inventing a new bad suspension is the first step to inventing a new fantastic suspension.

@furtivedig

Жыл бұрын

Do you work at Ferrari by chance?

@jckf

Жыл бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/ealsu8uNlbifiLg.html

@flyingby3703

Жыл бұрын

You skipped the steps of new less bad suspension, new mediocre suspension, new kinda ok-ish suspension and new decent suspension. Suspension is wizardry.

@Roguescienceguy

Жыл бұрын

Agreed. The Porsche 911 was a terrible concept to begin with and look at what it is now😂

@killsalot78

Жыл бұрын

reinventing the wheel is how you put the cart before the horse, especially when you're trying to take the perfected round wheel and make them into squares. this video would only be a first step for the primitive technology guy

We don’t do things because they are easy, we do things because we thought they would be easy

@AlbertLamarque

Жыл бұрын

Or did not have the foresight to know how hard they would be

@oldschoolman1444

Жыл бұрын

Ha Ha, good one! 😅

@InNeedOfSpeed

Жыл бұрын

Or because somebody said it couldn't be done

@ryanb3731

Жыл бұрын

@@AlbertLamarque nah man

@LunarLaker

Жыл бұрын

We do not do things because they are hard, but because they are Harder Drives ™

Maybe it would be good to put a balisticprotected steelplate behind the seats. So you don't get it mounted to your spinal in an accident. You know Matt, we can't live with you, and not without you ❤

@awesomecronk7183

Жыл бұрын

That's a damn good idea lol

the mathard bar looks perfect for buckeling during cornering sending you upside down into a tree perhaps even on fire

@anglegrinder

Жыл бұрын

As long as the Wendy’s is ok

@thomasriley5675

Жыл бұрын

all hail the fo fo fo

@zeitgeist57

Жыл бұрын

Do you KNOW that, or do you BELIEVE that? There's a difference....Believing is Engineering.

@wowgabber123

Жыл бұрын

@@zeitgeist57 I believe that long sticks under load might send you into a Wendy's

@jonathangehman4005

Жыл бұрын

If your suspicion(suspecting is not engineering you know), every Wendy's would be piled up with big heavy, upside down Nascar stockers. That is my belief

'Suspension geography' had me rolling. Super interesting stuff.

@96gts

Ай бұрын

Matt's deadpan delivery is fantastic for jokes like these.

That was the the best combination of informative and hilarious I have seen since the golden era of This Old Tony. Well done.

@jesse1136

Жыл бұрын

You'd think there would be so many more hilarious engineering channels.

@Zander10102

Жыл бұрын

The golden era of tot is still happening, friend

@matthewthemanparker

Жыл бұрын

@@Zander10102 Quality is still there, quantity has gone way done though.

@pilotdog68

9 ай бұрын

My knowledge of suspension design comes entirely from these videos, and the videos of Matt's Offroad Recovery. I cannot imagine any more completely opposite philosophies to suspension design. Both named Matt.

One of the few creators where I'm laughing out loud during the sponsored content. That's awesome.

@bobroberts2371

Жыл бұрын

Did anyone catch the irony of point 4 on the box flap?

@SuperfastMatt

Жыл бұрын

I noticed it.

@thejerkyshack8040

Жыл бұрын

@@bobroberts2371the less our food contributes to the problem the more our cars can.

@bobroberts2371

Жыл бұрын

@@thejerkyshack8040 Does the food also reduce methane emissions?

@thejerkyshack8040

Жыл бұрын

@@bobroberts2371 no that’s why we should all be vegan duh

The worst part of these videos, is the inability to leave more than one thumbs up. 👍👍

@ihdieselman

Жыл бұрын

Humm I've been able to do it several times you just can't leave an even number of thumbs up so you'll have to borrow someone's thumb.

@shanepowers7566

Жыл бұрын

I agree.

I was promised 💩 jokes. I only got 1 poop joke. 😞

@loadedzune

Жыл бұрын

For some reason I cannot make a new comment. So here is my only option. To get more ground clearance while still maintaining a very strong axle option is portel axles. They allow a roughly 10 in drop from axle to wheel hub at the wheel hub instead of over the width of the axle

@kschleic9053

Жыл бұрын

You were promised a balance of engineering, ADHD, and poop jokes. The poop joke was solid and must have been worth at least 1-3 ADHD episodes.

@gavster89

Жыл бұрын

Portal axles also have a gear reduction in them like a low range gearbox

@steveodea4884

11 ай бұрын

@@gavster89 they can have but don't have to have any change in ratio

"So essentially i've solved one small packaging issue by introducing several other packaging problems and about 12 additional failure points" this is basically me dealing with my problems

It may be worth investigating the "mumford-link" it's not exactly common, but could probably be adapted to work within your constraints and still keep the roll-center inside the continental US. it's kinda like a watt's link but with a few extra triangles.

@emmajacobs5575

Жыл бұрын

I was thinking about that too, but you still need frame structure behind the axle to mount the pivot/bellcrank gubbins. I had a quick search, but couldn’t find if anyone has mounted one forward of the rear axle.

@theafro

Жыл бұрын

@@emmajacobs5575 You could fit one ahead of the axle, but that may raise the roll-centre too high. without modelling it inside the confines of the viper rear end, it's hard to know if there's any chance.

@David-gk2ml

Жыл бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/lKSBxKNxlrPRn6w.html found one

@veejay120793

10 ай бұрын

⁠@@theafroMumford link is good if you want your roll center low.They’re use for ground effect cars where you want your roll center under the ground. I have one on my foxbody. I don’t it’s gona work on this application.

@theafro

10 ай бұрын

@@veejay120793 It requires a little imagination to achieve total freedom. with a little variation in the geometry (and linkage design) you could put the roll center on the moon if you wished.

Don't worry, the roll axis isn't attached to the bell crank like that, it goes through the center point of the bell crank yes, because that point is fixed in relation to the car. The inclination of the roll axis is set by the geometry of the 4 link though. And yes, you can introduce some weird and wonderful behaviour like roll steer. Alternatively, the watts link also still works if you attach the bell crank to the vehicle and have 2 links going to 2 points on the axle. You could even have a double bell crank, one on each side of the drive shaft, for clearance. And a wholly different idea: what if you put a 5th link in the same plane as the bottom links, but diagonal. No clue what it'll do to the roll center though, but I think it would fit packaging-wise?

@Zero76606

Жыл бұрын

The late model Crown Victorias used a somewhat similar arrangement for the watts links as well.

@thebigmacd

Жыл бұрын

When the bell crank is mounted to the vehicle the roll center moves up and down with the body instead of the axle, and side to side as the axle tilts. This tends to shimmy the body side to side over rough surfaces when the suspension is drooping. It's better for anti-roll geometry but maybe not for traction and comfort.

@AlexanderBurgers

Жыл бұрын

@@thebigmacd Ah, good point, that'd be kinda iffy yeah.

@martylawson1638

Жыл бұрын

"5th link in the same plane as the bottom link but diagonal" Sounds like a great solution to me. You'll only get 2nd order effects moving the axle sideways when the body rolls. Will put the roll-center where the diagonal link connects to the axle though so maybe diagonal brace the top links instead?

@leximatic

Жыл бұрын

5-linkage-axis already made 1982 by Mercedes for the C 111 Prototype and for Type W 201 put in Production (Model 190). For Matt just invented the Matts-linkage, i guess he was a german in his former incarnation.

“Race cars, like primates, must squat in order to go.” ~ Carroll Smith (who did a lot of off-road design later in his life, though I don’t know that he wrote any books about that)

@hannahranga

Жыл бұрын

That's a shame, his books are pretty damn good reading (even purely for entertainment).

I'd love to see a video of you presenting your design problems to Matt's Off-Road Recovery. The cross-promo wouldn't hurt, either.

@nononanonon

Жыл бұрын

See 9:04

we could really blow out the budget with portal gear

@InNeedOfSpeed

Жыл бұрын

Portal axles are super sexy. It should also help with drive shaft angle.

@uliwehner

11 ай бұрын

an independent rear suspension with portal gears. reducing the unsprung (axle) weight by a LOT. making room for the weight of the portal gear.

@InNeedOfSpeed

11 ай бұрын

@uli wehner That is also very sexy, E-class all-terrain concept they built with I think unimog? portal hubs comes to mind.

You definitely know what you are doing when you don't know what you are doing. That is clear to me. Keep doing the things that push you along until they hold you back. Then change everything to stay on the same path. You go you.

This seems to be begging for a "portal" aka "drop" axle, as seen in the original VW Bus and the H1 Hummer. [edit] Love the Matts link and the 'W' / 'M' symmetricality.

I work at a company that employs engineers that firmly believe that 'believing is engineering'... one would think when the IT guy (Me) walks by and says "Ahh... that doesn't work that way... none of this works that way!" and yet, through the power of belief, they build it out that way anyways, and then I grab popcorn and watch beliefs shatter. All Hail the Algorithm!

@_the_Chad_

Жыл бұрын

You must be new, I haven't seen you around my office yet!

@depressedferrarifan9066

Жыл бұрын

What I have been taught through this process is that everyone has to believe or else it won't work

@BrunodeSouzaLino

11 ай бұрын

Let's call it "Jesus Engineering."

@cyberburnzy

9 ай бұрын

​@@BrunodeSouzaLinoJesus built my car, it's a love affair, mainly Jesus and my hotrod (Ministry)

Looks like the solid axle may be just as complicated as an independent suspension ;-) I've never been a fan of solid axles for off-road anything, because of the terrible negative and positive chamber that happens when one side of the suspension has to travel further than the other. I don't how many times I've seen people roll their vehicle because of that, but it's a lot. Good luck with figuring something out.

There are watts links out there that mount the pivot off of a frame connected to the chassis and attach the lateral links to the axle tubes. Fays2 comes to mind, but I've seen them from other manufacturers as well.

It’s always a good day when Matt uploads. 😂

Driving a jeep is a unique experience. It wants to corner when you're going straight and it wants to go straight when you're cornering. I assume this is one of those practical jokes that found the perfect idiot who loved it and now they're stuck with it.

@piccalillipit9211

Жыл бұрын

I drove a Lincoln Town Car 30 feet limo across Europe from my home in the UK to my new home in Bulgaria - it was exactly the above experience. To turn right yo simply stopped turning left. to go straight you turned left, you did as little actual turning left as possible - it didn't like left. To stop you prayed - very hard.

@ItsDaJax

Жыл бұрын

​@@piccalillipit9211 Something was wrong with it, then. It should drive like any standard Panther. Does remind me of this old chevy c1500 at an old job, that wasn't allowed on the expressway. I found out why, when I drove it. It somehow turned right, fine, like it was new in 92. But left... left was spin the wheel hard left- but to stop turning left; add turn back more than the first left, right, then slightly back left. It did stop, and managed to drive straight-ish, all while carrying a not strapped down zero turn Turf Tiger on its landscaping bed.

@ItsDaJax

Жыл бұрын

Your jeep description reminds me of a review of a 1st gen MR-2, where they said it seemed to understeer and oversteer at the same time.

@Argosh

Жыл бұрын

@@ItsDaJax that's a great description.

@apricity69

Жыл бұрын

@@ItsDaJax “Toe out front or rear? Compression or droop?” Toyota engineers: “YES!”

Can't wait to see what you end up with. Whatever it is, it will be overengineered and/or underdeveloped. I don't know how those would be possible at the same time, but I *believe* it.

@smellysam

Жыл бұрын

Today, I overengineered a pan & tilt camera cabling support - in a day - but due to it's underdeveloped nature, it broke at fitting - tomorrow, I will redo this fiberglass part in 304 Stainless - that will show the sliding ruler Gods!

Hi Matt - I have a Land Rover Discovery 2. The location of the rear axle consists of one lower link each side, plus a Panhard rod. The lower links run parallel to the centreline of the car forward to somewhere near the centre of the car. They are fixed more or less rigidly to the axle with two bolts in such a way that the axle cannot twist about the half shaft axis. This means there is no need for any upper fore and aft link. It occurred to me that this might be a useful solution for you.

@uliwehner

11 ай бұрын

does that not bend the shit out of the bars when you step on the gas or on the brakes? as in wheel hop? or do they have leaf springs who function to locate the axle as well? edit: i looked and it does have a watts linkage.

The ending was hilarious

The more videos you post, the closer it feels your sense of humor gets to the portal games and aperture laboratories, which I am all for

If you haven't thought about it already, I recommend make/installing some trap doors in the oil pan. Of course the pan has some baffling, but they aren't the greatest and definitely not intended for the angles you will have that engine in. Nice thing about the pan design, it will be very simple to make/install some trap doors, its almost like Dodge intended to do this, but then looked at the cost and said "meh, this will be fine". And you probably know already 11mm, 7/16" and T25/T27(I cant remember which one, been awhile) will be one of your go to sockets when getting into the engine. An Accusump might not be a bad idea either. Vipers were my life for about 12 years, so its really cool to see someone actually doing something different for once. Keep up the videos, I enjoy them a lot!

I am so into these engineering shenanigans! Can't wait to see how it turns out. All hail the algorithm!

@jcorkable

Жыл бұрын

Not me, I’m here for the poop jokes

Wile studying for my A levels (which are kinda now actually), I've been designing the suspension for a track car I'll eventually build (with who knows what money). I've been doing it in Fusion, like you, and it's SUCH a pain. At first it I tried to draw it with just lines and points all in one perfectly constrained "3D sketch", and I have a pretty decent pc but fusion just wasn't having all those constrained moving parts. Then I moved on to using series of 2d sketches all in different components and I also eventually gave up on making sure "all the lines were black" because seriously life is too short and I'm pretty sure they're all *mostly* constrained anyway. A combination of XF motorsport videos and Wikipedia have taught me what feels like most of the black magic that is suspension/steering geometry but GOD do I feel your pain. Every bloody angle effects every other one so I fix my roll centre and pitch centre and camber and caster KPI and all that and I turn back on my wheels and the scrub radius ends up being measurable only in kilometres. I really thought I'd mostly mastered F360 but god was I wrong. Please if you have any tips for making the software cooperate with the mess of ball joints and constrained lines reply to this comment.

I love where the Matts linkage is going, but have you considered portal axles, like on Unimogs?

@carterbliss484

Жыл бұрын

time for the off road viper to get a little german

@Vaino_Hotti

Жыл бұрын

Time for the budget to fly out the window

@bake162

Жыл бұрын

He’s already over budget so that doesn’t count as an excuse anymore 😂

@dodecahedron1

Жыл бұрын

or early VW type 2s which used kübelwagen portal axles to overcome the fact that a 24hp 1100cc engine is nowhere near powerful enough for a 1.5 ton van with a cargo capacity high enough to carry a beetle

@JohnnyRottenest

Жыл бұрын

Ugh, yeah forget it. They’re like $25k new, and you’ll probably never find them in a in a US junkyard since they’re mostly on Humvees and other non-US military vehicles.

Look at an AC Cobra rear with the Panhardbar. Your geometry and packaging problem is already solved. Alternatively a Land Rover 110 setup solves your problem too.

A solid axel has advantages in offroading. Besides the reliability and less parts to fail, it gives you a known clearance when negotiating obstacles. It may be used in cheaper road cars but in 4WD vehicles it has these advantages besides price.

Matts Linkage, is seemingly very similar to how Torsen Differentials operate with worm-gears, blocking the undesirable motion. Frikken awesome, salute Matt!

Suspension geography tickled me more than it should. lol. The first thing I thought when I saw the thumbnail was an idea I still haven't got to try. I think I read about it in 4x4 and off-road..... hydraulic sway bar links........open the valve and when 1 tire gets pushed up, it pushes the 3 other tires down, close the valve and the sway bar acts normal..... I'm going to try it someday

@Blaquer17

Жыл бұрын

Pretty sure there was a rally car with this setup (or maybe it only tied left front to right rear and vise versa). I think the system was banned for being too good. I'd look it up but my lunch break is over.

Check out how the suspension works on the rear of a Jeep Liberty, it runs a large A arm on the top of the differential with a ball joint in the center of the v that attaches to the top of the differential and it allows a lot of articulation while keeping the differential centered.

18:10 "It has all of the benefits of the Watts linkage with no drawbacks. Unfortunately it has several drawbacks." Love it, I might use this quote next time I feel I've designed something clever haha.

I just watched three videos from Suspensions Explained. Huibert is awesome! He's like Matt but with less distillation, crayons, and sarcasm

I'm not even a car person but I adore the stuff you make, the humor, the presentation, it's so freaking good

A key advantage to a solid rear axle in off-road use, no loss in ground clearance under the diff when a wheel moves up. With independent suspension, the diff moves closer to the ground as the wheel moves up. Possibly striking the ground. With a solid axle, the diff moves up as the wheel moves up.

Not sure if anyone else mentioned this, early 2000's crown victorias have the forward mounted watts link thet youre looking for, could be worth a look just to understand geometry. Looking forward to seeing this build!

I think your picture makes it look worse than it might be, but be careful tilting the engine that far. You might run into oiling issues if you tilt it more than the pan was designed to deal with. Guessing if you plan to crawl with it or run up steep dunes or something it would make that even worse. Maybe not any worse than something like high acceleration drag racing, but worth thinking about.

@haphazard1342

Жыл бұрын

Forget drag racing, the real killer is circle track. Constant side forces. Dry sump and call it a day.

@aaronhunter7026

Жыл бұрын

Dumb idea: why not keep the engine flat and angle the transmission downward, connect the two with a CV joint and make a new transmission housing to cover the CV joint? I think it would be easier to cover/protect than a regular boot covered CV joint and wouldn't need to flex either. Maybe not a great idea on something that already has a really short drive shaft though.

@cyjanek7818

Жыл бұрын

he killed engine like that already So I think he Will remember now

Why do I think in 3 - 6 months we are gonna have a video “My awesome suspension worked really awesome until I tried it?” I’m honestly really excited to see how it works. Long bars and potentially opposing forces (and lets face it, you are anything but polite to your off road vehicles) and I think we will see bent components on the Matt’s Linkage like you had on the Toyota Tie Rods a few videos back.

You could also try rear radius arms, then you wouldn't have to make a frame mount for the upper control arm as it would be connected to the lower arm

"It has all the benefits of a Watts linkage with none of the drawbacks............ Unfortunately it has several drawbacks" 🤣🤣🤣🤣 Has me dead

It’s amazing how much information and jokes and car/engineering/design nerdery you manage to convey in an understandable way in such a short time. Thank you for the entertainment!

I'm so happy I not only found this channel, but also took the time to basically watch all the things now. So I was exited when I saw the this upload, and was thoroughly entertained (and informed!). I did have to pause several times when we made the rounds from the Matty-Go-Rounds to the Matthard Bar (™ I assume), cause I was laughing so hard that I couldn't actually follow any more.

Matt is the only person that makes creating custom suspension on an off-road viper look like it’s done on a lemons budget

Have you considered (or heard-of) a Mumford linkage. It's a bit like a Watt's linkage, a bit more complicated in the middle, but can have the rods that extend out to the side attached at the same height. Thinking about it, it's pretty-much a Matt's linkage with the parts in different places. For the longitudinal location, have you considered a leading-trailing arms with the upper arms attaching to the chassis behind the axle, this pretty-much turns each side of the axle into a Watt's linkage with very little fore/aft movement.

Gotta love the Matts link

As always, fun for the whole family. Bravo!

You could use a Watt's link, but replace the bell crank with a ring (with diameter ~equal to the length of the bell crank) on a big bearing whose inner race mounts to the diff and provides through access for the drive shaft. Kinematically it would be identical.

I read a paper on Watts Linkage Geometry which stated that unlike a Panhard bar the axle center does not describe an arc. However the Watts Linkage does induce an “S”-shaped line as the axle rises and falls. So the axle still has some side-to-side motion which must be managed. Did the author explain how this works? Yes, so I guess they KNOW, rather than believe.

Mind blown! Learned a lot. Looking for more

I love it. Keep ruining ideas to keep me entertained, please. It makes all my failures feel petty. I love your channel

Ford 8.8's came with a front top mounted watts link on some Panther cars, use DORMAN 905306 as a reference. Should be able to weld a mount on differential and use lower frame rails for mounts.

Have you considered a sliding pillar? I had an Austin Healey prepped for tracking with this solution. It was basically a big bolt pointing to the rear (could probably be to the front also). It holds a square bronze block. This block was sliding up sand down between two vertical u-bars. It does keep the axel very stable in the middle

Theres a company named Rockford Constant Velocity that makes custom CV prop shafts. They specifically make them to have incredibly high angles.

I notice you didn't look at articulation (one wheel up, one when down) in this video which is kinda a big deal in an off-road truck. Top mounted Watts link would need to deal with since serious angles with articulation. I think this is the point where a lot of people reach for the grinder, remove all floor and frame from behind the seats and make their own. It sounds crazy, but often makes things a lot more simple compared to packaging around things you don't really want there. ***Custom frame rails and triangulated 4 link... I believe it's the best way***

In reading suspension tuning, you are on the right track. I did sway bars "added" to my originals. One behind the front wheels keeping the stock front in front of the front wheels. The stock sway bar in the rear is mounted behind the rear wheels. I added a front mounted rear sway bar. Plus all the bracing lowering and relocating the battery behind the right rear tire. My words!!! Ballance, weight transfer, smooth ride, Fun Factor! Priceless! This is strictly street, fast turns and fun! In the pictures your viper looks like a off roader???

As a mechanical engineer and car nut, I thoroughly enjoyed this video. Your sense of humor is priceless. Keep up the good work.

Did you just invent the cousin to the Jacob's ladder? Alternatively, you can mount the pivot of the Watt's link to the chassis and connect the outboard ends of the links to the axle housing.

'Race Car Vehicle Dynamics' by the Milliken brothers. Most of the time, when people say something is an art not a science, they are looking for a particular solution to a set of differential equations. It is complicated, but well-understood.

You probably have already started building, so this comes too late, but another option is an upper wishbone link (three-link suspension) which rock crawlers like because it helps with articulation (less binding) while eliminating the problems inherent in the panhard/watts link.

Can we all just stop and appreciate how fing good that rear axle scan is for a second?

Matt, you could mimic Watts link in front by installing big ass bearing around deferential bell , or modify differential by adding another bearing between cv joint and differential - input shaft is a pivot point.

Man this was an awesome video. Watching you design stuff is motivating me to try and start actually designing things before I start building them

I'm a biology major and somehow you make me understand this stuff better than my own subjects. You should consider being a professor.

Reminds me of a rudder control linkage for a hover craft I designed in high school. Forward and back would compress or expand a linkage allowing the rear rudders to divert air into ducting for brake/reverse function.

Take a look at 06+ crown vic rear suspensions. Their watts link design is probably exactly what you need. The center rotating link is mounted horizontal-ish, maybe 60-70 degrees, and hugs closer to the axle.

The bell crank on a watts link does not have to mount to the center of the rear. A reverse Watts link mounts the bell crank to the cross frame and uses clamp on stations to attach to the axle tubes. There is a company that has a bolt on Watts Link, it's called a Fays 2 Watts link kit. It may come into play here to help solve some of the clearance issues.

Just get a gigantic roller bearing and mount the bell crank around the pinion nose and mount the Watt's link frame mounts between the links. I know its way goofy but it would be entertaining and probably makeable with Send-Cut-Send parts

@michaelblacktree

Жыл бұрын

I was thinking something similar. Although it would need to be a pretty large bearing, so you can mount it as close to the axles as possible. (to minimize lateral twisting forces)

You can easily use a conventional vertical axis Watts linkage mounted in front of the axle, but displaced to one side of the driveline. One link will then go over the top of the driveline. Also your efforts to keep the driveline pointing at the gearbox output are misplaced. Leave the gearbox line where it is and modify the rear axle linkage to keep the axle input parallel to the ground then you can use conventional Hooke joints and you will get no vibrations, whatever angle you run them. This works because the two Hooke joints cancel out each other’s vibrations provided they are correctly phased on the shaft.

The Jeep axle might handle the torque, but it may not handle total power very well. I'd check the fluid once in a while.

great fun. use the watts link. instead of having the central pivot on the diff, put it on the body with a cross member that comes down behind the diff. put the two rod mounts behind each brake plate on the axle. reverse the locations of the arms and pivot. I'm sure I'm missing something, but I think it would work.

So many problems for future Matt, so exciting!

40 years ago I started building a small sports car not unlike a Lotus Seven. I designed the rear suspension based on a solid axle with unequal length trailing arms to minimise the movement of the nose of the diff and better line up with the tailshaft. All the arms had rod end bearings and worked fine when both wheels went up and down together. However when one wheel tried to go up by itself the axle locked solid! The solution was equal length parallel trailing arms. All vehicles with unequal trailing arms have rather large rubber bushes to accommodate the errors in geometry. I used a Panhard rod for lateral location and have enjoyed 30 years of motoring to date. (Took 10 years to build!)

The top pivot watt's link will be fine. Your roll center is still at the projected intersection of the watt's link tie-rods when viewed from the rear. Add the body roll degree of freedom to your cad and it should be a lot clearer. (while click-n-drag is nice, it's better to constrain suspension with several driving dimensions.) Also CV's have a lot of internal sliding friction. It's why they're packed with tons of Molybdenum disulfide grease. This means that they'll overheat if operated at high power and high angle for more than a few minutes. Double U-joints don't have this issue, so are a great choice for the transmission. I'd also be tempted to look at agricultural PTO shafts. Pretty easy to find a shaft with 2x double U-joints and a long sliding spline section, though harder to find shafts that are happy at 3-4000 rpm.

Trying to lift a third gen Fbody with a 3-link suspension. I feel your pain. Though glad it came with a panhard bar.

The key to a good off-road suspension is handling the droop in rotation. Other wheel high in the wheel well, while the other is digging a new path into China. The more you can create suspension pressure onto the dropped wheel and the further down you can drop it, the better will your off-road suspension be.

Just install vertical rails for the axle to slide up and down on that prevent lateral movement. Picture it, two pivoting hooks that drop down behind the axle and curve to cradle it. As the axle goes up they pivot backwards, as the axle goes down they pivot forwards.

Late model Ford Panther body cars (Ford Crown Victoria, Mercury Grand Marquis, Lincoln Town Car) have a Watts link in front of the axle, ok, more like on top of the axle, but still, might be worth checking it out.

Coming from a mini trucker, a Panhard bar is a horrible decision for long travel. You watch your axle go left to right one to 2 inches in travel you should go Watts link.

No, you invented engineering comedy 🤣 and it's awesome 😎 👍

Matt, there used to be a show called Xtreme 4x4 that later changed its name to Xtreme Off-Road. Back when I watched it it was on Spike network during "The Powerblock" segment of several car shows. I remember the hosts Ian and Jessie doing a lot of custom suspension for Jeeps and tube chassis rock crawlers and deserts race trucks. They often had segments explaining how they got their dimensions and geometry for the specific setup they were using and seemed pretty knowledgeable. It's been a while since I've seen the show (I don't have cable anymore), but you might try seeing if you can find a few of those episodes online somewhere. It might offer some guidance or inspiration for you. Good luck.

Believing is Engineering is the filosophy of my boss. I'm an engineer and I believe in CAD simulations. I don't know how they really work, but if they are positive I'm totally in. Naming the links in the Matts suspenssion is one of the funniest things I've ever heard about suspenssions. Congratulations. I would definately go with your suspenssion system, and every time you show your car to people you can tell them how the matt link work with the matty-go-round and all that stuff.

The best way to mount a watts link is to the chassis, that way the roll center stays a consistent distance from the center of gravity height. Also mounting the watts on its side is perfectly acceptable, your roll center does nothing weird I promise. The center the watts center pivot cancels out the angular offset of the rose joint pivots.

Chassis mounted Watt’s Link. You can mount it centered behind the axle and the other links go to the ends of the axle.

Vary funny, thank you. What I love about "simple " engineering solutions like Panhard rods is that they look so quaint or crude sometimes...and then YOU try to do it and....hmmm

Why not make a triangulated 4 link that connects under the axle, instead of above, and make it super beefy with some guards for the joints so you dont have to drop the axle as you said.

17:53 the famous what’s-up-Matt’s linkage !! And I was there to see it being invented !! 🎉🎉🎉🎉

The crown Vic uses a top mounted watts link, and uses funky bends on the bars and angles at the turn table part that keeps thing happy I think

If you angle the engine and the gearbox, think about the oillevel at both.

love it. keep up the sarcasm and jokes man brightens my day every time I see one of your videos drop.

You could do a watts link but mount the middle pivot to the chassis on a triangulated bracket behind the diff, and mount the watts link arms to the diff. They do that on race cars because if you mount the middle pivot to a screw you can adjust the height of the watts link relative to the body easily to adjust roll centre. You might be able to get something like that happening on the Viper... Probably a better solution than the Mathard bar even though it's not as fun...

Swapping from IRS to solid axle is pretty common on drag cars - it's much easier to adjust squat geometry on a 4 link setup (with adjustable pickup points) than it is on IRS, add in (approximately) zero camber all the way through (even) travel and it just works better.

I'm don't remember how I found your videos, but I'm glad I did. The dry sarcasm is perfection 🤌

I still can't believe you only have 326k subscribers! You deserve 1M+ seriously! 👏

Could you reverse the watts link linkage idea you had at the rear of the diff? Such that the bellcrank is mounted to a bracket which is fixed between the two top chassis rails at the rear, then the two bars are attached to the left and right sides of the axle? Same motion, but opposite parts moving up/down essentially

Milliken’s “Racecar Vehicle Dynamics” has a great section on solid axle suspension geometry.

Put a diagonal rod from the inside of the left lower link where it attaches to the frame to the right lower link where it attaches to the axle. This will be like a panhard bar in a way, but allow the suspension to articulate, ideally without the driveshaft and the link wanting to occupy the same space.