven’t read the books. The spells are just Latin-ish phrases. With all the real evil in this world, people need to get a life!

@danielhager8399

Жыл бұрын

@@loretta3203 Thank you for proving my point!

@mbld33

Жыл бұрын

@@loretta3203 Real spells? C’mon man! Can’t we just relativize in peace?

I dont know anything of the occult, so someone could put occult references and symbolism in stuff and id have no idea. It seems like people are sneaking the occult in everything these days, and i have no idea. This video may have brushed aside others arguments, but their arguments werent very credible themselves.

What makes Dr Plato an expert on harry potter because he read the Book wow reading a book doesn't make him an expert I can read a book about all kinds of things that doesn't make me an expert on those things because if he was an expert he wouldn't be endoring a book like harry potter instead of reading the book he should ask the advice of real experts who know what is really in these books if he did want endorse something there are so many good books that he could have endorsed Dr Plato did you ever pray about these books if they are good or not or just make your own mind decide well these are harmless because you say they are do you know that you will be judged on Judgement day if lead people on the wrong road because you said these book harmless according to you when they are not harmless these are serious things we are in battle for our very souls so then don't make up judgements on things without knowing the facts like it says in Scriptures In Proverbs 3:5-6 Trust in the Lord with your heart; and lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways acknowledge Him, and He shall direct your path. God is the ultimate judge not you Dr do you understand that !

Has Matt not seen the movies either? He doesn't know how it ends???

The reasons I've heard are that some of the spells used are actual witchcraft spells. I don't have a problem with Tolkien, because all of his spells and such he made up. Not so with Harry Potter.

@JP2GiannaT

Жыл бұрын

They're all singular words in Latin. No way they're real spells.

My neurosurgeon son, during medical school, rewarded himself after a long day of studying with a Harry Potter book. They’re not just for dummies.

@mbld33

Жыл бұрын

So what if he’s a neurosurgeon? The question is “Are HP books compatible with Catholic faith or not?”.

If you’re a parent, and allow your children to watch marvel, star wars, lord of the rings, bewitched, or just about any other piece of media with magic, then you’re a complete and utter hypocrite for believing that Harry Potter is somehow worse, or even dangerous. You’d let your kids be space wizards from Star Wars, but they can’t so much as watch Harry Potter which involves wizards on Earth?

@thomasmcanerney1534

Жыл бұрын

There is a difference between a fictional world and a book set in our world. Also, there is a biological explanation without any kind of incantation used in Star Wars.

@Cloudroth

Жыл бұрын

@@thomasmcanerney1534 Okay what about all the super hero movies set in our world too? There's plenty of examples.

@thomasmcanerney1534

Жыл бұрын

@@Cloudroth most have natural explanation, bit by a spider, fell into toxic waste, inherited special genetics, pumped up with roids, I mean super soldier serum… they have explanations.

@Thedisciplemike

Жыл бұрын

@@thomasmcanerney1534 so your line that shouldn't be crossed is the presumption that Spidermans super powers are "explained"? If they weren't explained then that means it's evil?

@jmclaughlin2009

Жыл бұрын

@@thomasmcanerney1534 I mean, magic is genetic is Harry Potter, so there kind of is a biological explanation for that as well. It's fundamentally different from "real life" magic. Children will give up their dreams of learning magic when they don't get their letter from Hogwarts.

NO.

Harry Potter books are no good no Catholic should read them

I read Harry Potter through about three times and watched the movies. I was wondering whether I should read it again. I’m 75 and these multiple readings extend several years from the time it came out. I’m retired and going into surgery and looking for something I’ll enjoy. But I was worried that it wasn’t Catholic. Now I’ll enjoy it more. Warning though, her other stuff is probably evil.

@pbg7225

Жыл бұрын

Don't read harry potter no matter what dr Plato says it is wrong it is evil it is not Catholic book these book disguise themselves as being harmless but they are not there are so many Catholic experts who say it is not good. there are so many good books out there I like Narnia that is fun and exciting there is The Lord of the Rings there is G.K Chesterton his book the Suprise is fun and interesting to read and he has others Shakespeare book are good if you want a good Catholic romance book Janette Oke Love comes softly series of books are good the movies are too she has other good books Dante book are good Pride and Prejudice are good Charles Dickens he has plenty of good books Mark twain books are good there are so many good books out there without picking a controversial book like harry potter which to many are not good even though there are people who they are harmless but they are not

@JP2GiannaT

Жыл бұрын

I dunno, she's the one celebrity in the UK willing to speak out against the transgender agenda. And she's suffered immensely for it. That earns her some cred in my book.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

Why are some Catholics okay with just throwing around the term 'evil' like that? Close minded! (And super judgmental). "Probably evil". Right then. Don't do your own research or anything.

@meganpata9033

Жыл бұрын

@@monkey6207 because lots of things are evil. Even something like losing a limb in an accident is an evil-a natural evil, but evil nonetheless. It’s perfectly reasonable to be cautious. You’ve commented on several comments in this thread and seem overly upset that other people are choosing to be cautious based on statements from exorcists. I certainly don’t think that’s unwise. Maybe if their opposition to something offends you this much, you are too attached.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

@@meganpata9033 Condescending ad hominin with no argument attached. Is this comment supposed to be convincing?

I don’t spend a lot of time on podcasts but I really enjoyed your channel until now.

Counterpoint: Adult Harry Potter fans are CRINGE!!

I think Harry Potter is a good example of books being more dangerous than their movie adaptations. You have 0 influence over your child's interpretation of the literature, but watching the movies together can help reduce it to just the entertainment value. That's why most of the insane HP fandom were book obsessed as kids

@InexorableInquisitor

Жыл бұрын

That’s interesting. I’ve never thought about that

@Thedisciplemike

Жыл бұрын

Lol what? Go ahead and ban every book for your kids with that logic. You shouldn't let your kids read the Bible because they might take a blasphemous interpretation. Cmon man. We should encourage thought. Reading takes thought. But it doesn't mean you can't talk about it afterwards with them.

@MikeyJMJ

Жыл бұрын

@@Thedisciplemike I don't want to get into a pointless back and forth argument so I'll make these points. 1. Nowhere did I say a kid shouldn't read books, that's a massive logic jump. 2. You can't compare the Bible to Harry Potter. There are adults who read the Bible and take blasphemous interpretations. Also there are tons of easy to read Bible related books catered for kids. 3. Catholic parents should have the final say on what books their children read, that's a very reasonable view.

@Thedisciplemike

Жыл бұрын

@@MikeyJMJ I agree parents should have the final say on what their children read. 100 %. But a child will develop his own interpretation as he sets out to try and understand the world in no matter what he reads. This should properly be complimented by an informed parent's guidance. Whether Harry Potter or the Bible.

@InhabitantOfOddworld

Жыл бұрын

I think you have it backward. The fandom is much more inspired by the movies and their actors

Yes, Harry Potter is incredibly well written, INCREDIBLY. But it's not superior to Tolkien. I mean, she's created an amazing world and it WILL go down as one of the greats. But Tolkien created 5 languages. He created this long and extensive, world history. They are in similar leagues of world building and creativity, good character design, good storytelling, but yes, Tolkien is higher.

@lunalee3021

Жыл бұрын

Say what you want, but Tolkien never had quadruple plot twists. The Shrieking Shack scene from Prisoner of Azkaban will never be replicated, and I don't plan on seeing something like that in children's media ever again in my lifetime. (Been sorely disappointed and distressed ever since reading it at 12).

@GaserBeam-hi4ez

3 ай бұрын

Tolkien is a more challenging read, but HP is more encouraging of goodness, love, sacrifice, and love. Harry Potter can and has reached for more hearts than Tolkien ever has or will.

Harry potter does have real spells in It. An excorcist told me this.

I don't think Fr Ripperger would care for Bewitched either which was a TV show from the '60s which was as harmless as Harry Potter

@InhabitantOfOddworld

Жыл бұрын

From what I can tell, Fr Ripperger doesn't know much about Harry Potter. He's made many claims, most of which are false or evidence-less, and people like to repeat them.

I have seen young woman on catholic Holy Spirit retreat,or how do you call it in English. She was nice,but little bit anxious there. When we recieved Holy Spirit,she started shaking and they couldnt to wake her up. When they make exorcism,she woke up. She was weak. The other day she had the testimony. When she was girl,she and her friends make fun with the Harry Potter magic skills. They were saying loud the magic words etc. And when she got Holy Spirit,something inside her started to block Holy Spirit. She was shaking,and she raised her hands like Harry is used to do and make magic. It was terrible for her. The exorcist knew what to do. Dont tell me,that Harry is ok. You can persuade yourself intelectualy,that it is ok. Ask God...and He will give you the answer.

@JP2GiannaT

Жыл бұрын

All the "spells" in Harry Potter are singular words in Latin. "Lumos" "Expelliamous", etc. I struggle to think that playing pretend by yelling out Latin is dangerous. I'm guessing something else was going on with that young girl.

I’ll stick with the exorcist’s and the ex-satanist’s (Zachary King) recommendation and opinion. BE CAUTIOUS with this man’s opinion. I’ve seen all these movies and my wife read all these books when we were younger. Comparing Tolkien to Harry potter is a joke. I have 5 kids and decided NOT to let them into the Harry Potter world.

The concept of magic in Harry Potter very much mirrors irl occultism: secret knowledge allowing you to command mysterious forces in order to gain power over things and people. I'd wager a good percentage of todays self proclaimed "witches" started going down that path when they read those books.

@hamie7624

Жыл бұрын

Definitely

@JP2GiannaT

Жыл бұрын

Have you read them? I don't remember that being the case at all. It was more like the X-Men, an ability you're born with that others may not understand. Now, Buffy the Vampire Slayer...THAT has a dangerous depiction of witchcraft. Witchcraft is actually an attainable and desirable art in that.

@mikeindiacharliehotelalpha2373

Жыл бұрын

@@JP2GiannaT I have read them, allthough to be fair it's been a few years. I do however distinctly remember that while magic was an inherent trait - like you said - the ability to utilize it was taught in a secret school seperated by 10 layers of mystery and spellcraft from the ordinary world. I mean why does the protagonist ultimately win? Because he knows how the right of ownership of a magic wand works and the bad guy doesn't. In short he knows more secrets and that makes him more powerful. Meanwhile the antagonist got killed because his soul splinters were found and destroyed i.e. his secrets were exposed.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

Accoring to this logic, the majority of the human race has been inspired to become witches.(Because the majority of the human race has read Harry Potter). Maybe people would have believed you 20 years ago, but get over it and admit it is a Catholic series.

Ask Milo ...

Great discussion!

I was listening to Anne Borik talking about saint sharbel, original name is Yusuf or Joseph, thinking when one or maybe all of those big catholic youtubers , will decide to shed the light big time on this great saint? Suggestions like inviting multiple guests to give their testimonies live on how the miracles through st sharbel INTERCESSION changed their lives. Its time for the American population to know this loving saint , don t you think?

Sorry- I don't speak nerd.

I don't know one exorcist that doesn't say to stay away. That's enough for me.

Fr Chad Ripperger and Fr Donald Calloway disagree. Harry Potter has real magic.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

At this point in time, Catholics should be extremely embarrassed and apologetic about what they've said about JK Rowling. Fr. Ripperger has a lot to answer for. He is so dishonest when it comes to JK Rowling it makes me question if he is a sincere Catholic!

@abelovedchildofgod7383

Жыл бұрын

@@monkey6207 they are, not only him but other exorcists have said the same thing.

@monkey6207

Жыл бұрын

​@@abelovedchildofgod7383 Makes me question them, too! Fr. Vincent Lampert gave an honest answer: "They are probably harmless". The other exorcists tell blatant lies like "JK Rowling used to be a witch", so why should anyone believe them? They should have more integrity with a job like that, so people will believe them when it's important!

I'm a big fan of warhammer and fantasy and 40k and stuff, it's got demons and magic and alien gods and everything, I have no faith in any of it and I like to think im a better catholic than ever

Anyone who is against Harry Potter must be honest about it and forego fantasy fiction altogether, there is literally not a single piece of fantasy fiction that's "Catholic", not even Tolkien's, because fantasy fiction inevitably presumes to create exactly that, a fictional world that is different from ours, that means, no Christ, basically, if y'all want theology just go read theology LOL, not Tolkien, not C.S Lewis, not J.K Rowling, I swear, y'all are giving too much credit to scrupulous and quite frankly, superstitious priests who love to make bold claims with very little backing, y'all are getting a bit much.

Reading Michael O Brien's book "Harry Potter and the Paganization of Culture" and "A Landscape with Dragons" was enough for me not to read HP and not to let my child read them.

@JP2GiannaT

Жыл бұрын

I deeply disagree with O'Brian's critique of The Hunchback of Notre Dame Disney movie, lol. Completely off topic, but I don't run into other people who have read that book often.

Dr. Plato is quite clearly grossly misinformed about magic in Tolkien's Middle Earth. While the wizards (like Gandalf) can very clearly use magic, they actually go out of their way not to, preferring instead to use natural means and resources to achieve their goals. The only agents in the series (from The Silmarillion to The Return of the King) who use actual magic powers on a regular basis are the forces of evil (Sauron, Saruman, and Morgoth). Magic represents a bending and warping of God's universe and natural laws which is why a discerning Christian sees it for what it is, a tool of evil.

@lunalee3021

10 ай бұрын

Unless the magic is supposed to be synonymous for super powers. Why flip out over the terminology of a trope? It has nothing to do with anything real.

Great discussion and guest, I'm glad he didn't write it off as evil just because of the occult aspect. The occult sciences were never evil. The devil lurks in corners everywhere and the occult is no exception, but you can't label all of the occult as evil, especially when so much of it is strongly Christian based. Have a great weekend everyone! God bless.

@danielhager8399

Жыл бұрын

You know the devil quoted Bible verses all the time. He knows it better than we do. Certain words mean certain things . There is nothing in the definition of occult that would otherwise describe it as Holy and therefore not of or for God.

As an Englishman we think Americans are crazy. is it okay to watch Shrek?

@telephonebear21

Жыл бұрын

No: kzread.info/dash/bejne/oXycmqeCXdvUhto.html And many Englishmen, I at least speak for myself, regret deeply that we grew up partaking in things like these that we weren't to know were evil until growing up and getting a good Christian education at last.

@meganpata9033

Жыл бұрын

Well that’s rude. And no, Shrek is garbage.

Mr. Fradd, could you check this out please? I've heard as this guest says and I've also heard what I'll type below. According to Patrick Campbell, who had a possesed son and works with exorcists: former High Satanic Priest, Zachary King has said that the author had a demon possess her to write Harry Potter. Harry Potter could open a door for the demonic. The clip where Patrick and Joy Campbell talk about this is on youtube: Joyful Hope TV channel. It's one of their 7 Minute Booms: Cursed Objects Exorcists Can't Ignore.

@number5mom

Жыл бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/nGWCr8qEoJDNg9o.html Cursed Objects Exorcists Can't Ignore 7 minute Boom on JOYFUL HOPE TV on KZread. The Harry Potter talk starts at minute 4:40 in the video I referenced above.

@Sean-Kennedy

Жыл бұрын

Father Rippeger also talks about the dangers of reading Harry Potter as well. There was one exorcism session (I’m not sure by whom but it’s recounted by Father Rippeger) where the demon said it was one of the 6 demons that possessed J.K Rowling write the books. Also Rowling has a Baphomet tattoo on her wrist and admits that she was into actual witchcraft… At the end of the day people are going to read and listen to what they want but everyone should know the dangers they’re entering into. Between Harry Potter and Yoga this is always a touchy subject for people

@loretta3203

Жыл бұрын

1. Jo Rowling was not possessed by a demon. 2. You are aware that Harry Potter is a fictional character who cannot open any doors for anyone, right?

@number5mom

Жыл бұрын

@@loretta3203 Kindly, your opinions are not facts and exorcists have more credibility on this issue. 2 exorcists have spoken out. You don't know if Rowling was possessed or not.

@loretta3203

Жыл бұрын

With all due respect, if the exorcists have not read the books, they cannot opine knowledgeably.

Harry Potter isn’t demonic or anything (this is clear to anyone who’s actually read the darn books), but it’s certainly not anywhere near as good as something written by JRR Tolkien or CS Lewis. Or, for that matter, Star Wars. I don’t regret my parents keeping me and my sister from reading them (till we were much older), even if I disagree with their reasoning.

@loretta3203

Жыл бұрын

Respectfully, I think Tolkien is incredibly boring. I could not get through one paragraph. Harry Potter is engaging and exciting - much better writing.

@TitusCastiglione1503

Жыл бұрын

@@loretta3203 lol I can see that. LOTR was written in a different age, when long slow beginnings were more acceptable. Rowling’s prose and pacing is certainly more snappy.

@robertajaycart3491

Жыл бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/f4thlNaiZKe1dJs.html

Unfortunately this comments section seems really devoid of charity. I don’t think it’s crazy or scrupulous or something to stay away from Harry Potter because several prominent exorcists have spoken out about it. You don’t have to have a personally well-articulated reason for staying away from it other than just playing it safe. I’ve read the books and so did my husband. The story was interesting and it was well written, certainly, but even without warnings from exorcists, I would be hesitant to let young children read it because you just don’t need to be thinking about some things. I think the sixth book was particularly disturbing to me when I read it as a young child. I think you can certainly be a good Catholic and disagree, but please do so charitably. We also avoid Pokemon and yoga because of warnings from exorcists. Priests don’t even have to have a good understanding of the thing itself to be able to warn you against it. Exorcists see things we don’t. It’s never unwise to listen to someone, especially an exorcist, who God has given to you as a shepherd.

HP is literary dross, a genericaly ripped-off bad photocopy and served up with an undertone of genuine authorial nastiness

Harry Potter… linguistically “air-y pottah” and thus “heir of the potter” Gryphon… mythological two-natured lion and eagle, the animals considered lord of the heavens and the earth One could go on and on

Not ok 👎

Man : those books about WITCHCRAFT are not really bad. That’s why we should NEVER take advices from someone who does NOT have the gift of discernment. This is outrageous.

@Mish844

Жыл бұрын

they aren't bad. They are pretty fun, harmless and decently written

@JESUSSavesWAKEUP

Жыл бұрын

@@Mish844 Don’t be deceived. Many shows on Netflix are fun and such but they are also pure evil. Again don’t be deceived.

@JESUSSavesWAKEUP

Жыл бұрын

NOT Harmless ! That’s what got me into Wicca and magic. STAY AWAY front those books and movies. I’m not kidding. Trust the gift of discernement of some of your brothers and sisters in Christ

@Mish844

Жыл бұрын

@@JESUSSavesWAKEUP by "evil" you mean that they offend your sensitivities dictated by your strict interpretation of bible. The god gave us the gift of creativity, it would be more sinful to waste it.

@JESUSSavesWAKEUP

Жыл бұрын

God used is almighty creativity to creates everything that He called GOOD

Harry Potter is ok for novus ordo “Catholics”