1. Establish the active dynamic 2. Reinforce active dynamic: I will testify against him 3. Point out evidence 4. Point out witnesses 5. Officer, you will have my full cooperation after I’ve spoken with counsel

@shane727

4 жыл бұрын

This should be pinned

@lucasoparowski6911

4 жыл бұрын

I think rather than I will fully cooperate say that is my only statement until I speak with counsel

@PlanktoniusRex

4 жыл бұрын

I understand the list he gave and agree but have a question: what if several or even one of the witnesses you point out are friends of the perp? I mean if witnesses lie to damage your case that cant be good. Just for discussion...should there be guidelines for what one should think about before pointing out a witness?

@2bituser569

4 жыл бұрын

Char Char Binks To fully cooperate does not mean you incriminate yourself.

@Morggin

4 жыл бұрын

@@PlanktoniusRex That witness is going to testify against you anyway. Better to point him out where he stands and it will be recorded in the officers duty camera so he doesn't come back and say he was someplace else on the scene.

I love his final point. Carrying doesn’t make you a Superman. If your head isn’t in the right place, and you can’t control your emotions under stress, you are potentially a danger to yourself and others. Keeping cool can keep you from even having to “defend your actions “

After listening to all this--Now i can understand why lawyers advise saying nothing until you speak to lawyer. Simple.

@elmospasco5558

4 жыл бұрын

You got folks up in Linesville, PA?

@MrEazyE357

4 жыл бұрын

You didn't get it before? I'm hoping you're a kid or something.

@tacattac534

4 жыл бұрын

In reply to Jeff Beagle: YEP!

@mikehascats26

4 жыл бұрын

there is NO advantage to talking to cops. shut up and lawyer up

@matterbob5x

4 жыл бұрын

@@mikehascats26 There is an advantage, but you have to be careful what you say..

Anything you say can and WILL be used AGAINST you in a court of law. And we all know how honest our court systems is.

@jonb2046

4 жыл бұрын

This is certainly true. You have to balance that with "How bad can the responding officer make this for you if you piss him off by being rude?" The more I learn the more questions I have.

@conorfoster2337

4 жыл бұрын

That's exactly why you need to be able to articulate the situation. Silence will be used against you as well.

@davidpierce9065

4 жыл бұрын

@@papimaximus95 Cops are not your friend. Law enforcement officers, are enforcers. Speaking to LEO's is likely going to be frustrating and not diplomatic. Talking to armed enforcers who are confrontational ( the nature of their occupation ) and trained to be aggressive, and not trained to be diplomatic could escalate the situation. They have disarmed you and you are not able to protect yourself. They will shoot you if you say the wrong thing, or get frustrated.

@davidpierce9065

4 жыл бұрын

@Mary Smith let me guess... you subscribe to the theory that if you have done nothing wrong, you have nothing to hide. A notion that encourages the dismal of civil rights.

@Wr3ckZ

4 жыл бұрын

@@conorfoster2337 A lawyer can defend your silence, easier than your mistaken admission of guilt.

To review: 1) Establish the active dynamic (i.e. you are the victim and acted in self defense) 2) Confirm dynamic ("I will testify against him") 3) Point out the evidence 4) Point out the witnesses 5) "You will have my full cooperation after I have spoken with counsel" and now shut up

@gblargg

4 жыл бұрын

I've heard that making the 911 call establishes you as the complainant (i.e. victim).

@UncleTerry

4 жыл бұрын

@@gblargg Make that call before any of the perps do too. as soon as possible!

@ourcorrectopinions6824

4 жыл бұрын

Parts of #1, and all of 2, 3, 4 and 5 are no-gos. Basically say “he/she” did this (in one sentence or less), then "I’d like to speak to my attorney." End of story.

@herewardthewatchful1014

4 жыл бұрын

@@ourcorrectopinions6824 - I agree with that statement expect #3. In the rare scenario that a perp tosses their weapon over a picket fence or some other obstacle out of sight, it's in you best immediate interest to have it found and secured by Investigators.

@tobyschmoll2792

3 жыл бұрын

To me it seems that 1 and 4 are the only ones you would want to open your mouth for as the others would be subjective beyond lawyering up

In short, the brief fight for your life with your weapon won't be nearly as scary, dangerous, or drawn out as the following battle. You took them out of the loop by protecting yourself. So they now have to punish you with their unlimited resources.

@s0nnyburnett

4 жыл бұрын

Gunfight was just the warmup for the real arena of legal quagmire.

@bearly1727

3 жыл бұрын

Sad but true in most cases. Generally NOT where I live though.

@bodozier6952

3 жыл бұрын

Just like hunting, the work starts after the shots are fired

@texasbeast239

3 жыл бұрын

You have to have that same fighting instinct about more than just the violent incident. Self-righteous indignation. Determination not to go down like a wuss, because you were not the bad guy.

@georgealicea2978

3 жыл бұрын

So let me get this straight. You kill a perp who has a history of robbery & other crimes, and now they want to make you the criminal. Sounds like they trying to railroad you and make themselves look like heroes, by framing you. That's why you say nothing, except" where the fock is my lawyer"

My CCL instructor said the process begins with the 911 call. Anything you say to them can also be used against you. Just tell them there's been a firearm incident, please send police. Call your attorney while they're in route, and if your attorney has a call service, don't say anything to them because they are not protected by attorney/client privilege. If you can get your attorney on the phone before police arrive, he/she can guide you exactly what to say or not say.

@zerohero6602

Жыл бұрын

Solid advice

@jessicagrecco5813

8 ай бұрын

Fantastic advice indeed

@TristanRivers-lz4wv

6 ай бұрын

And your attorney will tell you to invoke the 5th and say nothing every single time.

unfortunately it seems like perpetrators have more rights than victims in our justice system. i'll take my chances being silent and talking with my attorney first.

@gregfalco4528

4 жыл бұрын

Well the perp is already dead, and the cops want someone to arrest. Cops LOVE arresting people.

@mihaeltomasovic

4 жыл бұрын

@@Morggin You have never been in a physically demanding situation like that, have you, my friend? Have you ever been in combat or even something like a fist fight or something? Do you remember how you felt after that and can you even remember how you felt during? By saying "of sound mind" - I think the gentleman was merely saying relaxed and calm. I agree, though, that not being "of sound mind" does sound bad, though. I think the person put it wrong, my friend, but just consider that.

@Morggin

4 жыл бұрын

@@mihaeltomasovic to answer your question. Yes, I have and all I have to say is when things get hard, be hard.

@mihaeltomasovic

4 жыл бұрын

@@Morggin Just out of curiosity - you don't notice your entire sympathetic nervous system going crazy in those times? The adrenaline doesn't make you say or do some things that you might not in regular circumstances? I just think perhaps some are effected this way, so if it applies to them, it might be good to do their best to remember to stick only with what was said in the video there. For folks like yourself, I don't think you would have to worry about it. I am a combat vet, but I never got used to it or comfortable, so I better try to keep the advice if possible as well lol. Anyhow, nice having the chance of discussing this with you. Have a great day :) . .

@shawnr771

4 жыл бұрын

@Fafhrd 2 A few years ago the Virginia State Police pulled a guy over who had several rifles, shotguns, pistols, ammo, a knife and a map of Washington D.C. with an X on the White House. After seeing all of this the cops said "Yup you are good to go" Two weeks later the guy drove to the White House. Left behind everything but the knife. Jumped the fence ran across the grounds, entered the front door, knocked the Secret Service agent at the door down and ran around inside the White House for a little while.

With all due respect to Massad, who I continue to respect, I disagree for several reasons based upon my representing people in gun cases for the past 26 years. I'd be happy to have a friendly round table discussion on the issue!

@ASPextra

4 жыл бұрын

I would love to get you two in the same room!!!

@WAGNERONE1978

3 жыл бұрын

How many of your gun cases where the Shooter had an open carry permit and was truly defending his Home after someone broke in with a crowbar and you the permit carrying Homeowner with an impeccable military and Civilian career did you lose. Or simply your win vs loss record? With all due respect your statement isn't a specific statement but could be legally a generalization.

@MarcVictorAttorneyForFreedom

3 жыл бұрын

@@WAGNERONE1978 Every case is unique. There is too much here for a short answer. Feel free to contact the firm and set a time for us to discuss your question in detail. Thanks!

@timothyclyne

3 жыл бұрын

@@ourcorrectopinions6824 Massad Ayoob is a former police officer, in fact retired Police Captain. Take his advice to speak with police to your own peril. His assertion that invoking your 5th is grounds for suspicion, is unconstitutional. ... Can I search? No. Well that gives me reasonable suspicion for a warrant to search. It does not work like that.

@timothyclyne

3 жыл бұрын

@@ourcorrectopinions6824 your assumption is wrong. I fully understood that you don't agree with retired Police Captain Ayoob's reasoning. I supported your previous assertion with vital omitted and very relevant information Massad Ayoob was a police officer for nearly three decades.

Be the first to call 911, Identify yourself as the victim, then say I'll wait for my lawyer.

The former detective who did my CCW class said if you say nothing at all, then all they can do is take you to booking. Saying just enought get's you to an interview room instead.

@mattpkp

4 жыл бұрын

exactly

@seanmcdaniel6818

4 жыл бұрын

@@thebubbacontinuum2645 THIS is the key point of the entire argument. Ayoob is playing checkers, trying to curry favor with the cops on scene and avoid being booked. Stop playing checkers, play chess. You will probably get booked, then bailed, then you can talk to your lawyer. The risk of destroying your case in the hopes of avoiding a night in jail is a ridiculous argument.

@phillhuddleston9445

4 жыл бұрын

@@thebubbacontinuum2645 That is probably because they were guilty and were caught in a lie, if you have not broken any laws and only state the very basics that are true and will come out anyway with a lawyer present you can not be tripped up on a lie. If you are going to talk think before speaking, the meaning of every word matters. The important thing is to not say too much.

@2bituser569

4 жыл бұрын

Morggin Who are you?

@whogivesafuification

4 жыл бұрын

@@2bituser569 The clown of the day

Thanks for recording this! People will agree or disagree and each will have to make that personal decision, but I applaud you for having Ayoob defend his position.

"Anything you say can and will be used AGAINST you." Not for you. Also Being mute does not envoke your fifth amendment. You must state you envoke it.

@timothyclyne

3 жыл бұрын

Even invoking your 5th, you answer ANY questioning afterwards, you reliquished your 5th protections for that line of questioning. Those answers are admissible. God help you, if it's the questioning officers hand written notes of what you 'said'.

@RealDapperDude

3 жыл бұрын

Thirty years Los Angeles DA: It's not enough to say I"m invoking the 5th. You must say, "I want my lawyer present before answering any questions". The interrogation must stop. Any continued questioning that gets a response is inadmissible.

@timothyclyne

3 жыл бұрын

Bravo Being mute is admissible if you have not invoked your rights.

@timothyclyne

3 жыл бұрын

Bravo Being mute is admissible if you have not invoked your rights. www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/salinas-v-texas/

@timothyclyne

3 жыл бұрын

@Tom Gulbranson you are wrong. Mason is correct. You must invoke your right to remain silent. www.justia.com/criminal/procedure/miranda-rights/right-to-silence/ You are wrong. And likewise wrong to use appeal to authority argument, which is a fallacious argument en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority

What I was told to say, "I'm going to cooperate, but I want my attorney present before I answer any questions".

@calvinlong1265

3 жыл бұрын

@bali song thanks!

You should have a round table discussion on this topic with Massad, Marc, and Terry.

@ASPextra

4 жыл бұрын

It would be awesome but it’s hard to get them all together.

@timothysherrange

4 жыл бұрын

@@ASPextra For sure. Maybe a video call?

@beefyoso

4 жыл бұрын

@@timothysherrange not enough money.

@timothyclyne

4 жыл бұрын

Massad is a retired police officer...

@Markomyt1

4 жыл бұрын

@@ASPextra ZOOM it Brother!

Massad is the MAN! I love to listen to his instructions on things. Talk about real-world smarts; he's the epitome of that in the world of carrying a weapon and such. Thank you, John, for this great interview. This is great information to know!!

He missed his calling as a bass singer

@wannabecarguy

4 жыл бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/g22Kz9pxcsbTlLw.html

@jjacksonjr2

4 жыл бұрын

🤣🤣🤣 boomboom boom boon

@DavidLLambertmobile

4 жыл бұрын

I wanted to take LFI 1 in 2004 & LFI 2 in 2008 but $$$ & schedule problems prevented it. Ayoob has been around years!!! More CCW users, armed officers need to learn about him.

@JaredHIll13

4 жыл бұрын

Ppl cpme from all around just to hear me get low on the mow mow...

@timothyclyne

4 жыл бұрын

His calling was law enforcement officer.

My CCW Instructor, a County Sheriffs Deputy, told us to just repeat "I had to stop the attack". But I like the statement that "Officer you will have my complete cooperation after I have spoken with council", that really sets the stage in my opinion.

@GS-cx6hv

3 жыл бұрын

...so you stopped the attack by killing the victim you were attacking? I guess that's one way.

@bearly1727

3 жыл бұрын

@@GS-cx6hv Pull your head out of your ask.

@GS-cx6hv

3 жыл бұрын

​@@bearly1727 but then how will you hear me when my head is out, but yours is still firmly lodged in?

@bearly1727

3 жыл бұрын

@@GS-cx6hv LOL no one cares to hear you.

@mrmd4734

2 жыл бұрын

Counsel

Two guys I could sit and talk ,mainly listen to for days .... LOVE YOUR CHANNEL MR C.. PLEASE KEEP US INFORMED..

Excellent advice from people who know that they are talking about. Thanks Mass!

WOW!!! This was really great to know. Good things to help, should the circumstances arise. Not too much, but just some main points to let the cops know of your intent to assist, but also not more than they need to hear, or more than you need to say. I've been keeping a binder of key things learned here on Extra, and ASP original. I hear it, I write it, I say it out loud. It helps me retain info.

The back of the uscca card has those exact steps in order, and after I've followed those I will repeat the last step over and over...."Officer I will cooperate 100% but first I need my attorney" SILENCE.

@Numguk

3 жыл бұрын

I wouldn't even bother saying you'll cooperate, as now you're making promises you don't intend to keep.

Good on you for giving Massad Ayoob time on your channel. A wise friend pointed me in his direction back around 1990 when I was taking an interest in self-defense. He's the real deal.

This is so important, thanks so much for sharing!

I am former Military and have held a CHL in numerous States for most of my life. I am now 75 years old. I train often and it is very high quality training. I am also a motorcycle Biker and frequently go to seminars to learn how to interact with police during traffic stops. I've also attended a few "adjudicator" training courses where you experience real life examples of shoot/no-shoot situations. Still, having to shoot someone in civilian life and dealing with the aftermath is something I don't look forward to. This was a very valuable video for me and I wish all my NRA course participants spent time watching clips like these. Great job and thanks!

I know it is tough to do in a short video, but one issue with the "limited statement" given to responding officers is That You Cannot Stop The Officer's Questions while you are giving your story.....and I think that is why a lot of good defense attorneys counsel for you to say nothing. Telling a story to officials is a Learned Skill Set. Thanks For Your Great Work !

Thank you for this enlightning video he certainly makes very good points especially about shell casings & evidence being moved or destroyed and the lengthy time between the incident and the trial.

Thank you Mas and John for sharing this video. I say ditto!!! to a few of the other comments on (somehow) getting Mas, Terry and Marc all together for a conversation on this subject. That would be a great video! Thank you again Mas and John! 😃👍 Keep yourselves safe! Randy

Just remember: The police are _NOT_ your friends when they arrive on scene. They are _NOT_ there to congratulate you on a good defensive shoot. They are _NOT_ going to take your word as the _truth_ . (Psst, criminals lie...) They _ARE_ trained in manipulating people into a potentially bad statement (it helps their case). They _ARE_ there to investigate a crime, of which you appear to be the perpetrator. They _ARE_ going to arrest you regardless of how perfectly within the law your self defense shooting was. There are exceptions of course, but be prepared to go in handcuffs. Lawyer up and shut up. If you say anything it needs to be VERY SIMPLE. "He attacked me." "I feared for my life and I defended myself and family." "I need time to process what happened." "I WILL help with your investigation, but I MUST speak with a lawyer first." I think that was along the lines of what Ayoob said, but he drug it out in more detail than I would ever do. The more you add to the equation, the more complex it becomes, and the greater the chance something potentially incriminating is said. I'm certainly not an expert, but I have worked in the CJ field for a few years...and I slept in a Holiday Inn Express last night. 😉

@drewe9514

4 жыл бұрын

Coming from a family of lawyers, more likes on this comment!

@developingdaddy

4 жыл бұрын

I agree with your comment. The only part I ask for clarification on is if cops are trained to manipulate you into a "bad statement." If by bad you mean INCRIMINATING and FACTUALLY CORRECT then I'll agree. But it's of no use to anyone to coerce false statements.

@johnbravo1034

4 жыл бұрын

Good info👍

@johnbravo1034

4 жыл бұрын

gwolff but some do coerce false statements. Read “You Have the Right to Remain Innocent”.

4 жыл бұрын

The only thing I disagree with is "I WILL help with your investigation..." You should in NO WAY help the police with their investigation (regardless of 100% justification), and here's why: Ya know that little bit in the Miranda warnings that says, "Anything you say CAN and WILL be used AGAINST you in a court of law?" Well, guess what? The opposite is equally as true: "Anything you say CANNOT and WILL NOT be used FOR you in a court of law." The cops work for the State, the prosecution. Everything their investigation uncovers can only be used against you in court. If the cops find irrefutable evidence that the shoot was completely justified, but the DA disagrees and decides to prosecute you anyway, that evidence will be quashed and never heard in court, I promise you! That piece of shit DA will never allow that evidence to enter the record because he/she has made up his/her mind to get a conviction, and fuck the facts, folks! Lawyer up and shut up!! Repeat it until you believe it!

Just remember- This is advice from someone with a LAW ENFORCEMENT background.. Remember a large part of their job is devoted to EXTRACTING information from people to be used AGAINST (their words) them. To hear both sides, make sure you listen to LEGAL experts that are faced with defending/prosecuting people every day.

@giii7599

2 жыл бұрын

Never say a word to cops. EVER. The cops today simply cannot be trusted. Law Enforcement isn't what it once was.

@mrdclark2003

2 жыл бұрын

Exactly!!!

@gmcjetpilot

2 жыл бұрын

You think Massad is trying to trick you? Ha ha. He is a highly respected expert in self-defense and a professional witness and you know more than he does? What he's saying is besides saying " I fear for my life so I shot him" you should go a little bit beyond that if appropriate. Like they were breaking down my door, there were two of them and one got away. Then you say I'm not going to speak anymore. I'm in shock but later I will fully cooperate. If you play belligerent and the one got away goes to Police and says you murdered his friend, that is the narrative and you stay silent? Get your story out then shut up.

@chasen62

2 жыл бұрын

@@gmcjetpilot trying to decipher your English but yes, I am saying he is (admittedly) not a legal expert and his advice should be taken as such ..

@robertvondarth1730

2 жыл бұрын

Correct

I appreciate the information and the reasoning behind it. Thank you!

Much respect Mas. Thank you for sharing your insights.

Maas is so knowledgeable and packed through and through with good, no great advice. Both of you are true Patriots.

Love to hear more from Mr Ayoob!!

a lot of good information to be learned, thank you for sharing.

@ASPextra

4 жыл бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

Thank you, sir, for your help. Immensely appreciate it. I would have been one of the EMS with the guerney and ambo attempting to help the injured. Sorry.

Thank you Pom for sponsoring this channel. I carry Pom OC spray every day. I was proud during training over the weekend when the instructor asked what non-lethal tools the students had, I held up my Pom and looked around to realize that I was the only one.

Been watching your videos for years, and they are great. But now that you have had Mas on your channel, you have a new subscriber. Today, there are way too many videos about tacticool gear and zombie toys. So your channel is a refreshing change. Took my first class with Mas over 20 yrs ago. Mas is absolutely the best trainer ever, and I still have all my notes. EVERYONE with a CCW permit should be REQUIRED to take his class, or at least watch every Mas video you can find. and yes, his videos from the 1980s are still being reposted. Plus, buy and read all his books!

@phyl1283

2 жыл бұрын

I suspect that Ayoob has been a very valuable associate in formulating what a cop should say to an internal affairs "investigation" but I wouldn't trust him to give me advice of how to protect myself as a citizen from giving statements to police at the scene of a crime or at a interrogation after the event happened. He knows what the police want and they know how to get it from a person who is accused of a crime, even if they have to lie, intimidate and threaten the perp. It's better to have someone beside you during any communication who can tell you to shut up because he realizes what the police are trying to get you to say and what its effect will be at trial. What the police want is self-incriminating statements that can be used to put you away...or worse. They have no sympathy for someone who will say something inadvisably that will result in him being shut away for a long time or for the remainder of his life, or even if the statement was not true as interpreted. The police if not your buddy. They are your accuser, your jailer and your punisher even if they lie to get you to talk. NEVER TALK TO THE POLICE. it won't help you at trial.

Excellent advice. I'll remember that and hope I never have to use it. Thanks to you both for the video.

More Mass!!! please. So much to learn from him. A great teacher. Thanks

Love this dude, Mass has been setting us straight for years 💪, reminds me of my uncle.

@thomasjensen6243

2 жыл бұрын

Your uncle is a lawyer?

As long and as respected as this man is I would’ve thought he would never give this kind of advice he is not an attorney and it shows , make a brief statement and shut your mouth and talk to your lawyer , my God 😳

@ASPextra

3 жыл бұрын

That's exactly what he said to do.

@danduran4981

2 жыл бұрын

Do not make statements!

@Colt-ii4qn

2 жыл бұрын

@@ASPextra he needs to stay in his lane , not a lawyer

@romans6two338

11 ай бұрын

I agree, this guy isn't a lawyer and the advice he is giving is horrible. My personal lawyer who I have paid before said this to me if I'm ever in that situation. Shut up and don't make any statements and remain silent. This guy and his so called expert advice is crazy talk.

Great advice John. Thank you both very much. The value of what you provide is very high.

@ASPextra

4 жыл бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

Thanks for this interview!

As much as I honor and respect Mr Ayoob's knowledge, and experience, My lawyer, (a former sheriff), has explained to me, that even the police don't make their documented statements for up to two weeks after a shooting. And they get coached on how to 'articulate' everything. His response and training for me has been: "be polite, but simply state you want to press charges, then politely explain you'll be glad to answer any further questions under counsel. ... Then shut up." Let me add this: I'm a union steward, and I've had to 'represent' workers at my job much the sane way. And even WE coach people to simply request their Weingarten rights, and shut up too. I too, have personal experience with people innocently saying even ONE fact that the investigator/supervisor tried to twist, making my job harder. I can defend a lack of words, and politeness, more times than not, than a missed/botched detail later. And... we all know how conveniently shoddy those body cams are. Anyways, I'll take my risks with being quiet, over trusting an officer to do his job right/working in my favor. "It's his job, but my right."

@Athonite

4 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the counterpoints.

@danni1993

4 жыл бұрын

I agree. I've watched videos of Officers, Lawyers, and Judges getting pulled over and they don't say anything. Even when they get pulled over for driving intoxicated, most often, they will refuse a breathalyzer or take a field sobriety test. Do they know something we don't know? I want to know why they refuse. If a Defence Attorney says "don't talk"...I will listen to him.

@kys00ner1

4 жыл бұрын

Anyone that’s ever been questioned/interrogated knows not to say a word.

@hav2win

4 жыл бұрын

@@rifleshooterchannel208 What a fking ignorant statement. Why would he be invited for an interview? And why would people be impressed that he took the time to give his opinion. You're the one who's the blowhard.

@Uberragen21

4 жыл бұрын

@@rifleshooterchannel208 I wouldn't say he is a _blowhard with zero credibility_ . That's somewhat inaccurate to say. If you said he was an expert in shooting techniques, but not legal stuff surrounding the aftermath of a shooting. You would be more accurate. Ayoob isn't a lawyer, he's a shooting expert. His advice was questionable. The more you talk, the more you incriminate yourself...even if you didn't do anything wrong. That's where I disagreed with his assessment of dealing with law enforcement after a shooting. He had some points that made sense on the surface, but I still would relay that information through a lawyer.

Thanks John for going straight to the well for this lifesaving drink of knowledge. Massad brings not only years of experience but also common sense to help us all better cover our ASP

Great job, both of you. Thanks.

wonderful video and enjoy sharing this info .. thanks for this EXTRA channel

@ASPextra

3 жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoy it!

What are cops told to do when they're involved in a shooting? I think we should do that.

@Scientist_Salarian

4 жыл бұрын

They ask for their union rep. Police Unions are far more powerful and connected than defense attorneys, unfortunately.

@JK-vc7ie

4 жыл бұрын

@@Scientist_Salarian Fortunately, not unfortunately. Cops risk it all for us for very little money. They deserve more.

@parler8698

4 жыл бұрын

Public pressure gets them fired for no reason.

@johnbyrne1022

4 жыл бұрын

It's a good starting point, but there is one big difference between them and you: their colleagues are *not trying* to get them locked up. They're trying to find ways to get them off the hook. .So all they have to do is avoid saying anything incriminating, and it will generally be interpreted in the most favorable light. You can't assume that they'll interpret your actions in the same light.

@psychodadandjfit3974

3 жыл бұрын

@J K. WRONG. Their job isn’t even in the top ten if dangerous jobs. They should be held to the highest standards. They should be severely punished for indiscretions. You’re either a cop or very naive.

A conversation between attorney Marc Victor and Ayoob would be fantastic!

@romans6two338

4 жыл бұрын

That would be an extremely useful briefing.

VERY consistent with what you teach all the time John - have a plan!

Well done for going back to Mas for his differing take on the matter vis-a-vis that of Marc Victor. You have dispassionately allowed two thoughtful, articulate, if opposing, view points to be compared and contrasted.

Massad Ayoob is an expert on guns and gun fighting and I will listen to every word he says on that subject. Period. But I will not listen to legal advice from someone who has never defended a shooting case in court. How many attorneys have you heard that said, "I could have gotten him off if he had kept his mouth shut!" A non-attorney cannot know what things will be taken out of context and twisted to be used against you by an ambitious DA. Do you trust police to remember exactly what you said and how you said it? And the most important of all, TALKING TO THE POLICE CAN'T HELP YOU! Nothing you say can be used FOR you in court! It's all hearsay! And who does he think he is, saying that somebody who panics after a gun fight should not be carrying a gun? I wouldn't want to know somebody who WASN'T shaken up after a gun fight.

@ASPextra

4 жыл бұрын

Mas is a court appointed expert witness who has been on litigation team for hundreds of actual litigations and helped hundreds of real people defend their life in court.

@freedomluvr5126

4 жыл бұрын

@@ASPextra That's interesting to know, but he is an expert witness, not an attorney. Big difference.

@Morggin

4 жыл бұрын

@@thebubbacontinuum2645 so ... you're a lawyer. How much did your law school teach you specifically about "Deadly Force law"? Did they teach you about the doctrine of competing harms/doctrine of necessity? Are you familiar with the concept of "An Affirmative Defense"? I suggest you take one of LFI courses. Massad will teach more about deadly force than you will ever learn at law school.

@marctrundle1416

4 жыл бұрын

@@ASPextra Are you also aware that he has been impeached on the witness stand while testifying in court as a witness? He was made a fool of while involved in court room testimony against the FBI years ago. Many of his articles written for the gun rags, "The Ayoob Files", were largely fabricated and less than factual. This plus his self enamored behavior of which I am personally aware of, leave me less than impressed. He does do a great job of marketing himself though!

@Rubycon99

3 жыл бұрын

@@marctrundle1416 Where can I read about this case? I read "FBI" and immediately think "scumbags", but I'd be interested in knowing the whole story.

While I agree with the sentiment I can't get over the fact that I need to make sure I tell the police enough to make sure the "Professionals" personal bias is satisfied to the point that he can function in an unbiased "professional" manner

@MiaogisTeas

3 жыл бұрын

It's not a personal bias, it's a professional one. As a teacher, I don't believe everything a kid tells me about what happens at their home, or why their homework looks like it was written by mommy. It's not that I don't trust the kid, I just know that it's human nature to protect oneself and one's ego - just as your comment suggests, actually.

Nice, I met Massad Ayoob in 2011, great guy with a wealth of Knowledge!!!

Massad Ayoob is nothing but pure class, character, wisdom, and knowledge. Thank you both, Mr. Correia and Mr. Ayoob. Keep fighting the good fight!

Still wont say anything without a lawyer present.

@1972glm

4 жыл бұрын

Agreed. I think that in a perfect world, Mas's advice isn't necessarily bad, and if you reasonably think you can follow it---go for it. But I just think it's real easy to start talking but not stop talking. Especially since cops are trained to get info from suspects and do so by pushing for it and/or appearing to be you friend. But it's not their job to be your friend. They want to get the "bad guy", and you maybe the BG to them. Also I don't trust them not to try and twist my words and screw me later. It happens all the time. I think the danger of overtalking is more than the danger of undertalking. Of course Mas would say that his method is just the right amount, but it's a gamble. I guess it's up to every individual. Now just shutting up immediately, eh I think you can say something to the effect "he tried to kill me, he had a gun/knife/pipe, and I defended myself" then shut up from there.

@gripboyjo.c9330

4 жыл бұрын

@@1972glm agreed. I'd say. Here's the body. There's the gun. I need my lawyer.

@loslosbaby

4 жыл бұрын

Bad guys can paint a picture and you won't be in it wearing a good guy hat.

@NikoBellaKhouf

3 жыл бұрын

@@1972glm even if the best cop in the world showed up and he was your actual friend, he could still unintentionally misinterpret what you say and it'll be used against you later.

@joeds3775

3 жыл бұрын

Another fool that ignores the expert.

From my experience, the absolute first thing I would say to do is put your hands in the air when they arrive and show that you are unarmed, say "I was attacked", the attacker is over here, and the weapon I used is here. From the very start it shows you are cooperative and not trying to hide anything. Also when you call 911, don't say "I just killed someone", say basically the same thing "I was attacked, I acted in self defense, please send an ambulance" It shows you don't want the attacker to die and you weren't meaning to kill them but to stop them.

@HickLif3

3 жыл бұрын

@bali song i was just telling my experience with it. That’s exactly what I did when I shot an attacker dead on my front porch and I only spent one night in the police department and except for maybe a hour of being handcuffed to a table the rest if the time was in interview rooms telling what happened. No charges were ever placed. No bail. No nothing. The only issue I had was it took almost 3 years to get my gun back.

@andrewvida3829

2 жыл бұрын

Not at all certain that I would stick around for the cops to show. You plug someone and have no idea whether his friends are close by. If I can get out of dodge, I'm gone. If my lawyer instructs me to turn myself in, that is what I do. I am under no obligation to further endanger myself for the sake of making the job of police easier. Keeping myself alive, is.

@skagenpige88

Жыл бұрын

@@andrewvida3829 While I agree you dont have to risk your life, saying his friends might be close by is really weak if he could have survived if you got him an ambulance.

The legend! Much respect to Mr. Ayoob!

I Really appreciate this one!

As an attorney, its to hard to give advice that at least keeps all your defenses open wo knowing a specific fact pattern. For example, if the government can’t make its case, then saying nothing is the right answer. Personally, if I were in a defensive situation, it would be important for the police to know you were afraid and took the most reasonable course of action you could come up with. Ayoob knows what he’s doing but I don’t think this advice can be applied universally.

@ASPextra

4 жыл бұрын

I think he gives principles and not a script, and for that, I think it has value.

@travelinman482

2 жыл бұрын

@@ASPextra Why are y’all at a church talking about guns?

@Vergoso_42

2 жыл бұрын

@@travelinman482 why not?

@travelinman482

2 жыл бұрын

@@Vergoso_42 Um, Jesus was against ‘living by the sword’ (aka the modern day AR rifle).

@travelinman482

2 жыл бұрын

@What saith the scripture? Keep lying to yourself.

I understand where Massad's thought process is coming from. Though in actual practice the likelihood of someone saying what he recommended versus self incriminating themselves seems to be very risky. You are already in compromised mental state after a shooting, yet you have the ability to coherently explain the situation rationally? I think very few people would be able to do so safely, without incriminating themselves. I think it's best to say nothing.

@danduran4981

2 жыл бұрын

Agreed. You are more likely to say something that will be detrimental to your case then helpful. We are not lawyers and certainly not competent to navigate the legal realm of giving a statement or answering questions without counsel.

Great to see Ayoob is still in the fight. Great advice

Awesome video, John! Thanks to you and Massad!!!

@ASPextra

4 жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it

i bookmarked this video and plan on watching it at least once everyday until i have it memorized.

@nmr6988

4 жыл бұрын

Me too.

@n.r.8719

4 жыл бұрын

Lots to memorize in a 12 minute video...

Thanks for uploading this for us to see. Another issue that wasn't discussed is obvious to us, but just not covered. Your concealed carry permit. CCW permit holders are some of the most lawful citizens in the country. They break the laws LESS than LE. The arriving LE personnel need to be told, and reinforced, that you have a lawful concealed weapon, and that you had a serious threat and you had to deal with it. You will cooperate in any way necessary, but wish to seek guidance from your attorney.

@stanleysourelis5104

Жыл бұрын

I really like the concise statement you advise someone to make.

Very very helpful! Thank You!

Great advice. Training doesn't end with a trigger pull. There's a whole process to be familiar with including the after action. The fight does not end until there's a final legal decision.

@thomasjensen6243

2 жыл бұрын

Every bullet has a lawyer attached to it.

great info

@johnniewasr5740

4 жыл бұрын

Indeed

Great information! Sure wish Mas’ books were back in print (e.g. In the Gravest Extreme).

Good to see you two together!

Great points and info!

Man... this has to be my favorite advice.... more of this!!!

The first book (and one I've given away about a dozen copies of) is Mr. Ayoob's "In the Gravest Extreme" - it's great to see that some of the advice has been updated in the last couple of decades to where the wisdom of years gone buy was that people don't go to prison for what the _didn't say_ and now it's say only what an investigating officer would need to know and let them be aware that you'll cooperate with them when council is there.

Priceless information period. Thanks ASP

Mass was my teacher in the 80s when I had a carry permit in NYC just had it not renewed last year This man is an Icon in the world of self defense my courses at LFI were invaluable but in those days there was one criteria for self defense and Mass always said so many are in jail because they didn’t respect the Avoidably aspect of the statute an essential ingredient to a sane self defense law leave it to Florida and others to remove the avoidably aspect of the law Stand your ground means goad someone into an act that qualifies as worthy of deadly force and use it what a perversion of self defense this is thanks Mass for making this so obvious to me

Thanks for making this video, very wise

So good. Thank you

Really good advice. Thank you.

Thanks for the advice!

Excellent. Thank you.

Mass has the best input. Excellent. Thanks for the info.

Always impressed by his knowledge

Massed speaks so calm and with common sense... plus he has been in this game for a long time.

@chuckschillingvideos

4 жыл бұрын

In this case, he's completely wrong and anyone taking his advice is doing so at his own jeopardy.

This was hilarious this guys vocabulary and mannerisms are real unique. Very informative too.

WOW WHAT A GREAT TOPIC!! IM YELLING SO HOPEFULLY YOU SEE THIS BETTER!! HE TALKS SO MUCH ABOUT THE SAME THINGS BUT THIS IS GREAT

Massad is a very smart man. He brought the cop perspective. Nice. I will be watching this video a lot and showing it to friends.

I started reading Massad Ayoob's books when I was 15 (35 years ago). He's a wealth of information.

@Dmanz67

4 жыл бұрын

Well, his advice here could get you life without parole for a crime you didn't commit.

@skagenpige88

Жыл бұрын

@@Dmanz67 Everything can, hes just trying to get you the best case to avoid getting parole for a crime you dident commit. Your advice might get someone life without parole too? Ever considered that?

What a great voice he has... golden pipes Ayoob

Don’t talk to police without an attorney.

@Trail-of-dead

4 жыл бұрын

Don’t talk to police even with your lawyer, let them do their job

@adamchurvis1

4 жыл бұрын

@@Trail-of-dead Wisest words yet, Trail of Dead. Bravo!

@timothyclyne

4 жыл бұрын

Massad Ayoob is a police officer.

@jondavidivey

4 жыл бұрын

@@Trail-of-dead Absolutely right. I've had expert witnesses like him who have been around so many lawyers they start thinking they know as much or more than a lawyer. Get a good experienced lawyer and let them do their job.

I was taught "I was in fear for my life, I want to talk to my lawyer" is the only thing you say. I like Mas's more in depth tutorial here.

@ASPextra

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah, that statement isn't magic words for sure.

@codemonkeymojo

4 жыл бұрын

I disagree with Massad on this. The Police don't decide your fate. The Prosecutor, Judge and Jury do. IMO you're better off lawyering up than saying something to convince the Police on scene you're innocent. It's not really their opinion that matters. By saying things to them you could hurt the opinions of those people who DO matter.

@darrellhamner4608

4 жыл бұрын

Got to remember Massad is talking from cops' perspective as he is (was?) one

@firedrake7179

4 жыл бұрын

Why, because you need MORE ways to incriminate yourself?

@seanmcdaniel6818

4 жыл бұрын

@@codemonkeymojo Ding ding ding. The cops never decide to prosecute, the DA,AG does. Focus on the long game, not making friends. Terrible advice.

I think Mass is telling us what he would do and framing it as what we should do. I don't think he realizes the difference between us and him. The guy is a professional orator with many decades of experience as an expert witness, firearms instructor, and police officer. He's well spoken, and extremely seasoned and intelligent. But as humans we are terrible judges of other people's knowledge versus our own, and this is a blindspot for everyone, including him. He is pulling from experience of particular cases he was involved with and thinking "ahh it would have been easier for this guy if he had done xyz at the scene!" but then not ALSO thinking about "hmmm, what if he talked more and said THIS, then he'd be FUGGED". You can be cooperative without saying a darn thing, don't be belligerent with the cops, listen to their verbal commands and enjoy your free ride downtown for questioning with consul present.

@klaykid117

8 ай бұрын

All he has to do is show his badge to get off a self defense charge

1) Prosecutor not gonna badger me on the stand unless my lawyer wants him to. 2) According to Marc (Attorneys for Freedom on your channel) if the prosecution does try to imply that I’m guilty to the jury for seeking council, then the charges could be dropped. I’d like to see this guy watch Marcs video on your channel and tell us what he disagrees with. This guy is recommending the use verbal judo on the police at the scene of a homicide where I’m the suspect. No thank you. I’ll play the long game.

@seankennedy4284

4 жыл бұрын

Verbal judo, indeed. I don't understand why this advice. Seems he's trying to have a trial right then and there.

@gmcjetpilot

2 жыл бұрын

Have you changed your opinion since Kyle Rittenhouse trial? You assumed the DEA in the prosecutor are super friendly to 2nd Amendment folks killing criminals and self-defense? That's a foolish promise.

Sorry but I'm keeping my mouth shut and calling an attorney and leaving it that.

@seanmcdaniel6818

4 жыл бұрын

Smart

@yoyo762

4 жыл бұрын

Now THAT is expert advice. Unlike moron Ayoob.

@glenncaswell9062

3 жыл бұрын

Think twice Tron. AN attorney may get you a divorce lawyer or real estate attorney. Mas has been involved in more self defense shooting cases than.most attorneys that specilize the the field and all of those that don't (99+%)

@yoyo762

3 жыл бұрын

@@glenncaswell9062 Think 3 times, glen. His advice is the advice of ALL criminal defense attorneys and I'll take their advice over this droning self proclaimed expert any day.

@NikoBellaKhouf

3 жыл бұрын

@@glenncaswell9062 how dumb do you have to be to get a real estate attorney to handle your criminal defense case?

Mr Ayoob is such a legend. John is on his way too.

@vector7818

4 жыл бұрын

Honestly, I think they're both badasses 😁

@pescatoralpursuit1726

4 жыл бұрын

Hope John never NDs into a range line roof in front of a crowd. Love Ayoob for decades but oof.

@yoyo762

4 жыл бұрын

A legendary idiot.

@todsimpkins8908

3 жыл бұрын

@@yoyo762 yes,., yes you are.

I don't see anything in a Miranda script about anything you say will be used for your defense. It's called a Miranda WARNING for a reason.

@Morggin

4 жыл бұрын

@ maybe you haven't seen that cops now have to wear a body camera.

@Morggin

4 жыл бұрын

@ so are you intimately familiar with the use of force laws then? What's your stance on Affirmative defense as it relates to the use of force shootings? Have you also heard of the doctrine of competing harms or the doctrine of necessity? (they are the same thing just different terms used in different states). Are you familiar with the Bernhard Getz case? I believe as many others do that Bernhard Getz's biggest mistake is going to a guilty man's lawyer. A lawyer that is famous for getting guilty men off the hook. I honestly believe it's because of his choice of lawyers that Bernhard had to spend almost a year on Rikers Island.

@richb.4374

4 жыл бұрын

Exactly! They tell you anything you say CAN and WILL be used against you in a court of law. The deck is already stacked against you before you even go to court.

@GS-cx6hv

3 жыл бұрын

@@richb.4374 the word you should have highlighted is against.........notice nothing about anything you say might help you? That's cause it won't

Great content. I train with a five-time champion for SASS, and his advice is very similar. Cooperate with the officer on scene. Your statement should be: 'I was forced to shoot because...' Point out evidence on scene. Make no further comments. Great advice.

@timothyclyne

4 жыл бұрын

Massad Ayoob is a police officer.

@jimbopurple2652

3 жыл бұрын

Make it as easy as possible for your lawyer say nothing.

I’ll follow legal advice

@petergunn1701

4 жыл бұрын

So you're calling your attorney before you call 911?

@bstimy

4 жыл бұрын

Peter Mahoney um, no. The legal advice I’ve been given is call 911 first. Tell them certain needed info, hang up. Call attorney.

@immikeurnot

4 жыл бұрын

@@petergunn1701 As Ben said, immediately after.

@rcvtacticalandfirearmsinst9107

4 жыл бұрын

1). Call 911- it’s recording while ringing - keep your mouth shut 2). Once they answer - give name -location - you were ATTACKED - Yiunwere FORCED to defend yourself- you need 2 ambulances (minimum- 1 for you and 1 for bad guy) - you need the police - HANG UP if safe to do so - immediately call your attorney 3) once police arrive - ID yourself - If firearm is used advise what direction you fired- that way they can make sure no innocents have been hit and need medical attention. 4) politely advise them that you will be more than happy to cooperate with investigation and answer any and all questions......once you have met with your attorney - INVOKE YOUR RIGHTS!! Everyone has the right to remain silent most don’t have the ability. It’s a natural reaction to explain or defend their actions. This is NOT the time or place for that.

I feel like if you got your lawyer friends together with this guy, they could take the good ideas of each side, and join them together to make one great idea. xD

@phillhuddleston9445

4 жыл бұрын

I would like to see a healthy debate about this subject between the lawyers and Massad since their recommendations are different.

@CallsItLikeISeizeIts

4 жыл бұрын

What he says is golden, you can be silent like every guy in hood. If you don’t talk to some extent, others wil for you.

@justins8802

4 жыл бұрын

Lawyers want you to be silent since it guarantees you will need their very expensive services. With Mas’s suggestion, you may avoid all suspicion and never need a lawyer, unless the family decides to sue you.

@Dmanz67

4 жыл бұрын

There is 1 great idea. Say nothing without your lawyer.

@shannonamos6303

3 жыл бұрын

@@justins8802 That is why anyone that carries needs USCCA insurance. In my State, if you use a firearm (even in self defense) you will be arrested and charged with murder/attempted murder. Then they let your attorney's hash it out in court.

This was one of the biggest takeaways I had from Mas' MAG20 - Armed Citizen’s Rules of Engagement course. Highly recommended for anyone who carries a gun!