I live in Australia. We invested in roof top solar like millions of other Australians. Unfortunately governments on the left and right have overseen the price we get for our solar energy from energy companies plummet. It’s ironic that Australia is now wasting vast amounts of renewable energy because governments on both sides of politics can’t work together to capture this energy. While I’m a fan of renewables, the fact is they don’t provide enough baseline power, in-particular during the night when most homes use most of their power.

@garneybaker

3 жыл бұрын

It seems politics is the problem on many levels in our societies. Politicized science and health, is contributing to divisionism and denial, leading us towards an environmental disaster.

@za7v9ier

3 жыл бұрын

heck I even read a report that the government is charging Australians for exporting this green electricity back to the grid!

@j.pgoodwin9020

3 жыл бұрын

The Politicians are just the visible actors, it is the ones behind that curtain that do the bribing, sorry campaign contributions that are the bad actors along with certain arguably evil media organisations that manipulate public perceptions and opinions

@lozoft9

3 жыл бұрын

That's why gov'ts should be funding geothermal R&D post-haste. If we can accelerate 10 years of development into 5 years, that will be all we'll need for the foreseeable future.

Thank you for everything you research for us. I'm on a fixed income and severely tight budget, and although I can't afford to financially donate, I spread the word about your channel all the time. Keeping us informed about changes that will overwhelm us over the next 20 years will be paramount, hopefully you'll be here to explain it all as we progress in an honest, easily comprehensive way. 💖

This is the first application of the hydrogen cycle that has an overall efficiency that I find palatable.

@mrhickman53

3 жыл бұрын

@bk_16 Fair enough. I am also sceptical but they have at least piqued my interest. My impression is that batteries will win the daily cycle but if the company can provide a cycle efficiency of close to 50% I would at least entertain the idea of incorporating such technology for longer outages. For areas that regularly have winter storm-related outages, coupling the waste heat energy into the home would improve overall efficiency The conundrum is that at the current price, several days worth of battery storage is economically competitive. Once one goes to 1/4 charge/discharge cycle per day the battery lifetime is approaching comparable performance to what the company is stating for the fuel cell. My desire to see at least 50% cycle efficiency is the collected solar energy is better sold to the grid than be used in a low-efficiency storage mechanism from a global warming perspective. We should prioritize more efficient processes until renewable energy has expanded to meet our full energy needs.

@jonmichaelgalindo

3 жыл бұрын

I'd like to be hopeful, but realistically, batteries are just getting better and better. They're already cheaper, with better efficiency, and they'll have longer lifetimes soon enough. I just don't see hydrogen technology catching up.

@mrhickman53

3 жыл бұрын

@@jonmichaelgalindo I tend to agree with you. I need to get off my search for seasonal storage and come to terms that renewable capacity generation capacity needs to be sized such that storage is at weather scale, not seasonal scale. Of course, the company is not promoting their product as such, but I was considering metal-hydride storage as an alternative to packing pipelines and underground formations with natural gas prior to peak season as what now occurs.

@hamsterminator

3 жыл бұрын

@@jonmichaelgalindo Battery technology has a lot of hard limits on what is possible, and those advances you mention are going to gain comparatively small increases in energy storage vs other mediums. Hydrogen won't need to try hard to catch up once battery tech plateaus, which it looks set to in the not too distant future.

@jonmichaelgalindo

3 жыл бұрын

@@hamsterminator That doesn't sound right. There are countless chemical systems that can cycle between differences in electrical bonds, possibly even systems that improve with use instead of degrading, and millions never yet synthesized. A bacterial battery would be free to manufacture, etc. I have never heard of any theoretical maximums other than 100% efficiency.

I love your videos. Happy Easter!

Home storage is a good idea even without windmills or solar panels as they can make the home independent for the times where there is neither wind nor sunshine to rely on or in the worst case a blackout.

@mrkokolore6187

3 жыл бұрын

@Claire H Hydrogen It´s always nice to meet like-minded people.

@colconn57

3 жыл бұрын

@@Embassy_of_Jupiter How would you get water in a "Texas style" emergency?? I'm guessing those people with battery storage and solar panels probably did quite well without the need for hydrogen.

@thelonelyrogue3727

3 жыл бұрын

@@colconn57 I have a well... and putting it in was a lot cheaper than buying energy storage.

@markplott4820

3 жыл бұрын

Mr Kokolore - WRONG, no wants a HINDENBURG in their Neighborhood , because it takes just ONE Hydrogen fuel cell to set the Whole Neighborhood on FIRE. SWB - Solar, Wind, Battery is the Cheapest form of Energy on Earth , you are BETTER off just getting SOLAR and a HOME lion Battery.

@mrkokolore6187

3 жыл бұрын

@@markplott4820 How on earth is a single hydrogen fuel cell(the cell is just a piece of metal where the hydrogen passes through) supposed to set an entire neighborhood on fire? Even if it was a big tank it would most likely only damage the house it is in as hydrogen isn´t napalm sticking on other houses. The worst that could (most unlikely) happen is the ignition of a close neighboring house that's it.

2 Thinks! First, my wife has chemical sensitivities so I made a hydrogen cook stove (Hindenberg I with modified natural gas range) and we cooked with H2 for years. The off-grid PV system electrolyzed water and stored H2 gas in an inverted barrel in a larger water filled barrel using only the pressure from the alkaline electrolyzers. We also purchased bottled H2 gas. Results are the chef-preferred "cooking with gas" but with no CO, CO2 pollution. Second, consider "H2 gas blending with CH4" at the home / business. Solar electrolysis H2 combining with natural gas at 10-20% H2 blend can be easily used in all gas appliances with no modifications. Reduced carbon and uses renewable energy to displace fossil fuel for distributed solar fuel at the point of use in residential, commercial and even industrial processes.

Brilliant, so helpful. I appreciate the links in the video description.

The energy ministery of my country (Chile), has started to invest a lot in green hydrogen at the north, not sure how it will develop in the next years

@sanansa4567

3 жыл бұрын

hopefully it will work out better then the management of your lithium resources. I saw a video where they didn't want to have experienced engineers from outside Chile assist and it is not being run effectively. Instead of hiring outside firms (for fear of being ripped off). I don't know why they just don't hire individual consultants

@lucasvillalobos6809

3 жыл бұрын

@@sanansa4567 because the country is ruled by clowns that only want money and status, they don't care about growing or helping people

@vrillx

3 жыл бұрын

@@lucasvillalobos6809 All countries are run by greedy power hungry clowns ....its what defines the 21 st century...

@antondegroot6061

3 жыл бұрын

@@vrillx It defines all of human history. I'm afraid its some sort of law of nature. Power hungry clowns are those who have the drive and ethics needed to rise to the top of society, so they are always our leaders. Democracy is supposed to stop that, but clearly it isn't working. We need to rethink how our system/society selects the people that rise to the top.

As I've come to expect from your videos, this was yet another very interesting and exciting development in the green energy industry. Enjoy your week holiday!

@JustHaveaThink

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you. Happy Easter to you too :-)

I didn’t get notified for this episode but stumbled here a day late. I have my bell on and had been eagerly awaiting to watch. Wtf KZread

Always great videos, logical and no BS!

We've been using acetylene dissolved in a carrier to make it safe and manageable, for 100 years. This is probably just the first of many hydrogen storage systems using this principle.

@j.pgoodwin9020

3 жыл бұрын

CSIRO has a patented storage as Ammonia, hydrogen is stripped out with a special membrane filter

@donalain69

3 жыл бұрын

Probably just the first to patent it, so they can make money from blocking it for the rest of the world. Capitalism really does everything anyhow possible to end humanity.

@stebarg

3 жыл бұрын

@@donalain69 True! The sick idea of trade is the root cause of ALL problems!!! Patents and money are tools to destroy the planet. Even the richest suffer!!! Wake up people and stop supporting bullshit!!!

@dnomyarnostaw

3 жыл бұрын

@@donalain69 Wow. Conspiracist trolls at work. They have already licensed it to three countries including South Korea.

@ClickToPreview

3 жыл бұрын

@@stebarg I assume you farm your own food, dug your own well, make your own clothes and shoes, and built your own house and every stick of furniture with your own hands right? "Trade" is a "sick idea" that is the root cause of all problems? Methinks thou doth protest too much.

"It takes more energy input from the fossil fuels than you get out. You can't make this up." All hydrogen production requires more energy put in than you get out. There is absolute no way around this law of physics.

@davidrossi1486

2 жыл бұрын

Precisely. That’s why the sensible are concentrating on hydrogen as a storage method. Use as a motive fuel Only makes sense when extremely high energy densities are required and gasoline is outlawed.

great vid! Every country needs this!

Extremely thought and experiment worthy!

Excellent - such a valuable and clear video. Very much appreciated, as someone who pays quite a lot of attention to Scott Morrison's massive climate policy vacuum.

it is indeed the HydroCarbons attempt to remain relevant and a financial force in Canada as evidenced by the Alberta Politicians statements that hydrogen technology will move forward to ensure jobs and a future for Canadas Oil and Gas Industries regardless of cost or viability.

Thank you for this excellent presentation of the evolution of Hydrogen for energy. Soon (I hope) you will present us with a user-friendly-economic-green-energy system for the home.

Fascinating stuff - thanks Dave!

Hydrogen storage in metal hydrides has been around for decades, I've even seen a large system personally in use at my university about a decade ago, feeding PEM fuel cells. This Lavo unit is just a sexy commercial version of very well established tech. The more important question is, why if it's been around for so long, has it not been widely implemented? Probably because fuel cells are generally considered as being too expensive to be practical at the moment, however, if they do become more mainstream, then hydrogen storage in metal hydrides would probably be the preferred choice imho.

@marclawson2536

3 жыл бұрын

Technology is only considered advancement when it serves capital. "Where will we put our meters?"

@RoadRashSpirit

3 жыл бұрын

My basic understanding of the metal hydride system is that it requires a high temperature to get the hydrogen back out again, which obviously uses energy which has to initially come from somewhere and will further reduce the efficiency of the whole system. For this reason it is un attractive and I do wonder if LAVO has a new chemical composition that mitigates this. There seems to be no mention of this so if I was a betting man I'd say not, luckily I'm not a betting man and I will watch this space over the next ten years.

@acmefixer1

3 жыл бұрын

@Nicola Toma The Gencell hydrogen fuel cell system can use ammonia for storing the hydrogen. The byproduct is nitrogen which makes up 79% of what we breathe. And the infrastructure for making ammonia is well established and produces huge amounts, but not green.

@travcollier

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, but that well established tech is optimized for different use cases. The landscape has shifted quite a bit with wind and solar costs coming down, so development of versions optimized to serve as "batteries" for that makes sense... And that sort of development/optimization isn't easy. I think where I've heard most excitement interest in metal hydride hydrogen storage in the past was around transport/cars. This application makes more sense to me, though I'm not certain about the fuel cell side of it.

@bozo5632

3 жыл бұрын

Because it doesn't make much sense without home solar or similar, which were very uncommon until recently.

Interestingly pretty much all of the state governments in Australia are at odds with the federal government in regards to carbon targets🙄

I absolutely love this channel :)

Good to see that there are arising so many options to store hydrogen

The metal sponge is the way Acetylene is stored.

@xdoods

3 жыл бұрын

I was thinking this, but if the term "hydride" is an actual chemical term, then there's little chance it's anything other than an alkali metal, which leaves about five candidates. When you factor in cost and abundance, then that narrows it down to three, and considering prices of lithium, that would bring it to two, cheapest and lightest of which is sodium or an alloy of NaK. I'd bet my GME stocks on it.

@Leopold5100

3 жыл бұрын

thanks, didn't realise Acetylene was absorbed into a metal

@tedf1471

3 жыл бұрын

I thought Acetylene was dissolved in an Acetone / kieselguhr slurry?

@iaindowling8993

3 жыл бұрын

@@tedf1471 yes in a metal sponge and the cylinder should never be laid on it’s side because of the Acetone

@stuffak4540

3 жыл бұрын

I could be wrong but I think the filling is more like a porous cementitious product. It used to be asbestos, but no longer I think.

Thanks, good video. I agree with your conclusion. More competetion will lower the costs while improving the designs. Green is improving at an astronomical pace. Yeah!!!

Really great content... Thanks for sharing this 💖

Excellent summation, thanks!

11:07 small mistake. You can't pressurise hydrogen to liquify it at "normal" temperatures. It's critical point is 32K.

@635574

3 жыл бұрын

Yes which makes the process even worse

@solartime8983

3 жыл бұрын

Did u mean ref. at 5:07? "(hydrogens) volume is enormous at normal temperature ...has to cryrogenically cooled to minus 250° Celsius" ?

Thank you for your ever so comprehensive video and information 🙏 love, from Portugal

Thanks again, and enjoy your well deserved holiday..

@JustHaveaThink

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you :-)

I love your videos! Great info and well delivered

Andrew Forrester a Iron Ore mining magnate, has expressed his interest into "green" hydrogen. Also making "green" steel. He is not waiting for govanostra. His company is Fortescue Metals.

@MrZoomah

3 жыл бұрын

Was seeing if anyone was going to mention Fortescue. Massive plan and hopefully the WA government can back it up

This isn’t new technology and it’s awesome to see it being pursued commercially finally.

@markplott4820

3 жыл бұрын

NOPE, too late . SWB - Solar , Wind, Battery is Already the Cheapest Power on Earth, Displacing Hydrogen, CNG and ALL Fossil fuels.

@richardstubbs6484

3 жыл бұрын

@@markplott4820 solar and wind yes, but batteries are not very environmentally friendly and are expensive ....

@markplott4820

3 жыл бұрын

@@richardstubbs6484 - this is FALSE , home batteries are a good Resourse as they REUSE spent BEV battery from cars , and battery Prices CONTINUE to fall each year. otherwise the Battery ends up in LANDFILL, at the END the Home battery can be RECYCLED and elements Extracted.

@aussie_al

3 жыл бұрын

I would like to know how many of these units have been produced. Its one thing to make something work on a bench but its different story to build at scale.

@EctoMorpheus

3 жыл бұрын

@@markplott4820 hey maybe throw some more capslock in there

Great vid as always!!!

Enjoy your easter JHAT!

I wonder they had considered using the heat from the electroliser as past of the domestic water heating. That would raise the operating efficiency.

@durwoodmaccool890

3 жыл бұрын

There's an idea.

@petermaceachern4843

2 жыл бұрын

@@durwoodmaccool890 the water inside the units do get hot well normal wet cell hho`s, you could incase a wet cell in moving liquid or pipes around it and use that as a heat source

@nitinmittal213

2 жыл бұрын

It is not a continuous process. Once the electricity storage is done, no heat will be produced. I doubt if it would be viable to add the complexity.

@market0that

2 жыл бұрын

@@nitinmittal213 agreed but given you are creating hydrogen as a fuel to heat the home. This short term heat would be added to the hot water store. It would mean less hydrogen needs to be burned for heat etc. If 30% of the energy is lost to heat using it is a significant boost in efficiency.

@andrewrance

2 жыл бұрын

@@market0that yeah I too love commercial Tri Gen systems! Looking at this system I suspect they already have too many components and potential points of failure, adding more on paper gives economic efficiency gains but I suspect would make the system even more unwieldy and “between” applications and all but impossible to gain domestic market penetration.

This could lead to a real EXPLOSION in home storage.. ;)

@brianfretwell3886

3 жыл бұрын

Well I wouldn't want to store much at home.

@angellestat2730

3 жыл бұрын

only if the people working in the system are as idiots as you.

@gryph01

2 жыл бұрын

Lol

@GamingDad

Жыл бұрын

1 reason why lithium ion based home batteries scare the shit out of me.

@kyleyoung2464

Жыл бұрын

Its actually safe. Hydrogen tanks can be shot and leak out and not cause a fire.

Thanks for the insight in Australia's storage abilities and technology, great to hear that Australia can compete with the rest of the world🥸

fantastic information, new subscribers 👏 😀

Without knowing which metal is hydrated, it's hard to know if this is just trading one problem for another one down the road.

@danyoutube7491

3 жыл бұрын

True; presumably it will not be one of the more abundant and commonplace metals or else the hydrogen absorbing property of it would surely have been appreciated long ago. In which case, it could be something that is in short supply.

@jimmyb1451

3 жыл бұрын

@@danyoutube7491 I posses none of the requisite knowledge to hazard a guess, however, when welding, low hydrogen rods are used because of hydrogen embrittlement of steels and iron. Perhaps it's not such an exotic material?

@nicholaskelly6375

3 жыл бұрын

At a guess I would presume titanium is the most likely candidate. This isn't new technology and the idea has been kicking around for years. The trouble is that like a battery it takes time to charge and discharge. If the manafacture have managed to improve the technology then this could be a real "Game Changer" The main advantage is you don't have to store pressurised hydrogen.

@nicholaskelly6375

3 жыл бұрын

@Claire H Hydrogen I am not surprised by that. As various metal hydrides have the ability to take up hydrogen. I only mentioned titanium because it is relatively cheap like aluminium. Certainly this is a good idea and I hope that it becomes reality.

@msvaughan

3 жыл бұрын

I think so, posted a comment saying that in the future if this is used as a permanent power source there would be an issue down the road where there is too much oxygen in the atmosphere instead of carbon dioxide. Besides, when this thing is running, just don't have a naked flame nearby!!!... boom

Thank you for your thoughts and knowledge. You mentioned that in Australia we can utilise millions of panels. Recently we have heard that people will be charged for uploading their excess power to the grid. I wonder if you could please investigate this recent change, thank you.

@thankyouforyourcompliance7386

3 жыл бұрын

Interesting. There are some real costs related for measuring & administration of exporting electricity into the grid. More volatile energy makes it also more difficult = expensive for the lazy base load systems like coal to react. If they blame the green energy for that they have an argument to penalize them. But is it really the fault of regenerative energy production that coal firing can not be properly adjusted to demand? This argument is imo based on a big fossil power generation perspective that is disturbed and wants to remain alone in the market.

@massimookissed1023

3 жыл бұрын

Sounds like bollox to me. Who would actually pay to provide excess energy to the grid when they could just disconnect and supply nothing ?

@nerdy1701

3 жыл бұрын

@@massimookissed1023 solar panels disconnected from a load don't fair too well. They heat up pretty dramatically but I suppose you could cover them

@walterwego1396

3 жыл бұрын

There are some complex arguments in this proposal - and it has been on the cards for a while. As a solar owner I was initially frustrated by this. It will however be scale based on what your system can feed in and you would still be making a 'profit' or credit as Origin puts it. I have heard arguments that we are effectively using an extant system to sell our produced solar and expect to be able to do so without incurring costs. My response is that the feed in tariff is lower than the purchase point which should be covering this cost. I think real and significant issue is bigger than all of this. Its that NSW State Govt could see the writing on the wall and sold off the poles and wires a few years ago to avoid it being their problem - consequently the private industry has not invested and now we have a grid incapable of dealing with the burgeoning solar during the day and supply everyone during the night (I say this as a layman and am happy to have further explanation provided to me). My personal belief is that more incentives should be put towards home solar owners purchasing battery options rather than penalizing those investing in home solar. This would relieve the grid... of course then those energy companies wouldn't be making their dollars at night.

@projectmalus

3 жыл бұрын

@@nerdy1701 What do you mean they heat up? The charge controller disconnects the array by not using power from it, if batteries are full. The panels sit there obediently until needed. Using them doesn't cool them off!

Nice overview, thanks!

Great stuff buddy!

Lavo could make sense today in a hybrid commercial system today where you use hydrogen and lithium ion. There is a portion of your storage that will need to cycle at a far higher rate so hydrogen can be used for that while the lithium ion can be used more for the medium term storage. Kind of like cache and RAM memory on a computer.

@per.kallberg

3 жыл бұрын

It would be the used the other way around. Batteries usually have massive cycle capability if you only use a small amount. Main question after the video is the power density. Could one unit produce 10 kW to power a home?

@per.kallberg

3 жыл бұрын

@Marc Jackson These units contain Lithium batteries and those batteries are used as I state. Info available in there spec. The power density is fairly low 5kW. It’s not enough to run a home. Info also available in there spec. Li-ion cells can have a million cycles if the correct circumstances are fulfilled. In these applications Li-Fe is common and they don’t suffer from thermal runaway.

@per.kallberg

3 жыл бұрын

@Marc Jackson Stop being a jackass and go read the spec for the product. It clearly state what I have written earlier. I tried to link it but YT won’t let me. There are some peer reviewed papers on micro cycles for Liion batteries. Read those as well. If what you say would be correct regenerative breaking in electric cars wouldn’t exist. There is no need to get offensive or have a bad attitude. Please behave as the best version of yourself.

So each module stores 10 kWh, and they are removable. So if the modules can be made cheaply enough, an outhouse could store a winter's worth of a Passivhaus-standard energy needs. Bit of a fiddle having to keep changing them but IMHO it's a move in the right direction.

@matthiasmay1977

3 жыл бұрын

It depends on module cost if this would be viable. At least a mechanism for exchanging modules would be quite simple and the capacity could be upscaled easily.

@durwoodmaccool890

3 жыл бұрын

Or just bigger modules. Might be more practical than swapping modules out. Or swappable modules could be used for powering a vehicle or other mobile device. One big advantage this kind of system offers is long term storage, basically any arbitrary length of time. Batteries aren't real good at holding charge for long periods. Whereas this thing really dosn't have much limit on how long ot could hold energy for.

@EdgeMasterPro

3 жыл бұрын

Wow so you can fill up the modules abs easily swap them out. If the modules are cheap why not have larger racks of modules.

@ianworthington2324

3 жыл бұрын

The video suggested the modules need to be kept pressurised to stop the H leaching out, though perhaps the pressures required aren't too onerous?

I just love your videos...absolutely fantastic

Great video as always. Thank you :-D

3:55 This looks like real progress to me. I have no doubt that, ten years ago, Morrison would have simply said "There is no credible energy transiton plan," and simply omitted the rest.

@idunnoay

2 жыл бұрын

3 years ago ScoMo brought a lump of coal into our parliament - now he doesn't talk about coal, only gas. Technically it is progress in the right direction, but nowhere near fast enough and we're still likely to have new gas fields, electricity generation plants and "blue" hydrogen hubs here, locking in higher emissions for decades to come. Luckily there is some momentum for the green version of hydrogen, and one of our many mining billionaires is actually putting real money behind specifically green hydrogen, saying there is no point in developing any other kind in a low emissions world. Just need the message to get through to the pollies.

@ronaldgarrison8478

2 жыл бұрын

@@idunnoay Oh yes, I know about ScoMo, even over here; just saw footage of him yesterday, in fact, in one of a seies of videos on the history of Tesla. We have Inhofe and his snowball, you have ScoMo and his lump of coal. You probably heard the saying that science progresses one funeral at a time. Alas, it tends to apply to politics as well.

I would like some follow-up videos to the New tech you've brought up over the years. New stuff is cool to hear about, but viability is only proven over time and I find it incredibly hard to check up on these things.

@letsgosurfing1786

3 жыл бұрын

The sad truth is most don't go anywhere, not because of some fossil fuel bogeyman but because an engineering hurdle that has yet to be overcome.

@autohmae

3 жыл бұрын

@@letsgosurfing1786 I would be more specific: because they couldn't bring the price down for mass-production or some other mass-production problem.

@boncholio

3 жыл бұрын

Good idea!

Exploring technology opportunities is part of the discovery of what works best under varied conditions.

Thank you very very much. Will share on FB.

Metal hydrides for storing hydrogen have been a known technology since the late 80's

@typhoon743

3 жыл бұрын

But the commercial viability has been lacking. However if countries start putting in carbon tariffs left and right, it may definitely swing. Especially for applications where extremely high heat is required. Carbon free combustion would make a great contribution towards removing a large portion of humanity's green house gas emissions especially smelting, cement clinker production etc...

@LaserGuidedLoogie

3 жыл бұрын

Exactly right, but they are heavy and they get really hot.

It would be really interesting if those hydride units are easy to remove when full and, say, stick in your car, or sell to someone who needs more energy.

@lestermarshall6501

3 жыл бұрын

Or store them on a shelf for future need.

@gtranquilla

3 жыл бұрын

The typical hydride is iron oxide which is massively heavy, i.e. far to volumous and heavy for practical hydrogen storage inside an electric vehicle.........even those super heavy lithium based batteries used in e-vehicles are lighter.

@gtranquilla

3 жыл бұрын

While much of this is interesting, i could not help but notice a significant and unwarranted degree of implied negative bias towards the fossil fuel industries. But that is likely due to my 40+ Electrical engineering career serving a broad range of energy industries beginning with hydro and CANDU fission nuclear and ending with oil and natural gas industries with some PV solar and environmental soil remediation tossed into that mix. The devil is in the details and who could know better than the energy industry engineers who struggle with intense laws of physics, economics and budget constraints 24/7/365 days a year. “Its not so much what we don’t know that gets us into trouble but what we know for sure that just ain’t so!” - Mark Twain.....and “It is much easier to fool someone than it is to convince that person that they have been fooled!” Consult any electrical engineer who has worked in a variety of energy related industries to gain a more thorough and indepth understanding of the transition challenge ahead....preferably one who is retired as those who are still working know enough to remain silent when their career could be on the line for speaking against an obviously bad energy concept...... You will not find many engineers who manage energy projects from the top down......but wealthy business men who hire engineers to do their bidding.

@JustHaveaThink

3 жыл бұрын

They are removable, and I think the company does hope to use them for different applications. Nott sure about a car though.

@EdgeMasterPro

3 жыл бұрын

@@JustHaveaThink a joke for us Australians if they are removable we could have them like a swappa bottle (8.5-9 kg gas bottles for the BBQ) we are psychologically trained to monitor the gas bottle abs swap them over

Great Presentation ---very professional ans balanced

Interesting to see how this will develop.

I think the low round-trip charge / discharge (in)efficiency won’t compensate for the high claimed cycle count. It’s a physical limit and can’t be improved much whereas cycle improvements in Li technology and further price falls will continue to improve it.

@onur6233

3 жыл бұрын

I completely agree. I don't think hydrogen makes sense in home storage and cars. This invention may have a great potential in planes/container ships where energy density is more important than efficiency and cost. And maybe grid storage, when you want to store energy for months due to seasonal abundance of a power source.

@suokkos

3 жыл бұрын

@@onur6233 , New batteries promise to allow use them as structural parts. This would allow battery replace some support structures reducing extra weight added. Chalmers University of Technology claims a breakthrough which would be good enough for products soon. They promise comparable strength to aluminium with 75Wh/kg specific energy which is close to 150-250Wh/kg for batteries in market.

@moblet

3 жыл бұрын

Even if this storage technology can't be improved, small-scale solar and wind generation technology can, which will continue to push down the cost of the additional generation capacity needed for this storage, making the lower round-trip efficiency less relevant to anyone with enough real estate to host the additional capacity. LAVO is targeting remote off-grid applications where there is plenty of real estate for solar and wind generation and the easier transport and longer lifespan will be advantages.

@xxwookey

3 жыл бұрын

Li storage is already 95% efficient so there is no room for improvement there. It's all about cost. This box claims to be cheaper than Li per kWh stored. Ultimately that's all we care about. PV is 20% efficient, Petrol engine is

@guiltyspark659

3 жыл бұрын

@@xxwookey You've missed the point completely. Li-ion is already significantly more efficient than this technology but OP was referring to storage capacity, cycle-life, and cost of ownership, which will be on the decline thanks to the massive push for batteries in the EV market. He also mentioned that there is a limit to the round-trip efficiency of hydrogen and will be capped, thanks to heat loss, long before it reaches the 95% mark we see with Li-ion.

It's always been a reality. But the tank you need is impracticably large. This is amazing.

@Christianbeale888

3 жыл бұрын

Dimensions: 1680 x 1240 x 400 mm, fairly larger than the power wall (1150x760x150mm) but if you have the space and can be kept outside still practical.

@LaserGuidedLoogie

3 жыл бұрын

Storing hydrogen in any useable form has always been a nightmare. If Lavo has solved this problem in such a small formfactor, then that is a monumental discovery on the scale of nuclear power. I'm betting it's BS.

Great vid...good timing.....👍

Very nice solution. Similar to HomePowerSolutions in Berlin, Germany. Produce H2 in summer and store it for the winter - will be a key technology! Great video, thanks.

I am hopeful for the technologies but skeptical because of the link to fossil fuels. Great video :>

@MrBenstero

3 жыл бұрын

It can start on fossil fuels but can eventually transfer to just using water as well when we find an easier way that's less energy intensive.

@autohmae

3 жыл бұрын

Remember this Lavo system has 0 connection with the fossil fuel, it's just a different kind of battery for the home.

@AndPennyThought

3 жыл бұрын

@@autohmae True, I have no problem with the battery itself, just the production of the fuel it uses (hydrogen).

@autohmae

3 жыл бұрын

@@AndPennyThought well, for this product the production only happens near the battery, so at home. No external fuel company involved.

@AndPennyThought

3 жыл бұрын

@@autohmae Oh geeze I think I misunderstood. For some reason I thought that tanks would have to be refilled! Thanks for pointing it out!

Love the cycle life. Hopefully they can get round trip efficiency up and cost down. . . .

@VinoVeritas_

3 жыл бұрын

Round trip efficiency isn't that important if the initial embodied energy is drawn from wind or solar. Mitigation of the intermittent nature of wind and solar is the greatest concern.

@iwiffitthitotonacc4673

3 жыл бұрын

@@VinoVeritas_ Some energy lost > all energy lost.

@VinoVeritas_

3 жыл бұрын

@@iwiffitthitotonacc4673 Exactly!

@phalanx3803

3 жыл бұрын

@@VinoVeritas_ Practicality is also important. as a farmer if you gave me the choice of 2 tractors one H2 and one EV i would take H2 it can be refilled in the field just as fast a diesel compared to an EV tractor that would need to be driven all the way home and take hours to recharge and we dont have time to wait around work has to be done or mother nature will leaves us behind.

7 months ago??? I’ve always been on lookout for anything green technology even earth batteries. This is the 1st time I saw you. Wonderful presentation. Look forward to seeing you on our “major media” news here in America.

@8a41jt

2 жыл бұрын

Just don't hold your breath. What I've found, here in America, is that you *must go looking* for the information. If the powers that be don't see profit in disseminating the information ... well, you know the rest of the story.

This is a great Australian invention developed into a commercial product. We are only a couple of months from the first commercial installation, so we will see how it works coupled with solar panels. It looks like a perfect fit to fill the power gap early morning and at night.

So, I might be wrong here, but in addition to being more than double the cost of a tesla power wall, wouldn't you also need to double your solar capacity in order to make up for the 50% efficiency rate? I think that needs to be considered as part of the total cost of ownership for a system like Lavo, since it's roughly 50% less efficient than the battery.

@ivobrick7401

2 жыл бұрын

It depends how much time are they able to hold power, even inefficient one. If you have double the power you need from your solar, let's say you use 2MV / year, you will need 4kWp solar array - that will cost you 149 eur / per 330 Wp panel, that mean little under 900 eur total (adition to your power plant). Also, need to know other things like max charging capacity of those new LAVO battery etc.

Brilliant concept open up a very healthy contest in storage intuitive and inventive product is wait will save humanity dispute politics

Love the direction this technology is taking!

Finally on the right track

If it's patented it's the opposite of "held close to the chest" - in fact, it's then public information

@bknesheim

3 жыл бұрын

They do not have to describe the exact method used to make the storage. They just have to describe how it function. Just have a look at some of the crazy software patents that have been granted.

@multimedia8729

3 жыл бұрын

@@bknesheim Yes and no. Look at what happened to Pfizer with Viagra - they lost their patent because they did not describe which component was the active one - just some mixture. This resulted in loosing their patent for the active ingrediant - and in generic Viagra. Softwarepatents are a whole different can of worms - and I believe they only work because of a cold war - everybody is holding so many softwarepatents which would disrupt the other side that nobody challenges them.

@bknesheim

3 жыл бұрын

@@multimedia8729 I would say that this is basically what i meant. You have to describe what makes it work, but not how you make the part/ingrediant.

The perfect home hydrogen fuel cell would get its water for electrolysis from rain water barrels, use excess solar power to convert the rain water to H2. The hydrogen fuel cell can power the house at night and warm the house during winter and run AC units during the summer. The fuel cell’s water byproduct is undrinkable without processing; you can either use that water to keep radiated heat pipes full, or filter/mineralize/soften the water for drinking. For me, I’d like to use a CO2 scrubber to turn the fuel cell’s water to soda water. Unlimited vodka club.

Neat! Storing compressed hydrogen always seems a bit scary to me. Storing it in some kind of foamy metal sounds GG.

It was an Aussie youtuber Chris Vanderstock that brought this to my attention some months ago and I did mention it and link to him and the Company both here and at several other sites such as the Limiting factor

4:13 Mark Z. Jacobson used as a source to "comprehensively debunk" anything is an oxymoron. His work is highly contested despite his tendency to sue anyone who disagrees with him.

@davitdavid7165

3 жыл бұрын

Probably a mistake.

@doritoification

3 жыл бұрын

@@davitdavid7165 Yeah I just feel the need to call out anything that references Mark Z. Jacobson because of the damage his "work" does

@davitdavid7165

3 жыл бұрын

@@doritoification dont know who he is,but from what i heard from you he deserves to be called out. Thank you

@davidmartin3947

3 жыл бұрын

I am disappointed in this channel. Jacobson deserves the patent for 'fake news' and is a complete nutter. And the ideological critique the author offers for seeking to dismiss hydrogen from natural gas with or without carbon capture and storage on the grounds that the fossil fuel industry is using it as a ruse is comparable to a marxist notion of 'fellow travellers' Numerate critiques look at the numbers. Hydrogen obtained by reforming for use in home fuel cells, as they do in 300,000 homes in Japan, means that the heat can be used for hot water, instead of vented to the atmosphere as present gas turbines do. So something of the order of a 30% improvement in energy utilisation and consequently fewer carbon emissions is dismissed as not ideologically pure enough. And some carbon capture methods result in solid carbon, for easy sequestration, and also industrial use. Ideologues banging on about their hobby horses without a real understanding of the technologies or a sensible numerical evaluation of options are part of the problem, not the solution.

TLDW: Unlikely edit: glad you addressed the link to fossil fuel companies

@JustHaveaThink

3 жыл бұрын

I can always spot which generation is talking to me... my Dad's generation tell me I talk too quickly, and my nephews generation tell my I talk too slowly. That tells me I've got it spot on ;-)

@morkovija

3 жыл бұрын

@@JustHaveaThink yup. I sense paper publishing worthy research)

@jedburnell9046

3 жыл бұрын

Hydrogen is just Gasoline wearing a dress.

Brilliant thank you

Love this. Do like your channel.

"Cooking on gas is one thing, Hydrogen, not so much" How does that make a difference lol! I'd rather cook on Hydrogen any day over propane lol! Hydrogen is Clean!

@morteza1024

3 жыл бұрын

Hydrogen burns so hot it melts anything

@julieheath6335

3 жыл бұрын

H2 does tend to explode if there's a leak. Kind of a negative. Don't forget the "Oh, the humanity!" Quote from the Hindenburg explosion...

@3000gtwelder

3 жыл бұрын

@@morteza1024 the make Hydrogen stoves.

@3000gtwelder

3 жыл бұрын

@@julieheath6335 Not, not really. It’s actually safer than gasoline. It is only dangerous in a confined space. It floats up and dissipates, where as Propane settles in low areas as it’s heavier than air. That “oh the humanity “ quote gets used for the wrong reasons way too much 😂

@angellestat2730

3 жыл бұрын

@@morteza1024 that is a lie.. hydrogen with air or oxygen burns at lower temperature than methane or most hydrocarbons. You are comparing just methane with air, vs hho which is a perfect mixture of hydrogen and oxygen.

I would think they could get the price down with economies of scale. However, I hope whatever metal they use is not an expensive one, e.g., platinum, which is used in Plug Power’s PEM fuel cells.

@quitequiet5281

3 жыл бұрын

Good point made. That would explain why the price tag is so high.

@jackdbur

3 жыл бұрын

Any fuel cell will have both expensive materials and expensive nanotechnology to get a decent efficiency level. Still your talking electricity to gas then back to electricity. Remember KISS principle make electricity : store electricity : use electricity. No middle step = more efficient less bits to go wrong or add cost.

whatever system they develop you can rest assured that either it will have a limited life (then you have to buy another) or they will make parts that have to replace, but what they will not allow you to have is a lifelong maintenance free system. Check out the new Hydrogen powered JCB that even gets its H2 from abroad in on-site storage tanks (excellent carbon footprint I must say) I have repeatedly asked them why their new engine is not HOD (Hydrogen On Demand) but have been ignored!

Thanks for explaining this for the average consumer. 😊

Have you considered making a video on the environmental impact of NFTs?

@moonlight-hm4bh

3 жыл бұрын

I guess most of it is linked to crypto mining, but in that case, a video on that would also be great

FYI, as an Australian I would like to declare that ScoMo is an absolute Womble.

@MrArcher0

3 жыл бұрын

As an American could you please translate that for us? Lol

@kaneo6162

3 жыл бұрын

As an Australian, I declare this sentence horrific. Wombles are fictional re-cycling heroes from the 70's. Lauding the PM, or an insult in some wrong fashion? FYI : Wombles are organised, work as a team, Wombles are tidy and Wombles are clean. Underground, overground, Wombling free. The Wombles of Wimbledon Common are we. Wombles are awesome. SocMO not so.

@kaneo6162

3 жыл бұрын

ScoMo is short for Scott Morrison, Australia's current Prime Minister.

@VMRDY

3 жыл бұрын

Without him you would’ve seen far more COVID deaths. Labor’s Dictator Dan’s COVID performance was responsible for 90% of Australia’s COVID deaths.

Interesting report. Could help solve the intermittency problem if renewables. I wonder about the environmental impacts of the mystery metal used in the process.

Thanks! Very interesting vid.

Awesome content 👍👍

@chrisdaniels3929

3 жыл бұрын

Agreed. This was a good video.

You can also use process heat from nuclear powerplants to create hydrogen using thermochemical processes to produce carbon-free hydrogen as you would with renewables only more reliable.

Me and my team in the university of tennessee at chattanooga department of engineering used this technology to power a small “chemical” car in regional and national competitions. Presentation of the pack was 5 V output and 0.5A. Very neat and important piece of tech here

@bogtrotter5110

3 жыл бұрын

"Me and my team used this technology....." Even grade schooler has better English.

@gutundu

2 жыл бұрын

@@bogtrotter5110 you bored?

@bogtrotter5110

2 жыл бұрын

@@gutundu Nah, just disgusted. We are engineering our planet to death.

@gutundu

2 жыл бұрын

@@bogtrotter5110 Seems like it. hopefully this tech helps us use more renewables though

Genius idea to combine hydrogen as a hydride instead of compressing or freezing. 50% of excess energy is a 100% gain of what would be a waste product. Great optimistic content again, well done and keep it coming.

"Electricity at low prices" LMAO. Prices and profits won't drop until energy companies (same for other utilities) are no longer privately owned. Maybe if Australia went on the 'green' production H2 use they could desalinate seawaterand regreen the interior.

@Tasmantor

3 жыл бұрын

You sure you ment privately owned?

@coreys2686

3 жыл бұрын

UK has had negative wholesale prices in the last couple years, and paying people to charge their cars.

@coreys2686

3 жыл бұрын

Ownership matters little. Corruption is the biggest problem, followed by poorly maintained infrastructure. And why use solar to split water into hydrogen, recombine it for power, then use that to desalinate water? Hydrogen isn't an energy source, per se. Its a storage medium, just like how petroleum is storing energy that plants used millions of years ago. The interior has already been greened to a certain extent. The range of kangaroo has expanded tremendously, thanks to the water sources that ranchers have for their livestock

@xijinpingpong4426

3 жыл бұрын

The high energy prices in Europe are mostly a result of renewable energy that won't be stored for times with no sun and no wind. So the old infrastructure is still there for this times and gets maintained. The old infrastructure produces less and costs nearly the same. At the same time more wind turbines and solar panels get build without building enough storage systems. The renewable energy gets highly supported by the state. Building storage systems is expensive and the old infrastructure is already there. So it is at least in most of Europe a result of energy politics and not of the "bad" private companies.

"RedFlow" 😂 I mean, I get it, redox flow -> RedFlow, but it just evokes menstruation imagery ^^

@oneirophon8912

3 жыл бұрын

When he said that name, my immediate thought was "Do they realize what that sounds like?!"

@citationsloth

3 жыл бұрын

Lol the power of my pissed off wife

@black_platypus

3 жыл бұрын

@@citationsloth If we could harness that, this channel would be out of a job! 😁

@godfreypoon5148

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah, that name is... uh... not real good.

6:20 I remember 30 years ago a US company created "steel wool" that could store hydrogen, it could only be released under a vacuum, which made it completely safe for vehicles.

The latest from Australia is the power industry wants to penalize people that have PV systems at certain times of the day for putting power into the grid. This is on top of having a difference of up to 30 cents per kilowatt for PV as against power from the grid (for example 11 cents for a PV kilowatt and then charging 37-38 cents per kilowatt in return to the same customer).

@westozbb8324

3 жыл бұрын

11 cents is better than the WA government give - they only pay 7.135 cents per unit

I want to go like grandpa quietly in my sleep; not like the kids kicking and screaming in the back seat of the car

@GeoFry3

3 жыл бұрын

I heard it grandpa was a pilot for 40 years who died peacefully in his sleep....his passengers on the other hand died screaming.

🙂 Very interesting. Maybe it could be used for long term storage without power loss over time, cutting down the wastage problem of degrading batteries 👍

I'll ruminate about this one, and comment in Patreon.

That was jolly interesting alternative

Your assessment of hydrogen in the big picture is spot on Dave. And in the small scale, energy cost to create hydrogen is very high which will never yield a high round trip efficiency needed for energy storage. There is no getting around this fact. Perhaps the utility and capacity will be the thing of value, certainly not efficiency.

The US PBS program Scientific American Frontiers S14 E3 'Future Car' discussed this same metal in the back in 2004.

We live in exciting times!

Would very useful if you could compare the Lava system to HPS - Picea a German home hydrogen system which uses hospital like oxygen gas bottles for storage, different from the Australian storage HPS was founded in 2012 ,but has existing home owner users who have surplus solar generation capacity in the summer. The Picea electrolyser uses the excess solar energy in the summer, produces hydrogen for storage and use in the winter. There are a number of videos on KZread showing the system working with owners comment on its efficiency and cost - it is not cheap! But one video shows a large chalet in the Swiss mountains now having all year around electricity where previously only a generator could supply electric, the house being nowhere near the local grid. Keep up the good work - your videos are always fascinating!