Excerpts from ABC Australia program Utopia. Doing a much better explanation of induced demand than most transport experts.
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@mwangi86236 ай бұрын
"Do I have to be there myself?" "You were supposed to be there." "I got stuck in traffic" 😂😂
@derser541
3 ай бұрын
We know, we watched the video.
@ghaithfarfour8391 Жыл бұрын
As a mobility planner working in transit, this is the reason I don't watch Utopia. I already see too much of this in my real world!
@kyletopfer7818
Жыл бұрын
Yeah but is Jevons Paradox really also the same in your field? I know it namely from mine in environmental science, where productivity gains from improved efficiency lead to overall growth in aggregate production.
@C0deH0wler
Жыл бұрын
@@kyletopfer7818 Honestly, this 'version' of it in the video is a bastardisation for automobiles. With trains, for example, you will get more revenue to increase frequencies. Which will encourage more people to live closer to stations, and if the agency is a developer/landlord of adjacent property... more revenue to improve services! And as a bonus, more energy efficiency per capita... saving people money they can invest instead. Sure, you could value capture an increase in motorists with a congestion tax, whilst you continue to expand, but you will continue to demolish houses (that pay property tax), people will commute longer (increasing total maintance needed), and will likely ruin metro centres even further. And guess what a lot of suburbs use to slow down their decay? Metro centres! Ruining them will make things worse... If you were to increase the congestion tax as value capture method - instead of a way to manage congestion on adequate roads, ideally with active & public transport investments (but I think it would still would do good even without these) - to meet these... a lot less would drive, defeating this weird policy I made up. Society is subsidising driving, in my offered situation and right now. And, subsidise in a very ruiness way, eating slowly away at society itself, instead of having a net positive BCR. Tho, worth pointing out that this stuff is more about the tendency to continue to expand. Stuff is less worse when expanding a few select, sparse roads into four lanes. To create a sparse arterial network, with a few sparse large intersections, like you find in the Netherlands. This type of stuff would usually have a net positive BCR, but not really that high.
@kyletopfer7818
Жыл бұрын
@@C0deH0wler whilst I agree with alot of the core of your argument, it comes across a neoliberalist capitalist take, and I assume you were focusing on those arguments because you think they're more likely to persuade people who otherwise wouldn't listen to what for me is the key. Namely the energy andsoace efficiency, the better places, the access to jobs and places of interest for less well-off families, and the climate and ecological impacts.
@jamesperkins191
Жыл бұрын
@@kyletopfer7818 ABSOLUTELY. My dad is an economist, he was working on sims for planning out City Link and other freeway expansions in the early 90s. The corridors need to be secured DECADES before you actually need them, to provide extra slack in the system due to Jevon's Paradox. I was like 12 at the time, so I loved the joke for personal nostalgia reasons along with everything else. ❤️ Jevon himself was an economist in the era of the Industrial Revolution, so we've known about the problem in various ways for more than 150 years!
@rodgerhempfing2921
Жыл бұрын
More buses needed
@AstonKwok2 жыл бұрын
This is not comedy. This is therapy for public servants. You wouldn't want to laugh. You'd want to punch the tv.
@awf6554
Жыл бұрын
Yep. I can't really watch it.
@timconnors
Жыл бұрын
I still have the last season, unwatched, waiting for me on my disk. I was a APS public servant and it was too hard to watch. An episode would take me 3 weeks to watch, having to pause it and bury my head in my hands every 3 minutes before running off to do something more fun, because it was way too much like a combination of work and watching the news.
@Dudemon-1
Ай бұрын
It's really true, without exaggeration. Younger people have this starry-eyed view of government vs private-sector. I've worked in both, and the amount of money taken from taxpayers and used to make things worse is astonishing.
@nilloc93
26 күн бұрын
Public servants are 1/2 the problem. Embedded bureaucrats who are more interested in making their job more important than actually accomplishing anything. They're the ones who make up the stupid rules that make any government project take 3X as long as require 50 extra administrators to install a street lamp.
@jena.alexia7 ай бұрын
This is when they'll just hire consultants to tell them what they want to hear and then can blame them when it inevitably ends in a parliamentary inquiry.
@unematrix
6 ай бұрын
They had a scene where that exact thing happened :D
@smalltime0
3 ай бұрын
@@unematrix lol, I think their line was "What do you want the report to say?"
@sakr-el-bahr272
Ай бұрын
Think Rozelle Interchange.
@kenoliver8913Ай бұрын
"Have you ever heard of the Jevons Paradox?" "I was hoping it was a death metal band" As an economist this line made me splutter out my coffee.
@sands7779 Жыл бұрын
X: I thought we were going to be data driven? Y: The data doesn't know what it's doing. Lamentably familiar to anyone working with data.
@glennsmethurst22352 ай бұрын
The WA Labor minister for transport was being interviewed for the 6pm news with the newly opened freeway widening behind him. When asked about traffic implement he informed the reporter that “problem is when the travel gets better more people use the road and it clogs up” It was laugh your ass off TV.
@zipidi
2 ай бұрын
I’m trying to find the quote. Do you know which channel and date?
@glennsmethurst2235
2 ай бұрын
@@zipidi it would have been 4 years ago, north bound freeway widening of Kwinana freeway at South street. 6pm news covered it , commercial MSM.
@Dudemon-1
Ай бұрын
The thing is, even though it's clogged, there are more people choosing to use it. They make tge choice as to whether it's worth it, so there's an improvement.
@Myne1001 Жыл бұрын
"I knew AI was a bunch of greenies" My sides immediately died after this RIP
@cathiemarvellous
Жыл бұрын
"I got stuck in traffic" was what got me.
@nunyabidness3075
Жыл бұрын
It’s true though. Amazingly true. Everyone in Academia knows how to fix a study, and that most of them are not objective. Also, I spent most of my career in tech. Near the end I figured out that most of the “progress” from the late 80’s to present day had really been speeding up the process of garbage in, garbage out. We made it so that idiots could use more tools, but the tools haven’t really improved so much as they have just gotten prettier. So, that AI is just reflecting what it was fed. Induced demand theory doesn’t gain or lose any validity because a computer applies it. What’s most amazing is the very people who will scream how absolutely true it is will deny the underlying principle and vice versa because it’s not convenient to their “side”.
@CatatonicImperfect
Жыл бұрын
@@nunyabidness3075 That's why I don't like science. What's it ever done for us? Now the middle ages, there's a way to live.
@nunyabidness3075
Жыл бұрын
@@CatatonicImperfect 🤣😂🤣
@liam3284
Жыл бұрын
People miss the point, in Australia, induced demand can be counted as "vehicles per household".
@lGODofLAGl3 жыл бұрын
This is one of the funniest and most accurate things I've ever seen, like a modern Autralian match for Yes Minister 😂
@Myne1001
Жыл бұрын
Utopia and Hollowmen were really good shows
@seanslater
Жыл бұрын
@@Myne1001 New season of Utopia coming this year!
@TheRealJavahead
Жыл бұрын
I actually felt nauseated and angry watching this. I’ve worked with people like that. Yes, it was in Canberra.
@sirt8684
Жыл бұрын
@@TheRealJavahead my wife too with current vic govt
@shraka
Жыл бұрын
@@TheRealJavahead Same.
@dzfz21002 жыл бұрын
This is so accurate I actually feel physically ill
@LetsGoGetThem Жыл бұрын
Jesus Christ this is just humor applied to 100% real shit. I love it. Anyone who has worked in this kind of stuff knows this. Very well written.
@MichelleWardley
10 ай бұрын
Realistic Satire...
@Dudemon-1Ай бұрын
In 1984, I took a course at a world-famous university titled, "Computer Aided Design in Environmental Systems". 1/3 of the class was traffic engineering, so we learned of this principle very quickly. Ten years later, a newspaper article quoted a head traffic engineer near the shore as saying, "We didn't realize more people would start using [the bypass] once it was built and made it faster to get to the beach!" That was when it really clicked for ne that the people actually making the decisions are often not the smartest ones.
@micheljavert5923
Ай бұрын
The people making the decisions are not the people taking those classes. They just know they saw/heard about a shiny fancy new thing that sounds good. And they want it for themselves.
@BiscuitBoi936 Жыл бұрын
This is too much like my reality. We produced a proposal spec for a project with £60m of benefits, the powers-that-be said £100m would be better. They made us put down £100m and then work backwards to get that outcome. The final spec wasnt worth the paper it was written on but got approved because it said £100m. In 9 months I'll probably be in for a reaming because we're £40m short
@petehill3634
6 ай бұрын
Bahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha - great comment and you're right about the reaming unfortunately
@SirJonathonDanielGregorySrVthe
4 ай бұрын
It's been nine months.
@BiscuitBoi936
4 ай бұрын
@SirJonathonDanielGregorySrVthe yeah I pretty much nailed it, only thing I missed was how many times I'd have to write the same information across briefing notes, quarterly performance updates and management information reports
@mRahman92 Жыл бұрын
You see, they just didn't add enough lanes. THE ANSWER IS ALWAYS MORE LANES!🤪
@thegoat5141
3 ай бұрын
One more lane bro
@LM-xw7ii5 ай бұрын
“The data doesn’t know what it’s doing.” Incredible
@sylviaelse50862 жыл бұрын
Yes. The Sydney Harbour Tunnel was great. For a few years.
@uncletiggermclaren7592
Жыл бұрын
Does anyone even use it other than tourists?. I was there all those years ago when they built the Eastern Distributor, and the relentless hype and over-runs and delays . . . and then it turned the streets into a siht-show. Absolute chaos, and questions asked in Parliament and every single Sydney road user KNEW it was a disaster and yet the entire time the spin-doctors ran their mouths telling everyone it was great.
@sylviaelse5086
Жыл бұрын
@@uncletiggermclaren7592 The tunnel and the Eastern Distributor get plenty of use. But the Utopia episode is correct. You cannot build your way out of road congestion.
@uncletiggermclaren7592
6 ай бұрын
Nah, never credit to malignancy, what might be credited to stupidity. ONE person might think to themself "I will push this project, because it is going to increase congestion, which will force people to move, or use public transport* and that is my real hidden aim". But TWO people, more than two?. A secret known to two people, is no secret at all. They would never dare be so obvious, because they would be pillared when it came out, and it always comes out. And tourists use things because they are not from there, and know no better. The tunnel speeds you out of the city . . . except it leads you right into the eternal congestion of the Cahill Expressway, and DOUBLES the traffic that goes out and jams at Woolloomooloo. It has never been as effective as they promised, because it LEADS into congestion. ( Spoilers, ALL their traffic ideas run into the fact that Sydney is constantly congested. )@trapd00rspider
@eaglen00b Жыл бұрын
This isn't comedy satire, it's a documentary.
@stormman83932 жыл бұрын
Don't laugh. I worked for the government. So much money wasted, nothing achieved but what is most important is what bin you throw your rubbish into.
@luckydannumber26 ай бұрын
So that's the reason why they are building a network of mass transport lanes in the city, to remove the congestion. Been to Brisbane this year and found that they were building a mass transport option using buses to get people around.
@Eta_Carinae__4 ай бұрын
This show is really good at slowly burning me up into a smouldering pile of ash.
@EdenMisc. Жыл бұрын
Huh, Jevons paradox. I just learned something new today.
@leonkernan Жыл бұрын
I love that they’re in Brisbane but their modelling is on Melbourne
@jarrethcutestory
11 ай бұрын
They are based in Melbourne?
@froggy0162
7 ай бұрын
It’s set in Melbourne - the office shots are the top of Spring St on the corner of Nicholson.
@devarmont87
6 ай бұрын
Probably part of the incompetent satire. Councillor - "which city are we in again?"
@darrenrobinson9041
6 ай бұрын
Brisbane doesn't have traffic lights yet.
@devarmont87
6 ай бұрын
@@darrenrobinson9041 we are still arguing whether to name it Brisbane or Meanjin.
@aqdrobert2 жыл бұрын
We have such great freeways around Phoenix, Arizona, USA, drivers enjoy driving the wrong way until the inattentive other motorists get in the way.
@liam3284 Жыл бұрын
Roads, never get cost benefit, transit, always gets one with unfavourable assumptions.
@martincollins6632 Жыл бұрын
That fact that this is so close to reality makes my blood boil.
@darylgraham4313Ай бұрын
The better you make it, the more people will use it; means you are getting your money's worth out of your improvements
@anishtimanna883 ай бұрын
It is a temporary decongestion, I can get that from cough syrup.😂
@moonna8088 Жыл бұрын
WestConnex took nearly 5 months to become red on the gardners rd exit.
@robcerrato6528 Жыл бұрын
I wish more Americans could grasp the concept of induced demand. Unfortunately I think this video would fly over most of their heads.
@chickennoodle6620
Жыл бұрын
Bro, just one more lane. Will definitely solve traffic.
@ChristopherHalbersma
Жыл бұрын
Most Americans live in places not dense enough to experience it. You can put a 20 lane highway through Kansas, nobody is coming to drive on it.
@captainpoppleton
Жыл бұрын
Public transport is awful. Firstly you have to share with the public. Have you ever met the public ? You are at the mercy of timetables which can change at any time with no notice. You have to wait IN THE RAIN for the bus to show up. If you are catching a bus at night sometimes the driver can't actually see you in the bus stop AND KEEPS DRIVING PAST. You are at the mercy of unions, vandals, planned maintenance and unexpected breakdowns. It is no cheaper to pay the fare than to drive a car. A car can get you somewhere in 5 minutes but public transport will take you 30 minutes. Bottom line - Keep building roads or I will vote for the other mob.
@pakxenon
Жыл бұрын
@@captainpoppleton Not sure if satire but lol car expensive. you have to first own one. then maintain it. and buy insurance. and fuel it with big oil. then your suburb taxes don't even cover the sewage pipes running under the roads they're attached to in addition to power lines and asphault cracks. then ya gotta walk through a dangerous parking lot at whatever mall you're going to. then your car breaks down and now you can't go to work and now you don't have money to fix your car.
@abhi211-T
Жыл бұрын
@@captainpoppleton Sounds like you live in a place with terrible public transport. I’m pretty sure you don’t live in the Netherlands.
@WiggaMachiavelli Жыл бұрын
It'd be funny if the reality wasn't that they knocked my childhood home down for this shit.
@matthewcarter2677 Жыл бұрын
Ronda is brilliant.
@jackkraken3888 Жыл бұрын
Its a supercomputer that can predict outcomes with 99% accuracy. God:"Damn that's impressive."
@jena.alexia
7 ай бұрын
Not another super computer. 😭
@kaypendergast56767 ай бұрын
Rhonda I love you!!! You are so REAL
@billwilkinson95999 ай бұрын
Excellent show...
@matthewcarter26777 ай бұрын
Steven Miles currently suggesting a road tunnel from Carseldine to Kedron to "solve" congestion.
@Sagittarius-812 жыл бұрын
The directors of this episode should be ashamed of themselves. The guy who wanted to data, actually wanted to use his pipes!
@Sagittarius-81
2 жыл бұрын
Having said that, I still want more from this show. Get every disappointed participant to get some vengeance. Show them Mercy.
@Sagittarius-81
2 жыл бұрын
Lights. Action. Showtime. Give that guy another go.
@jjsc4396
Жыл бұрын
Lay off the crack pipe mate.
@sylviaelse50862 жыл бұрын
I always want to give Rhonda a slap, and I'm not even a violent person.
@reillysomething5507
2 жыл бұрын
Kitty Flanagan does a great job of playing her
@earth-air-water-fire-aether
Жыл бұрын
Then slap yourself honey, because all you see is something within yourself.
@julianwalls1077
9 ай бұрын
What is scarely is there are Rhondas out there!😀
@CuriousJo1122 Жыл бұрын
This is HILARIOUS!
@wakelamp
2 ай бұрын
Does it work better in countries where there are referendums on new infrastructure?
@mikehoyt75922 ай бұрын
This is fantastic. I'm off to Netflix!
@ralphsmith11703 ай бұрын
LOL!! The most hilarious part of this show, is that most of it is all too true!!
@user-xs5dp4gw8e Жыл бұрын
1:48 😂 I'm hoping they're a death metal band
@MrScrofulous
2 ай бұрын
Math-core, as it turned out.
@kailahmann18232 ай бұрын
The good think: At some point, it's stop getting worse. You only need to wait until it's faster to walk (assuming cycling an public transit would need to use the same congested roads).
@mstoss56362 жыл бұрын
Brilliant
@Cyclops00003 ай бұрын
If you're going to spend a lot of money to try and improve transit times and reduce road traffic then for the love of god JUST BUILT PUBLIC TRANSPORT NETWORKS! Buses might move slowly but they're 1 vehicle and can carry thousands of passengers per day, many of which would previously have been using individual cars. Do the same with trains for longer distances and before you know it you've reduced car usage immensely.
@andrewmarks4640 Жыл бұрын
Build more roads, you get more traffic. Need to put caps on who can be on the road at peak times…..gov: no, we prefer everyone to fight with each other for road space….it’s a dog eat dog world, and a free market economy means we can’t make rules to stop it. By having more cars on the road than it can support, we make sure people use more petrol, which means more trips to the petrol station, which means more excise tax collected plus GST added on. So therefore we can’t afford to not have traffic.
@jamesperkins191
Жыл бұрын
Just no.
@shraka
Жыл бұрын
Naw it's just that they're short sighted and putting in PT scares them. The solutions are easy from a design and budget perspective: Light and heavy rail, bike paths, sending cars around the long way, more walkability. Done. The ideal models for this are all well understood, if done right they cost WAY less in the long run, and they're only hard to implement because people are scared of change and politicians are spineless.
@sergarlantyrell7847
6 ай бұрын
Yeah, but most caps, come in the form of congestion charges and so discriminate based on income.
@rohitnirmal1024 Жыл бұрын
Data driven working, and I am a data scientist
@ScoobyDoo-zp1sq11 ай бұрын
"enoughl talk, let the algorithm speak"
@ricardiumhues3 ай бұрын
After yet again being delayed by qld rail the algorithm has once again nailed my views
@sarcasmo572 жыл бұрын
gold
@mikemoran6445 Жыл бұрын
Talk about "Jevons Paradox" and watch as peoples eyes slowly glaze over...
@darrenrobinson9041
6 ай бұрын
So the logic is that there is no point building stuff because the stupid public will just use it ?
@dzello
6 ай бұрын
@@darrenrobinson9041 Nah, that's not the point. Car transit is inefficient transit so when you add car infrastructure (like lanes), you just get more inefficient transit. If you want to impove transit, you need to go from cars to something more efficient: walking, biking, bus, trains, etc. So if you have inefficient car traffic, you add an efficient train line, and that improves overall transit for a long while. It's why Tokyo has the population of Canada yet has good mobility: insanely efficient urbanism.
@thunderspark1536
14 күн бұрын
@@darrenrobinson9041 Adding on to what the other guy said, it's not something you can EVER fix with cars alone anyway. it's simple physics, they are too space inefficient.
@carolynmccall9407Ай бұрын
Does anyone else see the resemblance of Celia Pacquola and Kelly Macdonald? I love them both!
@katejean789910 ай бұрын
❤❤❤
@BlueBeeMCMLXI Жыл бұрын
When the legislature is in session, nobody is safe.
@charlielynes Жыл бұрын
Brilliant... Just like our HS2 railway here in the UK. ☮️💚🍻
@CatnamedMittensАй бұрын
What about just making express lanes thag travel through the city, bypassing local traffic for those just passing through?
@johns.82206 ай бұрын
Here in the USA this is an unfortunate reality as well. Can't tell you how many times I've seen people clamor for the widening of a congested road or building a new one altogether. And then every. Single. Time. It gets worse. A 4-lane road that sucks becomes a 6-lane road that sucks. And the "bypass" doesn't bypass jack shit, because it inevitably gets just as bad as what it was supposed to bypass. The idea of enabling alternate modes of transportation is the only thing that comes close to a long-term solution for congestion, but it is such a hateful idea to most Americans. After enough pressure cities will sometimes throw some token money at a crappy little bus system or something that inevitably fails so the carbrains can say "sEe iT dOeSn'T woRk!!1!!" We are stuck in a cycle of car dependency that won't stop until our cities are bankrupt and blighted off the map. Even then they'll be clamoring for just 1 more lane and opposing bike lanes and buses.
@JimmySailor2 ай бұрын
Yes you need mass transit, but the same paradox applies. The reality is that whatever transportation system you use will inevitably become congested as long as the city continues to grow, which is a good thing. So the choice is to grow or not. “Back to normal levels” in this case being more commuters arriving at roughly the same speed as before. Unfortunately this doesn’t appeal to existing city dwellers, because Growth is always bad for them. Increasing their rent/hassle/competition. So selling existing tax payers on growth is always full of some deceit.
@krystynaweston9317
2 ай бұрын
Growth will always pose challenges. Better to have more public transport, shared transport and active transport options than more cars which are mostly single occupancy/driver only.
@TheFirebird123456
2 ай бұрын
Kind of. Really it becomes an equilibrium where people will get to their destination at the same time regardless of transit method.
@michaelmorgan342123 күн бұрын
What is a mobility planner in transit and what do they do
@rohitnirmal1024 Жыл бұрын
Same at every public administration
@zaclegend1324 ай бұрын
Hell yeah Brisbane being kept alive by the construction industry!!!
@Rosa-lv8yw4 ай бұрын
Rozelle Interchange
@hopehoping6 ай бұрын
This is Rozelle, right?
@jarrethcutestoryАй бұрын
You know you are dealing with a complete Wayne Kerr when they call something a "game changer".
@woodennecktie2 ай бұрын
planning is like predicting a sif will keep water ... in time
@janicehipperson64435 ай бұрын
Coomera Connector is what they’re talking about.
@dala556822 күн бұрын
Was this filmed at Sheffield City Clowncil?
@dereklush9399 Жыл бұрын
Who the heck are you and why are you making such top notch content
@zipidi
Жыл бұрын
Mobility consultants and made this edit from an Australian satirical show, Utopia.It's now on Netflix, www.netflix.com/au/title/80063251?s=i&trkid=258593161&vlang=en&clip=81440235
@jamesperkins191
Жыл бұрын
The Working Dog team are veteran Aussie Comedy creators. They've done sketch comedy - the D-Generation and The Late Show; media satire - Frontline; Films including The Castle and The Dish; And government comedies like Hollowmen and this one - Utopia. Seriously, they've been at it for 40 years now!
@mrookeward
Жыл бұрын
@@jamesperkins191 "The Hollowmen"
@jamesperkins191
Жыл бұрын
@@mrookeward Damn autocorrect, thanks!
@stuartzoo2 ай бұрын
“I knew AI would turn out to be a bunch of greenies.” 😂 We call them “granolas” in the US
@sidneymonteiro36705 ай бұрын
What is the name of this show and what streaming service carries it in the USA?
@itube0047
4 ай бұрын
Utopia. Can't find it here either (Europe). Since Australia was initially made up of thieves.. I'm not saying you should, I'm just informing you on the origins.
@last_name3143 Жыл бұрын
Utopia actually hurts to watch
@CatnamedMittensАй бұрын
Isnt it 0 sum, because other roads will see less traffic?
@JT29501 Жыл бұрын
This is all fine and very clever, but just remember not to pretend that induced demand doesn't exist in other areas as well - if you aren't careful going down this road can lead to a defeatist "build nothing" attitude that will inevitably lead to national stagnation, higher prices and poverty. House prices would be a good example - "if you build it they will come", and you'll need to build yet more houses - but that doesn't mean you shouldn't build at all, as the alternative is often going to be homelessness in any sort of growing population. Even the "lefty greeny" option of more public transport is very susceptible to induced demand as well. Here in London the new Elizabeth Line is packed full already most mornings, and new housing developments are going up along its route to take advantage of its quicker links all the time. This isn't a bad thing necessarily, its growth! It just needs to be factored in when building new infrastructure. Of course population of a city (and demand) won't necessarily go up forever, but it's pretty fair to say that in a great majority it will tend to increase as much as local infrastructure allows.. and then quite a bit more!
@shraka
Жыл бұрын
A train line can carry easily carry 60,000 passengers an hour though - while a freeway lane can do max 2,400 - and that's in perfect conditions. You build a 4 lane freeway and you'll get congestion at around 9,600 passengers an hour. A train line already has a smaller foot print and is casually running at 1/6th it's max passengers at that usage. Chuck in an advanced automated Metro on that same train line and you can get up to 90,000 passenger an hour. Train lines are just so much better for scale.
@JT29501
Жыл бұрын
@@shraka Yeah I don't disagree, I live near the Victoria line for instance, which I'm reliably informed is one of the most efficient metro lines in the world! I'm just saying to be careful when making the argument that people using infrastructure means it has failed, because I see it a lot already with the newly opened Elizabeth line, and also with opposition to other train lines like HS2.. it's quite amazing really, people oppose infrastructure both because they have decided it's not needed, but also it's somehow going to be completely full.
@shraka
Жыл бұрын
@@JT29501 I see. I think of it in terms of what the alternative is. Adding a lane to a freeway that results in more traffic jams within a year or two is a terrible use of resources because spending that same money on improving rail would have been much more effective use of money. A fully utilised train line also has way better long term ROI, so yeah a fully utilised train is a good thing.
@drg86877 ай бұрын
How can you watch this show in the US?
@zipidi
7 ай бұрын
Try this link iview.abc.net.au/show/utopia. You may need a VPN. Good luck! The show is incredibly painfully, funny!
@pizzaki582 Жыл бұрын
I honestly can't watch this, it hurt's to much.
@johnmunro4952 Жыл бұрын
This is like Apollo 13!
@conorkirbymacguill6 ай бұрын
nice to see Andy Mathews and Naomi Higgins in their engineering element
@yayc85915 ай бұрын
Some guy called Jevon's 😂😂😂
@mutyalammapalemps8925 ай бұрын
Can they give drivers money out of 300 B to travel through others roads
@marcbiff21922 ай бұрын
"Mass Transit" in other words transport for the plebs.
@nathanbutcher77202 ай бұрын
"How do we launch this?" - the guy knows the issue is impossible to solve ahead of time, he only cares about the optics and how it is sold to the public.
@thepcfd4 ай бұрын
its still doesnt make much sense like if it will be stuck after 5 years does that means there is more vehicles? and if yes wouldnt that make old model worse.
@OsmaroAcosta2 ай бұрын
1000 terabytes man, EACH!!!
@wilfdarr4 ай бұрын
"So there is a margin for error..."
@samuelforsyth6374 Жыл бұрын
productive output? of no mention in that room haha
@mrme371722 күн бұрын
"where did the green go ' ? 😂😂😂
@MartinPittBradley2 ай бұрын
I’m not a right winger, but induced demand was a flimsy study. Alternative hypothesis: Since they only studied large cities, those improvements were so overdue that the new capacity was inadequate.
@qp9vp5 ай бұрын
Have not seen the show but I work at a major city. Im guessing that the suits in the beginning are politicians? Conservative id guess. This is how they reason. And the woman in white reason as 99% of all civil servants in my country. You would have to look for a long time to find any civil servants that would suggest building more roads because, WE KNOW THAT WON'T SOLVE ANY PROBLEMS. Trains, trams, buses, bikes and WALKING. Give me a green city!
@Omertahun19 күн бұрын
in London, every route is crap. Once google map finds out that one route is NOT 100% fucked, it sends the entire traffic through that way so it will be the most fucked up route. There is no way out. It was horrible before GPS, its horrible with GPS. And then the people who try to outsmart googlemap, realize that a route is not better only from the GPS not sending them that way. Sometimes it does happen though, that you keep ignoring googlemap and suddenly, for a very brief time, you find yourself on no mans land, no cars, no traffic and you can glide like a buttered dildo. than the AI is cathching up and its all fucked again.
@catastrophe22735 ай бұрын
And then they all realised using a bike was faster.
@SoFarSoBook2 ай бұрын
One word: T R A I N S
@scottburton78836 ай бұрын
#Rozelleinterchange
@TheRadFactor27 күн бұрын
2:38 😂😂
@B00kman Жыл бұрын
This is all purple. Bro, I feel your printer problems.
@RobertDavies-ky7rzАй бұрын
Made a lot of money off the government already retaired at 59
@rbaxter28625 күн бұрын
Utopia is the best ABC series that has been pretty much ignored by the US, and that is a shame considering the drivel it has managed to pick up on, like the execrable US Office. At least the US IT Crowd pilot thankfully died quietly. But, never waste your time UNDERestimating the intelligence of the US ..., just ask Duh-Nald.
@devarmont876 ай бұрын
Brisbane 👍🏽 This city is a psychologically dysfunctional Band-aid fix of a "city". Nothing will ever come good of it. Hey let's spend 2billion on upgrading a stadium with 6000 seats 😅 Hey let's build a tunnel for trains, and got 4x over the budget Hey let's build a spider web of overpasses near the hospital which are ugly and useless in 4 major directions... You cannot get from - 1) Bowen Hills mayne Rd to Gympie rd north (must take tunnel) 2) Gympie rd northbound to Abbotsford Rd Bowen Hills northbound. Must go long way 3) south bound Gympie rd to Abbotsford Rd again... - it's a giant concrete spiderweb of shite with a boral plant that only directs in a few ways... 😅 Dysfunctional and stoopid 😅
@deirdrawilson-anderson6571 Жыл бұрын
Lolz I got stuck in traffic
@trevorzzealley2670 Жыл бұрын
Government/Corporate at the helm , means A I is involved . Arrogance & Ignorance . Yeah
Пікірлер: 256
"Do I have to be there myself?" "You were supposed to be there." "I got stuck in traffic" 😂😂
@derser541
3 ай бұрын
We know, we watched the video.
As a mobility planner working in transit, this is the reason I don't watch Utopia. I already see too much of this in my real world!
@kyletopfer7818
Жыл бұрын
Yeah but is Jevons Paradox really also the same in your field? I know it namely from mine in environmental science, where productivity gains from improved efficiency lead to overall growth in aggregate production.
@C0deH0wler
Жыл бұрын
@@kyletopfer7818 Honestly, this 'version' of it in the video is a bastardisation for automobiles. With trains, for example, you will get more revenue to increase frequencies. Which will encourage more people to live closer to stations, and if the agency is a developer/landlord of adjacent property... more revenue to improve services! And as a bonus, more energy efficiency per capita... saving people money they can invest instead. Sure, you could value capture an increase in motorists with a congestion tax, whilst you continue to expand, but you will continue to demolish houses (that pay property tax), people will commute longer (increasing total maintance needed), and will likely ruin metro centres even further. And guess what a lot of suburbs use to slow down their decay? Metro centres! Ruining them will make things worse... If you were to increase the congestion tax as value capture method - instead of a way to manage congestion on adequate roads, ideally with active & public transport investments (but I think it would still would do good even without these) - to meet these... a lot less would drive, defeating this weird policy I made up. Society is subsidising driving, in my offered situation and right now. And, subsidise in a very ruiness way, eating slowly away at society itself, instead of having a net positive BCR. Tho, worth pointing out that this stuff is more about the tendency to continue to expand. Stuff is less worse when expanding a few select, sparse roads into four lanes. To create a sparse arterial network, with a few sparse large intersections, like you find in the Netherlands. This type of stuff would usually have a net positive BCR, but not really that high.
@kyletopfer7818
Жыл бұрын
@@C0deH0wler whilst I agree with alot of the core of your argument, it comes across a neoliberalist capitalist take, and I assume you were focusing on those arguments because you think they're more likely to persuade people who otherwise wouldn't listen to what for me is the key. Namely the energy andsoace efficiency, the better places, the access to jobs and places of interest for less well-off families, and the climate and ecological impacts.
@jamesperkins191
Жыл бұрын
@@kyletopfer7818 ABSOLUTELY. My dad is an economist, he was working on sims for planning out City Link and other freeway expansions in the early 90s. The corridors need to be secured DECADES before you actually need them, to provide extra slack in the system due to Jevon's Paradox. I was like 12 at the time, so I loved the joke for personal nostalgia reasons along with everything else. ❤️ Jevon himself was an economist in the era of the Industrial Revolution, so we've known about the problem in various ways for more than 150 years!
@rodgerhempfing2921
Жыл бұрын
More buses needed
This is not comedy. This is therapy for public servants. You wouldn't want to laugh. You'd want to punch the tv.
@awf6554
Жыл бұрын
Yep. I can't really watch it.
@timconnors
Жыл бұрын
I still have the last season, unwatched, waiting for me on my disk. I was a APS public servant and it was too hard to watch. An episode would take me 3 weeks to watch, having to pause it and bury my head in my hands every 3 minutes before running off to do something more fun, because it was way too much like a combination of work and watching the news.
@Dudemon-1
Ай бұрын
It's really true, without exaggeration. Younger people have this starry-eyed view of government vs private-sector. I've worked in both, and the amount of money taken from taxpayers and used to make things worse is astonishing.
@nilloc93
26 күн бұрын
Public servants are 1/2 the problem. Embedded bureaucrats who are more interested in making their job more important than actually accomplishing anything. They're the ones who make up the stupid rules that make any government project take 3X as long as require 50 extra administrators to install a street lamp.
This is when they'll just hire consultants to tell them what they want to hear and then can blame them when it inevitably ends in a parliamentary inquiry.
@unematrix
6 ай бұрын
They had a scene where that exact thing happened :D
@smalltime0
3 ай бұрын
@@unematrix lol, I think their line was "What do you want the report to say?"
@sakr-el-bahr272
Ай бұрын
Think Rozelle Interchange.
"Have you ever heard of the Jevons Paradox?" "I was hoping it was a death metal band" As an economist this line made me splutter out my coffee.
X: I thought we were going to be data driven? Y: The data doesn't know what it's doing. Lamentably familiar to anyone working with data.
The WA Labor minister for transport was being interviewed for the 6pm news with the newly opened freeway widening behind him. When asked about traffic implement he informed the reporter that “problem is when the travel gets better more people use the road and it clogs up” It was laugh your ass off TV.
@zipidi
2 ай бұрын
I’m trying to find the quote. Do you know which channel and date?
@glennsmethurst2235
2 ай бұрын
@@zipidi it would have been 4 years ago, north bound freeway widening of Kwinana freeway at South street. 6pm news covered it , commercial MSM.
@Dudemon-1
Ай бұрын
The thing is, even though it's clogged, there are more people choosing to use it. They make tge choice as to whether it's worth it, so there's an improvement.
"I knew AI was a bunch of greenies" My sides immediately died after this RIP
@cathiemarvellous
Жыл бұрын
"I got stuck in traffic" was what got me.
@nunyabidness3075
Жыл бұрын
It’s true though. Amazingly true. Everyone in Academia knows how to fix a study, and that most of them are not objective. Also, I spent most of my career in tech. Near the end I figured out that most of the “progress” from the late 80’s to present day had really been speeding up the process of garbage in, garbage out. We made it so that idiots could use more tools, but the tools haven’t really improved so much as they have just gotten prettier. So, that AI is just reflecting what it was fed. Induced demand theory doesn’t gain or lose any validity because a computer applies it. What’s most amazing is the very people who will scream how absolutely true it is will deny the underlying principle and vice versa because it’s not convenient to their “side”.
@CatatonicImperfect
Жыл бұрын
@@nunyabidness3075 That's why I don't like science. What's it ever done for us? Now the middle ages, there's a way to live.
@nunyabidness3075
Жыл бұрын
@@CatatonicImperfect 🤣😂🤣
@liam3284
Жыл бұрын
People miss the point, in Australia, induced demand can be counted as "vehicles per household".
This is one of the funniest and most accurate things I've ever seen, like a modern Autralian match for Yes Minister 😂
@Myne1001
Жыл бұрын
Utopia and Hollowmen were really good shows
@seanslater
Жыл бұрын
@@Myne1001 New season of Utopia coming this year!
@TheRealJavahead
Жыл бұрын
I actually felt nauseated and angry watching this. I’ve worked with people like that. Yes, it was in Canberra.
@sirt8684
Жыл бұрын
@@TheRealJavahead my wife too with current vic govt
@shraka
Жыл бұрын
@@TheRealJavahead Same.
This is so accurate I actually feel physically ill
Jesus Christ this is just humor applied to 100% real shit. I love it. Anyone who has worked in this kind of stuff knows this. Very well written.
@MichelleWardley
10 ай бұрын
Realistic Satire...
In 1984, I took a course at a world-famous university titled, "Computer Aided Design in Environmental Systems". 1/3 of the class was traffic engineering, so we learned of this principle very quickly. Ten years later, a newspaper article quoted a head traffic engineer near the shore as saying, "We didn't realize more people would start using [the bypass] once it was built and made it faster to get to the beach!" That was when it really clicked for ne that the people actually making the decisions are often not the smartest ones.
@micheljavert5923
Ай бұрын
The people making the decisions are not the people taking those classes. They just know they saw/heard about a shiny fancy new thing that sounds good. And they want it for themselves.
This is too much like my reality. We produced a proposal spec for a project with £60m of benefits, the powers-that-be said £100m would be better. They made us put down £100m and then work backwards to get that outcome. The final spec wasnt worth the paper it was written on but got approved because it said £100m. In 9 months I'll probably be in for a reaming because we're £40m short
@petehill3634
6 ай бұрын
Bahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha - great comment and you're right about the reaming unfortunately
@SirJonathonDanielGregorySrVthe
4 ай бұрын
It's been nine months.
@BiscuitBoi936
4 ай бұрын
@SirJonathonDanielGregorySrVthe yeah I pretty much nailed it, only thing I missed was how many times I'd have to write the same information across briefing notes, quarterly performance updates and management information reports
You see, they just didn't add enough lanes. THE ANSWER IS ALWAYS MORE LANES!🤪
@thegoat5141
3 ай бұрын
One more lane bro
“The data doesn’t know what it’s doing.” Incredible
Yes. The Sydney Harbour Tunnel was great. For a few years.
@uncletiggermclaren7592
Жыл бұрын
Does anyone even use it other than tourists?. I was there all those years ago when they built the Eastern Distributor, and the relentless hype and over-runs and delays . . . and then it turned the streets into a siht-show. Absolute chaos, and questions asked in Parliament and every single Sydney road user KNEW it was a disaster and yet the entire time the spin-doctors ran their mouths telling everyone it was great.
@sylviaelse5086
Жыл бұрын
@@uncletiggermclaren7592 The tunnel and the Eastern Distributor get plenty of use. But the Utopia episode is correct. You cannot build your way out of road congestion.
@uncletiggermclaren7592
6 ай бұрын
Nah, never credit to malignancy, what might be credited to stupidity. ONE person might think to themself "I will push this project, because it is going to increase congestion, which will force people to move, or use public transport* and that is my real hidden aim". But TWO people, more than two?. A secret known to two people, is no secret at all. They would never dare be so obvious, because they would be pillared when it came out, and it always comes out. And tourists use things because they are not from there, and know no better. The tunnel speeds you out of the city . . . except it leads you right into the eternal congestion of the Cahill Expressway, and DOUBLES the traffic that goes out and jams at Woolloomooloo. It has never been as effective as they promised, because it LEADS into congestion. ( Spoilers, ALL their traffic ideas run into the fact that Sydney is constantly congested. )@trapd00rspider
This isn't comedy satire, it's a documentary.
Don't laugh. I worked for the government. So much money wasted, nothing achieved but what is most important is what bin you throw your rubbish into.
So that's the reason why they are building a network of mass transport lanes in the city, to remove the congestion. Been to Brisbane this year and found that they were building a mass transport option using buses to get people around.
This show is really good at slowly burning me up into a smouldering pile of ash.
Huh, Jevons paradox. I just learned something new today.
I love that they’re in Brisbane but their modelling is on Melbourne
@jarrethcutestory
11 ай бұрын
They are based in Melbourne?
@froggy0162
7 ай бұрын
It’s set in Melbourne - the office shots are the top of Spring St on the corner of Nicholson.
@devarmont87
6 ай бұрын
Probably part of the incompetent satire. Councillor - "which city are we in again?"
@darrenrobinson9041
6 ай бұрын
Brisbane doesn't have traffic lights yet.
@devarmont87
6 ай бұрын
@@darrenrobinson9041 we are still arguing whether to name it Brisbane or Meanjin.
We have such great freeways around Phoenix, Arizona, USA, drivers enjoy driving the wrong way until the inattentive other motorists get in the way.
Roads, never get cost benefit, transit, always gets one with unfavourable assumptions.
That fact that this is so close to reality makes my blood boil.
The better you make it, the more people will use it; means you are getting your money's worth out of your improvements
It is a temporary decongestion, I can get that from cough syrup.😂
WestConnex took nearly 5 months to become red on the gardners rd exit.
I wish more Americans could grasp the concept of induced demand. Unfortunately I think this video would fly over most of their heads.
@chickennoodle6620
Жыл бұрын
Bro, just one more lane. Will definitely solve traffic.
@ChristopherHalbersma
Жыл бұрын
Most Americans live in places not dense enough to experience it. You can put a 20 lane highway through Kansas, nobody is coming to drive on it.
@captainpoppleton
Жыл бұрын
Public transport is awful. Firstly you have to share with the public. Have you ever met the public ? You are at the mercy of timetables which can change at any time with no notice. You have to wait IN THE RAIN for the bus to show up. If you are catching a bus at night sometimes the driver can't actually see you in the bus stop AND KEEPS DRIVING PAST. You are at the mercy of unions, vandals, planned maintenance and unexpected breakdowns. It is no cheaper to pay the fare than to drive a car. A car can get you somewhere in 5 minutes but public transport will take you 30 minutes. Bottom line - Keep building roads or I will vote for the other mob.
@pakxenon
Жыл бұрын
@@captainpoppleton Not sure if satire but lol car expensive. you have to first own one. then maintain it. and buy insurance. and fuel it with big oil. then your suburb taxes don't even cover the sewage pipes running under the roads they're attached to in addition to power lines and asphault cracks. then ya gotta walk through a dangerous parking lot at whatever mall you're going to. then your car breaks down and now you can't go to work and now you don't have money to fix your car.
@abhi211-T
Жыл бұрын
@@captainpoppleton Sounds like you live in a place with terrible public transport. I’m pretty sure you don’t live in the Netherlands.
It'd be funny if the reality wasn't that they knocked my childhood home down for this shit.
Ronda is brilliant.
Its a supercomputer that can predict outcomes with 99% accuracy. God:"Damn that's impressive."
@jena.alexia
7 ай бұрын
Not another super computer. 😭
Rhonda I love you!!! You are so REAL
Excellent show...
Steven Miles currently suggesting a road tunnel from Carseldine to Kedron to "solve" congestion.
The directors of this episode should be ashamed of themselves. The guy who wanted to data, actually wanted to use his pipes!
@Sagittarius-81
2 жыл бұрын
Having said that, I still want more from this show. Get every disappointed participant to get some vengeance. Show them Mercy.
@Sagittarius-81
2 жыл бұрын
Lights. Action. Showtime. Give that guy another go.
@jjsc4396
Жыл бұрын
Lay off the crack pipe mate.
I always want to give Rhonda a slap, and I'm not even a violent person.
@reillysomething5507
2 жыл бұрын
Kitty Flanagan does a great job of playing her
@earth-air-water-fire-aether
Жыл бұрын
Then slap yourself honey, because all you see is something within yourself.
@julianwalls1077
9 ай бұрын
What is scarely is there are Rhondas out there!😀
This is HILARIOUS!
@wakelamp
2 ай бұрын
Does it work better in countries where there are referendums on new infrastructure?
This is fantastic. I'm off to Netflix!
LOL!! The most hilarious part of this show, is that most of it is all too true!!
1:48 😂 I'm hoping they're a death metal band
@MrScrofulous
2 ай бұрын
Math-core, as it turned out.
The good think: At some point, it's stop getting worse. You only need to wait until it's faster to walk (assuming cycling an public transit would need to use the same congested roads).
Brilliant
If you're going to spend a lot of money to try and improve transit times and reduce road traffic then for the love of god JUST BUILT PUBLIC TRANSPORT NETWORKS! Buses might move slowly but they're 1 vehicle and can carry thousands of passengers per day, many of which would previously have been using individual cars. Do the same with trains for longer distances and before you know it you've reduced car usage immensely.
Build more roads, you get more traffic. Need to put caps on who can be on the road at peak times…..gov: no, we prefer everyone to fight with each other for road space….it’s a dog eat dog world, and a free market economy means we can’t make rules to stop it. By having more cars on the road than it can support, we make sure people use more petrol, which means more trips to the petrol station, which means more excise tax collected plus GST added on. So therefore we can’t afford to not have traffic.
@jamesperkins191
Жыл бұрын
Just no.
@shraka
Жыл бұрын
Naw it's just that they're short sighted and putting in PT scares them. The solutions are easy from a design and budget perspective: Light and heavy rail, bike paths, sending cars around the long way, more walkability. Done. The ideal models for this are all well understood, if done right they cost WAY less in the long run, and they're only hard to implement because people are scared of change and politicians are spineless.
@sergarlantyrell7847
6 ай бұрын
Yeah, but most caps, come in the form of congestion charges and so discriminate based on income.
Data driven working, and I am a data scientist
"enoughl talk, let the algorithm speak"
After yet again being delayed by qld rail the algorithm has once again nailed my views
gold
Talk about "Jevons Paradox" and watch as peoples eyes slowly glaze over...
@darrenrobinson9041
6 ай бұрын
So the logic is that there is no point building stuff because the stupid public will just use it ?
@dzello
6 ай бұрын
@@darrenrobinson9041 Nah, that's not the point. Car transit is inefficient transit so when you add car infrastructure (like lanes), you just get more inefficient transit. If you want to impove transit, you need to go from cars to something more efficient: walking, biking, bus, trains, etc. So if you have inefficient car traffic, you add an efficient train line, and that improves overall transit for a long while. It's why Tokyo has the population of Canada yet has good mobility: insanely efficient urbanism.
@thunderspark1536
14 күн бұрын
@@darrenrobinson9041 Adding on to what the other guy said, it's not something you can EVER fix with cars alone anyway. it's simple physics, they are too space inefficient.
Does anyone else see the resemblance of Celia Pacquola and Kelly Macdonald? I love them both!
❤❤❤
When the legislature is in session, nobody is safe.
Brilliant... Just like our HS2 railway here in the UK. ☮️💚🍻
What about just making express lanes thag travel through the city, bypassing local traffic for those just passing through?
Here in the USA this is an unfortunate reality as well. Can't tell you how many times I've seen people clamor for the widening of a congested road or building a new one altogether. And then every. Single. Time. It gets worse. A 4-lane road that sucks becomes a 6-lane road that sucks. And the "bypass" doesn't bypass jack shit, because it inevitably gets just as bad as what it was supposed to bypass. The idea of enabling alternate modes of transportation is the only thing that comes close to a long-term solution for congestion, but it is such a hateful idea to most Americans. After enough pressure cities will sometimes throw some token money at a crappy little bus system or something that inevitably fails so the carbrains can say "sEe iT dOeSn'T woRk!!1!!" We are stuck in a cycle of car dependency that won't stop until our cities are bankrupt and blighted off the map. Even then they'll be clamoring for just 1 more lane and opposing bike lanes and buses.
Yes you need mass transit, but the same paradox applies. The reality is that whatever transportation system you use will inevitably become congested as long as the city continues to grow, which is a good thing. So the choice is to grow or not. “Back to normal levels” in this case being more commuters arriving at roughly the same speed as before. Unfortunately this doesn’t appeal to existing city dwellers, because Growth is always bad for them. Increasing their rent/hassle/competition. So selling existing tax payers on growth is always full of some deceit.
@krystynaweston9317
2 ай бұрын
Growth will always pose challenges. Better to have more public transport, shared transport and active transport options than more cars which are mostly single occupancy/driver only.
@TheFirebird123456
2 ай бұрын
Kind of. Really it becomes an equilibrium where people will get to their destination at the same time regardless of transit method.
What is a mobility planner in transit and what do they do
Same at every public administration
Hell yeah Brisbane being kept alive by the construction industry!!!
Rozelle Interchange
This is Rozelle, right?
You know you are dealing with a complete Wayne Kerr when they call something a "game changer".
planning is like predicting a sif will keep water ... in time
Coomera Connector is what they’re talking about.
Was this filmed at Sheffield City Clowncil?
Who the heck are you and why are you making such top notch content
@zipidi
Жыл бұрын
Mobility consultants and made this edit from an Australian satirical show, Utopia.It's now on Netflix, www.netflix.com/au/title/80063251?s=i&trkid=258593161&vlang=en&clip=81440235
@jamesperkins191
Жыл бұрын
The Working Dog team are veteran Aussie Comedy creators. They've done sketch comedy - the D-Generation and The Late Show; media satire - Frontline; Films including The Castle and The Dish; And government comedies like Hollowmen and this one - Utopia. Seriously, they've been at it for 40 years now!
@mrookeward
Жыл бұрын
@@jamesperkins191 "The Hollowmen"
@jamesperkins191
Жыл бұрын
@@mrookeward Damn autocorrect, thanks!
“I knew AI would turn out to be a bunch of greenies.” 😂 We call them “granolas” in the US
What is the name of this show and what streaming service carries it in the USA?
@itube0047
4 ай бұрын
Utopia. Can't find it here either (Europe). Since Australia was initially made up of thieves.. I'm not saying you should, I'm just informing you on the origins.
Utopia actually hurts to watch
Isnt it 0 sum, because other roads will see less traffic?
This is all fine and very clever, but just remember not to pretend that induced demand doesn't exist in other areas as well - if you aren't careful going down this road can lead to a defeatist "build nothing" attitude that will inevitably lead to national stagnation, higher prices and poverty. House prices would be a good example - "if you build it they will come", and you'll need to build yet more houses - but that doesn't mean you shouldn't build at all, as the alternative is often going to be homelessness in any sort of growing population. Even the "lefty greeny" option of more public transport is very susceptible to induced demand as well. Here in London the new Elizabeth Line is packed full already most mornings, and new housing developments are going up along its route to take advantage of its quicker links all the time. This isn't a bad thing necessarily, its growth! It just needs to be factored in when building new infrastructure. Of course population of a city (and demand) won't necessarily go up forever, but it's pretty fair to say that in a great majority it will tend to increase as much as local infrastructure allows.. and then quite a bit more!
@shraka
Жыл бұрын
A train line can carry easily carry 60,000 passengers an hour though - while a freeway lane can do max 2,400 - and that's in perfect conditions. You build a 4 lane freeway and you'll get congestion at around 9,600 passengers an hour. A train line already has a smaller foot print and is casually running at 1/6th it's max passengers at that usage. Chuck in an advanced automated Metro on that same train line and you can get up to 90,000 passenger an hour. Train lines are just so much better for scale.
@JT29501
Жыл бұрын
@@shraka Yeah I don't disagree, I live near the Victoria line for instance, which I'm reliably informed is one of the most efficient metro lines in the world! I'm just saying to be careful when making the argument that people using infrastructure means it has failed, because I see it a lot already with the newly opened Elizabeth line, and also with opposition to other train lines like HS2.. it's quite amazing really, people oppose infrastructure both because they have decided it's not needed, but also it's somehow going to be completely full.
@shraka
Жыл бұрын
@@JT29501 I see. I think of it in terms of what the alternative is. Adding a lane to a freeway that results in more traffic jams within a year or two is a terrible use of resources because spending that same money on improving rail would have been much more effective use of money. A fully utilised train line also has way better long term ROI, so yeah a fully utilised train is a good thing.
How can you watch this show in the US?
@zipidi
7 ай бұрын
Try this link iview.abc.net.au/show/utopia. You may need a VPN. Good luck! The show is incredibly painfully, funny!
I honestly can't watch this, it hurt's to much.
This is like Apollo 13!
nice to see Andy Mathews and Naomi Higgins in their engineering element
Some guy called Jevon's 😂😂😂
Can they give drivers money out of 300 B to travel through others roads
"Mass Transit" in other words transport for the plebs.
"How do we launch this?" - the guy knows the issue is impossible to solve ahead of time, he only cares about the optics and how it is sold to the public.
its still doesnt make much sense like if it will be stuck after 5 years does that means there is more vehicles? and if yes wouldnt that make old model worse.
1000 terabytes man, EACH!!!
"So there is a margin for error..."
productive output? of no mention in that room haha
"where did the green go ' ? 😂😂😂
I’m not a right winger, but induced demand was a flimsy study. Alternative hypothesis: Since they only studied large cities, those improvements were so overdue that the new capacity was inadequate.
Have not seen the show but I work at a major city. Im guessing that the suits in the beginning are politicians? Conservative id guess. This is how they reason. And the woman in white reason as 99% of all civil servants in my country. You would have to look for a long time to find any civil servants that would suggest building more roads because, WE KNOW THAT WON'T SOLVE ANY PROBLEMS. Trains, trams, buses, bikes and WALKING. Give me a green city!
in London, every route is crap. Once google map finds out that one route is NOT 100% fucked, it sends the entire traffic through that way so it will be the most fucked up route. There is no way out. It was horrible before GPS, its horrible with GPS. And then the people who try to outsmart googlemap, realize that a route is not better only from the GPS not sending them that way. Sometimes it does happen though, that you keep ignoring googlemap and suddenly, for a very brief time, you find yourself on no mans land, no cars, no traffic and you can glide like a buttered dildo. than the AI is cathching up and its all fucked again.
And then they all realised using a bike was faster.
One word: T R A I N S
#Rozelleinterchange
2:38 😂😂
This is all purple. Bro, I feel your printer problems.
Made a lot of money off the government already retaired at 59
Utopia is the best ABC series that has been pretty much ignored by the US, and that is a shame considering the drivel it has managed to pick up on, like the execrable US Office. At least the US IT Crowd pilot thankfully died quietly. But, never waste your time UNDERestimating the intelligence of the US ..., just ask Duh-Nald.
Brisbane 👍🏽 This city is a psychologically dysfunctional Band-aid fix of a "city". Nothing will ever come good of it. Hey let's spend 2billion on upgrading a stadium with 6000 seats 😅 Hey let's build a tunnel for trains, and got 4x over the budget Hey let's build a spider web of overpasses near the hospital which are ugly and useless in 4 major directions... You cannot get from - 1) Bowen Hills mayne Rd to Gympie rd north (must take tunnel) 2) Gympie rd northbound to Abbotsford Rd Bowen Hills northbound. Must go long way 3) south bound Gympie rd to Abbotsford Rd again... - it's a giant concrete spiderweb of shite with a boral plant that only directs in a few ways... 😅 Dysfunctional and stoopid 😅
Lolz I got stuck in traffic
Government/Corporate at the helm , means A I is involved . Arrogance & Ignorance . Yeah
NZ National party in a nutshell.
Karens fix everything