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@jsong8282

Жыл бұрын

Will do

I am Historic Pre-Mill. However, my understanding is that Post/A-Mill believes that Revelation 19 precedes Revelation 20. They believe that Jesus on a white horse was a Spiritual event that destroyed the old covenant system on 70ad

Yes 3:35 !!!

Amen

7 churches 1-3 4 & 5 saints in heaven, 6-18 hell on Earth 19 Yeshua The church is the bride and body of Yeshua. He WILL NOT beat his bride before the wedding. & years Daniel's 70th week.

Bro Shultz, out of curiousity why can't we understand the 3.5y, 42 mo, 1260 days, time+times+half-a-time as literally as the 1000. If it is simply a matter of frequency, then have we reduced our trust in God's Word to a confidence interval?

I think the lack of distinction between Israel and the Church vis a vis Dispensationalism is a big selling point of Historic Premillennialism. The distinction between the two is what necessitates the secret rapture in my opinion

@methodministries

Жыл бұрын

I would say no. You can hold to a Post-trib and be a Dispensationalist, or some hold to a Pre-wrath rapture. Robert Gundry is a Post-trib Dispen to my knowledge, and he has a book on it.

@sammcrae8892

4 ай бұрын

What? Most of the Dispensationalists I know of make a distinct difference between Israel and the Church. I don't see where you get that idea. That's pretty much the whole basis of Dispensational Hermeneutics. 🙏✝️👑✝️🙏

8:46 yup

@jesusgeek7680

Жыл бұрын

Yes sir. He says this in a much nicer way than me 😂😂 just you and your bible is all we need ❤❤

I'll look at Revelations not chronological because you can see in the beginning of Revelations it's also matching the end so it's recapitulating to me I personally Cima premillennial I think everything is going to pan out whether we like it or not but I am different I stay to the true authentic scripture of a Middle East Beast replace Ezekiel 38 with Zechariah 12-14 which is yet future I don't see how preterists can put all this in the past I have made so many people stumble by going through the full context and it just amazes me what God is truly saying is really coming to past

The part that has me confused right now is verse 20:13. If this is the wicked, how does it tie into verses 5-9 which is the wicked who were resurrected and used for the devil's army?

I wondered if you could suggest a good reference for studying the different Historic Pre MIllenialism variations and developments in Protestant history, and church history.

@methodministries

Жыл бұрын

This book is fantastic! www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1938239059/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?ie=UTF8&qid=&sr=

His view of the resurrection of unbelievers to fight with Satan is far fetched.

@brycerogers5050

6 ай бұрын

To be fair, the resurrection of believers to do anything is naturally far fetched. We do have a God who deals in those types of things. "The God of peace will soon crush Satan under your feet". "This is what overcomes the world: your faith."

@David_VZ77

6 ай бұрын

@@brycerogers5050 doesn’t really have much to do with my statement, bro.

@brycerogers5050

6 ай бұрын

@@David_VZ77 oh, sorry, I read your comment as 'believers' (as in, those that are surrounded by Gog and Magog and witness their destruction at Christ's hands, Rev 20:9; in that sense, they fight 'with', i.e. against, Satan), that is my bad. As to the unbelievers, yeah, I suppose it can feel like that, but I also see the Great White throne judgement right after this purported resurrection of the dead (Rev 20:11, two verses later), and it doesn't feel like too much of a stretch to say these are unbelievers are raised to be defeated in battle, and then cast into hell, body and soul. But yeah, totally different comment in that light!

Could one be a PARTIAL presterist and hold to historical premill? Meaning, the Trib and such occurred in 70 (maybe with ongoing tribulation until Christ comes), but literal 2nd Coming, Mill Kingdom, and Great White Throne judgement.

@methodministries

6 ай бұрын

Yes. I would read John Gill for this. What people don't understand is that having a single fulfillment view of the Olivet discourse does not mean you must interpret the book of Revelation in that manner. Historic Premils never made that assumption.

@bobbyadkins6983

Ай бұрын

Good question.

And yes I am in agreeance that Paul Peter and them was a premillennial everything else has been added and that drives me insane lol

Do you believe in animal sacrifices in the future as per Zechariah 14:16? Or are these spiritual sacrifices of praise and prayer as the new testament teaches? What do you believe about the abomination of Desolation in Matt 24:15? future or past? Literal temple in jerusalem or temple of "the church"? [how can a temple built by antichrists be considered temple of God?]

@methodministries

7 ай бұрын

I believe what Zechariah 14:16 says will happen when Christ returns. Not all do though. I believe Schultz doesn't though. It varies from Premil to Premil on this. I believe Matthew 24:15 is a double fulfillment: Once in A.D. 70, then again in the Great Tribulation.

@AidenRKrone

7 ай бұрын

The very early church was a Jewish religious body. One of the worst things contemporary Christians can do is rip the Book of Revelation (and the entire Bible as a whole) out of its Jewish theological and cultural context. The earliest Christians were steeped in Jewish apocalyptic thought. They understood the apocalyptic and millenarian sections of the Hebrew Bible, especially the books of Isaiah and the minor prophets, literally; they understood the Old Testament to be teaching not only a Jewish Messiah, but also a restoration and worldwide rule of a reunited Israel. (The idea that the Gentile "Church" replaced Israel in God's plan would be rightly seen as a totally foreign idea injected into the text.) The earthly millennial reign of Christ is a thoroughly Jewish kingdom. That said, the Book of Zechariah absolutely does tell us that the kings of the earth will travel to Jerusalem to bow down to King Jesus, and that they will observe the Feast of Tabernacles. Animal sacrifices will also return and will be conducted in a reconstructed Third Temple. (The Antichrist will set himself up in the Temple and commit the abomination of desolation; he won't construct the Temple himself, nor will it be built under his auspices.) Make no mistake, the blood atonement of Jesus Christ on the Cross is sufficient to cleanse the sins of all persons; the purpose of animal sacrifices returning in the Millennial Kingdom is to commemorate Christ and the ultimate sacrifice He performed for us. (The animal sacrifices of the Mosaic Law were never meant to atone for sin; they were always meant to be a type/shadow of the coming Messiah. This is the purpose those sacrifices will serve during the Millennium.) The nations and kingdoms that participate in the celebrations during the Millennial Kingdom will be blessed by God.

@Jus4kiks

6 ай бұрын

@@AidenRKrone Few questions if you don't mind. Where do you get that there will be a 3rd abomination of desolation, also where do you get from the text there will be a 3rd temple? And when God says he doesn't desire the blood of bulls and goats, why would he desire it for 1000 years?

You don’t have to necessarily be premil if chapter 19 and 20 are a continual story.

Hello, my question would be. When Christ comes, what will happen to unbelievers that will be alive then? I ask because when Christ comes, the dead in Christ will rise first..and then the rest of believers alive at the time will meet Him the air...but what about non believers that would be alive?

@bobbyadkins6983

Ай бұрын

They are cast into Hell.

@Mr.Fotingo-qf9hk

Ай бұрын

@@bobbyadkins6983 what about the 2nd resurrection after the 1,000 years? isn't that when they will al be judged? Why are they sent to hell before getting judged?

@bobbyadkins6983

Ай бұрын

@@Mr.Fotingo-qf9hk The Bible doesn't give us all the answers. But here's what it says about the angels that sinned or at least some of them. I believe demons that are roaming the earth are fallen angels as well: 2 Peter 2:4 [4]For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; Jude 1:6 [6]And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. They have already been judged in part you could say. But one day all of them and all wicked people will be receive their judgement in full on the same day it would seem.

It's not clear how seeing Revelation 19 and 20 as a continuous vision could be problematic for non-premillennialists.

@methodministries

Жыл бұрын

Because if Revelation 19 is the 2nd coming of Christ, then it means the 1,000-years happen after Jesus returns. Which mean, Pre-millennialism is true: Jesus comes before (pre) the 1,000-years.

@petromax4849

Жыл бұрын

@@methodministries But it might not be the 2nd coming, and even if it is that doesn't mean that all the chronological details of the vision need to match the chronology of the real events being symbolized. I can see how not having a break between 19 and 20 might favor premillennialism, but it seems like it could work for other positions too, albeit less neatly. And couldn't a premillennialist interpretation work even with a break? The presence or absence of a break in the vision doesn't seem absolutely decisive either way.

@methodministries

Жыл бұрын

@@petromax4849 Rev 19 talks about the marriage super of the Lamb. It shows the heavens opened and Christ coming with the armies of heaven following Him. He’s defeating the antichrist army of Rev 13. The battle talking place is the final war Satan is preparing for in Rev 16:14. It is the 2nd coming. Which means Jesus comes before the 1,000-years and the 1,000-years start after He returns. Notice, the resurrection happens in Rev 20:4. That only happens when Jesu returns.

@petromax4849

Жыл бұрын

@@methodministries As far as I can see, all you're saying is that if you interpret it like a premillennialist, premillennialism is correct. If you believed that the rest of the new testament was clearly amillennialist or postmillennialist, would you have any difficulty reading Revelation that way? I'm not trying to sound hostile, I just think it's a weak argument, and weak arguments shouldn't convince anyone who isn't already convinced.

@methodministries

Жыл бұрын

@@petromax4849 Would you say the marriage supper and the great battle already took place then?

The problem with historic premillennialism is also the early sexta/septa-premillennialism. And no, Polycarp, and especially the Didache is not demonstrably premillennial. We do not see Chiliasm before the certain interpretations of Revelation 20:1-10.

@methodministries

Жыл бұрын

Premillennialism is the earliest form of Millennialism in Church history.

@seanchaney3086

Жыл бұрын

So, you are saying that misrepresentation was the first interpretation? You know what was prior to Millennialism? "This Age and the Age to Come."

_"The rest of the dead are raised only to be sent to hell so the elect may have some subjective sense of security in the presence of God. I think that as the image of God we are endowed with our creators morality, and that's the voice in our heads telling us that such a proposition is contrary to His nature."_ The rest of the dead are the resurrection to judgement, and will be judged by the judges seated on thrones of authority during the millennial judgement. After instruction in the truth of God free of deception, many will choose life and others rebellion. Matt 24: 31-33 Look: _"They came to life (immortality) and reigned with Christ a thousand years. The rest of the dead did not come to life (immortality) until the thousand years were ended."_ Did the meaning of life change between 24 and 25, one sentence later? In 24 we know life is immortality because it is stated directly: _"the second death has no power over them."_ In all of John's letters, John, 1John, 2John and Revelation, zōē in all of its forms means eternal life 72% of the time. That is compelling evidence.

@Scribeintheink

Ай бұрын

We are by nature children of wrath friend. We don’t have God’s morality in any sense until we are born again

@jacobsilverberg1329

Ай бұрын

@@Scribeintheink _"For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law..."_ Well I agree in part. Not sure how that ties in to my post though. I think there's probably confusion. Apparently I forgot to isolate the quote taken from the video. I made an edit for clarity.

@Scribeintheink

Ай бұрын

@@jacobsilverberg1329I think we tend to confuse the conscience God gave us with our actual morality. Conscience in a Biblical sense doesn’t indicate a person’s morality but rather their being aware of what is and is not moral

1 could be explained by defining “rule” which doesn’t necessitate the subjugation of others. It could simply indicate our rule of the world, more a description of who this world belongs to. As to your other points… they are good and give credence to the idea that we would rule over the non believers

I’m afraid this position was poorly explained and defended. In addition, the way you presented the other positions was very inaccurate.

@Scribeintheink

Ай бұрын

Uh huh. But did you know you can save money by switching to Geico for your car insurance