Based on my testing, I've discovered that achieving optimal noise performance and dynamic range involves a specific workflow. Begin by balancing the image or adjusting the exposure according to your preference; if there are skin tones present, aim for around 38 IRE with false color. Next, increase the exposure by 0.5 to 1.0 full stop without overexposing the highlights. You can later adjust this in post-production to maintain a pristine image quality. Additionally, I've developed a custom N-Log to Rec709 conversion LUT, drawing inspiration from the color rendering of ARRI cameras, particularly the Alexa 35.

@AaronSpieler

4 ай бұрын

That's quite the workflow. Do you mostly shoot in studio/controlled environments? And are you using an external monitor? I don't think the Z cameras have that built in, so I am assuming that you are. 38 IRE sounds pretty low for skin tones, even with how dark/contrasted N-Log shoots. Is there a reason you don't shoot 18% grey at 34-48 IRE? I have found that gets the best results for me, at least with skin tones present in the composition. I hardly have to correct anything at that point and skin tones sit at about 68-75 IRE once I apply Nikon's V2 3D LUT to Z 9/Z 8 footage. The Z 8 and Z 9 are ever so slightly different, but that hasn't been a big enough deal for me. Also, how did you create your own 3D conversion LUT? I would love to know more about that and if you use it for everything you shoot. Did you make it in Resolve? Does it work in every NLE? I'm so curious haha. Thanks for your comment, always love hearing how other people do things to help me learn and grow.

@ErikSutton1

4 ай бұрын

@@AaronSpieler Ah my bad😂 Of course middle gray is what I meant for 38 IRE! Yeah I normally place the skin tones at the 65 to 75 IRE range!😁

@AaronSpieler

4 ай бұрын

Oh! Gotcha haha. That makes more since. I was like damn that's dark lol

@ErikSutton1

4 ай бұрын

@@AaronSpieler I created the conversation LUT in resolve, in combination with a CST and many adjustment nodes to control color rendition. I use my LUT for everything N-Log, either as is, or as a starting point for a creative grade👍🏼😁

@AaronSpieler

3 ай бұрын

That's awesome! We dove into color grading last fall as our weddings became more often. So we are still very new to the process, but slowly trying to learn haha

So if I expose NLOG with a Shinobi (or waveform on the LCD screen) I have the same LUT active as the one I grade with. Still, the waveform only shows LOG values, while on my Lumix, the result of the applied LUT is active and visible in the waveform. Is this a Nikon thing, or a setting in the Z9 I can change? Now I switch to SDR temporarily to set a correct exposure. Thanks!

@AaronSpieler

3 ай бұрын

I have not found a way to change this. As far as I know, it always shows the LOG IRE values. If you have the view assist turned on, it shows the SDR values that the v2 LUT will apply to the image, but not the waveform. And if you have zebras on, it is showing you which highlights are about to lose detail. It doesn't really bother me anymore since I have gotten used to it, but I do wish that was something that you could change

When converting nraw to rec 709 you must use color transforms( can be found in davinci ). The luts you are using are for 10 bit video, while nraw still in nlog( you can shoot sdr in nraw) is 12 bit. The new lut just gives more ‘steps’ to the extreme highlights and takes the steps from the shadows part. Luts normally are applied after the raw conversion.

@AaronSpieler

6 ай бұрын

Interesting. As you can see, I don't use Resolve. Maybe someday, but currently wouldn't make sense for our business. With that said, I still watch a lot of videos on Resolve just to try and understand the information better. Is this why Premiere doesn't natively support N-Raw? Since it doesn't have a color space transform feature. It can read ProRes RAW natively though, I have used that before just to see what it can do. And since RED removed the lawsuit against Nikon (knowing they would lose is my guess), will Premiere ever support N-Raw? And by 'new lut', are you referring to the Z9 v2 LUT? Sorry for all the questions, part of the reason that I made this video was to help start a discussion about the things that I don't understand and can't seem to find online. I appreciate the comment.

@MadManTnT

6 ай бұрын

@@AaronSpieler prores is just a container, you could record 8bit rec 709 in prores. I don't know why premier doesn't have n-raw support. I moved from premier long time ago as it is not color managed and all the time my exports will differ in colour from what i was presented in premier. New lut ( nikon new lut). I don't know how you record log video on the z8/z9 but I record using the view assist feature and the wave form. I expose for the skin and the rest will fall in place just fine. Of course if I find my self in crazy dynamic range scenarios I must sacrifice something(normally the highlights ).

@AaronSpieler

6 ай бұрын

That sucks, I haven't experienced that yet with Premiere. It only looks different once I am viewing the video on a different display, such as watching a KZread video on my phone. But if I watch it on my computer and open premiere project on the same screen then I don't see a difference. Not that you are mistaken, just wanted to clarify what I was getting at. I do both video and photo professionally and I get all of Adobe for half off the normal price, so paying for Resolve doesn't seem worth it at the moment. I still don't use everything premiere has to offer and I don't have any glaring issues with it. As far as exposing log, i do use view assist with zebras and try to expose my subject around 35-40 IRE on the wavefrom. I like this method because the assist gives a good idea of what starting spot I will have in post, the zebras help to know what is close to clipping and if I don't want to lose that area I just drop the exposure a bit, and since the waveform is showing the log exposure and not the assist exposure, I can really make sure that my mental gray card is exposed correctly, if that makes sense. I am a big fan of the tools that the 8 and 9 have for video. And considering the 8 and 9 are Nikon's first attempt at some serious video specs and features, I am sure it will only get better. Now I just need to get better at processing it haha

@julesc8054

26 күн бұрын

My suggestion is to, using the free version of resolve, follow the recent Nikon video on the Nikon you tube channel and export the lut as cube64, then use that exported lut in Premier. This exported lut will then be the resolve colour space transform. You can then also load it into premier, your camera, ninja etc so what you see is more consistent.

Ive switched to using a lut exported from resolve using the Davinci colour space transform. Its the same method outlined in Nikon recent N-log video on the official Nikon KZread channel. It seems to be a good starting point.

@AaronSpieler

9 күн бұрын

Which Nikon channel? The USA one or a different one?

@julesc8054

9 күн бұрын

@@AaronSpieler Yes the Nikon USA search for “How to Color Grade Nikon N-RAW with N-Log in DaVinci Resolve” then Generate the lut cube64. Generate 2 luts see long answer below. Nikon footage is: Rec2020 with N-log Gamma Long answer: Sorry got a bit carried away something in here may be new to you. Check whether you have generated a lut Full Range or Video Levels. Make a lut for both and maybe clearly label them. The one you would use in premier with N-log ProRez video levels and the other use with N-Raw Full Range. This can be set in resolve on the media page right click the clip > Clip attributes > video > full range / limited. Both N-Raw and ProRez N-log are the same Rec.2020 but Premier interoperates the N-Raw as Rec 2020 full Range and ProRez it assumes Rec.709 Video Levels. In Premier as you have discovered you should put the lut on the track above in the timeline or in last luminentry in the chain of luminentry effects so you are grading with the dynamic range of log and converting after your grade. I recently switched to resolve from Premier, I edit in custom colour managed rather than the CCT node method as shown by Nikon so my clips show the right gamma in the bins. I've noticed grading with resolve colour Managed as apposed to using a lut is more robust. My first N-log project a year ago was in premier and I had the same issues as you except the rec 2020 was interpreted as limited rec709. Premier assumes all footage is Rec.709 video levels not Rec2020 full range. The Nikon lut assumes rec.2020 Full range. Premier reads raw files correctly. In Premier sequence settings have you tried “Maximum bit depth” “Maximum Render Quality” and “Composite in Linear Colour” options? If you ever decide to edit N-log in Resolve here are my resolve custom colour project settings on the Colour Management Tab: Colour Science : Davinci YRGB Colour Managed Deselect “Automatic colour management” Colour Processing Mode: Custom Select: Use Seporate colour space and gamma Input colour space: Rec.2020 - Input Gamma: N-Log Timeline colour space Rec.709 Gamma Rec.709 Timeline working Luminance: SDR 100 Limit Output Gama to: Rec.709 Input DRT: Davinci Output DRT: Davinci

@julesc8054

9 күн бұрын

@@AaronSpieler Yes the Nikon USA search for “How to Color Grade Nikon N-RAW with N-Log in DaVinci Resolve” then Generate the lut cube64. Generate 2 luts see long answer below. Nikon footage is: Rec2020 with N-log Gamma Long answer: Sorry got a bit carried away something in here may be new to you. Check whether you have generated a lut Full Range or Video Levels. Make a lut for both and maybe clearly label them. The one you would use in premier with N-log ProRez video levels and the other use with N-Raw Full Range. This can be set in resolve on the media page right click the clip > Clip attributes > video > full range / limited. Both N-Raw and ProRez N-log are the same Rec.2020 but Premier interoperates the N-Raw as Rec 2020 full Range and ProRez it assumes Rec.709 Video Levels. In Premier as you have discovered you should put the lut on the track above in the timeline or in last luminentry in the chain of luminentry effects so you are grading with the dynamic range of log and converting after your grade. I recently switched to resolve from Premier, I edit in custom colour managed rather than the CCT node method as shown by Nikon so my clips show the right gamma in the bins. I've noticed grading with resolve colour Managed as apposed to using a lut is more robust. My first N-log project a year ago was in premier and I had the same issues as you except the rec 2020 was interpreted as limited rec709. Premier assumes all footage is Rec.709 video levels not Rec2020 full range. The Nikon lut assumes rec.2020 Full range. Premier reads raw files correctly. In Premier sequence settings have you tried “Maximum bit depth” “Maximum Render Quality” and “Composite in Linear Colour” options? If you ever decide to edit N-log in Resolve here are my resolve custom colour project settings on the Colour Management Tab: Colour Science : Davinci YRGB Colour Managed Deselect “Automatic colour management” Colour Processing Mode: Custom Select: Use Seporate colour space and gamma Input colour space: Rec.2020 - Input Gamma: N-Log Timeline colour space Rec.709 Gamma Rec.709 Timeline working Luminance: SDR 100 Limit Output Gama to: Rec.709 Input DRT: Davinci Output DRT: Davinci

@julesc8054

9 күн бұрын

@@AaronSpieler my reply keeps getting deleted not sure what's going on

@AaronSpieler

8 күн бұрын

It looks like it posted twice for me which is fine. That all does look pretty helpful, I'll have to dive into that more soon. Thank you!

I always have success loading my lut in the creative tab, instead of the adjustment layer.

@AaronSpieler

4 ай бұрын

I'll start by saying that I am no professional when it comes to the technical aspect of PP, but I have experimented quite a bit. What I have found is that no matter where you apply it, a 3D LUT will convert LOG into rec.709. With that said, PP still works kind of like Photoshop layers. Meaning, if you apply the 3D LUT to the Basic Input drop down in the basic panel, any adjustments that follow are being applied to an already converted clip and not the LOG 10-bit metadata. So when you apply a 3D LUT to the creative tab, you can still make exposure, contrast, white balance, etc. changes to the clip, but if you go down to the curves, color wheels, or hsl secondary, you are now working with a converted clip and not the original metadata. I hope that makes sense. Again, I could be wrong and I have done a TON of research trying to figure out why PP does this in the first place. Seems like a flaw IMO, you should be able to apply a conversion LUT into the basic input LUT drop down and work with the clip that way. But even the "all mighty" DaVinci Resolve uses nodes which works a lot like PS Layer and PP adjustment layers. All that said, I personally like the adjustment layer method since all of my clips use the same LUT, that workflow works well for me. But I understand that can get really complicated depending on other peoples situations.

THIS is literally the video I've been searching for for the last month. I have the Z6 and have bought the ninja V+, now I'm experimenting with 10 bit N log and still looking what is better between under or overexposing the scene in camera. Apparently so Nikon says to underexpose at around 35 IRE. Now it's back to testing and finding out for myself what that looks like for me. Could you maybe do a video on N log and exposing it while you are filming clips? Like some sort of BTS about N log and how you make sure the IRE doesn't go to zero while not clipping the highlights? It always happens to me when I try not to clip the highlights I drop my blacks to flat 0 or the other way around when I try not to underexpose I clip my highlights to far to flat 100. Or will that be just a problem of needing the dynamic range I don't have?

@AaronSpieler

6 ай бұрын

I made this video because I couldn't find anything like it on KZread and figured that maybe someone else would be, so I'm glad I was able to help. As far as the BTS video, I would be more than willing to do something like. I love getting suggestions for what people like to see. But to clarify, you are looking for a real time video of me exposing for an scene and what my thought process is along the way? Just want to make sure I cover what you are looking for

@alessiofasano3808

6 ай бұрын

@@AaronSpieler YES exactly that! Like maybe a few different scenes? All completely different, like lets say a landscape, a couple, a moving subject, moving subject while lighting changes,... Like a lot of different scenes and your thought process on what you would expose for, what values you would expose at and all that stuff.

@AaronSpieler

6 ай бұрын

I see, that's not a bad idea. I could definitely do something like that. I did something kind of similar talking about the Z9 full time auto focus ability while shooting video, but I could do something similar for exposure. That's a good idea

@harpenfluit

4 ай бұрын

Nikon advises against underexposure; rather, it emphasizes the importance of accurately exposing according to the log curve utilized. Log recording is developed to optimize the dynamic range captured by the camera. This method employs a logarithmic scale for recording brightness levels, enhancing the sensor's efficiency in capturing details in both shadows and highlights. The correct exposure for Nikon's N-log is achieved by using an 18% gray color chart and adjusting the exposure for a video signal level (IRE) of 35%, which corresponds to a 10-bit code value of approximately 372. It is good practiceto expose your scene accurately and only deviate from your routine for valid reasons. Grading footage with varying exposures can be a pain, especially when advice from sources like KZread suggests employing techniques such as "expose to the right" (ETTR). While overexposure can be beneficial for capturing more detail in shadows, underexposure may be necessary to preserve highlights, albeit at the expense of shadow detail. Typically, the best practice is to ensure correct exposure.

@AaronSpieler

4 ай бұрын

I'm not entirely sure what your point is here. I mentioned the same exact thing in the video, that is about exposing 18% grey at 35 IRE. Could you share where Nikon says to not underexpose? I can't find that anywhere. Other than that, the main argument that I was making here is that shooting at 35 IRE is simply not always realistic. I have began to learn how to find it with my "eye" while shooting, but I would argue that a majority of people shooting with the Z8 or Z9, or even and older Z camera, are not shooting soley in controlled shooting environments. As an example, when I am out shooting video of weddings, the compistion changes, the subject moves, the sun goes behind clouds. So many things change that play a factor into how I choose to expose in that moment to retain as much detail. It might not be exactly how Nikon intended, but the world also isn't a studio. We can't always control all of the elements. Therefore, I expose to what suits that scene best, not what suits N-Log best. With that said, when I shoot these KZread videos, I spend up to an hour sometimes dialing in exposure and yeah! Looks great later. But that isn't always an option depending on what you are shooting and that is the only argument I was trying to share here, that getting the shot close is better than obsessing over correct exposure. I'm basing this off 3 years of experience and I know there could be someone out there struggling like I did and I just want to share my experience.

Lumetri Color's "exposure" slider is a joke. It's not exposure it's brightness. You have to add contrast in couple with it--or adjustment layers as you've mentioned.

@AaronSpieler

2 ай бұрын

Interesting. That's the first I've heard of that being the case. I know it is brightness for compressed codecs, but it's true for RAW as well?

howe you find or set 35 IRE in z9 ?

@AaronSpieler

3 ай бұрын

It is a little tricky since the screen on the Z 9 is small. If you have an external recorder then it helps. But the waveform monitor on the Z 9 has 5 lines. The bottom one is 0 IRE, the next one up is 25, then 50, then 75, then 100. So I do my best with the waveform set to large to put my grey card in between the 25 and 50 IRE lines, staying closer to the 25 since 35 is closer to 25. I wish they had an actual line that represented where they recommend grey cards to be set at, but maybe that is something they will do soon.

@voederbietels

3 ай бұрын

@@AaronSpieler Hi Aaron. thnkz a lot but i didnt know abot the grey card. i thought that was for white balance?

@AaronSpieler

3 ай бұрын

I have heard some people argue that the white balance checkers and 18% grey cards aren't actually accurate. I am not experienced enough to say if that is accurate or not, but from my experience, the little collapsible one that I have has worked fine so far. On one side is just white fabric which allows you to use a pin dropper or a parade vectorscope to dial in your white balance pretty closely as long as you weren't extremely far off. On the other side is fabric that is called 18% grey as far as I know. This allows you to set your exposure to the recommended IRE for whatever LOG gamma you are using, N-LOG in this case. Depending on the rec.709 conversion LUT you are using, you can set your 18% grey to different IRE values, but that is why I brought that point up in the video. If you are able to use the 18% grey card for white balance, I am unaware of how to do so. I do know they also make color checker charts which allows you to make sure all of your colors are where they should be, not just white, but I haven't really had a need thus far to pick one up. Probably should and start learning how to use it haha

@voederbietels

3 ай бұрын

@@AaronSpieler Thank you so much for your time to answer me ) i also have no idee how to use a gray card. foro photography it can be usefull if it has te be colour perfect i think. i also have to dive in to it. The z9 is fabelous for filming and i am learning to us davincy with Nlog .. so far so good but my monitor isnt colour accurate. maybe a rec 709 monitor in the future. again thanks a lot ... greetings from the Netherlands )

@AaronSpieler

3 ай бұрын

That's awesome! Glad you are enjoying it. Please feel free to let me know about any other videos you might find helpful!

All normal grading has to be done in DR. Amen

@AaronSpieler

4 ай бұрын

...wut?

You can't explain to people how to expose LOG and rely on Premiere's haphazard gamma and color space management to tell you anything about the data in the file. Try again once you learn Resolve & Color management.

@AaronSpieler

9 күн бұрын

Thanks for your engagement!