Oh my goodness, How have I been to all these therapists that never understand my anxiety and make me feel like its weird every time I try to explain it. What causes anxiety they ask. Everything I answer, and then they look at me like I am from Mars. HOW Have they not heard of this? HOW have I not heard of this.? This is my whole life explained🤯. Thank you so much for this!

@jimwilliams3816

Жыл бұрын

@OneCatShortOfCrazy ...first off, I love your user name! It has just occurred to me that our cats, and probably most cats, have PDA. That's why they can't be "herded," and maybe one reason I relate to them. I also feel my responses make my therapist look at me like I'm from Mars. I suspect some of that may come from my RSD -- I'm used to people being confused by the way that I put things, so I probably expect it -- but I don't think that's all of it. I'm in the US, and honestly the DSM (which does not include PDA or RSD) is a deeply flawed work by committee...heck, my psychiatrist has said as much. And my sense is that therapists are trained to lead people to the "right" conclusions, and maybe that makes some sense, but I don't think it always works so well with neurodivergent people, of which I am one. I describe a lot of things in terms of the processes that are going on in my head, and I think therapists expect me to use "feelings/emotions" terms more than I do. At this point, I am starting to think that the way I describe things is less a deficiency than a difference. I can still analyze what I am doing pretty well, and therapy should be more about getting to a better place than learning "the right answers."

@LeahPerec

Жыл бұрын

Yes yes yes my therapist could not recognize that. But I am going mute when met with demand.

The audio was difficult for me to get through but the information provided and overall presentation is appreciated. Thank you.

@shpaanda

Жыл бұрын

agreed

I'm 68 and have only just realised I have PDA. It's been a tough life

@tamatebako_yt

Жыл бұрын

I'm sorry.

@kingmasterlord

Жыл бұрын

just remember that it makes you immune to being ruled through tyranny, we literally cannot submit and obey.

@unnikasteng-jakobsen1529

Жыл бұрын

❤

@youtubeaccount-gp5ml

Жыл бұрын

@@kingmasterlord✊🏻

@cameron4225

11 ай бұрын

I’m 26 and I realized it thanks to this video. I am sorry that must have been very difficult 😥 it was difficult for me too. It took years of therapy and moving to Japan to snap out of my self pity. Us survivors conquer anything 💪

Y’know what’s funny? I feel this way towards myself and not others. I love to run around following orders from others all day; it makes me feel important. But when I try to follow my own orders, it’s like something is broken in the pathway, unless I feel “compelled” by pure impulse or passion. Many people say to give yourself little rewards, but that doesn’t work for me as anything I designate a “reward” becomes something I’m withholding from myself at all other times. I end up compulsively eating my reward candy, ahaha. Maybe there is something wrong with how I am telling myself to do things - I am not being nice enough or making myself feel important for doing the thing? I will try out some of your positive phrasing to see if that helps. Another idea I have is rewarding myself for starting tasks, instead of rewarding myself for finishing them. Because if I really have PDA, then my biggest challenge is taking an instruction-directed action, not finishing the task. (If I don’t finish, that means another instruction is necessary to restart the task, which should come with a reward). Now I just have to think of a reward I can give myself *while* starting the task (i.e. no distracting activities) that isn’t food!

@user-vr8qd4hk6y

Жыл бұрын

Interesting. Thanks for sharing.

@Xanderj89

Жыл бұрын

I’ve heard that described as inverted control,“I decided to allow all these demands from this source”. All those demands lose the attack on agency, you decided to let this person (or ruleset, or struture/guideline etc) set commands and expectations regarding a certain activity, so now all I have to do is play my part, it’s uncomplicated and I don’t have to spend so much energy keeping tight control over every expectation, I can just DO (which is also my goal in situations where I do demand control, I want the freedom to just BE, and unknown expectations are a threat to that). So instead of having to watch my back for new attacks on my agency, I have decided (importantly) to allow someone else to watch my back, and now I can relax that control since I made the decision and their demands are in alignment with my intent. I expect them to make demands and my goal is to do whatever they say, so what the demand is no longer matters as I preemptively decided I was going to do them as the one being led. Then I can focus on problem solving and application. A way to not feel controlled by demands counter to your will, is unintuitively, letting someone control you so their demands are no longer stopping you from exercising your will, you’re already intent on performing the demands so they no longer cause that recoil.

@Jokaanan

Жыл бұрын

@@Xanderj89 based insight

@sultana695

Жыл бұрын

This is a point in the favour of the internet being a positive innovation- reading someone else describe an aspect of my internal landscape is soul quenching.

Thank you! I'm brand new to the concept of PDA, I suppose in part from being in the States. It feels largely applicable to me, I think my biggest factor is that most of it is internal for me, what I feel I am expected to do. That most often triggers dread or freezes. If I do get the top tier, actual demands, I do have that anger response, but I don't get it too much because I think I've trained most people I deal with regularly not to demand. And I am probably pathological about my fear of saying "no," which I think fits into the picture somewhere. I suspect feeling like I can't say no either triggers more anxiety (someone asked me for something, OMG now I have no choice!) or resentment (why do they feel I must do it??). That layer of self-interpretation, which is part RSD, makes it that much more emotionally confusing. I laughed at the toothbrush; that's become an increasing issue for me, and I hate going for a tooth cleaning because the hygienist seems to me to be soooo judgmental about how well I keep up my teeth. Which, come to think of it, was a big issue for my mother as well.

Unfortunately, PDA is either unheard of by many therapists and psychiatrists in the United States, so it is tough to even receive a diagnosis. I don't do well with jobs based on most jobs being meaningless in my life, and I don't do well with commands or directions (as well as advice or suggestions), even if they will contribute to some sort of help. If i didn't come up with my own advice, i won't take it...well, even if i did come up with it, I'll procrastinate of just forget it if it feels like too much pressure. It is tough to meet new people, or even keep friends because of it. Because it is so rare, people think i am making this up or just being lazy... P.S.: I can most definitely relate to the list you've created... P.S. Part Two: I also do not do well with compliments, for they feel so condescending. Feels like you are only complimenting me based on you only being satisfied because it pacified you.

@JustMe-ty2rp

Жыл бұрын

Getting advice from people often makes me feel like they think I'm stupid and I get irrationally aggravated. I also don't do well with criticism (though I've learned to shoulder it for the most part, it can put me in a funk). Even self-imposed demands like taking a course can put me into a state where I feel physically immobilized and my body gets heavy, arms feel weak, etc. It's really quite frustrating!

@fedoramcclaren4294

Жыл бұрын

@@JustMe-ty2rp Oh my goodness, isn't it?

@fedoramcclaren4294

Жыл бұрын

@@JustMe-ty2rp Oh nooo, wait... Was that response okay, because for me, even if someone agrees (at times), it feels like anxiety builds up for me, like my answer is no longer mine alone. Long story abridged, living with this is quite difficult.

Recently dx'd with high functioning asd and one of my biggest issues has always been that when I want to do something or set a goal for myself (like say, learning computer programming) I will get excited about the prospect of learning a new skill, until it's actually time to do it - and then I get this physical feeling come over my body like *I CAN'T MOVE*. It's almost like physical pain, or an extreme apathy that I feel in my limbs, and it becomes hard to lift them + I end up with anxiety. Also throughout most of my life holding down jobs was equally difficult for the same reason. I wanted the job, I was happy to make money and work, but when it came time to go to work I would feel the same physical 'freezing up' and it would make it hard to get to work, the harder I tried, the more anxious I would get and I would ultimately end up calling in sick - all the while assuming I must have some kind of severe social anxiety or something, even though I never fully fit that profile (and the fact it happened with self-imposed restrictions or demands as well); and if someone made an appointment for me (like a partner saying "oh hey, I volunteered you to help at so-and-so's birthday at the end of the month") I would become irrationally angry, to the point of aggression (which resulted in a lot of self-hatred and depression - but it seemed no matter how hard I tried I couldn't stop when I was triggered?). I found PDA by asking some ppl if they've ever experienced the same, and after watching a couple of videos I'm pretty sure this is what's going on. I read some things that said early-life trauma or parental neglect, abuse, etc. has nothing to do with it - but I think that's a stupid thing to say given the lack of research as well as the fact almost everyone I've heard say they fit the profile can trace the reasoning back to childhood in some fashion. For my own example, I was often forced as a child to have to do things I didn't want to do, like mow the lawn (being told I had to do it right when I would ask to go and play with friends - eg, Me: "my homeworks all done, can I go and play with my friends?" My Dad: "get out there and mow the lawn first" Me: "but my friends can only stay for an hour and they will have to go home!" My Dad: "No buts!!! Get out there and get it done, then you can go!" 😭) or being told to do the dishes when all the other kids my age were playing outside. I was also not often given a choice about what I wanted to do and would be forced to do things like go on scary rides, or even sit on the edge of a ferryboat overlooking the water (my Dad would hold me of course, but if I got scared and said I didn't want to do it he would get very angry and make me, saying that I needed to get over my fear and that I would have fun once I was up there [I didn't]) and I think that somehow this translated into this subconscious irrational fear that demands = bad. I went through decades of self-medicating and trying different things to get over it, alcohol seemed to help but having to get drunk in order to 'do' things isn't really a feasible solution, I really would just like to not have this stupid disorder and be able to make myself do the things I want/need to do in order to get to where I want to be in life!!! I know my Dad was just trying to raise me to be a hard worker, but I wish he had understood that the result was the exact opposite. Thankfully I now have a job where I am the Boss for the most part, and have a lot of leeway in getting things done - but it can still be a struggle when I'm on a time crunch, or when any other 'demands' are involved!!!

Thabk you so much for this!! I am 43 and am in the process of getting an autism dx and I am fairly certain I have this as well and I've never heard another person say they experience anything like this - such a relief! Thank you!

That totally explains a lot of things that I struggle on a day to day basis. After watching your video, I got very overwhelmed by realizing that I have PDA. It made me have an internal meltdown.

Thank you! This is so helpful as a mother of someone with PDA. I’m always curious how it feels to be him so I can help him. In fact, that’s a new conversation we continually have now: what does it feel like to be you in this situation? It has completely transformed our relationship and eliminated so much unnecessary stress for us both. Thank you, thank you, thank you. ❤❤❤

Has anyone ever thought, I can't do that I'll get in trouble. Doing things gets me into trouble. Breathing, talking, moving gets me into trouble.

@amandasutton4056

Жыл бұрын

A similar thing perhaps? As soon as I get up and start doing anything, everything goes wrong and it's just non stop stress until I stop..its not safe to do anything, doing things just leads to more and more problems.....

@emmacassidy8482

Жыл бұрын

@@amandasutton4056 yes exactly

@sirensheartsong4079

Жыл бұрын

So many times this! Usually if I persist, it just escalates, now I catch it sooner and just sit back down and be okay with *being* and called (^lazy^). Then attempt it again after some time, only going more slowly , talking aloud the steps i am taking, ie one scoop coffee, ok get a spoon, hi spoon, get a cup, hi cup, looking in the dishwasher..just narrating the process has helped rewire this for me. Not today Satan! Hahaha Much less tarps and hospital trips.

My boy fits PDA profile in so many ways. One thing I can't understand is when he asks for something then he doesn't want it, then he does and gets really upset. Anyone no what he is feeling or how I can help him.

@SallyCat123

3 жыл бұрын

This might be because his demand avoidance is triggered when he feels he *must* have the thing he wanted. This might be from his own internal perception (I really want X. Now I have X and must be pleased. I don't want to be pleased...) If he's then faced with letting go X, his demand avoidance against may lessen so he wants it again. I'm reminded of my daughter aged about 4. She really wanted some shoes for sale in a shop, so we said we'd get them for her. But when we neared the end of the queue to pay for them, she told us she didn't want them any more. We asked her if she was sure (by now we'd reached the checkout) and she insisted, tearfully, that she didn't want them. So we didn't buy them. Our bus home was leaving soon, so we left the shop and hurried to reach the bus stop. She suddenly said she wanted those shoes. We reminded her that she'd said she didn't want them. She became even more upset and said she really, really wanted them. Tears were streaming down her face. We explained that we didn't have time to go back to the shop because we had to get the bus. She started going into a panic attack. All we could so was try to gently distract her until she calmed down (this took a long time!)

@jsgamingtutorials9890

2 жыл бұрын

Hi Kelly, when I was younger. I would kind of cancel the original order but then after that cancellation, I would then see how many times that the person would reoffer it to me. In the end if it was say a drink. My mum would just put it on the table and it would then be up to me as to whether I had it or not.

Incredibly helpful! I've passed your video on to a client of mind who is struggling with irrationally powerful resistance to taking medication, even though they definitely help! Your video will be one that I use as a patient resource! Thank you! Tucson psychiatrist.

Thank you for sharing, this makes so, so much sense. Because you just described me.

Thanks so much for clarifying.. hearing straight from people who have diagnoses is so important in educating the public. LOVE THE CHART! really helpful. PDA sounds a bit like ptsd but without specificity.. so a stress response (fight, flight, freeze or fawn) gets triggered by something quite general and unavoidable .. i.e signals from other people ! I have had avoidant behaviour for about a year.. triggered by family behaviour after my dad died.. it feels quite subliminal like you described. i have been diagnosed with adhd but i think my mum has PDA. it would be so interesting to see the neuroscience of PDA.. it will take decades tho because psychiatry is weirdly avoidant of science!

@tamarakist6875

10 ай бұрын

😂 i see what u did there

Do you have any suggestions having Aspergers and dealing with PDA as an adult. I want to go to school for nursing but I’m feeling incapable because of this condition

@SallyCat123

2 жыл бұрын

Understanding how your invisible neurology impacts you may help you make choices you can cope with. Before understanding my PDA, and other invisible differenves, I felt continually depressed and ashamed because I couldn't do the things I thought I should be able to do (and which everyone also assumed I could and should do). I have found college cpurses much easier to cope with than paid work

English? Reminds me of the safety adverts 'Charlie says'. If you are in UK how did/do you get treatment, finding it really difficult.

So explains me.

This video is so helpful. It really gives me insight into my sons and possibly my husband. So often I feel others see his anxiety as a behavior issue or a choice when it is not. I would have never identified my my son on the Autism spectrum but the struggles of PDA fit him so well. Is it possible to have PDA and not be on the spectrum? I live in the states and have never herd of PDA before. Do you know if PDA is related to giftedness?

@fedoramcclaren4294

2 жыл бұрын

Pathological Demand Avoidance is within the autism umbrella, but unfortunately, it isn't in the DSM-5 manual in most places in the world. It's tough living with this, because most people don't comprehend because it is so rare. I have lost so many friends, or some friends have become associates because of what I go through. I end up apologising all the time because of it, with the random meltdowns and "lashing out" towards anyone who attempts to help me.

I have this also.

My whole day. I think nt's are dogs and we are cats. Try forcing a cat to do what it doesn't want to. As a child, I know I felt I was an individual entity and my wants and needs were every bit as important as the adult's. I felt like I was trapped, controlled, unheard. I could not wait to be an adult and be free of having to do what other people want. I hated being a kid. I burned out and retired at 59. When they asked me what I was going to do when I retired, I told them 'Whatever I want to do. Not what everyone else wants me to do.' Only to find out I don't even want to do the things I want me to do.

Done

Hahaha, even clicking off the video by accident and then thinking "I need to click back and finish watching it", my next reaction becomes "No, I'm not going to finish watching that video because i don't have to" and I go to watch something else instead. XD

A phone has a better mic than this.

It seems rational to me. I don't wanna downplay your struggles, I just think (and this is my opinion) that pathologizing this kind of stuff doesn't actually serve the people that have it. Yes, you can havd this issue but saying it's a disorder and that it's irrational... feels like... harming yourself with your words. I understand though... But, like, man... You know what they say about radical acceptance and how psych labels don't help with that.

@imautisticnowwhat

Жыл бұрын

Are you PDA yourself? Pre realising this was a disorder, I wasn’t doing super well. I dropped out of college. I’ve always been self-employed because I can’t keep a job. If you don’t know the reason why you do these things, you fill in the gaps with adjectives like lazy. I’ve had less meltdowns since discovering PDA because I’m able to understand my triggers. Not knowing you have PDA does not take it away.

@BL-sd2qw

Жыл бұрын

@@imautisticnowwhat You can and should have your struggles awknowledged by others without the need to patologize them. That doesn't make them go away. I just don't like the word "disorder". You can need help and have struggles without the need to say you are disordered in some way. You are human. People should have listened to you and understand you from the very beginning. I'm sorry if people called you lazy in the past. You didn't deserve it. And I understand. I'm sorry if my comment triggered you. This world is not built around actually helping people.

In other words you need full control or youre uncomfortable

@LobsterHaunting

Жыл бұрын

Ooooo mr helpful over here

Omg… pathetic

@christianvollenhoven

Жыл бұрын

It's an aspect of a disability - not people being pathetic.

@user-vr8qd4hk6y

Жыл бұрын

Your attitude, yeah

@Nakia11798

Жыл бұрын

You are, yeah

@Saje3D

Жыл бұрын

I’d ask what was wrong with YOU, but we don’t have that kind of time and I really don’t care.

🥲 thank you. I feel so validated/seen.